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kubotu::runtime-bugs:: [1035883] drkonqi crashed with SIGABRT in qt_message_output() @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1035883 (by R3vo tester)14:47
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1035883 in kde-runtime (Ubuntu) "drkonqi crashed with SIGABRT in qt_message_output()" [Undecided,New]14:47
alleeshadeslayer:  digikam 2.8 is in debian experimental.  Care to sync?14:47
shadeslayerallee: I can't sync, but please file a request and attach build logs and a reason why the delta can be dropped14:48
shadeslayeruse requestsync14:48
alleeshadeslayer: ah, right digikam has a ubuntuX revision now.  I'll check the deibian ubuntu diff14:50
shadeslayercool :)14:51
kubotu::runtime-bugs:: [1035883] drkonqi crashed with SIGABRT in qt_message_output() @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1035883 (by R3vo tester)15:50
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1035883 in kde-runtime (Ubuntu) "drkonqi crashed with SIGABRT in qt_message_output()" [Medium,New]15:50
alleeshadeslayer: the digikam pkgs are now quite different in debian and ubuntu.  No easy way to merge.   16:45
shadeslayerwill have a look tomorrow :)16:45
shadeslayerthanks for notifying me about the new package ...16:46
alleeshadeslayer: cool! Please remove debian/xpm.d  and close bug 658047 . debian menu and associated xpm files is not really used and 99% of the apps have no .xpm files16:48
ubottuLaunchpad bug 658047 in digikam (Ubuntu) "Update digiKam icon to default Oxygen provided icon" [Undecided,Expired] https://launchpad.net/bugs/65804716:48
allee^^ takes about updating.xpm bin IMHO they  should be removed16:49
kubotuallee meant: "^^ takes about updating.xpm but IMHO they  should be removed"16:49
alleeshadeslayer: thx a lot!16:50
shadeslayerno problemo16:50
afiestas_installed quantal, upgraded, no longer booting19:32
afiestas_X message error saying that startkde failed19:32
Riddellafiestas_: are kdm and lightdm both installed?20:02
afiestas_Riddell: just reinstalled 12.04, need something usable for tomorrow (traveling)20:02
afiestas_butno, it wasn't20:02
afiestas_because I tried to restart kdm and /etc/ini.d/kdm didn't existed20:02
Riddell"Mackenzie Morgan (maco.m) renewed their own membership in the Kubuntu Members" yay maco still loves us20:03
shadeslayerafiestas_: depends on whether or not you have fglrx installed and have X from proposed as well20:54
afiestas_shadeslayer: ?20:54
afiestas_my laptop ahs only an intel gpu20:54
shadeslayerah ok20:54
shadeslayerthen ignore me :P20:54
afiestas_I thoguht we were doing the "always usable" thing like ubuntu, aren't we?20:54
afiestas_asking for upgrading when I return from my trip or not20:55
* shadeslayer is dealing with ABI incompatibility all the way down to the kernel20:55
shadeslayerafiestas_: ahhhh20:55
shadeslayerI know20:55
shadeslayerafiestas_: make sure kubuntu-desktop is installed20:55
shadeslayerand kde-workspace-bin20:55
afiestas_shadeslayer: did kubuntu-desktop I think, everything was ok20:56
afiestas_didn't checked if startkde existed though :/20:56
shadeslayerafiestas_: kde-workspace-bin then, those 2 get uninstalled on a upgrade20:56
afiestas_aha :s20:56
shadeslayeryeah, no idea why that happens20:57
shadeslayerafiestas_: did that work?20:59
afiestas_reinstalled kubuntu 12.0420:59
shadeslayer.... why?21:00
afiestas_tomorrow going to a trip, need an usable thing21:00
shadeslayeryeah well, you should have just installed kde-workspace-bin :P21:00
afiestas_yeah well upgrades shouldn-t break stuff21:00
shadeslayerI know21:00
afiestas_if you want people to test stuff during development xD21:00
shadeslayerRiddell: ^ needs investigation21:00
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
yofelhome sweet home :)21:01
shadeslayerhey hey21:01
* shadeslayer is watching 2421:01
* yofel is pretty much used to apt being creative about what it removes on upgrades21:01
afiestas_with all the packaging stuff you do and the complex it is  is ****** that this happenz (if we have the usable policy on)21:01
yofelcan we make kubuntu-desktop... like essential or so?21:01
shadeslayercan we do that somehow?21:02
yofelwell, it's not really required to be installed pre-se, just on release upgrades that aren't done with apt21:02
afiestas_yofel: used muon21:04
afiestas_also, (I know this is not suppoted but still)21:04
afiestas_4.9 upgrade unstalled muon I think21:04
yofelyou don't by chance have the apt history left somewhere?21:05
