[00:03] <jono> hey kklimonda
[04:30] <pitti> Good morning
[04:32] <ajmitch> morning pitti
[05:02] <pitti> RAOF, SpamapS, slangasek, cjwatson, ScottK: FYI, I switched queuediff's default release to precise
[05:43] <fossilet> Hello.
[05:44] <fossilet> What is the procedure to propose a certain package update after precise release?
[05:45] <fossilet> Is it just file a bug in Launchpad?
[05:45] <micahg> !sponsorship | fossilet
[05:47] <fossilet> It is updated recently in debian sid,  may later into testing.
[05:47] <fossilet> I suppose this update will not be synced to precise automatically, right?
[05:48] <fossilet> I have to upload it and find someone to sponsor it to the master archive?
[05:48] <micahg> fossilet: if it's unchanged in Ubuntu, it'll be autosync'd for quantal
[05:48] <micahg> fossilet: which package?
[05:48] <fossilet> 4digits
[05:49] <fossilet> Because the version in precise has a severe bug.
[05:49] <micahg> fossilet: you could run requestsync -e now if you want, unseeded universe is open for another 6 hours
[05:52] <fossilet> I still have time?
[05:53] <fossilet> wiki says 1.5 days before
[05:53] <fossilet> final release
[05:53] <fossilet> unseeded means not on cd/dvd?
[05:53] <micahg> fossilet: yes, that's 12:00 UTC today :), right now it's 06:00
[05:53]  * micahg still has at least one more upload
[05:54] <fossilet> so precise timing
[05:55] <fossilet> micahg,  Can you help me run that command? I have no ubuntu now. And after home, I may be later?
[05:55] <fossilet> late*
[05:55] <micahg> fossilet: do you have a launchpad account?
[05:55] <fossilet> yes
[05:56] <fossilet> fossilet
[05:56] <micahg> fossilet: can you log in and edit the description for the reason for the new version?
[05:56] <fossilet> where
[05:56] <micahg> launchpad
[05:56] <fossilet> edit where?
[05:56] <micahg> in the bug I'm about to file ;)
[05:57] <fossilet> ok
[05:57] <micahg> fossilet: actually looks like it's all bug fix, I"m syncing it now
[05:57] <fossilet> yup,
[05:58] <fossilet> This process does need some previlige?
[05:58] <RAOF> Hey, are we expecting to VT switch on suspend?
[05:58] <micahg> fossilet: requestsync doesn't (just ubuntu-dev-tools installed), syncing the package requires upload rights (which I just did)
[05:59] <fossilet> micahg, Thank you=)
[05:59] <micahg> fossilet: you're welcome
[06:01] <fossilet> micahg, one more question. Is precise still autosynced with debian testing even after release?
[06:02] <micahg> fossilet: no, new package versions will only go into quantal, these can be backported to precise if new features are needed (with the appropriate testing, see requestbackport script for more info), or fixes can be cherry picked and SRUd  (Stable Release Update) to precise
[06:03] <fossilet> what is quantal?
[06:03] <micahg> 12.10
[06:03] <fossilet> Oh, you even know that
[06:04] <fossilet> top secret
[06:04] <micahg> fossilet: http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1121
[06:04] <fossilet> not a animal!
[06:06] <fossilet> Oh
[06:06] <StevenK> Qantal is the codename
[06:06] <micahg> Quetzal is certainly an animal of sorts
[06:08] <fossilet> ya
[06:09] <slangasek> "Quantal" - it's not named after your national airline ;P
[06:10] <slangasek> RAOF: "vt switch on suspend" - no, but I think we still put the VT into text mode?
[06:10] <StevenK> slangasek: Bleh :-(
[06:10] <slangasek> :)
[06:10] <micahg> slangasek: well, if the blog title "Quality had a new name" was satirical ;)
[06:44] <dholbach> good morning
[06:53] <RAOF> slangasek: Reading the pm-utils scripts, it seems that we do still chvt to 63?
[06:53] <RAOF> Maybe?
[06:55] <RAOF> slangasek: I ask because if we *do* VT switch on suspend then bug #968845 is a whole lot easier to solve.
[07:09] <speakman> Hi folks. I'm about to fix #968845 but I'm not sure how to handle patches in <srcdir>/debian/patches/. Are there any documents how to do it?
[07:09] <pitti> speakman: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems documents the most common patch systems we have
[07:10] <speakman> pitti: thanks alot!
[07:14] <speakman> hmm... trying to build precies packages on oneric wasn't that very smart... How can I revert "sudo apt-get build-dep xxx"?
