[03:31] mr_pouit: ok, sounds good [06:35] astraljava: hope this is what you were expecting https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Testing/Short/HardwareProfile [06:41] crap :( [06:46] astraljava: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Testing/HardwareProfile [06:53] hobgoblin: Sweet, looks alright to me. Thanks! [06:53] just got to get them to delete the wrong one :( [06:54] but cool - glad to help :) [09:22] hi everyone [09:22] what did i miss over the weekend? :) [09:30] hi ochosi [09:32] hi hobgoblin [09:55] so, [09:55] https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ase3mbY6LZYodEtyOC03U0MxNnFYbUpKdlFkU3FHRlE [09:55] i gathered a spreadsheet of all the submissions to the ML about gmb so far [09:56] (don't worry, it's not giving out any personal info the people haven't sent to the ml theirself!) [09:56] hey knome [09:56] :) [09:56] ochosi, so can you confirm you can play streams and podcasts with gmb? [09:57] knome: i can confirm that gmb doesn't have that feature (yet) :) [09:57] oh. [09:57] why did i think it had. [09:58] btw, announcement: i'll be away for all of august and probably ~half of july [09:58] ffft [09:59] "sometimes loses library on exit" > crash. we should ask for more info (although there have been many bugfixes between 12.04 version and git now) [09:59] knome: most of those feedbacks are basically - how do you use it ... [09:59] hobgoblin, not really. [09:59] hobgoblin: excuse me, but "most"? [09:59] hobgoblin, a few [10:00] well the ones about having issues I meant :) [10:00] obviosuly the 'it's great' ones aren't :) [10:00] yes... but there are only a few of them too. [10:00] not even then it's most, half of them are about missing features (ipod,ubuntu-one,media-keys) [10:01] knome yep [10:01] and tbh, those who i've marked "no experience" are useless [10:01] anyway, i see a lot of trouble with gtk3.6 on the horizon, that's why i wanted to announce i'll be away [10:01] and you can't really count them [10:01] because how do you know if it would have been okay for them if they just uninstall it? [10:01] I agree [10:01] we might have to push greybird-updates late in september as sru's or something [10:02] (i haven't marked those who said they tried it) [10:02] just the ones purging right away [10:02] also those that say they don't need a player with library-support are kinda useless [10:02] lol [10:02] because we said we want that (otherwise you can keep using parole) [10:02] is that's one of our requirements, yes [10:03] *if [10:03] i can send that link to upstream [10:03] upstream-gmb i mean [10:03] maybe later [10:03] i think we still have feedback coming [10:03] ok [10:04] and this is just condensed stuff anyway [10:04] yeah, but the condensed stuff is good [10:04] heh, yeah [10:04] any ideas how to improve that spreadsheet? [10:05] should we try to do some formatting for those who aren't useful or so? [10:05] i think sorting them somehow would make sense [10:05] well, they're sorted chronologically now [10:05] sort them by "do you use gmb?" [10:06] which made most sense when creating the list ;) [10:06] and then put those that have "no xp with gmb" down at the bottom [10:06] and still does, if we maintain that [10:06] to some extent, but in the final evaluation, the time is a useless parameter imo [10:06] sure :P [10:06] s/time/time of submission/ [10:07] I'd say there were 3 categories - never used it/tried it/used it [10:07] any more sorting out will not be of much use I'd have thought - too many other variables [10:07] some color-coding might help as well [10:09] see sheet2 [10:10] that makes more sense [10:21] knome: yeah, much better [10:23] knome: if you share it with me, i can create another sheet for "missing features" [10:23] ochosi, sure [10:24] ochosi, sent to simon@sp [10:25] ty [10:26] seems like i still can't edit [10:27] oh wait, i guess i'm signed in with my other google-account [10:27] meh, mind to share it with s.s@gmail.com? [10:27] just tell me what that was again and i can add that too :P [10:27] ok [10:27] beiss? [10:27] otherwise i have to logout/login all the time [10:27] yup [10:27] added and rm'd @sp [10:28] not that it matters... [10:28] mhm [11:11] knome: .wav support? afaik gmb supports .wav fine (and what player wouldn't) [11:11] i thought