| FloatingGoat | okay | 02:08 |
|---|---|---|
| FloatingGoat | len-dt: its like very static? | 02:08 |
| FloatingGoat | len-dt: whats the best way to record guitar? | 03:49 |
| len-dt | Whatever gets the sound you want | 03:49 |
| len-dt | Last bit I did, I used a vocal mic (at 2020) to record an acoustic, and ran the electric direct. | 03:50 |
| len-dt | I added effects to the guitars after I had most of my tracks for mixdown. | 03:51 |
| len-dt | That can be a bit limiting because one plays different depending on how the sound is | 03:52 |
| len-dt | But it does give a nice clean track that any effect will work on. | 03:53 |
| len-dt | FloatingGoat, When I say direct in... that means through a preamp... not direct to sound card. | 03:54 |
| len-dt | The pre amp I used is the one in a Mackie 1604 mixer. | 03:55 |
| len-dt | Still, lots of records made with an SM57 in front of the guitar amp too. | 03:56 |
| len-dt | Depends what kind of sound you want. | 03:57 |
| len-dt | Use your ears... make 5 or 10 tracks doing it every way you can think and keep what sounds best for the song you are doing. | 03:58 |
| len-dt | If I use more than one guitar track I try to do each one different. | 03:59 |
| len-dt | Use different guitars, mics, amps, effects etc. | 04:00 |
| FloatingGoat | okay | 04:00 |
| FloatingGoat | i pretty much did it the way you said | 04:01 |
| FloatingGoat | i recorded my acoustic through | 04:01 |
| FloatingGoat | my mic and the electric through the not mic | 04:01 |
| FloatingGoat | I mean like | 04:01 |
| FloatingGoat | if its a two minute song | 04:01 |
| FloatingGoat | should I play guitar for two minutes and thats the track? | 04:01 |
| FloatingGoat | the same thing for two minutes? | 04:02 |
| len-dt | Whatever sounds right for the style of music and gets what the song is trying to say across. | 04:02 |
| len-dt | Music is about communication. | 04:02 |
| len-dt | Take Neil Young... Old Man Vs Hey Hey, My My | 04:04 |
| len-dt | They are saying two completely different things and are two different styles. | 04:05 |
| FloatingGoat | yeah? | 04:10 |
| len-dt | Hey music is art, some paint with oils and others watercolours.... and some with film | 04:14 |
| len-dt | There is no such thing as a set of rules... just do this and it will work... unless you are doing vocal gymnastics for Idol | 04:15 |
| len-dt | What do you do on stage? start with that. | 04:17 |
| len-dt | Then listen... maybe you will get an idea to change something... so try it. If it sounds better keep it. Don't be afraid to try things. | 04:18 |
| len-dt | The nice thing about a computer tracker is that you can have lots of tracks, mute the ones you aren't using and they won't load the computer down | 04:20 |
| len-dt | Listen with your eyes closed, Does every sound support the vocal or the instrument solo? Or does something distract? | 04:24 |
| len-dt | There is nothing wrong with recording something and deciding not to use it later. | 04:24 |
| FloatingGoat | yeah i guess | 05:31 |
| FloatingGoat | it just takes time and effert | 05:31 |
| drupin | VLC is giving me flickering. very minute flashes... | 07:25 |
| drupin | how can i play video files in vlc | 08:36 |
| velho | http://www.linuxdsp.co.uk | 10:15 |
| jablo | Hi I am trying to make puredata work with Jack with no luck. Every time I select "jack" in puredata, puedata locks up completely. | 10:21 |
| ailo | jablo: Did you try starting jack first? | 10:22 |
| ailo | And if that still doesn't work, try this in a terminal (after starting jack): pd -jack | 10:23 |
| ailo | You can even do: pd -jack channels 2 -alsamidi | 10:24 |
| jablo | I start jack with qjackctl fist, yes. I'll try your command lines, need to do some "kill"s first though. | 10:24 |
| ailo | Ah, sorry. -channels | 10:24 |
| jablo | 1) Start jack; 2) pd -jack -channels 2 -alsamidi; 3) Pureadta window shows up with a big "Audio Error". | 10:27 |
| jablo | Still - setting dsp and making a small "osc~ 440" --> "dac~" gives sound. | 10:28 |
