/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/09/03/#ubuntu-desktop.txt

pittibryceh: moderated now04:23
pittiGood morning04:23
jbichapitti: good morning04:28
jbichaapport-gtk recommends update-notifier which depends on update-manager, but for the Ubuntu GNOME remix, we were going to try gnome-packagekit which has its own update-manager04:29
pittihey jbicha04:30
pittijbicha: ah, that's because it needs u-m for the automatic crash notification (u-n has the bits that poll /var/crash/)04:30
pittijbicha: I did not originally have this recommends:, but people were complaining about installnig "apport-gtk" and then not getting popups04:31
pittijbicha: but I'm happy to add an alternative dependency04:31
pittiwithout u-n, apport-gtk crash reporting will essentially not work, though04:31
jbichathat might be useful ;)04:32
jbichadoes update-notifier need update-manager?04:33
pittinot for the apport bits04:33
pittieventually these should all really become systemd/upstart user jobs, but we have neither yet04:33
jbichacould we drop that depends and count on ubuntu-desktop to pull in update-manager?04:33
micahgit's already seeded where it needs to be AFAICT except for ubuntu studio04:37
* micahg can fix Ubuntu Studio now if this will be changed04:39
micahghrm, actually, it doesn't have it ATM04:42
pittijbicha: I think we can drop it if u-n behaves sanely when u-m is not installed04:45
MCR1smspillaz: Hi :) https://code.launchpad.net/~mc-return/compiz/compiz.merge-minor-fixes/+merge/122398 should be ready now...07:11
chrisccoulsongood morning everyone07:44
chrisccoulsongood morning everyone07:48
=== tkamppeter_ is now known as tkamppeter
pittihey chris|08:00
Laneyhey08:02
chrisccoulsonhmmm, working on 3g today!08:08
seb128hey desktopers08:32
dupondjeHi seb128  :)08:32
dupondjeGetting HDMI output on my laptop seems to be harder then excepted :(08:35
dupondjeBinary nvidia blob can't even read my laptop supported resolutions08:37
dupondjenouveau HDMI output works when manually editting xorg.conf08:37
chrisccoulsonhey seb128, how are you?08:37
dupondjebut xrandr is broken :(08:37
seb128hey dupondje chrisccoulson08:37
pittibonjour seb128! as-tu un bon we?08:37
seb128chrisccoulson, I'm good, how are you?08:37
seb128pitti, j'ai eu un bon w.e merci ! et toi ?08:37
pittihey chrisccoulson; still trouble with your connection?08:37
chrisccoulsonseb128, yeah, not too bad thanks. hopefully have working internet again later ;)08:37
pittiseb128: oh, "eu"08:38
chrisccoulsonthere's a BT guy around now replacing my line. it seems that the people who replaced our roof earlier in the year mangled our cable :(08:38
pittiseb128: moi aussie; rather quiet, though, I'm still not over my cold08:38
seb128pitti, taking some time to get over this one :-(08:38
pittiseb128: I started with the Questions lesson; really confusing!08:39
seb128pitti, "j'ai eu" is avoir used in passé composé forme (past tense)08:39
pittiI'm still astounded how French manages to end up in a letter salad like Qu'est-ce que c'est? :)08:39
seb128hehe08:40
LaneyDonaudampfschiffahrtsgesellschaftskapitän!08:42
=== tjaalton_ is now known as tjaalton
seb128Laney, guten tag! ;-)08:44
Laneyhallo :-)08:44
larsuLaney, you're missing an 'f' there :P08:45
LaneyI copied and pasted it, blame the internet :P08:45
larsu(at least according to the "new" spelling rules)08:45
jibelseb128, don't teach incorrect french to pitti "J'ai passé un bon WE" not "J'ai eu un bon WE"08:45
dupondjelol08:45
* pitti watches the French guys fight it out and grabs the snacks08:46
seb128lol08:46
seb128jibel, en effet08:47
jibelseb128, lol :)08:47
xclaesseswitching user from gnome-shell makes everything freeze when session is started from gdm :(08:48
seb128ogra_, hey08:56
seb128ogra_, thanks for fixing the unity-gles issues ... how come it worked only with compiz for you the other day?08:56
