[00:27] <balloons> not quite sm
[12:57] <silverarrow> I have put in one extra GB in my iBook
[12:57] <silverarrow> ram I mean
[14:08] <balloons> ping njin
[16:21] <elfy> balloons: I've been looking at the testcases for arm - should they not say boot with sdcard?
[16:22] <balloons> elfy -- ohh!
[16:22] <balloons> I was just going through the list of what's needing updating
[16:23] <elfy> I'll be going through them properly tomorrow - now I can finally get back on track lol
[16:24] <balloons> I was thinking of putting the stuff needing done on the wiki to help coordinate everyone -- thoughts?
[16:28] <elfy> sounds like a plan to me
[16:30] <balloons> k, I'll do that now and we can make sure the ARM updates land in there too
[16:31] <elfy> yep
[16:36] <silverarrow> so old toad?
[16:40] <Ade> Hello everyone. I am looking for a little advice on how I can get involved with helping contribute to Ubuntu. Is there anyone around who could answer a few questions for me?
[16:41] <silverarrow> just post them
[16:41] <balloons> Ade, fire away
[16:41] <silverarrow> :-)
[16:42] <silverarrow> all you need to do is have a computer you can set aside for testing, and install the daily builds
[16:42] <Ade> Cheers guys, basically I am a university student in my second year studying computing and software development. I have been using Ubuntu on and off for 18 months or so now and would like to get involved for more enjoyment, experience and of course to help others...
[16:44] <silverarrow> I joined the testing team when I heard they needed people with ppc hardware
[16:44] <Ade> ... I initially thought being a developer in Ubuntu was the way forward and then helping with triaging bug but have found that all to difficult to really get into straight off. Do you think being involved in QA would be a little easier to start with and if so how do I get the ball rolling so to speak?
[16:47] <silverarrow> I`m not clever enough to fix any bugs, but I can report back problems I bump into
[16:47] <Ade> I have a couple old laptops and am familiar with installing VM machines, would that be adequate?
[16:47] <balloons> Ade, you can certainly get invovled in QA
[16:47] <balloons> yes.. image testing via an old machine you have is a great way to get started
[16:48] <balloons> if possible, you can also install the development version of ubuntu and use it.. helping to test specific applications, or reporting bugs you find by running the OS yourself
[16:48] <balloons> on our wiki there's a little info on 'getting invovled'
[16:48] <balloons> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam
[16:49] <balloons> do you have a precise installation?
[16:49] <balloons> elfy, how does this look? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/QuantalTestcaseUpdates
[16:50] <Ade> I have used 10.04 for ages and ages now and threw the latest (12.04) on a VM machine a while ago to see what the UI was like because the pictures of it looked awesome.
[16:51] <silverarrow> 12.04 should run fine
[16:52] <Ade> I have also been spending a couple hours browsing the wiki and making note. So best advice is to join the mailing list and jump right in :o)
[16:52] <balloons> Ade, ahh yes 10.04 :-)
[16:52] <balloons> 12.04 is the latest LTS, and indeed should run just fine for you
[16:52] <balloons> unity has come a long way since intoduction
[16:53] <balloons> Ade, yes, jumping in, asking questions and trying things out is a great way to get started
[16:53] <balloons> the walkthroughs on the wiki can help give you an idea of how things work..
[16:53] <balloons> being on the mailing list will help you stay in touch with what's going on right now
[16:53] <balloons> you'll want to dedicate a machine (virtual or real) for running the development version of ubuntu
[16:54] <Ade> Ok, great. Would you advise doing a little bug triaging concurrently, would that be of any benefit to my learning??
[16:54] <balloons> and you can do your first task as part of installing it on the machine using the isotracker :-)
[16:54] <elfy> balloons: looks fine till I see my name next to it :p
[16:54] <balloons> elfy, haha.. just for you!
[16:55] <Ade> eh... isotracker?? Newbie alert! lol
[16:55] <balloons> Ade, indeed.. no worries though
[16:56] <balloons> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/QATracker
[16:56] <Ade> Ok... am reading and learning as we speak.. I now know what isotracker is!
