[06:00] <knightwise> hey freedomrun
[06:02] <freedomrun> yes?
[06:04] <knightwise> 0/
[06:10] <freedomrun> knightwise :)
[06:53] <popey> morning
[06:53] <knightwise> hey popey
[07:16] <AlanBell> morning all
[07:16] <knightwise> hmm
[07:16] <knightwise> wifi acting up here
[07:17] <AlanBell> popey: how do I tell if I am using llvmpipe for unity?
[07:17] <AlanBell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1274472/
[07:17] <popey> glxinfo
[07:17] <knightwise> hey AlanBell
[07:17] <popey> glxinfo | grep renderer
[07:17] <diplo> Morning all
[07:18] <AlanBell> OpenGL renderer string: Mesa DRI Intel(R) Ironlake Mobile
[07:18] <popey> so not
[07:18] <AlanBell> when unity starts it doesn't seem sure about it
[07:18] <AlanBell> compiz (core) - Info: Unity is not supported by your hardware. Enabling software rendering instead (slow).
[07:18] <AlanBell> compiz (core) - Info: Unity is fully supported by your hardware.
[07:18] <popey> heh
[07:19] <popey> it downgrades the experience now
[07:19] <popey> to speed things up a bit
[07:19] <AlanBell> ok
[07:19] <popey> fewer effects
[07:19] <popey> the wording is amusing
[07:19] <knightwise> hmm.. Wallch is a pretty nice app :) Wallpaper changer and stuff
[07:19] <diplo> Having an issue yesterday and this morning on Quantal, it seems I'm sending / receing lots of data to canonical
[07:19] <diplo> Yesterday after a reboot it stopped
[07:19] <popey> knightwise, i use variety
[07:20] <diplo> 91.189.88.0 - 91.189.95.255
[07:20] <popey> those are canonical servers, you're on quantal?
[07:20] <popey> ubuntu one perhaps?
[07:20] <popey> and the video lens, music lens and shopping stuff goes via those servers
[07:22] <knightwise> popey: thanx :) i'll look into that also
[07:22] <diplo> Outgoing rates thoughis 1000-3000 kbits/sec and all I've done is boot up, u1 is already synced
[07:22] <knightwise> hmm.. looking forward to quantal for hte whole web integration
[07:22] <diplo> I'll reboot again to see if it stops again
[07:22] <knightwise> hate having to open up chrome to get to my gmail all the time
[07:22] <popey> i wouldn't reboot
[07:23] <popey> that doesnt analyse the issue
[07:23] <popey> you still need the browser open knightwise
[07:23] <popey> it only gets your mail if the page is open
[07:23] <popey> brb
[07:23] <knightwise> popey: I thought you could "tie in" your google account to the notifier ?
[07:26] <diplo> OK, as soon as a reboot it basically slows our line down to a crawl before even logging in
[07:26] <diplo> Need to get some work done first but will start up again later and work my way through it.
[07:33] <ali1234> knightwise: you can but it only does anything if you have gmail open in a browser
[07:34] <ali1234> knightwise: there are two gmail notifiers in universe which work how you would expect them to
[07:34] <ali1234> have been there for years
[07:34] <knightwise> ali1234: and would those notifiers also take care of picking up the "mailto" links ?
[07:34] <ali1234> yes
[07:34] <ali1234> one of them does that
[07:34] <knightwise> which one do you recommend ?
[07:34] <ali1234> it adds gmail as a default application
[07:34] <knightwise> Wicked
[07:35] <ali1234> so not just mailto: but also anything that sends email in gnome
[07:35] <ali1234> you need them both
[07:35] <ali1234> one does that, the other is the actual tray icon thing
[07:36] <ali1234> there's actually several now
[07:36] <ali1234> gnome-gmail is the one for integrating mailto: links
[07:36] <ali1234> the other one, you have several alternatives
[07:36] <jacobw> morning
[07:37] <knightwise> Done :) thanx ali1234
[07:39] <diplo> actually I need my box now, so I suppose i better find the cause
[07:39] <diplo> wireshark i guess is my best option
[07:40] <knightwise> ali1234: works great! :) thanx
[07:40] <ali1234> diplo: tcpdump -n -A -i eth0
[07:41] <ali1234> knightwise: np
[07:41] <diplo> ok ta, just logging in now
[07:41] <ali1234> that will dump first 65k of every packet in ascii
[07:41] <ali1234> so it's quite noisy
[07:43] <ali1234> oh, try netstat -n --protocol=inet too
[07:43] <ali1234> add -p to that one to see which program it is
[07:44] <popey> i used wireshark and set a filter to only show http traffic
[07:44] <ali1234> tcp       38      0 192.168.0.5:57868       91.189.89.218:443       CLOSE_WAIT  25173/rhythmbox
[07:44] <ali1234> tcp        1      0 192.168.0.5:38840       91.189.89.144:80        CLOSE_WAIT  2932/ubuntu-geoip-p
[07:45] <ali1234> yeah why is rhythmbox connected to canonical? and why is geoip service running?