[07:15] <RAOF> speakman: Have your root filesystem on btrfs, be using apt-btrfs-snapshot, and do a rollback? :)
[07:15] <speakman> RAOF: I wish! ;)
[07:15] <micahg> speakman: run sudo mk-build-deps -i -r and uninstall?
[07:16] <RAOF> speakman: Presumably you've added precise sources to your sources.list in order to grab the needed versions of the build-deps?
[07:16] <micahg> you have to run that in the source dir
[07:17] <speakman> RAOF: I bzr branch'ed the package I was gonna fix and it (of course) lacked build dependencies. Just did "sudo apt-get build-dep xserver-xorg-input-synaptics" totally forgetting I was on Oneric (It's my home computer running Precise). :)
[07:18] <RAOF> Oh, then that's easy; micahg's command will work.
[07:18] <speakman> micahg: thanks, it created a xserver-xorg-input-synaptics-build-deps package, installed it and then removed it. Free'd 36,9 kB.
[07:18] <micahg> well, the only issue is if the initial install marked the packages as manual
[07:19] <RAOF> I was thinking that you'd installed precise packages on oneiric to satisfy some build-deps; that's a different kettle of fish.
[07:19] <speakman> I could go into apt log and remove manually of course.
[07:20] <micahg> speakman: means there's a build dep conflict (not surprising on oneiric), you can run lesspipe on the deb (get rid of the -i and sudo even) and see what you need to remove
[07:20] <micahg> speakman: be careful and what the removal output that it doesn't try to remove half your system or X or something
[08:25] <hyperair> any ubuntu-sru and ubuntu-release around? bug #981856 needs a sponsor
[08:25] <hyperair> er i meant ubuntu-sru and ubuntu-sponsors (main)
[08:30] <micahg> hyperair: you just need a core-dev or desktopper to upload
[08:30] <hyperair> yeah
[08:30] <speakman> sorry, but what's a "sponsor"?
[08:30] <hyperair> that's right.
[08:30] <hyperair> speakman: someone with upload privileges and willing to review packages for upload
[08:30] <speakman> Thanks
[08:31] <hyperair> speakman: while anyone can contribute to ubuntu, not everyone can directly upload into the archive. so people who don't have upload access to ubuntu require sponsors to review their contributions and upload them into ubuntu
[08:31] <speakman> Thanks I see
[08:33] <dholbach> and once you've worked with sponsors for a while and you gained their trust and some experience, you can apply for upload rights yourself :)
[08:34]  * speakman having a hard time just making a package install a script into /etc/pm/sleep.d/ :p
[08:35] <speakman> Should I make a patch which modifies Makefile.am to install the file, or should the debian/rules install it? It's a workaround for touchpads to be rmmod'ed and instantly insmod'ed after sleep: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-input-synaptics/+bug/968845
[08:36] <speakman> Ubuntu on MacBook Air is really unusable in the current state :(
[08:36] <hyperair> speakman: that depends on whether this should go upstream
[08:37] <hyperair> if the script is ubuntu-specific, then just drop something in debian/package-name.install
[08:37] <dholbach> @pilot in
[08:37] <hyperair> (and include the script in debian/
[08:38] <hyperair> speakman: if other distributions can benefit from the patch, you should amend Makefile.am to install the script, and send the patch upstream
[08:39] <dholbach> hyperair, regarding the glib-networking fix - I just had a look at the SRU procedure - do you think you could add a test-case to the bug description?
[08:39] <hyperair> dholbach: hmm okay.
[08:40] <speakman> hyperair: I think it's a quick workaround for now. It seems like no one really knows where the bug is. Re-inserting the bcm driver at least makes it work. It's a pure workaround but I don't the Precise should release without it (unless the real bug is fixed).
[08:43] <Laney> speakman: I've been interested in that bug too, and was going to do the patch (but since I didn't I'm glad you are). Just put it in debian/ and then reference it in debian/package-name.install as hyperair said.
[08:45] <RAOF> speakman: You should be aware that I've *probably* got a better fix for that bug.
[08:45] <Laney> yeah?
[08:45] <RAOF> Allow me to reboot, and check precise-proposed.
[08:46] <speakman> Laney: I was about to do it, but forgot I was on Oneric here at work. My MBA running Precise is at home. :)
[08:46] <speakman> RAOF: that would be awesome!
[08:48] <dholbach> can somebody please reject https://code.launchpad.net/~kroq-gar78/ubuntu/precise/scala/fix-987561/+merge/103191 based on my comment?
