[00:06] <littlegirl> Hey there, I don't have the power to edit the http://www.ubuntu.com/news/Official_Ubuntu_Book page, and the link to the Official Ubuntu Book is wrong. Is there someone with editing power who can change it to http://www.informit.com/store/product.aspx?isbn=0132748509      ?
[00:07] <littlegirl> Whoops, wrong channel - sorry!
[12:07] <fregl> lol, can one crash the kubuntu 12.04 installer by putting spaces in the hostname?
[12:10] <Riddell> fregl: hmm possible
[12:48] <jtechidna> iirc harald fixed that one
[12:48] <jtechidna> though after 12.04
[12:55] <debfx> I hope that's SRUed
[12:56] <debfx> apachelogger: ^
[12:56] <fregl> it seems to crash on the current installer image, but then again, only silly colleagues would accidentally do this kind of thing :D
[12:59] <BluesKaj> 'morning all
[13:18] <apachelogger> debfx: ?
[13:18] <apachelogger> ah
[13:19] <apachelogger> debfx, jtechidna: cjwatson is taking care of SRUing
[13:25] <ScottK> Riddell: How is this new printer thing better than the one we have?
[13:26] <apachelogger> ScottK: it does not crash for pointless reasons :P
[13:26] <apachelogger> also it is maintained :P
[13:26] <apachelogger> also it looks nice :P
[13:26] <ScottK> apachelogger: I can't recall last time it crashed for me (and I fixed a number of crashers for 12.04).
[13:27] <ScottK> The backend bits of the current one are well maintained since we benefit from all the work Til is doing on the common parts.
[13:27] <ScottK> I'm a bit worried that if we go off on our own, even though we'll have a maintained GUI, all the tricky printery bits will get less maintained.
[13:27] <apachelogger> who maintains the gui?
[13:28] <ScottK> For the new one I guess danti.
[13:29] <ScottK> For the old one, I'd been planning on doing the Python 3 port when the backend gets ported to Python 3.
[13:29] <ScottK> The problems we've had relate a lot more to backend stuff than GUI failures.
[13:33] <jtechidna> For one, the python printer applet uses 22 MB of RAM to show a tray icon.
[13:39] <jtechidna> adding the equivalent print-manager plasmoid to the tray only increases plasma's mem usage by ~1 MB
[13:45] <ScottK> jtechidna: Each of my bazillion akonadi processes takes at least the 22MB.
[13:45] <ScottK> I agree it's a difference, but is it important?
[13:50] <jtechidna> there's also the improved UI
[13:51] <debfx> which new printer thing are you talking about?
[13:51] <jtechidna> print-manager. jr sent a mail to k-d about it
[13:54] <debfx> aha
[13:56] <debfx> does it have any external dependencies?
[13:57] <Riddell> debfx: only libcups
[13:57]  * debfx sees some org.fedoraproject and com.redhat dbus stuff in there
[13:58] <Riddell> ScottK: it's shinyer and probably it, but I some parts of the UI I'm unconvinced about and it doesn't recommend a print driver
[13:58] <Riddell> but it probably doesn't have any random parts of broken gtk use that I failed to get round to porting in it
[13:59] <debfx> Riddell: so what implements org.fedoraproject.Config.Printing?
[14:00] <Riddell> good point, there is some system-config-printer-common dependency
[14:00] <debfx> maybe it doesn't recommend a driver because nothing provides that dbus interface?
[14:00] <debfx> there is a GetBestDrivers call
[14:02] <debfx> ah indeed that's s-c-p-c
[14:06] <Riddell> neither print-manager nor s-c-p-k set up my printer when I plug it in, some issue in the backend I guess
[14:06] <debfx> nice, that dbus service needs gtk
[14:07] <debfx> and one of the modules it needs is in system-config-printer-gnome
[14:08] <apachelogger> Riddell: FWIW, driver recommendation is bogusy IMHO
[14:08] <apachelogger> with plug'n'print you should get the right driver 99% of the time
[14:08] <apachelogger> in cases were pnp does not work you likely do not have a driver altogether
[14:08] <apachelogger> that's what I have been told anyway
[14:10] <debfx> so system-config-printer needs some packaging changes for print-manager to work
[14:12] <Riddell> debfx: what needs changed?
[14:13] <debfx> Riddell: all python modules that scp-dbus-service.py requires need to be moved out of -gnome
[14:36] <apachelogger> Riddell: print'n'plug is in CUPS btw (IIRC)
[14:36] <apachelogger> not frontend related at any rate
[14:38] <apachelogger> all ktp 0.4 should be built soonishy in staging, will do public call for testing tomorrow
[14:40] <apachelogger> claydoh: SteveRiley: how about having a forum where people can share ktp experiences?
