[01:11] <holstein> KiteHawk: ? kubuntu has the same kernel
[01:11] <holstein> should have sound.. make sure its not just you getting used to the KDE environment
[01:15] <KiteHawk> I think it actually was my graphics card
[01:16] <holstein> yup.. the driver*
[01:16] <KiteHawk> i thought i was using the onboard but i saw it was a funky card so i upgraded and loaded kubuntu and mixxx jumped right up
[01:16] <KiteHawk> my bad
[01:17] <KiteHawk> but yes now when i click on sound settings nothing happens
[01:17] <holstein> sure.. but the kernel is the same
[01:17] <KiteHawk> at top of screen where sound volume control is
[01:17] <holstein> open a terminal, and run
[01:17] <holstein> aplay -l
[01:17] <holstein> you'll see what devices are listed, if any
[01:18] <holstein> also, open in the terminal alsamixer, and trust none of the lables
[01:18] <holstein> labels*
[01:18] <KiteHawk> ok its remote and xfce environment has no vnc or am i mistaken about that?
[01:18] <holstein> KiteHawk: ?
[01:19] <KiteHawk> alsamixer i did that but i will up the volumes to verify
[01:19] <holstein> XFCE is alternatice to KDE
[01:19] <holstein> vnc is a way to share a desktop. you can do that with any environment
[01:19] <holstein> i use vino and vinagre usually from XFCE
[01:19] <KiteHawk> the machine is another machine than the one im on so i usually operate it through vnc or ssh but neither are setup yet
[01:20] <holstein> sure... use whatever software you want
[01:20] <KiteHawk> ah c i didnt know the program vino allows sharing desktop'
[01:20] <holstein> VNC, tight VNC.. vino... whatever
[01:20] <holstein> teamviewer
[01:20] <KiteHawk> k
[01:20] <holstein> also, use those with whatever desktop you want
[01:21] <holstein> though, typically, we dont use vino with KDE
[01:21] <KiteHawk> ubuntu 12.04 has it in the menu to start
[01:21] <holstein> and whatever the native one to KDE... you might not want to use that in gnome or XFCE
[01:21] <KiteHawk> so xfce is preferred because its faster?
[01:22] <holstein> KiteHawk: xfce is preferred only if you prefer it
[01:22] <KiteHawk> not sure exactly how to choose
[01:22] <holstein> i personally dont like KDE
[01:22] <holstein> and im not useing XFCE right now either, though i like it better, and support it
[01:22] <KiteHawk> ok for audio production purposes
[01:22] <holstein> KiteHawk: for whatever
[01:22] <holstein> doesnt matter
[01:22] <holstein> if you are remoting into an audio server occasionally, you dont need much of a desktop
[01:22] <holstein> maybe LXDE would be enough
[01:23] <KiteHawk> hmmm so why the variety just for variety sake?
[01:23] <holstein> KiteHawk: they are different
[01:23] <holstein> is XFCE faster than KDE? by default id say sure
[01:23] <holstein> but, KDE is different, and answers a different user base
[01:24] <holstein> can you have KDE and run ubuntustudio software? sure
[01:24] <KiteHawk> ubuntu studio for example is a collection of media for install so it would be considered media centric?
[01:24] <holstein> its all open, so the answer is always "yes".. its just how much of a pain
[01:24] <holstein> KiteHawk: ubuntustudio is us
[01:24] <holstein> its you and me
[01:25] <holstein> its a pre-set up version of ubuntu with customizations
[01:25] <holstein> we have metapackages... groups of software for tasks
[01:25] <holstein> you dont need ubuntustudio or any of the metapackages
[01:25] <KiteHawk> yes i understand the flexability is there but how is the protocol developed?
[01:26] <KiteHawk> what is the strenght of ubuntu studio?
[01:26] <holstein> its an out of the box solution
[01:26] <holstein> for audio and other things...
