[15:28] <bencer> when does the DMB meeting start?
[15:55] <tumbleweed> bencer: 19:00 UTC https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard/Agenda
[16:11] <bencer> yup, just saw it, thanks tumbleweed, i'll be arround here for my PerPackage application
[18:16] <jjohansen> \o
[18:16] <tyhicks> Hello!
[18:17]  * sbeattie o/
[18:17] <micahg> at least I don't have to chair this one :)
[18:19] <micahg> or do I?
[18:19]  * micahg looks around for jdstrand
[18:20] <jjohansen> micahg: thanks for volunteering :)
[18:20] <micahg> jjohansen: I'm already doing one, what's two?
[18:20] <jjohansen> micahg: just teasing we should wait for jdstrand even if you were running it
[18:21] <micahg> I know :)
[18:22] <jdstrand> ok, sorry
[18:23] <jdstrand> I called the meeting then didn't show up :)
[18:23] <jdstrand> that is pretty lame
[18:23] <jdstrand> #startmeeting
[18:23] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon May 21 18:23:15 2012 UTC.  The chair is jdstrand. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[18:23] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[18:23] <jdstrand> The meeting agenda can be found at:
[18:23] <jdstrand> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/Meeting
[18:23] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Weekly stand-up report
[18:23] <jdstrand> I'll go first
[18:23] <jdstrand> I am on triage this week
[18:24] <jdstrand> mdeslaur and I will be finishing the work items review this week
[18:24] <jdstrand> I will be publishing a libxml2 update today or tomorrow
[18:24] <jdstrand> I have several pending updates I am working on
[18:24] <jdstrand> and then an embargoed issue
[18:25] <jdstrand> I'm hitting small work items here and there, and have started ufw python3 port (over the weekend, but may poke at it some this week)
[18:26] <jdstrand> mdeslaur is off today. I know he is working on pending updates. he is in the happy place
[18:26] <jdstrand> sbeattie: you're up
[18:26] <sbeattie> I'm on community this week
[18:26] <sbeattie> I've also got a few updates in progress.
[18:27] <sbeattie> I'm also planning on apparmor work this week.
[18:27] <sbeattie> I think that's it for me.
[18:27] <sbeattie> micahg: you're next
[18:28] <jdstrand> sbeattie: are those apparmor work items, the SRU or some combination?
[18:29] <sbeattie> jdstrand: SRU + work items, yes.
[18:29] <micahg> I've got patch piloting today, webkit update for precise this week, apparmor profile fixes for Firefox/Thunderbird (SRU for lucid-precise), will do earlier in the week so as not to block sbeattie, and chromium's build is broke ATM, so I need to dig into that as there's a pending update
[18:29] <jdstrand> awesome, thanks :)
[18:30] <micahg> I guess that's it for me
[18:30] <tyhicks> I'm in the happy place this week
[18:31] <tyhicks> It is a short week for me since I'm off Friday
[18:31] <tyhicks> I took on a sudo update and a sudo feature backport last week, so I've still got my eCryptfs work that I planned on doing last week
[18:32] <tyhicks> I imagine that getting caught up on eCryptfs bug fixes and the kernel merge window will soak up most of my week. I've got a few bug fixes that have patches written, I just haven't had a chance to test and push them upstream.
[18:32] <tyhicks> If I do get through all of that early, I've got a pidgin update that is pending in the testing stage.
[18:33] <tyhicks> (I see a reoccuring theme here :)
[18:33] <tyhicks> That's it for me
[18:33] <tyhicks> jjohansen: You're up
[18:33]  * jjohansen needs to work with sbeattie on releasing apparmor 2.8 this week, there are a couple of minor patches to finish up/test finish. /me also needs to finish going through work items and sticking time estimates on them. After that its back to resurrecting prototypes, dbus, cgroups, env filtering
[18:34] <jjohansen> I think that is about it jdstrand back to you?
[18:34] <jdstrand> jjohansen: how did the quantal kernel fixes go?
[18:35] <jjohansen> jdstrand: oh those look good, thanks for the kick I forgot to push them on the weekend
[18:35]  * jjohansen will do that first
[18:35]  * jjohansen got side tracked bug hunting
[18:35] <jdstrand> cool
[18:35]  * jdstrand wasn't trying to kick, just curious :)
[18:36] <jjohansen> nah, is good
[18:36] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Highlighted packages
[18:36] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/libspring-java.html
[18:36] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/python-tornado.html
[18:36] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/drupal6-mod-views.html
[18:36] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/dimp1.html
[18:36] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/pyfribidi.html
[18:37] <jdstrand> The Ubuntu Security team will highlight some community-supported packages that might be good candidates for updating and or triaging. If you would like to help Ubuntu and not sure where to start, this is a great way to do so.