[14:40] <apachelogger> just random thinking :)
[14:44] <ScottK> For me, every printer I've got (they are on the network) they are automatically discovered and I just click through accepting the recommendations.
[15:31] <littlegirl> Hey there, is the official IRC network for Kubuntu irc.freenode.net or irc.ubuntu.com?
[15:34] <Riddell> it's the same thing
[15:34] <Riddell> but generally we'd point to irc.ubuntu.com
[15:35] <littlegirl> Okay, then I'll change the references to irc.freenode.net. (:
[15:35] <jjesse> littlegirl,  is that a entity?
[15:35] <littlegirl> It will be. (:
[15:36] <littlegirl> It will end up being more than one. irc.ubuntu.com will be an entity and then the separate channels will be entities, as needed.
[15:36] <littlegirl> I figure the more things I turn into entities, the easier it will be for anyone else later to change something. (:
[15:37] <littlegirl> We have until October to get this stuff done, right?
[15:37] <jjesse> yes
[15:37] <jjesse> string freeze or doc freeze don't remember what it is called
[15:37] <littlegirl> Good, because this is a slow process with small changes that affect other changes. (:
[15:38] <jjesse> littlegirl, i should have time starting in august to get started
[15:38] <jjesse> sorry i've been un responsive :)
[15:38] <littlegirl> Great!
[15:38] <littlegirl> You've been very helpful. (:
[15:39] <littlegirl> Listen, while I've got your ear, I found a link to copyright.html in the legal.xml file, and that file does not exist (it's a dead link in the existing KHelpCenter, too). Is that something that I need to write and put into the kubuntu-docs, or is that created and handled by someone else?
[15:40] <littlegirl> It's a link to help:/kubuntu/copyright.html in the legalnotice.xml file.
[15:41] <jjesse> i thought there was a copyright file
[15:41] <jjesse> it should reference something like Copyright Ubuntu Documentaion Team or something
[15:41] <jjesse> see if ubuntu-docs has it still?
[15:44] <jjesse> littlegirl, not familiar enough w/ the new ubuntu-docs and mallard so not sure where the copyright file is in the current branch
[15:44] <littlegirl> I did "locate copyright.html" and only turned up two files, both of which are for DocBook, the software.
[15:45] <jjesse> yeah not quite sure
[15:45] <jjesse>  but i think there needs to be a copyright doc but don't know for sure
[15:45] <littlegirl> It
[15:45] <jjesse> might want to ping Daskreech or ubuntu-doc list
[15:46] <littlegirl> It's trying to reference the Creative Commons license, which is in ccbysa.xml, but I don't know how to link that, because it's not on the docs subdirectory, and it gets called inside of each file, so the ../../ structure could wreck the links depending on which file calls it. (:
[15:46] <littlegirl> Okay, I'll try both. (:
[15:46] <littlegirl> Hey there, Daskreech, can I bend your ear about a copyright.html file?
[15:49] <littlegirl> jjesse: I'm also not sure how to handle these help:/kubuntu/_____ links in which _____ is replaced by a topic. Each of them points to an HTML file, none of which is maintained inside of the kubuntu-docs subdirectory, so their content is beyond my control and may or may not be up-to-date (and as seen in the case of the copyright one, missing entirely).
[15:49] <jjesse> i would have to look into that
[15:49] <jjesse> can you send me a direct email
[15:49] <littlegirl> Will do. (:
[15:49] <jjesse> i know you've been updating the blueprint but those get filtered
[15:50] <littlegirl> I also put a few of the things that need to get done into the TODO file in the main kubuntu-docs directory. That way if anyone were to download and go offline, there would still be a list of work to do. (:
[15:51] <littlegirl> I could slam it all into the TODO file if that would be better. I think the blueprint is just a politeness thing to let others know what needs to be done and who's working on it. (:
[15:52] <jjesse> well i guess we can figure out our own workflow right :)
[15:52] <littlegirl> I'm open to suggestion, and if you ever see me do anything I shouldn't, don't hesitate to let me know. (:
[15:52] <jjesse> i think the TODO file is pretty cool idea
[15:53] <littlegirl> Yeah, the nice thing about that is if you download and then go offline. You then still can see everything in one place and not be left in a lurch until you get internet service again. (:
[15:55] <littlegirl> I still have a bunch of things I can do without any help, so there's plenty of time to get to the things I'm unsure of, but I'll fire off an email to you on the help:/kubuntu things and see if I can find out more about these HTML files in the ubuntu-doc channel, and then I'll be coming in here and all the other kubuntu and ubuntu channels begging people to please help me verify the accuracy of the content of all the topic docs. (
[15:55] <littlegirl> :
[15:59] <Daskreech> littlegirl: SUre what's up?
