/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/09/24/#ubuntu-server.txt

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linociscohi all07:40
segvello07:41
linociscoI am sure everybody is aware of attack on Godaddy's website . Ubuntu site is backed by Godaddy. I am wondering how much it affected on ubuntu site.07:41
segvNo clue, which attack?07:42
linociscosegv, DDOS07:42
segvThe recent attack that they played off?07:42
segvas a router misconfig?07:42
smwlinocisco, the service went down, but they claim it was not a DDOS07:42
linociscosegv, yes. by Annoymous07:42
smwlinocisco, they claim it was their problem07:43
linociscosmw, how long was which service down?07:43
smwHours07:43
smwnot sure how long07:43
segvyeah07:44
segvmost of the day07:44
segvstandard PST work hours 9-5+ a few07:44
smwyep07:44
smwpissed me off to no end07:44
linociscosmw, it is the problem of Godaddy, but ubuntu is authenticated through it. I am wondering if hackers could penatrate07:44
smwhad me running in circles07:44
smwnot really...07:45
segvlinocisco: if it was down, they weren't penetrating much haha07:45
smwlinocisco, the took it down... that is sort of the opposite ;-)07:45
linociscosmw, so ubuntu website was down for a couple of hours?07:52
shaunowhere are you getting the impression they're 'backed' by godaddy?07:59
apwDaviey, hey is it expected that after installing kvm and virt-manager, you need to reboot to make it work08:37
* ogra_ wouldnt see a reason for this 08:40
ogra_(but i cant remember if i actually had to when i installed that setup)08:41
jpdsapw: Your user needs to be in libvirtd.08:45
apwjpds, yeah i started virtmanager with that in my group, ie. i logged out and in and it did not help08:47
jpdsapw: Hmm, works for me...08:47
apwworked not for me08:47
AdvoWorkHi all, after some advice please. Production server so in use all of the time, whats the best way of applying/installing updates, i would assume check these first, see if anything jumps out as a problem,and then just install? I dont want to install and have problems08:49
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Davieyapw: sort of.. you need to be added to a group.. so loging out and in should be enough08:59
Davieyah, read follow up08:59
Davieyso no, shouldn't be required08:59
apwDaviey, it wasn't ... and after trying to restart everything related i gave up and rebooted, which fixed08:59
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lordievaderGood morning10:05
jamespageSpamapS, pls can you ping me re ceph upload when you start10:52
jamespageDaviey, having thought about it more I don't think that switch for python-ceph makes sense11:05
jamespageit will be a delta we always have to maintain ontop of Debian11:06
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Davieyjamespage: yeah.. I agree.  I don't see why it was raised.. Where was it mentioned?11:21
jamespageDaviey, irc when discussing which bits go to main11:22
jamespageDaviey, I need to discuss with SpamapS as I think some of his additional changes relate to the upstart integration11:26
jamespagewhich is still considered 'beta' so we don't ship the upstart configurations to support it.11:27
Davieyjamespage: should i be accepting SpamapS's change or wait?11:30
jamespageDaviey, hold of for the time being please...11:31
Davieyokie11:34
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zulgood morning12:40
jdstrandjamespage: hi! on bug 1055416, you said that 1.466.2 is fixed, but upstream lists 1.466.2.1 as fixed12:42
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1055416 in jenkins "user data security issues in Jenkins" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/105541612:42
jamespagejdstrand, thats for the Cloudbees enterprise distro12:42
jamespage" LTS users should upgrade to 1.466.2"12:42
jdstrandoh, I see12:42
jamespageis the one applicable in quantal12:42
jdstrandLTS users should upgrade to 1.466.212:42
jdstrandok, thanks12:42
jamespagejdstrand, I spent 30 mins trying to ID the commits but upstream are not that open about security fixes....12:43
jdstrandjamespage: fwiw, it looks like they have a cloudbees with 1.424.6.1112:43
jdstrand:\12:43
jamespagejdstrand, the cloudbees distros build on the open-source LTS releases12:44
jamespageI have todo the same but blind....12:44
jamespagejdstrand, I've ping the upstream project lead for guidance and how to discuss12:44
