/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/09/16/#xubuntu-devel.txt

=== TheMaster is now known as Unit193
knomehey elfy 09:56
elfyhi knome 10:04
knomeelfy, want to review a few more doc pages? :]10:06
smartboyhwlol10:06
elfyknome: I can - which ones 10:06
knomeelfy, let me see10:06
knomethese are not submitted by you, so these are the only ones you can still review:10:07
knome5/Photos and Cameras10:07
knome6/Network connections10:07
knome6/Troubleshooting10:07
knome7/Printing10:07
knome7/Scanning10:07
knomeand that's it10:08
elfyok10:08
knomethanks10:08
knomei'll try to get more converted to docbook today again10:08
smartboyhwIdentify yourselves guys chanserv is back10:09
* knome is still identified10:09
* elfy is too10:09
smartboyhwWell sure I didn't since I just joined and I can't identify when it is down mate10:10
* Unit193 is as always10:10
smartboyhwlol10:10
knomei suppose i should just start working with the docs...10:13
elfyknome - just checking for englisg/grammar etc - I can't check scanning or prinitng for it working 10:14
knomeelfy, yeah, that's fine, and if you can check that the app paths are correct as much as you can...10:15
knome(and menus)10:15
elfyyep :)10:15
elfyok - back in a bit then :p10:15
knomethanks!10:15
* knome goes converting another subsection to docbook10:15
elfyknome: you want to know in here which I have checked or on the pad? if the pad - what's the link again :p10:20
knomehere is fine at this stahge :10:20
knomestage and :P too10:20
elfyscanning is done10:21
smartboyhwelfy: You mean http://typewith.me/p/x-q-docs-checkout ?10:21
elfyknome: printing done, troubleshooting done - but if network connections is "network connections" then troubleshooting should be "network troubleshooting" logically10:45
knomeok, thanks10:46
knomei'll fix that for the docs10:46
elfyk10:46
elfyknome: network connections done10:53
knometa10:54
elfyknome: I've removed the image viewer bits that jackFromm temp struck out and that is all checked now too 11:02
knomein what? :)11:06
knomephotos/cams?11:06
elfyyea sorry - thought it would make sense as it was last one you asked me to check :)11:07
knomehehe, yeah11:07
knometa11:07
elfyshould be just quick guide and upgrading left in Table of Contents not bold I think11:08
knomeyep11:08
knomeand not much that isn't underlined ;)11:08
elfyunderlined is ? converting to docbooks? 11:09
knomeunderlined is converted11:09
knomeisap11:09
knomeheh11:09
elfycool11:09
knomethere goes my test-vbox pass :P11:09
elfylol11:10
elfyso anything you want me to look at today knome ? 11:19
knomeumm.. not really after you done those reviews, unless you want to go adventurous and build the docs :D11:19
elfy... 11:20
elfynot sure :p11:20
knomeyeah, you really don't need to11:21
elfyok lol 11:21
elfyI'll go hae lunch instead then :)11:21
knomeok, bon appetit :)11:22
knomehey jjfrv8 :)11:44
jjfrv8G'day.11:44
jjfrv8knome, Looks like you're almost there :)11:45
knomeyeah, almost11:46
knomehey bluesabre :)11:52
bluesabrehiya knome!11:52
elfyhi bluesabre 11:53
bluesabrehey elfy11:53
bluesabrehow is everyone today?11:53
knomegood11:53
elfyok now thanks 11:53
knomeworking on the docbook conversions again11:53
bluesabremaking good progress?11:55
knomequite11:55
knomecheck the wiki11:55
elfyknome: you not want upgrading and quick guide checked - or have they been done already11:56
knomeelfy, you've submitted them for review, so you can't review them ;)11:56
knomebluesabre could...11:56
bluesabrewowza11:56
Unit193I took a look at upgrading one.11:56
elfyaah - /me forgets stuff fairly quickly 11:56
Unit193+the11:56
bluesabrelooks like we're almost there11:56
knomebluesabre, exactly11:56
knomeUnit193, do you think it's ready to be published, or do you want somebody to still review it?11:57
bluesabreI can have a look at quick guide11:57
knomebluesabre, we should move the stuff in quick guide around11:57
knomesee how the internet -section is organized11:57
knomei mean, inside the guide11:57