ogra_seb128, well, apparently i tested against a unity that had GLES support :/ compiz had actually no issues at all ... everything else did09:55
seb128ogra_, where did you find that unity?!09:55
seb128ogra_, well anyway thanks for getting those fixed09:56
seekerhi, I'm trying to figure out the best way to keep up with chromium updates. the chromium team ppa seems to be no longer updated09:56
ogra_seb128, all unitys since the first upload to precise-proposed have had working GLES suport09:56
ogra_*support09:57
seb128seeker, get chrome directly from google?09:57
seb128ogra_, hum ok09:57
ogra_this one was the first where the packaging changed it seems09:57
ogra_(gles2_architectures := foo)09:57
seb128ogra_, I would be very surprised if that was the case09:58
ogra_seb128, also it didnt really help that it is a native package ;)09:58
seb128is it? it's not supposed to me09:58
seb128be09:58
ogra_it wasnt until the last upload09:58
seb128crap09:58
seekerseb128: I'd like to stick to chromium09:58
seb128https://launchpad.net/unity/+download has the orig tarball09:59
seb128well, orig, upstream09:59
ogra_well, i'll leave that to lukas to fix :)09:59
seb128ogra_, I guess another 1am upload error, probably missnamed the tarball09:59
ogra_ah, i thought you only took over what he packaged09:59
seb128yeah, well I sponsored it, I should have noticed that10:00
ogra_well, shit happens :)10:00
ogra_another issue is that the clean target doesnt properly clean up everything, there are bits left in autopilot and some translation bits tend to lie around10:01
Laneyif it were made 3.0 (quilt) you couldn't have that kind of error10:01
ogra_i dont even think the upload has a source/ subdir10:02
Laneyno, it defaults to 1.010:02
seb128Laney, and you could bzr merge cherry pick fixes10:02
* ogra_ remembers seeing complaints during builld10:02
seb128couldn't10:02
Laneywhy not?10:02
seb128because it would complain about inline diff10:02
Laneyyou can have a 'single-debian-patch' or whatever it is10:02
seb128and tell you to review /tmp/diff10:02
Laneywhich is basically like the old .diff.gz10:03
seb128that's a huge usability step back10:03
seb128when you bzr merge -c rev, bzr does the tracking for you10:03
seb128and will do the right thing next time you merge-upstream10:03
seb128like see that this revision was already in and handle it without conflict or having to do any work10:03
seb128if you move the revision to a patch you loose all that10:04
LaneyI wonder if it works if you exclude the generated patch from vcs10:04
Laneylike can it be auto generated10:04
Laneynever mind, /me gets back to reviewing those updates10:04
seb128ogra_, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/108693811/unity_5.12-0ubuntu3_5.12-0ubuntu4.diff.gz10:07
seb128ogra_, see, the gles = foo was done in that upload in may10:08
seb128ogra_, so weird it was working before the recent uploads ... anyway, sorted out10:08
ogra_right10:08
chrisccoulsonnice, there's a second fault on my line. it's a surprise that it worked at all10:10
mptJohnLea, bug 102567410:36
ubot2`Launchpad bug 1025674 in update-manager "List of updates is much too short by default" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102567410:36
chrisccoulson_aha, lets hope this connection is a bit more reliable now :)10:44
seb128chrisccoulson_, what did you change?10:48
seb128ogra_, https://launchpad.net/~unity-team/+archive/staging/+packages does have arm* enabled10:49
seb128ogra_, re your comment in that bug10:49
ogra_why wasnt the issue catched then ?10:49
chrisccoulson_seb128, the cable from my house has been replaced. it was damaged by the people who replaced our roof (they'd cut almost all the way through the cable)10:49
seb128ogra_, "the issue" being runtime? I guess because nobody actually tried the binary10:50