[18:37] <jdstrand> See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures for details and if you have any questions, feel free to ask in #ubuntu-security. To find out other ways of helping out, please see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/GettingInvolved.
[18:37] <jdstrand> did that slightly out of order...
[18:37] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Miscellaneous and Questions
[18:37] <jdstrand> There are a lot of merge opportunities for packages listed in http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/d2u/. Performing these updates is a great way to help Ubuntu and bolster your developer application.
[18:37] <jdstrand> I also had two other things
[18:38] <jdstrand> 1. jjohansen has too many work items. once he gives time estimates mdeslaur and I will look at them and then probably discuss as a team how to proceed (eg, Roadmap 'low' ones or reassign some)
[18:38] <jdstrand> (mdeslaur will lead that effort)
[18:39] <jdstrand> 2. the desktop team approached me about testing mozilla releases before upstream release day
[18:39] <jdstrand> (fyi micahg ^)
[18:39] <jdstrand> I said that this is the plan and that we have work items in place to achieve this
[18:40] <micahg> they do realize this is one day, right?
[18:40] <jdstrand> micahg: no, test the images for they tag them
[18:40] <jdstrand> like we said, we build them automatically
[18:40] <micahg> jdstrand: huh?
[18:40] <jdstrand> when it gets close, we test
[18:40] <jdstrand> s/for they/before they/
[18:41] <micahg> yes, I mean there is only 1 work day to do this still (builds are tagged on Friday), yes, it's possible
[18:41] <jdstrand> eg, the release every 6 weeks
[18:41] <jdstrand> at 5 weeks, we can have testable packages
[18:41] <micahg> no, we can't
[18:41] <jdstrand> why?
[18:41] <micahg> they push out fixes in the final week
[18:41]  * jdstrand nods
[18:41] <micahg> the beta PPA is for people to test
[18:42] <jdstrand> the beta ppa is on 15 or something now, no?
[18:42] <micahg> ideally, people are running the beta and reporting issues along the way so my final testing is basically a rubber stamp
[18:42] <mdeslaur> test = look at 20 screenshots
[18:42] <micahg> if I catch anything in my testing, it's too late anyways
[18:43] <micahg> yeah, once we have the automated testing screenshots, I think I'll run that against the beta PPA weekly, that should improve things
[18:43] <micahg> s/improve/catch things earlier/
[18:43] <jdstrand> I would still argue that testing twice, once a week before and one day of would still be better than testing a day or two after
[18:43] <jdstrand> even if it is not automated yet
[18:43] <jdstrand> but anyway
[18:43] <micahg> sure, I can QA the beta the week before
[18:44] <jdstrand> in this particular instance, that asked if we could test early (ie, twice) to catch anything for the point release
[18:44] <jdstrand> micahg: can you coordinate that with the desktop team-- ie the exact timing)
[18:44] <micahg> the point release is in 3 months, we'll have 2 more releases before that
[18:45] <jdstrand> micahg: you might also mention the beta ppa-- I mentioned it, but they ones I saw were way past '13'-- they were on 15
[18:45] <micahg> 12.04.1 will get FIrefox 14
[18:45] <sbeattie> jdstrand: is there ay possibility of getting QA resources to assist?
[18:45] <jdstrand> micahg: yes, I know-- but they asked for this to happen in a couple of weeks. can you coordinate/clarify what they need?
[18:46]  * jdstrand is trying not to be the middle-man
[18:46] <micahg> jdstrand: sure, who's the contact for that?
[18:46] <jdstrand> seb128 asked me-- I imagine either him or chris
[18:46] <micahg> sbeattie: I asked QA a while back to start running QRT, maybe I can get them to review the results more frequently once we have the screenshotting capability
[18:47] <jdstrand> sbeattie: well, now that we are on rapid release, we don't have the big call for testing-- everything is just a 'regular' update
[18:47] <micahg> jdstrand: I think he meant help with testing :)
[18:47] <jdstrand> and all they are asking for is us to do our regular testing by some point
[18:47] <sbeattie> jdstrand: what micahg said, not just calls for testing.
[18:47] <jdstrand> (see last statement)
[18:48] <jdstrand> and since that regular testing is something we should be doing anyway, I said 'ok'
[18:49] <jdstrand> anyhoo, this is a little more complicated than it has to be. desktop team needs tests to happen be a certain date. if micahg can ascertain the date and do the testing, that would be great. everything else is executing our work items
[18:52] <jdstrand> I think that is it
[18:52] <jdstrand> Does anyone have any other questions or items to discuss?
[18:57] <jdstrand> #endmeeting
[18:57] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon May 21 18:57:23 2012 UTC.
[18:57] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-05-21-18.23.moin.txt
[18:57] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-05-21-18.23.html
[18:57] <jdstrand> mdeslaur, sbeattie, micahg, tyhicks, jjohansen: thanks!