Unit193knome: I think it was pretty much set, just made a couple changes.11:58
knomeUnit193, ok, i'll mark it as checked-out hten11:58
knomethen11:58
Unit193Wouldn't hurt I'm sure, having another look. :P11:58
knomewell, all the pages are not going to be perfect anyway11:59
knomeso we'll probably get bugs, and we can fix them for Q or R11:59
elfythat'll be a whole lot easier 12:02
knomedefinitely12:02
bluesabreknome, as far as moving things around, what are you shooting for with the other sections in the quick guide?12:03
knomei mean, the first word should be the application bolded12:03
knomeand the link should be at the end12:04
knomefeel free to disagree :)12:04
bluesabreok, I thought that was what you meant.  Just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything12:04
knomeheh, sure12:04
Unit193elfy: If you wanted to look at the diff, and see if I changed something in error? :P12:05
elfythere are 2 links in that page that go to empty pages - media applications adnd libreoffice12:05
elfyUnit193: if it's needed 12:06
knomeelfy, yeah, you can dismiss that12:06
elfydismiss or remove ?12:06
knomeLO is because the wiki markup (CamelCase creates links)12:06
knomeand media apps is fixed in docs12:06
knomeso just dismiss, it will be okay12:06
elfyI thought bluesabre was looking anyway - so I was just saying :)12:07
knomenp12:07
knomegood to make sure12:07
elfy:)12:08
bluesabreso that means you're not currently editing, right elfy?12:08
elfyyep12:08
bluesabreCool, thanks12:08
elfynot editing anything at all 12:08
knomeso update manager is "software updater" in Q?12:12
knomei need to fix that12:12
knomedone12:22
knomeok, all but 4 subsections converted12:23
* bluesabre wonders if we really need to link to the core xfce/gnome apps websites12:26
knomemaybe not12:26
bluesabreDone.  http://dagobah.princessleia.com/Xubuntu/12.10/Quick guide to default applications12:30
bluesabreBut yeah, who is honestly going to click the link for12:30
bluesabrePulseAudio, Dictionary, Evince, Orage, Gigolo, Task Manager12:31
bluesabrePulseAudio, maybe12:31
knomebluesabre, feel free to drop links you don't think are necessary12:31
knomeand i don't even know if we should specifically list task manager :P12:32
knome(unless we tell what it does, for starters)12:32
elfydoes not the name give it away 12:32
knomekind of12:33
knomebut doesn't every OS have one?12:33
elfyI'd have to assume so 12:33
bluesabreI'd imagine that if a user doesn't know what it is, it's probably better for them to not know about the Task Manager12:35
* smartboyhw will click Orage and PulseAudio if I'm a beginner...12:36
bluesabreYeah, I opted to not remove links12:36
bluesabreknome, elfy, others?  Wanna review the changes?12:46
* elfy can look12:46
elfylooks ok to me 12:48
knomelooks fine to me12:48
elfythough I wonder at the inclusion of Ibus - it's not to my knowledge mentioned anywhere else 12:49
knomeso isn't task manager ;]12:52
elfy:)12:52
bluesabreyeah, not sure about that one, but people might be curious as to what it is (now that I read that section, I finally know what its for)12:52
elfyand actually don't you have to install pavu? 12:54
elfynow I come to think about it12:55
bluesabreI have no idea12:57
elfynot in xubuntu-desktop so I assume not12:58
elfybut anyway - as it stands - it looks ok :)12:59
knometake that, docbook13:32
knomeonly one section left to convert13:33
bluesabrebooyah13:33
* smartboyhw adds oil on knome13:34
smartboyhwadd oil = give support:)13:34
olbihello16:24
olbiwho is responsible for translating slides during installation of Xubuntu 12.10? :)16:24
knomeolbi, the community16:54
SkippersBossknome, i send something through the e-mail list17:01
SkippersBossI was told i was blocked. Did you see it ??17:02
knomeSkippersBoss, i believe it's simply in the queue17:02
knomeSkippersBoss, have you subscribed to the list?17:02
SkippersBossthought i did17:03
SkippersBossits was my reactions towards the wish to scrap all outside references in the quick guide17:04