[16:57] <Ade> Thanks balloons!
[16:58] <balloons> no problem
[16:58] <balloons> feel free to ask questions, and don't be afraid to dive in
[17:00] <silverarrow> battery indicator in lubuntu is totally off
[17:00] <Ade> That's exactly what I am going to do right now :o) Will also read the wiki's a little more in depth and get to grips with things. Thanks for the advice
[17:01] <silverarrow> do you feel we should stick with 12.04?
[17:01] <silverarrow> I want the latest really
[17:02] <silverarrow> hoping some bugs are fixed with apps
[17:02] <silverarrow> new versin of software I mean
[17:03] <balloons> silverarrow, are you asking if you should upgrade to 12.10 now or not/
[17:03] <balloons> ?
[17:03] <silverarrow> no, I am doing that anyhow
[17:04] <silverarrow> I just wondered if there was any need for reporting and testing in the long term release
[17:05] <balloons> ahh I see
[17:05] <balloons> there is one testing event going on
[17:05] <balloons> it invovles testing the quantal kernel on precise
[17:05] <balloons> see here: http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/223/builds
[17:48] <Ade> When going into the ISO tracker, could someone please tell me the difference between precise and quantal? Which one should I be using?
[17:49] <kanliot> ade, i need more information
[17:49] <kanliot> why are you testing?
[17:50] <balloons> Ade, those are the releases
[17:50] <balloons> precise is the current stable release
[17:50] <balloons> quantal is the current development release
[17:50] <balloons> our testing primarily focuses on the development release of ubuntu
[17:52] <Ade> Yes, kanliot I am about to do my first test :o)
[17:52] <kanliot> what are you going to test
[17:53] <kanliot> or do you want to join the testing team?
[17:53] <Ade> Thanks balloons, have gone through the procedures wiki and even brushed up on how to report a bug correctly - wish me luck lol
[17:53] <kanliot> different topic: balloons, do you have a boss in qa, or are you mostly limited to the community side?
[17:53] <balloons> good luck!
[17:54] <balloons> kanliot, I'm unsure what you mean.. I do community QA (which means I get to interact with you :-) )
[17:54] <balloons> there is a QA team @ canonical.. they do work on products that come from canonical
[17:54] <Ade> Both kanliot (although I joined the team about an hour ago).
[17:55] <balloons> if you are asking if I am officially connected to them, the answer is no
[17:55] <balloons> I work under the great and powerful jono
[17:55] <kanliot> i'm talking about the update-manager bug
[17:56] <kanliot> so if you escalate the bug
[17:56] <kanliot> you'd escalate to jono
[17:57] <kanliot> well i'm officially asking you to escalate it
[17:57] <kanliot> i know i am very new to qa
[17:57] <kanliot> but i'm still askin
[17:58] <kanliot> and i hope your tuesday is a good one balloons
[17:58] <kanliot> :)
[17:59] <balloons> kanliot, I was looking @ that bug again this morning
[17:59] <balloons> I haven't forgotten about you
[17:59] <balloons> sadly I wasn't around last friday to raise it
[17:59] <kanliot> they all say that
[17:59] <kanliot> ;)
[18:00] <balloons> However, I know the team behind update-manager
[18:00] <kanliot> did i tell you about the time i was put on hold at tell
[18:00] <kanliot> for 24 hours?
[18:00] <kanliot> s/tell/Dell
[18:00] <balloons> really? the phone connection stayed on that long?
[18:00] <kanliot> yup
[18:00] <balloons> lol
[18:00] <balloons> you weren't awake, so how'd it happen?
[18:01] <kanliot> came into work the next day
[18:01] <kanliot> still on hold
[18:01] <kanliot> :)
[18:01] <balloons> did you ever get to chat with someone?
[18:01] <kanliot> someone's average call time took a hit
[18:01] <balloons> it got crushed!