=== chrisccoulson_ is now known as chrisccoulson
ogra_seb128, the issue being FTBFS :)10:50
seb128ogra_, that and try prepared the release in a /release ppa which didn't have armel enabled10:50
seb128arm*10:50
ogra_(and the issue being testing too indeed)10:50
seb128chrisccoulson, oh, ok10:50
seb128ogra_, it's mostly "too much rush to get the thing landed at all, didn't have time to do a proper job of it"10:51
seb128ogra_, but yeah, I will try to make sure it doesn't happen again10:51
ogra_seb128, right, i wuld just like to prevent such issues in the future somehow, several people lost their weekend (or parts of it) to it10:51
ogra_and i think its not your responsibility but upstreams to make sure they tested it10:52
seb128ogra_, sorry about that, I will pay a round of beers at UDS to you guys10:52
seb128ogra_, yeah, we made "the best of the situation" I think, which still sucked but for a while I though we wouldn't land anything at all before beta110:52
ogra_(yours is probably testing the packaging, but there were massive upstream issues with hardcoded GL linking etc that should have been catched before even giving you the package)10:52
seb128agree10:53
ogra_it would never have built with that setup10:53
seb128late landing of compiz GLES made it hard to test the other bits10:53
ogra_yeah, agreed10:53
ogra_also i should have insisted to get nux and unity binaries to test, but i wasnt even aware that armhf GLES was disabled since may10:55
seb128ogra_, you were, Didier discussed it with you by then :p10:56
seb128ogra_, but I guess you forgot or didn't notice that was still the case10:56
ogra_seb128, then i blame age :P10:56
sil2100Ah yes, arm testing10:56
seb128;-)10:56
ogra_i wonder if we could work something out with QA for doing some upstream daily testing10:56
seb128ogra_, well, since you had unity running with the new compiz I assumed that unity was ok, which was not the case10:56
sil2100I think we were supposed to have that last week? But I don't remember that happening :(10:56
seb128sil2100, I think that skipped, too much going on, another issue of being that late...10:57
ogra_we should probably have a checklist for unity releases on arm that has to be worked down by the different teams before an upload can happen or so ... not sure that makes sense10:58
seb128ogra_, it does10:59
seb128ogra_, at the bare minimum there should be a "somebody testing it on the pandaboard" check10:59
ogra_well, there should also be an ftbfs check from upstream :)10:59
seb128well, they have a daily build ppa which has arm enabled11:00
seb128the thing is that "red" was a normal state until we had GLES landing11:00
ogra_but they didnt enable arm in the packages ;)11:00
seb128now green should be the normal state :p11:00
seb128yeah, we are over that now11:00
ogra_someone needs to make sure thats the case before they give you the bits and pieces11:00
seb128so I expect things to keep working from now on11:00
* ogra_ hopes so11:01
seb128and to be regularly tested11:01
ogra_yeah, sadly QA doesnt have proper ways to do desktop testing yet ...11:01
seb128ogra_, I'm waiting for your google session for my pandaboard :p I'm pondering dist-upgrading it from precise or rather doing a new install11:01
* ogra_ hopes pitti will fix that though 11:01
Laneytry the current quantal images11:02
Laneythey should have the current bits11:02
ogra_not yet11:02
ogra_try the next ones, i dotn think unity made it11:02
seb128Laney, is that just a dd the iso on an sdcard and boot it?11:02
Laneyshould be11:02
* Laney checks the manifest11:03
ogra_yeah, its in the manifest11:03
ogra_so go for it11:03
ogra_seb128, right11:03
Laneygreat, I expected it to be there11:03
ogra_and have a USB disk ready as target device11:03
ogra_(or USB key)11:03
seb128ogra_, I've a 8GB waiting for that ;-)11:08
ogra_great !11:08
* seb128 starts download and go for lunch11:08
