jhansonxiderekv: I love netbooting LiveCD/DVDs so a distro change is only an <alt><sysrq><b> away.  Good for demoing DEs.02:10
jhansonxiI wish that distros other than Debian-based supported netbooting with NFS mounting.  Most just want the entire ISO dumped into initrd and served over TFTP.  Way too slow.02:11
derekvjhansonxi: virtualbox03:40
jhansonxiderekv: Netbooting also allows me to test distro compatibility with target hardware before installation.  Also good for repairs.03:41
snap-lGood morning11:44
=== brousch1 is now known as brousch
jrwrengood mornin12:36
snap-lbrousch: http://reinout.vanrees.org/weblog/2012/09/18/vagrant.html <- I'm amused this is becoming more prevalent.12:36
brouschYeah, I'm working with 3 OSX guys on viget.org, and they are pretty much dead in the water without vagrant12:37
brouschIt took another guy a full day to get postgis working on OSX for use with a Ruby project12:37
rick_h__hmm, no mention of homebrew12:38
brouschIn the comments12:38
rick_h__wonder if he missed the boat that things moved on to there12:38
brouschThe boat moves too often12:38
snap-lbrousch: ++12:38
rick_h__not that I disagree, if you want to do linux use linux12:38
rick_h__I've always said a mac is a shitty linux machine12:38
brouschIt is12:38
snap-lAnd conversely Ubuntu can be a shitty mac.12:39
snap-lI'm just glad it's got everything I need12:39
brouschKDE makes it all good12:40
snap-lKDE makes it a shitty Windows machine. ;)12:40
brouschYou can make your Ubuntu into a Mac or Windows with KDE12:40
snap-lbrousch: I can make art from bull semen too, but I'm not about to try.12:41
brouschYou should enter that in ArtPrize. You could with $250,00012:42
snap-lAlready been done. (was re: Metallica's Load / Reload)12:42
rick_h__heh, I was going 'crap they changed the twitter ui...wtf' then loaded greader and I see the posts about it12:43
rick_h__interesting, so totally thinkgeek or bust13:04
rick_h__makes some sense I guess. "which of these is not like the others"13:05
snap-lThey're focusing on the one that makes money13:05
rick_h__"The deal is bringing Dice a set of sites that are profitable and generating good revenues"13:05
rick_h__seems they all are :P13:05
snap-lThough I can forsee something like github / stack exchange careers coming to fruition sooner than later.13:07
snap-llink your SF.net code to your dice profile13:07
rick_h__yea, it makes some sense there I guess13:07
snap-lIt's not as bad of a fit as some other companies I can think of13:10
snap-lbut I'm wondering what it'll look like in a year.13:10
snap-lI finally deleted my Dice Profile because it was a douche magnet.13:10
=== jcastro_ is now known as jcastro
jcastroprobably because most tech recruiters are douches13:16
rick_h__sales people...can't stand sales people13:17
jrwrenyou guys are obviously not software devs. You can't make ubuntu into a mac at all, and when you make it a shitty windows machine, its really called wine.13:19
snap-ljrwren: You can make Ubuntu into a shitty mac machine, you just can't run XCode and develop iPhone apps on it. ;)13:23
jrwrenwe have different definitions of "mac machine"13:24
jrwrenI'm not sure, but its going to be very difficult to make ubuntu use dyld as its loader.13:25
snap-lPicky picky.13:26
jrwrenas for that "use vagrant" I'm pretty sure I've built all of those in a virtualenv on osx.13:27
jrwrennot sure what this guys deal is.13:27
jrwrendyld is just tip of the picture. there are many differences between mac and ubuntu.13:27
jrwrenone can make ubuntu look like it has a mac veneer13:28
brouschbcrypt is the current best way to store passwords, right?15:07
rick_h__works for me15:08
rick_h__mitechie approved lol15:15
brouschThe rick_h_ stamp of approval is always nice15:16
brouschI'm enabling bcrypt in django15:16
brouschCrap, now I lost the stamp15:16
jrwrenany tips on finding a python generator ignored Runtime Exception15:17
rick_h__jrwren: what was the exact exception? recusion depth, generator exit?15:18
snap-lJust had a fire drill here15:20
