[00:03] ion: In an ideal world, yes. In the real world different renderers support different GL extensions (or GL versions), and exporting all GL extensions that can be implemented in software is user-hostile. [00:04] RAOF: ah, heh. Thanks for the explanation, I'd completely forgotten the name AIGLX :) [00:04] How about exporting all GL extensions but telling the user which ones are hardware-accelerated? [00:05] GL doesn't support that :) [00:05] A Mesa extension? :-P [00:06] ion: to what end? when would you have more than two drivers in practice - one accelerated, one sw? [00:07] I think the problem here is some oddball driver loaded that doesn't implement the bits that mesa's in-tree drivers do, no? [00:08] That's one possible problem, yes [00:08] so even if mesa had awesome support for proxying unsupported extensions over to the llvmpipe swrast driver, that doesn't help if you're not using a mesa driver to begin with, I think [00:09] btw, did linaro's gles proxy lib ever manifest? [00:10] (which, er, was supposed to handle exactly this sort of thing) === cpg is now known as cpg|away === _salem is now known as salem_ === Nisstyre_ is now known as Nisstyre === salem_ is now known as _salem [02:40] barry: re ufw> yep, as of 0.32 [03:32] Good morning [03:33] hi pitti === cpg|away is now known as cpg [04:28] any reason not to upgrade a precise box to quantal right now? [04:29] SpamapS: qemu-kvm has some issues [04:29] libreoffice has no menus in non-unity envs [04:39] yeah I briefly looked at the critical bugs [04:39] just sometimes people say NO WAYT THEARCHIVE IS BZORKEN when I do that ;) [04:40] SpamapS: the archive is frozen ATM :) === Phantomas1 is now known as Phantomas [05:04] hi all [05:05] i wanted to write an upstart job which kicks in just before halt/reboot. [05:05] any pointers on how to do that [05:06] I tried with "start on runlevel [06]". But, I guess that starts as soon as runlevel 0 or 6 is reached [05:06] Right. [05:07] At what point in the shutdown process does it need to run? If it's ‘just as FOO is shutting down’, then ‘start on stopping $FOO’ would get you something like that. [05:07] yeah, i was looking for something like that.. [05:08] like a S89mytask in rc6.d for sysV [05:10] You can of course just have a sysv task if you want; upstart supports it. [05:11] RAOF: ok, just wanted to do it the upstart way. [05:11] There probably is an event you can start on. [05:11] yes, I was looking for that event. like you said "start on stopping foo" [05:12] I am looking for that foo [05:15] So when does it need to run? [05:15] just before the halt/reboot is issued [05:37] ahsan: what exactly do you want it to stop after? [05:38] ahsan: shutdown has a very specific order.. stop services, kill processes, unmount network filesystems, stop networking, kill off straggler processes, unmount filesystems, halt/reboot [05:44] ahsan: for instance, a few things do need to be stopped between unmounting network filesystems, and stopping networking. For those, 'stop on deconfiguring-networking' is a good choice, as it will block the shutdown until those things are stopped. [05:53] ugh, touchpad on MBA 4,1 is not working now [05:59] SpamapS: thanks, will give it a try [05:59] SpamapS: I wanted to just delete a marker, as late as possible [06:00] Can I delete a patch sent to Debian? [06:00] ahsan: so you have to do it before filesystems are unmounted [06:00] I accidentally submitted a duplicate to someone else's fix... [06:02] SpamapS: ok, can you please tell the syntax [06:07] SpamapS: "start on starting mountall" will be a race condition? [06:08] ahsan: mountall is started during the system boot. I thought you wanted on shutdown [06:09] SpamapS: oh, you're right. sorry [06:10] SpamapS: btw, when does mountall stops? .. also, which task handles unmounting filesystems? [06:10] ahsan: there's no event, currently, attached to unmounting filesystems, but you could either a) push it back to just before networking is deconfigured, or b) add the event to /etc/init.d/umountfs [06:11] ahsan: mountall never stops IIRC [06:11] ahsan: unmounting is done by /etc/init.d/umountfs [06:12] SpamapS: thanks [06:17] SpamapS: which event is emitted when networking is disconfigured [06:18] ie "start on stopping foo" .. whats foo here? or disconfiguring-network itself is an event which is emitted? [06:18] /s/disconfigured/deconfigured [07:00] good morning [07:07] bdrung, AFAICS ubuntu-packaging-guide is ready for upload :) [07:16] didrocks: I noticed some important python applications do not work on Quantal (they all fail with the same error: Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_widget_style_get: assertion `GTK_IS_WIDGET (widget)' failed) - who can/should I nerve with this ? [07:16] didrocks: examples are qbzr or trimage packages... [07:17] it happened again, a bug i just reported got duplicated of a private one https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/colord/+bug/1046690 and https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1038768 [07:17] Error: Bug #1046690 is a duplicate of bug #1038768, but it is private (https://launchpad.net/bugs/1038768) [07:17] Error: malone bug 1038768 not found [07:17] MCR1: those are using pygtk or pygi? [07:17] can someone mark the second public and tell me where i open a bug so that this doesn't happen again? [07:18] didrocks: qbzr says it depends on python-qt4, python2.7 [07:19] MCR1: yeah having the same problem :-/ [07:19] MCR1: ok, are all python applications having this kind of gtk warning qt apps? [07:19] I wonder if it's not just the qt -> gtkstyle binding which is broken [07:21] didrocks: trimage is also depending on python-qt4 and python >= 2.6 [07:21] didrocks: I am not sure if all have this kind of warning, but many python applications work, while those 2 don't anymore, while at least trimage was working on Precise [07:22] but I guess qbzr also works there... [07:23] tsdgeos: Which python applications are creating this problem for you ? [07:31] MCR1: to be honest i'm only using qbzr [07:31] MCR1: so, I would say it's a Qt issue to not work with latest GtkStyle, maybe some people are knowledgeable on #kubuntu-devel [07:33] didrocks: ok, I'll ask there. Thx. After all qbzr is a quite important tool for Ubuntu development as there is no real replacement I know of (bzr explorer is slow and buggy) [07:34] it seems someone decided to break qt on quantal, assistant is also crashing on startup :D === henrix_ is now known as henrix === mcclurmc_away is now known as mcclurmc === mcclurmc is now known as mcclurmc_away === mcclurmc_away is now known as mcclurmc === mcclurmc is now known as mcclurmc_away === henrix is now known as henrix_ === henrix_ is now known as henrix === henrix is now known as henrix_ === henrix_ is now known as henrix [09:15] does anyone know why i might be seeing: [09:15] Qt: Session management error: None of the authentication protocols specified are supported [09:15] in Precise (12.04.1)? [09:16] i read something about no X server - which couldn't be possible [09:16] barry: http://en.chys.info/2011/11/a-problem-with-pipes-in-python-3/ - gotcha, possibly worth mentioning somewhere. Note my comment [09:17] Relevant if you do things like subp = subprocess.Popen(blah, stdout=subprocess.PIPE); for line in subp.stdout: without universal_newlines=True [09:18] Because now it defaults to unbuffered for byte streams [09:25] pitti, https://plus.google.com/116315264177593873442/posts/aQq8vV7gUnE :-) [09:32] hey zyga [09:33] zyga: ah, nice! this looks similar to what "apport-bug storage" is doing [09:33] pitti, cool, I didn't know that [09:33] zyga: hm, wouldn't it be easier to run udisksctl monitor? or is that missing some signals? [09:33] pitti, I'll be using that to port checkbox to udisks2 [09:33] pitti, no, it's just something I wrote for this task, the code is shared with checkbox actually [09:33] zyga: anyway, if it helps, it should build just fine on precise, so we can put it into a PPA or so [09:34] pitti, hmm, udisks2 in precise ... it might be cool but then again some things (mounting) will still happen via udisks1 [09:34] pitti, I'll think about it but the focus right now is to get results from standard installs [09:35] makes sense [09:35] pitti, so that we have predictable behavior in practice === cpg is now known