[00:05] <chrisccoulson> fantastic. so, not only does gcc4.7 break canvas in firefox, it also makes it a fair amount slower
[00:17] <TheMuso> chrisccoulson: Sounds like gcc 4.6 for now then I guess. :p
[03:31] <TheMuso> C
[04:59] <pitti> Good morning
[05:00] <TheMuso> Morning pitti.
[05:12] <robert_ancell> TheMuso, hey, are you running quantal?  Are you doing the gnome-orca update?
[05:12] <pitti> hey TheMuso
[05:12] <pitti> good morning robert_ancell
[05:12] <robert_ancell> pitti, hey
[05:13] <pitti> robert_ancell: can you please drop libgdu from gvfs' build deps? Now that g-d-u has been updated, libgdu is NBS
[05:13] <pitti> robert_ancell: how is gvfs holding up with udisks2?
[05:14] <robert_ancell> it wasn't - didn't you point that out yesterday?
[05:14] <pitti> someone uploaded it now
[05:15] <pitti> robert_ancell: anyway, gdu is obsolete, and I don't think gvfs does anything with it if udisks2 is available
[05:15] <pitti> libgdu, I mean
[05:15] <robert_ancell> yup, uploaded with that dropped now
[05:15] <pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/nbs.html now has a few remaining rdepends, but shouldn't be too hard
[05:23] <TheMuso> robert_ancell: Yes its covered.
[05:23] <TheMuso> orca that is.
[07:41] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[07:42] <ritz> chrisccoulson, morning
[07:42] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson
[07:43] <chrisccoulson> hi ritz, pitti, how are you?
[07:43] <ritz> so far, so good :)
[07:45] <pitti> chrisccoulson: quite fine, thanks!
[07:47] <ritz> chrisccoulson, how are you doing ?
[07:47] <chrisccoulson> ritz, preparing for an "interesting" day, but otherwise, not too bad thanks ;)
[07:48] <pitti> chrisccoulson: more fun with PGO?
[07:49] <chrisccoulson> pitti - fortunately, not this time
[07:49] <chrisccoulson> bug 1003733
[07:49] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1003733 in firefox "Canvas does not work when built with gcc4.7" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1003733
[07:49] <chrisccoulson> which is broken on any gcc4.7 build of firefox
[07:49] <chrisccoulson> pitti, did you say that you noticed issues when switching tabs too?
[07:50] <ritz> chrisccoulson, need a favour, ff xslt/java thinggy. Pretty much lost on what to do here. Who might be good at this ?
[07:50] <pitti> chrisccoulson: when I haven't looked at a tab yet since I started firefox, it loads the tab when switching to it, instead of at the beginning
[07:50] <pitti> chrisccoulson: in the past it kept a cached version around, so that all tabs were immediately visible and usable after startup
[07:51] <chrisccoulson> pitti, ah, a recent change now loads tabs on demand. you can toggle a pref to restore the old behaviour though
[07:51] <pitti> ah, so that's not a bug
[07:51] <pitti> too bad, the old behaviour was quite nice
[07:51] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i don't think so
[07:51] <chrisccoulson> you can revert to the old behaviour in the general pane of the preferences window
[07:51] <pitti> I could pre-open tabs at home, then hop into a train or plane and still had them all available
[07:52] <chrisccoulson> there's a checkbox here "Don't load tabs until selected"
[07:52] <seb128> hey pitti, chrisccoulson, how are you?
[07:52] <pitti> hey seb128
[07:52] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128
[07:52] <chrisccoulson> i'm good thanks. how are you?
[07:52] <seb128> I'm good thanks ;-)
[07:52] <pitti> chrisccoulson: perfect, thanks!
[07:52] <seb128> today shapes like another summer day
[07:52] <seb128> it's already 23°C outside
[07:52] <pitti> chrisccoulson: yup, workign fine
[07:53] <pitti> it's still quite nice in the early mornings
[07:53] <chrisccoulson> ritz, the only person who's likely to look at your bug is me. but i need to make firefox actually not broken for everybody in quantal first ;)
[07:56] <chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, you've got warm weather too?