[16:01] <littlegirl> The common/legalnotice.xml file has this <ulink url="help:/kubuntu/copyright.html">Creative Commons ShareAlike License</ulink> link which points to a nonexistent file. Do you know who maintains that file (and any other html files that are linked to in the Kubuntu system documentation) and where I can find a copy of it?
[16:02] <littlegirl> Sorry, link to the document in question: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/kubuntu-docs/quantal/view/head:/common/legalnotice.xml
[16:04] <Daskreech> Well the creative commons is a common (ha haha ooooh) license. It has multiple versions so I would suspect they want a particular version
[16:05] <Daskreech>  Unless they were upgrading versions and misplaced the file?
[16:06] <Daskreech> http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/legalcode is the current version
[16:06] <Daskreech> http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/ if you want a human to read it
[16:06] <littlegirl> It pointed to 2.5. Should I update it to 3.0 in the Kubuntu system documentation?
[16:07] <littlegirl> This is a link to a local copy in case there is no internet connection, and it's expecting to find an html file. Is that something I should create and put somewhere in the documentation, or is that handled by the Ubuntu team?
[16:07] <littlegirl> Oh, I forgot to mention that I made an appropriate groan sound at your common reference. (:
[16:10] <ScottK> You can't change it from 2.5 to 3.0 without permission of all the copyright holders.
[16:10] <littlegirl> Okay, I won't touch it, then. (:
[16:50] <Daskreech> ScottK: would the copyright holders be the doc team in this instance?
[16:50] <ScottK> It would be whoever wrote the words.
[16:51] <Daskreech> littlegirl: I would guess that you could put a copy there but ask the Ubuntu team who put it there in the first place. May as well find out if they wanted it updated in the meantime
[17:15] <littlegirl> Thanks - I'll ask in the #ubuntu-doc channel. (:
[17:18] <Daskreech> RC2 is out
[19:24] <SteveRiley> apachelogger: claydoh: i'm not sure how many folks on KFN are using KTP (or its predecessor). i'll start a thread in the quantal forum asking for folks to chime in with feedback. can i point folks to sumski's existing KTP ppa so they can get the 0.4 bits now?
[20:28] <littlegirl> Okay, my sleuthing efforts have resulted in finding html versions of almost all the documents in /usr/share/doc/kde/HTML/en/kubuntu/ but the copyright.html file is still missing. Does anybody know how and/or why those html documents are generated? They appear to be html versions of the Kubuntu system documentation xml files.
[20:33] <ScottK> Darkwing: ^^^^ jjesse ^^^
[20:33] <littlegirl> LOL
[20:33]  * littlegirl heads into email
[20:38] <ScottK> It's possible Riddell might know.
[20:38] <ScottK> Personally, i have a life goal to avoid knowing about XML as much as possible.
[20:42] <littlegirl> I just recently learned XML and DocBook and I'm loving them. You probably just need to get to know them better and you'll develop warm fuzzies for them. (:
[20:43] <littlegirl> I've got a pretty big Linux blog and I'm contemplating converting all my content to DocBook just because it's a wonderful tool for converting content to a whole lot of other formats quickly. (:
[21:18] <ScottK> I may be weird, but I find csv and counting rows more intuitive.
[21:24] <Riddell> littlegirl: yes those are the xml docbook converted into html which is what the packageis
[21:35] <littlegirl> Riddell: Thanks! How is that done? There's no script for it in the scripts subdirectory, and since at least one of the html files is missing, it looks like the script that does it should be updated.
[21:46] <Riddell> littlegirl: it's in the packaging
[21:46] <Riddell> actually it's in Makefile
[21:47] <Riddell> see target under "All Kubuntu Documentation"
[21:47] <Riddell> for doc in `ls docs/`;
[21:54]  * Riddell snoozes
[21:55] <littlegirl> Hmmm, I see that now, thanks! Then that file needs to be tweaked to include the contents of the common subdirectory. In the meantime I changed the links to point to the xml documents to get around the problem entirely. (:
[21:55] <littlegirl> Is there any objection to doing that with all the html links?
[21:56]  * littlegirl hands Riddell some coffee
[21:56] <littlegirl> ScottK: That sounds fine to me. (:
[21:57] <littlegirl> Worse and worse. That Makefile does address common, so it's over my head. Hopefully one of you can fix it. (:
[22:14] <littlegirl> Riddell: You're a genius! Problem solved! That file refers to license.html instead of copyright.html. When I change copyright to license, all is again well with the world. (: