/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/06/29/#ubuntu-meeting.txt

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* skaet waves14:56
mdeslaurhi!14:56
skaethiya mdeslaur :)14:56
ScottK\014:57
brendandhi!14:59
arosaleshello14:59
skaet:)15:00
skaetlooks like quorum has emerged.  :)15:00
skaet#startmeeting15:00
meetingologyMeeting started Fri Jun 29 15:00:47 2012 UTC.  The chair is skaet. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.15:00
meetingologyAvailable commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired15:00
skaetAgenda (and minute location):15:01
skaethttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReleaseTeam/Meeting/2012-06-2915:01
skaet.15:01
skaetUpcoming dates:15:01
skaet2012/07/05 - DebianImportFreeze15:01
skaet2012/07/23 - Alpha 3 image candidates start15:01
skaet2012/07/26 - Alpha 315:01
skaet.15:01
skaetWork Items:15:01
skaet2012/06/29 -  2782 (was 2926 last week):  BEHIND trendline for this point.15:01
skaetPlease help get us back where we should be by making sure https://launchpad.net/~/+upcomingwork is up to date for your tasks.15:01
skaet.15:01
skaetBugs:15:01
skaetQuantal: http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-q-tracking-bug-tasks.html15:01
skaet12.04.1:http://status.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/kernel-bugs/reports/rls-p-tracking-bugs.html15:01
skaet.15:01
skaetA2 Testing Report: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/ReleaseReports/QuantalAlpha2TestReport15:01
skaetThank you to all the testers, and jibel for coordinating, and another excellent job in highlighting the key issues in a timely fashion.  :)15:01
skaet.15:01
skaetPending action items:15:01
skaet[skaet] - SRU team vanguards: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates/#Publishing - DONE15:01
skaet[seb128] - summarize on ubuntu-release mail list what desktop wants for 12.04.1 (201206 15:15:33:13) - ?15:01
skaet[skaet] - start off a blueprint for -r release for people to record ideas and thoughts on logical steps for making progress to the long term goal. (skaet, 20120622 16:25:27) - https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/other-r-future-release-brainstorming - DONE15:01
skaet.15:01
skaetWeekly Status Received:15:01
skaethttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001462.html -hw cert: brendand15:01
skaethttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001465.html- security: mdeslaurs15:01
skaethttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001467.html - desktop: seb12815:02
skaethttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001468.html - kernel: ogasawara15:02
skaethttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001469.html - community testing: balloons15:02
skaet** 2100 UTC - due time ^ Thank you to those who submitted on time **15:02
skaethttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001471.html - lubuntu: gilir15:02
skaethttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001472.html - server: arosales15:02
skaet** Reminder,  please get your team's summary in by 2100 UTC, so there's time to prep, take care of issues on the mail list, and keep the meeting short.15:02
skaet..15:02
skaet#topic Questions and Comments.15:03
=== meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Questions and Comments.
skaethiya,  any other team minutes available that I missed in my last pass?15:03
seb128hey15:03
skaetReminder: DebianImportFreeze is next Thursday 7/5,  after that all imports will need to be explicit.15:03
skaetThank you to stgraber and balloons for the updates to the iso tracker,  new features rolled out nice and smooth for A2 from my perspective.  :)15:04
seb128sorry I assumed we had no meeting after alpha2 (as we didn't have one after a1 IIRC) ... anyway I'm here ;-)15:04
ScottKDebian's freeze for Wheezy release is tomorrow, so the amount of new stuff from Debian should start to drop off in any case.15:04
skaetthanks seb128,  with holidays coming up,  and A2 being so smooth (overall),  seemed prudent to have one before DebianImportFreeze15:04
seb128yeah, makes sense ;-)15:05
skaetGeneral request:  Leads please work through your alpha 2 work items, and for those items not accomplished,  please retarget or postpone.   Burn downs are showing us fallling behind where we wanted to be.15:05
skaet..15:05
skaetanyone else have comments/questions before I start into my list?15:05
ogra_https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-June/001473.html - foundations: ogra15:05
ogra_(sorry !)15:05