[18:57] <micahg> thanks jdstrand
[18:57] <sbeattie> jdstrand: thank you!
[18:57] <jjohansen> thanks jdstrand
[18:57] <tyhicks> thanks!
[19:00] <jdstrand> ah, one more thing:
[19:01] <jdstrand> Felix Geyer (debfx) provided a debdiff for pidgin-otr (LP: #1000363)
[19:01] <jdstrand> Your work is very much appreciated and will keep Ubuntu users secure. Great job! :)
[19:01] <micahg> !dmb-ping
[19:02]  * stgraber waves
[19:02] <tumbleweed> hi
[19:02] <bencer> hi all, bencer here for the DMB meeting
[19:02] <micahg> we need one more for quorum
[19:03]  * bdrung waves
[19:04] <micahg> #startmeeting
[19:04] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon May 21 19:04:24 2012 UTC.  The chair is micahg. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[19:04] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[19:04] <micahg> #topic Review of previous action items
[19:05] <micahg> I don't seem to recall any that need discussing and the wiki isn't showing any either
[19:05] <micahg> anyone have anything to discuss WRT this?
[19:06]  * micahg takes that as a no, moving on
[19:06] <stgraber> I think we took care of all past actions during the last meeting, that's unless we count the recuring action for cody-somerville to write that wiki page on testimonials, but this one has been there for more than 6 months now :)
[19:06]  * micahg also has a recurring action item that he'll get to next week
[19:06] <micahg> #topic Cesare Falco PPU
[19:07] <micahg> cfalco: are you around?
[19:07] <cfalco> hi all!
[19:07] <micahg> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/c.falco/DeveloperApplication
[19:07]  * tumbleweed looks for an IRC log for the previous conversation
[19:08] <micahg> #link http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/04/23/%23ubuntu-meeting.html#t19:35
[19:08] <tumbleweed> ah, thanks
[19:11] <micahg> cfalco: so, continuing from last time, if a few files moved from one package to another, let's say mame -> mame-common, what changes would need to made to the packaging to accommodate this
[19:11] <micahg> *to be made
[19:11] <cfalco> depends
[19:11] <bdrung> micahg: your question is a reminder for me for the vlc PPA package. ;)
[19:12] <cfalco> @micahg: what's vlc? :o
[19:12] <meetingology> cfalco: Error: "micahg:" is not a valid command.
[19:12] <micahg> cfalco: vlc is a package that bdrung maintains in Debian
[19:12] <cfalco> micahg: what's vlc? :o
[19:13] <cfalco> ah ok :)
[19:13] <cfalco> mame should depend on mame-common
[19:14] <cfalco> and maybe also a breaks or something, or dpkg could have trouble in removing mame before installing mame-common
[19:14] <cfalco> but before doing anything I would check the debian policy ;)
[19:14] <tumbleweed> let's assume you already had mame and mame-common, and so mame was already depending on mame-common
[19:15] <tumbleweed> but you moved a file from mame to mame-common
[19:15] <cfalco> I guess replace is only suitable when *all* files get moved
[19:15] <cfalco> correct?
[19:17] <micahg> replaces isn't what you think it would be
[19:19] <micahg> cfalco: do you know where to look up these things?
[19:19] <cfalco> micahg: ok, so I assume I should use replace?
[19:19] <cfalco> micahg: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html
[19:21] <micahg> well, I'd like you to tell me the changes :) (and that's the right link)
[19:22] <cfalco> ok both, replaces: and breaks: :$
[19:22] <cfalco> and we were assuming depends: from the start
[19:23] <cfalco> I must admit I thought replaces: is only suitable when *all* files are to be replaced
[19:23] <micahg> for which packages and are they versioned?
[19:24] <micahg> cfalco: yeah, replaces is slightly counterintuitive from the non-packaging definition
[19:25] <cfalco> micahg: the version I'm packaging... i.e I'm packaging mame-common 2.0: -> Replaces: mame (<< 2.00)
[19:25] <cfalco> where << is strictly less than iirc
[19:25] <micahg> cfalco: cool, thanks
[19:26] <bdrung> cfalco: which tools will you use to sync a package from Debian to Ubuntu?
[19:27] <cfalco> bdrung: I guess it's syncpackage, but I still have to read all the documentation on this
[19:28] <bdrung> cfalco: why not just use dput?
[19:30] <cfalco> bdrung: I see it preserves the checksums and I'm not sure dput would do that
[19:31] <bdrung> cfalco: dput can preserve the checksums, but it opens a window for errors. that's why using syncpackage is recommended.
[19:31] <tumbleweed> cfalco: are you subscribed to ubuntu-devel-announce?
