/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/08/30/#xubuntu-devel.txt

pleia2knome: once we finish edits, I think I'll close down account creation, you and everyone who has worked on it will still be able to log in, but not new people00:09
pleia2getting like 6 spam accounts created per hour, it's meh and moin doesn't have good controls for this00:09
pleia2(their response is "It's a wiki!")00:09
knomeyeah00:09
knomecan you moderate account creation?00:10
pleia2not without code changes00:10
pleia2http://moinmo.in/FeatureRequests/DisableUserCreation outlines how to do it00:10
knomefss00:10
knomei mean moderation as in somebody needs to click a button00:11
knome:P00:11
pleia2I was hoping for that, alas...00:11
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knomeooh! our doc wiki is down!09:57
knomemr_pouit, what's your schedule today?10:20
mr_pouitknome: not available, it's a good schedule :P10:32
mr_pouitI can upload any last minute change before UIF10:32
knomemr_pouit, what about the doc looks stuff?10:34
knomemr_pouit, do you think it's possible to review that quickly and push?10:34
knomemr_pouit, it's not perfect, but at least it's much better than what we've had before10:35
knomemr_pouit, if you know at what time you would get to that, i can try to make it better before10:36
mr_pouitI can't upload before 19 my local time anyway10:37
mr_pouit17 UTC I guess10:37
knomeok10:37
knomei'll try to get fixes in by that then10:37
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knomemr_pouit, bug #104395717:18
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1043957 in xubuntu-docs (Ubuntu) "Update documentation looks" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104395717:18
knomebbl, about 19UTC17:23
mr_pouitokay17:24
bluesabreknome, I tried.  It's at least a little better organized.  http://dagobah.princessleia.com/Xubuntu/12.10/Troubleshooting17:33
mr_pouitochosi: abiword patch is in17:50
bluesabre:'-) <-- Tears of happiness17:51
bluesabreuh oh, lightdm is in this apt-get update17:54
bluesabre(Don't break anything) :)17:54
knomemicahg, what's the status with the indicators?19:03
micahgknome: removed for beta 119:13
knomemicahg, when are you expecting to get to reupload the gtk2 versions?19:14
knomeis beta 2 realistic?19:14
micahgknome: mr_pouit is handling that, you're CCd on the E-Mail thread, so you should know as much as me at this point :)19:14
micahgyeah, should be19:14
knomeok, good enough for me. thanks! :)19:15
bluesabre:(19:15
bluesabreI miss the indicators already19:15
knomebluesabre, don't be sad... :)19:15
knomebluesabre, btw, the messaging indicator is probably not going to make it in Q19:15
bluesabreknome: And you say don't be sad?19:16
knomebluesabre, unless you wish to work on it...19:16
bluesabreD:19:16
bluesabreThat's tempting19:16
knomewell, i can't help it, so i'll try not to be sad. that's just how it is19:16
bluesabreBecause I really like the messaging menu19:16
knome:)19:16
knomeask micahg and mr_pouit for details!19:16
bluesabreSo, what's the deadline for that?19:16
knomeor probably just mr_pouit :D19:17
knomebluesabre, deadline? feature freeze...19:17
knomebluesabre, but it'd be good to get them to beta 2 with FFe's19:17
bluesabreok19:17
bluesabremr_pouit: Do we have indicator-messages in a branch somewhere?19:17
knomeanybody in the team who has got something new uploaded after alpha 3, please update http://xubuntu.org/wp-admin/post.php?post=1413&action=edit19:25
knomexubuntu-team members should be able to login with ubuntu sso at http://xubuntu.org/wp-admin/19:26
knomeif you have problems, be in touch with me19:26
* knome will now release the edit lock19:26
bluesabreholy crap, you can integrate wordpress with ubuntu sso!19:28
knomeyes, that's a canonical-provided feature19:28
knomei heard you can integrate apache with ubuntu sso...19:29
bluesabreI don't suppose app updates should be included?  (catfish/parole)19:31
