[00:12] <Azelphur> ali1234: this is a shame, looks like the gnome15 developer has disappeared, no longer maintaining the project
[00:12] <Azelphur> I might fork it
[01:31] <ali1234> Azelphur: he put out a new version about 2 weeks ago
[01:31] <Azelphur> ali1234: huh? no?
[01:31] <Azelphur> ali1234: he hasn't logged in to his own website in 2 months nearly
[01:32] <ali1234> oh ok
[01:54] <Azelphur> ali1234: hey cool, just found out I got a mention at bitcoin conference http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmPD_YSQ--k&t=18m17s
[01:54] <Azelphur> that loan was me xD
[02:10] <ali1234> Azelphur: i've not been online for a week, but last i heard was nefario got in trouble over some thing that was listed
[02:10] <ali1234> i think it was a GLBSE stock that wasn't done by him but by a scammer
[02:10] <Azelphur> ali1234: *shrug* glbse is down atm and theres a lot of uncertainty :p
[02:10] <ali1234> lol
[02:11] <ali1234> what happened?
[02:12] <Azelphur> ali1234: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=115669.0
[02:16] <ali1234> HA
[02:16] <Azelphur> indeed
[02:16] <ali1234> fail
[02:16] <Azelphur> oh the woes of bitcoin
[02:16] <ali1234> i have no idea what any of that means
[02:17] <ali1234> any update on pirate?
[02:18] <Azelphur> ali1234: 12th is when that ticks for news
[02:18] <Azelphur> http://pastebin.com/DVNsx7xz
[07:26] <christel> morning
[07:48] <czajkowski> morning
[07:54] <christel> HELLO czajkowski!
[07:54] <christel> czajkowski: would jon like to be in a shortfilm?
[07:54] <christel> we need some extras for a scene we're filming on the 14th!
[07:54] <christel> (in london)
[08:05] <czajkowski> ou can ask but unsure
[08:05] <czajkowski> *you
[08:05]  * czajkowski is in .IE 
[08:05] <czajkowski> so not in prodding distance
[08:06] <christel> aah yes i forget!
[08:08] <bigcalm_laptop> Good morning peeps :)
[08:37] <popey> morning
[08:48] <bigcalm_laptop> Hola popey
[08:49] <AlanBell> morning
[08:49] <bigcalm_laptop> Hi AlanBell
[08:50] <popey> pip pip
[08:51] <rewritable> g'day
[08:51] <popey> lo
[08:54] <bigcalm_laptop> I'm at a conference and yet I'm still on IRC
[08:54] <popey> \o/
[08:55] <AlanBell> what conference?
[08:58] <bigcalm_laptop> phpnw12
[08:58] <bigcalm_laptop> Up in Manchester
[08:59] <bigcalm_laptop> mgdm is here as well, somewhere
[09:00] <AlanBell> oh I saw some tweets from lornajane about that too
[09:00] <bigcalm_laptop> :)
[09:01] <MooDoo> morning all
[09:01] <bigcalm_laptop> She's run off to prepare for her own talk
[09:01] <AlanBell> now I know what the hashtag means :)
[09:01] <bigcalm_laptop> :D
[09:01] <bigcalm_laptop> AlanBell: time to spam it then ;)
[09:02] <AlanBell> http://instagram.com/p/Qb1DR9p_4X/ looks busy
[09:03]  * AlanBell plays spot the bigcalm_laptop 
[09:04] <bigcalm_laptop> AlanBell: I'm to the far left of that photo
[09:29]  * popey notes it would probably be easier to spot him if they hadn't used instagram to "improve" the picture
[09:31] <AlanBell> I don't get the point of instagram
[09:31] <AlanBell> lets make pictures square and worse, and sell out for billions \o/
[09:31] <AlanBell> how does that plan ever succeed?
