[00:11] knome: in case that calms you down, ubiquity will at least be readable in quantal (after xnox's patches are merged) [00:11] knome: there are still some problems, i commented on the respective bugreports [00:12] knome: to be exact #1010487 and #924909 [00:13] knome: for the latter i tested the fix we talked about (switch off compositor), created a branch and submitted that for review (if it doesn't get accepted, poke stgraber or cjwatson about it) [07:25] ochosi, that's good news [07:32] bug #1046667 [07:32] ;) [07:32] Launchpad bug 1046667 in parole (Ubuntu) "Parole Media Player does not display gui correctly " [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1046667 [07:33] gna, brb [07:35] that caught me out too :) [07:40] what i don't completely understand is why didn't you both try to play a video? :) [07:41] where would a vignetted image like that come from [07:48] I rarely play videos on the PC and use it for music sometimes :) [07:56] bbl [07:57] anybody know the original upstream 'repo' for gvfs? [09:44] knome: lol, nice parole error [09:46] are we not using the xubuntu wiki short/long tests anymore ? or is it just that all the testcase are the ones written by nskaggs on the tracker? [10:20] knome: i'm marking our bug #1010487 as duplicate of this one #744283 [10:20] Launchpad bug 1010487 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Xubuntu - black windows" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1010487 [10:20] knome: since the patch at least fixes the colors, i think that's fine [10:21] maybe when ubiquity is properly patched the theme gets loaded properly as well with this patch [10:21] otherwise we'll just report a new bug, i'd say [10:21] Bug #744283 [10:21] Launchpad bug 744283 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Precise) "Steps "Preparing to install" and "Erase disk" are unreadable with high-contrast theme enabled" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/744283 [10:58] ochosi, yup [10:58] i've done it already anyway :) [10:58] i also submitted a new, corrected, branch for review to ubiquity [10:58] elfy, we should update the testcases on the QA tracker, yeah [10:59] ochosi, did you read cjwatson's comments? [10:59] ochosi, or was this corrected stuff about that [10:59] sure, i just branched the wrong thing last night [10:59] now the patch is as tiny as it should be [10:59] yeah :D [10:59] great [10:59] knome: so use the ones we were using previously - the wiki ones ? just don't want to waste my time :) [10:59] huhu [10:59] elfy, yes, run those [10:59] g2g, prolly bbl [11:00] elfy, they will be updated on the QA wiki in the following week [11:00] k cheers - I already had ... then saw this new testcase stuff and flipped out completely lol [11:00] hehe [11:00] yeah [11:00] i should do it today or tomorrow [11:00] as soon as i have time [11:01] i'm now at a railway station so not willing to do it now :P [11:01] or whack a mail of to the list just to let people know [11:01] lol [11:01] if you can, that'd help ;) [11:01] or I can do one now and you can follow it up [11:01] just say they will be moved to the tracker in a week [11:01] and you should still run at least the short test [11:01] k - will do that right now - cos I am at home and drinking tea and not at a railway station :D [11:02] anyway, i had a nice 2 hours with the guy running the linux courses [11:02] yea - well I run the short test and then the long test basically for milestones [11:02] i think i just talked us up to 60 tests for beta2 [11:02] and that's totally doable again with other releases... [11:02] he was really excited about it all, so good sign for us [11:03] maybe i'll even go there and talk a bit about linux.. [11:04] elfy, and thanks for sending the email :) [11:04] welcome [11:05] do you possible have time to look at the docs today? [11:05] there are a few sections/subpages that only need reviewing [11:05] if we got those reviewed and ACK'd, i could start converting them to docobok [11:05] docbook too [11:05] and we'd save ourself from some hassle [11:06] I can yea - got a bit frustrated earlier [11:06] hehe [11:06] things will look much more brighter when we get to review those pages [11:06] and get them uploaded [11:06] i think we have almost half on docbook then [11:07] excellent [11:07] that might be positive thinking [11:07] but at least we'll have quite a lot then [11:07] positice thinking is the best way [11:07] so, are going ahead with beta 1 or suspend until