[00:48] <WindBuntu> hello edubuntu
[02:10] <cog> What specific secondary level education software does Edubuntu provide?
[03:03] <JanC> I suppose that depends on what teenagers are supposed to learn in your country…
[03:04] <cog> I have my reservations about that posit, because I do not believe that Edubuntu changes according to country.  Could you assist me in proving me wrong? :)
[03:04] <JanC> (or what you want them to learn)
[03:06] <JanC> cog: lots of software that's not designed for educational purposes can be educational, depending on the classes they take, etc.
[03:07] <JanC> e.g. I know a school that uses Ubuntu & LibreOffice in latin for latin class  ☺
[03:08] <cog> OK :)
[03:09] <cog> I adore Latin :D
[03:10] <JanC> and when I refer to countries, it's because in some countries "computer class" means "how to use MS Office"  :-(
[03:13] <cog> Well, you may have heard of the more economical key layout referred to as DVORAK?  We invented that 25 years after the more-than-century-old QWERTY layout.
[03:13] <cog> Yet most computer keyboards say QWERTY on them.
[03:13] <JanC> mine says azerty  ;)
[03:15] <JanC> but, yeah
[03:15] <JanC> anyway, I'm off to sleep  ☺
[03:15] <cog> OK :)
[03:15] <cog> Have a good rest.
[08:29] <rhorstkoetter> hi. I'd like to know how I may contribute documentation to edubuntu, i.e. the preferred way to do it? I mean, let's assume I found out something by tinkering around like how to best boot a thin client with a pcmcia network card and I'd like to document that somewhere and share it with the community
[08:29] <rhorstkoetter> the pcmcia thing just as an example
[08:33] <rhorstkoetter> related to that I'd feel it valuable to preserve maybe already existing documentation at a central place for better/easier availability to he the community and thus I'd like to ask what you think about and how I may contribute to these efforts?
[08:33] <rhorstkoetter> s/he/the
[08:34] <alkisg> rhorstkoetter: better ask ltsp documentation questions in #ltsp
[08:34] <alkisg> As we're designing a new wiki
[08:35] <alkisg> The (ed)ubuntu ltsp documentation is at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/
[08:35] <alkisg> ...but I don't know how/if the ltsp wiki will affect distro-specific documentation
[08:36] <rhorstkoetter> alkisg: I'm not sure yet what exactly (distro-specific or not) my potential contributions would be, most likely a mix down the road getting my own setup up and running
[08:37] <rhorstkoetter> it's just that after tinkering around for several evenings, I found out a lot of things and few of these insights came from a central docu at neither ltsp nor edubuntu
[08:38] <alkisg> Which central docu?
[08:38] <rhorstkoetter> yesterday for example I had this pcmcia pxe boot thing and hit the wall with etherboot/gpxe/ipxe until I searched around, combined several articles/howtos, extended these with own thinking into a whole so to speak
[08:39] <rhorstkoetter> alkisg: in my case ubuntu/edubuntu
[08:39] <rhorstkoetter> but, e.g. the pcmcia pxe boot thing isn't distro-specific
[08:40] <rhorstkoetter> just as one example, lemme link an article quickly http://howto.gumph.org/content/pxe-boot-a-laptop/
[08:40] <alkisg> rhorstkoetter: that is hopelessly outdated
[08:40] <alkisg> There's an ipxe package you can install to get the images
[08:40] <alkisg> sudo apt-get install ipxe
[08:41] <rhorstkoetter> alkisg: ipxe doesn't work with pcmcia network cards
[08:41] <alkisg> And which one does?
[08:41] <rhorstkoetter> neither does etherboot/gpxe
[08:41] <rhorstkoetter> netboot
[08:41] <alkisg> Ah sorry I read etherboot at first
[08:43] <alkisg> So basically it uses a dos packet driver for the pcmcia card?
[08:43] <rhorstkoetter> I just mean that this an example of documentation that I even may extend with some steps to get it on CD that would be very valuable to the community and would save someone some time searching if something like that would be at edubuntu.org
[08:43] <rhorstkoetter> alkisg: yes
[08:44] <rhorstkoetter> the howto is, as is, rather incomplete as it misses the last step to get a CD out of a boot floppy which is documented somewhere else for example
[08:44] <alkisg> rhorstkoetter: such a page could go under UbuntuLTSP, or it could go in a non-ltsp page as well
[08:45] <alkisg> Since netbooting laptops with pcmcia cards does relate to LTSP, I'd probably put it under UbuntuLTSP for it to be better organized
[08:45] <alkisg> Even though it's not strickly ltsp specific
[08:46] <alkisg> And it could also go in the new ltsp wiki site, as it's pretty much distro agnostic
[08:46] <rhorstkoetter> I see. this is anyways just an example.