[19:32] <cfalco> not yet
[19:32] <tumbleweed> please do, it's where freezes are announced
[19:32] <tumbleweed> (amongst other useful things)
[19:33] <cfalco> tumbleweed: I'll do it for sure :D
[19:33] <barry> cfalco: i see that mame is out of sync b/w ubuntu and debian.  what are your plans for sync'ing them and how would you go about doing that?
[19:34] <cfalco> barry: mame 0.146 has just been released today, it will mark the first release synced from Debian
[19:34] <tumbleweed> \o/
[19:35] <barry> cfalco: cool.  do you foresee any reason for ubuntu to carry deltas from debian in the future?
[19:36] <cfalco> barry: no, I'm working with the debian maintainers and we will make things suitable for both distros as much as we can
[19:36] <barry> cfalco: great, thanks
[19:37] <bdrung> cfalco: btpd is only available in Ubuntu. are there plans to get it into Debian?
[19:38] <cfalco> bdrung: no at present, but I'd like to. I find it very useful, but it seems nobody else is interested.
[19:39] <bdrung> cfalco: how did you come to the conclusion that nobody is interested?
[19:40] <cfalco> bdrung: is the utnubu team still  active? maybe I could find some help from them.
[19:40] <cfalco> bdrung: I have no feedbacks in ubuntu, let alone debian... ;)
[19:41] <tumbleweed> cfalco: there are a bunch of ubuntu people who are DDs. I'm working on a list that makes them easy to find
[19:41] <cfalco> tumbleweed: cool! is it in the wiki?
[19:41] <bdrung> cfalco: dunno if utnubu is still active, but debian mentors is up and running.
[19:42] <micahg> DEX has superseded utnubu for the most part AIUI
[19:42] <micahg> Ubuntu DEX to be more specific
[19:42] <tumbleweed> yeah, you don't need ubuntu-developers to sponsor it, any debian sponsor will do. But obviously ubuntu people have extra motivation to help us get ubuntu packagesinto Debian
[19:43] <tumbleweed> the list is here, but doesn't show who the DDs are yet http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~stefanor/debian-ubuntu-developers/
[19:44] <cfalco> I see micahg is a DEX member, right? :)
[19:44] <micahg> yeah, with no Debian uploads
[19:44]  * micahg needs to fix that
[19:45] <micahg> cfalco: are you familiar with how to request a freeze exception and when it's appropriate
[19:46] <cfalco> micahg: i did it once for btpd, for a minor fix in a configuration file iirc
[19:47] <cfalco> it was long ago, I'd need to check the wiki :$
[19:47] <micahg> cfalco: ok, you know where that is?
[19:48] <cfalco> micahg: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
[19:48] <micahg> cfalco: great
[19:48] <micahg> ok, any more questions?
[19:48] <bdrung> yes
[19:48] <bdrung> cfalco: what changes with DIF?
[19:50] <cfalco> bdrung: after dif packages with differences between ubuntu and debian must be imported explicitly by a developer
[19:51] <bdrung> cfalco: are package with differences between ubuntu and debian synced automatically before the DIF?
[19:52] <cfalco> bdrung: I guess no, as the version is different
[19:53] <cfalco> I mean the 0ubuntuNN suffix
[19:53] <bdrung> cfalco: then i have to ask again: what is the different before and after the DIF?
[19:54] <bdrung> because packages with 0ubuntuNN needs to be always synced manually
[19:54] <bdrung> (or merged)
[19:55] <cfalco> bdrung: I guess it's like the "main" freeze
[19:56] <cfalco> I mean, before dif you sync the package
[19:56] <cfalco> after dif you ask something like a freeze exception
[19:56] <bdrung> no: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianImportFreeze
[19:57] <bdrung> new versions of packages will be automatically imported from Debian where they have not been customized for Ubuntu
[19:57] <bdrung> that's before the DIF and it needs to be done manually afterwards
[19:57] <cfalco> bdrung: so no syncpackage is required on a non-customised package before dif?
[19:57] <bdrung> you are still allowed to sync packages with new features after DIF
[19:58] <bdrung> cfalco: exactly
[19:58] <cfalco> bdrung: great
[19:58] <micahg> that is unless you have an immediate need in the devel release (bug fix needed immediately, FTBFS, NBS)
[19:58] <cfalco> and should a new version be put in debian after dif I'll have to manually sync it in ubuntu, right?
[19:58] <tumbleweed> yup
[19:59] <micahg> ok, we need to vote
[19:59] <cfalco> bdrung, micahg, tumbleweed: thanks!