as cpg|away === mcclurmc_away is now known as mcclurmc === tkamppeter_ is now known as tkamppeter [10:43] mpt: what is your opinion on tooltips? bug 1045799 [10:43] Launchpad bug 1045799 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Manual partitioner: Add tooltips to icons 'Add', 'Remove', and 'Modify'" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1045799 [10:43] KILL THEM ALL [10:43] KILL THEM WITH FIRE [10:43] * mpt reads the bug report [10:46] lol [10:49] xnox, is how it looks with the default theme? [10:49] Those are some weird icons. [10:49] Wait, that isn't even the installer, that's GParted! [10:54] mpt: so I did change "Add partition","Remove partition", "Edit partition" to symbolic icons "+","-","cog" [10:54] xnox, may I see a screenshot? [10:54] mpt: now I am confused if people are confused about Gparted or Ubiquity. [10:54] mpt: one moment. [10:56] I suspect Erick is confused in ways that jibel is not. [10:56] mpt: i really want the "Pencil" icon, instead of/in addition to a "cog" [10:59] xnox, I specced "Change..." as text: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1bZ4yQIVgGaUGSYu3qiUHnQt3ieBZoqunP_DcleHCr3I/edit#heading=h.6zratkhfgk60 [10:59] mpt: I was naughty =) === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch [11:38] dholbach: done. [11:38] thanks bdrung! :) [11:46] xnox, I don't know why you'd add tooltips post-UIF but not just switch to the specced label post-UIF [11:48] mpt: here is link how it currently looks like https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/jsf4RKjSfg6IKFMoShVwtlh0btKKriD5FR8jiayHfxc?feat=directlink [11:48] mpt: I personally hate tooltips and status bars with passion [11:49] xnox, why don't the buttons have borders? [11:49] mpt: also the right click menus [11:49] mpt: ask the theme designers =/ [11:49] mpt: the border appears on mouse-over [11:49] Are you sure this is a theme issue? [11:49] mpt: the onces on the right are "button box" the onces on the left is "toolbar" [11:49] Does the theme say "whoa, this button has only an icon in it, I'm dropping the border"? [11:50] xnox, ok, well don't do that then, use a normal button :-) [11:50] mpt: I was naughty =) menubar is the easiest / quickest way to get symbolic icons, but I couldn't get mixed labels/icons in the same toolbar. [11:51] mpt: =))))) [11:51] My designs can take only so much abuse before they break, you know. [11:51] * xnox LOL [11:52] mpt: ok. What about the size of the + and - ? big enough? just right? too small? [11:54] xnox, looks right to me. [11:54] mpt: let me change it to what it was suppose to be and then I'll give you another screenshot. [11:54] ok === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch === MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow [13:25] ppa queue ~7h.. [13:44] hm, seems xserver-xorg-input-mtrack has restored my trackpad [13:44] tho I seem to recall having lots of other problems with this driver [13:45] restored how? === amitk is now known as amitk-afk [13:48] tjaalton: with evdev, I get no working trackpad [13:51] SpamapS: ok [13:52] bug 1046675 btw :) [13:52] Launchpad bug 1046675 in xorg (Ubuntu) "macbook air 4,1 trackpad does not work on upgrade to quantal from precise" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1046675 [13:53] well I've got xserver 1.13 ready, but nowhere to build it [13:53] since half the builders are idle or offline, queue ~7h === Nisstyre_ is now known as Nisstyre [13:58] cjwatson: yes, that does seem unfortunate. at least it's documented though ;) http://docs.python.org/py3k/library/subprocess.html and search for 'bufsize' [14:13] ev, should configuration file prompts in upgrades (bug 86028) be considered errors like debconf prompts? What do you think? [14:13] Launchpad bug 86028 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "RFE: ask all config-file questions at the start or end of the upgrade" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/86028 [14:14] mpt: I'm inclined to say yes, but we should chat with someone who knows conffiles better than I do. [14:26] pitti: I'm not an archive admin, so can't commit to ubuntu-archive-tools [14:26] mpt: a