[08:47] <alkisg> Sure. But it was a good example, other ones might fall right into the ltsp category, and others might be completely unrelated to ltsp, so it would be easier to decide then.
[08:48] <alkisg> E.g. people often ask "how do I lock down gnome?" This is completely unrelated to ltsp.
[08:48] <rhorstkoetter> The reason I ask is in the end that my very own cheat sheet grows in size every evening and I thought that some things may be of some value to someone else as well and as it is rather hard to find ltsp-specific topics/docu at a central place I felt it a good approach to contribute bits and pieces of insight (in written docs) back to the community
[08:49] <alkisg> Indeed
[08:49] <rhorstkoetter> I understand
[08:49] <alkisg> I think the final plan is to put the distro-agnostic bits in the ltsp wiki, and the ubuntu-specific ltsp bits under the UbuntuLTSP page
[08:49] <rhorstkoetter> makes sense
[08:49] <alkisg> The temporary place for the new ltsp wiki is there: http://ltsp.flowledge.nl/index.php/LTSPedia
[08:49] <alkisg> But it will be moved soon into wiki.ltsp.org or someplace
[08:50] <rhorstkoetter> great. and I guess the general slogan here is … just do it, it's a wiki?
[08:50] <rhorstkoetter> at either ltsp and ubuntu wikis
[08:51] <rhorstkoetter> I mean is there any QA in place I need to be aware of?
[08:51] <rhorstkoetter> never contributed to ubuntu and/or ltsp before
[08:51] <alkisg> Right, but if you're going to spend much time on ltsp documentation you might want to lurk on #ltsp too, to ask questions when you're unsure about things etc
[08:51] <rhorstkoetter> certainly
[08:52] <alkisg> I haven't seen a QA. You can start editing pages under UbuntuLTSP right away, no need to get any permission or anything
[08:54] <rhorstkoetter> most likely I dealed way to much with wiki QA job-wise in the past
[08:54] <rhorstkoetter> ;)
[08:54] <rhorstkoetter> have seen too much processes in that regard
[08:55] <alkisg> Many devs are bored to document stuff so... :-/
[08:56] <rhorstkoetter> I know this too badly
[08:56] <rhorstkoetter> I myself worked as a community manager/architect/project manager for some years in FLOSS
[08:56] <rhorstkoetter> thus I know about the conflict dev >< docu
[08:57] <rhorstkoetter> lots of awesome developments and just a few know how to use it to full potential
[08:58] <rhorstkoetter> I guess this is a general crux in open source/community project
[08:58] <rhorstkoetter> s/project/projects
[08:59] <alkisg> We're having ltsp-docs meetings every week on irc, if you want you can join us
[09:00] <rhorstkoetter> alkisg: actually I would be honored doing so
[09:00] <rhorstkoetter> this there a calendar?
[09:00] <alkisg> Let me check...
[09:01] <alkisg> Ah the wiki has moved to http://server.ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/LTSPedia
[09:01] <alkisg> "Next meeting ... ?"
[09:02] <alkisg> No meeting programmed, some of the devs will be missing for a couple of weeks
[09:02] <rhorstkoetter> as a replacement for http://ltsp.flowledge.nl/index.php/LTSPedia
[09:02] <rhorstkoetter> so http://server.ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/LTSPedia is most recent?
[09:03] <alkisg> Yes... I think it's still a temporary place though, it'll be moved into a more proper subdomain
[09:03] <rhorstkoetter> I see
[09:03] <alkisg> Ask in #ltsp for more details
[09:04] <rhorstkoetter> ok
[09:30] <rhorstkoetter> dealing with zram (this time on the client side): is my assumption correct that I would put /etc/init/zram.conf into the client chroot and rebuild the chroot to enable it?
[09:31] <rhorstkoetter> I have it running on the server side already but I guess zram on the client side would be even more beneficial
[09:36] <alkisg> nbd-swap should be more beneficial than zram, at least with my old compcache measurements
[09:36] <alkisg> compcache reduced available ram on the client and it caused high cpu usage
[09:37] <alkisg> But in cases where one cannot use nbd-swap, sure, zram sounds useful
[09:38] <rhorstkoetter> alkisg: ok, thanks for sharing experience. still, zram for the client would require chroot rebuilding as described, correct?
[09:39] <alkisg> I don't know what's needed to enable zram. For compcache, a kernel parameter was all that was necessary. Maybe for zram updating the initramfs image will be enough.