[01:26] <KiteHawk> strength(s)
[01:26] <holstein> if you want to have ubuntustudio, you install it, and have it
[01:26] <KiteHawk> yeah
[01:26] <holstein> its really something that no other operating system has
[01:26] <holstein> its like, if you bought OSX with protools and all the plugins preinstalled
[01:26] <holstein> with a differnt wallpaper
[01:26] <holstein> and icons
[01:27] <holstein> that would be "appleOSX studio"
[01:27] <holstein> that cant exist though... but we can do whatever
[01:27] <KiteHawk> i guess i get confused when so many things get loaded and it seams like one ubuntu is different from another
[01:27] <holstein> KiteHawk: they are all different, sure.. but the same base
[01:27] <holstein> ubuntustudio *is* ubuntu... *is* kubuntu
[01:28] <holstein> but, kubuntu is quite different
[01:28] <holstein> xubuntu and ubuntustudio look a lot alike now
[01:28] <holstein> like ubuntustudio and ubuntu did
[01:28] <KiteHawk> correct and keeping track is where i need know
[01:28] <holstein> but ehy are all the same
[01:28] <holstein> KiteHawk: nah.. just try em live, and enjoy
[01:28] <holstein> most distros have live CD's
[01:29] <holstein> and all of them have the linux kernel in some form of other
[01:29] <KiteHawk> yes i have been since version 6 but i'd like to be able to get to the task easily so as to appreciate ubuntu that much more
[01:29] <KiteHawk> i luv ubuntu:)
[01:30] <KiteHawk> 8)
[01:30] <holstein> version 6?
[01:30] <holstein> 6.04?
[01:30] <KiteHawk> thanks also for your support
[01:30] <holstein> sure.. anytime
[01:30] <holstein> or was it 6.10?
[01:30] <KiteHawk> yes i started with a mac ppc ubuntu 6.04
[01:31] <holstein> i loaded that up for history's sake
[01:31] <holstein> ppc is a pain
[01:31] <KiteHawk> it was just before 8.04 came out
[01:31] <KiteHawk> it sucks i had to let them all go
[01:31] <holstein> ppc?.. i was glad to drop them off and the recyclers :)
[01:32] <KiteHawk> no more support for the most part and they were quality servers
[01:32] <holstein> i have a couple still i run headless
[01:32] <KiteHawk> run forever
[01:32] <KiteHawk> yeah
[01:32] <KiteHawk> bus speed is horrible
[01:32] <holstein> running a desktop on them is a pain
[01:32] <holstein> ok... gtg... enjoy!
[01:32] <holstein> im going on vaction and might be on spotty network for a while
[01:33] <KiteHawk> cool have a great vacation  :D
[01:34] <KiteHawk> headless i didn't catch that what is?
[02:47] <acmeinc> what is the latest kernel version on U-S 12.04?
[02:48] <acmeinc> i started using a custom kernel and realized i haven't been getting updates.   wanna check if mine is actually the latest
[02:48] <acmeinc> hehe, timmy asks me every week to go to charlie murdochs now
[02:50] <acmeinc> wrong message, lolz
[03:04] <game2> acmeinc: Yes, no kernel updates on u-s.  But that is irrelevant if you are using a "custom kernel" surely?
[03:05] <acmeinc> i reverted back, but thx :)
[07:54] <Mish> There seems to be some problem in rendering text in Ubuntu studio. Black text doesn't appear totally black but appears to have purple and green colourations like in this screenshot.
[07:54] <Mish> http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/6466/screenshot0728201212573.png
[07:55] <Mish> This is not a browser only problem. I've seen it in the menu items as well as text in different places in the DE
[11:24] <Guest64607> nick sun
[13:02] <eein_> morning
[13:03] <cfhowlett> eein_: "morning"?  It's 2100 here in China...
[13:04] <eein_> :-)
[13:07] <eein_> its 2012 here in US but we are looking to catch back up with China soon
[13:31] <cfhowlett> 2100 - 9 p.m.
[13:33] <eein_> :-) i know just being dumb
[16:20] <Unit193> hypnocat: Hello, nice nick.
[16:20] <hypnocat> hi
[16:20] <hypnocat> thanks :)
[16:21] <hypnocat> i need a little help with ubuntu studio
[16:21] <hypnocat> i'd like to install a synth app called "din", for which ubuntu packages exist here:  https://launchpad.net/~dinisnoise/+archive/din/+packages
[16:21] <hypnocat> how would i do that?
[16:21] <holstein> hypnocat: i used the .deb
[16:21] <hypnocat> how do i use the deb?
[16:21] <hypnocat> i'm new to ubuntu
[16:22] <holstein> https://launchpad.net/~jagernot/+archive/din-is-noise
[16:22] <holstein> though, remember the information at the site being pretty easy
[16:22] <hypnocat> which of those debs do i download?
[16:22] <hypnocat> and how do i install them?
[16:22] <holstein> you can literally click them and run them, though i would read the site
[16:23] <hypnocat> ah
[16:23] <holstein> http://dinisnoise.org/download/
[16:23] <holstein> https://launchpad.net/~dinisnoise/+archive/din/+packages is where the site sends you
[16:24] <hypnocat> also, which ubuntu version does ubuntu-studio correspond to?  maverick?  lucid? karmic?