[19:59] <micahg> #voters bdrung, cody-somerville, Laney, micahg, barry, tumbleweed, stgraber
[19:59] <meetingology> Current voters: Laney barry bdrung cody-somerville micahg stgraber tumbleweed
[20:00] <Laney> posh
[20:00] <micahg> #vote Cesare Falco PPU for btpd and mame
[20:00] <meetingology> Please vote on: Cesare Falco PPU for btpd and mame
[20:00] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
[20:00] <Laney> +1
[20:00] <meetingology> +1 received from Laney
[20:00] <tumbleweed> +1
[20:00] <meetingology> +1 received from tumbleweed
[20:00] <barry> +1
[20:00] <meetingology> +1 received from barry
[20:00] <bdrung> +1
[20:00] <meetingology> +1 received from bdrung
[20:01] <micahg> +1
[20:01] <meetingology> +1 received from micahg
[20:01] <micahg> stgraber: ?
[20:01] <stgraber> +0 [would have liked to see better pre-meeting knowledge of the Ubuntu processes and freezes]
[20:01] <meetingology> +0 [would have liked to see better pre-meeting knowledge of the Ubuntu processes and freezes] received from stgraber
[20:02] <micahg> #endvote
[20:02] <meetingology> Voting ended on: Cesare Falco PPU for btpd and mame
[20:02] <meetingology> Votes for:5 Votes against:0 Abstentions:1
[20:02] <meetingology> Motion carried
[20:02] <micahg> cfalco: congratulations
[20:02] <cfalco> thanks anyone! :)
[20:02] <micahg> #action stgraber to give cfalco PPU for btpd and mame
[20:02] <meetingology> ACTION: stgraber to give cfalco PPU for btpd and mame
[20:02] <micahg> #action micahg to add cfalco to ubuntu-dev
[20:02] <meetingology> ACTION: micahg to add cfalco to ubuntu-dev
[20:04] <micahg> #topic PPU for Jorge Salamero Sanz
[20:04] <micahg> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JorgeSalamero/PerPackageDeveloperApplication
[20:04] <micahg> cfalco: one last thing, just want to encourage you to come to #ubuntu-motu with any questions
[20:04] <stgraber> micahg: action done
[20:04] <micahg> stgraber: thanks
[20:04] <micahg> bencer: can you introduce yourself?
[20:05] <bencer> hi all
[20:05] <bencer> I'm Jorge Salamero aka bencer
[20:05] <cfalco> micahg: sure, thank you! :)
[20:05] <bencer> I'm a DD since a few years already, now I'm working on eBox Technologies, the company behind Zentyal (previously eBox Platform)
[20:06] <bencer> I'm applying for PerPackage rights to upload zentyal packages to Universe, eventually main if we make it
[20:06] <bencer> I've been working on the packages, although is jacalvo, the product manager the one making the releases
[20:07] <bencer> and I also have pushed all the needed deps via Debian and then requesting the sync
[20:07] <bencer> I was in Oakland on the UDS, holding 4 sessions on Zentyal / Ubuntu integration
[20:08] <bencer> and seems that we made a good progress making people aware of Zentyal and for Q we have some blueprints we are going to work together with Edubuntu ppl
[20:08] <bencer> I think that's it :)
[20:10] <bencer> micahg: any questions?
[20:11] <barry> bencer: hi.  i noticed that zentyal is only in ubuntu currently.  you're a dd - why isn't zentyal in debian?
[20:11] <bencer> barry: zentyal uses some ubuntu specific stuff
[20:12] <bencer> like upstart, appamor and specially the versions of the packages
[20:12] <bencer> i always say that would take 3-4 days work to make it fully working on debian
[20:12] <micahg> upstart and apparmor are in Debian (not entirely functional yet, but that's a WIP)
[20:12] <bencer> but we dont have the time
[20:12] <bencer> i know, its wip
[20:13] <micahg> once they are updated and available and working, would you then be interested in pushing this work up?
[20:13] <bencer> but probably the biggest issue is that our versions depend on ubuntu versions
[20:13] <barry> bencer: but if someone contributed changes to make it possible, would you sponsor it into debian?
[20:13] <bencer> sure
[20:13] <bencer> we are working a lot on getting more contributors
[20:14] <micahg> I'm glad to see the dependencies at least pushed to Debian which lays the ground work for someone to do the last mile bit
[20:14] <bencer> due the philosophy of zentyal, most of our community are sysadmins with not developers/integrators
[20:14] <bencer> micahg: yes, we always do that, we want to contribute as much as we can to debian/ubuntu
[20:14] <bencer> we have sent some patches to asterisk
[20:15] <bencer> filled bugs to launchpad on per daily basis (almost) :)
[20:15] <bencer> and some contributions to samba4 are on the way
[20:16] <tumbleweed> bencer: I seem to recall that the zentyl packages have only had a single upload so far
[20:16] <tumbleweed> which required a bit of back and forth for sponsorship
[20:16] <tumbleweed> are you confident in yoru ability to maintain them from here?