[09:32] <apacheuk> morning all, quick question I've been using 12.10 on a laptop (for testing) since the first alpha, performing the updates every day... in the last two days the system has become unstable and crashes shortly afterward, I've submitted the a bug using the automated process but I noticed in the bug info that it still talks about 'alpha' version.... does applying the updates everyday not mean I'm at the latest beta or d
[09:32] <apacheuk> o I have to dl that?
[09:33] <AlanBell> apacheuk: if you have ben doing the updates, then you are up to date
[09:33] <AlanBell> bug number?
[09:33] <apacheuk> AlanBell: OK cheers... I thought so, but wanted a sanity check
[09:33] <apacheuk> 1062743
[09:33] <AlanBell> bug 1062743
[09:35] <popey> apacheuk, any particular reason you're using nouveau and not the binary nvidia driver?
[09:36] <apacheuk> popey: can't honestly remember why... I haven't used it on any of my other systems.... I don't think so anyway :)
[09:36] <popey> is it a mac?
[09:36] <apacheuk> no, Toshiba P100
[09:36] <popey> I'd install "nvidia-current" then
[09:37] <apacheuk> doing so now,
[09:38] <apacheuk> cheers
[09:40] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[09:40] <AlanBell> do supermarkets still do printed cakes?
[09:41] <popey> yes
[09:41] <popey> asda do i think
[10:04] <jacobw> morning
[10:04] <brobostigon> morning jacobw
[10:11] <ali1234> can they print a cake based on jpeg? because i would love to see marzipan jpeg artifacts
[10:13] <jacobw> that's not a normal wish
[10:19] <AlanBell> ali1234: I think I will find out what formats are acceptable, I did one ages ago and yes, there were jpeg artifacts
[10:20] <AlanBell> it basically gets printed onto a thin icing sheet by an inkjet printer
[11:45] <Laney> Going out... to buy running shoes...
[11:45] <Laney> I made a rash promise to run a half marathon
[11:45] <Laney> having never run more than for the bus in my life, this could be bad
[11:46] <popey> :)
[11:52] <jacobw> oh dear
[11:52] <Laney> I have a whole year to get fit :P
[11:54] <penguin42> there was a thing where Wolfram explained that he had a treadmill positioned where he could type and work on his computer while walking on it; and he had years of pedometer graphs from it
[11:54] <jacobw> that's quite a long time
[11:55] <jacobw> i can't imagine wolfram jogging
[11:57] <penguin42> jacobw: http://blog.stephenwolfram.com/2012/03/the-personal-analytics-of-my-life/    not sure it was actually jogging
[11:57] <penguin42> jacobw: The stats he gathers are amazing; timing of every keystroke he's typed for 10 years
[12:19] <popey> AlanBell, a carton of tomato juice arrived :D
[12:43] <penguin42> popey: How much (and how many varieties) have you drunk in the last week?
[12:43] <AlanBell> popey: \o/
[12:46] <popey> only one variety
[12:46] <popey> 2L
[12:54] <gord> £10 to anyone that can drink a 2L carton of tomato sauce
[13:20] <czajkowski> aloha
[13:28] <popey> yo czajkowski hows it going?
[13:34] <czajkowski> good thanks
[13:34] <czajkowski> people turned up
[13:34] <czajkowski> loved marks talk
[13:34] <czajkowski> lots came out going I'm going to try unity and loved the lens
[13:34] <czajkowski> as he demoed how to do stuff via the dash and lens
[13:38] <czajkowski> tweetng lots :)
[14:46] <czajkowski> release party for London taking place http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2006/detail/ open to all to come along
[15:22] <jacobw> czajkowski: the url contains events/ubuntu-uk/2006 ?
[15:25] <czajkowski> yup
[15:25] <czajkowski> event id
[15:25] <jacobw> wolfram looks like my secondary school history teacher, it's confusing for me :(
[15:25] <penguin42> haha
[15:25] <jacobw> czajkowski: coincidence strikes again
[15:39] <jacobw> unity 6.8 is a performance improvement
[15:40] <jacobw> it seems faster to me but not smoother
[16:31] <jacobw> hey hamitron, stgraber
[16:31] <hamitron> evening
[16:31] <hamitron> :)
[16:43] <popey> jacobw, bug reports welcome
[16:52] <ali1234> "it seems faster" doesn't sound like a bug to me
[17:07] <jacobw> popey: which package would i file jerky window animations against?
