| ailo | I got my toe dipped in jack programming today. Created a jack transport start|stop cli app. Just a couple of lines in python | 00:39 |
|---|---|---|
| smartboyhw | Hi! | 07:54 |
| astraljava | len-dt: Good news, thanks! | 10:15 |
| smartboyhw | astraljava: What good news? | 10:16 |
| smartboyhw | On the news of len-dt, another news: 64-bit testing completed by me now | 12:53 |
| astraljava | Thanks. I'm still not sure whether there'll be new images, so please keep your eyes on the tracker, if you have time still before the release. | 12:56 |
| astraljava | Huge thanks for all testers! | 12:56 |
| astraljava | I don't expect any big issues, as our unique parts haven't changed much, this refresh is mostly foundations-related. But have you noticed any peculiarities, len-dt or smartboyhw? I'm not talking bug-worthy (as I expect those having been filed), but anything out of the ordinary? | 12:58 |
| smartboyhw | astraljava: NO! | 12:59 |
| smartboyhw | BTW, thanks scott-work and astraljava and everybody for making such a nice OS | 12:59 |
| smartboyhw | Now I'm waiting for ailo to finish the 64-bit lowlatency kernel to test...:) | 13:00 |
| astraljava | ailo isn't making the kernel (yet), but writing testcases for it. I need to bug the kernel team tomorrow so that we'd get an updated -lowlatency for 12.04.1, though. | 13:06 |
| smartboyhw | ailo jst got len-dt a kernel to test for 32-bit, mate | 13:07 |
| astraljava | Which would, of course, require new tests for the image, if it happens. I'll keep this channel posted, though. | 13:07 |
| smartboyhw | astraljava: I mean this | 13:10 |
| smartboyhw | http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/precise/daily-live/20120817.3/precise-desktop-amd64.iso | 13:11 |
| smartboyhw | Oh, sorry, not thed link | 13:11 |
| smartboyhw | [14:28] <ailo> len-dt: Kernels are built https://gitorious.org/ubuntustudio-testing/pages/Kernel | 13:11 |
| smartboyhw | On 17th August, that is | 13:11 |
| astraljava | smartboyhw: Right. Well, we aren't hosting our official kernels on gitorious, that's just unofficial testing. If you look into the kernel version on quantal, you'll notice that we're still in the 3.5.0 tree. | 13:14 |
| smartboyhw | Oh, that's why | 13:15 |
| === shnatsel is now known as SergeLion | ||
| stochastic | That's it I'm goin' camping. :) | 14:13 |
| knome | have fun stochastic | 14:15 |
| smartboyhw | stochastic: Bye and have some fun! | 14:16 |
| smartboyhw | ailo: Are you here? I want to know the progress of the amd64 kernel:) | 14:48 |
| ailo | smartboyhw: I told you before, I'll let you know when the tests are finished. Me and Len have been working on the ground work for them. That is why I have only been notifying Len so far | 15:21 |
| smartboyhw | Oh, that's why..... | 15:21 |
| smartboyhw | Thanks | 15:21 |
| smartboyhw | ailo: Been wondering about Bug 1021264 | 15:33 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1021264 in Ubuntu Studio "forward bugs to Ubuntu Studio Bugs Team" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1021264 | 15:33 |
| smartboyhw | You have already succeeded in doing so, why don't you change the Importance to "Fix Released"? | 15:33 |
| ailo | smartboyhw: Not fixed | 15:34 |
| smartboyhw | ailo: Why? | 15:34 |
| ailo | I need to do some research on that. But it's not a priority at the moment. We have the bug team, and a new mail list for bugs. The forwarding was a bit difficult to set up. | 15:35 |
| smartboyhw | Oh, that's why, the forwarding | 15:36 |
| smartboyhw | BTW, on Bug 152853 | 15:36 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 152853 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] image2dv" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/152853 | 15:36 |
| smartboyhw | I packaged it today, but I'll need a MOTU to do so, but actually has it been fixed? | 15:36 |
| smartboyhw | I mean I'll need a MOTU to actually merge the branches | 15:40 |
| ailo | smartboyhw: If you have packaged it, the best way is to get it into Debian | 15:40 |
| smartboyhw | ailo: I need to wait for a MOTU to approve the packaging | 15:40 |
| ailo | subscribe to the Debian Mentors list, and tell them you want to upload a package | 15:40 |
| smartboyhw | Debian Mentors List? What's that? | 15:41 |
| ailo | smartboyhw: It's better you go through Debian. | 15:41 |
| ailo | That way, it will end up in all Debian based distros, including Ubuntu | 15:41 |
| smartboyhw | OK | 15:41 |
| ailo | Only upload to Ubuntu, if for some reason, it is Ubuntu specific | 15:41 |
| ailo | Like, ubuntustudio-controls | 15:42 |
| smartboyhw | oh | 15:42 |
| ailo | smartboyhw: The Debian Mentor mail list is a place where Debian uploaders and developers help new participants | 15:42 |
| ailo | You just say you want to upload a package, and you are seeking a sponsor | 15:43 |
| smartboyhw | OK | 15:43 |
