[00:39] I got my toe dipped in jack programming today. Created a jack transport start|stop cli app. Just a couple of lines in python [07:54] Hi! [10:15] len-dt: Good news, thanks! [10:16] astraljava: What good news? [12:53] On the news of len-dt, another news: 64-bit testing completed by me now [12:56] Thanks. I'm still not sure whether there'll be new images, so please keep your eyes on the tracker, if you have time still before the release. [12:56] Huge thanks for all testers! [12:58] I don't expect any big issues, as our unique parts haven't changed much, this refresh is mostly foundations-related. But have you noticed any peculiarities, len-dt or smartboyhw? I'm not talking bug-worthy (as I expect those having been filed), but anything out of the ordinary? [12:59] astraljava: NO! [12:59] BTW, thanks scott-work and astraljava and everybody for making such a nice OS [13:00] Now I'm waiting for ailo to finish the 64-bit lowlatency kernel to test...:) [13:06] ailo isn't making the kernel (yet), but writing testcases for it. I need to bug the kernel team tomorrow so that we'd get an updated -lowlatency for 12.04.1, though. [13:07] ailo jst got len-dt a kernel to test for 32-bit, mate [13:07] Which would, of course, require new tests for the image, if it happens. I'll keep this channel posted, though. [13:10] astraljava: I mean this [13:11] http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/precise/daily-live/20120817.3/precise-desktop-amd64.iso [13:11] Oh, sorry, not thed link [13:11] [14:28] len-dt: Kernels are built https://gitorious.org/ubuntustudio-testing/pages/Kernel [13:11] On 17th August, that is [13:14] smartboyhw: Right. Well, we aren't hosting our official kernels on gitorious, that's just unofficial testing. If you look into the kernel version on quantal, you'll notice that we're still in the 3.5.0 tree. [13:15] Oh, that's why === shnatsel is now known as SergeLion [14:13] That's it I'm goin' camping. :) [14:15] have fun stochastic [14:16] stochastic: Bye and have some fun! [14:48] ailo: Are you here? I want to know the progress of the amd64 kernel:) [15:21] smartboyhw: I told you before, I'll let you know when the tests are finished. Me and Len have been working on the ground work for them. That is why I have only been notifying Len so far [15:21] Oh, that's why..... [15:21] Thanks [15:33] ailo: Been wondering about Bug 1021264 [15:33] Launchpad bug 1021264 in Ubuntu Studio "forward bugs to Ubuntu Studio Bugs Team" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1021264 [15:33] You have already succeeded in doing so, why don't you change the Importance to "Fix Released"? [15:34] smartboyhw: Not fixed [15:34] ailo: Why? [15:35] I need to do some research on that. But it's not a priority at the moment. We have the bug team, and a new mail list for bugs. The forwarding was a bit difficult to set up. [15:36] Oh, that's why, the forwarding [15:36] BTW, on Bug 152853 [15:36] Launchpad bug 152853 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] image2dv" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/152853 [15:36] I packaged it today, but I'll need a MOTU to do so, but actually has it been fixed? [15:40] I mean I'll need a MOTU to actually merge the branches [15:40] smartboyhw: If you have packaged it, the best way is to get it into Debian [15:40] ailo: I need to wait for a MOTU to approve the packaging [15:40] subscribe to the Debian Mentors list, and tell them you want to upload a package [15:41] Debian Mentors List? What's that? [15:41] smartboyhw: It's better you go through Debian. [15:41] That way, it will end up in all Debian based distros, including Ubuntu [15:41] OK [15:41] Only upload to Ubuntu, if for some reason, it is Ubuntu specific [15:42] Like, ubuntustudio-controls [15:42] oh [15:42] smartboyhw: The Debian Mentor mail list is a place where Debian uploaders and developers help new participants [15:43] You just say you want to upload a package, and you are seeking a sponsor [15:43] OK [15:45] Ok, subscribing now [16:23] astraljava, The only differences I have noticed have been good. For example I have not seen any scrollbars on our install slideshow for a while now. [16:41] ailo, to continue on the comment I left in the other channel. [16:43] ailo, in your controls app, it may be a good idea to have a way for checking user is in audio group and adding iff needed [17:59] len-dt: That is the main feature I'm adding. realtime privilege administration [17:59] Good [18:00] len-dt: And, my comment was more about the task installs for ubuntu studio [18:00] That even if you install the ubuntu studio desktop task, you might not get those settings correct [18:00] If I remember correctly, this is still the case [18:00] Ya, there are a number of people who start with vanilla or kubuntu and use our metas. [18:01] I've noticed over the years.. [18:01] permissions is the biggest issue with doing that right now [18:02] One of the metas could have a post install script to handle that, and ask the user if to be included into the group [18:02] Just like the jackd install [18:03] Yes like -settings or maybe a new -audio-settings [18:03] or maybe the audio meta [18:03] I'd vote settings [18:04] Though that would be harder because the audio meta is based solely on seeds right now. [18:04] I think settings should have everything that includes any kind of system configuration [18:04] ailo, I am wondering if someone installing mettas over vanilla would want our -default-settings [18:05] They are xfce dependant [18:05] I could imagine someone only wanting realtime privilege, and one or two apps [18:06] I would assume that all happens in settings. On the other hand, I'd assume installing jackd would be enough to get started :( [18:06] And if realtime privilege is done in settings, should audio depend on it? [18:06] Or should be we break settings into workflows? [18:06] As you said before [18:07] Then ubuntustudio-audio would depend on ubuntustudio-audio-settings [18:07] Maybe the audio meta should be separated from seeds and have its own package so we could include audio settings or maybe an audio-setting package that the audio meta includes [18:08] no, it makes most sense as a seed, I see no issue with something like ubuntustudio-audio-settings being built out of the -default package for a case like this [18:09] micahg, I think we both just came to that conclusion :) [18:10] Anything else is too much work to maintain [18:10] right [18:11] micahg, if we add setting the user to audio group in a settings package then we could remove the preseed line that does that, right? [18:15] not sure about that [18:16] I guess my question should really be would it hurt to add the user to the audio group twice. [18:18] len-dt: Nope. But the install script could be made smart. [18:19] ailo, the preseed would have to be smart too. [18:19] len-dt: I think we need to separate those, unless you can add ubiquity choices as well. Same as for jackd [18:20] Ya [18:21] if we set group in settings it would be best to remove the preseed. [18:22] Only if we can make choices during ubuntustudio install [18:22] It could be a choice like jack does and preseed the choice like we do with jack [18:22] Aha, like so [18:22] Right [18:22] The if we ever get a ubiquity module the coices could be made there. [18:23] *Then [18:25] len-dt: Did you have a loot at the kernels I built? There's not that many versions, and not a great deal of difference between them [18:25] There's the one with the ticking timer [18:26] TBH no I haven't. I have been busy with other things so far. [18:26] I will have other family related things to do this next few weeks too. [18:26] len-dt: Well, the ticking timer might be interesting as far as midi goes [18:27] For midi I still need to find a situation that causes problems... [18:27] len-dt: I think the ticking timer might make things worse [18:28] So far all of my tests have shown no changes with any setting. [18:29] I'm getting more busy now as well. Starting tomorrow [18:30] Things have a tendency to just drag on forever. I keep putting too much time on the wrong details [18:32] I think we should but swappiness and hrt/rtc in audio group in defualt settings at least for this cycle. The rest we have yet to prove they do anything (good) [18:40] len-dt: My tests are meant to do that, however, have you found any proof of hrt/rtc making any improvement yet? [18:41] None, but I have not played with rosegarden at all. It is just that as we have added them to the kernel we should finish the job. [18:42] We can't test everything. [18:42] Shouldn't be any different on Rosegarden. Still alsa midi [18:43] The purpose of the tests I'm making is to gather data from several machines, to see the actual impact of tweaks [18:44] I don't know, it is just that these recommendations have come from the rosegarden forums, so I would think that is where they solved problems. [18:44] alsa midi is a bit difficult to automate though, but we should still probably use the same test for it [18:45] midish might make it easier. [18:45] It can set up connections and filtering as well as playback/record midi streams [18:45] All CLI driven. [18:46] I'm creating a standard use case using at least a DAW. Perhaps, qjackctl + hydrogen [18:46] Anyway, I should go... [18:47] Controlling transport from the script [18:47] len-dt: See you [18:49] That should have been qtractor + hydrogen.. [19:31] len-dt: Just recorded some audio from hexter to qtractor, using qtractor to send midi to hexter. It's not in sync. [19:32] I'm on Debian now. Need to check my settings too [20:28] len-dt: Actually, I found that monitoring qtractor controlled Hexter, and Hydrogen, both started with jack transport are not in sync at all [20:28] But, after recording hydrogen to qtractor, the recording itself was a bit better synced [20:29] Still, not nearly perfect [20:30] The midi seems to be a few notches ahead of audio [20:30] ailo, it should be [20:30] It's just strange that what I hear is not what is [20:30] What setting are you using for -p on jack? [20:31] The latency is pretty large right now [20:32] The audio from hydrogen is taking less time to arrive to my speakers, than to qtractor [20:33] Also, the recorded material in qtractor is a few notches too early [20:33] I'm missing maybe 10-20 ms at the beginning [20:34] midi or audio? [20:34] audio [20:34] Also, not in sync [20:34] The beats are a bit off [20:35] I'm not really doing any testing now [20:35] Was just going to record some audio to use for the test [20:36] len-dt: Hang on. I'm making a screen shot [20:38] len-dt: http://imagepaste.nullnetwork.net/viewimage.php?id=4721 [20:38] len-dt: The bottow two channels have the same exact drum loop, but those are two separate bars of it [20:39] I just copied and pasted one under the other [20:40] You can clearly see they are out of sync, not only with qtractor, but with themselves [20:40] I'm using the hpet and rtc improvements [20:40] -p 1024, I think [20:45] I did not test midi to audio timing. My question is this a qtractor problem? [20:45] One could try using different settings too. qtractor has settable midi timer [20:45] We probably need to have signal flow diagram for both midi and audio. [20:47] Could be the situation changes dramatically if not using jack transport. There's a lot of variables [20:50] Coming to think of it, these are exactly the type of things we should get right, and document. [20:52] But, I do think jack midi would make things easier here [21:18] len-dt: Measuring midi agains midi doesn't show you if the midi clock has jitters [21:18] Since everything is following the same clock [21:19] Previously, when I explained the sync problem and how it was apparent to me, was when recording audio [21:19] I haven't ever tried recording midi [21:19] jack midi is solid in this sense [21:20] I used ardour3 to control my external synth and recorded from it [21:21] I think with all the problems that comes with alsa midi, it would just make things easier if we just replaced everything with jack midi [21:21] not "we", literally, of course [21:23] heh, funny. I set qjackctl to use "seq" midi driver, and I get a ticking sound from my speakers [21:24] Hmm, it's from PA [21:24] Seems like my internal card has disappeared too. Something with this MB [21:25] well..