| jablo | So I'd say - thanks for your help. | 10:28 |
| jablo | Apparently I need to start puredata from the command line. | 10:28 |
| ailo | jablo: Did you make sure to choose number of inputs and outputs when choosing jack from the pd menu? | 10:31 |
| ailo | jablo: Also, don't forget that even if you have a low latency with jack, you'll need to set pd's latency low too, for the non-audio operation (such as midi) | 10:32 |
| jablo | Yes and no - puredata locks up as it displays the jack audio configuration menu | 10:32 |
| ailo | jablo: Which OS and release is this? | 10:32 |
| jablo | Ubuntu Studio, Ubuntu 12.04.1 LTS, uname 3.2.0-23-lowlatency | 10:34 |
| jablo | x86_64 | 10:34 |
| ailo | jablo: You might like to try pd-extended instead. https://launchpad.net/~eighthave/+archive/pd-extended | 10:36 |
| jablo | ICE1712 - Hoontech SoundTrack Audio DSP24 | 10:36 |
| jablo | Ok I'll try and look at that. | 10:36 |
| ailo | Those are older, but should work | 10:36 |
| ailo | There's also the beta of pd-extended.. | 10:36 |
| jablo | I'm still trying to get the pd patch you or (who was it?) sent me the other day, to detect sound and trigger a bass drum from hydrogen | 10:37 |
| ailo | jablo: Ah, yeah. That was me | 10:37 |
| ailo | Well, pd vanilla should do that well enough. | 10:38 |
| ailo | There's something weird about the jack interface only when starting it. | 10:38 |
| jablo | Since I got sound out of puredata through jack when starting it on the command ... | 10:39 |
| ailo | pd-extended includes loads of extra libs, as well as having a more pleasant look | 10:39 |
| ailo | jablo: You need to make sure alsamidi is enabled. If you don't see pd in qjackctl alsa midi tab, enable the alsamidi from the pd menu | 10:40 |
| ailo | When running the patch, you want to have dsp on, and needless to say, the audio and midi ports properly connected | 10:40 |
| ailo | After making sure it works, you'll want to reduce latency as well | 10:41 |
| jablo | When I load the patch - seems that puredata locks up again. The window with the flow is unresponsive, can't move things around. | 10:41 |
| jablo | Cant' open puredata audio preferences | 10:41 |
| jablo | so - something isn't working well | 10:41 |
| jablo | jackd latency is 2.9ms | 10:42 |
| jablo | 64 sample blocks | 10:42 |
| ailo | Try reducing jack latency | 10:42 |
| ailo | Just for testing | 10:42 |
| ailo | The patch has a auto dsp on | 10:42 |
| ailo | After starting pd, before opening the patch, try turning dsp opn | 10:42 |
| jablo | killling things and retrying... brb | 10:43 |
| jablo | just starting puredata (on the command line, with jack aleady started), puredata continuously spits out: | 10:45 |
| jablo | damn cutn'paste not working | 10:45 |
| jablo | watchdog: signaling pd... | 10:46 |
| jablo | Jack: JackClient::ClientNotify ref = 3 name = pure_data_0 notify = 3 | 10:46 |
| jablo | Jack: JackClient::kXRunCallback | 10:46 |
| jablo | Jack: JackClient::ClientNotify ref = 3 name = pure_data_0 notify = 3 | 10:46 |
| jablo | Jack: JackClient::kXRunCallback | 10:46 |
| ailo | What's jacks latency at now? | 10:46 |
| jablo | still 2.9ms | 10:46 |
| ailo | Try reducing it just for seeing if pd will start. Also, did you set latency before in pd settings menu? | 10:47 |
| ailo | If not, all is fine | 10:47 |
| jablo | I tuned on dsp, then load patch. Puredata locks up before the patch is loaded. | 10:47 |
| jablo | yes i checked that pd latency (block size) is 64 like jack | 10:48 |
| ailo | You can set blocksize also from the commandline. pd --help gives you an idea | 10:48 |
| ailo | I'd try with a much larger blocksize to see if it will start | 10:49 |
| ailo | On both jack and pd | 10:49 |
| jablo | ok. | 10:49 |
| ailo | I run pd with 64 frames myself, but I don't use vanilla pd | 10:51 |
| jablo | 512 - seems to be working a bit better | 10:51 |
| jablo | Afte the patch loads, shouldn't the window be alive - ie, I should be able to highlight, click and move the blocks aoround? | 10:52 |