SkippersBoss:-)17:04
SkippersBosssorry smiley went ino wrong window17:04
knomeoh well17:05
knomeit's converted to docbook now :)17:05
SkippersBossnever mind then17:06
SkippersBossYour the boss17:06
SkippersBossI follow your lead here17:06
knomei think it's good to point to external stuff, especially if they offer more user support than our docs17:06
SkippersBossThat was my rationelle. Don't do double work17:07
pleia2knome: yay!17:08
SkippersBossa ms ghana17:08
SkippersBosswhen are you leaving17:08
pleia2october 10th17:09
olbiwhen will be updated Daily Builds LiveCD whith newest transaltions?17:09
knomepleia2, :)17:11
knomepleia2, now can you ask rocket2dmn to help us get the rest of the stuff done..17:12
micahgolbi: only if there are new upstream versions17:12
pleia2knome: if you put in a MP and send a mail to the -doc list, I can follow up on the thread I was talking to him on17:12
knomeMP?17:13
knomeoh, merge proposal17:13
pleia2yeah17:13
knomebefore doing that, i'd actually want somebody to look at our branch17:13
pleia2ok17:13
pleia2actually, I think you really should just put in the MP17:15
knomelol17:15
knomei'll look at that when i'm on my desktop17:15
pleia2it should auto-ping the people who may want to look at it, so they can just sit down, review, approve17:15
pleia2instead of sit down, review, email you back to do the MP, forget where they left off, review 2 days later...17:16
knomelol17:16
elfy:)17:16
olbi:]17:17
olbiwhat is the adress of document where I could test daily builds and types results?17:18
elfyhttp://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker17:18
elfythat one olbi ?17:18
pleia2disabled creation of new accounts on the wiki, now to do some cleanup17:19
olbiI mean same document in google docs which was with Xubuntu 11.10 :)17:20
knomehave i done it wrong, or why don't i have a merge proposal button in my branch overview17:21
pleia2hmm17:22
pleia2the link should say "Propose for merging"17:23
knomeyeah, no such link17:23
pleia2how did you check it out initially, bzr branch?17:23
knomei believe so yeah17:24
pleia2ok, I'll just send an email now and ask for some guidance17:27
knometa17:27
pleia2you're on the list right, no need to Cc:?17:28
knomeubuntu-doc?17:28
knomei'm not17:28
pleia2ok, I shall cc17:28
knomei hate docs >:)17:28
pleia2ok, sent17:29
pleia2haha17:29
knomeoh oh!17:34
knomei think i solved it17:34
pleia2oh good17:35
knomehmm, no17:35
knomemeh17:35
pleia2hehe17:35
knomehead hurts17:35
pleia2aw17:35
Unit193Less whiskey.17:35
knomeok, i think i fixed it17:42
knomeno?17:43
knome"not mergeable"17:43
pleia2hrm17:44
pleia2maybe it has something to do with /quantal not existing as an active branch17:44
pleia2I guess we'll just wait for help17:44
knomeoh my!17:49
knomehttps://code.launchpad.net/~knome/ubuntu/quantal/xubuntu-docs/new-docs/+merge/12458017:49
pleia2huh17:50
knomemeh. :)17:53
knomeso at least it's done now17:53
knomepleia2, do you want to update them? that branch you linked to doesn't exist anymore18:06
pleia2ok18:07
knomethanks18:07
pleia2oh good connor replied19:47
knomemmhmm19:49
knomei shall look...19:50
knomeaha19:51
knomepleia2, you still there?20:28
knomehey Book_em_Dano 20:36
Book_em_Danohey20:37
knomeso, what do you know about documentation building? :P20:37
Rocket2DMnknome, this is Connor21:04
knomehey Rocket2DMn! :)21:05
knomeso, i've pushed the changes to the branch21:05
knomeall the validation errors looks like gone now21:05
Rocket2DMnalright, give me a minute21:07
knomesure21:07
Rocket2DMndid you update pot files?21:08
knomemm, i'm not completely sure - possibly21:09
knomei can do that if that's the only missing thing21:09
Rocket2DMnno, you're not really supposed to touch them21:09
knomedoing 'make' still gives some warnings as i wrote in the mail21:09
knomeaha21:09
knomeok, so why does make create them? :P21:09
knome(there isn't even a make target that doesn't create them, but rebuilds the html and css)21:10