[18:02] <kanliot> the only thing i remember
[18:02] <kanliot> is this lady with a heavy african-american accent
[18:02] <kanliot> saying, "You got no bizness installing that hardware in your computer"
[18:02] <kanliot> it really took me aback
[18:03] <kanliot> but that was her stock answer for my problem
[18:03] <kanliot> like i just installed a new sound card and it ... "well you got no business installing..."
[18:08] <balloons> no biz-i-NESS!
[18:09] <kanliot> bidness
[18:09] <Ade> How many people use testdrive when performing their tests?
[18:10] <balloons> ade I used it on my first test, and continue to do so
[18:10] <balloons> it's handy for vm testing
[18:10] <balloons> obviously I still do some things manually as it doesn't cover testing on my hw
[18:13] <Ade> May I ask what your typical testing procedure is balloons? I figured I can vm test a lot easier than manually testing but what extra steps would I then need to take?
[18:13] <Ade> Also can ALL tests be done on a vm, or only select ones?
[18:14] <balloons> you can run everything in a VM
[18:14] <balloons> for some types of testing, real hw is preferable
[18:14] <Ade> Apologies for like a billion stupid questions lol
[18:14] <balloons> vm's are great for learning
[18:14] <balloons> I'd start there
[18:14] <Ade> Ok, will do.
[18:20] <kanliot> hmm the docs team is complaining about the lateness of added Dash features
[18:20] <kanliot> on the ubuntu-docs mailing list
[18:20] <kanliot> Interesting.
[18:29] <phillw> kanliot: as it leaves them 24 hours to do a lot of work, I'm not suprised!
[18:30] <phillw> quite what the translations team make of all this... pass :/
[18:30] <kanliot> aye
[18:42] <balloons> wow
[18:42] <balloons> hey phillw
[18:42] <balloons> did you see I signed you up for some stuff?
[18:46] <phillw> not yet, I've not read the email as yet!
[18:46] <phillw> just been doing some more work on the QA wiki.
[18:47] <phillw> Every time we get a new person join, it makes me spend some more time on it until I get dragged off :)
[18:47] <elfy> he's doing it all over phillw :|
[18:47] <phillw> balloons: s-tgraber is hopeful to have the new css in for test cases in over the weekend.
[18:47] <phillw> elfy: I'm as guilty!
[18:48] <elfy> phillw: not with me your not :)
[18:48] <balloons> lol
[18:48] <phillw> elfy: I think you sorted jasono out for his forum access (well, one of the forum admin / staffers did).
[18:49] <elfy> not me
[18:49] <phillw> as long as it was done :)
[18:50] <elfy> :)
[19:31] <elfy> balloons: you used gparted at all lately?
[19:32] <elfy> or anyone in fact :)
[19:33]  * patdk-wk uses it alittle
[19:34] <balloons> hmm
[19:34] <balloons> yes, I use it to mess about with partitions for arm testing
[19:34] <balloons> so it's been maybe 2 weeks since I ran it
[19:35] <elfy> does it mount everything it can and spawn file manager windows everywhere?
[19:35] <elfy> and then make you shout a lot ...
[19:36] <elfy> say you have 2 partitions on a stick - unmount one, then it refreshes - that's good, then unmount another - it refreshes and remounts the previous one
[19:37]  * elfy wonders if it is maybe tied up with the mad double partition's showing in xubuntu 
[19:37] <patdk-wk> doens't do that for me
[19:38] <elfy> mmm - been doing it for me for a while now - but possibly 'since' I started getting this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thunar/+bug/1039375
[19:43] <patdk-wk> I don't know thunar, and don't use xubuntu
[19:44] <patdk-wk> so maybe that is why?
[19:44] <elfy> :)
[19:53] <balloons> hmm
[19:53] <balloons> yea, also works fine for me elfy
[19:54] <elfy> ok - ubuntu I assume
[19:56] <elfy> I'm assuming/guessing that it is tied up with that other thing - my /media is also full of old references to not even alive disk references as well
[20:10] <noskcaj> testdrive doesn't let me allocate more than 1gb of ram to the vm, how can i put that amout up?
