[01:47] <electroglue> hey guys can someone point me to a ubuntu how to for beaglebone. Seem I'm not using the right image
[01:48] <rsalveti> infinity: ogra_: bug 983555
[01:48] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 983555 in compiz-plugins-extra "compiz-plugins-extra FTBFS on ARM" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/983555
[01:48] <rsalveti> and attached a debdiff containing the patch that disables the plugins that are gl-only compatible
[01:49] <electroglue> can someone tell me if http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/releases/oneiric/release/ubuntu-11.10-preinstalled-server-armel+omap.img.gz is the right image for beaconboard?
[01:49] <electroglue> I mean beaglebone
[01:50] <infinity> rsalveti: \o/
[01:50] <infinity> electroglue: Other than the part where I'd strongly recommend using precise/armhf instead of oneiric/armel, yes.
[01:51] <electroglue> infinity: armhf performance is much better than the soft one?
[01:51]  * twb perks up - ubuntu has a solid armhf now?
[01:51] <infinity> Better performance, plus we're dropping support for armel.
[01:51] <infinity> twb: Hrm?
[01:51] <infinity> twb: Where have you been for the last 6 months?
[01:51] <twb> infinity: last time I looked, which was months- asleep
[01:52] <electroglue> thanks infinity
[01:52] <twb> wrt ubuntu arm I well and truly have my "user" hat on and my "dev" hat off :P
[01:52] <infinity> I have a few too many dev hats.
[01:53] <infinity> rsalveti: So, I'm guessing no Linaro folk got around to taking gnat off markos' plate?
[01:55] <infinity> rsalveti: Also, uploaded that compiz fix for you.
[01:56] <rsalveti> infinity: I thought SteveMcIntyre was looking at it, need to ping folks to check
[01:56] <rsalveti> let me write down an email about that
[01:56] <rsalveti> infinity: thanks
[01:56] <infinity> rsalveti: Unless someone magically produces a compiler in the next few days, we're pretty much officially "too late" anyway.
[01:56] <rsalveti> yeah =\
[01:56] <infinity> Thankfully, no one actually uses ADA... Right?
[01:57] <rsalveti> well, there are always some weird folks that might be using it, but afaik not that many at least :-)
[01:58] <infinity> Well, the pet hobby language of the month seems to be haskell.
[01:58] <rsalveti> yup
[01:58] <infinity> I'd still love it if we got ghci working for those folks.
[01:58] <infinity> But at least ghc works.
[02:00] <rsalveti> cool, and do we have any issue with other haskell related packages?
[02:01] <rsalveti> I remember they were always a bit of a pain go get all in sync and building for arm
[02:01] <rsalveti> issues with builder and such
[02:01] <infinity> haskell-src-exts was having OOMing issues, that was fixed.
[02:01] <rsalveti> cool
[02:01] <infinity> So, it's only ghci that needs love.  And I'm told that porting ghci to a new arch is a lot of Not Fun.
[02:01] <infinity> Which is why upstream only supports two arches. :/
[02:02] <rsalveti> oh, ok, so will probably take time then
[02:02] <infinity> But I know, for instance, that CompSci classes teach interactive ghc usage, etc, so to many people, ghc without ghci is "useless".
[02:02] <twb> infinity: GHC struggles on "second class" archs because it has to compile to C first, then run a C compiler
[02:03] <infinity> Something to ponder spending time on for Q anyway.  Maybe.
[02:03] <twb> infinity: last time I looked upstream GHC team didn't support arm at all, that was all Debian
[02:03] <twb> infinity: if they want GHCI they can bloody well ssh into the student shell server :-/
[02:03] <infinity> twb: Yeah, most of the porting effort with GHC has been Debian, and the Debian maintainer's awesome, but he's also a limited resource. :P
[02:04] <twb> I used to maintain Darcs in Debian, from 2.0 up to about 2.4 or .5
[02:06] <infinity> Hrm, Uploaders gets filtered out by dpkg-gencontrol, doesn't it?
[02:06] <infinity> So I can still fix this source without rebuilding the binaries.
[02:06] <infinity> Shiny.
[02:07] <scientes> you you guys saying alot is broken with armhf?
[02:07] <infinity> scientes: Other than gnat, no, it's just as broken (or slightly less) a armel. :P
[02:07] <infinity> s/a armel/than armel/
[02:08] <scientes> cause i ran into the opposite with firefox
[02:08] <scientes> to run on armv5 you have to turn off the JIT or you get segfaults
[02:08] <twb> Meh, ff is always a problem child
[02:09] <micahg> scientes: you'll want Debian's build if you're using armv5
[02:09] <scientes> twb, ever try to build ff?
[02:09] <twb> Yes
[02:09] <scientes> micahg, yeah that is what i was using
[02:09] <twb> Although nowadays it's separate from xulrunner so the heavy lifting happens there
[02:09] <scientes> micahg, it works except it doesn't turn off the jit by default for some reason
[02:09] <micahg> twb: AIUI in Debian xulrunner and Firefox are built from the same source now
[02:10] <twb> oh.
[02:10] <scientes> the 2GB for libxul linking sure caught be off gaurd
[02:10] <twb> grumble grumble
 twb: AIUI in Debian xulrunner and Firefox are built from the same source now
[02:10] <scientes> correct
[02:10] <scientes> i like that
[02:10] <twb> scientes: hey man you can't even CHECK OUT emacs from bzr unless you have 800MB of RAM
[02:10] <twb> Let alone compile it
[02:10] <scientes> well that a bzr problem
[02:10] <twb> Yeah I know ;-)
[02:10] <scientes> which is not exactly something i care about
[02:10] <infinity> Checking out emacs seems more like a personal problem.