| ailo | You need to be in edit mode for that | 10:52 |
| jablo | YES! | 10:52 |
| ailo | Ctrl + E | 10:52 |
| jablo | I am SO new to puredata. Hate it. I'm a programme, not a mouser :) | 10:52 |
| jablo | *programmer | 10:53 |
| jablo | Hmm. I don't see puredata in jacks midi pane. | 10:53 |
| ailo | There's no jack midi for pd | 10:54 |
| ailo | So, you'll find it in alsa midi | 10:54 |
| ailo | If you enabled alsamidi, that is | 10:54 |
| jablo | Ok, let me be precise here: I see puredata in jack "audio" pane, but not in jack "MIDI" pane nor in jack ALSA pane. | 10:54 |
| jablo | Woups, now it's there | 10:55 |
| jablo | Ahha. So - I should be ready to hook up Ardour --> puredata --> hydrogen. | 10:55 |
| jablo | And get a decent drum bass sound whenever my badly recorded bass drum sounds. | 10:56 |
| jablo | With 512 sample blocks, probably a bit time skewed - but that's for later. | 10:56 |
| ailo | The [bonk~] object works pretty well without any arguments, but it can be tuned. To see help for objects, just right-click and choose help | 10:56 |
| jablo | Thanks. Yes. I'll get some tea, play around with this and possibly be back. | 10:57 |
| jablo | You are very helpful. | 10:57 |
| ailo | np | 10:57 |
| jablo | Other question - are you guys using ubuntu studio? and using -generic, -lowlatency or -realtime kernels? | 10:58 |
| ailo | I use -lowlatency | 10:58 |
| jablo | k | 10:59 |
| ailo | Haven't used an -rt since Ubuntu Natty | 10:59 |
| jablo | -generic was completely unusable to me. even with i think 1024 block i got more noise than sound | 10:59 |
| ailo | I was on puredyne 9.10, based on Ubuntu 9.10, which had an -rt kernel in the main repo. That one was pretty ok. Since 11.04 I started using -lowlatency instead. Those kernels are actually a bit better on performance | 11:00 |
| ailo | I mean, the ones on 11.04 and perhaps 11.10 | 11:01 |
| jablo | That's what I read too. | 11:01 |
| ailo | Here's a howto I made on building an older -lowlatency kernel on a newer release https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BuildOldLowlatency | 11:01 |
| ailo | I haven't yet prepared a production system for my pd patches, which are quite extensive and used with our band. I will probably want to try the older kernel | 11:03 |
| ailo | I only tried it quickly when I made the howto, and it seemed more responsive | 11:03 |
| jablo | I just grabbed a -lowlatency i had in synaptic package manager | 11:03 |
| ailo | Since 12.04, there's a lowlatency in the main repo | 11:03 |
| ailo | But, we were testing kernels already a year earlier | 11:04 |
| jablo | Ah. | 11:04 |
| ailo | 2.6.37 was very nice, but 2.6.38 was the first to support the rtirq script | 11:04 |
| ailo | Another piece of -rt that has gotten into the main kernel source | 11:05 |
| jablo | HEY, puredata is doing something to my sound. | 11:06 |
| jablo | theree's a "velocity" thingie that changes values in step with the music! | 11:07 |
| ailo | Not sure what you mean | 11:08 |
| jablo | I connected ardour (bass durm track) to the puredata patch. And started playback in ardour. | 11:09 |
| ailo | The noteout is given a message: note 30, velocity $1. Velocity is based on the volume that [bonk~] object | 11:09 |
| ailo | Missing words there, but you get the point | 11:09 |
| jablo | Yes that's what I figured. So, since the velocity object moves, puredaata hears the sound, pocesses it... DOES something. | 11:09 |
| jablo | hooking up to hydrogen now. | 11:09 |
| ailo | It doesn't do anything with the sound. It only outputs midi | 11:09 |
| ailo | There's no audio out on the patch | 11:10 |
| jablo | Nono fine, I want a midi signal into hydrogen. | 11:10 |
| jablo | Yes. There'a a small blinking "midi in" thing now in hydrogen... now... sound... | 11:10 |
| jablo | AND it's actually hooked up to the bass drum... wow. | 11:11 |
| jablo | Amazing. | 11:14 |
| jablo | Hydrogen is playing the bass drum now. | 11:14 |