conffile prompt for a conffile that the user didn't edit is an error; a conffile prompt for a conffile that they did is the standard conflict resolution method; there's no way for us to tell the difference from an automated report [14:26] stgraber: ah, I thought as ~ubuntu-release you were [14:28] pitti: ~ubuntu-release now has direct queue admin rights on and -proposed, so I can accept packages but I'm not in ~ubuntu-archive [14:29] slangasek, what would we need to change to make them distinguishable? (store the modification date somewhere? or a hash value?) [14:29] mpt: there's nothing you can do [14:29] it's *either* a user modifying it, *or* it's software going rogue and modifying it [14:30] you can't distinguish these unless you know what software is going rogue, e.g. by reproducing it in an autotest [14:32] barry, pitti: could one of you review an aptdaemon merge proposal? https://code.launchpad.net/~brian-murray/aptdaemon/bug-875879/+merge/122979 [14:32] Launchpad bug 122979 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "[aiglx][intel][r300] Video playback is buggy under Compiz" [High,Fix released] === Nisstyre_ is now known as Nisstyre [14:53] url 1 [14:53] oops [14:55] bdmurray: seems fine to me, thanks [15:11] pitti: are you going to upload aptdaemon then? also do you have any ideas for an SRU test case for this? [15:11] we are still frozen anyway, and mvo is working on a few branches which I guess he'd want in soon as well, so I guess he'll do an upload soon [15:15] yeah, I would love to get a new version in on friday [15:16] mvo: do you have an idea of an sru test case for bug 875879? [15:16] Launchpad bug 875879 in update-manager (Ubuntu Quantal) "update-manager crashed with AttributeError in show_diff(): 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'group'" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/875879 [15:20] cjwatson: you mentioned a couple of days ago that something was misbuilt [15:21] I fixed it [15:21] https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/syslinux-themes-ubuntu/5 [15:21] That was the cause of the iso-hybrid failures in live-build [15:27] bdmurray: hm, we could have to find a package that changes the conffile during a upgrade, I could try to fabricate something [15:29] Laney: haskell-hint builds on ppc, and it looks like it's restrictions on architecture are based solely on needing ghci. Should I set it to Arch: any and update the build-deps to use ghc-ghci? [15:35] bdmurray: hrm, hrm, so I created a artifical conffile prompt, but couldn't trigger the bug with it [15:36] mvo: with quantal or precise? errors.ubuntu.com doesn't show any quantal versions of the error for some reason [15:37] bdmurray: tested on my precise box [15:39] can somebody please reject https://code.launchpad.net/~ianrob1201/ubuntu/quantal/libmoosex-semiaffordanceaccessor-perl/typo-fix/+merge/122370? [15:40] Laney: …so that seemed to the the correct way to handle it based on other packages, I've uploaded that change [15:40] mvo: that seems strange [15:40] https://code.launchpad.net/~radumstoica/ubuntu/quantal/libnss-pgsql/typo-fix/+merge/122383 too please [15:41] Laney: And after that, it seems the transition is basically done for powerpc (two dep-waits that will eventually trigger today sometime) [15:41] bdmurray: I put info how to reproduce into the bugreport now, its a artificial thing that should only be done in a VM [15:42] mvo: okay, thanks I'll have a look in a bit [15:42] bdmurray: its really odd, the conffile is there and all but the diff looks valid instead of crashing [15:42] does update-manager -d work against a local mirror? [15:43] as in, when there is no network to archive.ubuntu.com [15:43] but there is to some other official mirror [15:43] xnox: if the mirror is the only server then yes, if you mix it with a official mirorr it will ocmment the local one out [15:43] infinity: Is ghci segfaulting on arm? [15:43] mvo: what if the official one times-out? [15:44] mvo: or otherwise inaccessible? e.g. blocked by firewall? [15:44] xnox: I'm not sure, but I don't think its very clever in this case and will just fail [15:44] mvo: ok. [15:48] Is anyone