the install issues are fixed? [11:08] it looks like we need to skip beta1 [11:08] knome: I'll send to xubuntu-devel/xubuntu-users and ubuntu-qa ? [11:08] elfy, -devel is fine i think [11:09] elfy, but feel free to send to all [11:09] ok - not the -qa then - I'd send to -users - might even get someone to think "Hey, perhaps I could help there" [11:10] sent now [11:10] elfy, yup, thanks :) [11:12] elfy: So you wanna use the short one or the long one? [11:12] ? [11:13] I mean the short testcase or the long testcase [11:13] The two links you provided in the email [11:13] talk to knome about it please [11:14] Oh alright [11:14] but basically we use them both for milestone releases [11:15] i'm probably making the short test mandatory and long test run-once [11:15] makes sense [11:16] I generally check once that encrypted works as expected as well - but that's not on the test cases [11:16] Alright:) [11:16] elfy, we can probably reintroduce it now that we don't have alternate [11:17] aah yea - good thought [11:17] elfy, but let's talk about this later [11:17] yep [11:17] cya [11:17] probably tomorrow [11:17] yup, i'm off [11:17] see you and have fun! :) [11:17] I'll be about AM and then back in the evening if you want me [11:17] knome: On the "not having the alternate" part, balloons and phillw will be rewriting it:) [11:17] I mean the testcases:) [11:17] smartboyhw, we don't have alternate images [11:18] smartboyhw, so we don't need alternate testcases. [11:18] I know, since you deleted it [11:18] Or the release team [11:19] pleia2? [11:19] But then balloons will be editing the desktop ones to let people get used to not having the alternates [11:23] they'll be rewriting the other stuff not the xubuntu wiki tests I suspect [11:23] elfy: I think knome means to rewrite it on the ISO QA Tracker [11:24] have fun knome [12:43] How do you guys apply the xubuntu theme to xscreensaver? [12:54] Unit193: PM [13:14] mips1911: you can't apply any theming to xscreensaver. most of the "style" is hardcoded [13:14] Have you made any changes to 12.10 daily yet, regarding the theming issues? [13:15] pnarciso: you mean ubiquity or which theming issues? [13:15] yes, ubiquity [13:15] ochosi, I recall 12.04 having a custom theme, if you install xscreensave from the repos it lacks the theme so how does it get into ubuntu if it's hardcoded or do you guys ship a different xscreensave packge on the install media? [13:15] you can follow the merge-requests to see that [13:16] mips1911: no, 12.04 has the standard awful xscreensaver lockscreen [13:16] mips1911: this one: http://www.bstegmaier.de/wiki/images/Xscreensaver.png [13:16] (incl. the terrible terrible pixmap) [13:17] ochosi, I can swear mine was themed as in 12.10 I now have the plain one [13:17] mips1911: maybe you used gnome-screensaver [13:17] x screensaver is buggy [13:17] pnarciso: bug #744283: "Merged into lp:ubiquity at revision 5631" [13:17] Launchpad bug 744283 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Precise) "Steps "Preparing to install" and "Erase disk" are unreadable with high-contrast theme enabled" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/744283 [13:18] ochosi, no definitely xscreensaver [13:18] I must disable it because it interferes with games [13:18] It doesn't recognise gamepads [13:18] we'll try to drop it for 13.04 anyway [13:19] I'll prefer that my screen enter suspend mode instead of having a screensaver [13:20] screensavers are already disabled by default in 12.10 [13:20] there's only suspend and then a lockscreen now [13:20] if xfce power manager had the option to lock the screen when the monitor enters suspend mode it was the ideal solution [13:21] it's more or less what will happen, yes [13:21] we'll try to get lightdm to do the screenlocking [13:21] 12.10 have a blank screen screensaver enabled by deafult [13:22] right [13:22] well i guess my/the idea was to only let the monitor suspend, but wha'eve [13:22] r [13:23] :) good moring people [13:23] Hi GridCube, ochosi [13:23] ahoi GridCube [13:23] hi [13:23] good morning! [13:23] what are we pondering today? [13:23] oh, ahoi bluesabre :) [13:23] I heard that due to test failures knome is not gonna release Beta 1. [13:24] i heard there was a respin of beta 1 [13:24] i heard knome was going to sponsor all of us for uds [13:24] skaet, i'm thinking that xubuntu will skip beta 1 looking at all the fails. [13:24] (except not really) [13:24] bluesabre: funny, i heard the same :} [13:25] bluesabre: You're kidding:) [13:25] sadly, yes smartboyhw [13:25] Well [13:25] bluesabre: if you come, i'll come as well :] [13:26] Let me ask my bank account [13:26] well, that was a quick "no" [13:26] bluesabre: LOL [13:26] :D [13:26] hehe [13:26] bluesabre: did you check the flights? [13:26] (just out of curiosity) [13:26] Nope. Haven't checked [13:27] But it's very likely they're outside of my present budget [13:29] Why does xubuntu use the droid sans fonts instead of ubuntu fonts? [13:30] mips1911: why not? [13:31] (because it's prettier) [13:31] lol [13:31] 13.04 --> Roboto font [13:31] ;) [13:31] ;0 [13:31] heh [13:31] Actually, I like Droid Sans better than Roboto [13:31] yeah, it's not so bad, but i also prefer droid as UI font [13:33] Anybody else interested in looking at indicator-messages? [13:33] :D [13:33] i always change it to ubuntus font :P [13:33] GridCube: SAME [13:34] i have two that pop up everyday, one says "you have 400 updates" and other one says "there was a faliure in a previous session", are those interesting indicator-messages? :P [13:35] bluesabre: tbh i already looked at the source and i feel very, very lost with it [13:35] yes, but there is one that is much more interesting ;) [13:35] bluesabre: ubiquity's scripts are a piece of cake in comparison [13:35] It would be quicker to create a gtk3 panel [13:36] not sure [13:36] at least not incl. all the plugins we need [13:36] I ignore anything that says something has failed unless it is in big bold red letters [13:37] As far as I can tell, to use the GtkActionGroup, I basically need to extend GtkWidget [13:37] which means we'd probably ship a custom gtk [13:37] it seems crazy [13:37] I'd like the thing that used to sit in notifications back again - used that all the time [13:37] wow, that's a bit over-the-top for a single indicator [13:37] i ignore it because its tehre every single time saying blueman has failed, when in fact i dont have any bluethoot device [13:38] Are the other indicators restored? [13:38] GridCube: you not having a bluetooth device is probably why it fails :D [13:38] bluesabre: not sure, mr_pouit was a bit silent about that the last few days [13:38] it'd probably tell em that too GridCube if I'd left it in startup [13:42] GridCube: sudo apt-get autoremove bluez [13:42] that's my method [13:43] * bluesabre would like to have bluetooth in his next laptop [13:43] bluesabre: Sure make it 4.0 or 5.0 [13:43] bluesabre: from when is your laptop? my gf's laptop is 6(!) years old and has bluetooth [13:44] 2009/2010 [13:44] bluesabre, :P that would help, but then if i wanted to use my bluethoot thingy to sync my cellphone i cant, but i only use that like never [13:44] bluesabre: How much does your notebook cost? [13:44] I went to a college where you're given a laptop, so they customized it to have what the college needed [13:44] i see [13:45] so no bluetooth, no backlit keyboard, etc [13:45] bluesabre: Oh OK [13:45] but it runs xubuntu like a champ [13:45] :D [13:46] ;D [13:46] as my netbook does, [13:47] for some reason the case for my netbook has a precut hole that says "GPS" i dont know why because it doesnt have one, but i think that theres another version that do have gps [13:47] HAHAHA [13:49] oh boy, i though this was ot, sorry for derailing people [13:49] :p [13:49] * GridCube hides in shame [13:50] ;P [13:58] btw, what do you guys think of the original "wingpanel"-idea? (not sure everyone is familiar with it) [13:59] * elfy isn't [13:59] reference: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/12/wingpanel-elementarys-slick-new-space-saving-panel [13:59] we could easily do the same with xfce-panel in 4.10 [14:00] mmm [14:00] It seemed like a good idea, and worked well when that wingpanel worked well [14:00] anyway, i'm testing it atm [14:00] !? [14:00] not sure if that wouldn't freak me out a bit [14:00] elfy: to freak ppl out less, we could call it a new "maximize-mode" [14:01] lol [14:01] Yeah [14:01] ideally the xfce-panel would get intelli-hide mode [14:01] you forget that I make my panel 20 pixels and hide it at the bottom [14:01] then we could make the rest, that is not "wingpanel-style" autohide when a window is maximized [14:01] elfy: i can't forget something i don't know [14:02] :p [14:03] the panel looks good at 26px [14:03] :D [14:03] yeah, currently we're still at 24, but i'm really considering 26 for the next release [14:03] have a reduced panel like that implies that a more advanced docking app is used, to