[07:45] <popey> online store in rb?
[07:45] <ali1234> yeah but i've never opened it
[07:45] <diplo> http://pastebin.com/kZshCDRX
[07:46] <ali1234> diplo: add -p to netstat command
[07:46] <ali1234> but that's rhythmbox
[07:46] <ali1234> or u1
[07:46] <ali1234> or something over https
[07:46] <ali1234> so tcpdump isn't going to reveal much
[07:47] <diplo> http://pastebin.com/KP71Wad9
[07:47] <popey> the url at least
[07:47] <ali1234> that server has a self signed certificate :S
[07:47] <popey> whoopsie :)
[07:47] <diplo> Error reporting
[07:47] <ali1234> ah, you're uploading crash dumps
[07:47]  * AlanBell tries gnome shell
[07:47]  * AlanBell likes it rather a lot
[07:47] <ali1234> rm -rf /var/crash/*
[07:48] <diplo> OK, but this was happening for houes yesterday
[07:48] <ali1234> yeah
[07:48] <ali1234> crash dumps can be several gigabytes
[07:48] <popey> and if they never complete.. i.e. if you keep rebooting :)
[07:48] <diplo> lol 436mb
[07:48] <diplo> :P
[07:48] <ali1234> they upload automatically now unless yo click the box that says "don't upload"
[07:48] <diplo> I didn't yesterday popey
[07:48] <ali1234> yes, and if something keeps crashing over and over... moar dumps
[07:48] <popey> be nice to see what was in there before you rm it
[07:48] <popey> or just move them out the way
[07:49] <diplo> whoopsie, good thought to late :D
[07:49] <ali1234> since i switched to gnome i only get skype crashes
[07:49] <diplo> it was _usr_bin_eog.1000.crash
[07:49] <ali1234> eye of gnome image (viewer)
[07:50] <diplo> yeah it seeems
[07:50] <diplo> It's still doing something as we're still laffing
[07:51] <diplo> tcp        0 258592 192.168.1.21:54978      91.189.95.55:443        ESTABLISHED -
[07:51] <popey> maybe whoopsie was uploading
[07:51] <ali1234> well deleting a file from disk doesn't delete it, if the file is open
[07:51] <popey> and you didnt stop it before rmming the files
[07:51] <diplo> yeah
[07:51] <popey> hence why I was trying to suggest not diving in rebooting, deleting stuff :(
[07:52] <diplo> It was a very good point
[07:52] <ali1234> whoopsie is mental
[07:52] <diplo> Restart of whoopsie has sorted it though
[07:52] <diplo> I think I know what caused it now though, so I could try and replicate
[07:52] <ali1234> did anyone ever figure out what the graph on the server (daisy?) even means?
[07:52] <diplo> EOG opened a fairly large jpg yesterday and crashed
[07:53] <popey> crashes per day ali1234
[07:53] <ali1234> yeah it does do that
[07:53] <popey> if you mean errors.ubuntu.com ?
[07:53] <ali1234> yes
[07:53] <ali1234> that makes no sense for two reasons
[07:54] <ali1234> firstly, the value is 0.04
[07:54] <ali1234> that's 1 crash every 25 days
[07:54] <ali1234> seems unlikely
[07:54] <ali1234> and secondly the graph has markers for every day
[07:54] <popey> per day per user? :)
[07:54] <ali1234> but says it is an average
[07:54] <ali1234> how do you average something over a period equal to sampling period?