[02:11] <scientes> haha
[02:11] <twb> infinity: it's a communicable disease
[02:11] <infinity> This is right up there with "I find it really difficult to masturbate to rotting corpses".
[02:11] <scientes> i just dont see why in bzr explicit renaming support is touted as a "feature"
[02:11] <infinity> The obvious response being "don't do that, then."
[02:11] <scientes> the content-centric approach of git seems much better
[02:12] <twb> scientes: it's better enough that Darcs adopted it too
[02:12] <scientes> > its cancer enough that darcs adopted it too
[02:12] <scientes> FTFY
[02:13] <scientes> infinity, so are you guys going to maintain some sensible armel multiarch so that broken packages can still be installed as armel?
[02:13] <twb> If you analyse the Θ of typical operations in a traditional delta-store backend vs. a content-oriented database, the latter is a clear win for VCS
[02:13] <infinity> scientes: We do support multiarch, yes.
[02:14] <scientes> so you will have a armel and armhf repo like debian, just not support the armel for primary arch?
[02:15] <infinity> We have both for now.  We'll have both for the life of precise.  I can't say if we'll have both forever.
[02:15] <infinity> (really, probably not)
[02:16] <scientes> well then they cant accuse your of breaking stuff that doesn't work on armhf, they can install the armel packages, and port it if someone cares
[02:16] <scientes> sounds perfectly reasonable to me
[02:16] <twb> I thought not all of the multiarch ducks were lined up yet
[02:17] <twb> Like, it's in dpkg now, but not in apt yet
[02:17] <infinity> I have a fine collection of ducks here.
[02:17] <infinity> It's been supported since oneiric...
[02:17] <scientes> haha, yeah there is alot of gui lack, and i've seen bugs in aptitude
[02:17] <infinity> We shipped with multiarch on by default for amd64 in oneiric.
[02:17] <infinity> aptitude is buggy, yes.
[02:17] <scientes> but ubuntu has had it for a while unlike debian
[02:17] <infinity> But who cares, it's aptitude. :P
[02:17] <scientes> infinity, I use it!
[02:17] <micahg> aptitude is better in precise, but still needs help
[02:18] <twb> infinity: oooh, so you did biarch while waiting for Debian to solve the general case?
[02:18] <scientes> i use apt-get and aptitude
[02:18]  * micahg would like apt-getitude
[02:18] <scientes> i use to use synaptic, but now heavily dislike it, along with software-center
[02:18] <infinity> twb:
[02:18] <infinity> twb: Err, what?
[02:18] <infinity> twb: No, multiarch in oneiric was multiarch.
[02:19] <twb> So I could add precise armhf to my existing oneiric/precise armel sources.list, and it should Just Work?
[02:19] <infinity> Well, to precise/armel, sure.
[02:19] <scientes> twb, if you have armv7 hardware, yes
[02:19] <twb> Is there a howto wiki page somewhere?
[02:19] <infinity> Given that multiarch needs package versions to match, oneiric/precise won't exactly work.
[02:19] <infinity> And it's not added in sources.list at all.
[02:20]  * scientes uses [arch=amd64] in sources to make downloads faster
[02:20] <twb> infinity: what I mean is I'm currently using oneiric and cherry-picking things I care about from precise
[02:20] <infinity> twb: echo "foreign-architecture armhf" > /etc/dpkg/dpkg.cfg.d/multiarch && apt-get update
[02:20] <infinity> twb: Congrats, you're multiarch.
[02:20] <scientes> ^^bingo
[02:20] <twb> Thanks
[02:20] <scientes> and you can also change the primary arch to armhf
[02:21] <infinity> twb: I'd recommend having an armhf base, though, and cherry-picking in the other direction if absolutely necessary.
[02:21] <infinity> (Which, unless you really like ADA, it shouldn't be)
[02:21] <scientes> armhf can bring like 25% performance improvement
[02:21] <micahg> infinity: pascal as well
[02:21] <twb> I'm currently running a random wacky android .36 kernel.  Do I need that to be compiled with specific options for armhf to work, and if so, how do I check those options?
[02:22] <scientes> and even more on VFP-intensive stuff
[02:22] <infinity> micahg: I'm still pondering a 0-hour pascal transition.
[02:22] <twb> scientes: yeah I was going to put Debian armhf on this box but my previous box died and I was in a rush :-(
[02:22] <scientes> twb, i think it even works with a armel kernel
[02:22] <infinity> twb: The kernel doesn't give a hoot about VFP.
[02:22] <twb> That's what I thought, thanks
[02:22] <infinity> No such thing as an "armel" or "armhf" kernel.
[02:22] <scientes> but you can compile your kernel with VFP support, but there is very little FP in the kernel
[02:23] <twb> Hm, I can't see apt-get update pulling down armhf entries yet...
[02:23] <scientes> the option is there
[02:23] <scientes> in make nconfig
[02:23] <twb> http://paste.debian.net/163468/
[02:23] <twb> I guess because it hasn't got to the precise one yet, and there isn't one for oneiric?
[02:24] <infinity> There's no armhf in oneiric, no.
[02:24] <twb> Yep, there's the armhf dl now
[02:24] <scientes> upgrade!
[02:24] <twb> SHINY
[02:25] <twb> The main thing is to avoid bricking it in any way, because this is my main / only workstation
[02:25] <infinity> You're as bad as ogra...
[02:25] <twb> So-rry
[02:25] <infinity> ;)
[02:25] <twb> If this was a normal server I wouldn't be worried about the userland bricking it because I can deal with that
[02:26] <scientes> twb, then use even more shiny like me and switch to btrfs :P
[02:26] <twb> But this stupid thing can't exactly just boot off a USB live key atm :P
[02:26] <twb> scientes: how do you think my last laptop died
[02:27]  * infinity slams his head on the desk.