Rocket2DMni dont know very much about translations, not sure how they are supposed to get updated in our source, if at all.  translations are done through lp21:10
knomemm-hmm21:10
knomeyeah, i was wondering how they work too21:10
knomebut i can remove the .pots from the final version before MP21:10
Rocket2DMnhmm im not really the person to answer questions about the pot files, i never touch them21:12
knomeok... :)21:12
knomedo you know who is?21:12
Rocket2DMnive never actually worked with the xubuntu docs, mostly just the main ubuntu-docs and the serverguide21:12
Rocket2DMnmdke (Matthew East) is in charge of the docs team, he would probably know how they are handled.21:12
Rocket2DMnHe's the guy we need to update the branches too21:12
knomeubuntu-docs at least used to use the same stuff than xubuntu21:13
Rocket2DMnyeah it used to be in docbook, now its in mallard.  the proiject setup looks very similar to the older ubuntu-docs setup21:13
Rocket2DMnthe serverguide still uses docbook21:13
knomeyeah, it was really similar, but i've cleaned up a bit21:14
Rocket2DMnwe still have the problem of merging it back into our development branch21:14
knomewell, i noticed there were some problems earlier21:14
Rocket2DMnyou branched from lp:ubuntu/xubuntu docs rather than lp:xubuntu-docs right?21:14
knomei didn't even get a "merge proposal" link21:15
Rocket2DMnfrom what i gather, the latter just updates from the former whenever we do a release21:15
knomebut i simply pushed to different location, and now it allowed me to propose the merge21:15
knomei can't remember which one i originall branched tbh, it's quite a lot of time21:15
pleia2Rocket2DMn: hey, thank you!21:15
Rocket2DMnpleia2, long time no see.  you're welcome21:16
Rocket2DMnknome, i assume you deleted files as part of this process?21:16
knomeRocket2DMn, yeah, quite a lot actually21:17
knomeRocket2DMn, i was wondering if i deleted something we needed, but i don't think so21:18
Rocket2DMnim just trying to figure out the best way to get your changes merged, give me a few minutes to play around21:20
knomesure, and please tell me if i can help in any way21:20
Rocket2DMnknome, how familiar are you with bzr?21:30
knomemediocre21:31
Rocket2DMnhmm21:32
Rocket2DMni'm trying to decide if i should do this in one commit or two.  since we're gonna blow everything away that's currently there, it might be safer to delete everything first, commit, then merge21:33
Rocket2DMnsince these branches don't have a common ancestor, i get conflicts everywhere when i merge, which is expected, i'm just not entirely sure i am resolving them properly21:33
knomedeleting first sounds okay to me21:34
knomewe don't want to migrate anything from the old branch anyway21:34
knome(and we'll always have the history)21:34
Rocket2DMnit might be better to have mdke just create a new lp:xubuntu-docs branch from scratch21:34
Rocket2DMnthen we can dump everything there with a clean history21:34
knomeeverything goes for me, as long as we can do this before docfreeze and beta2freeze21:34
Rocket2DMni can commit what i have, but i'm going to email Matthew to see how he wants to do it.  i'd suggest a branch new branch since we're basically starting over21:35
knomesure21:36
knomeand again, if you need anything from me...21:36
Rocket2DMnknome, i sent an email to Matthew.  You can find him in #ubuntu-doc but he is away most of the time21:50
knomethanks, i'll join21:51
Rocket2DMnif you idle on IRC, you can probably send him a message and wait.  He lives in Europe I think, so it may be difficult to get ahold of him in the late afternoon/evening21:51
knomehuh, idle 60 days21:51
knomei live in EU too. :)21:51
Rocket2DMn60 days, nice21:51
Rocket2DMnah ok, then you may have better luck getting ahold of him than i usually do21:51
knomemmh, maybe, if he isn't planning to be idle the next 60 days too ;)21:52
Rocket2DMnok, well i'll idle on IRC for awhile, but i am stepping afk, i'll check back periodically21:55
knomeok, have fun and thanks!21:56