[07:55] <ali1234> effectively implies it's an average of 1 value, which is crazy
[07:55]  * popey shrugs, I didn't write it
[07:55] <popey> https://launchpad.net/whoopsie-daisy
[07:55] <ali1234> it can't be per user, because look at the spike after beta 1
[07:55] <ali1234> more users = more errors
[07:55] <diplo> I wish it told me it was uploading that though
[07:56] <diplo> Or some notification
[07:56] <ali1234> it does
[07:56] <ali1234> when the crash happens
[07:56] <ali1234> it shows a dialogue
[07:56] <ali1234> sometimes that crashes as well, and then you get two dumps to upload
[07:56] <popey> yo dawg
[07:56] <diplo> yeah apport crashed a few times
[07:57]  * diplo remembers why he doesn't upgrade anymore
[07:57] <ali1234> i think i'm going to skip 12.10
[07:57] <ali1234> i'd have to rebuild too many customizations
[07:57] <popey> 13.04 will be fun
[07:58] <ali1234> yeah i'll probably skip that one too
[07:58] <diplo> ali1234: 12.10 is a huge improvement, _huge_ for me anyway
[07:58] <ali1234> is wayland going to be in 13.04?
[07:58] <diplo> Runs perfectly at home, apart from I havem't got sound working
[08:00] <popey> dunno about wayland
[08:00] <ali1234> afaik it's still proff of concept stuff
[08:00] <SuperMatt> woo, my pangolin and quetzal t-shirts have arrived
[08:00] <popey> yeah
[08:01] <SuperMatt> I think I'll wear the pangolin next wednesday
[08:01] <SuperMatt> and the quetzal on thursday
[08:01] <popey> wow, i barely know what I'm wearing today let alone next week
[08:01] <SuperMatt> or will I look like an idiot wearing a quetzal shirt to the meet up?
[08:01] <popey> nope
[08:01] <AlanBell> SuperMatt: you will probably look like several other people
[08:02] <popey> oh noes _I_ said I was wearing that!
[08:02] <ali1234> maybe it means "unique errors"
[08:03] <AlanBell> well gnome shell does appear to be rather good, only problem I can see is the losenge hack means the close button is graphically a bit sub-optimal
[08:12] <diplo> I forgot thanks guys for the help :)
[08:41] <knightwise> hey TheOpenSourcerer !
[08:41] <knightwise> °/
[08:41] <TheOpenSourcerer> meauning
[08:42] <knightwise> you decided to come out of your coffin at last ?
[08:42] <knightwise> and embrace the dawn with its glares of glass and cold kitchen floors ?
[08:43] <JamesTait> Happy Friday, folks! :-D
[08:44] <JamesTait> Good meauning, TheOpenSourcerer. :)  Hippy Froday!
[08:46] <knightwise> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBTuq8yjQGo  HAPPY FFFrrrIdaaaay !$
[08:55] <bigcalm> Ello peeps :)
[08:55] <knightwise> hey bigcalm
[08:56] <TheOpenSourcerer> knightwise: I'm feeling a bit crap to be honest. And just had to go and collect my eldest from school as he's unwell too. Probably a NSV that is wandering round the family...
[08:59] <kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: you sleep in a coffin? ( knightwise ) .. hope you feel better soon. Sofa day?
[09:00] <TheOpenSourcerer> https://joinup.ec.europa.eu/news/contribution-open-source-europes-economy-450-billion-year
[09:00]  * AlanBell is in the office, looking at the font garden at home http://ubingo.libertus.co.uk/cam/
[09:01] <popey> haha
[09:01] <popey> watching it move
[09:01] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[09:01] <AlanBell> yup, someone is clicking :)
[09:01] <popey> want
[09:01] <knightwise> TheOpenSourcerer: its going around, tummybug and stuff
[09:02] <kirrus> AlanBell: nice control system.. much better than that crappy thing on it by default
[09:02] <bigcalm> Nice bins
[09:02]  * TheOpenSourcerer recalls a discussion on "Today" (BBC R4) yesterday morning about the legal issues (data protection etc.) of "home" cameras...
[09:02] <AlanBell> kirrus: yeah, the default thing is a bit rubbish
[09:03] <kirrus> AlanBell: are you calling the default thing with your script, or have you hacked it away?
[09:03] <knightwise> AlanBell: obviously you took out the trasj this morning
[09:03] <AlanBell> steerable cameras should not be put up in a public place apparently
[09:03] <gord> "failed exceeding max clients", everyone else get off AlanBells camera! i want to see his garden!