able to give me shell access to an arm box so I can try to fix ghc? [15:50] BenC: http://arm.trystack.org/ <- public access to the calxeda machines [15:50] (takes a while to get an account, but I can spin one up and give you acesss to it, if you want) [15:50] Thanks, I think I'll actually just fire up a qemu [15:51] yaeh, that works well enough for ARM [15:52] ev, interesting how errors.ubuntu.com has a spike in errors/day during the weekends, but trunk has a dip in the weekends. [15:52] hmm, nice spot [15:53] (In both cases the pattern might be clearer if they were PDT or CT days rather than UTC -- not that that means you should switch.) [15:53] some day we'll calculate it by hour [15:53] and let you zoom in [15:53] ah [15:53] I guess that doesn't help here [15:55] mpt: buttons as per spec: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/IX7RCztyVR5RU0OPsX2CXVh0btKKriD5FR8jiayHfxc?feat=directlink [15:56] * xnox is dissappointed that (a) gtk does not have symbolic stock buttons (b) that I couldn't simply use + and - ascii characters for those "labels" and had to hack together symbolic image with empty text label next to it [15:57] xnox, better, thanks. Someday we'll have buttons smart enough to glob together (like USC's Back and Forward buttons) if you put them right next to each other. [15:57] A really smart theme could do that. [15:58] mpt: well that was one reason I used toolbar buttons originally, naïvely thinking they'd do the globbing [15:58] cr3, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1189171/ [15:58] zyga-w510: sweet, thanks man! [15:59] mpt: although in System Settings we have globbing! Open System Settings -> Appearance and notice that (all settings|appearance) [16:00] cjwatson: awesome, thanks :) [16:00] mpt: I am committing this for now, can do globbing later. [16:00] zyga-w510: so, your Wacom ISDv4 E2 Finger touch doesn't seem to be detected as a multitouch device. is it appearing in the System Settings -> Wacom Graphics Tablet? [16:00] let's see if it works === deryck is now known as deryck[lunch] [16:00] cr3, yes [16:00] cr3, it's dual touch technically [16:01] zyga-w510: technically, but it's not currently working as mutitouch, right? [16:01] cr3, it does't work at all now [16:01] cr3, touching the screen randomly moves the pointer around [16:01] thanks xnox [16:01] cr3, actually [16:01] zyga-w510: good for me, bad for me :) this is valuable information [16:01] cr3, when I tried that just now it _did_ work [16:01] err, s/bad for me/bad for you/ [16:02] zyga-w510: it's working as a touch device but not a multitouch device though, right? [16:02] yes [16:02] cr3, although a moment ago I'm pretty sure that id did something rather stupid and made the pointer dance around the screen [16:02] cr3, in precise I did apply a few udev tweaks that I forgot about and got lost later when I wiped this machine [16:02] zyga-w510: ok, so we need to determine whether we want to test whether touchscreens work as touch devices separately from whether they work as multitouch devices [16:03] cr3, definitely [16:04] cr3, testing this now I realize one more thing is important and relevant for udisks2 and other tests [16:04] cr3, the speed of discovery -- it's not instant [16:04] cr3, I suspect there's some polling behind the scenes [16:04] cr3, I'll add timestamps to my output so that we know better what to do, maybe the 20 second timeout should be changed [16:05] zyga-w510: while you're on that machine, could you also pastebin the output of /usr/share/checkbox/scripts/udev_resource? it's so great having all the scripts in checkbox readily available onthe live image to test hardware! [16:06] sure [16:10] cr3, http://paste.ubuntu.com/1189198/ [16:12] zyga-w510: hehe, I meant the output of running that script :) [16:12] oh [16:12] I was curious after doing that [16:12] why would you need it ;) [16:13] zyga-w510: I love the python3 part, barry will be proud :) [16:13] http://paste.ubuntu.com/1189202/ [16:13] cr3, that the script is written in python3? [16:14] cr3: rock! [16:14] zyga-w510: lines 480 to 492 look pretty darn good! [16:14] so drop the rest ! [16:14] ogra_: we're still talking