[07:56] <chrisccoulson> it's been quite warm here this week too
[07:56] <seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, it feels like summer
[07:57] <seb128> we got around 29°C yesterday
[07:57] <chrisccoulson> this is the first time we haven't had temperatures that are closer to winter so far this year ;)
[07:57] <seb128> ;-)
[07:57] <seb128> Didier picked the right timing for a 5 days w.e
[07:57] <seb128> he let me with the unity SRU to deal with as well :p
[07:57] <chrisccoulson> lol
[07:58] <seb128> hum
[07:58] <seb128> robert_ancell uploaded the new aisleriot when we said we didn't want that transition, it was even written on the etherpad :-(
[07:58] <chrisccoulson> you should leave it for when he gets back
[07:58] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I really want some of the fixes out though ;-)
[07:59] <chrisccoulson> seb128, you could just assign him some more WI's instead ;)
[07:59] <chrisccoulson> you have the power!
[07:59] <chrisccoulson> :-)
[07:59] <seb128> hehe, indeed! ;-)
[07:59] <ritz> chrisccoulson, sure. so far, ff works for me on quantal.
[07:59] <seb128> speaking of which
[07:59] <seb128> RAOF, thanks for the specs drafting ;-)
[07:59] <chrisccoulson> ritz, try anything that uses a html canvas
[07:59] <RAOF> seb128: They're written up to your satisfaction? :)
[08:00] <seb128> RAOF, indeed they are! ;-)
[08:00] <seb128> RAOF, some "approved" are going back your way ;-)
[08:00] <RAOF> Superb! :)
[08:01] <ritz> chrisccoulson, http://www.html5canvastutorials.com/labs/html5-canvas-elastic-stars-with-kineticjs/ seems to work fine
[08:02] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, not sure why it works there
[08:02] <chrisccoulson> but it doesn't work anywhere else i've tried ;)
[08:02] <chrisccoulson> like http://chrome.angrybirds.com/
[08:22] <ritz> chrisccoulson, indeed, is broken. works fine in opera though.
[08:28] <ritz> hmmm, broke between ff 12 and 13
[08:49] <seb128> chrisccoulson, did you try bug #997640 while you were under gnome-shell yesterday?
[08:49] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 997640 in firefox "Keyboard shortcuts for moving tabs don't work" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/997640
[09:53] <rickspencer3> je vais au salle du gym plutot
[09:53] <rickspencer3> ooops
[09:53] <rickspencer3> lol, that was a pm
[12:49] <jbicha> hmm, robert_ancell tried to sync aisleriot 3.4
[12:54] <jbicha> since it didn't build we could undo that...
[12:57] <bcurtiswx> good morning
[13:00] <seb128> hey jbicha, bcurtiswx
[13:01] <bcurtiswx> hi seb128
[13:01] <seb128> jbicha, hum not sure, I think pitti got that to work once before by deleting the source and getting the old version reuploaded?
[13:01] <pitti> yes, we can, but NB that we can never ever upload/sync that version again
[13:02] <pitti> why wouldn't we update to aisleriot 3.4 or 3.6 in quantal?
[13:03] <seb128> pitti, cf Laney's note on the etherpad, it would start a lib transition which we would want to avoid starting with a game
[13:03] <pitti> ah, ok
[13:08] <bcurtiswx> hmm, should my vncviewer on 10.04 only show a terminal when connecting to my vnc4server on Precise ?
[13:15] <bcurtiswx> well i did fix the settings so that it would start a normal desktop, but it's just a checkered screen.
[13:19] <jbicha> pitti: ok, well we could always use a build1 or something if we end up needing that version later
[13:19] <pitti> right
[13:19] <jbicha> also guile-2.0 currently doesn't build on arm
[13:22] <bcurtiswx> nvm, it's good now
[13:24] <pitti> hey mterry
[13:26] <pitti> jbicha: do you know about gnome-games-extra-data? It's in universe, still at version 3.2, but now gnome-games recommends it
[13:27] <mterry> pitti, heyo
[13:28] <jbicha> pitti: yeah, that's the other wrong sync from last night, I can go ahead and fix that
[13:29] <pitti> jbicha: should g-g-extra-data be updated or removed?
[13:31] <jbicha> gnome-games doesn't need to depend on -extra-data
[13:40] <pitti> jbicha: right, but I meant what should be the fate of the g-g-extra-data source?
[13:42] <jbicha> pitti: I don't understand...
[13:42] <pitti> jbicha: does that source still exist for GNOME 3.4/3.6, i. e. should we update it, or drop it?