[17:08] <jacobw> popey: as far as i know, the window animations are implemented as compiz plugin, so would that be compiz-plugins-main?
[17:09] <popey> if you can get it on video that would be good, but just file against comiz itself
[17:09] <jacobw> ok, i'm looking at the screencast instructions now, thanks
[17:09] <popey> might be better with a phone/camera
[17:09] <popey> screencast might not show it up as well, or may make it worse
[17:10] <ali1234> screencast definitely will make it 1 million times worse
[17:18] <jacobw> the case that can reproduce is probably a caused by terminal redrawing
[17:40] <popey> AlanBell, can you access the Ubuntu UK G+ page? I used to have access but no longer do
[17:40] <AlanBell> yes
[17:41] <popey> the UUPC one has just vanished since the last show
[17:41] <popey> and all the posts have gone
[17:41] <AlanBell> wow
[17:42] <AlanBell> was it attached to your other G+ account?
[17:48] <popey> no
[17:48] <popey> i only have one G+ account
[17:49] <popey> oh, hang on.. it once was
[17:49] <popey> and I disabled that old account, bet that's it
[17:49] <popey> balls
[17:52]  * popey re-creates
[17:57] <livingdaylight> hi
[17:58] <livingdaylight> is there bbc iplayer for linux; a workaround?
[17:58] <penguin42> livingdaylight: Should find it just works in the browser
[17:59] <livingdaylight> yes, works in the browser, I mean for downloading and watching later, penguin42
[17:59] <penguin42> livingdaylight: Ah there was a get-iplayer a while ago, not sure if it's still available
[18:00] <popey> it still works
[18:00] <livingdaylight> it still works? was that command-line only, or was there a gui front-end developed for it too?
[18:01] <penguin42> I only ever used the command line one, I think there was a front end though
[18:01] <popey> http://git.infradead.org/get_iplayer.git
[18:01] <popey> there was
[18:01] <popey> still is
[18:01] <popey> git clone git://git.infradead.org/get_iplayer.git
[18:01] <popey> job done
[18:01] <livingdaylight> thanks !
[18:01] <popey> might also need rtmpdump if you want HD download
[18:03] <Darael> The get-iplayer package doesn't include the GUI but does exist, so it may be marginally easier.  I'm sure it didn't depend on flvstreamer before, but it's in the recommends now.
[18:58] <exobuzz> you will need rtmpdump yeh
[19:44] <ali1234> any model railway experts here?
[19:47] <ali1234> i'm trying to fix an old motor from model railway. it has springs inside the motor to form a connection to power. and i have no idea why. they don't seem to serve any purpose except to fall out and get lost and prevent the thing from working
[19:48] <ali1234> which is what has happened, probably 20 years ago
[19:49] <Darael> Inside the actual motor, or inside the engine model forming a connection to the motor?  Most models I've seen have internal wires soldered on to the motors.
[19:50] <Darael> But springs could allow for easier replacement with a non-identical motor?
[19:50] <ali1234> Darael: i found a picture of an identical one online http://img441.imageshack.us/i/cimg2935.jpg/
[19:51] <ali1234> you see the two brass "tabs"
[19:51] <ali1234> under there is a hole
[19:51] <ali1234> in the hole is a small metal peg
[19:51] <ali1234> the tab doesn't touch the peg, there's a spring in each hole that maintains the contact
[19:52] <ali1234> you can just see a tiny bit of it on the right hand side
[19:55] <ali1234> this is what i have: http://ubuntuone.com/1BLslh5ivgt3oPSS9zwFJ1
[19:56] <Darael> Hmm.  Something to do with maintaining the contact over things like points and slightly-loose track-connections that cause jolting, perhaps?  But why not just use a solid contact the whole way through?
