[04:30] <ScottK> Note the comments: http://lwn.net/Articles/515350/#Comments
[04:30] <ScottK> All very nice for Kubuntu.
[07:00] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: would be nice to have indeed
[07:54] <kubotu> ::workspace-bugs:: [1050725] clicking on system tray spawns large empty window @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1050725 (by ill)
[07:54] <kubotu> ::workspace-bugs:: [1050776] kde4-window-decorator crashes when starting up @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1050776 (by Iven Hsu)
[08:25] <jussi> ubottu: ignore kubotu
[08:25] <jussi> tsimpson: any idea why that doesnt stay in place? 
[08:27] <tsimpson> jussi: because "ignore" is an Encyclopedia command, use Admin ignore add
[08:27] <jussi> oh pesh. 
[08:28] <tsimpson> and hopefully Bugtracker honours ignores...
[08:29] <tsimpson> actually, the ignore command should work (it's just a wrapper command)
[08:29] <tsimpson> ...I think...
[08:29] <tsimpson> oh, I know why
[08:31] <tsimpson> silly jussi, gateway/shell/ubottu/x-somerandomthing is random, you know
[08:53] <Riddell> mm, interesting, I guess this is good for kubuntu http://tech.slashdot.org/story/12/09/13/166203/ubuntu-nvidia-graphics-driver-windows-competitive-but-only-with-kde
[08:58] <inetpro> Riddell: well done!
[08:59] <Riddell> well dunno if a phoronix article about bugs in ubuntu is something to be celebrated
[09:00] <inetpro> hmm... :-)
[09:12] <Riddell> ScottK: FFe for your consideration in bug 1050463
[09:26]  * shadeslayer is very annoyed
[09:27] <Riddell> shadeslayer: what's up?
[09:27] <shadeslayer> my macbook pro
[09:27] <shadeslayer> I feel like tossing it off the roof
[09:28] <shadeslayer> I can *barely* get it to work like I want it to
[09:32] <shadeslayer> laptop gets *really* hot, no brightness control ( right now I echo values into /sys ), *some* fan control, no hw acceleration
[09:35] <apachelogger> Riddell: I believe mgraesslin has an opinion on that sort of story telling :P
[09:39] <shadeslayer> gosh, the XPS 13 sure is expensive
[09:42] <apachelogger> ...
[09:42] <apachelogger> and it has a supreme glossy screen
[09:42] <apachelogger> god I hate them screens
[09:42] <shadeslayer> mhmm
[09:42] <tazz> shadeslayer, we advised you against it. Now weep.
[09:42] <shadeslayer> I'm fine with a glossy screen
[09:43] <apachelogger> working outside is like the sun barfs all over the screen and you consequently go blind, what with the sun being bright and all that
[09:43] <shadeslayer> tazz: aye
[09:43] <apachelogger> http://www.novatech.co.uk/laptop/range/novatechnfinityn1402.html
[09:43] <apachelogger> that's what I plan on getting soonishy
[09:43] <tazz> get a Lenovo thinkpad X230
[09:44] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: Weight :
[09:44] <shadeslayer> 1.65KG
[09:44] <shadeslayer> pfffttt
[09:45] <apachelogger> the weight diff between this smoochy and the xp13 is not even an ipad
[09:45] <apachelogger> oh actually
[09:46] <apachelogger> mind that all of them ultrabooks have crapshit panels
[09:46] <apachelogger> where the xps13 has one of the better crapshit panels
[09:46] <apachelogger> if you want a sane screen you probably want to spend 2k eur
[09:46]  * shadeslayer tries his hand at compiling his own kernel
[10:33] <dav_> hi, i tried to upgrade to 12.10 beta but upgrading is not finished. Now I can't install updates and system works not fine. Some suggestion, please?
[10:34] <dav_> nothing?
[11:01] <Peace-> i would like know if there si klook 
[11:02] <Peace-> in 12.10
[11:03] <apachelogger> there is not
[11:03] <Peace-> mmm why not? :D
[11:41] <ScottK> Riddell: Commented?
[11:50] <kubotu> ::qt-bugs:: [1038636] package libqtcore4 4:4.8.1-0ubuntu4.2 failed to install/upgrade: conffile './etc/xdg/Troll... @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1038636 (by xabier)
[13:18] <shadeslayer> \o/
[13:18] <shadeslayer> I finally have compositing
[13:18] <shadeslayer> and no overheating
[13:18] <shadeslayer> had to compile my own kernel, but well worth the effort
[13:18] <Riddell> oh tsk release meeting
[13:19]  * Riddell forgot
[13:59] <apachelogger> http://wstaw.org/m/2012/09/14/plasma-desktopeo5369.png
[13:59] <apachelogger> le colors are le wrong
[13:59] <apachelogger> do we have a bug report about this?
