[15:54] <silverarrow> how serious is it to test a new kernel?
[15:54] <silverarrow> someone asked me to test an upstream kernel, and what to do?
[15:55] <silverarrow> I filed a but on non working wireless chipsets, and there is a reply
[15:56] <patdk-wk> it's a bit of a pain, but not hard to install
[15:56] <patdk-wk> and testing it is very simple
[16:16] <elfy> balloons: you got a link to the arm beta1 - I can't find one
[16:16] <balloons> elfy, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/quantal/beta-1/ubuntu-12.10-beta1-desktop-armhf+omap4.img
[16:17] <elfy> cheers - no idea why you want me to install that and upgrade it to the state of the one I've got here that works fine though :)
[16:18] <balloons> elfy, yes, it was requested by the teams to test continuity in the archive
[16:18] <elfy> hope I can get it working then - can't remember that one working for me
[16:18] <balloons> I don't suspect we'll see issues, but I am/was worried about unity 6.8 on ARM
[16:19] <elfy> k
[16:21] <elfy> will do it tomorrow now - damn things are slow to install anyway
[16:21] <elfy> today's daily appears to be fine though :)
[16:26] <silverarrow> can Ubuntu live in 30GB?
[16:26] <silverarrow> on*
[16:26] <elfy> mine always used to fine silverarrow
[16:26] <silverarrow> good
[16:27] <silverarrow> I am downloading todays Ubuntu, and plan on dual install
[16:27] <silverarrow> with lubuntu
[16:27] <elfy> oic
[16:28] <silverarrow> ?
[16:28] <elfy> 30 Gb shared? or just for ubuntu - I used to run with 10Gb just so you know
[16:29] <silverarrow> just for ubuntu
[16:30] <elfy> loads of room
[16:30] <silverarrow> 10GB and runs fine?
[16:31] <silverarrow> not sure about that
[16:31] <elfy> yea never had any issues at all
[16:31] <silverarrow> so grub is probably the main issue then
[16:31] <elfy> not sure what it'd be like now silverarrow - but my xubuntu - which has had all manner of things installed is at 8.3
[16:32] <elfy> issue?
[16:32] <silverarrow> yeah, to make it behave with dual boot. login and all that
[16:33] <elfy> should be ok silverarrow - I've never had to fight with win7 or anything
[16:35] <balloons> I run ubuntu on about 6 gig
[16:36] <balloons> not for the feint of heart ;-)
[16:36] <elfy> :)
[16:36] <silverarrow> ooh
[16:36] <balloons> I wouldn't go lower than 8.. 10 is much btter
[16:36] <patdk-wk> 6gig what?
[16:36] <balloons> the full install is about 5 gig
[16:36] <elfy> so do I - but it never gets updated - just gets installed over again
[16:36] <silverarrow> it can have 30
[16:36] <balloons> and as soon as you update, you need space to download and have 2 copies of packages at the same time
[16:36] <patdk-wk> I normally do 20gig for ubuntu desktop, generally only ever use 8gigs of it
[16:36] <balloons> let's just say I have to massage dist-upgrades through on that thing
[16:37] <patdk-wk> my mythtv frontends are currently using 3gigs
[16:37] <balloons> I'm not doing it by choice persay,  I only have an 8 gig ssd
[16:37] <elfy> balloons: pppft - I just apt-get clean first :)
[16:37] <elfy> actually I don't
[16:37] <patdk-wk> my servers are all either 2 or 8gigs :)
[16:37] <patdk-wk> normally <1gig used
[16:37] <silverarrow> you might get a larger one, these days they are a bit cheaper
[16:37] <elfy> I just never really upgrade it
[16:38] <balloons> elfy, I have to uninstall all large programs
[16:38] <balloons> dist-upgrade, intterupt, apt-get clean, then continue
[16:38] <silverarrow> but as long as it works, thing are fine
[16:38] <balloons> then re-install big stuff
[16:38] <elfy> :)
[16:38] <balloons> :-P