the same. but i'm not the one sending that message... [11:11] yes i know, i just wanted to know whether there was more info in the email that would make it clearer [11:12] ochosi, look for the poster name, then find that from the -users archive [11:12] ochosi, that's why i posted the names [11:14] ok, compiled a shortlist of features [11:14] unfortunately many of them are known (at least by me) [11:14] mmh. [11:14] and i guess they won't get the quick and simple implementation [11:14] otoh, good that there isn't lots of bugs we don't know about [11:14] yup [11:15] definitely [11:15] it's actually comforting to see that the quest for feedback didn't just return a shirtstorm :) [11:15] ;) [11:15] (usually only annoyed users care enough to send something) [11:15] agreed [11:15] though there was some really useless posts [11:15] "oh well i use vlc IT'S THE BESSSTTT" [11:16] ubuntu-one support won't come upstream, we'd have to do that ourselves [11:16] ... [11:57] knome: greybird-tabs-update: http://imagebin.org/217745 [11:58] i also like these tab colors btw, what do you think? http://dribbble.com/shots/615066-Tabs [12:00] hmmh. [12:01] make the inactive tabs a bit lighter [12:01] you mean the bg? [12:01] i like the latter colors, but you are not quite there with the "new" variant [12:01] yes [12:01] i know i'm not, that was just something i stumbled upon after updating the tab-style [12:01] but yeah, i'll make them a bit lighter [12:02] :) [12:02] http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-06252012-020224pm.php [12:03] our general bg color is a bit darker, so all the tab-bg is also a bit darker [12:04] or at least if we want tab-content to be brighter, i'd have to tweak all possible sub-items of tabs [12:05] anyway, off for lunch [12:07] bon appetit === yofel_ is now known as yofel [13:09] Hello, I have a problem with spontaneous window movement in Xubuntu 12.04. Probably a bug. [13:10] Steps to reproduce: [13:10] - Start Mahjongg [13:10] - make the window somewhat bigger (don't maximize it) [13:10] - click anywhere on the grey task bar of Mahjongg [13:10] - click on the dark blue background in Mahjongg [13:10] In more than 25 % of the cases, this causes spontaneous weird window movements: the Mahjongg window almost entirely disappears in the lower right corner of my display, or is being dragged by mouse movements. [13:10] From other people I've heard similar reports about Gedit and Disk Utility, so it's not Mahjongg-related. The strange thing is: no similar problems in applications like Firefox and LibreOffice. [13:10] I have two questions:1. Can I work around this bug? 2. Against which package should I file this bug on Launchpad? [13:31] pjotr: there is already a bugreport [13:31] and i'm aware of it, it's gtk3 specific [13:32] ochosi: Thanks. Can I work around it somehow (hacking some settings file)? [15:14] ochosi: That particular bug is particularly annoying with multiple monitors (at least with NVIDIA drivers). [15:23] bluesabre_: yeah, i tried deactivating window-move on menubar-grab in gtk3, i don't think it really fixed the issue [15:29] astraljava: ping [15:29] madnick: ping [16:58] ochosi: pong [17:09] madnick: hey! just wanted to ask you how it's going and whether friday is still a realistic goal [17:09] Not sure if the default audio player is still on the table, but the latest audacious alpha is quite nice and simplistic. http://imagebin.org/217771 [17:10] (and the Sound Menu artwork actually works [17:10] ) [17:10] ochosi: i'd say its realistic, if i run into some major problem ill come back to you :P [17:11] madnick: ok, good. just wanted to check in cause i'm back :) [17:11] bluesabre_: haven't really tried audacious in a while, does it have library management? [17:11] Sure does. [17:12] does it? [17:12] just asking cause it looks very playlist-based to me on that screenshot [17:12] Well, its basic [17:13] Not as featured as gmb [17:13] there is a library plugin - but I've got a bug on that - crashes with my library [17:13] mhm [17:13] as default app, I'd consider simplicity over features, music player vs. music library manager [17:13] It worked for me, just clicking on that search button lets you set your library [17:14] Sysi: the basic argument "pro library" was that if we just want a simplistic player