show what apps are open [14:03] ochosi: so what does it actually do - make notifications bigger [14:04] elfy: what does what? [14:04] this wingpanel type affair [14:05] it makes maximized windows use all available screen estate [14:05] because the notification panel overlays the window-border [14:05] and all other panels hide [14:05] oh - I see that now [14:06] that at least is the rationale [14:06] but as pnarciso pointed out, it implies a dock or an xfce-panel that can intellihide [14:06] yeah [14:06] and we'd have to tweak xfce4-notify [14:06] why? [14:06] or: how? :) [14:06] since I think it would hide under the wingpanel if there's no space reserved at the top [14:07] possibly [14:07] ochosi: kind of like the don't reserve space on borders option ? [14:07] haven't actually checked [14:07] bluesabre: no, notifications still work [14:07] cool [14:07] elfy: not "kind of like", but yes, that option :) [14:07] * bluesabre stops blurting out answers in class [14:08] ok - now I understnad better - I like that idea :) [14:08] bluesabre: Who would ever blurt out answers in class???:O [14:08] lol [14:08] I've moved my panel and notifications to the bottom, since I was always clicking on notifications when trying to click a different tab [14:09] But that's just me :P [14:09] mine's at the bottom on the right of the lefthand monitor - so it is 'sort' of midpoint [14:09] yeah, i never understood the idea of the panel on top [14:10] +1 [14:10] tbh i think it doesn' matter where a panel is, top or bottom are both conventions that ppl get used to [14:10] yeah [14:10] it's just the classical "windows versus mac" paradigm... [14:11] Let's do unity next, leave the panel at the top and put the launcher dock on the left [14:11] yep, in my netbook i placed them on the sides, because its widescreen and that takes less verticall space [14:11] :P [14:11] also: gnome2 (and xfce upstream) have the panel at the top (i know, gnome2 had two panels, but much of what we have there now was on the top one) [14:11] true [14:11] yeah, we could do a unity-like layout [14:11] if we get a good patch for dock-functionality into the paenl [14:11] :D [14:11] panel [14:12] that would be desirable anyway [14:12] so I've got to start looking at kde now ... :p [14:12] but someone with some bamf skills would have to do it (although bamf is probably not the hardest part of it) [14:12] haha [14:13] elfy: yeah, you're joking, but there are really users that start to flame and be really pissed off because of the default panel config (a different config is approx. 2 clicks away) [14:13] mint aproach on xfce put the notification bar on the bottom [14:13] http://imagebin.org/227416 [14:14] GridCube: i was using the same for a long time (well, without the second panel on the right) [14:14] GridCube: only downside is clock and date... [14:14] ochosi: I know :) [14:14] pnarciso: what notification bar? [14:14] I meant xfce panel [14:15] Everything [14:15] ah ok [14:15] kinda like this [14:15] like all versions of windows after win3.1 [14:15] http://imagebin.org/227417 [14:15] yeah, basically [14:15] But you know, there was something magical about win3.1 ;) [14:16] the good thing about this is that you can do the "click-close" mouse action (it's almost a gesture!) [14:16] you mean "magical" because everything happened so counter-intuitively? :] [14:16] more or less [14:17] in fact, compaq had their own setup that involved the use of notebooks for everything [14:17] It was... [14:17] wrong [14:17] yeah [14:17] that reminds me of this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/frankbooth/lightdm-gtk-greeter [14:17] lubuntu asked us whether we wanna re-design the login-greeter with tehm [14:17] yeah bluesabre thats how my desktop is like, except i have a panel acting as a dock on top [14:18] heh [14:18] ochosi: Please don't do that design [14:18] bluesabre: mine is similar http://imagebin.org/227419 [14:18] bluesabre: i won't. but the "terrible use of notebooks" reminded me of that [14:18] lol [14:19] lol [14:19] anyway, if any of you feel like participating in the discussions of how the login-screen should look, i set up a xubuntu-internal spec-page as well: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap/Specifications/R/LightDM-Greeter [14:19] it's still in a very raw stage, haven't had much time [14:20] but it's for R, so there's still quite a bit of time [14:20] You know what? That looks like the Metro UI used in Windows 8 [14:20] ooh shiny [14:21] smartboyhw: not really. furthermore it's just a login-screen [14:21] Hahaha [14:21] smartboyhw: explain how it is even remotely similar to this: http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2011/06/6-1-11-metro.jpg [14:21] rectangle [14:22] wait... you're right!! - both designs use rectangles! [14:22] Apple has sued for less [14:22] yES:) [14:22] ;) [14:22] I want a circle [14:22] or oval [14:22] anyway, basically that debian-proposal should be possible [14:22] looks nice [14:22] at least if we get our hands dirty with the code a bit [14:22] Yeah, sounds like an interesting possibility [14:22] i like that there is no extra panel [14:22] Though, I really like the gtk-greeter with the 12.10 theme [14:23] i don't think it's needed [14:23] in the 12.10 theme it's basically empty [14:23] just two small menus... [14:23] a more advanced lightdm greeter would add a nice touch do xubuntu, but in the end of the day, it's just another login manager, and single users won't see them much [14:23] yeah [14:23] pnarciso: well, it would also be used as a lockscreen [14:24] This discussion, while offtopic, is still remotely mostly -devel related... congrats us! [14:25] yeah, walking the thin line... [14:25] It's ok, knome doesn't appear to be around ;) [14:25] HAHAHA [14:26] It IS dev related, unless you wanna start a #lightdm-gtk-greeter channel :) [14:26] Anything is better than working on indicator-messages-gtk2 ;) [14:26] I just don't know what to do anymore [14:26] lol [14:27] For now fixing the indicator-messages should be top priority :) [14:27] Oh it is, I'm just still stuck [14:28] I only I knew anything about programming [14:28] If I only knew anything about programming [14:28] * elfy too pnarciso [14:29] If only the ayatana devs didn't kill gtk2 support... [14:29] And from what I've read, XFCE devs wil stick to gtk2 for 4.12 [14:30] yup [14:30] * ochosi thinks it's time for a coffee [14:30] Yeah, but there's the possibility of a gtk3 panel at least for 4.12 [14:30] ttyl [14:30] seeya ochosi [14:38] there's only a month and a half for the release of 12.10, the decision must be made in releasing it in the current state or postponing. [14:39] postponing would be better [14:39] but that's just my opinion [14:40] I would give more time for fixing the regressions and polish some functionality [14:59] pnarciso: release what in what state? [14:59] indicator-messages or the whole thing? [14:59] indicator-messages [15:00] ah right [15:01] well shipping it later would mean it's not in the default panel config [15:01] so most ppl wouldn't even notice if we got it working again later [15:01] (it's indicators, they're added automatically as long as they're not blacklisted in xfce4-indicator-plugin) [15:03] also the duplicate devices on thunar and desktop are also a problem [15:04] mr_pouit: yes, but it wouldn't get installed by default [15:05] they are not installed in the latest build [15:05] but if they were, and plugins were later fixed, wouldn't they show up [16:13] knome: I checked a whole bunch of pages - sent list to the list [16:15] knome: I never got a reply on ubuntu-doc (big surprise) but someone followed up directly with a doc team member and we can just submit MPs [16:16] pleia2: I see you get notification of changes - I tried to tick the trivial change box if it was just a word or something - but it still said you were getting them [16:17] elfy: yeah, I subscribe to trivial as well (have to, the spam bots only do trivial changes) [16:17] :( [16:17] sneaky bots [16:18] ohe yea - channel is logged ... sneaky bots [16:18] I'll tell you what I really think in -ooftopic :p [16:19] I copied the wiki front page to a m/l and made notes against it as to what I did today [16:19] thought a proper list people can note against on m/l would be a useful idea [16:19] yeah :) [16:21] * elfy has headache now [16:21] aww [16:21] copying the list out did show me that we are really quite close now :) [16:42] I've got my ubuntu-membership meeting today at 22:00 UTC :D Excited! [16:43] woot [16:43] where's your wiki then bluesabre [16:43] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeanDavis [16:49] Thanks for the testimonial elfy! [16:49] well I wrote something bluesabre - if it wasn't really late I'd pop along for moral support too [16:49] welcome [16:50] though I might anyway :p [16:51] :D [17:27] Guys quick question, is fluendo included on the 12.04 livecd as people say they can play mp3s from the livecd? [17:33]