[03:34] <astraljava> Has anyone tracked the ISO size issue currently? I seem to recall seeing talk about this over on the vanilla side, but am unsure about the decisions. I suppose we're still wanting to get down to a size that fits a CD, right?
[03:34] <micahg> Ubuntu is doing 800MB
[03:35] <astraljava> Right. I just realized I had not realized this while sending the email to the lists, so nobody actually was able to burn it to a disk. I hope this didn't cause anyone to turn away from us.
[03:36] <micahg> the flavors can do as they wish
[03:37] <astraljava> Yeah. What's your opinion, is it too hard to do? Have things bloated up lately?
[03:37] <micahg> I think Xubuntu is fine at 700MB
[03:38] <micahg> although alpha2 is oversized
[03:38] <micahg> so, whatever people want
[03:39] <astraljava> I guess I'll add it to next meeting's agenda.
[03:39] <micahg> we could probably get it down for alpha3 (although, we might have issues with 2 python, webkit, and gtk stacks)
[03:39] <astraljava> ...and try to get some numbers for it.
[03:39] <astraljava> Oh, right.
[03:39] <astraljava> That'd be an easy... what, 25MB?
[03:42] <astraljava> Well probably not that much.
[03:42] <micahg> we can see about getting gtk3 versions of the webkit stuff maybe
[03:42] <micahg> that's ~7MB
[04:49] <astraljava> pleia2: Btw. re: translations bug, did you follow the instructions at: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs#translation
[04:50]  * astraljava hasn't yet done an analysis of the bugs so far
[04:54] <pleia2> astraljava: no, but I don't think it was any of those things, it was just a portion of the desktop that wasn't showing up translated
[04:57] <astraljava> pleia2: Do you mean that it _is_ translated, but it isn't working in quantal?
[04:57] <pleia2> well, I don't know if it's translated
[04:58] <pleia2> I really don't understand the translations process all that well, so I'm not even sure where to look
[04:59] <astraljava> Yeah me neither. :)
[04:59] <astraljava> High time to learn, I suppose.
[04:59] <astraljava> Well, err... translations page is not available for quantal. How are we supposed to check?
[05:00] <astraljava> I'll ask on -testing.
[05:29] <astraljava> Wait, we're providing support for stable+1 on #xubuntu?
[05:29] <astraljava> Then I see no objections to send the testers in there for the IRC case.
[05:31] <pleia2> I don't know, are we? :)
[05:35] <astraljava> Says so on the release notes draft. :)
[05:36] <pleia2> oh, that
[05:36] <pleia2> we always say that, but I never actually read it apparently
[05:36] <astraljava> LOLlero.
[06:13] <astraljava> pleia2: There's a fine line between reading text and understanding it.
[06:33]  * astraljava just realized the keyboard layout thingie is in the testcases twice.
[06:34] <astraljava> knome: pleia2: anyone with interest: Which do you think it'd suit better? Is it important enough to have it in Short (thus getting more frequency)?
[07:42] <astraljava> knome: I went ahead and removed the protocol babbling from /Long's email section.
[08:21] <ochosi> astraljava: i think we can remove the "appearance"-section from 12.10 testing again, otherwise we'll get lots of duplicates to bug #1016713...
[08:32] <astraljava> ochosi: Heh, ok, if you feel like it. Will you, or shall I?
[09:13] <ochosi> astraljava: hmm, on second thought, maybe i can also rephrase it towards missing icons
[09:13] <ochosi> astraljava: cause that would make a lot of sense and still be helpful
[09:14] <astraljava> ochosi: Excellent, thanks!
[09:15] <astraljava> pleia2: re: bug 1018550, was the not-translated part visible in the panel by default? If so, then I presume it's DateTime plugin that we're talking about, instead of orage. My apologies if that's the case.
[09:15] <ochosi> astraljava: ok, done
[09:15] <astraljava>  \o/
[09:19] <ochosi> btw, how was yesterday's meeting?
[09:19] <ochosi> haven't had time to read the backlog and there are no minutes yet
[09:26] <astraljava> I didn't see any conversation happening during the time of the meeting, except princess telling us she was sorry she was late (of nothing). :D
[09:27]  * astraljava had to also miss the meeting
[09:28] <ochosi> ok, then i guess there probably wasn't one
[09:29] <astraljava> Most likely that is the acceptable resolution, yes.
[09:30] <ochosi> maybe we should re-schedule
[09:42] <ochosi> bbl
[10:00] <astraljava> I doubt there's that much open and pressing issues.
[10:09] <astraljava> Heheh. Apparently we should pay a little more attention to the testcases. At least I don't even find where I could set the suspend timer.
[10:21] <Sysi> https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8744 is this bug present in 4.10 on quantal?