[16:24] <holstein> https://launchpad.net/~dinisnoise/+archive/din/+files/din_3.5~precise~ppa1_i386.deb for example, if you are on 23bit 12.04
[16:24] <holstein> hypnocat: depends on which version you have
[16:24] <holstein> 12.04 is precise...
[16:24] <holstein> lucis is 10.04...
[16:24] <hypnocat> i'm definitely using 12.04
[16:25] <hypnocat> i forget which version i burnt on this dvd, though.. 32 or 64
[16:25] <holstein> hypnocat: in a terminal, run "uname -a"
[16:25] <hypnocat> i'm on a 64 bit system, and "uname -a" reports:  Linux ubuntu-studio 3.2.0-23-lowlatency #31-Ubuntu SMP PREEMPT Wed Apr 11 02:24:03 UTC 2012 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
[16:25] <holstein> https://launchpad.net/~dinisnoise/+archive/din/+files/din_3.5~precise~ppa1_amd64.deb
[16:25] <hypnocat> thanks
[16:26] <holstein> din uses 3d acceleration, so when it wont start, you can start troubleshooting there
[16:26] <holstein> if it wont start*.. i should be more optimistic :)
[16:27] <hypnocat> heh
[16:28] <hypnocat> it started
[16:28] <holstein> cool! enjoy!
[16:28] <hypnocat> now i have to remember how to use it..
[16:29] <hypnocat> time to watch the tutorial videos again..
[16:29] <hypnocat> thanks for your help!
[16:29] <holstein> sure... anytime
[16:59] <vaev> few more questions about ubuntu studio pulse-jack solution so I understand it right (I'm doing research on the subject, so this is not strictly US support related)
[16:59] <vaev> firstly, are you using the mixed jackd/jackdbus approach or plain jackdbus?
[16:59] <vaev> (as per http://trac.jackaudio.org/wiki/JackDbusPackaging )
[17:02] <len-dt> jackdbus
[17:02] <len-dt> The bridging will not work without it.
[17:02] <vaev> secondly, have you attempted using jack server as a boot time launched daemon? or simply letting users manually start it / programs autolaunch it, resulting in dynamic autonegotiation between pulse and jack if jack is running? and when it's stopped pulse would reacquire the alsa devices
[17:03] <len-dt> However the user is able to choose not touse dbus.
[17:03] <vaev> len-dt: actually it will if you statically configure module-jack-sink in pulse to be the only option without alsa fallback (letting pulseaudio launch jackd or jackdbus if available)
[17:04] <vaev> okay
[17:04] <len-dt> Ok I did not know that.
[17:05] <len-dt> We only have so many people for testing... So we have not done the amount of testing you have even.
[17:06] <vaev> I can post my findings on the subject to your mailing list.. I'm attempting to compose a guide as generic as possible regarding this matter
[17:06] <len-dt> If we were doing an Audio only distro it would just be jack.
[17:06] <len-dt> We are trying to get the "normal" desktop experience to work as well.
[17:07] <vaev> I'm trying to find a decent solution with minimal user interaction with the daemons needed for complete desktop and proaudio usage
[17:07] <len-dt> I think things will change again as Firewire makes its way into ALSA.
[17:08] <len-dt> I also think there are new things coming in both pulse and jackd that will change things too.
[17:09] <len-dt> The one thing I have noticed is that turning off PA-jack bridging seems to be jsut as effective as turning off pulse.
[17:09] <len-dt> This is easy to do on the fly.
[17:10] <vaev> I'm trying to keep an eye on them both. going to post to jack-devel soonish if they could evaluate my findings and suggest where to start repairing certain issues that have arisen
[17:11] <vaev> just hoping I don't fire up a powder keg of alsa-pulse-jack politics :)
[17:11] <len-dt> However, If I was doing "pro" audio. I personally would have the audio processing computer(s) with just jackd and no external net access.
[17:12] <len-dt> I am not suggesting it has to be that way, just my feeling
[17:12] <vaev> yep. in those use cases that is sensible
[17:12] <len-dt> I would want my audio computer to be as close to a one use box as I could.
[17:13] <vaev> same here. I already have a perfectly working solution for my personal use case, I'm just trying to generalize it so others can benefit from it too
[17:13] <len-dt> There are a lot of other things I would remove as well... including swap and most services.
[17:13] <len-dt> The fun of developing a distro :-)
[17:14]  * len-dt is saying all this while watching youtube on his audio computer...