we already have parole for that [17:14] http://imagebin.org/217772 (at bottom of side panel) [17:15] btw, the arrangement of buttons in the toolbar is somewhat weird [17:15] play,stop,prev,next ?? [17:16] I agree. I think I might offer some suggestions since its still in alpha [17:16] are you in touch with the devs? [17:17] Nope, not yet [17:17] :D [17:17] It has a PPA, so I thought I'd play with it [17:17] ok, first check how open they are :) [17:17] ochosi: having neither playlist or any kind of library is more lacky than simple [17:17] Sysi: parole has playlist-support [17:17] Everyone's not as open as the xubuntu-devel folks? :O [17:17] (basic one at least) [17:17] bluesabre_: how big a music library is it searching? just for my sanity [17:18] ochosi: queue-like or library-like [17:18] 3 GB. Somebody with a more impressive library might want to look into it [17:18] I did ... :( https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/audacious/+bug/932574 [17:18] Launchpad bug 932574 in audacious (Ubuntu) "audacious crashed with SIGSEGV in mpg123_info() Search Plugin fails" [Medium,Confirmed] [17:19] lol [17:19] Sysi: well you can drag stuff into the sidebar and it'll play it in that order (parole) [17:19] ochosi: but it's not saved when you close the app? [17:19] ochosi: I use parole if I'm after something quickly [17:20] Sysi: it's a bit like winamp, it just doesn't remember your last playlist/state. you can open/save playlists in m3u format [17:21] well, audacious is exatly like winamp :P [17:22] I kinda like idea of unified media player now that I use vlc for music too, I wonder if there would be suitable frontend for mplayer, if we can include that to installation cd [17:23] Sysi: you can use mplayer as backend for gmusicbrowser ;) [17:24] (instead of gstreamer, which is currently the default because parole uses it as well) [17:24] (no, I don't like parole, bad support for subtitles) [17:25] bluesabre_: and it crashed again :) [17:25] Well, I guess that's out of the question for now then :) [17:25] gmb netbook could be really simple if shuffle was disabled by default, though so could shimmer desktop [17:26] how can disabling shuffle been made so difficult.. or I'm just really dumb when I failed to do it [17:26] Sysi: the shuffle-issue really strikes me, i'm a bit surprised by that. but i think we can easily change that with a new default setting [17:27] s/i think/i hope/ :) [17:27] I'll install GMB and try again [17:28] remove your .config/gmusicbrowser folder before you reinstall [17:28] or purge it [17:28] just to be sure you start with new settings [17:28] would be good to know what the shuffle-problem is exactly [17:28] yeah, did that [17:32] sauna break, real testing after that -> [17:34] first problem was that I couldn't see any music after adding it to library, I had to change to Simple list view and select "All genres" to see my library in songtree view too [17:45] yay, fix to bug 1016925 seems to have cured the alt installer :) [17:46] Launchpad bug 1016925 in xubuntu-meta (Ubuntu) "12.10 Alternate installer fails with libavformat53 unmet dependencies" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1016925 [17:46] no dailys link in ISO tracker today, how does this all work with alpha2 coming up? [17:47] hey pleia2 [17:47] g'day ochosi [17:47] should I be submitting look-and-feel bugs, or do we just wait until gtk3 stuff settles? [17:48] i'd say rather submit it [17:48] then at least i've seen it all [17:48] ok :) [17:49] but it's not improbable that i won't work on them until some things in unico/gtk3 have been fixed [17:50] when alpha2 is there - what do we test it against - the short testcase - long one when it appears? [17:59] any test is good, the long test is better [17:59] ochosi: do you want long explanation about how shuffle can be confusing for new user without really giving any advantage as default setting? [18:00] GridCube: cheers [18:00] Sysi: no, just tell me what "shuffle" exactly means here [18:01] ochosi: songs are not played in order they are in list, they do that for me when using "Artist,Album,Title,Track" [18:02] Sysi: in what order are they played? [18:02] random, as far as I acn tell [18:03] the problem is: the user can change the sort-order anytime, but the play-order isn't synced with