skaetthanks ogra_ :)15:06
skaetseb128,  any update on the pending action item to post what desktop looks to land for 12.04.1?   (did I miss it on the ubuntu-release list?)15:06
seb128sorry15:08
seb128skaet, I mentioned it last week in reply to my weekly report email15:08
seb128"I also had an action item to check what images the desktop team wants to support for the LTS .1 release: we will keep doing what we did for previous LTSes, and support the same set of images that for the release, including the DVD ones. "15:09
seb128skaet, ^15:09
skaetthanks seb128.  I'll mark it done then.  :)15:09
seb128thanks15:09
skaet..15:09
skaetbrendand, do you have a prioritized list (ie. most to least important) of the bugs cert wants fixed for 12.04.1?   is bug 1013843 the key blocker?15:09
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1013843 in casper (Ubuntu Quantal) "resolv.conf empty when doing PXE installations" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/101384315:09
brendandskaet, as far as i know that's only in quantal15:10
skaetbrendand,  ok.  :)15:10
brendandskaet, as for prioritization, i will need to discuss with ara. when would you like a list by - and how many bugs? 5? 10?15:11
brendandskaet, or all of them, just prioritized?15:11
skaetbrendand,  top 5 most impact to fix would be good,  or a list in descending order of inpact,  so we can get some focus.15:11
skaetpossible to mail something out to ubuntu-release mail list by next week?15:12
brendandskaet, asap15:12
highvoltage~/win 1215:12
skaet:) ok,  will add it to the actions.  :)15:13
skaet..15:13
skaetmdeslaurs,  for those AA uploads, is there someone identified, or just waiting in queue?15:13
brendandskaet, about the 1013843 bug, i wanted to ask stgraber if he is blocked trying to reproduce it?15:13
stgraberbrendand: I'm not, just busy with other things15:14
brendandstgraber, ok. whatever resources you need to try and reproduce it, the guys in montreal can provide15:14
skaet..?15:15
stgraberbrendand: I have a netboot setup at home so should be easy to reproduce locally (though the fixes I pushed in quantal were specifically to make it work ;))15:15
stgraber..15:15
skaetmdeslaur, ^  (sorry about the typo on your nick)15:16
seb128skaet, tab completion is handy ;-)15:16
skaetyup.15:17
mdeslaurskaet: jdstrand is identified, or he may sponsor sbeattie15:17
skaetcoolio,  just wanted to make sure wasn't going to linger over holidays/debconf/etc.  :)15:18
skaet..15:18
skaetseb128, does it make sense to ask balloons to get the new gtk's ally enablement tested by the community?  Would be nice to get early feedback, and a chance to fix before we get to beta.15:19
* skaet notes that balloons will need to be followed up by with email. 15:19
seb128skaet, that would be great15:19
seb128skaet, balloons: check with TheMuso if you need details on what needs testing15:20
seb128skaet, balloons: a slightly more detailed email on the topic is on https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2012-June/003868.html15:20
skaetseb128,  ok,  I'll put in a request and copy you and TheMuso on it.15:21
seb128thanks15:21
skaet..15:21
skaetseb128,  popey,  when will the next unity, compiz drops land?15:21
seb128unity for quantal is being worked15:22
seb128next week if everything goes well15:22
seb128new compiz landed this week15:22
popeyoh hai, didnt realise there was a meeting right now15:22
popeywhat seb128 says :)15:22
seb128we should have another compiz within 2 weeks with gsettings support (finger crossed)15:23
popeyquantal + nux should be testing monday, release tuesday15:23
seb128gsettings code is being worked, sam estimates to a good week of work so I count on 2 weeks for landing if that goes well15:23
popeythanks seb12815:23
ogra_we're still waiting for upstream to merge the gles patches for arm15:23
ogra_(compiz that is)15:23
seb128ogra_, that will be after gsettings, don't count before a month15:24
seb128..15:24
ogra_current compiz is built with gles support, which will not work on arm15:24
seb128ogra_, right, well they have 2 compiz maintainers and work for 5, there is only so much they can get done at the time15:24
ogra_(that doesnt matter much though since we have no working drivers for any arm platform yet, waiting for TI as usual)15:24
seb128gsettings is first then they will do gles15:25
seb128..15:25
skaetthanks seb128, popey, ogra_ .  ok, that helps with setting the expectations.15:25
ogra_seb128, i didnt mean to blame anyone or so :) just wanted to throw it in the meeting so people are aware and dont complain that their pandas dont show bling ;)15:25