| jablo | Sound awful though | 11:14 |
| jablo | But that's the hydrogen drum set AND filtering in bonk~. Wow wow wow. | 11:15 |
| ailo | jablo: Another thing you can do, if you want to be more advanced, is used pd as the sample player | 11:17 |
| ailo | But, that'll make you need to learn how to make pd patches | 11:17 |
| ailo | You get a bit more control, but I gather that is probably not needed in your case | 11:18 |
| jablo | A gate on the drum track has fixed this for now. | 11:20 |
| ailo | jablo: [bonk~] has more options in it's right outlet. You might want to look into that. | 11:21 |
| jablo | Amazing - now I have the sound of a hydogen bass drum synchronously playing with our recorded track | 11:21 |
| jablo | Thanks - I'll definitely look into this. This is a fabbatastic proof of concept! | 11:22 |
| jablo | Going to use this trick and make an updated set of music-minus-one mixes for the band. Wee hee :-D | 11:23 |
| jablo | bonk~ help says something about it working on 256 sound samples at a time. So probably one sholdn't set jack block size lower thatn 256 | 11:26 |
| ailo | jablo: Nah, it works on lower setting too | 11:45 |
| ailo | As I said, I use it at 64 | 11:45 |
| ailo | pd's internal block size is 64 by default, I believe. This may not be related to audio latency | 11:46 |
| ailo | Try reducing latency using the -audiobuf in ms instead | 11:46 |
| ailo | Or, data latency, not audio latency. Audio latency is controlled by jack | 11:47 |
| jablo | Ailo, I have one more queestion. What I have now with the bonk~ puredata ptach is very useful. It does, however, at times generate some extra spurious notes (bleeding from snare drum into bass drum mike). So I would like it to limit the number of notes it outputs. | 12:18 |
| jablo | and threshold setting comes to mind. But I don't understand the help - do I add a box called threshold, or ... ? | 12:18 |
| ailo | jablo: You either create the object with arguments, like [object arg1 arg2] | 12:24 |
| ailo | jablo: Or, you give it messages, using the message object. | 12:24 |
| ailo | jablo: Adding a message is done either from the edit menu, or Ctrl + 2 | 12:25 |
| ailo | You can type whatever you want in a message, and that will be outputted from its outlet to anything its connected to, when you click it | 12:25 |
| jablo | so if i add messgae, and type "thresh 2.5 5" that should do something to bonk~ ? | 12:26 |
| jablo | oh yes, the help displays the same icon as message. oh. | 12:26 |
| ailo | Yea | 12:26 |
| jablo | (as I said: I'm a pogrammer, not a mouser/guie'er. sry.) | 12:26 |
| jablo | Thanks. | 12:28 |
| ailo | In the patch you have, there were two messages. One for the [noteout] object, and one to start pd. Anything after ";" in a message is sent somewhere, in this case "pd". The first word in the list identifies where it's sent | 12:29 |
| ailo | One to start dsp, sorry | 12:29 |
| jablo | Ah, i was wondering what the "loadbang" --> "; pd dsp 1" was for. | 12:29 |
| ailo | There are the [send] and [receive] objects. You can use those too | 12:30 |
| jablo | I must say - it's really working extremely well. Just using you patch and some fiddling with the low pass + aggressive gating on the sound track, hydrogen does exactly what it should, and feeding back into ardour all sound samples are nicely lined up. Timing is perfect. | 12:31 |
| ailo | I use the [bonk~] object with a couple of trigger pads. Beats the hell out of any midi drum I've tried | 12:31 |
| jablo | Ha. I have never really combined computer + music (my 2 great hobbies, and computers my work too). | 12:32 |
| jablo | I can see where you could do some really neat things... controlling... yeah, well, anything - just from your music. | 12:33 |
| ailo | [clip 0 127] just makes sure the output from [bonk~] is within the midi velocity range. Variables in messages, like [30 $1( will be filled with whatever you push it. | 12:33 |