[13:42] <pitti> s/drop/remove/
[13:42] <jbicha> it still exists, it just doesn't need many updates as it's just art http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-games-extra-data/log
[13:43] <pitti> ah, but it's still compatible
[13:44] <jbicha> well Robert's commit there this week makes me wonder if it was silently broken with 3.4
[15:09] <ritz> seb128, heya, busy ? got a question on nm-strongswan
[15:11] <ritz> the current code is buggy, we are thinking of rebasing it. This will fix the bugs, additionally add smartcard support
[15:11] <ritz> in precise
[15:11] <seb128> ritz, you want to talk to cyphermox if you have nm questions ;-)
[15:11] <seb128> he's maintaining that stack
[15:12] <ritz> seb128, thanks.
[15:13] <ritz> cyphermox, heya.
[15:13] <cyphermox> please go right ahead yeah ;)
[15:13] <ritz> cyphermox, curious, why are you not listed in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/strongswan ?
[15:13] <ritz> as maintainer ?
[15:13] <cyphermox> you're working on n-m-strongswan upstream?
[15:14] <cyphermox> because i don't "maintain" it :)
[15:14] <ritz> nope
[15:15] <ritz> cyphermox, hmm, I am confused. Who manages this ?
[15:15] <cyphermox> i wonder what pulled this in main though, that's a good point
[15:15] <ritz> cyphermox, essentially, strongswan 1.2.x deprecates nm-strongswan package
[15:16] <cyphermox> ok
[15:16] <cyphermox> is there a replacement?
[15:16] <ritz> I am new to this
[15:17] <ritz> strongswan bundles the source
[15:17] <cyphermox> I'd think the l2tp plugin possibly takes care of most cases, maybe
[15:18] <ritz> User is hitting this bug - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-strongswan/+bug/872824
[15:18] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 872824 in network-manager-strongswan "Network-manager locks up when adding strongSwan VPN connection" [Critical,Triaged]
[15:19] <ritz> using legacy glade code
[15:19] <cyphermox> yup
[15:23] <cyphermox> ritz: unfortunately this is not a simple problem
[15:25] <ritz> hmmm
[15:26] <cyphermox> ritz: the versions before 1.3 won't be working with NM 0.9; see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-strongswan; and https://mail.gnome.org/archives/networkmanager-list/2011-September/msg00037.html
[15:27] <cyphermox> someone should, I think, first package 1.3 in Debian so that we can get the updated version, then probably figure out how far Martin's patch went.
[15:27] <cyphermox> as far as I know, it's not merged, I don't think there was a second post for such support
[15:27] <cyphermox> maybe it's not needed :)
[15:29] <ritz> I will have to test this , hmmm
[15:29] <cyphermox> but all in all, I'm getting to the suspicion that a strongswan-specific plugin for NM might not be necessary
[15:30] <cyphermox> I think the l2tp plugin probably covers it, but I haven't really played with this yet
[15:35] <cyphermox> seb128: for e-d-s/evo, do we want to go aggressively with 3.5 in prevision for the 3.6 release?
[15:35] <stgraber> cyphermox: I don't think l2tp covers the same thing as strongswan. My IPSEC vpns don't use ppp at all and authenticate with either a PSK or a certificate.
[15:35] <cyphermox> stgraber: and you use strongswan?
[15:35] <seb128> cyphermox, not sure yet, I would wait for 3.5.4 time
[15:35] <stgraber> cyphermox: from what I see from screenshots of the l2tp plugin, it's covering a subset of the roadwarrior+ppp setup, not the general IPSEC setup
[15:36] <seb128> cyphermox, i.e stay on 3.4 for a month or so
[15:36] <cyphermox> stgraber: I realize it's not all the same thing, but merging both would IMO be pretty good :)
[15:36] <stgraber> cyphermox: between sites on my network, yes. I still use OpenVPN for my clients though
[15:36] <seb128> cyphermox, btw if you start on it check with jbicha I think he did some work on the updates
[15:36] <cyphermox> seb128: yes, I would have done it with 3.4. as a first step anyway. I've just been discussing 3.4 with jbicha :)
[15:36] <seb128> ok
[15:37] <seb128> jbicha, dunno if you saw but jordi was looking at setting up a transition tracker for Debian
[15:37] <cyphermox> I'll try his ppa and merge nautilus-sendto to make sure everything is good, then it's likely all a sync
[15:37] <seb128> cyphermox, great!
[15:38] <cyphermox> stgraber: ah, but that's why I was asking -- on the client side, n-m-strongswan is horribly broken and non-trivial to fix
[15:38] <cyphermox> stgraber: didn't you mess with the code too?