[14:06] <Riddell> apachelogger: what's wrong with it?
[14:07] <Riddell> you prefer your fifty shades of grey?
[14:07] <apachelogger> yes
[14:08] <apachelogger> coherence I say
[14:08] <Riddell> there's no bug report, I think you're the main fifty shades of grey fan here, but go ahead and report one
[14:15]  * apachelogger was into grey brefore it was hyped -.-
[14:15] <apachelogger> hm
[14:16] <apachelogger> Riddell: did you notice the flat grey when starting the live cd selection screen?
[14:16] <apachelogger> appears for >1 second before the actual UI is rendered
[14:21] <apachelogger> http://wstaw.org/m/2012/09/14/plasma-desktopTJ2405.png
[14:21] <apachelogger> it appears logging out is a bad idea
[14:47] <Riddell> apachelogger: no users shown?
[14:47] <Riddell> I've not seen that
[15:00] <apachelogger> Riddell: actually I wonder how you'd get back to the selection screen
[15:00] <apachelogger> i.e. if you log out of the test session you should get back to that, not lightdm
[16:04] <apachelogger> !find pyuic4
[16:04] <apachelogger> !find pyuic
[16:04]  * apachelogger blinks
[16:04] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[16:05] <Riddell> it's in /usr/share/pyshared/PyQt4/uic/pyuic.py
[16:05] <Riddell> !find pyuic.py
[16:06] <Riddell> hmm
[16:08] <yofel_> !find pyuic.py precise
[16:09] <yofel_> jussi: somehow the quantal cache is broken ^
[16:10] <apachelogger> TypeError: Error when calling the metaclass bases
[16:10] <apachelogger>     metaclass conflict: the metaclass of a derived class must be a (non-strict) subclass of the metaclasses of all its bases
[16:10] <apachelogger> and they say gcc is cryptic
[16:22] <Riddell> Quintasan_: what's your nearest airport?
[16:23] <Peace-> Riddell: have you some plan to put klook on kubuntu 12.10?
[16:23] <Peace-> or users must use ppa even on 12.10
[16:23] <Riddell> Peace-: I don't know what it is
[16:23] <Peace-> lol
[16:23] <Riddell> what is it?
[16:24] <Peace-> Riddell: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xr4z53_dolphin-with-klook_tech
[16:25] <apachelogger> brrr
[16:25] <Peace-> apachelogger: :P
[16:25] <apachelogger> Riddell: runtime ui loading takes about 4 times as long as compiling to .py and loading that
[16:27] <Riddell> apachelogger: hmm fooey
[16:27] <Riddell> runtime loading is so much more elegant to the programmer
[16:27] <apachelogger> the good news is goign from runtime to buildtime is relatively straight forward
[16:28] <Riddell> apachelogger: are you looking at this with something in paticular in mind?
[16:28] <apachelogger> the bad new is that this is not the biggest bottleneck in ubiquity
[16:28] <xnox> hhmmm?
[16:28] <apachelogger> Riddell: it takes forever for ubiquity to draw the UI after startup
[16:29] <Riddell> yes might well be worth making that change
[16:29] <Riddell> but generally i think d-i will be the bottleneck
[16:29] <Riddell> looks like you hit xnox's highlight :)
[16:30] <apachelogger> also not background scaling apparently (though on an interesting note: in some runs loading the main ui file took as long as upscaling the background to 1680x1050)
[16:30] <Riddell> apachelogger: how are you measuring this?
[16:30] <apachelogger> Riddell: I dunno, it appears to me that something in specific WRT drawing is the problem
[16:30] <xnox> to restart greater session: stop lightdm; stop ubiquity; pkill -9 X; start ubiquity
[16:31] <xnox> to restart & be able to do "Try" option, do restart lightdm.
[16:31] <apachelogger> i.e. I get the main window (which is triggered by blahblahmainui.show()) and then only like 1-2 seconds after that appears the content
[16:31] <xnox> well reading ISO is slow.
[16:31] <xnox> plus we are faking the desktop session from scratch with ubiquity-dm
[16:31] <xnox> look into ubiquity-dm if you want to speed it up.
[16:31] <apachelogger> xnox: I can reproduce it on my regular install
[16:32] <xnox> apachelogger: strace it with timings. we do re-exec ubiquity =/
[16:32] <apachelogger> also everything should be set up at this point, so something is astray in the UI or Qt
[16:32] <xnox> so we hit python startup cost multiple times.