[19:57] <Darael> Nope, no idea.
[19:57] <ali1234> i dunno
[19:57] <ali1234> i guess it is so you can replace the motor inside without soldering
[19:57] <ali1234> "somehow"
[19:57] <ali1234> but the spring falls out so easy
[19:57] <ali1234> and then you have a broken train. cos you have zero chance of finding it. it is tiny
[19:58] <ali1234> well look at that: you can buy replacements for £5 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LIMA-Motor-Brushes-and-Springs-OO-HO-600875-/300681796833
[19:58] <ali1234> that's probably more than this thing is worth
[19:59] <Darael> Heh.
[19:59] <ali1234> i bet i have a spring likethat in one of my junk boxes actually
[20:00] <Darael> The thing to do would be to attach one end of the spring more permanently.  Probably the tab end.
[20:00] <ali1234> yeah that would be smart
[20:00] <ali1234> i bet they get a lot of ... i dunno corrosion from sparks
[20:01] <ali1234> so they probably need replacing from time to time anyway
[20:01] <Darael> Probably.  Do the attachment with a tiny bit of solder, though, and one could just melt it off again when replacement-time came.  Might be tricky to get it soldered right in the first place...
[20:02] <ali1234> i guess fixing the thing all the time is the most fun thing about model trains. if it just worked and went round and round forever... it would be the most boring hobby ever
[20:02] <Darael> Nah, model railways are a bit like gardens: Sometimes finished, never complete.
[20:25] <Goshawk_> Hi there, how do I give myself write permission?
[20:27] <Azelphur> Goshawk_: I wrote a blog post explaining permissions, http://blog.azelphur.com/node/295
[20:32] <Goshawk_> Azelphur: cheers for that
[20:32] <Azelphur> Goshawk_: welcome :)
[20:42] <brobostigon> interesting, ubuntu-gnome remix.
[20:42] <penguin42> ?
[20:43] <brobostigon> penguin42: something i just found on the wiki, that is new to 12.10.
[20:47] <ali1234> cool i fixed it by making my own spring from a piece of wire
[20:47] <penguin42> brobostigon: Cool, I'll try that in my test vm
[20:47] <brobostigon> penguin42: :)
[20:48] <penguin42> (although the X server on quantal doesn't really seem to like kvm guests)
[20:50]  * penguin42 wishes he would remember the syntex to apt-key for adding keys, I'm getting better but it still takes a few goes
[20:51] <brobostigon> weird thing is though, i have debian unstable running gnome3, and running this of an sdhc, ubuntu-gnome with gnome3.6 seems alittle faster.
[20:52] <penguin42> brobostigon: I was impressed in the speed of gnome3 running in a vm, it seems faster than unity these days
[20:53] <brobostigon> penguin42: i havent tried unity in about a year. so couldnt say myself. properly.
[20:53] <penguin42> brobostigon: I give it a try every so often
[20:54] <brobostigon> penguin42: i used to use ubuntu woth gnome3 ppa, then went to debian-unstable with gnome3, when that ppa went out of date. so when i found this remix earlier this evening, i thought, yes, it kinda fits better, which what i was looking for.
[20:55] <Goshawk_> I'm trying to install a program but it keeps telling me I don't have permission, can anyone help?
[20:56] <penguin42> Goshawk_: How are you trying to install it ?
[20:56] <Goshawk_> penguin42: in the terminal
[20:56] <penguin42> brobostigon: Hmm, I don't get any new options on login, still just ubuntu (i.e. unity?) or Gnome
[20:56] <penguin42> (or gnome classic - hmm what's that)
[20:57] <brobostigon> penguin42: gnome-shell, and then gnome-fallback.
[20:58] <Azelphur> I just had a clever idea for my nexus 7 xD
[20:59] <brobostigon> penguin42: but like normal, ubuntu uses about double the ram of debian.