about lines, right? :) [16:15] yeah, but then your code becomes *perfect* [16:15] like a haiku :) [16:15] cr3, in the pastebin? [16:15] ogra_: 0 lines == 0 bugs [16:15] ++ [16:15] category touch? [16:16] zyga-w510: yeah, your wacom device seems to be properly detected by the udevadm parser. so at least we're reporting complete information and accurate too, as it's being properly recognized as a TOUCH device [16:16] cr3, right, I understand that now, cool, that's very good [16:16] zyga-w510: we might need to refine that category for touch vs multitouch [16:17] cr3, do you think you'd like a separate multi-touch category (or extra property somewhere) [16:18] zyga-w510: I'm very careful before adding categories, so we'll evaluate the need for it as we write tests [16:18] barry, why oh why py3k/py2k bytes type is such a mess :-) [16:19] barry, couldn't py3k use raw_bytes or something [16:19] zyga-w510: i'm not sure what you mean ;) okay, yeah it's a mess in py2 [16:21] barry, I mean that since it means something totally different then for the sake of easier compatibility the true bytes type in py3k could have been called raw_bytes, leaving bytes as an alias of str to keep the old crappy behavior [16:21] barry, I probably want the impossible [16:21] (I now have to do the ord/chr dance) [16:22] ogra_: I find it unfortunate that the industry still rewards people adding code more than those removing it [16:22] cr3, evolution did the same, mind you [16:22] zyga-w510: never settle for anything less than the impossible :) [16:22] heh [16:22] yeah, given that python 2 is a dead end, it's impossible :) [16:23] * zyga-w510 wishes for py2.7.9(9) release with from __future__ import bytes3k [16:23] to suck less [16:23] zyga-w510: evolution is slowly getting rid of the appendice routine [16:24] appendix in english, I mean [16:25] barry, was there a 3to2 program or is there only 2to3? [16:26] zyga-w510: pep 404 :) [16:26] heh [16:26] yeah [16:26] barry, but in all fairness that policy huts the transition -- I'm not asking for a real 2.8 [16:26] zyga-w510: there's a rumored 3to2 program, but i've never tried it. frankly i'm not a fan of 2to3 for production or development either (although a cool framework, it's just too slow) [16:27] barry, it's like u getting back to 3k [16:27] s/huts/hurts/ [16:28] zyga-w510: yeah. it's just that i think that if your py2 code is unicode clean, you will have a much easier time with the transition. caveat that with the tricks we've learned, tools like the six module, and maybe even the re-introduction of u'' in py3.3 for the web framework guys [16:29] barry: wait, why reintroduce u'' for web framework guys? [16:29] barry, what would you do when you had to ship 2/3 programs for the next few years? [16:29] cr3, for 2to3 to indicate where it is safe, web is not unicode [16:29] web is _B_Y_T_E_S_ man [16:30] cr3: http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0414/ [16:30] I have packages that run 2to3 at build time and ship both python and python3 binaries, it's not that hard. [16:30] Scott, I wrote mine in py3 so I'm hosed [16:31] ScottK: waow, and you didn't have to adjust anything else? [16:31] * didrocks always has some adjustement to do after running 2to3 [16:31] zyga-w510: i agree, but i'm not the project leader of django/zope/cherrypy/wtfwebetckthxbye [16:31] Upstream coded for it to be done that way. [16:31] zyga-w510: i've written lots of single-code base py2/py3 compatible code. it's not that hard [16:32] ah ok, it's not the pure python2 first draft, it had been adapated :) [16:32] zyga-w510: w/o 2to3 [16:32] BenC: I haven't been paying attention to GHC (or much of anything) lately. :/ [16:32] barry, so did I today [16:32] adapted* [16:32] Personally, I find it easier for stuff I'm writing to target 2.6+ and make the code work with python and python3. [16:32] barry, except for bytes that I'm actually fixing now [16:32] didrocks: Yes. It's upstream's method for supporting older than python2.6 and python3. [16:32] barry: thanks, I can appreciate this harsh reality: Most of those users couldn't care less about the "purity" of the Python language specification, they