snap-lThat was fun15:20
jrwrengenerator i15:21
jrwrengnored GeneratorExit15:21
jrwrenand the Traceback is entirely wrong AFAIK15:21
rick_h__brings up something along those lines on how it's a bit crazy15:21
jrwrenyes, i can google too :)15:21
jrwrenbut do you have any advice on finding the root ?15:21
rick_h__but no, I don't hit that much15:22
snap-lOK, I find this comment somewhat hypocritical, considering where I'm reading it: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=453793015:37
jrwrensnap-l: agreed.15:40
jrwrenthe amazing thing to me is just how slow the death of slashdot has been15:41
devinheitmuellerslashdot is still around?15:48
paultagI love /.15:48
brouschI read about 1 article/day there15:48
paultagyeah, me too.15:48
jrwreni haven't read /. regularly in a long time, maybe even 10 yrs.15:50
jrwrendoes python not like nested exception blocks?15:50
paultagI read it about twice a day, quality is very much not great15:50
paultagjrwren: nah, it can handle that fine15:50
brouschI get it via RSS15:50
jrwrenis socket.error somehow special?15:50
paultagjrwren: not that I know of, why?15:51
jrwreni've got a try: socket.close() /*which is causing a socket.error*/ except socket.error,e: #blah15:51
jrwrenand the exception is still bubbling up, not being handled.15:52
paultagjrwren: except socket.error as e?15:52
paultagjrwren: and it looks alright here15:52
paultagdo you have a small example?15:52
jrwren_cpwsgiserver.py from 2.2.1 :)15:53
jrwrenso no, i dno't have a small example.15:53
paultagbleh :)15:53
paultagit might be coming from somewhere else?15:53
paultagwhat's the traceback?15:53
jrwrenI think so, because of a generator exception15:53
jrwrenbut now I'm triggering it without that Generator Exit Error15:53
jrwrenit seems obvious what is happening to me, but I can't handle it.15:54
jrwrencherrypy wraps the socket with makefile and eventually calls close on that file wrapper15:54
jrwrenwhich flushes and closes15:54
jrwrenbut the socket is already closed15:54
jrwrenso sendall causes a socket.error15:54
jrwrenso I try to catch socket.error, but nope!15:55
jrwrencan't catch it.15:55
jrwreni want to play pokemon with socket.error but it won't play with me. #gotta catch 'em all15:55
jrwreni almost want to say socket.py is buggy.16:03
jrwreni should look at 3k and see if it is different.16:03
rick_h__jrwren: they aren't monkey patching socket or anything are they?16:06
rick_h__greenlet/etc kind of stuff going on?16:06
jrwreni don't think so.16:06
jrwrennope, its a threaded server :(16:06
jrwrenbut they are using makefile, which is nice, but this close() funciton looks wrong16:06
jrwrenindeed, 3k returns an entirely different beast.16:07
jrwrenugh, its changed a lot.16:09
rick_h__they reorged exceptions in 316:09
jrwrenbut leads me to beleive it was changed for good reason and is a problem.16:09
rick_h__the whole oserror stuff is a mess in py216:09
jrwrenno no, not exceptions, socket.makefile()16:09
jrwrenused to return a pure python file like object typeof _fileobject(object) in socket.py16:10
jrwrennow it returns a io.TextIOWrapper16:10
jrwrenwhich looks like a beast of C16:10
rick_h__ah, must be to make it unicode happy?16:10
jrwrenmaybe fixes this close bug.16:11
jrwrenI don't think it had unicode issues16:11
jrwrenStringIO is unicode happy, even in 2.7, right?16:11
rick_h__I mean TextIOWrapper needed to make a unicode friendly io stream stuff16:11
jrwrenbut definitely gonna perform a lot beter with all those buffers implmeneted in C16:11
jrwrene.g.  http://hg.python.org/cpython/file/3a880d640981/Modules/_io/iobase.c#l180  this is different behavior than 2.7's _fileobject16:13
jrwrenchecks if it is closed before flushing and closing.16:13
jrwrenits a funny thing that cpython. WAY more lines of code to make your code go faster!16:15
paultagthat's often the case16:16
jrwrenyeah, its even true in F# and ocaml.16:17
jrwrenofficial GNU prject. now see, to me that is a turn off :)16:30