[20:59] <Azelphur> My N7 is usually perm tethered to my S3 to get internet anyway, I wonder if I could run a NFS server on my S3, giving the N7 a boatload of storage
[21:00] <brobostigon> Azelphur: yes, that is possible.
[21:00] <Azelphur> I'm hunting for an android NFS server now, hehe
[21:00] <brobostigon> :)
[21:06] <Azelphur> I found a samba server, but this makes me feel sad inside
[21:14] <Azelphur> do ATI cards have a VDPAU equivalent on Linux?
[21:16] <ali1234> ugh i just found the instructions that explains everything about the springs + brushes
[21:17] <Darael> Well done.
[22:25] <penguin42> Azelphur: What's vdpau?
[22:26] <Azelphur> penguin42: GPU video acceleration
[22:26] <Azelphur> so you can play 1080p videos on old crappy processors
[22:26] <penguin42> Azelphur: So yes I think they support the Xv stuff and other X extensions
[22:26] <Azelphur> fun
[22:28] <penguin42> Azelphur: Even the open driver is claiming to have XVideo and XVideo-MotionCompensation - I think there are bits glued into the GLX stuff as well but I don't really know
[22:28]  * Azelphur shrugs
[22:36] <MartijnVdS> Azelphur: libva > vdpau
[22:36] <MartijnVdS> vainfo tells you what's supported (h264, mpeg2)
[22:37] <MartijnVdS> there's a backend for vdpau and one for intel (and probably ati)
[22:37] <MartijnVdS> there's a gstreamer element, and vlc supports libva
[22:37] <MartijnVdS> as does xbmc
[22:38] <MartijnVdS> it's the New Hotness©
[22:38] <MartijnVdS> ®
[22:43] <Azelphur> fun
[22:43] <Azelphur> I'm planning to start migrating all my stuff away from nvidia, I've had enough of them :p
[22:46] <Azelphur> looks like my netbook handles N64 emulation with no issues
[22:46] <Azelphur> well maybe a little choppy, probably needs some config
[23:01] <mattt> heeeeeelp
[23:01] <mattt> had this annoying cold for near on 7 days now :~(
[23:01] <penguin42> mattt: Ah, you to
[23:04] <penguin42> mattt: Started really badly last saturday, I've managed just about to work the week and still feel crap
[23:04] <popey>  yeah, wifey has had that too
[23:07] <Azelphur> how do I tell if I'm running fglrx or not? jockey seems to be a bit confused
[23:12] <ali1234> if opencl works you're using fglrx
[23:12] <ali1234> well if it works and doesn;t say "CPU"
[23:12] <ali1234> i'm sure you;re familiar with that stuff :)
[23:12] <ali1234> the opencl stuff is built in to the newest drivers in ubuntu i think
[23:13] <ali1234> i had to go through and fix that up. you don't need the app-sdk any more
[23:13] <Azelphur> is there not a command I can use to check? I'm not after setting up opencl stuff on here
[23:13] <ali1234> clinfo
[23:13] <ali1234> it's incuded in fglrx driver now iirc
[23:13] <ali1234> you can also look at xorg.0.log
[23:13] <ali1234> look for catalyst/fglrx references
[23:14] <Azelphur> nope, no such package, xorg.log has some fglrx stuff so I guess I'm running proprietary even though jockey says I'm not \o/
[23:15] <ali1234> hmm
[23:15] <ali1234> it's real easy to mess up catalyst drivers :(
[23:16] <ali1234> i think i too am going to put the 5870 into my desktop and give up mining when bitcoin subsidy cut happens
[23:16] <ali1234> though nvidia might win me back if their new xrandr stuff is good
[23:18] <Azelphur> ali1234: I got pissed off with nvidia big time now over the multi monitor thing
[23:18]  * Azelphur is in full anti nvidia PR mode now :p
[23:18] <ali1234> it always worked fine for me
[23:18] <ali1234> about 3 people have >2 monitors
[23:18] <penguin42> Azelphur: I'm told nouveau is getting a lot better, certainly for 2d use and multiple monitors
[23:19] <ali1234> nouveau still doesn't support my card
[23:19] <ali1234> it crashes within 20 minutes every time, and is marked as "unsupported, please don't report bugs"
[23:19] <Azelphur> ali1234: they implemented >2 monitor support
[23:19] <penguin42> erk
[23:20] <Azelphur> then they bricked it to only allow 3 monitors
[23:20] <Azelphur> to try and force quadro cards and GTX 680's onto people
[23:20] <Azelphur> that made me mad.