[08:49] <stgraber> dholbach: looking
[08:49] <dholbach> thanks stgraber
[08:50] <stgraber> dholbach: done
[08:50] <dholbach> merci beaucoup
[08:51] <RAOF> Laney, speakman: You can snaffle the source from the Unapproved queue; feel free to test it :) https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=
[08:51] <Laney> If I'd have known then I would have taken my laptop to work :P
[08:52] <Laney> still, nice. thanks!
[08:52] <dholbach> slangasek, is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libxml2/+bug/987502 sru material or something we should just fix through a merge from Debian in quantal?
[08:55] <dholbach> or a sync rather - nice
[09:01] <hyperair> dholbach: okay, i've put a test case into bug #981856
[09:01] <dholbach> thanks a lot hyperair - I'll take a look
[09:08] <speakman> RAOF: Looks great! How to inform the bug report subscribers it's about to be solved?
[09:08] <dholbach> hyperair, good work on the patch - it works :)
[09:09] <RAOF> speakman: That works correctly for you, then?  Next time someone who isn't me goes through the SRU queue it'll get a request-to-test on the bug.
[09:11] <speakman> RAOF: Sorry, I've got my MBA at home and can't test right now. I just went through the code changes and the original bug report at redhat and so on. I could go fetch my MBA in a few hours though. How do I get your proposed update? Just enable "Precise Proposed Updates" in the Software Souce settings?
[09:12] <RAOF> speakman: Yes, but only once it's actually *in* proposed; it needs to be accepted by an SRU team member.
[09:13] <speakman> Ok, I see! I'm not very familiar with the Ubuntu release path, but I'm learning  :)
[09:24] <speakman> Any idea where to get in touch with the utouch developers? (that's the folks working on multi touch gestures and stuff on Ubuntu right?)
[09:48] <speakman> RAOF: pitti just accepted your update and commented in bug report. Great! Will test as soon as it's available. :)
[09:50] <hyperair> dholbach: great, thanks =)
[09:50] <dholbach> anytime :)
[09:52] <pitti> anyone here familiar with Chinese Ubuntu? ArneGoetje, freeflying?
[09:52] <pitti> the Chinese image is oversized by 9 MB
[09:53] <pitti> based on this, our options are to remove one of: ttf-wqy-zenhei (we already ship microhei), ibus-table-wubi (we already ship sunpinyin), or libreoffice-help-zh-cn
[09:53] <pitti> what would hurt least?
[09:53] <pitti> note that a network install will pull these in, but not if you install offline, and it's also an issue for the live session
[09:56] <dholbach> dpm, ^ who could help out with pitti's question?
[10:00] <dpm> dholbach, pitti, I cannot help with this. I can ask on #ubuntu-cn-translators, but I'm not sure there is someone knowledgeable on fonts
[10:00] <pitti> I was hoping that freeflying is still online
[10:00] <pitti> happyaron isn't unfortunately
[10:02] <freeflying> pitti: anything I can help?
[10:03] <pitti> freeflying: I had a question 10 minutes ago here; I can re-post if you need
[10:03] <pitti> freeflying: hey, how are you?
[10:03] <freeflying> pitti: good, thanks
[10:03]  * freeflying scrolling back
[10:04] <freeflying> pitti: ttf-wqy-zenhei and sunpin can be dropped
[10:05] <pitti> freeflying: oh, so the android pinyin db is "good enough"?
[10:05] <pitti> freeflying: it's actually enough to drop just one of these, i. e. zenhei or wubi or sunpinyin
[10:05] <pitti> sunpinyin is biiig (20 MB), so dropping that would leave lots of room even
[10:07] <freeflying> pitti: the best pinyin is ibus-googlepinyin
[10:07] <freeflying> pitti: its footprint is much smaller than sunpinyin
[10:08] <pitti> freeflying: ah, that's in universe, so a little late for precise
[10:08] <pitti> freeflying: but we should get that into main in quantal then, and drop sunpinyin back to universe?
[10:08] <pitti> and use it on the Chinese images
[10:09] <pitti> freeflying: so dropping ttf-wqy-zenhei would be bearable?
[10:09] <freeflying> pitti: sure, since microhei is already there
[10:09] <pitti> freeflying: ok, many thanks!
[10:09] <freeflying> pitti: drop both sunpinyin and microhei will be fine
[10:10] <pitti> freeflying: does sunpinyin actually get in the way? we don't need to drop it
[10:10]  * pitti would rather make minimal changes now, we just need to fix the oversizedness
[10:11] <freeflying> pitti: I doubt how many people use it in real world, since googlepinyin has been in place for a while
[11:27] <dholbach> slangasek, there's a number of other multiarch requests in the sponsoring queue - what's your take? are they SRU material?