[16:32] <apachelogger> Riddell: ad timing ... QTime -> .start -> .elapsed
[16:33] <apachelogger> xnox: oh, while I have you here ... do you also have a flickering between ubiquity-dm and login-splash?
[16:34] <xnox> apachelogger: what login-splash? /me only does the gtk frontend and yes there is a flicker between "Try Ubuntu" and auto-login into desktop-session of ubuntu (kubuntu) user
[16:34] <apachelogger> yeah, that is what I meant
[16:45] <apachelogger> uha
[16:45] <Riddell> shadeslayer: ooh you backported libkolab, that'll keep people happy
[16:45] <apachelogger> Riddell: you did not backport the qt 4.8.2. without the patch?
[16:47] <Riddell> apachelogger: I've not backported qt 4.8.2 anywhere
[16:48] <apachelogger>  *** 4:4.8.2-0ubuntu5~precise1~ppa1 0
[16:48] <apachelogger>         500 http://ppa.launchpad.net/kubuntu-ppa/backports/ubuntu/ precise/main amd64 Packages
[16:48] <apachelogger> emit sigh
[16:48] <apachelogger> now my kate is broken
[16:48] <apachelogger> hooray
[16:48] <apachelogger> -.-
[16:51] <Riddell> hmm really
[16:59] <apachelogger> some please fix that
[17:00] <Tm_T> so looks like I do make it to UDS (:
[17:00] <apachelogger> actually
[17:00] <apachelogger> shadeslayer in particular please fix that
[17:00] <apachelogger> also that really means ASAP because I cannot use kate *at all*
[17:01] <Riddell> Tm_T: oh great, your first one isn't it?
[17:02] <Tm_T> my first time proper outside Finnish borders too
[17:02] <Riddell> Tm_T: careful, there be dragons
[17:03] <Tm_T> and I get paid for every day in the trip (:
[17:03] <Tm_T> so triple yay
[17:03] <Tm_T> Riddell: I like dragons (:
[17:04] <Riddell> Tm_T: what sort of sessions will you be interested in?
[17:05] <Tm_T> (KDE-)UX, enterprise server (virtualization etc, due to my work), IRC, and U-women related
[17:15] <Riddell> hmm battery about to die, that's what I get for working in a cafe
[17:16] <micahg> re libreoffice seed change, bug 1044657 is still a problem
[17:31] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: I'm working on too many things atm
[17:31] <shadeslayer> cannot handle more stuff
[17:31] <shadeslayer> Riddell: aye ;)
[17:32] <shadeslayer> also backported libkgapi
[17:32] <shadeslayer> kdepim-runtime needs all of that
[17:33] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: it is good that I cannot work on anything then
[17:33] <apachelogger> *shrug*
[17:34] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: more time to watch prn
[17:35] <Tm_T> oh, finnish IT magazine reviewed Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Lubuntu and Mint
[17:36] <shadeslayer> did we win
[17:36] <Tm_T> Kubuntu got highest scores (with Mint, but that doesn't count)
[17:36] <shadeslayer> yay
[17:36] <shadeslayer> cookies for everyone 
[17:36] <shadeslayer> kubotu: cookies for everyone
[17:36] <shadeslayer> bleh
[17:36] <apachelogger> Tm_T: oh please do tell more, I cannot work on anythign as shadeslayer broke my kate and refuses to fix it anyway
[17:37] <shadeslayer> how did I break things
[17:37] <shadeslayer> I didn't even touch qt4-x11
[17:38] <shadeslayer> infact, by the state of things, I've fixed so much on my MBP today
[17:38] <shadeslayer> temps at a all time low of 50 \o/
[17:39] <apachelogger> http://www.google.at/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&cad=rja&ved=0CE8QFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.linkedin.com%2Fpub%2Fdir%2FDaniel%2FChen&ei=QmtTUPCjBMvBtAa3_IC4Dg&usg=AFQjCNGnhe6rgc4hgmtk9f_5iId5Z20h3A&sig2=w-2pSVTUj-V2CFJQtbDlDw
[17:39] <apachelogger> eh
[17:39] <apachelogger> http://wstaw.org/m/2012/09/14/plasma-desktopDY2498.png
[17:39] <shadeslayer> oh hmm
[17:40] <shadeslayer> I don't remember back ... ahhh
[17:40] <Tm_T> apachelogger: well, it was quick review, they just told in general how they differ from each other (Unity simplified, Kubuntu configurable and extensible, Lubuntu lightweight but rough, Mint has codecs preinstalled), gave stars (Kubuntu got 4,5/5) and that's pretty much it
[17:40] <shadeslayer> that's because Mek wanted the latest Qt
[17:41] <apachelogger> Tm_T: why that's jolly boring :P
[17:41] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: k will upload to backports
[17:41] <Tm_T> apachelogger: yeah, here in the homeland of Linux, media, especially IT media, don't see Linux as something worth really caring
[17:42] <apachelogger> explains why the nvidia hater left I guess :S
[17:42] <Tm_T> it took long them to even admit it is an option vs commercial OS:s atleast in some cases
[17:42] <Tm_T> yeah
[17:45] <Tm_T> hmm I was reading the meeting notes
[17:45] <Tm_T> so which way it went, Calligra or LO?