[20:18] <bencer> ok, sorry guys, i had some problems with the charger, im back
[20:18] <bencer> tumbleweed: what happened is that in the past, was a volunteer/unofficial upload
[20:19] <tumbleweed> what has changed since then?
[20:19] <bencer> now one of our project goals is to get the best integration with the ubuntu ecosystem we can get
[20:19] <bencer> so we have official resources=time, to invest in ubuntu
[20:19] <tumbleweed> right
[20:19] <bencer> also this is not a new upload, but a rename of the packages
[20:19] <bencer> in the past the packages were ebox-*
[20:19] <bencer> now they are zentyal-*
[20:19] <tumbleweed> yeah, I seem to recall that Breaks + Replaces was missing in the rename
[20:20] <bencer> yeah, that was fixed on time :)
[20:20] <micahg> bencer: yes, but you also only had one round of the ebox packages, and that was a year previous
[20:20] <tumbleweed> I assume we can expect some more frequent uploads now?
[20:20] <bencer> yes, i've not too much to say about the previous packages
[20:20] <bencer> tumbleweed: yes, i can show you more than words
[20:21] <tumbleweed> bencer: you are subscribed to ubuntu-devel-announce?
[20:21] <bencer> http://git.zentyal.org/zentyal.git/commit/ac1c7717efdd52cb763ec55e8c10b61301a8b053
[20:21] <bencer> this commit fixes one of the reported issues on launchpad
[20:22] <bencer> to the packages we uploaded
[20:22] <bencer> we are going to discuss if it should go to SRU or not
[20:22] <bencer> tumbleweed: sure
[20:22] <bencer> also security, -server, -edu and -doc
[20:22] <tumbleweed> good
[20:23] <bencer> since we have a chapter in the ubuntu-server-guide
[20:23] <bdrung> bencer: why are the packages all native packages?
[20:24] <bencer> bdrung: this has been a hot point
[20:24] <bencer> we consider zentyal as an ubuntu only software
[20:24] <bencer> is tied to ubuntu software like i said (upstart, apparmor, etc)
[20:24] <bencer> and is tied to specific versions included in ubuntu
[20:25] <bencer> our configuration templates are tested with the versions on ubuntu
[20:25] <bdrung> other packages are tied to upstart and apport too, but aren't native
[20:25] <bencer> not with any squid or dansguardian versions for example
[20:25] <bencer> bdrung: imho we can find reasons to push in both directions, native and non-native
[20:26] <bencer> according to the policy, we define ourselves as native, and we are native
[20:26] <bencer> true that we could be non-native
[20:26] <bencer> but current status is as it is
[20:26] <bencer> maybe the day someone contributes debian support, we can evaluate going to non-native
[20:26] <bdrung> but with more maintenance power it could become non-native with supporting other distros?
[20:26] <bencer> but at the moment, we only run on ubuntu, so we are native :)
[20:27] <bencer> could be, but the company is not interested in supporting other distros
[20:27] <bencer> so that would be community contributions
[20:27] <bdrung> you wrote that you dislike when Debian and Ubuntu packaging are different without justification
[20:27] <bdrung> do you have examples for it?
[20:28] <bencer> in the past asterisk, at the moment i dont know the status
[20:28] <bencer> i think they are the same now
[20:28] <micahg> no, we still have a diff
[20:28] <bencer> if eventuall we want zentyal in debian
[20:29] <bencer> having the packages we use, be as similar as possible, would help a lot
[20:29] <bencer> but again, i dont see debian support close, maitenance of it wouldnt be easy neither
[20:29] <bencer> as the release cycles of both doesnt fit
[20:29] <bdrung> bencer: any ideas to reduce the amount of differences? do you work on getting the differences reduced?
[20:30] <bencer> bdrung: our first goal was to get the zentyal packages on a good shape in precise
[20:30] <bencer> now our goal is going to be to contribute patches to make all the services we depend on, use upstart
[20:31] <bencer> also some contributions are in the roadmap, like sssd support on auth-client-config
[20:31] <bencer> reducing the differences was a personal thing, more than something scheduled on the roadmap
[20:32] <micahg> bencer: are you aware of the various freezes in Ubuntu and how they might affect your ability to upload?
[20:33] <bencer> yes
[20:33] <bencer> micahg: we already had to deal with that
[20:33] <bencer> zentyal packages got uploaded with a feature freeze exception
[20:34] <micahg> bencer: ok, what about the milestone freezes, if for example, edubuntu would have an image with zentyal on it
[20:34] <bencer> yup, our internal planification is done with the wiki page of release timeline next to us
[20:35] <bencer> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QuantalQuetzal/ReleaseSchedule
[20:36] <micahg> so, if zentyal were on and Edubuntu image, would you be able to upload a new version on June 6?