[13:04] <tsdgeos> ahasenack: ping
[13:04] <ahasenack> tsdgeos: hey
[13:04] <tsdgeos> ahasenack: did you get the unity-2d crash again? and if not did you get the debug line of the code we added?
[13:05] <ahasenack> tsdgeos: neither, but I could have missed the debug line
[13:05] <tsdgeos> i see
[13:05] <ahasenack> tsdgeos: as the crash is by itself quite noticeable
[13:05] <ahasenack> tsdgeos: still running in gdb in a terminal, and with the patch in place
[13:05] <tsdgeos> would you say that without the line would have crashed before in this time you've been using it?
[13:05] <tsdgeos> i.e. what was the average crashing time?
[13:05] <tsdgeos> hours? days? weeks?
[13:05] <ahasenack> tsdgeos: 2 days I would say
[13:06] <ahasenack> tsdgeos: meaning, I wouldn't go past 2 days without a crash
[13:06] <ahasenack> tsdgeos: can that log line be made a WARNING or ERROR?
[13:06] <tsdgeos> and you've been running it for 2, 3 days, right?
[13:06] <ahasenack> tsdgeos: yes
[13:07] <tsdgeos> ahasenack: well, you can change the contents of between the quotes freely
[13:07] <ahasenack> tsdgeos: sure, I was thinking about the colors :)
[13:07] <tsdgeos> feel free to put something long and with lots of caps there to make it easier to notice
[13:07] <tsdgeos> nah, don't think can do that
[13:08] <ahasenack> ok
[13:31] <dholbach> @pilot out
[13:31]  * ogra_ hugs dholbach 
[13:31]  * dholbach hugs ogra_ back :)
[13:38] <speakman>  How often is Ubuntu mirrors syncing?
[13:39] <cjwatson> it'll vary; #ubuntu-mirrors should have detail
[13:40] <speakman> thanks!
[13:40] <cjwatson> the master updates every half an hour, I vaguely recall hearing at some point that most were four hours, but I could be out of date
[13:51] <cyphermox> @pilot in
[14:22] <speakman> RAOF: Bad news, the mousepad now works after S3 but it's also scrolling the page while moving the cursor. I've enabled two-finger scroll fyi.
[14:33] <pitti> speakman: can you please report this at the bug, so that it becomes verification-failed? thanks for testing!
[14:35] <speakman> pitti: already did, and just replaced verification-needed with verification-failed
[14:35] <pitti> thanks
[14:36] <speakman> thanks for working with the bug :)
[14:44] <speakman> If there's anything else I can do, please tell me.
[15:23] <mneptok> is there a doily build Yoda in the house?
[15:23] <mneptok> err ...
[15:23] <mneptok> "daily." my wife does crochet. she can help with doilies.
[15:32] <slangasek> RAOF: hmm, ok, it looks like we do still chvt switch, yes
[15:32] <slangasek> dholbach: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libxml2/+bug/987502 isn't SRU material, no
[15:32] <dholbach> slangasek, and the other multiarch bugs in the sponsoring queue?
[15:33] <slangasek> I haven't seen what's there
[15:33] <slangasek> what's the best link for looking at the sponsoring queue?  firefox recently dumped my awesomebar cache :P
[15:33] <dholbach> 978228, 890928, 977940, 977952, 987502
[15:33] <dholbach> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
[15:48] <dholbach> slangasek, if you could comment on them that'd be very nice :)
[15:50] <slangasek> dholbach: several of those are candidates for SRU into precise, but I don't have time to comment on them currently; they're likely to be non-trivial
[15:51] <dholbach> hum - my pilot shift is over, but I wasn't sure which of these constitute SRU material and which don't
[15:51] <dholbach> I guess I'll just leave them for somebody else then
[15:52] <slangasek> the only one that's probably not SRU-worthy is libpaper
[16:33] <bdmurray> pitti: could you look at an sru for bug 987383?
[16:35] <bdmurray> mvo: could you look at bug 966474?
[17:03] <BenC> Anyone familiar enough with debian-installer to know how to add a source for udeb's in addition to the normal sources.list (for custom kernel udeb's)
[17:04] <BenC> I've already built with a custom kernel, but it doesn't know to look for the udeb's at my custom apt archive
[17:04] <cjwatson> build/sources.list.udeb.local is the easy way
[17:04] <cjwatson> if you start a build and then copy build/sources.list.udeb to that, you can customise from there
[17:05] <cjwatson> (or 'make -C build sources.list.udeb')
[17:06] <BenC> cjwatson: ah, thanks
[17:07] <BenC> cjwatson: so that will become part of the installer itself?
[17:08] <cjwatson> hm?