[16:39] <balloons> I'm on 12.04 lts now.. it's never upgrading again
[16:39] <balloons> it will EOL on that
[16:39] <silverarrow> we should get balloons  a new ssd for christmas
[16:39] <elfy> lol
[16:40]  * silverarrow suspects he already have one in a drawer 
[16:40] <patdk-wk> 8gig ssd's are so painfully slow
[16:40] <balloons> lol
[16:40] <balloons> it's the only ssd I own actually
[16:41] <balloons> to be honest, I've never really run them, since in my desktops are all traditional disks
[16:41] <silverarrow> I  have none, I consider my 7200rpm speedy
[16:41] <patdk-wk> I thought so too
[16:41] <patdk-wk> even upgraded my 7200rpm laptop drive to ssd, and didn't think ssd was much faster
[16:41] <patdk-wk> ssd died, went back to the drive
[16:41] <patdk-wk> oh the pain
[16:41] <silverarrow> lol
[16:42] <elfy> I'd not know one if it got up and said hi
[16:42] <silverarrow> a step back is always the worst
[16:42] <balloons> an ssd boot with crazy read performance makes sense
[16:42] <balloons> keepin your stuff on a traditional drive is fine
[16:42] <patdk-wk> well, in this case, did lots of vm suspend/restores
[16:42] <patdk-wk> so the ssd made that increadably fast
[16:42] <silverarrow> I want one of those Samsung 9 series,
[16:42] <patdk-wk> my current laptop has dual 256g ssd's
[16:43] <silverarrow> I think they are 125GB SSD
[16:45] <patdk-wk> I went with a lenovo t530, and customized it with a msata 256g and samsung 830 256g
[16:47] <silverarrow> I`m not sure I have seen the lenovo model
[16:47] <patdk-wk> hmm, yo ucan get a samsung 9 with 256g, but not quadcore cpu it looks like
[16:48] <patdk-wk> I figured I needed a quad core, in order to last long enough, without it feeling painfully slow in a year or two
[16:48] <silverarrow> I would be happy with a asus zenbook, but they don`t have 15" screens
[16:49] <silverarrow> yeah, that is the best way about it
[16:49] <silverarrow> computers often live on long after you get a new one even
[16:49] <patdk-wk> yep, totally overspec'd the laptop
[16:49] <patdk-wk> hmm, not my laptops :)
[16:50] <patdk-wk> well, my last laptop lenovo t61p is 5 years old now
[16:50] <silverarrow> they don`t?
[16:50] <patdk-wk> it's completely toast
[16:50] <silverarrow> I have had laptops die after less than 3 years, some lasted 11 years, a handmedown packard bell
[16:51] <patdk-wk> screen has issues, cpu won't stay cool, fan works ok, new battery drains faster than it should, case is worn so thin, it's cracking
[16:51] <silverarrow> it worked fine with almost anything bug flash
[16:51] <silverarrow> It wasn`t all that good though
[16:52] <silverarrow> this time I want a new one, with as high specs as possible on a slim laptop
[16:53] <silverarrow> teh t530 looks like it has a double screen
[16:53] <patdk-wk> hmm?
[16:53] <patdk-wk> it has a 1920x1080 15" screen
[16:53] <patdk-wk> and can have 4 screens total attached
[16:53] <silverarrow> maybe just the pick then
[16:54] <silverarrow> no, it is correct rendering
[16:54] <patdk-wk> I tested 4 screen mode, while works, not fun on linux to do yet
[16:54] <patdk-wk> plus, powering on the nvidia graphics card doubles the laptop power draw, from my normal 6-9w to 20w
[16:55] <silverarrow> which matters if you run on battery
[16:55] <patdk-wk> ya, I like getting 10-12h per battery :)
[16:55] <silverarrow> any heat issues?
[16:55] <patdk-wk> nope, at 10w, the whole thing stays cold
[16:56] <silverarrow> great
[16:56] <silverarrow> I have to run now, back later
[16:56] <silverarrow> it`s getting dark
[17:00]  * patdk-wk sends silverarrow a usb flashlight
[18:17] <silverarrow> patdk-wk: are you there?