shadeslayerisn't that stored into /var/log/apt ?21:05
yofelit is21:05
shadeslayerthere we go?21:05
shadeslayerah, he said that he reinstalled21:06
afiestas_yofel: from the kdeworkspace-bin not installed or the 4.9 upgrade uninstalling muon?21:06
shadeslayeryofel: I have logs that show kubuntu-desktop being removed21:06
yofelafiestas_: what you have. Without at least the package list that was upgraded we'd have to guess what happened21:08
shadeslayerlook for something that removes kde-workspace-bin instead21:10
shadeslayerbecause if you remove kde-workspace-bin, kubuntu-desktop will be removed, not the other way around21:10
shadeslayeryofel: http://paste.kde.org/533204/21:11
shadeslayertoo many packages :(21:11
yofelshadeslayer: I once had kde-workspace-bin being removed by a broken dep in kde-workspace-data-extras, so please don't assume that apt behaviour is understandable21:11
shadeslayeroh my21:11
shadeslayerapt sure does weird things done21:12
yofeland yeah, kwin is fun :P21:12
yofelshadeslayer: are you sure that's not just archive skew from when kde-workspace ubuntu3 was uploaded?21:14
yofelas I see workspace binaries being upgraded but no -data21:15
Riddellshadeslayer: it does, on my things to investigate tomorrow list21:15
shadeslayeryofel: can't say ....21:15
afiestas_I'm quite sure youc an reproduce it in a vm easily21:16
afiestas_I installed latest alpha and selected "log in automatically" (it may affect) and clicked on I want third party sfotware and the other checkbox as well21:16
afiestas_then once log in into quantal, I upgraded using muon, restarted and boom21:17
yofelafiestas_: did muon at least tell you what it wanted to remove? I remember that aptitude and synaptic show a warning if they remove packages to satisfy dependencies21:20
* yofel should use muon more...21:20
shadeslayerI just find it too many clicks to upgrade :P21:23
afiestas_yofel: it said something kinda "Mark upgrades" clicked ok21:23
afiestas_then a popup with packages, clicked ok as well xD21:23
yofelok, that means the UI doesn't have enough RED in it ^^21:24
shadeslayerjtechidna: ^^ needs more RED21:24
afiestas_nope,that means that UI shouldn-t appear if it means destroy your computer21:24
afiestas_an upgarde should always be safe if we want ppl to test our alphas/betas21:25
afiestas_common ppl don't go outthere with one spare laptop to test distros...21:25
afiestas_and if they did the test they'd do would be minimal21:25
afiestas_install, open rekonq, close21:25
afiestas_instead of living with i21:25
yofelcan we then get an experimental archive where we can do actual *development* ? I don't particular want to use quantal-proposed for that21:26
yofeland archive skew can be caused by any mixed-arch-all-any package upload, blame launchpad's publisher21:26
afiestas_you know guys I'm super noob on packaging but I can help you with workflows we use on soft development21:27
afiestas_what chrome, ff, some KDE projects are using to keep "trunk/master always stable" can be applied here as well21:27
yofelsure, but then we still need a big red box in muon that one should be careful about upgrading the development release. Nobody here is perfect and sh** happens.21:30
yofelbeing careful on upgrades is usually the first thing you get told when you ask for help in #ubuntu+121:30
afiestas_yofel: ubuntu has been doing usable +1 for 2 releases (counting this one)(21:30
afiestas_dunno if that includes upgrades, or how they handle that 21:31
afiestas_imho if we have an GUI that can break shit, we should say "System can't be upgraded right now" and be done with it21:31
afiestas_if the user is advanced, he will go to the CLI and use apt21:31
shadeslayerafiestas_: that's why yofel proposed we should set kubuntu-desktop to Essential or sth21:31
afiestas_if the user is not, s/he will wait until that "you can't upgrade' is removed21:31
shadeslayerso that apt says, OMG You don't want to do that21:32
afiestas_yet most ppl will click on YES21:32
yofelwell, we probably shouldn't do that - or it would have to be done for all meta packages21:32
yofelafiestas_: the problem is: apt CANNOT tell packages that are supposed to be removed and packages that aren't supposed to be removed apart if some packages have to go as part of the upgrade process21:33
yofelso the first time you intentionally remove a package - you break muon21:33
yofelit's a rare case sure, but happens21:34
afiestas_well it is not that rate, happened to me many times before21:34