[17:10] <BenC> cjwatson: I want the resulting installer to know to use add my entry to sources.list for when it tries to install the kernel udeb during the install
[17:10] <cjwatson> that's handled separately I'm afraid
[17:10] <BenC> s/udeb/deb/
[17:10] <cjwatson> you can preseed it in apt-setup/local0/repository et al (see the installation guide, there's a little more and I forget the precise details)
[17:11] <cjwatson> build/sources.list.udeb* just controls the installer build system itself
[17:12] <BenC> Ah, ok, I'll check that then
[17:12] <BenC> Thanks
[19:24] <robbiew> cjohnston: ping
[19:24] <cjohnston> robbiew: sir?
[19:25] <robbiew> cjohnston: quick question, if summit grabs a blueprint and schedules it
[19:25] <robbiew> then we rename the blueprint
[19:25] <cjohnston> ::headdesk::
[19:25] <robbiew> does the older entry go away?
[19:25] <robbiew> lol
[19:25] <robbiew> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/meeting/20388/servercloud-q-swift-replacement/
[19:25] <robbiew> can you delete this?>
[19:25] <cjohnston> does that answer yourquestion?
[19:25] <cjohnston> yup
[19:25] <robbiew> thx
[19:25] <cjohnston> np
[19:25]  * robbiew keeps that in mind for the future
[19:25] <cjohnston> it is supposed to
[19:26] <robbiew> yeah...I thought it used to
[19:26] <cjohnston> but hey.. we got summit stable, but we can't do everything all at one
[19:26] <cjohnston> once
[19:26] <cjohnston> lol
[19:26] <robbiew> no worries
[19:28] <cjohnston> its on our radar.. I tried getting Daviey to do it..heh
[19:47] <jeinor> probably a stupid question, but: can I get hold of the probably-will-soon-be release images for precise today? or will they be released exactly on the date?
[20:23] <astraljava> jeinor: Release Candidates are being tested right now, of course you can get a hold of them.
[20:24] <astraljava> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com will help you there.
[20:31] <jeinor> will the RC differ in any way to the final release (if we pretend there will be no critical issues blocking the rc to be the release)?
[20:31] <jeinor> what I am asking is: will I have to make another upgrade/reinstall when the final version is released?
[20:32] <ScottK> jeinor: The images we have now may be the final images.  We don't know.  Even if we have to redo them though, you won't have to reinstall.  It'd just be a few package updates, the same as you get from time to time post release.
[20:39] <jeinor> ScottK, good news! I'm way to impatient to wait until thursday :)
[20:42] <jeinor> Is it the images called beta2? Can't find any named rc
[20:45] <ScottK> They aren't named RC.
[20:45] <ScottK> Look on cdimage.ubuntu.com
[20:45] <sladen> jeinor: eg. http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
[20:46] <jeinor> thanks
[20:57] <cyphermox> @pilot out
[21:06] <azert> hello there
[21:07] <azert> any ubuntu version for armel ?
[21:08] <ScottK> lamont: Looking at http://news.gmane.org/gmane.mail.postfix.user/cutoff=229255 I'm thinking we'll want a microversion update of postfix sooner rather than later.
[21:09] <lamont> some days, I hate ssl
[21:09] <dupondje> superm1: thanks for the rfkill patch :)
[21:09] <azert> anyone there ?
[21:09] <superm1> dupondje: sure :)
[21:09] <lamont> buehler
[21:10] <dupondje> Seems to work on a XPS L502X also
[21:10] <ScottK> lamont: Are there days you don't?
[21:11] <ScottK> The only days I don't are the ones where it's been abstracted away from me having to care about it.
[21:11] <lamont> ScottK: days when I'm sending email, and not working on postfix
[21:11] <ScottK> Right.  Email is hard.
[21:11] <lamont> lets go shopping
[21:12] <ScottK> Well, on spfbis (IETF working group ML) today one of the RFC 821/822 co-authors was having trouble sending mail.
[21:13] <lamont> well, I have this opinion about spf...
[21:13] <ScottK> I know.
[21:14] <ScottK> The point wasn't where, but who.
[21:14] <lamont> azert: the first ubuntu armel version I had was 9.04... I wouldn't recommend going that far back though... the current 11.10 bits are good, 12.04 are even better, albeit not quite out yet
[21:14] <lamont> ScottK: and the sympathy nonexistant. :D
[21:14] <lamont> oh.  this is an 821/822 author, not an spf author?
[21:14] <azert> where i can down load it ? lamont
[21:15] <ScottK> Yes.
[21:15] <lamont> azert: I'd prolly start at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ARM
[21:16] <lamont> azert: but it's more of a #ubuntu question than a #ubuntu-devel question