[14:02] <len-dt> Just found another reason to be able to disable PA-jack bridge. 
[14:03] <len-dt> It sure helps make things cleaner and easier to work with in qjackctl->connect, Patchage and other connection apps
[14:05] <len-dt> Speaking of which.... There is also a midi "through" port hinging around in the alsa section. Is there a use for this? Or is this one of those things left over from days gone by?
[14:07] <len-dt> Finally, are there be a meeting this day?
[14:07]  * len-dt sometimes mangles English on purpose
[14:16] <len-dt> ailo, between ardour,qjackctl,patchage,jackdbus,PA,a2j,(something using python) and firefox I am using all my memory. The python thing I am not sure where that came from. But it is something to do with the audio stuff because it wasn't there before I started running the audio apps.
[14:18] <len-dt> Ah, zynjacku is python.
[14:32] <len-dt> On a low memory system, pulse is a significant memory user and because it is always busy, will never go to swap.
[14:34] <len-dt> pulse uses more memory than firefox with 10 tabs open, even with flash content.
[14:37] <holstein> len-dt: is that pulse alone though?
[14:38] <holstein> i havent done those tests recently.. and addmitedly, the tests i did were not very scientific
[14:38] <len-dt> holstein, I am looking at "top" which shows a line for pulseaudio that is using 10.9% of my 1Gig.
[14:38] <holstein> ive been using alsa only on my netbook for over 6 months
[14:39] <holstein> i find, like with most things, there are advantages to both scenarios
[14:39] <holstein> thought, there was talk of pulling pulse out of US
[14:39] <holstein> though*
[14:39] <len-dt> holstein, pulse is generally well behaved even with bridging.
[14:40] <holstein> i think pulling pulse is arguably an uncessasary step backward
[14:40] <holstein> pulse is the future i think
[14:40] <len-dt> There are some people who need it so they can use apps that rely on pulse with firewire. (I know you have a work around, but others don't)
[14:42] <holstein> well... i just dont need pulse with FW
[14:42] <holstein> wouldnt call it a work around :)
[14:42] <len-dt> Jack is probably going to be around as well. It fills a use that pulse probably never will.
[14:43] <len-dt> holstein, you did actually :-)
[14:43] <holstein> maybe the analog cable trick ;)
[14:44] <len-dt> Anyway, PA needs to stay. stopping and starting while having respawn when needed would be nice.
[14:44] <holstein> agreed... 
[14:45] <len-dt> Bridging seems to lock jack to the internal card's min latency...
[14:47] <len-dt> holstein, on my netbook, the internal IF has minimum late of 128 but the USB can do 64. However if PA-jack bridging is set up even with pulse having the internal card "off", I can only get latency of 128.
[14:47] <holstein> interesting....
[14:48] <holstein> so much to learn and test
[14:48] <holstein> more and more questions
[14:48] <len-dt> I'm getting tired of it :/
[14:48] <holstein> hehe
[14:48] <len-dt> I have found a way to get really solid performace out of the netbook though
[14:49] <holstein> well, i appreciate your time here
[14:49] <holstein> i understand frustrations as well :)
[14:49] <len-dt> I have runlevel 3 set up for no cron, no wireless and cpu governer at "performance"
[14:50] <holstein> yeah... i havent tweaked that much other than on my studio desktop rig
[14:50] <holstein> those little tweaks make a difference though
[14:50] <holstein> OK... BBL
[14:50] <len-dt> I also turn PA-jack bridging off, but it seems removing PA from memory would be better.
[14:50] <len-dt> k
[15:10] <len-dt> The webpage says meeting every first Sunday of the month... the "next" one being 5 pm (17:00) UTC February 19th 2012...
[15:14] <len-dt> Guess it doesn't matter, it is 15:14UTC now... I won't be here in two hours... works in the winter though.
[15:45] <ailo> len-dt: 05:16 < len-dt> holstein, on my netbook, the internal IF has minimum late of 128 but the USB can do 64. However if PA-jack bridging is set up even with pulse having the internal card "off", I can only get  latency of 128.
[15:45] <ailo> This only happens to AFAIK
[15:45] <ailo> So, not a general thing
[15:46] <ailo> Do you mean you cannot start your USB with 64?
[15:48] <ailo> Or you just get a lot of xruns?
[15:49] <ailo> (I'm beat. Going to sleep already..)
[15:59] <ailo> len-dt: Also, I think just using Firefox is problematic enough. For audio, depending on what you do you can use really small amounts of RAM, and the desktop could be really slimmed down, but as soon as you need a modern web browser, you're screwed memory wise
[15:59] <ailo> I think 2GB is barely enough
[16:32] <len-dt> ailo, pulse was using more than firefox... I am not suggesting that firefox be let run while doing audio though :-)
[16:32] <len-dt> However, if firefox is "problematic" then so is PA.
[16:34] <len-dt> I am actually looking for more memory for my system(s) and it looks like 2Gig (even on my "modern" netbook) may be the max I can use.
[16:37] <len-dt> Certainly a netbook should not be put forward as a good system to run audio on, but there are MBs for desktops that use the same chipset that people do buy just for audio because they can run without a fan.(see the LAU mail list)
[16:39] <len-dt> So being able to run US in a memory slim mode would be useful in that case.
[16:42] <len-dt> The netbook, while not a good audio machine, could be good for remote recording. It has the power and memory (even with the stock 1Gig) to record 8 tracks to disk on the road (maybe more). It could be used for guitar effects (live) or even as a softsynth (well I haven't tried a USB midi IF...)
[16:43] <len-dt> I think it is worth while documenting what things can be done to slim memory down to make these things workable.
[16:44] <len-dt> An app that does this with one click is a bonus.
[16:44]  * len-dt is heading off to go play.
[16:47] <len-dt> ailo, I mean that with the PA-jack bridge running I can not even start the external IF at less than 128. With the bridge off it starts fine and has no xruns.
[16:48] <len-dt> s/fine/at 64 fine/
[16:48] <kubotu> len-dt meant: "ailo, I mean that with the PA-jack bridge running I can not even start the external IF at less than 128. With the bridge off it starts at 64 fine and has no xruns."
[22:32] <len-dt> ailo, There is some discussion on the LAU list that seems tied to our dbus-jack problems (jack can't be stopped with qjackctl)
[22:33] <len-dt> The message of interest came out at 13:52 PST(-0800)
[22:35] <len-dt> There have been some days of discussion though it didn't look like the same problem at first. look for the topic "jack2 turned verbose"
[22:37] <len-dt> ailo, I should have said Sunday june 3