| smartboyhw | Ok, subscribing now | 15:45 |
| len-dt | astraljava, The only differences I have noticed have been good. For example I have not seen any scrollbars on our install slideshow for a while now. | 16:23 |
| len-dt | ailo, to continue on the comment I left in the other channel. | 16:41 |
| len-dt | ailo, in your controls app, it may be a good idea to have a way for checking user is in audio group and adding iff needed | 16:43 |
| ailo | len-dt: That is the main feature I'm adding. realtime privilege administration | 17:59 |
| len-dt | Good | 17:59 |
| ailo | len-dt: And, my comment was more about the task installs for ubuntu studio | 18:00 |
| ailo | That even if you install the ubuntu studio desktop task, you might not get those settings correct | 18:00 |
| ailo | If I remember correctly, this is still the case | 18:00 |
| len-dt | Ya, there are a number of people who start with vanilla or kubuntu and use our metas. | 18:00 |
| ailo | I've noticed over the years.. | 18:01 |
| len-dt | permissions is the biggest issue with doing that right now | 18:01 |
| ailo | One of the metas could have a post install script to handle that, and ask the user if to be included into the group | 18:02 |
| ailo | Just like the jackd install | 18:02 |
| len-dt | Yes like -settings or maybe a new -audio-settings | 18:03 |
| len-dt | or maybe the audio meta | 18:03 |
| ailo | I'd vote settings | 18:03 |
| len-dt | Though that would be harder because the audio meta is based solely on seeds right now. | 18:04 |
| ailo | I think settings should have everything that includes any kind of system configuration | 18:04 |
| len-dt | ailo, I am wondering if someone installing mettas over vanilla would want our -default-settings | 18:04 |
| len-dt | They are xfce dependant | 18:05 |
| ailo | I could imagine someone only wanting realtime privilege, and one or two apps | 18:05 |
| ailo | I would assume that all happens in settings. On the other hand, I'd assume installing jackd would be enough to get started :( | 18:06 |
| ailo | And if realtime privilege is done in settings, should audio depend on it? | 18:06 |
| ailo | Or should be we break settings into workflows? | 18:06 |
| ailo | As you said before | 18:06 |
| ailo | Then ubuntustudio-audio would depend on ubuntustudio-audio-settings | 18:07 |
| len-dt | Maybe the audio meta should be separated from seeds and have its own package so we could include audio settings or maybe an audio-setting package that the audio meta includes | 18:07 |
| micahg | no, it makes most sense as a seed, I see no issue with something like ubuntustudio-audio-settings being built out of the -default package for a case like this | 18:08 |
| len-dt | micahg, I think we both just came to that conclusion :) | 18:09 |
| len-dt | Anything else is too much work to maintain | 18:10 |
| micahg | right | 18:10 |
| len-dt | micahg, if we add setting the user to audio group in a settings package then we could remove the preseed line that does that, right? | 18:11 |
| micahg | not sure about that | 18:15 |
| len-dt | I guess my question should really be would it hurt to add the user to the audio group twice. | 18:16 |
| ailo | len-dt: Nope. But the install script could be made smart. | 18:18 |
| len-dt | ailo, the preseed would have to be smart too. | 18:19 |
| ailo | len-dt: I think we need to separate those, unless you can add ubiquity choices as well. Same as for jackd | 18:19 |
| len-dt | Ya | 18:20 |
| len-dt | if we set group in settings it would be best to remove the preseed. | 18:21 |
| ailo | Only if we can make choices during ubuntustudio install | 18:22 |
| len-dt | It could be a choice like jack does and preseed the choice like we do with jack | 18:22 |
| ailo | Aha, like so | 18:22 |
| ailo | Right | 18:22 |
| len-dt | The if we ever get a ubiquity module the coices could be made there. | 18:22 |
| len-dt | *Then | 18:23 |
| ailo | len-dt: Did you have a loot at the kernels I built? There's not that many versions, and not a great deal of difference between them | 18:25 |
| ailo | There's the one with the ticking timer | 18:25 |
| len-dt | TBH no I haven't. I have been busy with other things so far. | 18:26 |
| len-dt | I will have other family related things to do this next few weeks too. | 18:26 |
| ailo | len-dt: Well, the ticking timer might be interesting as far as midi goes | 18:26 |
| len-dt | For midi I still need to find a situation that causes problems... | 18:27 |
| ailo | len-dt: I think the ticking timer might make things worse | 18:27 |
| len-dt | So far all of my tests have shown no changes with any setting. | 18:28 |
| ailo | I'm getting more busy now as well. Starting tomorrow | 18:29 |
| ailo | Things have a tendency to just drag on forever. I keep putting too much time on the wrong details | 18:30 |