knomewell, if they are completely different than in a3, then include them19:32
bluesabreCool19:32
knomewe can always drop them from the final notes, if we have too much of them, but i don't think we will :)19:32
knomebluesabre, http://temp.knome.fi/xubuntu/quantal_blueprints/doclooks-update.png (updated a min ago, so take a look if you saw that url before)19:36
bluesabreWoohoo, we've made it to the future!19:37
knomeyeah19:37
bluesabreLooks really good19:38
knomenow we only need to update the content...19:38
knomethanks :)19:38
* knome worked about 2h with it today19:38
bluesabreImpressive19:38
bluesabreMaybe we should call you knome-shell?19:38
knomehah :P19:38
* holstein would totally run knome-shell!19:39
knomeha19:40
bluesabreHow much work is it to take the wiki-formatted docs and convert back to our offline docs?19:40
knomei don't know docbook, but i believe it takes a few days19:40
knomeshould look at the syntax quickly someday19:41
knomewe have about three weeks to update the doc strings, so now that the doc look is updated, we have again some breathing space with it19:41
bluesabreCool19:41
knomeafter that, there's two weeks time to translate the docs19:42
bluesabreI tried to work on the Network Troubleshooting section, but only managed to clean it up a little bit and reorganize19:42
knomeit's a good start19:42
knomeifconfig? isn't nm able to give connection info too19:43
knomeright-click -> connection info19:43
bluesabreAh19:46
bluesabreSo it seems19:46
bluesabreThat's a lot more user-friendly!19:46
* bluesabre will return to editing19:47
ochosibluesabre: it seems we'd also have to update our icon-theme for the messaging-menu... http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/08/ubuntu-add-new-message-indicator-icons20:36
bluesabreI saw that20:37
ochosibtw, the icons look horrible imo20:37
bluesabreI agree20:37
bluesabreWe can do better20:37
bluesabre:D20:37
ochosiexactly :)20:37
ochosiat least if someone gets it to work20:38
bluesabreIf we have a branch somewhere, I can have a look at it20:38
ochosii don't think we do yet20:38
ochosii'm wondering how mr_pouit works on code, maybe he just pulls it locally and then pushes it when he's done with it20:39
ochosifeel free to create at least a private branch in lp20:39
bluesabreI'm not even sure where to start.  Is it indicator-messages-gtk2 I'm assuming?20:40
mr_pouitre (quickly)20:40
ochosii guess you'd have to look at the changes in the gtk3-version first20:41
ochosioh, there is the man!20:41
mr_pouitbluesabre: you need to take lp:indicator-messages from bzr, the latest branch20:41
mr_pouitthey changed the protocol, it's now libmessaging-menu, which uses some gtk3-only functions20:41
bluesabreSo do we need to fork that too or something?20:42
mr_pouityou can try to port it to gtk2 ;>20:42
bluesabreI might play with that a bit then20:43
ochosimr_pouit: so both would have to be ported to gtk2, indicator-messages and the lib?20:44
mr_pouitknome: I'll try to take care of indicator-application and indicator-sound this week-end20:44
mr_pouitochosi: it's in the same source20:44
ochosioh ok20:44
mr_pouitlubuntu only uses indicator-application by default, so basically they don't care with the rest20:44
ochosihm, i see20:45
ochosiso no support from gilir then...20:45
mr_pouitochosi: I usually push branches as soon as possible, unless I did some horrible and unclean and dirty and horrible again hacks ;>20:46
ochosihehe, ok :)20:46
ochosidarn, seems i should fix another bug in albatross-gtk2 :/20:47
bluesabreI'm starting to consider buying that ultra-widescreen laptop20:47
ochosibluesabre: which one?20:47
mr_pouit(I put my hacks at https://lionel.lefolgoc.net/misc/indicators-gtk2/ until i've cleaned that in a branch :P)20:47
bluesabreI forgot who makes it20:47
bluesabreBut it has a 21:10 ratio I believe20:47
ochosimr_pouit: uu, untrusted connection! should i trust it?? (:20:47
mr_pouitremove the 's' :P20:48
pnarcisohello all20:48
ochosioh right, 's' as in untruSted20:48
ochosiciao pnarciso 20:48