jrwrenwow! "Launchpad and Bazaar have never really been meant as products in their own right, but more as facilities to build Ubuntu. "16:35
paultagI'm glad everyone's honest about that now16:36
jrwreni read that as: "dont use bazaar for version control unless you are building ubuntu"16:36
jrwrennot everyone, that is the Bazaar lead dev16:36
paultags/unless you are building ubuntu//g16:36
jrwrenis there a git to bzr bridge?16:36
paultagyah, I think so16:37
paultagjelmer wrote python-dulwich16:37
paultagI think that was for playing between the two16:37
rick_h__not a great one16:37
jrwrenlaunchpad is damned good. lp was github before github. it just stopped inovating and github took things to next level, IMO16:37
paultagrick_h__: it's an awesome name16:37
paultagrick_h__: mr. and mrs. git are from dulwich16:37
rick_h__bzr people hate git saying it's unintuitive16:37
rick_h__but I've found bzr to be a mess16:37
paultagyou just need to get into the right mindset, and understand how git works, don't treat it like svn16:37
jrwrenit is unintuitive if you don't use your brain :)16:38
paultage.g. don't learn push and pull first, learn about remotes and fetches16:38
paultagthen it will become clear what a pull does16:38
jrwrenpaultag knows !16:38
jrwrenand use the reflog!16:38
jrwreni used bzr and never saw the reflog AFAIK16:38
jrwrenand if I did, it was no easy to use.16:38
rick_h__yea, too many people act like the reflog is like delving into the kernel source code16:38
jrwrenin git it is easy to use.16:38
paultaggit is easy to use16:39
rick_h__we had this discussion at the last CHC where someone said rebase was 'dangerous'16:39
paultagoh lrody16:39
paultagwhen you use --force like a dillweed16:39
rick_h__and I went off that it's just people don't use it, don't practice it, but with the reflog nothing's ever lost16:39
jrwrensomeone been reading the wrong writing and not thinking for themselves.16:39
rick_h__and then reflog was like this arcane library you had to travel up a mountain to get at16:39
paultagbrb, foods and stuff.16:40
rick_h__so they want to pretend it's not there, therefor rebase is dangerous :/16:40
snap-lI wish the whole "Ubuntu is trying not to be Linux" meme would find a nice cozy fire to curl up and die in16:52
greg-gtempting http://www.indiegogo.com/iosafe16:57
devinheitmuellerFirst they complain that it doesn't say "GNU"...  Now they complain that doesn't say "Linux"...16:59
rick_h__greg-g: yea, that's cool16:59
greg-gdid someone complain that it no longer mentions linux? All I see is "fair enough" and a factual title17:00
* greg-g thinks someone is a bit defensive17:00
snap-lIt was on fossworldproblems17:00
greg-git's also in /r/Ubuntu17:01
jcastrothat's awesome17:05
rick_h__android is not linux...it's a limited set of apis on top of linux and things that work on android don't work on linux17:06
jrwrenrick_h__: LOL, you are fun.17:06
rick_h__I'm just trying to get brousch going17:06
rick_h__he loves to say how everyone uses linux because they use android17:07
jrwreni love to say that too.17:07
jcastroI don't use linux, I use ubuntu17:07
jcastrowhich has linux in it17:07
jrwrenforget linux on desktop, linux in your hand, and it did ubuntu bug #1 - no one runs palm or windows ce anymore. they run linux17:07
jrwrenyeah, what jcastro said.17:07
jrwreni love ubuntu, but I don't like a lot of other linux. slackware or gentoo for instance don't help me as much as ubuntu, so I don't like them as much17:08
paultagjcastro: you run linux, that's your kernel. You have other stuff, sure, but that's like saying, "I'm not using an engine, I'm using a Ford!"17:10
paultagwhich is sorta true, but also sorta false.17:10
paultagnot trying to get into some flame here, just sayn'17:10
jrwreni think you just proved his point.17:11
jrwrenyou use a computer and drive a car.17:11
paultagbut I acknowledge the fact I have an engine17:11
jrwrenwhen asked what kind of car, you don't say "2.0L 4 cyl" you say "ford focus"17:11
jrwrenthe engine is assumed17:11
paultagI do usually stuff the engine stuff too17:11