[15:39] <stgraber> cyphermox: yes, I have a version that doesn't freeze NM in my PPA, instead it segfaults when connecting ;)
[15:39] <cyphermox> yay.
[15:39] <cyphermox> can you send me your patches?
[15:39] <stgraber> no patches, just updated to the latest upstream tarball I could find
[15:39] <cyphermox> or we can look at n-m-strongswan 1.3, which is supposed to be fixed, though it might interact badly with n-m
[15:39] <stgraber> bzr merge-upstream + dput, that was it
[15:39] <cyphermox> yes, alright
[15:40] <stgraber> and that's 1.3 I have in my PPA
[15:40] <cyphermox> ok
[15:40] <cyphermox> wanna dput to quantal? :)
[15:40] <stgraber> well, it doesn't work ;) it doesn't fail as badly, true but it still doesn't work :)
[15:41] <cyphermox> yes, but we can fix it more easily if more people can look at it, no?
[15:41] <cyphermox> since it's already broken, it shouldn't be a big deal
[15:41] <ritz> cyphermox, stgraber thanks . Will check this up
[15:41] <ritz> gn folks
[15:41] <cyphermox> ritz: thanks
[15:42] <cyphermox> stgraber: I'll pull the source and play with it, since I'll need debug symbols anyway
[15:43] <stgraber> cyphermox: https://launchpad.net/~stgraber/+archive/experimental/+sourcepub/2293302/+listing-archive-extra
[15:44] <ayan> When setting in gconf like /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_windows, can I refer to XF86LaunchE as just LaunchE?
[15:44] <ayan> really, my question is how to i set /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_windows to XF86LaunchE.
[15:44] <ayan> ?
[15:45] <cyphermox> stgraber: do you have a device I can test connections with, or sample config?
[15:45] <stgraber> cyphermox: I don't have the server side setup or client config, though IIRC any config would cause the segfault, it never actually tried to connect :)
[15:50] <cyphermox> mmkay
[15:51] <cyphermox> omg, the build-depends for n-m-strongswan are scary.
[16:34] <pitti> good night everyone!
[16:35] <bcurtiswx> nite pitti
[16:36] <seb128> pitti, 'night
[17:22] <chrisccoulson> i think i'm going to permanently run firefox with paint flashing enabled
[17:24] <jbicha> I run GNOME Shell with the close window buttons on the left but that looks more fun
[17:24] <chrisccoulson> heh
[17:26] <chrisccoulson> wow, facebook sucks. it triggers a repaint of the entire page every few seconds
[17:28] <jbicha> I wanted to make the GNOME Shell close button on the left by default but I think I was overruled :(
[17:29] <mlankhorst> jbicha: oh i run without window decoration, much better :)
[17:30] <seb128> jbicha, by who? where?
[17:30] <jbicha> mlankhorst: I try unity --reset when that happens ;)
[17:31] <mlankhorst> jbicha: currently running with kde + kwin, with some tweaks you can go by fine without decoration, since its a waste of space anyhow
[17:31] <jbicha> seb128: just for Ubuntu for consistency, but I didn't try very hard
[17:32] <seb128> jbicha, well, who did you discuss that with for ubuntu? I'm just surprised I didn't see the discussion
[17:32] <jbicha> desrt: what do you think? ^
[17:33] <jbicha> it was more of a joke really but I do find it useful as I switch between Unity & gshell pretty frequently
[17:35] <jbicha> gsettings set org.gnome.shell.overrides button-layout 'close:'
[17:35] <jbicha> and restart gnome-shell
[17:37] <seb128> I've no strong opinion on it
[17:38] <seb128> it's the sort of things where some people will prefer the cross desktop consistency
[17:38] <seb128> you can argue that the layout of the decorator is an OS thing, not a desktop thing and the Ubuntu one is on the left
[17:40] <seb128> kenvandine, mterry, cyphermox, chrisccoulson, jbicha, others: is one of you using glade and still on precise?