[09:03] <knightwise> I just made it move
[09:03] <bigcalm> Black hole sun
[09:03]  * knightwise feels like god
[09:03] <AlanBell> gord: I just shut mine
[09:03] <AlanBell> kirrus: default thing
[09:04] <bigcalm> I've closed it as well
[09:04] <bigcalm> What's the bandwidth useage like?
[09:04] <AlanBell> kirrus: it gets the video stream as guest:guest passed in on the URL, the server side script authenticates as admin to control it
[09:04] <kirrus> AlanBell: neat
[09:04] <AlanBell> bigcalm: not entirely sure, but I have oodles
[09:04] <bigcalm> Fair enough :)
[09:05] <popey> haha plug
[09:05] <AlanBell> yup
[09:05] <bigcalm> I forget, is it wifi or ethernet connected?
[09:05] <AlanBell> wifi
[09:05] <bigcalm> I could put on in my garage then :D
[09:05] <popey> is it noisy
[09:05] <popey> ?
[09:05] <AlanBell> you need to ethernet connect it to configure it and set up the wifi password
[09:05] <AlanBell> very quiet
[09:05] <gord> does it go all the way around 360?
[09:05] <AlanBell> and the night vision is brilliant, but doesn't go through glass
[09:06] <bigcalm> gord: no
[09:06] <AlanBell> gord: nope
[09:06] <popey> can you capture?
[09:06] <gord> aww, i was going to write a script that would constantly spin it day and night :(
[09:06] <knightwise> does it turn 360 degrees
[09:06] <AlanBell> over 180 degrees of movement and goes high and low
[09:06] <knightwise> you know , when there is nothing on the telly we can spy on you
[09:06] <popey> hack it so it can
[09:06] <knightwise> lol popey :) *evil Grin*
[09:06] <AlanBell> popey: yes, can be captured
[09:07] <gord> put it on a turntable with the motor controlled by an arduino
[09:07] <knightwise> and set it to 45 rpm ?
[09:07] <AlanBell> gord: this costs £35, get two back to back
[09:07] <AlanBell> you can mount it upside down and flip the image too
[09:07] <popey> stick it on your car and go streetviewing
[09:08] <gord> oh, set up a script that can pick up moving objects (there are a few binaries that does that) that then moves the camera to track the object to freak out the mail man
[09:08] <knightwise> LOL :)
[09:08] <bigcalm> I don't think the response and speed of movement would be good enough for that
[09:08] <AlanBell> gord: I did thing of openCV to do that
[09:08] <knightwise> and put a poster from "BIG BROTHER" above the cam
[09:08] <AlanBell> bigcalm: it could do
[09:09] <bigcalm> AlanBell: get cracking then :D
[09:09] <bigcalm> I should find my usb rocket launcher
[09:09] <AlanBell> I have to do some real work :)
[09:09] <bigcalm> Pah
[09:09] <AlanBell> however I might blog this
[09:09] <bigcalm> Yes, you should
[09:10] <AlanBell> I have a suspicion that the mjpeg stream will work on planet ubuntu too :)
[09:10] <gord> oh oh, attach laser pointer to the camera, attach camera to a cat. remote control cat
[09:11] <popey> http://www.firebox.com/product/2510/FroliCat-BOLT?video_id=2787&tab1=0#videos_h
[09:11] <popey> frolicat!
[09:13] <diplo> AlanBell: I think I'm going to get 1 or 2 myself, you going to stick the code on LP or something when you're done ?
[09:23] <bigcalm> popey: yay, that's my parents' cat's xmas present sorted for this year
[09:23] <bigcalm> Oh, not available. Arse
[09:24] <AlanBell> diplo: sure
[09:36] <diplo> great thanks
[09:38] <bigcalm> popey: slightly cheaper on amazon and in stock. Hope the cat has fun
[09:39] <MartijnVdS> http://www.google.com/patents/US5443036
[09:40] <bigcalm> ...
[09:40] <MartijnVdS> bigcalm: don't worry, patent is from '75, it's expired
[09:40] <Myrtti> I haven't really looked into it, but does the login manager remember what session a user prefers to use? ie. I like Unity, my sister likes XFCE4, does it automatically choose the right one for me?