[20:13] <balloons> noskcaj, you can manually adjust after the vm launches
[20:13] <balloons> probably could look at submitting a patch to the gui to allow for custom entries or up the options :-
[20:14] <noskcaj> how? is this in qemu or virtualbox
[20:14] <balloons> virtualbox
[20:14] <balloons> all testdrive will do is create a vbox vm
[20:14] <noskcaj> i shall try that
[20:14] <balloons> you can always adjust it
[20:15] <noskcaj> thanks
[20:15] <balloons> it will be named testdrive-0, testdrive-1, etc
[20:15] <balloons> np :-)
[20:54] <knome> hey balloons :)
[20:54] <knome> i'm looking at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/QuantalTestcaseUpdates and thinking all the xubuntu-related work items are done
[20:54] <knome> if you think that's wrong, can you shed some light on what we are still missing? :)
[20:57] <noskcaj> do we need a lvm+encription testcase as well as them separately?
[20:58] <balloons> knome, I'd agree actuallyt
[20:58] <balloons> I wasn't sure on the post-case stuff..
[20:58] <balloons> but looks done too
[20:58] <balloons> :-)
[20:58] <balloons> your just so quick
[20:58] <knome> yeah, i did that
[20:58] <knome> hah ;)
[20:59] <balloons> your welcome to help out in the other areas :-) the 2 new testcases are up for grabs for someone from the admin team :-)
[21:00] <knome> humph
[21:00] <balloons> you know I have to ask.. but you've done a ton
[21:00] <balloons> I'm going to bank on your help though for post beta2
[21:00] <balloons> to finalize the dt work
[21:00] <knome> yeah, well, i'm afraid i don't have time before beta2 freeze, but after that should work a bit better
[21:00] <knome> now that i say that, it probably won't :P
[21:01] <knome> but i'll just stay up later a few nights :P
[21:01] <balloons> knome, btw, you saw the outcome of the changes right?
[21:01] <balloons> http://packages.qa.dev.stgraber.org/qatracker/milestones/225/builds/16296/testcases/1305/results
[21:01] <balloons> looks good!
[21:01] <knome> no, i didn't :)
[21:02] <knome> still not at iso.qa :<
[21:02] <balloons> later this week.. it's going in with some other changes
[21:02] <knome> yeah
[21:02] <balloons> then we can convert things
[21:02] <knome> i hope before b2f
[21:02] <balloons> post-beta2, but before final is the hope
[21:03] <knome> i've been talking with a guy in the local uni, and we might get up to 60 tests for xubuntu b2, and i wouldn't want them to look at the non-styled version... ;)
[21:03] <phillw> knome: the alternates will be done ( I've done 2 out of three) - they are flavour agnostic.
[21:06] <balloons> hurray for agnostic testcases!
[21:06] <balloons> this is seriously so exciting
[21:07] <noskcaj> is there anything else i could do since the xubuntu stuff is done?
[21:09] <balloons> ohh. hello jackson ;-)
[21:09] <balloons> <-- nskaggs
[21:09] <balloons> yes, you can still help out verifying the testcases
[21:09] <phillw> balloons: I'm just going to take a break for a bit while my eyes settle down. Just got entire disk with encryption to do.
[21:09] <knome> phillw, we don't have an alternate :)
[21:10] <phillw> knome: oh, you boys dropped it as well?
[21:10] <balloons> I'll have several new testcases.. so does phillw
[21:10] <knome> phillw, yeah
[21:10] <balloons> checking for errors would be marvelous
[21:10] <balloons> things like readability, etc
[21:10] <phillw> we still need it for low RAM machines,
[21:10] <knome> phillw, we kind of need it too but... :)
[21:11] <knome> phillw, we'll just point them to you then.
[21:11] <phillw> knome: by all means, our next massive headache is getting a ppc iso to work, as we're the only ones taking it on for 12.10 :(
[21:12] <balloons> ok -- I've got to step away for about an hour.. I'll be back later
[21:12] <phillw> I'll catch you later balloons i'm also going to rest my eyes and brain!
[21:12] <balloons> phillw, sounds excellent!