[02:27] <infinity> I need to alias git/bzr/svn all to one wrapper that checks for .git, .svn, bzr and DTRT.
[02:27] <twb> Not to worry tho, my scratch VM is still btrfs all the way
[02:28] <twb> infinity: http://cyber.com.au/~twb/.bin/twb-get
[02:28] <infinity> So sick of running the wrong commands in the wrong projects.
[02:28] <twb> infinity: or you could use Emacs which does exactly that ;-)
[02:28] <micahg> infinity: debcheckout/debcommit?
[02:28] <twb> micahg: mm, that too
[02:28] <infinity> micahg: In this case, it was "bzr diff" in a subversion checkout.
[02:29] <infinity> Last night, it was git merge.  Because I can't imagine merging without git.
[02:29] <infinity> But then I realised I had to.
[02:29] <infinity> Etc.
 I need to alias git/bzr/svn all to one wrapper that checks for .git, .svn, bzr and DTRT.
[02:29] <scientes> i feel you
[02:29]  * scientes wishes it was all git
[02:29]  * scientes uses the git mirror of mozilla-central
[02:30] <infinity> I miss the fix-it-yourself appeal of RCS/CVS.
[02:30] <infinity> Of course, they also sucked.
[02:30] <scientes> hahahaha
[02:30] <infinity> A lot.
[02:30] <infinity> But, still.  If I wedge a repository for any of the new shiny VCSs, it's over.
[02:31] <twb> infinity: hey hey I still use RCS - for evil
[02:31] <twb> http://paste.debian.net/163469/
[02:32] <twb> gpg + rcs = version-controlled, encrypted netrc files
[02:33] <twb> http://paste.debian.net/163470/ is the manpage, since that sh code is pretty obtuse
[02:37] <scientes> why did ubuntu switch to statically linking libxul into firefox?
[02:37] <scientes> esp when they switched to shipping thunderbird by default
[02:37] <scientes> seems you could save a few MB of ram for nothing
[02:37] <infinity> You could, but the pain of keeping the world in sync was awful.
[02:38] <infinity> And when you're running firefox and thunderbird, "a few MB" is laughably nothing.
[02:38] <scientes> true....
[02:38] <infinity> My Firefox is happily dining on 3G of RAM.
[02:38] <scientes> it use to crash at 2GB all the time
[02:39] <scientes> no that that is fixed there is no end in sight
[02:41]  * twb sighs
[02:42] <twb> I know RAM is cheap, but "it's cheaper to add ram than code an O(logn) algorithm instead of an O(n) one" is like fingernails on a blackboard to me
[02:42] <scientes> well, xml is neither fast nor ram-sensitive by its very nature
[02:42] <twb> The problem XML solves is not hard, and XML does not solve it well.
[02:43] <scientes> xml only creates problems
[02:43] <scientes> yes, it is context-free which is nice
[02:43] <scientes> but so is json, which is much better
[02:43] <twb> So are sexprs, a better solution to the problem that existing in *1959*
[02:43] <scientes> are there any 100% xml-compatible binary representations
[02:44] <scientes> that we could support in browsers?
[02:44] <twb> Who cares
[02:44] <twb> The browsing public doesn't give a shit about anything except stupid shiny web apps
[02:44] <scientes> it would be easier to parse
[02:45] <twb> Personally I avoid 90% of the problem by using w3m for everything except the odd broken site
[02:45] <scientes> thats pretty extreme
[02:45] <scientes> i mean even noscript and adblockplus gets you pretty far
[02:45] <twb> adblockplus is a clusterfuck; that code belongs in DNS
[02:45] <twb> afk food
[02:46] <scientes> thats what people say, but adblockplus works much better IMHO
[02:46] <scientes> cause it actually removes the elements from the DOM
[02:46] <scientes> and they are never rendered at all
[02:46] <scientes> or requested
[02:46] <twb> I wouldn't know about that, I was pulling its data files and putting them into squid and polipo
[02:46] <scientes> and it works better than simple host forging
[02:46] <twb> I haven't actually used ff since about 1.5
[02:47] <twb> Since webkit has slightly less bloat
[02:47] <scientes> well adblockplus is ported to chromium
[02:47] <scientes> but i use firefox cause its the only browser than you can coaxe into slightly keeping your privacy
[02:52] <micahg> twb: you should give Firefox 13 a go, much smaller memory footprint
[02:52] <scientes> and much faster javascript
[02:52] <scientes> and also video support
[03:01] <twb> are you serious?  They're up to 13 now?
[03:01] <twb> micahg: well I was running it over X so I didn't have to pay the footprint penalty on my local netbook
[03:02] <twb> TBH the video stuff annoys me because now I can't opt out by not installing flash
[03:02] <micahg> noscript should help there
[03:02] <twb> If I want a video I'll fucking well fun mplayer, I don't want it loading without asking inside a browser, any more than I want geocities "background music" in a web page
[03:02] <twb> micahg: so instead of taking stuff out, I have to add more stuff to stop the first stuff from doing anything?  Yuk
[03:03] <micahg> 13 is current in the aurora channel which is ~7 weeks from release (1 week till beta migration + 6 week migration cycle)
[03:03]  * micahg thinks noscript is sensible in any event for browsing
[03:04] <twb> IMO if you have js in a browser it should be off by default
[03:04] <twb> It's absurd to me that you need a third-party module to make that the case
[03:04] <micahg> twb: if you saw how many bugs we get because people disable stuff, you'd understand why :) (Mozilla probably gets more)
[03:04] <twb> But then, that's why I use w3m and I'm not an arsebook weenie
[03:04] <scientes> twb, you can in firefox settings
[03:05] <twb> micahg: yeah I grant you moco has to deal with a lot of fuckwits
[03:05] <scientes> noscript just lets you set it on a per-domain basis
[03:05] <scientes> whic is more useful
[03:05] <scientes> same with cslite
[03:05]  * micahg loves permablocking the ad sites
[03:05] <twb> scientes: I think if I was building it, I'd just have a keychord that said "toggle js in this tab"
[03:06] <twb> micahg: I do that in hosts(5) ;-)
[03:06] <scientes> twb, yeah i was looking for a way to only have ajvascript run in current
[03:06] <scientes> but firefox actually does that by default now
[03:08] <twb> infinity: btw with both oneiric and precise enabled, apt-get whinges because it can't find oneiric/armhf
[03:08] <twb> http://paste.debian.net/163476/
[03:09] <infinity> twb: Yeah, cosmetic bug worth fixing at some point, but it's not exactly a common use-case.