knomeRocket2DMn, just updated the branch; removed the .pots and did some more cleanup22:13
ochosihi everyone22:24
Book_em_Danoknome, I have a question about the images that are supposed to appear inline on the docs, this may not be a high priority topic given what you are trying to accomplish as of yet22:31
knomeBook_em_Dano, yes?22:32
Book_em_Danothe images are not appearing, what are you using to render the xml files22:32
knomegedit :P22:32
knomei wonder if the latest "fixes" broke them then22:33
knomeBook_em_Dano, i can see them.22:34
knomeBook_em_Dano, are you building the docs in a different way or sth?22:34
Book_em_DanoI've been using yelp to render the source code22:35
knomeaha, i don't know about yelp. i've been building the docs with the Makefile22:35
knome(just run make in the root, and look at "build")22:35
Book_em_Danoonce the package is built, you are using the html files22:35
knomeyes22:35
knomethose html files do show me the images22:36
ochosiknome: what viewer are we using for our docs atm? (haven't bothered to use them in a looong time)22:41
knomeochosi, for the offline docs? $default_browser22:41
ochosiso ff in our default case22:42
knomeyes22:42
ochosimmhm22:42
* ochosi wonders whether there'd be a better solution for that22:42
knomewhat do you mean?22:42
ochosidunno, a slimmer browser22:42
knomea better browser, or a better way to work with the docs?22:42
ochosii mean yelp is dedicated to docs22:42
knomemm-hmm22:43
ochosibut otoh it's not very slim22:43
knomemidori :P22:43
knomei don't really know if we need yet another browser22:43
knomeff works fine22:43
ochosieither that, or a tiny gtk-html implementation22:43
knomeok, it's slow, but so what?22:43
knomeyou're not going to need to refer to the docs all the time22:43
knomethey aren't even so extensive you could22:43
ochosiyeah, but still, imo it's always nice to have an efficient solution for one usecase22:44
knomekind of, but in a way it again feels a bit unnecessary, since we already have FF for browsing and viewing html files22:44
knomeif we want to be lighter, let's switch firefox22:45
knomewhy does amazon "recommend" me something that is on my wishlist?22:46
ochosiheh22:46
ochosiyeah, tbh switching ff would work for me22:46
ochosiat least if we also switch to a different mailclient22:46
knomeheh22:47
knomei'm still fine with that if people do thorough comparison reports22:47
micahgFWIW, dropping yelp would be great as it would drop some more unneeded GNOME stuff22:48
micahg(including gnome-user-docs)22:48
ochosi+1 as our docs don't use yelp that'd be great22:49
knomeyeah, but something does use yelp, right?22:49
ochosignome apps use yelp for their docs22:49
knomeyeah22:49
knomewould it suck if gnome apps didn't have help?22:50
knomewell, kind of, if they aren't pulling yelp in at all..22:50
ochosihaven't looked, but it'd be at least evince, simplescan...22:51
ochosian alternative would be to also use yelp for our docs22:52
knome:F22:52
* ochosi sees potential up and downsides there22:53
ochosiit'd prolly be worth to talk to folks like j1mc bout that23:01
knomeyeah, and i think it might have been worth thinking if we want to step away from docbook too23:02
knome(the answer is now: you are free to do it, but i'm not helping :P)23:02
knomebut might've been different 6 months ago23:02
ochosiyeah i can see why now is a bad time to talk about that23:03
knomenow, or even for S23:04
knomei don't see any reason why we'd migrate away, since docbook, once converted, does not need a specialized application to browse23:04
knomeand our situation now is quite good, the docs should be pretty up-to-date and all23:05
ochosiyup23:06
ochosiupdating my quantal testbox now to see what awaits us in b223:11
knome:)23:33
ochosistrange, somehow greybird's xfwm4 didn't get installed...23:34
knomehmm? :)23:34
ochosireinstalling the pkgs now23:35
knomeheh, monday's first mail23:36
knomenot to us, but neighbours23:36

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