[10:25] <Sysi> alt+printscreen also fails for me, assigned to xfce4-screenshooter -w in default settings
[10:31] <astraljava> I can come back to those after the milestone is released, too busy now.
[10:41] <knome> astraljava, well ideally we'd only have one test which everybody always runs.
[10:41] <knome> astraljava, but i suppose it can be at /Short, since it's been there before
[11:21] <astraljava> knome: Yeah well, if you want to include /Long into one that always gets run, then I can foresee a drastic reduce of daily testing for sure. .)
[11:22] <knome> i know
[11:22] <astraljava> knome: But yeah, I concur, I'll remove it from /Long for now.
[11:22] <knome> maybe call the short test "daily" then and the long test.... "milestone" :P
[11:23] <knome> or daily and extended
[11:29] <astraljava> Well that's technically not "correct" when doing the milestones, cause then "daily" is a prerequisite for the "extended". But I think the proper solution in the end is that you will only see one testcase in the tracker, so you don't have to see the names for the cases at all. Milestone only has the "daily" embedded first.
[11:29] <knome> yes
[11:30]  * astraljava hates the transition times :D
[11:30] <knome> o'rly?
[11:30] <knome> i'm so happy that the tests are actually reviewed now
[11:30] <knome> and that there is much more sense in them
[11:32] <astraljava> Yeah. Like I noticed that no one had realized, or at least voiced the absence of a timer for Suspend in Xubuntu. :D
[11:32] <astraljava>  /Long warranted the testing of such in the Suspend case...
[11:33] <astraljava> Made me wonder whether anyone actually _really_ tested the /Long at all, but then maybe they just didn't have laptops.
[11:44] <knome> yup.
[11:44] <knome> i think actually many skipped the short/long tests altogether
[11:44] <knome> i did at first, because i didn't know they existed
[12:01] <astraljava> Well that shouldn't be the case this time, considering I shed blood and tears for that announcement email, dangit!
[12:06] <astraljava> knome: We've reviewed Wubi?
[12:07] <knome> astraljava, didn't we. i already sent an email to ev telling to drop all support.
[12:08] <astraljava> It's possible, I just have no recollection of it. It isn't all that surprising. If you know we did, then I'm cool with it.
[12:08] <knome> we pretty much decided that at the sprint we had
[12:08] <knome> there might have been some brief discussions after, all coming to the conclusion that we simply don't have testers for it
[12:08] <astraljava> Right, ok, that explains why I can't recall, cause there's no trail of crumbs. :)
[12:09] <astraljava> Yeah, I just thought that the decision was now pending on ev's response to the call for help.
[12:09] <knome> and that it is just one more thing to carry with, and a thing that comes with problems
[12:09] <knome> no, he responded that the changes were being made
[12:09] <astraljava> Yeah, I agree whole-hearedly.
[12:09] <knome> i suppose they are done already
[12:09] <astraljava> heartedly*
[12:09] <knome> heh :)
[12:09] <astraljava> Excellent, thanks.
[12:10] <knome> let me see if i still have that mail
[12:10] <knome> looks like i don't
[12:10] <knome> i think i forwarded it to you though?
[12:10] <knome> at least the original mail
[12:11] <knome> oh, no, there it is
[12:11] <knome> you're cc'd in that message
[12:11] <knome> "Re: Xubuntu Wubi status", June 8th
[12:11] <astraljava> My apologies, somehow I've missed that. I see it now. Case closed.
[12:12] <knome> ...aand i have forwarded it to xubuntu-devel too :D
[12:12] <knome> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel/2012-June/008244.html
[12:12] <knome> there we go
[12:12] <knome> (for information generally)
[12:14] <astraljava> Have you written the blog article you promised in that mail?
[12:14] <knome> probably not... :)
[12:15] <astraljava> Ok, there was no deadline for it, real or imaginary. Just whenever, but preferably not long after quantal gets released.
[12:15] <knome> if you want to do it... :>
[12:15] <astraljava> I can, next week or so.
[12:15] <knome> maybe in the alpha notes too.
[12:15] <astraljava> No time for that.
[12:15] <knome> hmm?
[12:16] <knome> i could add that, i mean
[12:16] <astraljava> Ohh... sweet.
[12:16] <knome> oh, you're editing the post.
[12:16] <astraljava> Oh that reminds me.
[12:16] <astraljava> Sorry.
[12:16] <knome> heh :)
[12:16] <astraljava> Damn, it got left open at home... :(
[12:16] <astraljava> Can you not unlock it?
[12:16] <knome> lol
[12:16] <knome> i can just force
[12:17] <knome> if you don't have anything changed
[12:17] <astraljava> Cool, do it, cause I didn't make any changes.
[12:17] <knome> ok, coll
[12:17] <knome> cool too
[12:17] <astraljava> But it reminded me, we're saying we want the people to join us on #xubuntu for support of stable+1.
[12:17] <astraljava> Like, for realsies?