| len-dt | I think we should but swappiness and hrt/rtc in audio group in defualt settings at least for this cycle. The rest we have yet to prove they do anything (good) | 18:32 |
| ailo | len-dt: My tests are meant to do that, however, have you found any proof of hrt/rtc making any improvement yet? | 18:40 |
| len-dt | None, but I have not played with rosegarden at all. It is just that as we have added them to the kernel we should finish the job. | 18:41 |
| len-dt | We can't test everything. | 18:42 |
| ailo | Shouldn't be any different on Rosegarden. Still alsa midi | 18:42 |
| ailo | The purpose of the tests I'm making is to gather data from several machines, to see the actual impact of tweaks | 18:43 |
| len-dt | I don't know, it is just that these recommendations have come from the rosegarden forums, so I would think that is where they solved problems. | 18:44 |
| ailo | alsa midi is a bit difficult to automate though, but we should still probably use the same test for it | 18:44 |
| len-dt | midish might make it easier. | 18:45 |
| len-dt | It can set up connections and filtering as well as playback/record midi streams | 18:45 |
| len-dt | All CLI driven. | 18:45 |
| ailo | I'm creating a standard use case using at least a DAW. Perhaps, qjackctl + hydrogen | 18:46 |
| len-dt | Anyway, I should go... | 18:46 |
| ailo | Controlling transport from the script | 18:47 |
| ailo | len-dt: See you | 18:47 |
| ailo | That should have been qtractor + hydrogen.. | 18:49 |
| ailo | len-dt: Just recorded some audio from hexter to qtractor, using qtractor to send midi to hexter. It's not in sync. | 19:31 |
| ailo | I'm on Debian now. Need to check my settings too | 19:32 |
| ailo | len-dt: Actually, I found that monitoring qtractor controlled Hexter, and Hydrogen, both started with jack transport are not in sync at all | 20:28 |
| ailo | But, after recording hydrogen to qtractor, the recording itself was a bit better synced | 20:28 |
| ailo | Still, not nearly perfect | 20:29 |
| ailo | The midi seems to be a few notches ahead of audio | 20:30 |
| len-dt | ailo, it should be | 20:30 |
| ailo | It's just strange that what I hear is not what is | 20:30 |
| len-dt | What setting are you using for -p on jack? | 20:30 |
| ailo | The latency is pretty large right now | 20:31 |
| ailo | The audio from hydrogen is taking less time to arrive to my speakers, than to qtractor | 20:32 |
| ailo | Also, the recorded material in qtractor is a few notches too early | 20:33 |
| ailo | I'm missing maybe 10-20 ms at the beginning | 20:33 |
| len-dt | midi or audio? | 20:34 |
| ailo | audio | 20:34 |
| ailo | Also, not in sync | 20:34 |
| ailo | The beats are a bit off | 20:34 |
| ailo | I'm not really doing any testing now | 20:35 |
| ailo | Was just going to record some audio to use for the test | 20:35 |
| ailo | len-dt: Hang on. I'm making a screen shot | 20:36 |
| ailo | len-dt: http://imagepaste.nullnetwork.net/viewimage.php?id=4721 | 20:38 |
| ailo | len-dt: The bottow two channels have the same exact drum loop, but those are two separate bars of it | 20:38 |
| ailo | I just copied and pasted one under the other | 20:39 |
| ailo | You can clearly see they are out of sync, not only with qtractor, but with themselves | 20:40 |
| ailo | I'm using the hpet and rtc improvements | 20:40 |
| ailo | -p 1024, I think | 20:40 |
| len-dt | I did not test midi to audio timing. My question is this a qtractor problem? | 20:45 |
| ailo | One could try using different settings too. qtractor has settable midi timer | 20:45 |
| len-dt | We probably need to have signal flow diagram for both midi and audio. | 20:45 |
| ailo | Could be the situation changes dramatically if not using jack transport. There's a lot of variables | 20:47 |
| ailo | Coming to think of it, these are exactly the type of things we should get right, and document. | 20:50 |
| ailo | But, I do think jack midi would make things easier here | 20:52 |
| ailo | len-dt: Measuring midi agains midi doesn't show you if the midi clock has jitters | 21:18 |
| ailo | Since everything is following the same clock | 21:18 |
| ailo | Previously, when I explained the sync problem and how it was apparent to me, was when recording audio | 21:19 |
| ailo | I haven't ever tried recording midi | 21:19 |
| ailo | jack midi is solid in this sense | 21:19 |
| ailo | I used ardour3 to control my external synth and recorded from it | 21:20 |
| ailo | I think with all the problems that comes with alsa midi, it would just make things easier if we just replaced everything with jack midi | 21:21 |
| ailo | not "we", literally, of course | 21:21 |
| ailo | heh, funny. I set qjackctl to use "seq" midi driver, and I get a ticking sound from my speakers | 21:23 |
| ailo | Hmm, it's from PA | 21:24 |
| ailo | Seems like my internal card has disappeared too. Something with this MB | 21:24 |
| ailo | well.. | 21:25 |
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