pittidéjeunér! c'est une grande idée! J'ai aussie..11:10
smartboyhwpitti: Please use Englihs11:10
* Laney giggles11:10
pittismartboyhw: ici, la language officielle est français! (ask seb128, he'll confirm :) )11:11
chrisccoulsonWhat's "Englihs"?11:11
smartboyhw... What? I don't speak French...11:11
chrisccoulsonit's pretty easy to figure that out, even for someone like me who doesn't speak french :)11:12
LaneyЯ предпочитаю русский11:13
chrisccoulsoni had to open google translate to work out that Laney prefers Russian ;)11:14
LaneyI had to open google translate to prefer Russian :P11:14
chrisccoulsonlol11:14
ogra_should have been "moi aussie .." though11:15
ogra_<- german nitpicker11:16
chrisccoulsoni thought that pitti would have made klingon the official language in here11:16
ogra_muhahaha11:16
pittiogra_: d'accord, pardon; mon français est trés mauvais..11:17
ogra_lol, mine is worse, thats the only bit i know :)11:18
pittismartboyhw: (in case it wasn't clear, we are kidding of course)11:18
smartboyhw...11:18
* ogra_ thought he could show off with that one bit ;)11:18
pittiogra_: well, until three weeks ago, mine was basically nonexistant :)11:18
* pitti lunches for real, bbl11:18
ogra_pitti, i dont think the klingon part was actual kidding ;)11:18
xnoxLaney: it even was grammatically correct Russian preference.11:20
Laneyxnox: Отлично!11:22
LaneyI read those letters as if they were their closest English counterparts11:23
Laneyotnnyho!11:23
xnoxLaney: translit.ru11:24
xnoxLaney: Otlichno11:24
Laneyoh, that's cool11:24
mitya57О, клуб любителей русского11:25
smartboyhwRussian now?11:29
Laney:-)11:30
ogra_seb128, i guess you need to wait with your panda install for bug 1044717 to be fixed first11:33
ubot2`Launchpad bug 1044717 in ubiquity "ubi-partman crash during Quantal daily install on Panda board" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104471711:33
smartboyhwDuplicate isn't it??11:34
smartboyhwBug 104429911:34
ubot2`Launchpad bug 1044299 in ubiquity "ubi-partman crashed, and then no installation process, no installation options" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104429911:34
Laneyno11:34
Laneydifferent but in the same component11:34
smartboyhwHmm11:34
seb128ogra_, hum, ok11:50
ogra_i just tested a fix, we might do a respin for it11:51
Laneywill11:51
ogra_k11:51
Laneycan't have that kind of bug in a release :-)11:51
ogra_oh, yeah, i was referring to "today" :)11:52
ogra_that we respin before thu was clear :)11:52
Laneyoh, hope so11:52
seb128ogra_, is that the sort of "can patch the .py on the sdcard if I want to install"?11:52
Laneythere's a few things lined up for it already11:52
ogra_seb128, yup11:52
ogra_sudo wget -O /usr/lib/ubiquity/plugins/ubi-partman.py http://people.canonical.com/~xnox/ubi-partman.py11:53
seb128ogra_, danke11:53
ogra_:)11:53
xnoxLaney: so above fix works. Committed.... new upload.... again?11:54
Laneyyes11:54
Laneyget Colin to review or something11:54
xnoxLaney: renamed widget.... with old code left using old name....11:54
xnoxand it's not shown on i386/amd64 VMs by default....11:55
Laneywould static analysis get that?11:55
Laneystupid dynamic languages11:55
xnoxLaney: yes and yes.11:55
xnoxLaney: is there static analysis for python?!11:55
LaneyI know of lint-style ones like pylint and pychecker11:56
Laneynot sure if they get this kind of thing11:56
Laneytry it11:56
Laneyhttps://bitbucket.org/jwilk/lintian4python :O11:57
xnoxLaney: hmm we are already running pep8 & pyflakes. Didn't use lintian4python yet.11:58
xnoxpylint looks interesting.11:59
LaneyAFAIK it tends to be more style checks though11:59
* Laney lunches12:00
mitya57lintian4python uses pyflakes for non-packaging checks12:10
OrangerHum sorry but I can't acess to "http://pad.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-desktop", is it normal ?12:25