the sort-order [18:03] which can be really practical [18:03] so you can re-order your library visually but not change the way it's playing [18:03] obviously that can be confusing [18:04] I hardly get idea of that [18:05] most if any players don't have those separately at all [18:05] i know [18:06] but well, with changing settings the way I did you can use GMB even if you don't know that.. I guess [18:07] unless the user clicks a column-header [18:07] but i totally agree with you, i think we should set that sort-order by default [18:07] just have to figure out how :) [18:08] the most robust one i know about is actually: folder,album,disc,track,filename [18:08] that also works (a bit) for stuff with broken/missing tags [18:09] I'd like to try what happens if I click column header but I'm afraid I can't undo that [18:11] actually nothing broke, it just fails(shuffles?) if tag's missing [18:13] thing is: [18:14] there are a few levels of sorting: there is "grouping" (by default we set it to album) [18:14] that could theoretically break if you sort by "song-title" (in songtree-view) [18:14] in songlist view, nothing will break [18:14] and by break i mean: you have to re-set the sort-order again by right-clicking the column header and setting it to whatever you had before [18:16] and that depends about play order settings? advanced features always bring advanced usability.. [18:16] how are you supposed to control songtree view, since it's apparently needed to even see your library in default setup? is using search in simple list the only option? [18:17] I generally find listview nicer/simpler, just as an opinion [18:17] no wait, not sure what you mean with play order settings there [18:18] i'll quickly illustrate.. [18:18] rightmost button under album cover [18:21] both menus shown at the same time (two separate screenshots merged): http://imagebin.org/217779 [18:21] now the settings are in sync [18:21] so it'll play what you see [18:24] I think I understand.. [18:25] now, this is what is complex for most users at first: http://imagebin.org/217780 [18:25] after clicking the "title" column-header, everything is seemingly shuffled... [18:25] (when in fact it isn't, and the player still plays everything in the "normal" order) [18:26] well, it pretty much just works if you don't touch anything, which is my ubuntu-philosophy [18:26] hehe [18:26] that's not such a bad verdict imo [18:26] we just need good default sorting order [18:26] agreed [18:26] we can simply add a default sort-order and create a matching default play-order [18:27] so that at least ootb, it will be in sync [18:27] yeah [18:30] Sysi: would you be willing to test it? [18:30] (would involve re-purging gmb and installing from ppa) [18:31] doesn't sound too bad, I have a free week [18:31] I'll play around with it again as well [18:31] * hobgoblin has been following the conversation off and on here [18:32] Sysi, hobgoblin: ok, thanks, i'll let you know when the ppa is ready [18:32] ok [18:34] Artist,Album,Title,Track seems to work when sort-order is "click Album column header" too [18:35] Sysi: what do you mean exactly? [18:35] playing order is seemingly rational [18:36] mind to test with "path album disc track file" ? [18:37] not so good with random files with same artist [18:37] what about "path artist album disc track file" ? [18:41] mhm, it just won't work completely properly unless they're same, at least for first sorting items [18:42] humm, not sure i get it 100%, mind to show me screenshots of your results? [18:44] if at least first sorting property isn't same, visible sort-order and play-order donät match (like you said already) [18:55] mhm [18:56] what's difference of Disk and Album in sortin options? [18:56] the disc is a different tag [18:56] an album can e.g. have 2 discs [18:56] (or even more) [18:57] currently we're displaying that like this: http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-06252012-085711pm.php [18:57] (assuming the tags are set correctly) [18:58] I don't think I have anything tagged like that, though not sure [18:59] if you have an album with more than one disc/cd, you can quickly tag it and see :) [18:59] that's where the treeview is really handy [19:00] I'm trying to find nice playing+sorting order [19:06] i have the patch ready for setting