[20:36] <micahg> s/and/an/
[20:36] <bencer> yup, actually we plan to upload something close to our zentyal 3.0rc
[20:37] <bencer> i already discussed this with jacalvo, in charge of the releases
[20:37] <bencer> but as this schedule was published a few days ago, still we dont have detailed plan
[20:37] <bencer> but we are totally aware of the dates
[20:38] <micahg> bencer: I'm not so sure :), June 6 is relevant for uploads on images, do you know why?
[20:38] <highvoltage> yeah we talked about it in the edubuntu session, so the actual upload after the freeze would just be a minor bug fix upload
[20:39] <bencer> micahg: probably to deal with images sizes?, but i dont know exactly why
[20:40] <bencer> having upload privileges will help to be faster uploading packages
[20:40] <micahg> bencer: for alphas, the archive is soft frozen, any uploads for sources that affect images needs to be coordinated with teh release team
[20:40] <bencer> also rebuilding all the images take time, so a change in on of the packages forces a complete rebuild
[20:41] <micahg> right
[20:41] <micahg> so, given that, would you still upload a new version on June 6?
[20:42] <bencer> only if a critical bug is found that forces us to do so
[20:42] <bencer> but will try our best to have everything before ready
[20:42] <micahg> bencer: what would you do if you found a bug that needed to be uploaded?
[20:42] <bencer> also i cound with the support of more experienced people like highvoltage or jamespage (or last sponsor)
[20:42] <bencer> count*
[20:43] <bencer> so we will be asking for advice to them when in doubt
[20:43] <bencer> well, as this will be because edubuntu, first of all i will discuss about the bug with edubuntu people
[20:44] <bencer> and if we dont have any other option that request a new upload
[20:44] <bencer> file a bug and explain the release team the situation
[20:44] <micahg> bencer: are you subscribed to ubuntu-devel-announce?
[20:45] <bencer> yup
[20:45] <bencer> all announces about release dates are sent there
[20:45] <micahg> bencer: do you envision more people wanting to apply for upload rights to these packages?
[20:46] <bencer> jacalvo in the future too, so i'm not the only one, in case i'm super busy with something else
[20:46] <bencer> also i plan to ask for motu once i'm more experienced with the ubuntu workflows, which are different to the debian ones i'm used to and i know well
[20:46] <micahg> ok, I'd like to create a packageset with those packages in it then
[20:47] <bencer> this way we will be able to work more on depends
[20:47] <bencer> but that will be after we start contributing patches to these packages, doesnt make sense to do it now
[20:47] <micahg> bencer: do you have a description we can use for that packageset to determine what belongs in it?  (is zentyal-* sufficient?)
[20:47] <bencer> there is an other one
[20:47] <micahg> (we still have to vote on the packageset and your rights as well)
[20:48] <bdrung> zbuildtools does not match zentyal-*
[20:48] <micahg> bencer: right, I see zbuildtools as well (I mean for future additions that won't require coming back to the DMB to be added)
[20:48] <bencer> zbuildtools
[20:48] <bencer> +zentyal-*
[20:48] <micahg> ok
[20:49] <micahg> so, we'll take 2 votes, one on the packageset and one for bencer to upload to it
[20:49] <micahg> #vote create a zentyal packageset with zbuildtools, zentyal-ca, zentyal-common, zentyal-core, zentyal-dhcp, zentyal-dns, zentyal-firewall, zentyal-network, zentyal-ntp, zentyal-objects, zentyal-openvpn, zentyal-printers, zentyal-samba, zentyal-services, zentyal-squid, zentyal-users as the initial packages and zentyal-* for the addition criteria
[20:49] <meetingology> Please vote on: create a zentyal packageset with zbuildtools, zentyal-ca, zentyal-common, zentyal-core, zentyal-dhcp, zentyal-dns, zentyal-firewall, zentyal-network, zentyal-ntp, zentyal-objects, zentyal-openvpn, zentyal-printers, zentyal-samba, zentyal-services, zentyal-squid, zentyal-users as the initial packages and zentyal-* for the addition criteria
[20:49] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
[20:49] <barry> +1
[20:49] <bdrung> +1
[20:49] <meetingology> +1 received from barry
[20:49] <meetingology> +1 received from bdrung
[20:49] <micahg> +1
[20:49] <meetingology> +1 received from micahg
[20:50] <stgraber> +1
[20:50] <meetingology> +1 received from stgraber
[20:50] <micahg> Laney: ?