[18:18] <silverarrow> I was in center of town just now, and in one of the old radio shops (which hardly has radios any more) the had a Lenovo B570,
[18:22] <patdk-wk> hmm, dunno that one
[18:23] <patdk-wk> I stick to the R/T/W/X lines, as the others seem to be lacking quality
[18:23] <silverarrow> it was just before closing time so I didn`t get to see all the models
[18:24] <silverarrow> it was unusually low priced
[18:24] <patdk-wk> ya, looks a lot like my sl500
[18:24] <patdk-wk> that one only lasted me a year :(
[18:24] <silverarrow> oh
[18:24] <silverarrow> terrible
[18:24] <silverarrow> they should at least last five
[18:24] <silverarrow> with out serious hardware failure
[18:24] <patdk-wk> the plastic just wore out, from my hands rubbing on it
[18:24] <patdk-wk> and the screen flexed too much and broke
[18:25] <silverarrow> that happened on a fujitsu I had
[18:25] <patdk-wk> and each time they *repaired* it, it got more broke
[18:25] <silverarrow> the silvergrey finish wore off
[18:25] <patdk-wk> I litterally wore a hole though it :)
[18:25] <silverarrow> I don`t know lenovo, but I have liked some HP models
[18:26] <patdk-wk> well, lenovo used to be ibm, till ibm said they didn't want to make consumer stuff anymore
[18:26]  * silverarrow wonders what kind of hands patdk-wk has. Sandingpaper or very acid?
[18:26] <patdk-wk> but lenovo had branched off the ibm line with other lower priced lines
[18:26] <patdk-wk> defently sandpaper
[18:27] <silverarrow> lol
[18:27] <silverarrow> I have noticed some asus models have steel casing
[18:27] <patdk-wk> actually, I had to grow my hands skin back a few years back
[18:27] <silverarrow> like a dark brushed steel
[18:27] <patdk-wk> I froze it all off
[18:27] <silverarrow> they look good
[18:27] <silverarrow> horrid
[18:28] <patdk-wk> nothing like taking your hands, and making them -40c in a few seconds
[18:28] <silverarrow> you were in the mountains or?
[18:28] <silverarrow> oh, nitogen tank?
[18:28] <patdk-wk> all the skin came off, and took about 2 months for the skin to grow back, and a good year for it to stop cracking
[18:28] <patdk-wk> na, hvac
[18:28]  * silverarrow googles hvac
[18:29] <silverarrow> oh, and acronym
[18:29] <silverarrow> we hardly have those here
[18:30] <silverarrow> we have ventilation, but the more advanced air condition only larger shoppings centers and office buildings
[18:31] <silverarrow> I know a guy who is the sort who volunters on military practices and that kind of thing
[18:31] <silverarrow> he lost a toe
[18:31] <silverarrow> froze off
[18:31] <silverarrow> and next year happily joins again
[18:49] <elfy> balloons: not sur whether upgrading from beta 1 via update mangler is something that I would generally do - especially as it is telling me it's a partial upgrade ;)
[18:50] <balloons> elfy, oh really?
[18:50] <balloons> is the archive not in a good state atm
[18:50] <balloons> I just upgraded
[18:53] <elfy> no idea - software sources crashed as well
[18:54] <elfy> or I think it did - this beta 1 had that really annoying m,ove the mouse and you can't see anything bug :)
[18:54] <elfy> just going to see what synaptic says first
[18:55] <elfy> the use the whole disk only allocates something like 400Mb of swapfor some reason as well
[19:00] <elfy> balloons: confirmed that archived tests bug :)
[19:01] <balloons> elfy, so it works yes?