seb128Oranger, works here, I don't know, seems like a I.S sort of issue if it doesn't work for you12:27
Orangerseb128: "Either you have not been granted access to this resource"12:27
Orangerthat's bad... :p12:27
seb128yeah, not sure what the acl are and who is handling that...12:27
Orangerseb128: Ok, because in the title of the chan I read " If you want to help out, check out http://pad.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-desktop" so that's why I report that ;)12:28
seb128Oranger, thanks for pointing it, I'm asking the #is guys12:29
seb128I assumed that it would be publicly availabler12:29
Orangerok, thank you seb128 :) Please inform me of news about it :)12:29
seb128Oranger, will do12:30
seb128Oranger, what sort of things are looking at doing?12:30
Orangerseb128: Just try to learn and read docs before help for the ubuntu-desktop prokect12:30
Oranger*project12:30
seb128Oranger, you can have a look to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam as well12:32
Orangerseb128: Ok thanks you :)12:32
Orangerseb128: And where can I see things where you need help ?12:33
smartboyhwseb128: I do want to ask: I look at the page given to Oranger, and why is the part for testing that small?:(12:34
seb128Oranger, we track outdated packaged on http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/gnome.html which is part of what we do12:35
seb128Oranger, otherwise bugs that we try to fix: http://status.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ubuntu-desktop/precise.html12:35
seb128Oranger, or bug triage...12:36
seb128smartboyhw, because nobody wrote in there, it's a wiki, feels free to improve12:36
smartboyhwAh ah ah12:37
seb128smartboyhw, is that really funny?!12:37
smartboyhwNo12:37
smartboyhwI just ah.12:37
Orangerseb128: It seem that you have a lot of work..12:37
seb128Oranger, we indeed do12:37
smartboyhwseb128: So a question: How do I work on testing? Bit weird, I've been doing this for 2 months in the ISO QA Tracker...12:40
seb128jibel, ^ can you help smartboyhw?12:40
smartboyhwNo thanks seb128....:)12:40
seb128smartboyhw, do you need help or not?12:40
seb128smartboyhw, testing is done by the qa team not so much by the desktop team12:41
smartboyhwNo, just wondering why it has such less content12:41
seb128smartboyhw, because as I told you, too much to do, not enough people, nobody took time to write content there12:41
smartboyhwAh12:41
seb128smartboyhw, but if you want to help feel free to step up and do write something12:41
smartboyhwOK, I will write sth12:42
seb128thanks12:42
Orangerseb128: On the package list I can see "newer version available in Debian", it's mean that the package get a superior version on the debian repo than on the ubuntu repo ?12:42
seb128Oranger, yes12:42
Orangerseb128: So what do you do usually to fix it ?12:42
seb128Oranger, we update to the current debian version, see http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/ for a more complete documentation on how to do that12:44
Orangerseb128: Ok, but you update package that are in experimental version too ?12:53
seb128Oranger, we do sometimes, that list is an indication of things we might want to update, everything shouldn't be updated13:24
Laneymore things will be in experimental currently because Debian is in a freeze13:25
seb128Oranger, btw the #is guys say the pad is restricted to ubuntumembers, that's probably why you don't have access13:25
Laneyso, something being there isn't necessarily an indication that it's risky per se13:25
jbichaOranger: I believe all you need is to join this group: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-etherpad13:29
jbichagood morning folks13:30
Laneyhey13:30
smartboyhwGood morning jbicha13:32
jbichaseb128: what's https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-gnome for?13:47
xnoxseb128: legacy.13:47