jamespagegoing forwards...12:45
jdstrandjamespage: right, I just ment that precise has 1.424.6. maybe if it was possible to diff 1.424.6 and 1.424.6.11...12:45
jamespagejdstrand, no source code for  1.424.6.1112:45
jdstrandah. hrmm12:45
jamespage*almost* what I said when the bug report was raised in Debian...12:46
AdvoWorkhow would i go about rename all symbolic links, im trying to change from S to K. I can see I can do sudo update-rc.d whatever stop, but it needs an NN, but i dont know this12:46
smbjamespage, Do you know who else might still be knowledgable with the orchestra/cobbler scripts? I just tried an ubuntu-cobbler-import of quantal and there seems to be an issue with the md5 signing.12:52
jamespagehmm12:53
jamespagesmb, roaksoax maybe - if its the script from the cobbler package?12:53
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smbjamespage, yes it is... actuall cobber-ubuntu-import...12:54
smbroaksoax, ^ Would you know what could cause this12:54
smbfailed to verify MD5SUMS via /usr/share/keyrings/ubuntu-archive-keyring.gpg (http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/quantal/main/installer-amd64/current/images/MD5SUMS)12:55
jamespagesmb, ah - actually that might be todo with the archive signing key changing - see ubuntu-devel ML12:55
smbjamespage, Well yes, I suspected it could be related. Maybe a piece forgotten12:56
jamespagesmb, is this on a 12.04 system?12:56
smbyes12:56
smbAnd that keyring only has the 1K key on it12:57
smbHm, maybe I should ask that cjwatson12:59
lordievaderGood afternoon13:07
smbjamespage, Ok, manually adding the new keys works for now13:08
jamespagesmb, good oh13:08
Davieysmb: did you see my follow up?13:10
irvhow to restart networking daemon in ubuntu server 12.04 ?13:11
smbDaviey, Which follow up on what?13:11
irvnm, got it, sudo /etc/init.d/networking restart13:12
smbDaviey, jamespage There will be a SRU for the keyring in 12.0413:12
jamespageyep13:12
Davieysmb: that was what i question on ubuntu-devel...13:13
Davieyhttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2012-September/035910.html13:14
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SpamapSjamespage: awake13:48
SpamapSjamespage: since its been a weekend since I did the ceph upload on Friday.. can you summarize for me what changes I had from the ones you did?13:48
jamespageSpamapS, hey - so minor confusion on my part this morning - the one place I did not look for you ceph upload was the unapproved queue :-)13:49
jamespageSpamapS, np13:49
SpamapSjamespage: yeah I should have pushed it to lp:ubuntu/ceph13:49
jamespageSpamapS, so I had picked the new binary for installation - ceph-keys-prepare or whatever13:49
SpamapSjamespage: I thought I pulled that in to the ceph package based on upstream's debian dir.  I think.13:50
jamespageSpamapS, I did look at the additional entries for ceph.dirs, but decided not to take those changes as there are related to upstart support13:50
jamespagewhich we don't ship13:50
jamespageat least I think so13:50
SpamapSjamespage: why don't we ship that yet?13:51
SpamapSthat seems.. a bit weird! ;)13:51
ninjixgood morning, everyone13:51
ninjixlooking for a Ubuntu sysad input on setting up UPS power management for my 12.04 host nodes.13:52
jamespageSpamapS, 'upstart: basic support for monitors, mds, radosgw; osd support still a work in progress.' - that was from 0.48 release notes13:52
jamespageas it was only partial I chose not to include it13:52
ninjixI familiar with NUT but was wondering what others are using.13:53
jamespageSpamapS, I see13:53
jamespageupstart: start everyone on a reboot13:53
jamespageupstart: always update the osd crush location on start if specified in the config13:53
jamespagein 0.48.2 release notes...13:53
jamespageSpamapS, I'm reluctant to switch to using upstart this late in the cycle13:54
SpamapSjamespage: I am worried about incompatibility between our packages and upstream's13:56
SpamapSjamespage: they didn't add upstart in 0.48.2 ... did we hold it back in 0.48 for some reason?13:56
jamespageSpamapS, I don't think compatibility is an issue13:58
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uvirtbotNew bug: #1055505 in nova (main) "nova-vncproxy conflicts with novnc" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/105550514:01