[03:09] <scientes> twb, infinity already said, oneric doesnbt have armhf
[03:09] <infinity> (ie: how often do we add ports, and have people attempt cross-series multiarch?)
[03:10] <twb> infinity: okey dokey
[03:11] <pnphi> make[1]: *** [stamp-conf-lite] Error 1 make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/ty/LuanVan/icewm/icewm-1.3.7~pre2' make: *** [build-stamp] Error 2 dpkg-buildpackage: error: debian/rules build gave error exit status 2
[03:11] <twb> I am ninja enough to ignore an error from apt-get ::P
[03:11] <pnphi> i can't fix this err
[03:11] <twb> pnphi: pastebin full transcript please
[03:11] <pnphi> make[1]: *** [stamp-conf-lite] Error 1
[03:11] <pnphi> make: *** [build-stamp] Error 2
[03:11] <pnphi> dpkg-buildpackage: error: debian/rules build gave error exit status 2
[03:11] <pnphi> 2 days , i can't  fix this err
[03:12] <twb> ubot2: pastebin
[03:12] <ubot2> For posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://imagebin.org/?page=add | !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic.
[03:12] <twb> pnphi: put the whole transcript, all those 100s of lines, into a pastebin
[03:12] <pnphi> ok
[03:13] <pnphi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/933470/
[03:14] <twb> pnphi: what is the version (first line) reported by iconv --version?
[03:15] <pnphi> must install iconv ?
[03:15] <twb> If iconv is not installed, that is probably the problem.
[03:15] <pnphi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/933473/
[03:15] <pnphi> iconv --version
[03:17] <pnphi> have iconv
[03:20] <twb> There is something wrong with your system, because an earlier version of iconv (2.11, from lucid) passes that test:
[03:20] <twb> echo foo | iconv --from iso-8859-1 --to UCS4//translit ==> foo
[03:21] <pnphi> yes
[03:21] <infinity> pnphi: Are you developing on maverick?
[03:21] <pnphi> yes
[03:21] <infinity> You realise it's EOL, right?
[03:21] <pnphi> yse
[03:21] <pnphi> yes
[03:22] <infinity> Of course, maverick's iconv *does* work, so I'm sure your problem is local.  But still.  You might want to use a newer release.
[03:23] <pnphi> newer...ok
[03:23] <scientes> yeah iconv works...
[03:23] <pnphi> must upgrade
[03:25] <pnphi> i'm very tried, 2 days with the err
[03:26] <pnphi> build by "dpkg-buildpackage -a<arch>" and "xdeb" , the same err
[03:31] <pnphi> i must upgrade into 11.04
[03:34] <pnphi> 11.04 is natty
[03:44] <pnphi> how using dpkg-cross
[04:13] <rsalveti> infinity: wooot, jockey worked fine from first boot :-)
[04:14] <infinity> rsalveti: Crazy talk.  You must have done it wrong.
[04:14] <rsalveti> ;-)
[04:14] <infinity> Also: \o/
[04:14] <infinity> I mean, it would be more "\o/" if the drivers were just free, but whatever. :/
[04:14] <rsalveti> yeah
[04:15] <rsalveti> hopefully some crazy dudes will reverse engineer it soon ;-)
[04:15] <infinity> I'm still waiting for some clever young kid with too much free time to make nouvea work on Tegra.
[04:15] <twb> Or you know, the vendor gets a fucking clue
[04:15] <rsalveti> would be awesome if robclark would be allowed to do that
[04:15] <infinity> rsalveti: That might represent a SLIGHT conflict of interest for him.
[04:16] <rsalveti> robclark: did you look at the tegra support before doing the work for the other driver?
[04:17] <infinity>  - ARM Fast Models as builders
[04:18] <infinity> rsalveti: ^-- You hate me, right?
[04:18] <rsalveti> infinity: oh yeah :-)
[04:18] <rsalveti> start crying ;-)
[04:18] <infinity> On it.
[04:19] <infinity> On the one hand, it would be nice to have the port ready before there's any GA hardware.  On the other hand, OH GOD NO.
[04:19] <rsalveti> lol
[04:20] <rsalveti> we're using it for big.little, and yeah, it's a pain
[04:20] <robclark> rsalveti, I didn't really look at tegra.. although that was more to do w/ hw I have access to.. :-P
[04:20] <rsalveti> infinity: ^ just need to get a tegra board to robclark ;-)
[04:20] <infinity> robclark: I'll mail you some Tegra kit.
[04:20] <robclark> heheh, well, I think I'll be busy for a while ;-)
[04:20] <infinity> Actually, in all seriousness, we might have some spare ac100s floating around the company, I could ask around.
[04:20] <robclark> although find some nouveau folks, send 'em tegras :-P
[04:21] <infinity> I just have a gut feeling that making nouveau do tegraish things would be dangerously close to "trivial" for someone who understands the architecture.
[04:21] <infinity> Since the Tegra GPU is, by all account, just a slightly crippled Geforce.