[17:46] <jtechidna> final vote went LO, but with the caveat of looking to include krita and maybe kexi on the iso
[17:46] <ScottK> Yes.
[17:46] <Tm_T> ah, shame
[17:46] <ScottK> Tm_T: Tell the Calligra people to care about interoperability.
[17:46] <ScottK> That's what decided the vote, not the core of how good or bad it is.
[17:47] <Tm_T> ScottK: that's a word I'm not sure I understand, elaborate?
[17:47] <ScottK> Calligra can read, but not write MS office files.
[17:47] <Tm_T> not being able to write is an issue, yeah
[17:48] <micahg> ScottK: LO is still broke in quantal unless you have a global menu, might want to delay the meta upload until that's fixed
[17:48] <ScottK> When people working in offices or schools exchange files to work on, they are virtually always in some MS format, so Calligra is unusable in those environments.
[17:48] <ScottK> micahg: Too late.
[17:48] <Tm_T> ScottK: gladly here at work we use ODF as much as possible (:
[17:48] <ScottK> Tm_T: Sure, but that is truly an exception.
[17:49] <Tm_T> indeed
[17:49]  * Tm_T enjoys working on an open source house
[17:49] <ScottK> I'm a consultant and I deal with 100% MS Office shops in my work.
[17:49] <ScottK> Or even if they have people with Macs, the document exchange format is still MS Office.
[17:50] <JontheEchidna> anything outside the computer science department (which we ssh in to fedora boxes to submit assignments) requires Office format here at my uni
[17:50] <ScottK> I had to teach my kids a lot about file formats so they'd stop ending up at school with a thumb drive with their assignment on it in the wrong format.
[17:51] <Tm_T> JontheEchidna: I never understood that requirement on univ environments
[17:51] <ScottK> Tm_T: Most people don't even understand there are alternative formats or why they might want to use them.
[17:52] <Tm_T> ScottK: the thing is, teachers don't accept plaintext files, or html, or pdf, only ms formats
[17:52] <ScottK> For awhile, I tried sending both ODF and MS Office to customers as an educational campaign (I keep ODFs of everything locally), but then that tripped up on spam filters in one case and I gave up.
[17:52] <Tm_T> just because
[17:54] <ScottK> Well, when I went to university everything had to be typed, on 8 1/2" X 11" paper with (IIRC) 1" margins, double spaces, 12 point courier (because that's what typewriters do).  Just because.
[17:54] <shadeslayer> odf tripping spam filters?
[17:54] <shadeslayer> what sorcery is that
[17:54] <ScottK> Yep.
[17:54] <ScottK> Unknown mime type filter.
[17:54] <shadeslayer> >.>
[17:55] <ScottK> Once I figured out the problem I talked to the company's IT department long enough to get them to understand, but it turned out to be hard coded in their proprietary spam filtering system.
[17:55] <ScottK> So they filed a bug with the vendor and I quit sending them.
[17:55] <Tm_T> but still, the most ridiculous uses of MS Office in my career has been 1st grade kids, yes, 7 years old who are just learning alphabets
[17:56] <ScottK> I don't think we've got that, but the school district we're in is all Macs.
[17:56] <ScottK> Funny story about that.
[17:56] <ScottK> When my youngest was in (I think) first grade I got a netbook.
[17:56] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: 4.8.2 from quantal being uploaded into backports
[17:56] <shadeslayer> by backports I mean kubuntu backports :P
[17:57] <ScottK> Before blowing away Windows and installing Kubuntu netbook I wanted to make sure all the hardware worked, so I booted up.
[17:57] <ScottK> While I was in Windows, she walked by and said to me, "Daddy, what's that"?
[17:57] <ScottK> I started to explain about my new netbook, but she interrupted me.
[17:57] <shadeslayer> lol
[17:57] <ScottK> "No Daddy, I mean on the screen."