jamespageSpamapS, found it " Likewise, the upstart support is still incomplete and not recommended; we will backport that functionality later if it turns out to be non-disruptive." 0.48 release notes14:05
jamespageknew I had read that somewhere14:06
jamespageSpamapS, I'll ask upstream14:09
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jamespagezul, updating my panda to see if the radosgw issue has gone away...15:07
zuljamespage: was there suppose to be two radosgw processes?15:08
jamespagezul, I don't think so15:08
zuljamespage: okies15:08
zulhallyn: ping when you are around15:10
hallynzul: 'sup?15:14
zulhallyn: have you seen soren's patches for qemu-kvm?15:15
hallynzul: the ones for precise, to fix the bridging network issues?15:17
hallynor a set he wrote himself?15:17
hallynif former, yes, if latter, no15:17
zulhallyn: the one in the ubuntu-virt ppa15:18
hallynzul: yeah.  we're waiting for confirmation that it solves the named bug.15:21
zulhallyn: i saw at least one confirmation this morning :)15:21
hallynzul: ah, excellent.  that's plenty then.  want to push it to precise-proposed?  :)15:22
zulsure! :)15:22
hallynzul: that was one of the biggest migraine-inducing bugs in awhile15:24
zulhallyn: yeah i know15:24
aboSamoorHi, I have an ubuntu server with 145 TiB in three md arrays with RAID6 implmented, when we use NFS we get a memory leak, any recent bug or similar issues appeared recently?15:27
jamespagezul, nope - still get it "*** glibc detected *** /usr/bin/radosgw: free(): invalid pointer: 0xb66f9df4 ***15:29
jamespage"15:29
zuljamespage: meh..15:29
AdvoWorkwould time stop an rsync, ie: time rsync -azx --stats --progress -numeric-ids --bwlimit=500 /mnt/test/ /mnt/test2  it says "DRY RUN" at the end?15:31
hallynzul: i'm nto quite sure what we put down as 'test case' for the SRU justification in that one15:36
zulhallyn: what about the netcat15:36
hallyni guess.  just not many ppl can actually reproduce it.  i never could15:36
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uvirtbotNew bug: #1055581 in python-tx-tftp (main) "FTBFS in Quantal test rebuild" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/105558116:06
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iqualfragileallright: i have several accounts saved into an ldap-directory, and i can log into my clients using that credentials17:26
iqualfragilenow i want kerberos to use the accounts including the passwords in the directory as principials and the clients to automaticly mount the users home-directroy from the server using kerberos-authed nfs (i allready got the automounting part)17:28
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iqualfragilecan someone point me to a bit of documentation? i could not find any17:29
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adam_ghallyn: ping17:34
hallynadam_g: .17:38
adam_ghallyn: any thoughts on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1035172 ? this is the issue that was blocking me from testing your libvirt last week on quantal. seems 'vhost=on' by default is the culprit17:39
uvirtbotadam_g: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out17:39
hallynadam_g: i'll look at it and get back to you (break for lunch)17:41
uvirtbotNew bug: #1049146 in cloud-init (main) "cloud-init runs again after reboot in release upgraded instance" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104914617:42
adam_ghallyn: cool17:42
uvirtbotNew bug: #1002155 in cloud-init (main) "dpkg-reconfigure cloud-init doesn't show CloudStack" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/100215517:47
adam_gzul: is there a bug for that keystone upgrade thing?17:55
zuladam_g: not yet17:55
adam_gzul: how did you hit that? with what config were you trying to upgrade? just the default, or something modified?17:56
zuladam_g: https://github.com/StackGeek/openstackgeek17:57
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adam_gzul: ?17:58
zuladam_g: just a bunch of scripts that does an openstack install for you17:58
b0otDoes anyone have a suggestion for any sort of distributed messaging/email system. I'm looking for something where all the servers are replicating all the data across the network. Where users can talk with one another based on something like username/ip and then if they try to send a message and the user isn't available they recieve the message when they get online17:58