afiestas_that's why i always upgrade after installing a unstable cd because I know it is a delicate thing21:35
afiestas_I don't know what linmitations apt has, but we should overcome them21:35
afiestas_maybe we can modify muon so it only allows upgrades (when in development) when we increase an integer somewhere21:35
afiestas_each time we increase the integer means that all packages are uploaded to launchpad or something of the kind21:35
* afiestas_ speaks without knowing shit about packaing21:36
yofelnah, skew by full KDE releases can be prevented by uploading to -proposed21:36
yofelit's the single package upload that's tricky21:36
afiestas_why is tricky? :s21:37
afiestas_excuse me fort my :s or :? or questions but you have to understand that for an outsider it is really weird that we have this problems21:38
afiestas_when having launchpad, apt, complex packaging etc21:38
afiestas_if for something all that should serve is for making these thigns easy and straight forward, and we are always having troubles21:38
debfxwhat was the problem? kde-workspace was temporarily uninstallable?21:39
yofelafiestas_: well, here's what I *think* happened in shadeslayer's paste: someone uploaded a small fix in kde-workspace directly to quantal - amd64 was finished building before i386 so was published earlier, he tried to upgrade and apt messed up because the kde-workspace-data* is only built on i386 and was thus missing21:39
afiestas_yofel: so if I try to reproduce it now it won't happen?21:40
afiestas_I mean, I would love to use quantal, I always like to be int he edge and give feedback21:40
afiestas_if you tell me it shuouldn't, I can try again21:40
debfxin that case the solution is to always upload kde-workspace to -proposed21:40
yofeldebfx: well, we're talking about how to prevent that muon removes kde-workspace-bin or so on archive skew leaving you without a GUI21:40
shadeslayeryofel: but that shouldn't happen since afiestas_ upgraded only recently21:40
shadeslayermaybe he's using a out of sync mirror21:41
yofelwell, he didn't post logs, so god knows what happened, but it's probably something along those lines21:41
shadeslayerafiestas_: try on a vm and post logs from /var/log/apt/21:41
* afiestas_ is astonished21:42
afiestas_if I get a repo out of syncs taht can crash my system?21:42
shadeslayerafiestas_: it can cause critical packages to be removed21:42
afiestas_shadeslayer: nah going to install it on my laptop and see what happens21:42
shadeslayeruh ok :P21:42
debfxthese problems will go away eventually when all uploads end up in proposed and are automatically moved to release when the packages are installable21:42
shadeslayertl;dr multiarch 21:42
afiestas_I'm liking apt less by minutes21:42
shadeslayerand the fact that arch independent packages might get published later on ....21:43
yofelshadeslayer: what debfx said resolves that21:43
afiestas_can't we stop using launchpad? it seems to create more problem that it solves21:43
afiestas_at least for building I mean21:43
shadeslayerafiestas_: you crack me up21:43
afiestas_what control do we have about all this?21:43
afiestas_can muon do some safetyu check? 21:43
shadeslayerafiestas_: upload to -proposed21:43
shadeslayernow that we're in universe, I'm a bit scared of other MOTU's21:44
shadeslayerthat was the only downside of going into universe21:44
shadeslayers/downside/fear I had/21:44
kubotushadeslayer meant: "that was the only fear I had of going into universe"21:44
debfxso far that hasn't been an issue21:45
shadeslayerwell .. yes21:45
shadeslayerbut who knows what might happen :)21:45
yofelwe already had core-devs changing stuff in our packages too and it wasn't an issue, so I doubt much will happen21:45
afiestas_now the live cd boots into a lightdm21:48
afiestas_with white background21:48
afiestas_I don-t see the user, only asks me password21:49
shadeslayerafiestas_: it's ubuntu21:49
afiestas_it worked before :s21:49
afiestas_well, thios is way unstable, will test next release21:49
shadeslayerI've heard issues about this happening, afaik happens in Ubuntu as well21:50
shadeslayerNever experienced it myself21:50
afiestas_is there any ppa with latest telepathy?22:17
shadeslayerafiestas_: latest stable telepathy for?22:18
afiestas_kde telepathy,12.0422:18
shadeslayerafiestas_: https://launchpad.net/~telepathy-kde/+archive/ppa22:19
shadeslayerI'm going to move that to Kubuntu Backports tomorrow22:19
Darkwingis anyone else having issues logging into 12.10?23:03
Darkwinglightdm wont log in23:03

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