just want their websites and applications to work as well as possible. [16:33] ScottK: >= 2.6 is a requirement imho, but some folks have been able to go all the way back to 2.4 with single code base. [16:33] ScottK: that's nice :) [16:33] cr3, end of quote ;) [16:33] zyga-w510: yeah, that's what i mean. the bytes v. strings model must be solid, which is not always easy. (e.g. email is both) [16:34] So is DNS. [16:34] yeah, I fully agree [16:34] ScottK: yeah [16:35] zyga-w510, cr3, ScottK: many people have found this compatibility library to be very helpful: http://packages.python.org/six/ [16:35] I've heard about it, but haven't used it. [16:35] and of course it's available as python-six and python3-six [16:35] wow [16:35] six.binary_type [16:35] ++ [16:35] cool, thanks [16:35] i haven't needed to use it myself, but i've occasionally lifted tricks from it :) [16:37] barry: exponent is even more powerful than multiplication, so eight will certainly be even better than six! [16:37] ev, speak of the devil: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/114961700/libreoffice-upgrade.png [16:38] mpt: ICK [16:38] barry: Oh, which reminds me: am I safe to assume at this point that we really aren't going to revert to py2, and start ripping out compatibility code from ubiquity? [16:38] heh [16:39] It's not a desperate hardship to keep it, but I kind of figure I'd have heard by now if we were going back [16:40] barry, I wonder if angry mint-switching users will fork python2.7 and release minthoon-2.8 ;) [16:43] zyga-w510: mint users are ok, until they take my packages from ubuntu (!) and report bugs against debian (!!) that it doesn't work with mint-foo (!!!) [16:43] ^_^ [16:44] well [16:44] you can't blame them [16:44] they go upstream, right [16:44] what`s wrong with mint then? [16:45] silverarrow: forking core libs & changing API&ABI without rebuilding r-deps in the whole archive.... shall I continue? [16:46] cjwatson: no going backward only forward :) it does mean will have to ship py2.7 and 3.3 for 12.10 and try again to remove 2.7 from the 13.04 isos, but i have no problem with you ripping out the compatibility code and making it a clean py3 app. that's what we're doing with gwibber (though it won't make it for 12.10 obviously) [16:46] silverarrow, supressing security updates [16:46] might get messy [16:46] zyga-w510: :) [16:47] ubuntu have at least been very good with security updates [16:48] barry: should the rest of the task still be completed on the best effort bases from the python-versions spec? [16:49] s/task/tasks/ [16:49] barry: and is xapian the road-block blocking everything else? [16:50] xnox: yes, if possible. i've copied the spreadsheet to a new one for 13.04 and removed all the green. i'll publish that soon, but i definitely want to get a jump on the ports for 13.04. [16:50] xnox: xapian, twisted, and the launchpadlib stack are big blockers [16:51] xnox: twisted is probably in the best shape (people are actively working on it). the lplib stack and xapian are still the most problematic [16:52] barry: ok. [16:52] barry: by launchpadlib you mean the bug reporting integration for apps or just the pythonic api to talk to launchpad (e.g. stuff like lp-shell and etc)? [16:57] xnox: well, actually, i will have to re-evaluate it for 13.04. launchpad-integration was the package that needed porting but it no longer has an ubuntu-desktop task afaict [16:57] xnox: if we can ignore that stack, i would be ecstatic [16:57] barry: yes, because it's dropped. We have whoopsie & apport instead. [16:58] barry: it's dead =) & on the way out. [16:58] whoop [16:58] sie? :) [16:58] ev you are my bff :) [16:59] barry: well lets get bracelets made then [16:59] <[snake]> can I compile something into a directory that I specify? [16:59] <[snake]> with make [17:00] xnox, ev: which cuts out wadllib, and a host of other really nasty and difficult to port stuff. win! [17:00] <[snake]> I've written a patch for xchat and I want to compile it somewhere where it doesn't overwrite my normal xchat [17:00] * xnox is googling for custom made bracelets "whoop" for ev and "sie" for barry [17:00] haha [17:01] :) [17:01] * xnox