[21:13] <balloons> noskcaj, I'll ping you when I've got something foryou to look at
[21:13] <balloons> should be tonight/tomorrow
[21:13] <balloons> ohh
[21:13] <balloons> noskcaj, also, if you want, you can create the desktopmemtest and desktoprecuse cases
[21:13] <knome> phillw, good luck
[21:14] <balloons> noskcaj, http://testcases.qa.ubuntu.com/Install/AlternateMemTest and http://testcases.qa.ubuntu.com/Install/AlternateRescue
[21:14] <balloons> we need 'desktop iso' versions of these
[21:14] <balloons> they should be pretty much the same, but need to be in our new format instead of the wiki
[21:15] <phillw> noskcaj: however, balloons has been known to tell fibs :P
[21:15] <phillw> notice carefully the use of the word *should* :D
[21:31] <noskcaj> i will work on that then
[21:33] <noskcaj> balloons: the memtest page doesn't exist
[21:34] <noskcaj> balloons: should i just do case res-001 from the rescue page?
[21:47] <noskcaj> the rescue page is http://typewith.me/p/xw7jvQq1Tm
[21:48] <knome> balloons, staged the new wikipage for the new format at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/TestCaseFormat/NewDL
[21:55] <noskcaj> how do you get the rescue thing to come up?
[21:58] <phillw> thanks knome, I saw earlier that s-tgraber does have the new ccs on his list of things to do as soon as he gets a bit of time :)
[21:58] <knome> phillw, yup, and np
[22:08] <balloons> k back
[22:08] <balloons> sorry :-)
[22:09] <balloons> knome, excellent, thanks for creating that
[22:09] <knome> np
[22:10] <phillw> balloons: the 3 alt's are done and the typo on all three has been corrected :P
[22:10] <balloons> hehe
[22:10] <balloons> are they ready to go?
[22:11] <phillw> it was actually on the master ones... I C & P'd sentances over :D
[22:11] <phillw> balloons: they are both on staging and live area.
[22:11] <phillw> *on both*
[22:12] <phillw> called lubuntu on staging, just alternate on live.
[22:13] <phillw> yeah, ready to roll. I'll ask L-QA people to idiot check them for me, as they are alternates!
[22:13] <phillw> ..
[22:15] <balloons> k
[22:15] <balloons> noskcaj, hey
[22:15] <noskcaj> hey
[22:15] <balloons> phillw, ok, so I'll push them live right now :-)
[22:16] <balloons> noskcaj, sorry I was afk for a bit there
[22:16] <noskcaj> wht am i meant to do with the repair?
[22:16] <balloons> rescue mode?
[22:17] <noskcaj> yeah
[22:17] <noskcaj>  i dont know how to get into it
[22:18] <balloons> phillw, should be live now
[22:18] <balloons> ahh, yes, let me boot a desktop iso, to make sure nothing has changed :-)
[22:19] <balloons> noskcaj, ohh wow.. I'm not seeing it etheir
[22:19] <noskcaj> bug?
[22:19] <balloons> hmm.. come to think of it, I seem to remember them potentially removing it from the cd
[22:20] <balloons> There is a lovely check disc option ;-)
[22:20] <balloons> we should have a case for that
[22:20] <noskcaj> also the memory link is broken, the page doesn't exist
[22:20] <noskcaj> yes
[22:21] <noskcaj> i have to go to school now, i will finish it later
[22:21] <noskcaj> bye
[22:21] <balloons> noskcaj, k
[22:43] <phillw> balloons: not sure if it is worth mentioning the w3schools link on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/TestCaseFormat/NewDL so people can have a play and see the results immediately?
[22:43] <phillw> balloons: oops, sorry ... you have mail :D
[22:43] <knome> phillw, the problem is that <dl> isn't styled like that by default
[22:44] <knome> i've actually even cheated the wiki with tables and all that to make it look like like it looks after our custom css in the ISO tracker
[22:44] <phillw> knome: so http://www.w3schools.com/tags/tryit.asp?filename=tryhtml_dd_test is no use?