[19:01] <elfy> yep = I put some results today
[19:01] <elfy> I'll keep an eye on it over the next couple of days when I do tests
[19:01] <balloons> k.. I think knome and I found it was a bug
[19:02] <elfy> yea - I read the backlog in here
[19:02] <balloons> we still need to file the actual bug.. attempting to recreate on staging
[19:02] <elfy> I really wish I'd accidentally not read this qa ARM email today ...
[19:02] <elfy> ok - well if you need me to do anything with it then just shout
[19:13] <elfy> balloons: no it's not the archive its update manager - synaptic is fine with it - upgrades and to be installed all going now
[19:14] <balloons> ahh
[19:14] <balloons> the update manager bombs eh?
[19:15] <elfy> just says there's a partial - I can run it with update manager with the partial if you really want to - but it'll not be good - it rarely is :)
[19:17] <elfy> to be honest I rarely use um unless I'm actually testing it itself
[19:24] <balloons> I'm sure it won't be
[19:24] <balloons> :-)
[19:24] <elfy> so you want me to do it with update mangler?
[19:25] <balloons> no no, no reason to mangle it up
[19:25] <balloons> how's unity
[19:25] <balloons> still ok?
[19:25] <elfy> not in beta 1 it's not
[19:25] <balloons> lol
[19:25] <elfy> it's that horrible don't move the mouse if you want to see the desktop bug in that one
[19:26] <balloons> yes, but it upgraded ok
[19:26] <balloons> and unity is fine now?
[19:26] <elfy> not yet - still doing it ...
[19:26] <balloons> same as your fresh install
[19:26] <balloons> ohh
[19:26] <balloons> ok
[19:26]  * balloons waits patiently
[19:26] <elfy> it was excellent before I went backwards :)
[19:27] <elfy> doing anything processor heavy here is really really slow - perhaps it's the stick - but I don't think so - works fine everywhere else
[20:14] <balloons> phillw, ping
[20:14] <phillw> balloons: pong
[20:18] <balloons> see your pm
[20:19] <silverarrow> hi
[20:19] <silverarrow> I`ve read the mail today
[20:19] <balloons> hey silverarrow
[20:19] <balloons> how are you?
[20:19] <silverarrow> I`m fine thank, and you?
[20:20] <silverarrow> are you in sync again after the all  nighter?
[20:21] <silverarrow> I had a few days of natural day night rythem when I worked nights
[20:22] <silverarrow> I have a new attempt at alsamixer issues
[20:22] <silverarrow> I have no idea where to start
[20:29] <silverarrow> lost connection
[20:31] <phillw> silverarrow: you really should pop onto #freenode and request an unafilliated cloak?
[20:33] <balloons> silverarrow, yes, I'm slowly easing back the hours
[20:33] <balloons> it will take me a bit to completely come back to normal
[20:34] <Noskcaj> do knome and i need to make a lvm xubuntu testcase?
[20:34] <knome> Noskcaj, i wouldn't worry about that for Q release
[20:34] <Noskcaj> ok
[20:41] <silverarrow> phillw: what`s that?
[20:41] <silverarrow> invisibility cloak?
[20:42]  * balloons rolls +6 die
[20:42] <balloons> 2
[20:42] <phillw> silverarrow: it prevents you giving out you IP address when you log onto IRC
[20:42] <balloons> silverarrow loses invisibility for 10 seconds
[20:42] <silverarrow> I see, that is a bad thing?
[20:42] <silverarrow> I have a sort of joint IP with the rest of the house
[20:42] <phillw> silverarrow: it can be, we aren't bad people, but others are. Having a cloak reduces risks
[20:43] <knome> phillw, i can give you an IP address any day!
[20:43] <knome> phillw, 24.65.152.45
[20:43] <knome> phillw, there you go!
[20:43] <silverarrow> 6 people uses this modem
[20:43] <silverarrow> though right now only two
[20:43] <phillw> silverarrow: it has no difference to them, just masks it when you log onto IRC
[20:43] <silverarrow> phillw: I shall look into the cloak
[20:44] <phillw> do we have a factoid bot on here?