seb128ogra_, my panda doesn't show screen atm, let's talk after bling later :p15:26
ogra_seb128, if there would have been dailies today, these would have a fix for that ;)15:26
ogra_..15:26
skaetogra_, yeah glad you brought it up,  sounds like its going to get close to feature freeze then before its all working,  which is a bit worrying.15:26
skaet..15:26
ogra_skaet, well, as i understand it, upstream expects that *all* plugins are ported to GLES before accepting the patch15:27
ogra_linaros patch only ports the ones we use in ubuntu15:27
ogra_..15:27
skaetogra_, yeah that could indeed make things *interesting* :P15:27
ogra_right15:27
seb128that's being sorted, they will not block on that15:28
seb128still there is a bit of work needed15:28
ogra_not much we can do about it though15:28
seb128and they go asked to finish gsettings first since blocks desktop updates15:28
seb128i.e part of GNOME is blocked on it15:28
seb128and that work is overdue (it was meant to land in oneiric)15:28
ogra_well, as long as there is a chance it makes FF15:28
seb128that should be fine15:28
ogra_if not, it would be good to know about that early enough so we can think of alternatives15:29
seb128as said it should be one extra week or max 2 to clear the gsettings stuff and the important bug fixes they are on15:29
ogra_ok, that sounds fine15:29
seb128then it's gles, which hopefully with take 1 or 2 weeks15:29
seb128I will keep you guys updated15:29
seb128..15:29
skaetogra_,   on the subject of worrying,  who has the lead for java on arm?   is there a good pointer to the plan for that part?  (me may have missed it in her last pass)15:29
ogra_thx15:29
ogra_..15:29
ogra_skaet, hmm, usually thats doko, not sure, probably infinity is on it too nowadays15:30
ogra_i can collect info on that for next week15:30
skaetogra_, that would be appreciated.  :)  Thanks!15:31
skaet..15:31
* skaet looks around to see if anyone else has questions?15:31
skaetlooks like that's it then for this week.15:33
skaetNext week I'll be on vacation,  and pgraner will be hosting the meeting.15:33
skaetThanks ogra_, arosales, mdeslaur,  seb128, brendand, popey, stgraber, ScottK15:34
skaet#endmeeting15:34
=== meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology
meetingologyMeeting ended Fri Jun 29 15:34:03 2012 UTC.15:34
meetingologyMinutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-29-15.00.moin.txt15:34
meetingologyMinutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-29-15.00.html15:34
stgraberthanks!15:34
mdeslaurthanks skaet!15:34
ogra_thanks skaet15:34
seb128skaet, thanks, enjoy your vacs!15:34
arosalesthanks skaet for chairing :-)15:34
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ajmitch#startmeeting21:04
meetingologyMeeting started Fri Jun 29 21:04:37 2012 UTC.  The chair is ajmitch. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.21:04
meetingologyAvailable commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired21:04
ajmitchOK, arb agenda is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard/Agenda21:05
* stgraber waves21:05
* highvoltage splashes21:05
ajmitchwas looking over http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-05-25-21.09.log.html from the last meeting, there weren't any actions added aside from the UDS items21:06
* wendar waves21:07
ajmitchyay, people :)21:07
highvoltageI'm really tired so sorry for my lack of enthusiasm :)21:08
ajmitchdo we want to quickly go over the developer portal bugs, or just be happy that they're there & being looked at? :)21:08
* ajmitch mostly wants to get people voting on submissions, fwiw :)21:09
highvoltageOk, I'll catch up with the votes tomorrow. And also all the nice things dolbach has been talking about.21:09
ajmitchyeah, I've been talking with dholbach a bit & following what he's been doing with the apps branch & arb-lint21:10
highvoltageand also try to get some sense of how many competition apps there are and what I can do about it21:10
ajmitchapparantly there are 30+ for the competition21:10
ajmitchI expect some won't be packaged for /opt/extras.ubuntu.com21:10
ajmitchthis sort of covers some of the UDS workitems, with the competition & the tools for reviewing21:11
ajmitchone thing that came up this week was whether ~ubuntu-dev should be added to the ~ubuntu-app-review-contributors team21:12
ajmitchthoughts?21:12
highvoltagesounds like it makes sense21:14
highvoltagethe more the arb process is integrated in the rest of ubuntu, the better21:14
highvoltage(imho)21:14