[17:16] <ailo> vaev: len-dt: I believe the jackd2 is mixed jackd and mixbus
[17:17] <ailo> You can either run jackd or jackdbus
[17:18] <len-dt> Yes, it can be run either way. But I am not sure pulse as we have it configured will bridge if jackd is run with out dbus.
[17:18] <ailo> pulse will only bridge to jackdbus, not jackd
[17:18] <ailo> But the jackd2 package is compiled with mixed jackd2 and jackdbus
[17:19] <ailo> So, both are available
[17:19] <vaev> ailo: pulse will bridge to jack in both cases, but not automatically if not jackdbus
[17:21] <len-dt> Ya there are 3 modules involved, one that watches dbus for jack and then loads the sink/source modules as needed.
[17:21] <vaev> in case of only jackd it will remain completely oblivious as to it existing but it can be defaulted to load jack modules only, in which case it will start jack server through jackd or jackdbus if available
[17:21] <vaev> if it is not running already
[17:22] <ailo> Another problem with jack is audio card selection
[17:23] <len-dt> ailo, in muticard cases so does pulse.
[17:24] <len-dt> s/muti.multi
[17:24] <ailo> There's no good gui control for making simple audio card selections
[17:24] <vaev> yep. that's another thing I'm going to look into if I choose to go with the static pulse config..to try to automate the usage of alsa_in and alsa_out (from jack package) to use additional cards
[17:25] <vaev> for desktop solutions it might also be enough to let jack reserve one card, and let pulseaudio sink to it..then let pulseaudio load the remaining cards through alsa directly
[17:25] <vaev> but that eliminates the possibility of routing those cards through jack
[17:26] <vaev> but that's something I have to discuss with jack-devel on how to approach best
[17:26] <len-dt> The more I look at multi-track or multi-card uses, the more I am starting to feel, user has to have some understanding of their own system. Even (especially) windows or osx are not immune to this problem
[17:27] <ailo> If jack is to be default, I'd like pulse not to auto-grab any cards. Just wait to connect to jack
[17:27] <vaev> ailo: that's what I've done
[17:28] <len-dt> vaev, Have you done any testing with pulse-jack bridging and how a second card pulse is connected to effects the card jack is connected to?
[17:28] <len-dt> I have had problems this way.
[17:30] <ailo> len-dt: Was pulse using both the jack sinks, or was something also using the other card simultaniously?
[17:30] <ailo> I mean, did you also have pulse sink to the other card
[17:30] <vaev> I did some preliminary tests closely related. jack will remain completely oblivious of any cards that pulse grabs directly. I tested with letting jack take the hw:0 in my system and let pulse handle hw:1 (ati hdmi) and hw:3 (usb headset) through alsa
[17:31] <len-dt> vaev, That is not true.
[17:31] <vaev> oh?
[17:31] <len-dt> They can both run, but the settings in jack will not be able to be any better than the card connected to pulse.
[17:31] <vaev> I base what I said on not encountering any problems letting pulse sink to jack and the hw:3 simultaneously
[17:32] <ailo> len-dt: You mean, when using the pulse bridge. This was not a case with the bridge, from what I read
[17:32] <len-dt> My internal card on my netbook can get latency to -p128 and it has an issue with the wireless.
[17:33] <len-dt> An external card that with pulse not seeing the internal card can get -p64 and no wireless issues has the same limits when pulse can see the internal card.
[17:34] <len-dt> That is if pulse has the internal card turned on, jack can now only go to -p128 on my external card
[17:35] <len-dt> going to pavucontrol and turning the internal cards profile to off, lets me use my external card to it's full potential.
[17:36] <len-dt> With bridging turned of this is not a problem.
[17:36] <vaev> oh now I see what you mean
[17:36] <len-dt> bridgin requires pa and jack to sync
[17:36] <vaev> yes, it could have a performance impact
[17:37] <vaev> something I haven't encountered or measured at this point
[17:37] <len-dt> My internal sound card happens to be pretty bad ;-)
[17:42] <len-dt> While my netbook is not a great audio platform, with 1G ram and yucky (slow) hardware, it can make a surprisingly good remote recording platform or even guitar effect with an external USB audio IF
[17:46] <len-dt> I suppose pa-jack briding _could_ use resampling to get around this problem... but pa-jack bridging already uses twice the cpu time as jackd does. I'm not sure it would be worth it.
[17:47] <len-dt> (twice the cpu at -p 128 on my machine, worse at -p 64)
[17:48] <vaev> I'll consider this in respect of the static sinking approach
[17:48] <vaev> thans for pointing it out :)
[17:49] <len-dt> No problem