pnarcisoitaliano :)20:49
ochosiyou seem to be quite quick from my last bugreport comment in lp to here :)20:49
pnarcisowell, I'm digging testing xubuntu20:49
ochosi:)20:50
pnarcisogreat work 20:50
ochosinice20:50
ochosithanks, user-interface freeze kept us busy the last few days20:50
ochosibut since that deadline has passed we can go back to ignoring bugs and bugreports ;)20:50
pnarcisocan you upload that background for the panel20:51
pnarcisoI would like to test it20:51
ochosiyou mean the one from the screenshot?20:51
pnarcisoYes, and more if you have20:51
ochosii contacted the author a few times, but he never responded and it was entirely unclear under what license he had published it20:51
ochosi(somewhere on deviantart i think)20:51
ochosibut someone suggested a new one20:51
ochosii can put it up somewhere for you to test20:52
pnarcisook20:52
ochosifor private use i can also send you the other one20:52
pnarcisooffcourse20:52
ochosibut we won't be able to use that in xubuntu i guess20:52
pnarcisoIt was a good idea to disable compositor by deafult, it causes more issues than advantages20:53
ochosipnarciso: http://imagebin.org/22648920:53
ochosimr_pouit: did we really disable the compositor by default?20:53
bluesabrepersonal branch: https://code.launchpad.net/~smd-seandavis/indicator-messages/indicator-messages-gtk220:53
bluesabreI'll hack on it tonight (possibly) and tomorrow20:53
ochosisounds great!20:54
mr_pouithttp://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/quantal/xubuntu-default-settings/quantal/view/head:/etc/xdg/xdg-xubuntu/xfce4/xfconf/xfce-perchannel-xml/xfwm4.xml#L920:54
mr_pouitochosi: nope, it's still enabled20:54
ochosithat's what i thought20:54
mr_pouit(unless something changed in xfwm4)20:54
ochosipnarciso: ^20:55
Sysifor some reason indicator-messages fix reminds me about guy who thought about making irc bot with Qt20:55
mr_pouitbut the bottom dock-like panel would look ugly with compositing anyway20:55
pnarcisoI'm talking about the decision in one of your meetings20:55
pnarcisoat least for the live cd20:55
ochosipnarciso: afair there was only a discussion, then astraljava should've investigated switching off the compositor just for the live-session20:55
ochosibut since that never went down (i guess because RL got in the way) it's still enabled everywhere20:56
ochosimr_pouit: not if it had a background-image or something20:56
mr_pouityeah20:56
ochosibut yeah, as long as xfwm4's borders are broken, i'm happy we have some shadow behind windows...20:56
mr_pouithehe20:57
mr_pouitbbl, maybe20:57
ochosiok, ttyl20:57
pnarcisoI've just put that background image and it looks gooood20:58
ochosiscreenshot?20:58
pnarcisohttp://imagebin.org/22649221:01
ochosiyeah, doesn't look bad21:02
ochosithere's a bug though with it21:02
ochosinot sure why21:02
ochosilook at the trash-icon21:02
ochosithe lines break before and after21:02
bluesabremr_pouit: Just to make sure I'm in the right direction, does (gtk_widget_insert_action_group) ring a bell?21:02
ochosi(i guess because it's not a launcher but a plugin)21:02
ochosibluesabre: he left at 22:5721:03
ochosi(oops, that's in my TZ)21:03
bluesabreI see that now21:03
ochosi:)21:03
bluesabreBut I think that's right21:03
ochosimaybe it's worth talking to indicator-devs21:03
ochosinot sure they'll be helpful21:03
bluesabreI'm curious to see how far I get21:03
bluesabre:D21:03
ochosibut we could try to make them feel bad :p21:03
ochosihehe, ok21:04
pnarcisoanother fix that landed today was for abiword, rullers aren't black anymore21:07
ochosiyes i read21:08
ochosii just fired up my vbox just to test that21:08
ochosibut i guess i have to change repos to the main server21:09
ochosifix hasnt landed on my mirror yet21:09
pnarcisothe problem right now is the flashing when scrolling the pages with mouse wheel or scroll bars21:11
ochosipnarciso: btw, do you have a hardware install or are you using virtualisation to test quantal?21:11