they will have "signed by didrocks" signature trademark. And inside will have a writting like in Lord of the Rings "To collect all bugs and unite all crashes..." [17:01] heh :) [17:02] <[snake]> target in the man page for make is where it compiles correct? [17:03] [snake]: #ubuntu-app-devel for app development on ubuntu. This a channel for developing ubuntu itself. [17:03] <[snake]> xnox, what if I am make-ing ubuntu? [17:04] "Replace the customized configuration file '/etc/update-manager/release-upgrades'?" [17:04] <[snake]> xnox, I mean, I'm not, but the question is just about make [17:04] <[snake]> :( [17:04] mpt: I call BS =) [17:04] Hii I want to be an ubuntu app developer any suggestions from where I should start?? Currently i have knowledge of c and c++ [17:04] [snake]: google for out of the tree builds, or VPATH builds then [17:04] xnox, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/114963812/update-manager-conf-file.png [17:05] [snake]: set a different --prefix with configure [17:06] bismay, questions like that are better in #ubuntu-app-devel, but the short answer is [17:06] <[snake]> tsimpson, oh, thanks :) I checked and target was just what you're compiling. so thanks for telling me that [17:06] mpt, thanks..:) [17:06] mpt: that bug was already reported =) [17:07] xnox, I didn't see it when I searched. [17:07] xnox, it's bug 1046942 if you want to mark it as a duplicate. [17:07] Launchpad bug 1046942 in update-manager (Ubuntu) ""Replace the customized configuration file '/etc/update-manager/release-upgrades'?"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1046942 [17:08] bdmurray: what was the bug for Libreoffice prompt vs Prompt? Or is mpt the first reporter? [17:08] I was not === deryck[lunch] is now known as deryck [17:08] mpt: wait.... why update manager. Me is confused. [17:09] maybe it's a different one [17:09] xnox, the libreoffice one is bug 918352 [17:09] Launchpad bug 918352 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Debconf prompt for /etc/libreoffice/sofficerc when upgrading to precise" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/918352 [17:09] can anybody field a casper question for me? [17:09] Now I'm about to report a gdm one [17:10] xnox: bug 1045579 [17:10] Launchpad bug 1045579 in software-properties (Ubuntu Quantal) "software-properties-gtk makes a change resulting in a conf file prompt on upgrade that's unnecessary" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1045579 [17:10] bdmurray: thanks. mpt ^^^^ [17:10] ohhhh [17:11] mpt: I can totally understand how easy it is to relate your & that bug titles [17:11] =)))))))))))) === mcclurmc is now known as mcclurmc_away [17:25] xnox, also, it was filed against a different package, so I wouldn't have seen it anyway. [17:25] mpt: haha. True. It has now been marked against the package that is causing the error, not the package where the file belongs nor the window that shows it. [17:26] mpt: it's same way that adobe acrobat reader, is causing similar errors on gnome-mimetypes package upgrade. Or something like that =) === cpg|away is now known as cpg [17:34] * mpt arrives at the "Remove obsolete packages" stage (bug 940789) [17:34] Launchpad bug 940789 in update-manager (Ubuntu) ""Obsolete packages will be removed" dialogue is too tall for netbook screen with KDE front end" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/940789 === Nisstyre_ is now known as Nisstyre [17:50] mpt: you are using KDE?! [17:51] * xnox is a bit sad =( [17:51] mpt: or does it affect gtk front-end as well? [17:55] xnox, I think it affects GTK coincidentally [17:55] It's a typical GTK2 dialog that hasn't been ported to GTK3 and ballooned in height [17:56] reported as bug 1046955 [17:56] Launchpad bug 1046955 in update-manager (Ubuntu) ""Remove obsolete packages?" prompt is taller than the screen" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1046955 [17:59] mpt i will take it for the jam then. [18:18] hi has anyone seen an error like this before > http://paste.ubuntu.com/1189405/ [18:18] attempting to checkout a branch on precise [18:20] not sure if this is a launchpad issue or not [18:22]