| ailo | It doesn't take a lot of time to whip something up on pd, creating both midi, audio and gui interfaces | 12:34 |
| ailo | jablo: If you want to find out more, I suggest looking into the manual in the help browser | 12:35 |
| ailo | Well, the part that's called "Pure Data" in the manual, is what I mean | 12:36 |
| ailo | in the browser, not the manual. Jeez | 12:37 |
| ailo | Anyway, I'm going cyclink. First day with no wind for ages | 12:37 |
| jablo | have a nice trip. | 12:38 |
| ailo | jablo: One good pointer is to use the [print] object a lot. Connect anything to print, and you see the output in the console | 12:42 |
| ailo | Ok, going now | 12:42 |
| pandoras | hello :D | 18:27 |
| pandoras | have troubles with jack and D-Bus | 18:27 |
| pandoras | cannot connect to socket, can't find some useful infos on the web | 18:28 |
| ailo | pandoras: Standard Ubuntu Studio install? | 18:33 |
| ailo | If you started jack, and it failed before, it could be running. The default setting for qjackctl is to start jackdbus | 18:33 |
| ailo | To kill jackdbus, do: killall -9 jackdbus | 18:33 |
| pandoras | alio, yes | 18:33 |
| pandoras | mom | 18:34 |
| ailo | Sometimes stopping jack does not stop jack. When that happens, you have to kill jack in order to start it again | 18:34 |
| ailo | This is a bug with qjackctl and jackdbus on Ubuntu 12.04 | 18:35 |
| pandoras | ok, ps -e | grep jack list anyway some running processes | 18:35 |
| pandoras | so, nothing is running, try again | 18:36 |
| pandoras | doesn't work | 18:37 |
| ailo | If that didn't help, try also restarting pulseaudio. I usually just kill it, and it respawns | 18:37 |
| ailo | pandoras: Make sure qjackctl is set to use a device you know works | 18:37 |
| ailo | So, I do: killall -9 jackdbus, killall pulseaudio. And then try jack again. | 18:38 |
| ailo | pandoras: What kind of device are you using with jack? | 18:38 |
| pandoras | ok, now its running | 18:39 |
| pandoras | the standart-device was (default) and not hw:2 | 18:40 |
| ailo | pandoras: Every time you boot, the devices might shift order | 18:40 |
| pandoras | im using a PCI-Terrasoniq TS-22 Studio-card | 18:40 |
| pandoras | ailo, should only happen, when a new device plugged in | 18:40 |
| ailo | pandoras: No | 18:40 |
| ailo | The devices are not listed in order | 18:41 |
| ailo | The order can change at each boot | 18:41 |
| ailo | pandoras: If you want to make sure qjackctl is always set to use the card you like, use the name, instead of the number. | 18:41 |
| ailo | If I do: cat /proc/asound/cards | 18:42 |
| pandoras | i had a roommate, and his xsever was not working anymore, because he has set the fix BUS-ID for the card. | 18:42 |
| ailo | This is my device: 2 [M66 ]: ICE1712 - M Audio Delta 66 | 18:42 |
| ailo | In qjackctl, I write: hw:M66 | 18:42 |
| ailo | Instead of hw:2 | 18:42 |
| pandoras | 2 [PCI ]: ICE1724 - Terrasoniq TS22 PCI | 18:43 |
| pandoras | Terrasoniq TS22 PCI at 0xec00, irq 18 | 18:43 |
| pandoras | that means only type "PCI" as setting? | 18:43 |
| ailo | hw:PCI | 18:43 |
| ailo | Try that. Should work. You type it in manually | 18:44 |
| pandoras | thx, very useful to know | 18:44 |
| pandoras | i figured out how the midi controlers of my keyboard with Ardour works :D | 18:44 |
| pandoras | do you know if yoshimi does support midi-mapping-controller? | 18:46 |
| ailo | I've never tried using midi devices to control ardour, but I assume it's mostly about assigning the right midi ctrl value, and channel to whatever you want to control | 18:46 |
| ailo | Never heard of midi-mapping-controller | 18:47 |
| pandoras | i mean put a midi controller to any parameter | 18:47 |
| ailo | I think qmidiroute might be helpful, if you can't create a template, or save settings in the program you want to use | 18:48 |
| pandoras | zynAdd/Yoshimi is so amazing and kickass | 18:48 |
| pandoras | sad that important features are missing | 18:48 |
| pandoras | ailo, kthxbye | 19:41 |
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