[20:44] <knome> !bot
[20:44] <phillw> !cloak
[20:45] <phillw> thanks knome, I'm used to DragonEyes :P
[20:50] <wxl> ew dragon eyes ;)
[20:50] <silverarrow> is my IP address of use to anyone?
[20:51] <knome> silverarrow, if somebody wants to make your life a bit more miserable, then yeah, it could be
[20:51] <silverarrow> hmm
[20:51] <silverarrow> the web is probably not worse than the rest of earth
[20:51] <silverarrow> nasty place at times
[20:52] <knome> probably not worse, but the bad things might be happening more often
[20:52] <silverarrow> hehe
[20:52] <silverarrow> like landing in the world of linux
[20:52] <silverarrow> hardly anyting works
[20:53] <silverarrow> at least in alpha
[20:53] <silverarrow> ;- )
[20:53] <silverarrow> luckily it gets better
[20:54] <knome> don't know about the world though...
[20:56] <silverarrow> does libre office work in gome/unity?
[20:57] <silverarrow> hashsum mismatch when updating
[20:57] <balloons> silverarrow, yes
[20:58] <silverarrow> good
[20:59] <silverarrow> there were a guy yesterday with toolbar problems
[21:00] <Noskcaj> virtualbox says its disconected from the internet whe my pc is not, what is this a bug in?
[21:01] <silverarrow> likely
[21:01] <silverarrow> battery monitor doesn`t work that  well in lxde on powerpc
[21:05] <elfy> Noskcaj: I had a bunch of issues the other day with vbox and internet, had to set it to bridged adapter
[21:05] <Noskcaj> ok elfy
[21:32] <elfy> balloons: so 2 hours later it is still upgrading the 883 packages ...
[21:34] <balloons> elfy, wow
[21:34] <balloons> that might be awhile
[21:34] <balloons> i'm uploading
[21:34] <balloons> 1 hr in a 5 hour jon
[21:34] <balloons> *job
[21:36] <elfy> going to bed as soon as this tea mug is empty :) will look in the morning lol
[21:36] <balloons> sounds like a good plan mate
[21:36] <elfy> as long as it all works then I guess it's worth it :)
[21:36] <balloons> yep
[21:37] <elfy> I noted on the testcase that I used synaptic
[21:49] <elfy> that'll do - night balloons
[21:51] <balloons> good night elfy !
[23:15] <skaet> plars, infinity,  balloons - was just doing an update on my quantal machine,  and have gotten "Update information  (null)" and system has stopped responding.    anyone else seeing this?
[23:22] <skaet> infinity, slangasek - do you want me to try to catch anything from the hung system before I reboot?
[23:23] <infinity> skaet: If it's hung, I'm not sure what you'd collect.
[23:24] <skaet> infinity,  well mouse moves around,  so not completely
[23:25] <skaet> but I can't get a terminal to come up from the keyboard,  so power cycle time.
[23:45] <phillw> infinity: the ppa is at https://launchpad.net/~gilir/+archive/lubuntu what needs doing?
[23:50] <infinity> phillw: I'm pretty sure gilir knows what to do...
[23:52] <phillw> infinity: so a simple "Yes, it is approved" will do?
[23:53] <infinity> phillw: It was already approved, so yes, he just needs to (a) commit to fxing/reverting if it breaks, and (b) upload it to the archive.
[23:54] <skaet> infinity,   past.ubuntu.com/1270232  -  results from rebooted, and triggering software updater again.
[23:54] <phillw> thanks, i know he still not 100% well so getting that (quite major) issue off his mind this close to a release will help a lot
[23:54] <skaet> paste.ubuntu.com/1270232 rather.
[23:54] <skaet> anything else you want included in the bug?
[23:58] <phillw> infinity: skaet as he away from computer, how best to (00:33:00) skaet: phillw,  please work to get it uploaded now in next couple of hours, and we'll call it even. ?
[23:59] <skaet> phillw,  see if one of the other MOTU's has bandwidth to help out, and get it uploaded.