a different play-order by default [19:18] i'll also set gmb to remember the last-playing song by default [19:18] so you go back to where you left off when you restart it [19:20] that's nice [19:21] there is even more stuff we can't potentially switch on by default [19:22] some people requested "scan/check library" by default on every startup [19:22] not sure that's so good though [19:22] it slows down startup... [19:23] it's easy to enable if you need it [19:24] yup, i'd say so too [19:26] you need to add songs to library manually anyway [19:28] yes, although i also fixed something there recently [19:28] before it was not added to the watched-folders list, only to the library [19:28] (if you used our default layout and settings > library > add music) [19:29] I think I hit that issue when I started [19:29] yes, it should be fixed in 12.10 [19:29] (and in the ppa) [19:29] what would you think about using listview as default? [19:30] i wouldn't mind i think [19:30] i mean it also seems more fail-proof [19:30] because there is no group-order that would break when your music isn't tagged correctly [19:32] yeah, I just couldn't get one song to play when it should, so I just dragged it to where it should be :) [19:33] you should put some description about gmb:s working mechanismon faq or somewhere, it would help understaning it a lot [19:33] yes, i agree [19:33] would you want to help with that? [19:34] I could try to come up with something, though it's kinds of absurd consept to explain [19:35] hehe [19:35] well, don't start with that [19:35] it shouldn't revolve around this particular issue [19:35] many people actually seem to do fine with gmb, at least we're not getting much bad feedback from those who use it [19:35] I'll call it "unique usage features" [19:36] just the normal step-by-step how to get your music in the player, play it etc [19:37] right [19:37] at least I'm now completely sold for GMB :P [19:37] and then at a later point we can get to the more complex stuff [19:37] hehe [19:37] nice [19:41] what should "Album" tab contain? it's empty for all my songs [19:45] it should contain all your albums [19:45] if your songs have albums in their tags [19:45] but it might depend on a filter [19:45] can you show me which tab you mean exactly? [19:46] one between Lyrics and Artist in sidepane [19:47] oh yes [19:47] that's also a wrong default setting i just corrected :( [19:47] go to settings > plugins > albuminfo and activate it [19:48] it's pretty nice, you can see album-reviews and infos and tag your albums on-the-fly by clicking the genre-labels in the tab [19:51] I can't see genre for some reason, even if I selected it in plugin settings [19:52] you might have to restart gmb for some of the settings to apply [19:52] (i think it says that in one of the tooltips) [19:53] didn't help, it shows some info but nothing about genre (on various songs) [19:54] well, I don't really need that anyway [19:55] gnome-mmkeys plugin isn't working, even if I have gnome-settings-daemon running [19:56] i'd recommend you to set them through the kb-shortcuts dialog anyway [19:56] do they work globally that way? [19:57] yes [19:57] e.g. "gmusicbrowser -cmd NextSong" [19:57] "gmusicbrowser -cmd PlayPause" [19:58] one of my favorites is: "gmusicbrowser -cmd Quit -ifnotrunning nocmd" [19:58] (that starts gmb if it's not running and quits it when it's running) [19:58] also nice: "gmusicbrowser -cmd ShowHide" [19:58] (to minimize to tray and restore) [20:03] I found -listcmd after some trying [20:06] yup [20:06] there are tons of things you can bind to custom keyboard-shortcuts [20:06] there is tons of everything in gmb [20:07] true [20:07] maybe we should set a few default shortcuts for playpause at least and stuff like that [20:08] shouldn't do any harm [20:09] volume control could be available somewhere besides equalizer, but that's minor tweaking [20:10] we decided to use the indicator-sound for that [20:10] so it's not present in the layout by default [20:10] you can use the scrollwheel on the trayicon though [20:11] it could be in settings, though that makes it minor; for when you want just statically change it [20:11] oh right [20:11] would be possible to pop up a window that shows volume and equalizer [20:12] actually it would just be a custom layout :)