[12:17] <knome> where?
[12:18] <knome> oh, that
[12:18] <astraljava> princess already admitted for not ever reading the release notes she writes. :D
[12:18] <knome> it says "#ubuntu+1 or #xubuntu"
[12:18] <astraljava> But what's the official stance on it?
[12:18] <astraljava> Yeah, that specifically _allows_ discussion about stable+1 on _#xubuntu_.
[12:19] <knome> #ubuntu+1 is sometimes really useless for non-stable xubuntuists
[12:19] <knome> think: new xfce version
[12:19] <knome> is anyone of us even hanging in there?
[12:19]  * astraljava points to self
[12:19] <knome> btw, i like the motion in -ops to create #ubuntu-discussion
[12:19] <astraljava> Don't care.
[12:19] <knome> i'm thinking that maybe we could rename
[12:20] <knome> i'll remove #xubuntu then
[12:20] <astraljava> Whatever, don't have an opinion to it.
[12:20] <astraljava> Ok, thanks.
[12:21] <knome> http://xubuntu.org/?p=1306&preview=true
[12:22] <knome> i think that might need some english-love
[12:22] <knome> :D
[12:28] <astraljava> "If you need support for this release..."
[12:28] <astraljava> Otherwise it's great.
[12:28] <astraljava> But we need to add the known issues.
[12:29] <astraljava> I'll try to do that this evening, at around 18:30 ->
[12:29] <knome> okay, thanks.
[12:32] <astraljava> Unless it needs to go out before that. I just asked from balloons, as no one seems to want to answer me on -release.
[12:32] <knome> awwh. :)
[12:32] <astraljava> Btw. are you around in the evening, from that time onwards?
[12:33] <knome> ermm, probably
[12:33] <knome> is there something worth it? :P
[12:33] <astraljava> We'd probably need to decide whether we're really going to release or not, depending on the results on the tracker.
[12:38] <knome> astraljava, right
[12:38] <knome> astraljava, it doesn't look *too* bad now
[12:39] <knome> oh, it kind of does with all the fails
[12:39] <knome> astraljava, is there a test you'd prefer me to run?
[12:39] <astraljava> No, it does not. Only the whole disk encryption (with encrypted $HOME to boot) fails with Thunar being unable to show the contents of $HOME. 
[12:40] <astraljava> knome: The other fails are not show-stoppers, really.
[12:40] <knome> yes
[12:40] <knome> that's why i'm not really sure about all this fail-stuff
[12:40] <knome> because we kind of have many fails, but oh well, let's still release
[12:40] <astraljava> I can't do any auto-resizes cause I'm using virt, or at least I don't know how to do them.
[12:40] <astraljava> So if you can, run them. Otherwise... we're cool.
[12:41] <knome> i'd vote for "fail" only if it really fails.
[12:41] <astraljava> BUT! You could run Studio's amd64s... *smirk*
[12:41] <knome> astraljava, to auto-resize, just create a big enough drive, then install xubuntu into it, and after that, install another xubuntu on a different partition, and autoresize the other partition
[12:42] <astraljava> Yes well, I think the result numbers are really important for final release, not so much for milestones.
[12:42] <astraljava> But it never asks for the boot image when it finds grub on the MBR.
[12:43] <astraljava> I probably need to tamper with the settings somehow.
[12:43] <knome> hmm.
[12:43] <knome> boot image?
[12:43] <astraljava> ISO
[12:43] <astraljava> .iso
[12:44] <astraljava> But I need to run now. Run whatever tests you want, if you want. We most likely won't get all the tests run anyway, so we're gonna have to make the decision with sub-par data after all.
[12:46] <knome> i think that's what we did with the 12.04 alpha2 too
[12:46] <knome> or, i did test like a madman, and i think we got all but a few done
[12:47] <knome> but i think one guy testing 10 things in a few hours isn't really what i call "testing"
[12:48] <astraljava> No, not really.
[12:49] <astraljava> I need to work much better for the next milestones, to attract more testers.
[12:49] <astraljava> But anyway, gone for now.
[12:49] <knome> yup. hf
[12:49] <astraljava> Back at around 1530-1600 UTC.
[12:52] <knome> yup.
[13:24] <ochosi> knome: any more/new gmb feedback?
[13:24] <ochosi> micahg: ping
[13:38] <skaet> astraljava, knome, - do you want the images to be released today, based on the results of your testing?   Not quite clear to me from the results on the tracker.
[13:55] <hobgoblin> ok - got this odd bug in the alternate alpha2 - absolutely no idea what to report it against - so some help would be cool
[13:55] <hobgoblin> install a kbd layout - add orage to panel - click on orage - changes kb layout - click on orage - changes kb layout back again
[14:00] <ochosi> hobgoblin: wow, that really does sound very odd...