ajmitchit'd allow any ubuntu developer to commit to the branches dholbach is importing, and let them comment & change state of apps on myapps21:15
ajmitchwhich I think is fine21:15
ajmitchassuming you find the branches useful21:15
wendarwell, remember that ubuntu-app-review-contributors gets special access in MyApps21:15
wendardo we want to grant that to all ubuntu-devs?21:16
ajmitchright, that's what I'm asking21:16
wendarit seems like some kind of verification step makes sense21:16
ajmitchsince changing the myapps state doesn't affect a whole lot unless they're rejected21:16
highvoltageI guess in that case they might as well just join #ubuntu-arb and ask to be added21:17
highvoltage(or mail or whatever)21:17
wendarI thought review contributors could do more than just change state?21:17
highvoltagewhat's the concern? that someone might do something malicious?21:18
wendarmore concerned about accidental disruptive changes, from people who don't know the interface yet21:19
wendarit's still a little buggy21:19
wendarbut, if they really only have access to comment and non-destructive state changes, then I have no concern21:19
wendarit is worth asking ubuntu-dev if they *want* to be added though21:19
wendararen't there default notifications sent out to review contributors?21:20
wendaror, is that only direct to the arb mailing list, and not individual notifications?21:20
ajmitchthat's what dholbach was checking, he said he hadn't received any21:20
wendaris that because they're going to ubuntu-app-review-board members? or to the mailing list?21:21
ajmitchto the mailing list21:21
wendarok, limited access and not spamming ubuntu-devs are my only concerns21:22
wendarif that's all sorted, and ubuntu-dev wants to be added, I'm fine with it21:23
ajmitchalright21:23
highvoltagesounds reasonable21:23
stgraber+121:23
wendaranother possibility is to just ask achuni to grant access to all ubuntu-dev, without joining up the launchpad teams21:23
ajmitchit's a bit hard to ask a team that encompasses everyone with upload rights, ~ubuntu-dev is often added to other teams21:23
ajmitchthat could work21:24
* ajmitch just wants more people reviewing21:24
wendaryeah, making that as easy as possible is a good idea21:24
wendarthough, there something neat about being granted priviledges when you join a team :)21:25
ajmitchideally we'd have some active arb helpers who could then go on to the arb team (election, appointment, whatever) & vote on apps21:25
ajmitchthe term length is indefinite in LP for some reason, but I know we all won't want to do this forever :)21:26
ajmitchok, that vaguely covers the recruiting agenda item from last month21:29
* ajmitch isn't sure if any of us have managed to set aside a regular reviewing time lately, so will skip that :)21:30
ajmitch#topic General state of the ARB queue21:30
=== meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: General state of the ARB queue
wendarajmitch: hmmm... we all had term expirations last I checked...21:30
ajmitchI'm worried that applications are getting lost in the voting process21:30
ajmitchwendar: I checked the other day, we no longer do21:30
wendarajmitch: how odd. I know mine's coming up soon21:31
ajmitchhttps://launchpad.net/~app-review-board/+members shows no expiry dates21:31
wendarajmitch: yup, you're right21:32
wendarajmitch: well, it's 2 years after start anyway21:32
ajmitchit's a life sentence :)21:32
highvoltageoh dear21:32
wendarso, 3 of us are out this September21:33
wendarbut, I don't think we should wait until then to add new people21:33
ajmitchno, nominally there are 7 on the board, but a couple haven't been heard from for quite some time21:33
wendarreally, I'd be happy to treat it as more of a promotion process21:33
ajmitchso would I21:33
wendarwe'd still need to do the poll of all ubuntu-devs21:34
wendarbut, it could be on a one-off basis21:34
ajmitch& not require adjusting quorum for votes on apps, even universe just requred 2 +1s from MOTUs for new apps21:34
wendaryeah, quorum is a fixed number, shouldn't vary by the size of the board21:34
wendar(it already is that way, so no change needed)21:35
ajmitchwe've struggled to get 3 votes lately, I know everyone's been busy (myself included)21:35
wendarajmitch: yes, I'm thinking I may switch to making voting my first priority21:35
ajmitchI came across an example of a lens that had the vote started about 7 weeks ago, but never got to +321:35
wendarespecially if we get some regular arb contributors21:35
ajmitchwhat do you think of a trello board for being able to see the state of the apps being worked on & reviewed? too much duplication?21:36