[17:40] <seb128> bug #999581 needs a SRU verification
[17:40] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 999581 in glade "3.12.1 stable version" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/999581
[17:40] <chrisccoulson> seb128, i'm on quantal now
[17:40] <seb128> (I can't do it since I did the update)
[17:40] <cyphermox> seb128: can reboot my desktop into precise and test
[17:40] <seb128> same for bug #999575
[17:40] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 999575 in gtksourceview3 "3.4.2 stable update" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/999575
[17:41] <kenvandine> on quantal
[17:41] <mterry> nope
[17:42] <seb128> you loosers :p
[17:42] <kenvandine> :)
[17:42] <seb128> cyphermox, no hurry but if you can do at some point I would appreciate
[17:43] <jbicha> seb128: is there anything specific you want tested? I haven't used glade in a few months
[17:43] <seb128> cyphermox, jbicha: bug #999593 as well
[17:43] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 999593 in vinagre "3.4.2 stable version" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/999593
[17:43] <seb128> jbicha, cyphermox: there are just stable update, no specific fix to test, just making sure glade, gedit (and syntax coloration), vinagre still work
[17:44] <jbicha> (don't tell anyone, but I don't actually use remote desktop)
[17:44] <seb128> lol
[17:47] <jbicha> I guess vinagre supports ssh so I could try that? lol
[17:49] <seb128> it does! ;-)
[17:50] <seb128> it's also easy enough to run vino-preferences and click the box to share you desktop and then use vinagre to connect
[17:50] <seb128> it even works on localhost, though that's not of the best use since you get a visual content loop in the viewer then, i.e you can't use it
[18:48] <chrisccoulson> grrrrrrrr
[19:00] <chrisccoulson> i think i'm almost ready to shift this firefox bug to somebody else now :)
[19:22] <cyphermox> omg, I suck at packaging today.
[19:31] <micahg> seb128: should we discuss testing now/
[19:31] <seb128> micahg, hey, we can!
[19:31] <seb128> did you have anything specific you would like to discusson the topic?
[19:31] <micahg> seb128: I might have to step away for a couple minutes (someone is stopping by to pick up an item)
[19:32] <micahg> seb128: well, I was told the desktop teams had some concerns about the timing of the Firefox testing
[19:33] <seb128> micahg, it's not so much concerns that we would like to be proactive to make sure we notice any potential issue before the release and not on the release day
[19:34] <seb128> micahg, like I was suggesting that maybe the security team could do a round of testing 2 weeks before release and one week before release to give us a status of the current daily
[19:34] <seb128> micahg, so we have time to act without delaying the update if there is any regression
[19:34] <seb128> i.e better to catch issues before release than after
[19:35] <micahg> seb128: would partial arch testing be sufficient for that in your opinion (i386 on lucid, amd64 on natty...)
[19:35] <seb128> micahg, well, any testing is better than none, but ideally it would be enough that we know "the current version is good to go out for security"
[19:35] <seb128> micahg, the goal is really to avoid having to ask those questions on the release week
[19:36] <seb128> we should know before they roll their tarball if we are good to go or not
[19:36] <micahg> seb128: the problem is that the final tag is the friday before release
[19:36] <micahg> and up until then, they take fixes
[19:36] <seb128> well chrisccoulson said that typically the number of commit the week before release is very low
[19:36] <micahg> so, we can catch stuff early, but we'll still need to retest the final binaries
[19:36] <seb128> so testing a week ago should be 99% of the code of release
[19:36] <seb128> right
[19:37] <seb128> but at least it would give us a picture of "almost" release
[19:37] <micahg> is 2 and 1 week before sufficient?
[19:37] <seb128> like if breaks a week before we want to know it
[19:37] <seb128> if it's good we still need to retest the final version
[19:37] <seb128> but at least if there is an issue to catch we catch it earlier
[19:37] <seb128> well, your call at the end
[19:38] <seb128> I would be happy with that yes
[19:38] <seb128> but if you want to do weekly testing of the coming version I'm not against it
[19:38] <seb128> I just want to make sure that if there is a regression we know about it a week before release
[19:38] <seb128> rather than waiting on the release day to test and see it
[19:38] <micahg> ok, I'll do partial arch testing and switch the arch for each week, so we should get ~full coverage
[19:38] <seb128> great
[19:38] <seb128> thank you!