[04:22] <infinity> Sadly, once it's made to work "just like the desktop GPUs", then someone needs to make it do GLES instead. :/
[04:22] <robclark> I'd heard somewhere that some nouveau folks thought it would need a different driver, but I'm not sure how much that has to do w/ command stream and shader ISA's, vs UMA vs vram..
[04:23] <robclark> I'd have to guess there is at least some family resemblance ;-)
[04:23] <infinity> It's the nose.  It's always the nose.
[04:23] <robclark> heheh
[04:24] <infinity> Honestly, we suffer along fine with ati/nvidia binary drivers on the desktop, and I think I've mostly come to terms with it.
[04:24] <infinity> It's the part where ARM SoC vendors are a bit less organised that makes it more painful.
[04:24] <twb> I don't suffer
[04:24]  * robclark used nouveau on old laptop (now have intel gfx)
[04:25] <infinity> (So, the omap4 + jockey thing is great news)
[04:25] <twb> I outright refuse to use anything but intel GPUs on the desktop
[04:25] <robclark> nouveau supported gles nicely thx to gallium
[04:25] <robclark> (gles also works well on new laptop)
[04:25] <infinity> twb: If Intel ever caught up in 3D performance, I may take that stand, but I still like my fancy video games.
[04:26] <twb> I have never once had a proprietary video game work properly under wine
[04:26] <infinity> (I hear that this year's crop of Intel GPUs are at least "not crap", compared to one generation removed for ati/nvidia)
[04:26] <twb> Even with non-intel (ATI) GPUs
[04:26] <infinity> twb: I used to play WoW in wine, worked fine.
[04:27] <infinity> On both ATI and nvidia.
[04:27] <twb> cube and tremulous worked OK tho
[04:27] <twb> infinity: the two I can remember are KOTOR and SMAC
[04:38] <rsalveti> infinity: and after reboot, unity 3d running :-)
[04:38] <rsalveti> janimo`: with today's image unity-3d is working after installing the pvr driver
[04:39] <rsalveti> janimo`: what issue did you get exactly?
[04:39] <rsalveti> can you also start just X and call unity by hand to see if you get any useful logs?
[04:49] <infinity> rsalveti: Huzzah!
[04:49] <infinity> I really need to test all of this on my Panda and see it in action.
[04:49] <infinity> The poor thing's been on fire with toolchain builds all week instead of playing with shiny things.
[04:50] <infinity> But, once this gcc-4.6/eglibc upload for Debian is done building, it's free again.  Finally.
[04:50] <rsalveti> hm, seems a bunch of gnome-related changes just landed, running dist-upgrade now
[04:50] <rsalveti> yeah
[04:50] <scientes> twb, i've had games work
[04:50] <scientes> infinity, i couldn't get a framerate over about 3 with ati
[04:51] <scientes> i also got a nasty corruption issue (which i managed to fix)
[04:51] <infinity> scientes: Ow.
[04:51] <scientes> nvidia +wow always worked fine however
[04:58] <twb> I know it seems to be JUST me
[04:58] <twb> everyone else seems to have wine work fine for everything
[04:58] <twb> Although I suspect that's mainly nvidia customers, not the ATI r250 I was using at the time
[05:00] <scientes> nvidia certainly is the strongest 3d driver for linux
[05:00] <scientes> but nouveau and radeon are certainly coming along
[05:01] <scientes> ..however nvidia just broke for me is some way on precise...
[05:01] <scientes> since last few kernels
[07:40] <ogra_> bug 983555
[07:40] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 983555 in compiz-plugins-extra "compiz-plugins-extra FTBFS on ARM" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/983555
[08:14] <nimesh_accenture> has anyone tried running the ubuntu Oneric 11.10 rootfs over android kernel 3.01 in ICS?
[08:29] <scientes> nimesh_accenture, there is no such this as "android kernel 3.01"
[08:29] <scientes> AFAIK
[08:29] <scientes> each device has a differn't kernel, which is part of the way ARM currently works
[08:32] <twb> or doesn't work, as the case may be :P
[08:35] <suihkulokki> tsk, tsk, CONFIG_INIT_PASS_ALL_PARAMS is still not merged mainline?
[08:37] <nimesh_accenture> scientes: Android has its own patches over the standard linux kernel , which had not recently been upmerged , until 3.3
[08:37] <scientes> nimesh_accenture, indeed, however most embedded devices use more than just android patches
[08:38] <scientes> nimesh_accenture, and as 3.3 doesn't have wakelocks booting android on it will eat your battery alive
[08:38] <scientes> only a select few boards work with upstream kernels, even with non-android
[08:39] <twb> nimesh_accenture: are they all/mostly in, in 3.3. then?
[08:39] <twb> Last I heard was "RSN, honest"
[08:40] <nimesh_accenture> twb: i'm not sure , but I read an article a few weeks back that android patches have been ypmerged into the std linux kernel , not sure if all had been merged
[08:41] <twb> shiiiiiiny
[08:43] <nimesh_accenture> scientes: what i'm basically trying to do is create a new rootfs using chrooot in android ICS and then include ubyntu packages and the glibc and the std libc in that root to run applications like g-streamer
[08:43] <scientes> nimesh_accenture, that should work just fine, however what does uname -a say
[08:43] <scientes> nimesh_accenture, also, see if you have /proc/config.gz
[08:44] <scientes> also, bind mount /dev
[08:44] <nimesh_accenture> i'm currently on my desktop
[08:44] <nimesh_accenture> panda hasn't been booted yet
[08:45] <scientes> nimesh_accenture, https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.galoula.LinuxInstall&hl=en
[08:45] <scientes> thats debian
[08:45] <scientes> oh if you have a pandaboard just use the ubuntu pandaboard images
[08:46] <scientes> should have said you have a more open device
[08:48] <nimesh_accenture> ya but the ubuntu panda board images contain the kernel et. all , i'll have to separate that out from the image and create a new rootfs
[08:49] <nimesh_accenture> i mean i've not done it before
[08:49] <nimesh_accenture> that is waht i assume
[08:51] <scientes> nimesh_accenture, are you trying to dual boot?