[14:00] <ochosi> (unfortunately i have no way of testing 12.10 atm)
[14:02] <hobgoblin> ochosi: you're telling me - I was completely confused - I thought I was seeing things 
[14:03] <skaet> help please,  there aren't any updates for Xubuntu in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QuantalQuetzal/TechnicalOverview/Alpha2
[14:04] <ochosi> knome, astraljava ^
[14:05] <hobgoblin> ochosi: had it in the entire disc one I also got bug 1013996 in that - but the encrypted one was fine 
[14:05] <hobgoblin> so whether it was tied up with that I don't know 
[14:08] <ochosi> skaet: astraljava said he'd be back around 16UTC, so he hopefully won't be (too) long
[14:08] <skaet> thanks ochosi.   :)
[14:09] <ochosi> skaet: no problem, sorry i can't help you myself
[15:43] <pleia2> skaet: updated with notes from our own release announcement (not much, just a couple things)
[15:43] <pleia2> well, wiki is saving...
[15:43] <skaet> Thanks pleia2 !  :)
[15:44] <pleia2> ochosi: we should add a "known issue" of 1016713, how shall we word it?
[15:45] <hobgoblin> pleia2: when you had issues with orage and languages - did you notice anything bizarre going on with keyboard layouts?
[15:45] <ochosi> pleia2: All applications using Gtk3 currently look bad because of a bug in the Unico engine.
[15:45] <pleia2> hobgoblin: no, I removed the applet after the keyboard test
[15:45] <ochosi> pleia2: not sure how else to say it, other than "look bad"
[15:45] <hobgoblin> pleia2: k - cheers
[15:46] <pleia2> ochosi: ok, I'll incl bug info
[15:46] <ochosi> pleia2: ty
[15:51] <pleia2> ok, I have an appointment to run off to, we should be good to go release notes and posts wise though
[15:51] <pleia2> will be back in an hour or so
[16:21] <ochosi> i'm off for the day
[16:21] <ochosi> hf!
[16:54] <micahg> ochosi: pong
[17:42] <astraljava> pleia2: Thanks for handling the technical overview! I gave the permission to release, despite the worrying bug elfy/hobgoblin found.
[17:56] <hobgoblin> astraljava: not got around to putting that result on the tracker by the way - no idea what to call the bug lol
[17:57] <astraljava> Oh? But... but... I think it is there.
[17:58] <astraljava> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/222/builds/17813/testcases/130/results
[17:59] <hobgoblin> no - that was a different one 
[18:00] <hobgoblin> aah - that's the live I did yesterday - the odd language/kbd thing was today with an alternate entire disc - http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/222/builds/17811/testcases/138/results
[18:03] <astraljava> Oh you were talking about that. Right.
[18:03] <astraljava> I didn't get to test that, yet.
[18:04] <hobgoblin> :)
[18:04] <hobgoblin> I really don't like alternates unless I REALLY need to use them :p
[18:05] <pleia2> well that's handy, I really don't like the desktop images :)
[18:05]  * astraljava ^5s pleia2
[18:05] <pleia2> ^5
[18:05] <hobgoblin> pleia2: LOL
[19:04] <pleia2> tossing alpha2 on fridge ;) then I'll publish ours
[19:06] <pleia2> http://xubuntu.org/news/quantalalpha2/
[19:06] <pleia2> voila
[19:09] <pleia2> twitter and g+ updated
[19:09]  * pleia2 goes back to work
[20:26]  * astraljava buys an imaginary trophy for our marketing champion
[20:29]  * hobgoblin doesn;t say anything about the llink to https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/987818 failing
[20:29] <Unit193> See? ubottu said no problem.
[20:29] <hobgoblin> that's excellent then :)
[20:29] <knome> bug 987818
[20:30] <hobgoblin> link fails knome 
[20:31] <astraljava> In soviet xubuntu, knome fails links.
[20:31] <hobgoblin> :)
[20:50] <knome> hah
[20:50] <knome> astraljava, so, is a2 ok?
[21:03] <astraljava> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/releases/quantal/alpha-2/
[21:04] <astraljava> The release is there, but I wouldn't say it's "ok". It's adequate, but there's still plenty of time. ;)
[21:06] <knome> heh
[21:07] <knome> https://twitter.com/ThinkIt_1/status/217787937746722816
[21:07] <knome> just pointing out.
[21:08] <knome> https://twitter.com/arcturax/status/216983739052457984 <- should we even retweet? ;)
[21:10] <astraljava> Can you comment on it? You could, and then add "Thanks, enjoy while it lasts. Prolly not that long."
[21:11] <knome> hummh? :P
[21:11] <astraljava> He may not stay with us for that 30 years he did on Apple's products.
[21:11] <knome> heh
[21:11] <astraljava> meh... on the former.
[21:14] <knome> my stomach is saying "hurr durr"