[19:39] <jbicha> how much additional testing do we need? we already have the beta PPA and beta releases are run most of the time in ubuntu+1
[19:39] <micahg> and we'll see how it goes, once we get most of the testing automated with browser shots, we might be able to do it weekly
[19:39] <seb128> ok
[19:40] <micahg> well, I don't recall any showstoppers yet, but it would be nice to have a bigger safety net
[19:40] <seb128> jbicha, well, we had an history of release to be delayed by non trivial time because testing was happening after release and issues were found
[19:40] <seb128> or concerns were raised
[19:40] <seb128> jbicha, I'm just trying to make sure we stay on top of things
[19:41] <seb128> i.e we test before release, spot any issue early and are ready to ship when the release is out
[19:41] <micahg> I think the only time we explicitly delayed is if we knew upstream had a regression and was respinning post release
[19:41] <seb128> (or with the minor delay due to another round of testing)
[19:41] <seb128> micahg, well, I know we discussed issues with tb at the rally in january where the new version was not shipped for weeks because of potential performances issues
[19:42] <seb128> I just want to avoid that happening again
[19:42] <seb128> we should know early if there is an issue and what the issue is
[19:42] <micahg> seb128: hmm, I guess you want this for thunderbird as well?
[19:43] <seb128> micahg, that would be nice yes
[19:43] <micahg> ok
[19:43] <seb128> same rational
[19:44] <seb128> we should be able to ship on time so we need to know in advance if something is problematic
[19:44] <seb128> we have daily builds of the channels so we should be able to test and get those infos early
[19:44] <desrt> jbicha: i feel like i should remind you about the follow-upstream-exactly policy :)
[19:44] <micahg> so, it's a little late this week, but I'll do the first  pre-testing tuesday and next cycle plan for weeks 4 and 5
[19:44] <seb128> micahg, thank you ;-)
[19:44] <desrt> jbicha: although i have to admit that i used to change the button to the left side (even before ubuntu was doing it)
[19:45] <micahg> seb128: thanks for bringing this up, I'll be able to relax a bit at release time if there's some pre-testing done as well
[19:45] <seb128> micahg, let us know if there is anything we can do to help for that testing btw
[19:46] <seb128> with the daily builds in the ppa it seems we are mostly set up on the infra side but I might be overlooking something
[19:46] <micahg> well, having people running the beta would help :) (I'm not running the thunderbird beta yet as I have no enigmail)
[19:48] <micahg> so, if chrisccoulson could get the enigmail beta in, that would mean I could use the beta on a real workload (~14 accounts, ~500k messages cached)
[19:48] <jbicha> desrt: I was joking about the default, but I think seb128 wanted the close button moved ;)
[19:49] <jbicha> micahg: yikes, seems like you have twice the email accounts you need...
[19:49] <seb128> micahg, well, maybe you should run without enigmail during your worktime even if it's inconveniant? testing what we ship is what we are supposed to do, like most of us run quantal even if it has bugs or missing features
[19:50] <micahg> seb128: I need to be able to sign e-mails when I send out the USNs
[19:50] <seb128> can't you have both versions? or another mailed for that?
[19:50] <seb128> led->ler
[19:50] <jbicha> seb128: quantal doesn't have bugs, it just has incomplete features :)
[19:51] <micahg> seb128: I'd rather not, anyways, there should be a beta available (and since we push enigmail out at the same time, it would be nice to test it as well)
[19:51] <seb128> micahg, ok, your call, but I don't see a feature limitation as a reason to not test what needs to be tested, they are way around limitations
[19:52] <seb128> micahg, like we asked most of our teams to run unity even when it was buggy or add feature limitations
[19:52] <micahg> seb128: I also get encrypted e-mail that I need to be able to read
[19:52]  * micahg is still running unity-2d
[19:52] <seb128> well, I'm sure you can find a way to test what needs to be tested and still get to those emails
[19:53] <seb128> like lot of people here have evolution and tb installed
[19:53] <micahg> also, other people need enigmail internally as well (I'm sure it's not just me that's not running the beta because of it)
[19:53] <micahg> seb128: oh, I can test, just not run it in a real life situation :0
[19:53] <chrisccoulson> enigmail is already in the beta PPA, isn't it?
[19:54] <micahg> version is lower than the release one
[19:54] <micahg> nope, no upload for 13
[19:54] <chrisccoulson> oh, i thought i'd uploaded that
[19:54]  * micahg wonders if he should say something next time
[20:42] <kenvandine> PPAs can be evil
[20:46] <topyli> so can random "ubuntu-*" blogs which recommend them
[20:46] <topyli> not evil, just ignorant
[20:49] <topyli> https://plus.google.com/u/0/108811128475515337596/posts/gMsbAhLnncq
[20:49] <topyli> like that
[20:49] <dupondje> some small question, how could I get the scroll lock status in GDK ?