[08:51] <scientes> whats wrong with the ubuntu kernel?
[08:52] <janimo`> rsalveti, wat I tested was an x86 wit pvr not panda, so likely oter issues
[08:52]  * janimo` needs to fix te h key
[08:52] <nimesh_accenture> nothing is wrong. I want the Android front end , but the ubuntu back end for apps like g-streamer , which dont run on android root
[08:54] <nimesh_accenture> so both will coexist. not dual boot.
[08:54] <twb> gstreamer isn't an app
[08:54] <nimesh_accenture> an engine i ment
[08:54] <twb> I wonder if anyone has filed an ITP for dalvik
[08:55] <twb> That would be one of the obvious prerequisites
[08:55] <nimesh_accenture> not bothered much abt ITP's at the moment ...
[10:34] <nimesh_accenture> guys ... I have a question about rootstock.... does rootstock download packages from the web or does it include it from the local machine?
[10:46] <janimo`> nimesh_accenture, from the archives. not the local machine
[10:47] <nimesh_accenture> so what do I do if i want to crreate a root fs from my local machine root files?
[10:48] <nimesh_accenture> i basically have the server image of oneric and i want all the packages that are included in that package
[10:52] <janimo`> nimesh_accenture, I don't think you can reuse your serer image iso from rootstock
[10:52] <spych102> i am having package problems with enabling my pandaboard, in 11.10 and 12.04
[10:53] <nimesh_accenture> ok...
[10:53] <nimesh_accenture> one more thing , what does "--seed linux-image-omap" actually do?
[10:53] <nimesh_accenture> and do we actually need to give that option?
[10:54] <spych102> what is the best sdcard image to start with and is there a version of omap extras to use
[10:54] <janimo`> nimesh_accenture, I think with --seed you specify extra packages to be added to the image which otherwise are not in the default rootstock image
[10:54] <janimo`> kernel must be seeded as that is specific to the platform you are building for
[10:55] <janimo`> if you add --seed ubuntu-server it may add all dependencies of that metapackage too. I am not sure though I rarely used rootstock and een then I did not understand exactly how it worked
[10:55] <LetoThe2nd> isn't rootstock largely outdated? there was even talk about removing it.
[10:56] <nimesh_accenture> i dont need the kernel, as i'm trying to chroot on top of Android kernel
[10:56] <janimo`> LetoThe2nd, yes it is. I don't know if there's a similarly easy way to build custom images though
[10:56] <janimo`> live-build is less straightforward
[10:57] <LetoThe2nd> janimo`: no idea, i usually just use debootstrap
[10:57] <nimesh_accenture> i basically need to chroot as i need libc and glibc .. so does --seed linux-image-omap , include the kernel in the rootfs tarball?
[10:58] <LetoThe2nd> well then whats the matter with debootstrap? set arch, pick the ports mirror, done.
[10:58] <nimesh_accenture> i didn't know abt debbootstrap ... i'll check it out
[10:58] <nimesh_accenture> thx guys!
[11:02] <janimo`> LetoThe2nd, rootstock is debootstrap + adding kernel + initrd basically I think
[11:03] <LetoThe2nd> janimo`: me thinks the same.
[11:05] <LetoThe2nd> quit
[11:06] <nimesh_accenture> so then rootstock "is" debootstrap
[11:06] <janimo`> nimesh_accenture, yes, a wrapper around it
[11:09] <ogra_> rootstock didnt (yes its dead and gone from the archive) do anysthing wrt kernel or initrd
[11:10] <ogra_> its essentially debootstrap+apt-get install $seed+a lot of initial setup for the rootfs (creating users, groups and all default configs the installer would normally doetc)
[11:11] <ogra_> and also rootstock was more a wrapper around qemu than around debootstrap (it indeed used debootstrap but that was only a minor part of it)
[11:12] <LetoThe2nd> not an adult part? *SCNR*
[11:13] <ogra_> heh
[11:15] <nimesh_accenture> ok...
[11:15] <nimesh_accenture> so if i dont need the kernel in rootstock , what do i do?
[11:15] <nimesh_accenture> or is it included by default?
[11:16] <ogra_> what kernel ?
[11:16] <ogra_> for which target arch
[11:16] <ogra_> s/arch/board/
[11:16] <nimesh_accenture> i'm going to do a chroot from the android kernel , but the ubuntu server oneric rootfs
[11:17] <nimesh_accenture> pandaboard
[11:17] <ogra_> why do you do that ?
[11:17] <ogra_> you will have to apply very heavy hacks to userspace to even get networking to work with an android kernel using it in a normal linux distro
[11:17] <nimesh_accenture> i want to run gstreamer on the chrooted rootfs, i cant run it on android
[11:18] <ogra_> ah, so you will run a full android and only chroot into the ubuntu rootfs ?
[11:18] <nimesh_accenture> yup
[11:18] <ogra_> good luck with that then
[11:19] <ogra_> for a chroot you can easily just use ubuntu-core as a base
[11:19] <nimesh_accenture> thx! but will rootstock include the kernel by default?
[11:21] <ogra_> no and i wouldnt count on it to work properly at all, its unmaintained since over a year
[11:21] <ogra_> and has never gotten support for noewer distros ... so its a matter of luck
[11:21] <ogra_> *newer
[11:21] <ogra_> use ubuntu-core instaed
[11:22] <ogra_> and if you want to transfer package selections from oeniric-server to it, use dpkg --get-selections on the server install and dpkg --set-selections in the chroot
[11:23] <ogra_> (and apt-get dselect-upgrade iirc)
[11:27] <nimesh_accenture> ah! ok... so no root stocking! thx ogra_!