[09:40] <bigcalm> Reading what patents will be awarded for really depresses me
[09:40] <MartijnVdS> Myrtti: I think it does, it uses some file in your ~
[09:40] <bigcalm> Myrtti: yes
[09:41] <bigcalm> Myrtti: I use xubuntu-desktop, the guest user uses Unity
[09:41] <Myrtti> that's good.
[09:43] <Myrtti> I might do an update on my sister's computer today then
[09:43] <Myrtti> move her over to XFCE4
[09:43] <knightwise> Myrtti: xfce is very pretty these days
[09:44] <knightwise> I ran it on a G4 iMac I have around the house
[09:44] <Myrtti> I know, I used to run it a year ago myself
[09:44] <Myrtti> then Unity lured me over
[09:45] <Myrtti> I'm pretty sure I don't have patience to tweak Gnome3 based stuff to look like Windows 98 so I'll just move her to XFCE4
[09:45] <bigcalm> I want to use Unity, I really do. I feel I'm letting the side down. But I'm more productive with xfce (and unity doesn't work with my 3 monitor set-up)
[09:46] <knightwise> bigcalm: I"m enjoying it so far , i remapped some buttons so the launcher responds as if it where spotlight (i run i on the mac)
[09:58] <jacobw> i wish the mate project was better
[09:59] <SuperMatt> I just can't use gnome2-alikes any more
[10:01] <popey> I booted 10.04 the other day to test the upgrade... wow.. that was fugly
[10:03] <jacobw> after solving the namespace problems, the only thing gnome2 preservation project should have to do is deal with API breakages between gnome2 and all it's dependencies
[10:03] <jacobw> which i have no idea of the scale of :)
[10:04] <bittin^work> popey think i updated from like 11.04 to 12.04 when i reinstalled Ubuntu on my new PC :>
[10:05] <bittin^work> but thinking of getting new discs for the 12.10 release
[10:05] <davmor2> Morning all
[10:05] <jacobw> morning davmor2
[10:05] <bittin^work> Morning davmor2
[10:06] <jonathonf> does anyone here have any experience of extracting information from the developer of a legacy system you've been asked to write a web front-end to?
[10:07] <Darael> Well, first you get a length of rubber hose...
[10:08] <jacobw> find out if their using a sane data structure or not
[10:08] <AlanBell> jonathonf: yeah, fun :)
[10:08] <jacobw> i.e, is it a SQL database that you can look at and guess what each field is?
[10:10] <ali1234> jonathonf: i've a lot of experience in that kind of thing, actually
[10:10] <ali1234> i don't bother with the developer, i just reverse engineer it
[10:11] <jonathonf> the rubber hose sounds good... the mssql database used is crazy, supposed to have stored procedures but there's a lot of duplication, and some functionality seems to be hidden in his VB code which i don't have access to :D
[10:11] <Laney> tried to have a peep inside AlanBell's house, failed
[10:11] <jonathonf> ali1234: that was my first thought :)
[10:11] <czajkowski> I read that from Laney as tried to have a pee inside AlanBell's house
[10:11] <ali1234> mssql databases always have loads of duplication
[10:11] <popey> i did that and broke his toilet
[10:12] <popey> well, sam did
[10:12] <AlanBell> heh
[10:12] <czajkowski> lol
[10:12] <AlanBell> wonder if the postman will be caught on camera
[10:12] <czajkowski> poor sam give him a complex
[10:13] <Daviey> popey: wouldn't flush the payload?
[10:13] <Daviey> a 'popey special'
[10:13] <jonathonf> this is the first time i've done this sort of thing; what sort of timescale would normally be reasonable (i know it will depend on the project etc. but weeks/months)?
[10:13] <popey> user interface broke
[10:13] <AlanBell> it now has an improved UI
[10:13] <popey> I did try to patch it
[10:13] <Daviey> popey: failed rebuild test?
[10:13] <popey> Soon I won't be allowed to AlanBells house.
[10:14] <popey> So far broken one ironing board and one toilet
[10:14] <popey> and terrorised a chicken
[10:14] <AlanBell> all true
[10:14] <popey> Daviey, failed QA
[10:14] <czajkowski> popey: as did Jon with the chicken, poor things get peace when AlanBell has no visitors
[10:14] <Daviey> popey: acceptance testing noticed it, after the developer tried to sneak in their cowboy fix?