[22:44] <knome> not really
[22:44] <knome> as you can see
[22:45] <knome> for example, it doesn't create numbering automatically
[22:45] <knome> well, that does give an overview how it'll look
[22:47] <phillw> I'm not a css person, I can do the basics for a site and that's it :D
[22:47]  * knome is
[22:48] <phillw> I still use xhtml4-strict with AAA accessibility. One of these days I will take the time out to learn html5
[22:48] <knome> xhtml 1 or html 4? :D
[22:49] <phillw> xhtml1 - Been that long since I did site coding, I'd even forgotten that :P
[22:49] <knome> heh, yeah.
[22:49] <knome> html 5 is much looser on syntax than xhtml (it doesn't try to be xml)
[22:50] <knome> and it has some new cool things, like html-native video embedding
[22:51] <phillw> can the screen readers 'read' it?
[22:51] <knome> i think there's fallbacks for that
[22:52] <phillw> e.g. orca and NVDA
[22:52] <knome> have to say i'm not too familiar with the screenreader stuff, as i mostly do not need to actively think how i'll get that working
[22:53] <phillw> Okies, I'm a big fan of accessibility.
[22:53] <wxl> i guess i should show up at the meeting since you're going to be discussing failing pc, eh, phillw ?
[22:53] <wxl> s/pc/ppc/
[22:53] <phillw> wxl: you are welcome at any QA meeting!
[22:54] <wxl> i know, i know :)
[22:54] <phillw> as are all of L-QA
[22:54] <wxl> can you save me the trouble of looking at the fridge and let me know when? :)
[22:54] <phillw> 14:00 UTC Wed 19th Sep
[22:56] <phillw> hmm, I've broken my footer on the site, a closing tag has fallen off.....
[22:56] <knome> oopsie. :)
[22:57] <phillw> well, it not getting done toniight... must have been like that for months!
[23:01] <wxl> yikes 7am; i might not be very present
[23:03] <phillw> yeach, that's really bc for you!
[23:03] <wxl> XD
[23:04] <phillw> 3 pm for me :)
[23:04] <wxl> the worst part of it is usually then i'm scrambling to get the daughter to school
[23:04] <phillw> wxl: no worries, we have the list of bugs!
[23:04] <wxl> where are you nowadays?
[23:05] <phillw> North West England (Manchester / Liverpool area).
[23:05] <wxl> oh der you're only an hr off; that makes sense
[23:05] <phillw> yup, we on BST atm
[23:06] <wxl> PDT here still
[23:06] <wxl> er no PST
[23:06] <wxl> sorry
[23:06] <wxl> i hate this daylight savings garbage
[23:06] <phillw> or, as it has been called this year .... BRT (British Raining Time)
[23:06] <wxl> hehehe
[23:07] <wxl> i was going to say we don't get much daylight anyways in the pacific northwest. it's kind of like trying to save money when you have no income.
[23:07] <phillw> We don't get that much Summer :P
[23:09] <phillw> But.... they did finally cancel the hose pipe ban... This did take area of England to be under 4 foot of water though!
[23:09] <phillw> *areas*
[23:09] <wxl> hose pipe ban?!
[23:09] <wxl> large sodas are not outlawed in nyc
[23:10] <wxl> not that i'm a big soda fan but that's some funny stuff
[23:10] <wxl> that's how i upgraded a few of mine
[23:10] <wxl> oops wrong chanenl as usual :/
[23:11] <phillw> oh, yeah... the winters have been drier than usual for a few years and the aquifiers were not recharging.
[23:11] <phillw> lol
[23:41] <wxl> phillw: where were those seed files you pointed me at once?
[23:41] <phillw> wxl: I've slept since then!
[23:43] <wxl> thank you irc logs found it
[23:43] <phillw> I was digging email archive :)
[23:46] <phillw> anyways.... 00:45 here, my eyes are tired and so it is time for bed!
[23:53] <balloons> phillw, going to bed on time?
[23:53] <balloons> excellent chap! sleep well
[23:54] <knome> lol, "on time", what's that?