[11:58] <sveinse> For how long will the armel Natty repos live? I don't mean how long its supported, but when will the deb repos disappear?
[11:58] <ogra_> they move with the EOL announcement
[11:59] <sveinse> Oct 12 I suppose then?
[12:00] <ogra_> likely
[12:00] <sveinse> thanks
[12:00] <ogra_> dunno whats the exact date
[12:00] <ogra_> but around that timeframe should be right
[12:12] <sveinse> I'm collecting license/copyright info for a Natty system. I find some packages without any copyright file, e.g. debconf-i18n, fuse-utils, klibc-utils, libgcc1. Do I have to fetch the sources to get their respective licenses? I thought it wasn't possible to publish a deb without copyright.
[12:12] <ogra_> it isnt, there must be one
[12:13] <sveinse> Well these don't
[12:13] <janimo`> sveinse, dpkg -L fuse-utils show that is has a copytight file
[12:13] <janimo`> not much else actually. This is on precise
[12:14] <sveinse> I'm reading none in fuse-utils_2.8.4-1.1ubuntu4_armel.deb
[12:14] <sveinse> which is the latest in Natty I believe
[12:16] <ogra_> libgcc1 is indeed weird
[12:16] <sveinse> Neither in amd64 nor i386. Neither in oneiric either
[12:20] <sveinse> The complete list of packages missing copyright is: debconf-i18n, fuse-utils, klibc-utils, libgcc1, libnih-dbus1, libpython2.7, libstdc++6, ntfs-3g, openssh-server, openssl, vim-tiny
[12:20] <sveinse> This is from our small embedded system without any GUI
[12:30] <ogra_> sveinse, check /usr/share/doc, some dirs are symlinks ;)
[12:30] <ogra_> (to save space)
[12:32] <sveinse> Yeah ok. That's good that they aren't missing
[12:32] <sveinse> Sorry for the confusion
[12:33] <ogra_> well, i knew it was a symlink somehow, thanks for asking else i handt looked :)
[13:20] <ogra_> oh !
[13:21] <ogra_> cute !
[13:21] <ogra_> http://www.solid-run.com/products/cubox
[13:30] <lilstevie> ogra_: that thing is nice
[13:30] <ogra_> it is !
[13:30] <ogra_> and it has eSATA ...
[13:30] <lilstevie> great step on the developer support by offering bootrom level recovery
[13:30] <lilstevie> and more to the point offering it as a feature
[13:47] <pnphi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/933970/
[13:47] <pnphi> help me
[13:48] <LetoThe2nd> pnphi: then try to start with a meaningful error description instead of coughing up random output snippets, maybe? ;)
[13:50] <ogra_> looks like you dont have all dependencies your build needs
[13:50] <LetoThe2nd> yeah, but whatever that build is/needs...
[14:06] <pnphi> so..i have full deps
[14:18] <pnphi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/933970/   help me
[14:18] <pnphi> i can't fix this err
[14:19] <LetoThe2nd> no new information, hence no new help is possible.
[14:53] <pnphi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/934066/
[14:53] <pnphi> the err , i can't fix
[14:54] <ogra_> what error ?
[14:54] <ogra_> (there is none in that log, its a successfull build)
[14:55] <pnphi> so,i don't see result
[14:56] <ogra_> it isnt in the pbuilder output dir ?
[14:56] <pnphi> where is the pbuilder output ?
[14:56] <pnphi> \var/cache/pbuilder/results
[14:57]  * ogra_ has no idea, i dont use pbuilder
[14:57] <pnphi> var/cache/pbuilder/results --> i don't see the resulr
[14:57] <pnphi> var/cache/pbuilder/results --> i don't see the result
[14:57] <pnphi> what do you use ?
[14:58] <ogra_> just a clean chroot
[14:59] <rsalveti> ogra_: suihkulokki got one cubox at connect
[14:59] <rsalveti> quite nice indeed
[14:59] <pnphi> detail ?
[15:00] <ogra_> pnphi, google :)
[15:00] <pnphi> chroot
[15:00] <pnphi> xdeb ?
[15:01] <ogra_> i'm using a chroot on a pandaboard or on a toshiba ac100
[15:04] <pnphi> how to build package armel from source ubuntu ?
[15:04] <pnphi> i use pdebuild
[15:05] <ogra_> yes, thats fine
[15:05] <pnphi> what the way to good ?
[15:18] <nimesh_accenture> i'm trying to follow instructions at: http://omappedia.org/wiki/OMAP_Ubuntu_Core , specifically "Chroot configuration on the Linux PC " . However when I try to chroot , it crashes out giving this error : qemu: fatal: cp15 insn ee1d7f70
[15:18] <ogra_> make sure to have the proper qemu-lianro package installed
[15:18] <ogra_> *linaro
[15:18] <ogra_> (and ask in linaro if you run into issues with that, they maintain it)
[15:20] <nimesh_accenture> im not using an sdcard, but I have the rootfs on a seperate folder... will that make a diff?
[15:20] <ogra_> shouldnt
[15:21] <nimesh_accenture> the instruction asks me to copy qemu-arm-static to my new rootfs's usr/bin
[15:22] <ogra_> yes
[15:22] <nimesh_accenture> so i did that step
[15:22] <ogra_> thats fine
[15:22] <nimesh_accenture> so what additional linaro package do i have to install?
[15:23] <ogra_> make sure to have the proper qemu-lianro package installed
[15:23] <ogra_> *linaro
[15:23] <ogra_> bah, using history doesnt help if there is a typo :P
[15:24] <nimesh_accenture> so how do i know which is the proper package ? apt-get install qemu-linaro ?