seb128xnox, what is legacy?13:47
xnoxjbicha: that's a legacy team.13:47
xnoxseb128: wrong nick.13:47
seb128jbicha, what xnox says13:47
seb128jbicha, it was the "people working on GNOME in Ubuntu" first13:48
seb128but that got superseded by desktop team13:48
jbichaso I created a ubuntu-gnome-dev group which has commit access to our bzr branches and I need to create a separate group for the rest of our contributors or users13:49
xnoxjbicha: ubuntu-gnome-friends?13:52
smartboyhwjbicha: As I said I am willing to help13:53
jbichaseb128: will you let me have your old group or do I need to make another?13:53
seb128jbicha, you can have it13:53
smartboyhwwhere's that old group???13:53
seb128jbicha, I set you as admin for it13:54
seb128jbicha, is that good enough?13:54
smartboyhwseb128 and jbicha: Where's the old group?:)13:54
seb128smartboyhw, read the scrollback of this channel, the url was with the question I replied to13:55
smartboyhwAh OK13:55
seb128jbicha, oh, found the "change owner" stuff, it's all yours13:55
jbichaseb128: thanks, that should be all I need13:55
smartboyhwJoined:)13:55
smartboyhwjbicha: OK, so what can I help with now?:)13:57
chrisccoulsonaccording to bug 1045226, whoever developed apport is "lacking in software development skills and not worthy of the reporters time"15:14
ubot2`Launchpad bug 1045226 in ubuntu "Thunderbird URLs don't open in configured browser" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104522615:14
chrisccoulsonnice person15:14
chrisccoulsonpitti ^^ ;)15:14
seb128chrisccoulson, yeah, that somewhat describe pitti :p15:15
chrisccoulsonlol15:15
seb128chrisccoulson, why do you think he moved to QA? ;-)15:15
chrisccoulsonheh15:15
seb128chrisccoulson, oh, and apparently you should show some intelligence as well :p15:16
pittiso that I cause fewer bugs, of course!15:16
* seb128 wonders if that guy should be pointed to the CoC15:16
seb128oh, chrisccoulson did that15:16
chrisccoulsonseb128, i pointed him to that in my comment :)15:16
seb128;-)15:16
pittiwow, what an angry comment15:17
chrisccoulsonhe couldn't be bothered to read even the first paragraph of the wiki i asked him to read, which explains quite clearly why i ask reporters to use apport :/15:17
=== Chipaca` is now known as Chipaca
ogra_pitti, geez, you shoudl hire him !15:34
ogra_if his skills are so much better than yours ...15:35
micahgjbicha: please set up a mailing list for https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-gnome-dev, and then add ubuntu-core-dev to members so that core devs can commit as well15:51
ogra_chrisccoulson, do you know if firefox has any GLES support we could enable ?16:21
chrisccoulsonogra_, yes16:21
chrisccoulsonand yes16:21
ogra_it performs really poor with under the 3D desktop on panda16:21
chrisccoulsonit's enabled on android IIRC16:22
chrisccoulsonogra_, want me to look at enabling it?16:22
ogra_right, what i fear though is that we break it on all non GLES arm installs16:22
ogra_(which is the majority)16:22
chrisccoulsonah16:22
ogra_but it would be good if we could test the difference16:23
ogra_i would say just enable it for one upload ... but i think that should have happened before FF16:24
Laneywhy not test it out of a PPA?16:24
ogra_yeah, thats the other opportunity16:25
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dednickfginther: ping22:39
fgintherdednick, pong22:39
dednickfginther: hey. just wanted to confirm something with you. re https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1043947 . Is it just the screen-shot that doesnt display, or the whole preview?22:40
ubot2`Ubuntu bug 1043947 in unity "Dash preview stuck on spinner on first time" [Medium,New]22:40
fgintherdednick, just the screen-shot22:41
dednickfginther: ok, thanks. thats what i thought.22:42
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