mwynnenot sure if it does messaging but for open source email you could look at Zimbra18:04
mwynneI used the email server and really liked it.18:04
zuladam_g: ok the database stuff for me is clearly not working for me18:04
zuladam_g: meaning im doing something non-standard18:05
adam_gzul: file a bug with the openstack geek squad? :)18:06
zuladam_g: yeah :p18:06
adam_gzul: keystone upgrade with an unpopulated database and default configs seems to work fine, FWIW18:07
hallynadam_g: well jinkeys, the email thread you list is from 2010.  and there was no followup?  they were ignored?18:10
adam_ghallyn: didn't really follow the thread entirely, but it got me looking in the right place. vhost=on by default breaks DHCP without the required iptables rules18:11
adam_gvhost=on by default seems to be new to quantal (libvirt, i assume)18:11
hallynadam_g: yes, there was a bug about something like that before.18:12
hallynadam_g: don't we now add that rule for virbr0?18:12
adam_ghallyn: maybe. have not checked for that, actually. if thats the case, perhaps we can get it added to the rules nova sets up for its instances (it doesn't use virbr0)18:12
adam_ghallyn: ya, looks like it: -A POSTROUTING -o virbr0 -p udp -m udp --dport 68 -j CHECKSUM --checksum-fill18:14
adam_ghallyn: is that rule something specific to our packaging or standard libvirt practice now?18:15
hallynadam_g: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libvirt/+bug/102943018:15
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 1029430 in libvirt "KVM guests networking issues with no virbr0 and with vhost_net kernel modules loaded" [Low,Triaged]18:16
adam_ghallyn: ah! thanks18:16
hallynadam_g: i think libvirt does it for all of its networks18:16
hallynadam_g: i assume nova manually creatis its own bridge?18:16
adam_ghallyn: yes, and goes about managing its own set of iptables rules per-guest/security group18:18
adam_ghallyn: gonna tag that as a nova bug as well18:18
hallynadam_g: maybe mark it as a dup of 102943018:19
hallynmaybe not18:19
uvirtbotNew bug: #1029430 in libvirt "KVM guests networking issues with no virbr0 and with vhost_net kernel modules loaded" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/102943018:37
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uvirtbotNew bug: #1055688 in cloud-init "host keys not written to console" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/105568818:46
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stgraberhallyn: can you push 0222-debian-dhcp3-package to your git tree?18:53
njinballoons, this isn't working for me: Test-case dash/lens-preview-music18:54
njinops, wrong chan18:54
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hallynstgraber: ok19:00
hallynstgraber: but i see it's in lxc/lxc.  any reason why i shouldn't just clone that over?19:02
hallynstgraber: well, pushed just that one for now19:03
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stgraberhallyn: commit message is a bit confusing, will do a tiny bit of editing when pulling ;)19:11
hallynstgraber: thanks19:11
hallyni'm a bit scatterbrained.  too many open tasks19:11
hallynstgraber: do you happen to know if anyone actually runs/tests the powerpc iso's?19:12
hallynwondering if what i'm seeing is a bug in my qemu-system-ppc, or in the openbios blob, or in the ubuntu powerpc iso19:12
stgraberhallyn: some lubuntu folks are. The others usually suffer by lack of testers.19:12
hallynstgraber: ok, thanks.  i'll try to drop by and ask them19:13
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stgraberhallyn: looking on the tracker, the lubuntu desktop image was booting on the 24th, though with quite badly broken desktop apparently19:14
hallynstgraber: i was trying the alternate installer.  sounds like that's just untested :)  will try server and then lubuntu19:15
stgraberhallyn: change applied to staging19:17
gabrtvit's been about a week and i'm still seeing intermittent issues with the EC2 repository mirrors19:21
gabrtvhttp://stackoverflow.com/questions/12438946/e-unable-to-locate-package-git-ubuntu-on-ec2/12571429#1257142919:21
gabrtvapt-get install git gives: E: Unable to locate package git19:22
gabrtvapt-get update, try again.. maybe it works, maybe not..19:22
sarnoldhave you found one or another mirror that works better than others?19:22
gabrtvsarnold: https://gist.github.com/7448ce4edf141b22643f19:24