paultagbecause models have different engines, but I'm also a gearhead17:11
jrwreni don't, becusae I don't drive anything exciting.17:12
paultagI know i'm an exception, but saying you don't run linux is silly17:12
rick_h__I have a synaptic17:12
jrwrenif I drove a CTSV, then, sure.17:12
rick_h__they made the trackpad I have...oh wait I have a thinkpad :P17:12
rick_h__which includes a samsung display, a synaptic pointing device, an intel ssd...17:12
snap-lOnly people who are sponsored have to rattle off the list of things in their equipment17:19
snap-lThink: NASCAR17:19
rick_h__"Stallman inside!"17:19
greg-gman, you guys are still talking about this?17:19
rick_h__too many good jokes in here17:20
greg-gI leave for 10 minutes and you can't handle yourselves ;)17:20
snap-lgreg-g: no dead horse left inbeaten17:20
rick_h__inbeaten! hah17:20
rick_h__lmao Gnome Do for github! https://github.com/blog/1267-github-launch-page17:21
krondoroh man I need to stop reading comments about the diceholdings geeknet acquisitions17:38
rick_h__heh, saying anything good? I've not checked out the comments17:38
krondorno, they're just degressing into youtube style nonsense.  Slashdot is actually the least annoying at the moment.17:39
krondorreading the HN thread on it will make your life hurt17:39
snap-lkrondor: I can't handle HN.17:40
snap-lreddit get get stupid, but HN gets smug.17:40
paultagHN is crap. Full of brogrammers and sexist neckbeards.17:40
rick_h__ok, wtf is this about a patent infringment hosting github?17:40
paultagrick_h__: just saw that on LWN17:40
paultagthe patents look silly, don't think it'll hold up17:40
rick_h__I can't figure out how this works...I mean...what's a host got to do with the patent of the software? http://techcrunch.com/2012/09/18/patent-complaint-filed-against-rackspace-for-hosting-github/17:41
greg-gpaultag: famous last words17:41
snap-lI need to patent a method for turning oxygen and water into carbon dioxide,and sue everyone that breathes.17:41
rick_h__I'm trying to wade through the doc to find the 'patent' part17:41
krondorsigh brogrammers... I hate that it is a thing17:41
paultaggreg-g: aye17:41
paultagkrondor: let's totally bro out and crush some code brah17:41
greg-gyou all just be glad you don't live in brogrammer mecca17:41
paultaglet me get the dave matthews17:41
snap-lgreg-g: I still don't understand why the Samsung / Apple trial was presented in front of a jur17:42
snap-lpatent lawyers have a hard enough time with this, but 12 people off the street are perfectly fine?17:43
rick_h__On July 2, 2002, United States Patent No. 6,415,280 (the “’280 patent”) was dulyand legally issued for an invention entitled “Identifying and Requesting Data in Network UsingIdentifiers Which Are Based On Contents of Data.”17:44
greg-grick_h__: welcomed to the shitty world of software patents17:49
jcastropreach it brotha!17:50
greg-gI am beginning to see violent imagery on a regular basis involving baseball bats and stupid people17:50
paultaggreg-g: welcome to my life17:50
jrwrenwhy wouldn't the trial be in front of a jury?17:52
jrwrenIMO its a great thing that jobs17:52
jrwrenIMO its a great thing that we have a right to a jury. if something is so complex that it cant be explained, then its a warning sign17:53
snap-ljrwren: Consider this the dead canary.17:55
jhansonxiHumble Indie Bundle 6 is available: http://www.humblebundle.com18:04
greg-g+1/-1 this idea: Creative Commons partners with Humble Bundle to do a bundle of great CC-licensed music albums (or maybe short films?). CC gets a share of the proceeds a la what EFF gets now.18:09
greg-g(and the creators obviously do as well, a la what they do now)18:10
jhansonxiThey did have a movie in a previous bundle.  They sometimes include a full game music download for some games.18:14
greg-gyeah, I've seen that, but this is a specific idea, like it or no? :)18:15
* greg-g is looking for fundraising methods for CC18:15
greg-gmomma's gotta pay rent!18:15