[09:40] <rhorstkoetter> you basically need to put an appropriate upstart job into /etc/init/
[09:40] <rhorstkoetter> it just needs enabling so to speak
[09:40] <alkisg> Manually? Whoah... then the appropriate place would be a init-ltsp.d script, which creates the upstart job based on an lts.conf setting
[09:41] <rhorstkoetter> this is for the server side and as client chroot basically is a very stripped down, i.e. minimal ubuntu I'd assume that the same upstart job (this time within the chroot) should work. just wanted some kind of verfication about my general chroot understanding
[09:42] <alkisg> ...is the only command in that upstart job just a modprobe?
[09:43] <rhorstkoetter> it's not that hard actually. I documented it for pre-zram (compcache) here http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=10103495&postcount=23
[09:44] <rhorstkoetter> it needs to be just slightly modified for zram
[09:45] <rhorstkoetter> there even seem to be a deb package in universe in the meantime (zram-config)
[09:45] <alkisg> If it's just a modprobe command, you can do it from lts.conf without anything else
[09:45] <alkisg> MODULE_01=zram
[09:45] <alkisg> That should suffice
[09:46] <rhorstkoetter> great. that would mean that I even can enable it for just one client
[09:46] <alkisg> Yeah. If it needs another command, use RCFILE_01
[09:47] <rhorstkoetter> I see. The more I deal with this lts.conf the better I understand how powerful it actually is ;)
[09:47] <rhorstkoetter> afaik I already used RCFILE_xy for some gconftool magic
[09:48] <rhorstkoetter> we talked about user profiles recently
[09:49] <rhorstkoetter> what I still haven't found out though, despite reading lts.conf manpage and ltsp manual is how to disable session menu in ldm
[09:50] <rhorstkoetter> i.e. define default session (accomplished that one) and then disable to session menu altogether
[09:50] <rhorstkoetter> s/to/the
[09:51] <alkisg> We've committed support for that 2 days ago
[09:51] <alkisg> So you'll need a very very recent LTSP in order to use it
[09:54] <rhorstkoetter> ah ok
[09:54] <rhorstkoetter> what about  a "hacking" solution then?
[09:54] <alkisg> Download the new files from ltsp-upstream then
[09:55] <alkisg> Ah you'll need a newer ldm executable too, so no
[09:55] <rhorstkoetter> alkisg: this would be a bit too much of a hassle IF I could hack it together
[09:55] <rhorstkoetter> I have an idea already :p
[09:55] <alkisg> Just install a newer ldm package
[09:55] <alkisg> No need to reinvent the wheel
[09:56] <rhorstkoetter> isn't it that ldm gets info about sessions from ldminfod?
[09:56] <alkisg> Time to go, bbl
[19:03] <stgraber> highvoltage: edubuntu installed in < 10min :)
[19:04] <highvoltage> stgraber: that's crazy talk
[19:04] <stgraber> no langpacks really seems to help :)
[19:05] <highvoltage> rhorstkoetter: hey there, just saw your question earlier about documentation. we have an action item to do the right thing for documentation this cycle and make it easier to contribute
[19:05] <stgraber> highvoltage: hmm, to add to the artwork todo => lightdm theme still says 12.04 LTS
[19:05] <highvoltage> stgraber: yeah, I noticed yesterday
[19:06] <highvoltage> (that and installer slideshow)
[19:06] <stgraber> right, I haven't updated a new slideshow for a1 anyway, will probably do it for a2
[19:09] <highvoltage> I'll change the one in the branch to be mostly empty, I really really really want a completely new nice revamptes slideshow that doesn't look like a powerpoint presentation
[19:22] <stgraber> highvoltage: got a few minutes?
[19:23] <stgraber> highvoltage: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/QuantalQuetzal/TechnicalOverview#Edubuntu needs some content :)
[19:23] <highvoltage> stgraber: ah yes, kate poked me too about that
[19:23] <stgraber> highvoltage: if you don't have time, I'd just copy/paste stuff from my -release e-mails
[19:23] <highvoltage> stgraber: I think that would be great
[19:23] <stgraber> highvoltage: oh, did she? She also asked me to nag all the product managers, guess people will get way enough poking if both of us do it :)
[19:24] <highvoltage> stgraber: yep, but I wasn't complaining :)
[19:25] <highvoltage> (and I did say I'd do it then)
[19:25] <highvoltage> (so it's my fault, if anyone's)
[19:58] <stgraber> highvoltage: langpack auto-installs seems to work fine, so I'll just need to add the dialog for the live session before alpha2 and we'll be good
[19:59] <highvoltage> that's really really cool