zuladam_g: ping for cinder you dont have to specify the -z cinder anymore19:25
sarnoldgabrtv: amazing. The second apt-get update downloads _more_ data than the first run!19:26
gabrtvlooks to me like http://us-east-1.ec2.archive.ubuntu.com works, and http://archive.ubuntu.com is busted19:31
gabrtvbut not 100% on that19:31
gabrtvalso, not sure how apt chooses which mirror to use.. the errors are pretty random.. sometimes works on attempt 1, other times attempt 2 or 319:31
gabrtvsarnold: something's badly awry w/ those mirrors.. i'm surprised i'm the only one who's noticed!19:32
gabrtvit's us-east-1 after all ;)19:32
sarnoldgabrtv: agreed that something seems strange there. I generally dislike hard-coding specific servers though...19:33
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gabrtvsmoser: saw your name as working on some of the EC2 mirrors, any thoughts?19:34
smosergabrtv, can you pastebin an error ?19:35
gabrtvsmoser: https://gist.github.com/7448ce4edf141b22643f19:35
gabrtvcorresponding shell at: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/12438946/e-unable-to-locate-package-git-ubuntu-on-ec2/12571429#1257142919:36
smosergabrtv, it would seem maybe your stderr went un-captured ?19:39
gabrtvyeah the exec environ is tty-less, over ssh19:39
smoserie, the output doesn't give any hints19:39
gabrtvthe point is that looping over apt-get update will eventually let me install `git`19:40
gabrtvsorry the formatting isn't more clear19:41
gabrtvbtw - this is us-east-1, if that wasn't clear19:41
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smosergabrtv, right. i understood the problem.19:48
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smoserbut you've not captured output that would help me figure out why19:48
gabrtvlet me see if i can get better log output19:49
hallynzul: weird, every time i try to make a change to bug 997978 (to mark the non-qemu-kvm bugs invalid) it times out19:52
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 997978 in qemu-kvm "KVM images lose connectivity with bridged network" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/99797819:52
zulwanna me try?19:52
zultimes out for me19:52
stgraberhallyn: let me try some magic19:53
stgraberhallyn: ok, even the API times out. Trying another way of killing those bug tasks.19:56
stgraberhallyn: gone19:57
three18tihow do I add swap space to ubuntu-server?  I'm trying to follow the instrictions here: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SwapFaq, but when I run dd it just creates a file that size...  should I replace /mnt/swap with the actual device that is to be swap?  (/dev/vdb in this case)19:57
hallynstgraber: thanks!19:57
stgraber(marking invalid didn't work, but removing them completely did)19:57
utlemmingsmoser: here19:58
hallynstgraber: from the api, or you could do it from the web interface?19:58
stgraberhallyn: I can remove tasks from the web interface. Not sure if that's something that's restricted to release-team/project-owners though19:59
stgraberhallyn: basically, if you can remove a task, you'll see a minus sign next to the package name (in a red circle). Click on that will remove the task completely19:59
uvirtbotNew bug: #1055658 in libvirt (main) "Under load, libvirt fails to start VMs concurrently" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/105565820:01
gabrtvsmoser: looks like the problem is a race condition w/ cloud-init.. archive.ubuntu.com doesn't have the `git` package, but the mirror does!20:05
hallynstgraber: yeah i don't see that20:06
hallynzul: i've just added sru description to bug 997978.  Did you push the ppa pkg to precise-proposed yet?20:06
uvirtbotLaunchpad bug 997978 in qemu-kvm "KVM images lose connectivity with bridged network" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/99797820:06
smosergabrtv, that doesn't make sense.20:06
smoserthe mirror is a mirror :)20:06
zulhallyn: not yet...i didnt know you want me to20:07
smosergabrtv, utlemming might be able to help you some more.20:07
smoserutlemming, gabrtv is having potential issue with the mirrors on ec220:07
utlemminggarbrtv, smoser: what's going on?20:08
gabrtvsmoser: appreciate it20:08
smoserhttps://gist.github.com/7448ce4edf141b22643f and http://stackoverflow.com/questions/12438946/e-unable-to-locate-package-git-ubuntu-on-ec2/12571429#1257142920:08