[23:20] <ali1234> Azelphur: yeah i heard about that. but only about 1 person has >3 monitors
[23:20]  * Azelphur shrugs
[23:20] <ali1234> buy a quadro card
[23:22] <Azelphur> or just buy an AMD card, they don't brick the software as a marketing tactic, and they work with open devs too \o/
[23:24] <ali1234> unfortunately that does not mean the drivers are any good :(
[23:27] <Azelphur> indeed, hopefully they will be soon
[23:29] <ali1234> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19857243
[23:29] <penguin42> ali1234: Yeh, that looks 'fun'
[23:29] <ali1234> is that the one that's supposed to be secure because "we keep all your details on our secure server"
[23:31] <penguin42> ali1234: I don't know
[23:32] <ali1234> i wouldn't be surprised if it was related to the apple udid thing
[23:34] <penguin42> why?
[23:35] <penguin42> ali1234: I mean a trojan'd phone or phished account is the most likely rather than something specific to that
[23:35] <ali1234> i suspect that the implementation is broken, hence them taking it offline for updates
[23:36] <ali1234> just reducing the daily limit is changing one variable
[23:36] <penguin42> and that's connected to the apple uuid how?
[23:36] <ali1234> that doesn't require taking the service off line. scrambling to fix a broken protocol that authenticates against udid however...
[23:37] <ali1234> like, suppose you only need the udid + 4 digit pin and there's no rate limiting on wrong attempts
[23:37] <ali1234> you take the list of udid and try every one with the same pin. that way nobody's account gets blocked. and sometimes you get it right the first time
[23:38] <ali1234> so there's no record of invalid attempts against that account
[23:38] <ali1234> in fact a guy demonstrated this exact attack against telephone banking service in india
[23:39] <ali1234> let me find the video
[23:40] <ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-y7aIKLgMoM
[23:42] <penguin42> haha that's dumb
[23:44] <ali1234> so yeah basically just them taking it offline makes me really suspicious that there's a serious flaw in the implementation that can't be trivially fixed
[23:45] <brobostigon> [A
[23:45] <brobostigon> good night everyone, sleep well.
[23:51] <penguin42> ali1234: Watching that talk, it's just dumb - I mean using your normal pin on a phone bank app is just plain stupid
[23:52] <ali1234> yeah. he does some more interesting stuff with SQL injection over speech recognition later, but that is not relevant
[23:53] <ali1234> to what i am saying. all i'm saying is we know it's stupid. that doesn't mean it doesn't happen :)
[23:53] <ali1234> using just the pin is obviously stupid. but combining it with the udid of the user's phone looks like it adds security. until all the udids get leaked.
[23:54] <ali1234> "it's Ok to use the PIN, because nobody else would have access to the user's phone anyway, so it doesn't matter"
[23:54] <ali1234> or rather "they would need physical access to the phone and they need to know the pin, therefore this is two factor" - but really it isn't
[23:58] <penguin42> ali1234: Yeh I think any app can read the udid so it doesn't take much, but fi you've got a good trojan'd app then it could take the pin anyway
[23:59] <ali1234> yep
[23:59] <ali1234> and it's probably a combination of all these things.
[23:59] <penguin42> ali1234: I actually suspect it might be more of a simple phishing type case - there is a lot of phishing going on, and I've been getting lots of Natwest phishing mails recently