[17:58] <ScottK> She had no recollection of ever having even seen Windows.
[17:58] <shadeslayer> unfourtunately, people here don't care about the software they use :|
[17:59] <ScottK> Right, the two older kids reverted to proprietary O/S as soon as they were out of the house.
[17:59] <ScottK> First one to Windows, the second one to a Mac.
[17:59] <ScottK> The second one represents progress, because she didn't want Windows because it was insecure and she didn't trust MS.
[18:00] <shadeslayer> well ... I quite liked SnoLo
[18:00] <shadeslayer> Lion was a PoS
[18:00] <shadeslayer> s/was/is
[18:02] <ScottK> micahg: Actually, not too late, my meta upload got rejected (I messed up the distro).  Please let me know when it's fixed.
[18:02] <micahg> well,, probably next week when sweetshark gets back
[18:02]  * micahg won't be here Mon and Tue though
[18:21] <micahg> Bug #1050726 has a kubuntu user complaining about the 12.04.1 image size, can someone handle please?
[18:22] <ScottK> Ran into that myself.
[18:25] <apachelogger> Oo
[18:27] <ScottK> micahg: Done.
[18:27] <ScottK> i386 is about 400K too big to burn on a CD.
[18:28] <micahg> þanks
[18:28] <micahg> *thanks
[18:28] <ScottK> micahg: What happened to not leaving regressions unfixed and continually usable?
[18:28] <micahg> ScottK: good question, the regressioner went on vacation
[18:28] <micahg> maybe something for the release meeting...
[18:28] <ScottK> Well then let's revert it.
[18:28] <ScottK> Too late, already happened.
[18:29] <micahg> yeah, it should've been listed by the desktop team, but I guess it wasn't
[18:30] <micahg> The problem is I don't have a decent way to test build libreoffice, so I'm reluctant to upload it
[18:31] <micahg> (needs ~30G disk space)
[18:31] <ScottK> micahg: What's the bug on LO?
[18:31] <micahg> bug 1044657
[18:32] <micahg> there's a fix supposedly too
[18:32] <micahg> but I have no idea where it even is
[18:32] <micahg> maybe some desktopper can help
[18:37]  * micahg adds a note about kubuntu and moves the milestone
[18:38]  * micahg also comments in -release
[18:39] <micahg> ScottK: oh, it was in the desktop team's list
[18:46] <xnox> is kubuntu 12.04 an LTS release?
[18:46] <ScottK> Yes.
[18:46] <ScottK> 5 years.
[18:47] <xnox> ScottK: ok.
[18:48] <Tm_T> 5 years of awesomeness
[18:48] <ScottK> Tm_T: You're on 12.04?
[18:49] <Tm_T> yes, currently
[18:49] <Tm_T> will test upgrade to 12.10 some point soon, first on virtual copy of my env though
[18:49] <ScottK> Tm_T: Can you install 4.8.5 from precise-proposed and then comment in Bug  #1047417?
[18:51] <Tm_T> ScottK: my KDE is already on 4.9-series apparently
[18:51] <ScottK> Oh.  Nevermind then.
[18:52] <Tm_T> as KDE isn't mission critical to my work, I feel safe to follow Kubuntu ppas (:
[19:23] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: I think I know what happened with muon updater the other day ...  I didn't update my package cache right before I added proposed, so the stuff I thought was -proposed stuff not going away was actually -updates stuff I didn't know about before I added proposed.  Sorry for the noise.
[19:31] <shadeslayer> KDE 4.9.1 for precise built in ninjas
[19:31] <shadeslayer> plz2test
[19:32] <shadeslayer> I should really get that 12 Mbps connection
[20:11] <JontheEchidna> ScottK: thanks for the update
[20:40] <yofel_> apachelogger: did you commit any of the 4.9.1 uploads to bzr?
[20:40] <CIA-59> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kmix] Philip Muškovac * 16 * debian/changelog release version 4:4.9.1-0ubuntu1
[20:56] <CIA-59> [lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/kmix] Philip Muškovac * 17 * debian/ (3 files in 2 dirs) cherry pick upstream commit 0addbb2d9cea4bef7146ccd35527af6113664fd1 as upstream_fix-master-channel-selection.diff
[21:10] <apachelogger> yofel: I had them bash line'd or so I thought
[21:10]  * apachelogger notes that actively doing things on a remote machine far far away is a terrible idea though
[21:13] <kubotu> ::qt-bugs:: [1047664] xorg swaps some gigabytes and so system is not very responsive @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1047664 (by Michael Mueller)