highvoltageyeah I think it makes sense priorotising voting, the last thing we want is a backlog of perfectly good apps.21:36
wendarreviewing an app that's already been cleaned up takes a lot less time than cleaning up a new one21:36
wendarajmitch: yeah, I wondered about using trello too21:36
ajmitchreally, the arb's only role should need to be voting21:36
wendarajmitch: it doesn't have to be a lot of work to maintain trello, if it's just the name and link for each app21:37
ajmitchwe can all do package clean up if we want, but voting is the main task21:37
ajmitchwendar: right21:37
wendartrello is far, far simpler to maintain than a wiki page for app status :)21:37
ajmitchthat way if you put an app up for vote, move it to the voting list in trello so we can see what to look at21:37
* ajmitch uses it a bit at work now21:37
wendarand we can grant arb contributors full edit rights on trello21:38
ajmitchyep21:38
wendarand, any app submitter can quickly check the status of their app21:38
ajmitchstgraber, highvoltage: in favour of it?21:38
highvoltageyep21:38
stgrabersounds good21:40
ajmitch#action ajmitch to set up trello board for tracking application votes & reviewer notes21:40
meetingologyACTION: ajmitch to set up trello board for tracking application votes & reviewer notes21:40
ajmitchok21:40
* ajmitch thought this weekend was going to be completely full with work, but it seems next weekend will be21:40
ajmitchdholbach's suggested this apps sprint this week, I'll probably be lurking around #ubuntu-arb in the evenings as usual21:41
ajmitchnot sure how crazy everyones' schedules are, but it'd be nice to get through a few apps for the competition over the next few days21:42
wendarSunday is okay for me this week21:42
wendarand Wednesday is a holiday21:42
ajmitchlucky :)21:43
wendarbut otherwise I've got a couple hours in the morning and a couple in the evening21:43
wendarso, I can do short snippets21:43
ajmitchany time is helpful21:43
wendarbut, not big stuff21:43
wendarlike, a whole app review usually takes me 4 hours21:43
wendar(with finding and fixing bugs)21:43
ajmitchI can understand that, it can be quite involved21:43
ajmitchwe'll try & get some cleaned up apps for voting on21:44
wendarI know I've got a couple that are just about ready to go up for vote21:44
ajmitchthey should take less time21:44
wendarso, I can focus on those for this week21:44
wendarand, on voting on the ones that are already up for vote21:44
wendardoes trello let you assign a task to a person/21:44
wendar?21:45
ajmitchyes21:45
ajmitchjust drag their icon onto the card21:45
wendarcool, that'll help21:45
ajmitchI'll probably need to get the email you use for trello so I can add people21:45
wendarlike, when I'm working on an app, I can put it in an active channel, and then tag it with my user21:45
wendarbecause honestly, right now it'll take me 30minutes just to find all my active apps, check on their status, and figure out what the next step is for each :(21:46
ajmitchyeah, and you can leave comments on each card, it's fairly quick to use21:46
wendarokay, that'll help alot :)21:47
ajmitchwith that, is there any other business to talk about?21:48
ajmitchapart from the meeting time & the next chair21:48
wendarsounds like not :)21:50
ajmitchok :)21:50
ajmitchdoes this meeting time still work for people, and who volunteers to be the next chair? :)21:50
* ajmitch will have to volunteer someone for it soon21:53
ajmitchhighvoltage: you're next alphabetically, available for it next month?21:53
highvoltageajmitch: ok21:53
ajmitchthanks21:54
ajmitchnext meeting at 21:00UTC on 27 july21:54
ajmitch#endmeeting21:54
=== meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology
meetingologyMeeting ended Fri Jun 29 21:54:59 2012 UTC.21:54
meetingologyMinutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-29-21.04.moin.txt21:54
meetingologyMinutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-29-21.04.html21:54
ajmitchthanks everyone21:55
wendarthanks ajmitch!21:55
ajmitchyou can go & have your friday drinks now, if you haven't started already21:55
highvoltagethank ajmitch21:55
wendarhah, I've got to launch 2 features before friday drinks :)21:55
wendar(launching them after is not a good idea, we used to do that in the dot-com days ;)21:56
highvoltagewendar: ouch! good luck :)21:56
* ajmitch was going to be spending all day today doing work, but that's deferred thankfully :)21:56
wendarajmitch: happy Saturday :)21:56
ajmitchheh, thanks21:57

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