ochosimeh, i can confirm the flickering with vbox :(21:12
pnarcisoI have both21:12
ochosialso: i'm not sure i like the grey background of the rulers21:12
ochosii'd have preferred if they had used the base-color, not the bg-color21:12
pnarcisowell, that's a thing that must be changed in the theme I guess21:13
ochosinot sure it can be changed21:13
ochosiabiword uses a very very custom widget for the rulers21:14
ochosiwow, this time ubuntu's community wallpapers are better than ever before21:15
bluesabreYeah, WAYYYYY better than 12.04's wps21:18
bluesabrebtw, the indicator-devs are jerks... using functions that are introduced in gtk 3.621:18
bluesabreIt will make this a funnnnnnn project21:19
ochosiyeah, well in short they don't care about us21:19
bluesabreI think I'm just going to try to drop the new "essential" stuff into the code for gtk221:20
bluesabreand wrestle with it21:20
ochosihmm21:22
ochosiwhat do the new functions do?21:23
bluesabreThey use things that weren't available in gtk221:24
bluesabreLike using a menu model21:24
GridCubethats like using new stuff to do new stuff, how they dare!21:25
bluesabrenot exactly21:25
bluesabrethe menu model existed in gtk221:25
bluesabrebut it appears like you couldn't actually use it for a menu21:25
bluesabreor at least, I haven't figured it out yet21:25
pnarcisocan we expect new changes regarding how menu is displayed? Is this what you are working on?21:28
ochosipnarciso: what do you mean with "how menu is displayed"? what menu?21:28
knomebluesabre, thanks for picking it up :)21:28
ochosiahoi mighty XPL21:28
bluesabreknome, no promises21:28
knomehey ochosi 21:28
bluesabreI'm going to try21:29
bluesabrereally hard21:29
knomebluesabre, at least you're trying... and seriously man, you have three weeks21:29
bluesabrebut can't guarantee anything21:29
knome;)21:29
bluesabrelol21:29
pnarcisothe subject that bluesabre is talking21:29
ochosipnarciso: we lost the indicators from the panel in 12.10 for now21:29
ochosipnarciso: bluesabre and mr_pouit are working to get them back21:29
bluesabreMy goal is to get them back in at least their previous form21:29
ochosiyeah, that would be enough imo21:30
ochosifor 13.04 we need an entirely new plan21:30
ochosi(prolly involving a gtk3 panel)21:30
bluesabreDoes the panel depend on a lot of xf-stuff, or is it largely gtk2 only?21:30
ochosinot sure21:31
ochosii think the main problem are all the plugins and goodies...21:31
pnarcisoOk, I get it, that why I can't see the mail indicator or gmusic browser21:32
ochosiexactly21:32
pnarcisois this because xfce still haven't migrated to gtk3?21:33
ochosiyes21:34
ochosibasically21:34
pnarcisohave you tried to contact xfce devs for a workaround21:34
ochosiindicators have nothing to do with xfce, they're done by ubuntu21:35
bluesabreheading out, bbl21:35
ochosiwe can only hope that the panel will get ported in time for 13.0421:35
bluesabreseeya guys21:35
knomewhatsoever, yes, we are in constant communication with the xfce devs21:35
ochosibluesabre: k, seeya later21:35
knomesee you bluesabre 21:35
pnarcisowith xfce now the default DE in debian, let's hope more ppl join xfce team, it's a great DE but it's lagging behind21:38
ochosiwell, it has been a very small team pretty much always21:38
knomeubuntu looks like keeping alternate at least for beta 1, so probably we should too.21:39
pnarcisoin the past week alternate install was the only way to install daily build21:42
knomei installed with desktop21:42
pnarcisodon't know if those problem were fixed by now21:42
knomeit wasn't today, maybe 2 days ago21:43
pnarcisoxorg 1.13 really messed up21:44
knomeonly by one pixel, so not a lot..21:44
knome;)21:44
knomere: alternate, looks like ubuntu is dropping it anyway. stgraber just wants to fix ltsp on alternate before they drop it ;)21:46
pnarcisoand firefox crashed with xorg 1.1321:46
knomefirefox crashes even without xorg :)21:46
pnarcisoabout multimedia support for ubuntu, do you have any improvements in mind for parole, or even thinking changing to another video player?21:47