[15:24] <ogra_> ask in #linaro
[15:25] <ogra_> i cant answer that ... i dont use any cross tools
[15:25] <nimesh_accenture> oki
[16:18] <ogra_> infinity, hmm, seems also ac100 users see the /init not found issue
[16:19] <infinity> Everyone would, yes.
[16:19] <infinity> I'm working on it.
[16:19] <infinity> Shh. :P
[16:19] <ogra_> heh
[16:21] <GrueMaster> The "/init" issue affects all arm as far as I can tell.  I am able to reproduce it on Panda with a preseeded netboot install and we are seeing it on armadaxp.
[16:22] <GrueMaster> The initial bug is lp:984007
[16:22] <ogra_> right, i just didnt see it mysefl since i didnt generate any initrd recently
[16:23] <ogra_> but there are plenty people in #ac100 since yesterday that have fallen over systems
[16:24] <GrueMaster> So, what package should that bug be filed against for tracking?
[16:24] <ogra_> eglibc i think
[16:24] <ogra_> but it should be fixed today
[16:24] <ogra_> i wouldnt bother with bugs
[16:25] <GrueMaster> Bug is already filed, just not against the right package.
[16:25] <ogra_> yes, we discussed it in #arm for the last two hours
[16:25] <GrueMaster> elibc in LP brings up purelibc.  Is this correct?
[16:25] <ogra_> eglibc
[16:26] <ogra_> or search for "infinitys home" in LP :P
[16:29] <ogra_> GrueMaster, looks to me like bug 984007 has all the packages right already
[16:29] <GrueMaster> Not sure why it was targeted at d-i.  Not sure how they correlate, as the install works, just post install boot that doesn't.
[16:29] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 984007 in initramfs-tools "netinst d-i fails on armhf" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/984007
[16:31] <GrueMaster> When I first cracked it open, only "The Eilt Project" was listed.  Which is why I asked about the package.
[16:31] <ogra_> ah
[16:31] <GrueMaster> Multiple fingers in the pie.
[16:31] <ogra_> well, as i said, the eilt team kept us busy discussiong it for the last 2h :)
[16:31] <GrueMaster> Yes, I know.  I saw the scrollback.
[16:32] <ogra_> (until infinity showed up and said "yeah, i broke it" ) ;)
[16:32] <GrueMaster> And was also asked to reproduce it here.
[16:32] <ogra_> oh my
[16:32] <ogra_> howb about they start discussions in the right place so it doesnt need someone to carry over the transcription :P
[16:34] <GrueMaster> This issue appears to have been discussed in 4 separate channels then.  2 on our servers, #ac100, and here.
[16:34] <GrueMaster> So, define "The Right Place".
[16:34] <ogra_> here
[16:35] <ogra_> unless there is highly confidential info to be tossed around :P
[17:07] <spych102> i can't install omap extras because the graphics and multimedia packages don't install properly, is there another way to install the omap extras manually?
[17:35] <pnphi> pbuilder-satisfydepends failed
[17:36] <pnphi> what the err ?
[17:41] <djszapi> ogra_: hey
[17:41] <djszapi> for some reasons, my binary is not executed after reboot even after installing the relevant upstart job. :/
[17:46] <pnphi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/934294/\\
[17:46] <pnphi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/934294/\
[17:47] <pnphi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/934294/
[17:47] <pnphi> i cant fix this err
[18:06] <ogra_> LetoThe2nd, bug 984007
[18:06] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 984007 in initramfs-tools "netinst d-i fails on armhf" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/984007
[20:16] <LetoThe2nd> hm, after netinstalling on the panda, how to fixup the locales? dpkg-reconfigure locales regenerates things, but does not offer me to change them
[20:21] <rcn-ee> LetoThe2nd, i usually "sudo update-locale LANG="en_US.UTF-8" LANGUAGE="en_US.UTF-8" LC_ALL="en_US.UTF-8"" or whatever you want..
[20:22] <LetoThe2nd> rcn-ee: basically i just want to change the encoding to something sane. for messages and everything else, "C" is totally fine.
[21:12] <scientes> FUUUUUUUU
[21:12] <scientes> "That´s the case of the FlexCAN interface, the i.MX53 Support it, but the QSB Board does not have access to this interface. I apologize for this inconvenience.
[21:12] <scientes> "
[21:12] <scientes> -freescale email
[21:14] <jimerickson> just did an update and rebooted pandaboard and all i get is a kernel panic. going to re-image card with todays image and try again.
[21:15] <LetoThe2nd> jimerickson: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/984007
[21:15] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 984007 in eglibc "netinst d-i fails on armhf" [Critical,In progress]
[21:16] <jimerickson> ok thanks at least they know about it.
[21:16] <LetoThe2nd> jimerickson: looks like initramfs-tools is/was broken
[21:30] <jimerickson> so i should wait on any updates after i re-image the card
[21:31] <LetoThe2nd> jimerickson: bugtracker says fix released...
[21:32] <jimerickson> ok thanks LetoThe2nd
[22:07] <GrueMaster> jimerickson: I would wait until tomorrow's images are built.  The current ones are broken.
[22:10] <scientes> jimerickson, or you could fix it up with qemu-arm-static and the specific fixed versin
[22:58] <avinashhm> Hi , has any one used alsamixer in linaro-nano OR linaro-developer .. after installing alsamixer, when i launch, i get strange characters on the screen .. may be something related to color packages .. but not exactly sure .. has anyone tried alsa mixer on -nano OR -developer .. pls do give any pointers
[22:59] <avinashhm> I am getting o/p like - http://paste.ubuntu.com/934710/
[23:09] <jimerickson> GrueMaster: yes. broken. waiting...