hallynzul: sorry, thought you had said you were going to.  i'll do it then, no worries.20:08
sorenI can do, too, if you want.20:08
zulhallyn: cool20:08
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gabrtvutlemming: the gist output is from an automated SSH exec.. it starts off using the archive.ubuntu.com repositories, in which it can't find `git`.. and then switches to the ec2 mirror repo (presumably due to cloud-init completing).. after which it can find the package20:09
hallynsoren: please go ahead20:09
sorenhallyn: Will do.20:09
hallyndrat i don't have the rights to push the sync'd augeas20:10
utlemminggarbtv: this is most unusual...but I wonder.....give me a couple of minutes20:11
hallynzul: can you sponsor http://people.canonical.com/~serge/augeas-sync/augeas_0.10.0-1fakesync1.dsc ?20:12
zulhallyn:  i suppose so20:12
hallynzul: thanks!20:12
hallyni would think augeas should be in the server upload set...20:12
zulhallyn:  404 on the tarball though20:12
hallyngrimace20:13
hallynzul: oh.  on the .orig.  bc we're keeping the ubuntu one20:14
zulyeah20:14
hallynzul: yeah so i kept it out of there to make sure i didn't copy the wrong one :)  (since it's in the archive).  but i just pushed it, pls retry dget20:15
zulcurl: (22) The requested URL returned error: 404 Not Found20:15
zuli think you need to update your changes20:15
hallynzul: got it.  silly me.  re-pushed.  i can now dget+extract20:18
utlemminggrabtv: can you put your script into apt debug mode for me?20:19
zulhallyn: uploaded20:22
hallynzul: thanks!20:22
hallynsorry about the mess20:22
gabrtvutlemming: is there a cmdline switch?20:23
utlemminggrabtv: try -o "Debug::Acquire::Http=True"20:24
gabrtvsure thing20:24
gabrtvutlemming: here ya go http://pastebin.com/z34Bgz8v .. was able to reproduce the same race condition.. check out line 102720:34
gabrtvsorry, 101720:34
DavieySpamapS: hey, did you disucss ceph with jamespage earlier?20:41
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SpamapSDaviey: we did20:53
SpamapSDaviey: I think either upload is fine. Mine was just adding a few dirs that are not 100% necessary20:53
DavieySpamapS: i dropped Jamespage's.. just waiting on your nod to accept yours.20:55
DavieyI assume i should progress?20:55
SpamapSDaviey: yes please! :)20:56
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DavieySpamapS: accepted20:57
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uvirtbot`New bug: #1046432 in quantum (universe) "FFE for quantum" [High,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104643221:01
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SpamapS50 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 2 not upgraded.21:12
SpamapSNeed to get 46.0 MB of archives.21:12
SpamapSneed.. new.. cloud..images...21:12
gabrtvutlemming: not sure if you got my message beforeā€¦  http://pastebin.com/z34Bgz8v .. was able to reproduce the same race condition.. check out line 101721:19
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uvirtbot`New bug: #978127 in cloud-init "incorrect time on node causes failed oauth" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/97812721:26
utlemminggabrtv: sorry, about that....on the phone...looking21:32
utlemminggarbtv: can you send me your script21:32
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gabrtvutlemming: http://pastebin.com/JKewkpbF ..21:33
gabrtvto reproduce the error on EC2 you'll have to run it before cloud-init finishes21:33
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TDJACR_Does anyone know of a good socks 5 proxy with UDP support?23:32
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adam_gSpamapS: ping23:39
SpamapSadam_g: pong, talk quickly, must go in 6 minutes23:39
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adam_gSpamapS: just wondering about that  openvswitch 1.4.0-1ubuntu1.3 upload thats still sitting in queue for precise-proposed. is there something blocking it?23:41
SpamapSadam_g: mostly just the release/SRU teams being busy w/ othe rthings23:42
adam_gSpamapS: yea, figured as much.23:42
SpamapSadam_g: I only did 1 SRU last week .. many others were similarly distracted23:42
SpamapSadam_g: and w/ quantal getting closer....23:42
SpamapStough to put much energy into the smoldering embers of 12.04 when quantal is approaching 3-alarms ;)23:43
adam_gyup23:43
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