ochosipnarciso: bluesabre and me improved parole quite a bit21:49
ochosipnarciso: have you tried it in 12.10?21:50
pnarcisoI have tried parole and I think it's very weak21:50
pnarcisobluesabre haven't tried yet21:50
pnarcisoI usually use smplayer, for me the best21:50
pnarcisoforgeat about the bluesabre part, I read wrong :)21:53
ochosi:)21:53
pnarcisoparole lacks option to choose what renderer to use21:53
ochosirenderer?21:53
pnarcisogl, vdapu, vv21:53
pnarcisoxv21:53
ochosinot a very basic feature tbh21:54
pnarcisowithout this options i'm stuck with video tearing21:54
ochosidepends, i dunno what gstreamer uses by default21:54
pnarcisoI think is XV21:55
pnarcisodunno21:55
ochosinot sure, we're using a newer version of playbin now21:55
ochosi(i mean since parole 0.3.0)21:55
pnarciso0.3.0.321:55
pnarcisois the latest version in repo21:55
ochosiyeah, it's our latest release21:56
pnarcisousing mplayer would be a better option21:57
pnarcisomore versatile and it support a lot of video renderers21:58
pnarcisoI have nvidia and I can use vdpau21:58
ochosimhm21:59
ochosii'm off for tonight, talk to you soon21:59
pnarcisosee ya22:00
amerigenaso, does the Network Troubleshooting section of the wiki need edits or not?23:16
pleia2amerigena: what name are you using on the wiki?23:17
pleia2looks like a JackFromm is actively editing that page23:17
knomepleia2, bluesabre was on it too :)23:17
knomebut generally, if you think you can improve it..23:18
knomepleia2, would you like to go through some sections and see if they'd be ready to publish?23:18
knomepleia2, if yes, make the "checked out" sections with bold23:18
pleia2knome: can't right now :(23:18
pleia2still working, then have an appointment, then more work, then packing!23:18
knomepleia2, http://temp.knome.fi/xubuntu/quantal_blueprints/doclooks-update.png23:19
knomepleia2, you didn't see that yet!23:19
pleia2pretty :)23:19
knomepleia2, yeah, and you know what? it's uploaded23:19
pleia2:D23:19
knomeso more breathing space before docstringfreeze.. .)23:20
knome+ another eye23:20
knomebut yeah, ok if you can't23:22
knomei'll see if i have time for some tomorrow23:22
pnarcisohey guys23:44
amerigenaRichDennis23:45
pleia2amerigena: ok, JackFromm's last edit was 5 minutes ago so it looks like he's actively editing that page and it doesn't need attention at this very moment23:45
amerigenathat's the name I'm using on the wiki23:45
amerigenaOK. Are there any pages that do need editing?23:46
amerigenaOr is it all done?23:46
pleia2knome: ^^23:46
pleia2(I don't know :))23:46
knomeuh23:48
knomethere's something to do yeah23:48
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pnarcisothe panel indicators are behaving weird, I just lost my x-chat panel indicator :)23:53
pnarcisohave xubuntu 12.10 entered feature freeze by now ?23:54
pleia2yeah, everything did today23:55
pleia2you can still submit bugs though, fixes can get in :)23:55
pnarcisoI would like to make a sugestion regarding a keyboard shorcut to enable/disable compositor on the fly23:56
pleia2ah, that sort of thing would be better as a suggestion for the next cycle23:56
Book_em_Dano does anyone need help w/ DocBook editing for the overhaul of the Xubuntu offline documentation?23:56
pnarcisoahh ok23:56
pnarcisoI come up with a really nice script to do that23:57
pleia2Book_em_Dano: we absolutely do! but I think we're not quite ready yet (still have folks working on the rewrite)23:57
pnarcisoand it's very useful23:57
pleia2Book_em_Dano: so please stick around, we'll need you :)23:57
pnarcisoif someone need portuguese translations I can help23:57
pleia2pnarciso: great, so each cycle we create a planning document: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap23:58
pleia2when we're creating that, there are posts on the xubuntu-devel mailing list, so I'd suggest signing up for that if you haven't already23:58

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