snap-lgreg-g: Did you see the Double Dragon Neon soundtrack was released CC?18:16
snap-lI added it to the end of the latest OMC18:16
jhansonxiMusic is kind of a crowded market.  I haven't heard much about the Severed Fifth/Liberate album (Jono Bacon's band).  I suspect that a free offering wasn't too successful at generating revenue.  Death Metal is a niche which doesn't help.18:17
greg-gso, again, the marketing arm behind Humble Bundle and CC for a pay-what-you-want collection of 5 or so albums: like it or not?18:18
jhansonxi Depends on the albums.  I have a wide range of tastes but many people don't.  There's no shortage of bad music on the Internet.  I'm not against the HB/CC concept.18:21
greg-gok, so a 0 then. got it.18:26
paultagso, who's down for some debian bug squashing at OLF?18:36
jrwrenanyone know of jmeter alternatives?18:53
snap-lgreg-g: They did a pay-waht-you-want for some non-CC music18:53
snap-lI was pretty non-plussed about it18:54
snap-lProblem is music is quite taste-specific18:55
snap-lI may never play half the games for the bundle, but I'll still buy it18:55
snap-lThe music piece, I'll be more picky about18:55
snap-lI don't know why that is. ;P18:55
rick_h__https://twitter.com/alex_gaynor/status/248108457721475072 for brousch19:00
jcastroanyone going to OLF from MI?19:00
rick_h__snap-l: I think, maybe waldo19:00
snap-lI'm going19:01
snap-lalong with JoDee.19:01
jcastrofor the whole weekend?19:01
snap-lThat's the plan.19:01
snap-lDriving down Friday, coming back Sunday19:01
jcastroI'm going down Fri but I can't stay, so will likely leave that night19:02
snap-lOh, bugger.19:02
snap-lCards Against Humanity is back in stock19:04
snap-land ordered.19:04
rick_h__oh yea?19:04
rick_h__cool, going to order for my neighbor19:04
snap-lYep. Just snagged a copy, plus the expansions19:04
rick_h__meh, he can get the extensions19:05
rick_h__hah, snap-l beats the email19:05
snap-lNah, I got the e-mail and then ordered. ;)19:15
* snap-l is quick like that. ;)19:15
brouschThere are extensions already?19:23
rick_h__two expansion packs with goodies in there19:24
brouschI haven't even played yet19:27
greg-gI give to you http://www.cipsum.com for your enjoyment20:19
devinheitmuellerIt's like the Dilbert Jargonator that came with the screensaver I had in 1998!20:20
paultaggreg-g: i've been using http://hipsteripsum.me/ lately20:21
greg-gpaultag: nice :)20:21
greg-gdevinheitmueller: :)20:21
krondorjcastro:  I'm going to olf20:25
paultagjcastro_: I'll be there, if you need someone to drink with.20:25
* krondor hours late to the scrollback20:25
jcastro_paultag, excellent20:26
=== jcastro_ is now known as jcastro
paultagjcastro: I'll be at the hyatt, i'll be coming in friday afternoon20:26
jhansonxiI'm thinking about attending OLF also.  Probably driving down Friday from Alpena and coming back Sunday morning.20:34
paultagif anyone wants to get down on some beersigning, I'll bring GPG slips20:34
krondoris there a good chrome plugin for gpg in gmail?20:39
krondorall I've seen is cr-gpg and it looks a bit rough (compared to firegpg)20:40
jrwrenturns out that GeneratorExit error was a red herring20:40
greg-gkrondor: it's call mutt :P20:40
greg-gs/call/called/ #grr20:40
jrwrenalso turns out that if a client closes a socket on cherrypy 2.2.x, it leaks file handles20:41
krondorgreg-g:  but then how will I read those pretty newegg newsletters20:43
rick_h__krondor: I usually do a v (select html file) <enter>20:46
rick_h__and it opens in chrome :)20:46
krondorI don't know, I really like the gmail ui though and if encouraging more CLI for me can only end badly.20:48
krondornext thing you know i'll be on gentoo again20:48
rick_h__hah, like a recovering addict20:48
greg-ghaha, one taste of the stuff...20:51
krondorquitting time I'm out :)20:52
jhansonxigreg-g:  Not quite what you were thinking with HB/CC but similar: http://groupees.com/taproot21:28
greg-gjhansonxi: interesting, had not heard of that21:44
=== jcastro_ is now known as jcastro

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