[20:50] <Laney> +0 // sorry, I've dropped the ball on this one and not been paying attention
[20:50] <meetingology> +0 // sorry, I've dropped the ball on this one and not been paying attention received from Laney
[20:50] <micahg> we have a +1 from tumbleweed also
[20:51] <micahg> #endvote
[20:51] <meetingology> Voting ended on: create a zentyal packageset with zbuildtools, zentyal-ca, zentyal-common, zentyal-core, zentyal-dhcp, zentyal-dns, zentyal-firewall, zentyal-network, zentyal-ntp, zentyal-objects, zentyal-openvpn, zentyal-printers, zentyal-samba, zentyal-services, zentyal-squid, zentyal-users as the initial packages and zentyal-* for the addition criteria
[20:51] <meetingology> Votes for:4 Votes against:0 Abstentions:1
[20:51] <meetingology> Motion carried
[20:51] <micahg> #action micahg to create LP team related to the new packageset
[20:51] <meetingology> ACTION: micahg to create LP team related to the new packageset
[20:51] <micahg> #action stgraber to create the packageset and make the new team the uploader of it
[20:51] <meetingology> ACTION: stgraber to create the packageset and make the new team the uploader of it
[20:52] <micahg> #action micahg to document the packageset
[20:52] <meetingology> ACTION: micahg to document the packageset
[20:52] <micahg> #vote Jorge Salamero Sanz for upload rights to the zentyal packageset
[20:52] <meetingology> Please vote on: Jorge Salamero Sanz for upload rights to the zentyal packageset
[20:52] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
[20:52] <bdrung> +1
[20:52] <meetingology> +1 received from bdrung
[20:53] <barry> +1
[20:53] <meetingology> +1 received from barry
[20:53] <stgraber> +1
[20:53] <meetingology> +1 received from stgraber
[20:54] <Laney> +0
[20:54] <meetingology> +0 received from Laney
[20:55] <bdrung> we have a +1 from tumbleweed also
[21:00] <tumbleweed> +1 (I'm back)
[21:00] <meetingology> +1 (I'm back) received from tumbleweed
[21:01] <micahg> +0 conditionally that bencer reviews the freeze process again with stgraber (I would have liked to have seen more go arounds for a +1, there were only 2 uploads of the set a year apart)
[21:01] <meetingology> +0 conditionally that bencer reviews the freeze process again with stgraber (I would have liked to have seen more go arounds for a +1, there were only 2 uploads of the set a year apart) received from micahg
[21:01] <micahg> #endvote
[21:01] <meetingology> Voting ended on: Jorge Salamero Sanz for upload rights to the zentyal packageset
[21:01] <meetingology> Votes for:4 Votes against:0 Abstentions:2
[21:01] <meetingology> Motion carried
[21:01] <micahg> bencer: congratulations
[21:01] <bencer> yay! thanks!!
[21:01] <bencer> :)
[21:02] <micahg> #action stgraber to review the freeze process with bencer
[21:02] <meetingology> ACTION: stgraber to review the freeze process with bencer
[21:02] <micahg> #action micahg to add bencer to zentyal packageset
[21:02] <meetingology> ACTION: micahg to add bencer to zentyal packageset
[21:03] <micahg> #topic AOB
[21:03] <micahg> next chair?
[21:03] <tumbleweed> looks like I am
[21:03] <tumbleweed> also, membership monitoring still broken
[21:03] <micahg> #action tumbleweed to chair the next meeting
[21:03] <tumbleweed> please action me to fix it
[21:03] <meetingology> ACTION: tumbleweed to chair the next meeting
[21:04] <micahg> #action tumbleweed to fix membership monitoring script
[21:04] <meetingology> ACTION: tumbleweed to fix membership monitoring script
[21:04] <micahg> anything else?
[21:05] <bdrung> the early meeting time
[21:05] <bdrung> ?
[21:05] <micahg> ah, right, do we have any results?
[21:05] <Laney> cody needs to reply
[21:05] <Laney> and BDRUNG!
[21:06] <Laney> however the only time left now is thursday 1pm
[21:06] <micahg> #action cody-somerville and bdrung to vote in early meeting poll
[21:06] <meetingology> ACTION: cody-somerville and bdrung to vote in early meeting poll
[21:06] <micahg> anything else?
[21:07] <bdrung> Laney: i did
[21:07] <bdrung> maybe i failed in submitting it. i failed to understand this website
[21:08] <Laney> the website doesn't agree
[21:08] <micahg> ok, we can take this out of meeting, anything else?
[21:09] <micahg> going
[21:09] <bdrung> i have no time Thursdays
[21:09] <bdrung> (only after 14 utc)
[21:09] <bdrung> wrong: only after 15 utc
[21:11] <micahg> ok, let's take the meeting time to the list, we can announce it later
[21:12] <micahg> #endmeeting
[21:12] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon May 21 21:12:46 2012 UTC.
[21:12] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-05-21-19.04.moin.txt
[21:12] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-05-21-19.04.html
[21:12] <barry> thanks micahg !
[21:13] <stgraber> thanks!
[21:13] <micahg> thanks everyone
[21:37] <cfalco>  #quit