[10:15] <popey> thats nearer the mark
[10:15] <davmor2> popey: don't make me come down there and show you how to break stuff
[10:15]  * popey plays Journey of the Sorcerer (again)
[10:15]  * popey hugs grooveshark
[10:18] <daubers> popey: Awesome bit of banjo work in that
[10:19] <daubers> popey: If you can find the original eagles version it's much much much awesomeness
[10:20] <daubers> and the Grooveshark versions hurt my ears and make me sad :(
[10:20] <ali1234> jonathonf: what does it have to do?
[10:20] <daubers> popey: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rOMGIbY-9s
[10:21] <popey> yeah
[10:21]  * popey wonders why AlanBell is sideways on G+
[10:21]  * AlanBell wonders that also
[10:21] <AlanBell> it just changed all by itself
[10:21] <gord> i thought you'd done it
[10:21] <gord> i didn't ask for fear of looking stupid
[10:21] <AlanBell> I wonder if shotwell/picassa did it
[10:21] <ali1234> jonathonf: figuring out the database shouldn't take you more than 1 day per table...
[10:25] <popey> how is grooveshark completely free?
[10:25] <bigcalm> I was wondering that myself
[10:25] <jonathonf> 1) adverts 2) they sell your listening habits
[10:25] <jonathonf> afaict
[10:25]  * popey sees no adverts \o/
[10:25] <gord> i can't work out why i have to pay to listen to spotify on my mobile, but listening to spotify on my laptop teathered from my mobile does not
[10:25] <mgdm> it's a business rather than a technical decision
[10:26] <Daviey> It could well be a licencing decision aswell.
[10:26] <Daviey> Ie, not THIER biz decision, but the labels.
[10:27] <czajkowski> http://www.lczajkowski.com/2012/10/12/back-to-school-in-limerick/  me almost 18 years ago :)
[10:29] <davmor2> czajkowski: what the hell happened you don't look the slightest bit evil there :D
[10:29] <daubers> davmor2: That was before the community stuff colour changed
[10:30] <czajkowski> davmor2: https://twitter.com/czajkowski/status/256700293805379584/photo/1
[10:31] <davmor2> czajkowski: making yourself look cute when you were younger just makes you look more evil now stop while your ahead ;)
[10:31] <czajkowski> hah
[10:31] <czajkowski> I am nice I'm not evil
[10:33] <davmor2> czajkowski: oh stop doing the evil laugh while typing things like that and people might believe you :D
[10:35]  * daubers gives up and puts the muppet movie soundtrack on
[10:39] <gord> as a software developer and a nerd, i refuse to accept anything other than a logical decision
[10:39] <popey> AlanBell, how much current does that camera draw?
[10:39] <daubers> gord: muppets = awesome therefore listen to muppets soundtracks?
[10:41] <davmor2> daubers: manamanam da dah da darra
[10:53] <bigcalm> My boss miss-spelt my name as Ian in an email just now. Should I reply and spell his name as Dareen?
[10:54] <jonathonf> "Darn", surely? .)
[10:54] <bigcalm> Too late, I corrected my typo
[10:54] <bigcalm> jonathonf: heh, should have been that
[10:54] <davmor2> bigcalm: no just WHO?
[10:54] <bigcalm> davmor2: I think you mean whom? :P
[10:56] <davmor2> bigcalm: no that would be "To whom do you think you are talking to". "Who?" would be perfectly correct in that instance :P
[10:56] <gord> half the emails i get are actually forwarded emails that just contain "Actually sent to the correct address", because no one can spell Allott
[10:57] <bigcalm> davmor2: bah
[10:57] <mgdm> My last name is not unusual in Scotland, but people botch it. (I'll let people not from Scotland away with botching it, I suppose). My firstname is not unusual in the UK, though, and people still get it wrong
[10:59] <davmor2> mgdm: it's the temptation to put McLean I guess
[11:00] <mgdm> yeah, that or McClean
[11:00] <bigcalm> Michel?
[11:01] <mgdm> I'm not French
[11:01] <davmor2> mgdm: but that would then become Mac-Clean and we thought you loved Ubuntu now we hear that you are a Mac Cleaner ;)
[11:02] <mgdm> haha
[11:02]  * mgdm is actually talking to you from a Mac
[11:02] <mgdm> (well, via an Ubuntu server with irssi + tmux)
[11:03] <davmor2> muhahahahahahaahahahaha
[11:03] <jussi> mgdm: here is a cookie to make you feel better for having to use evilware :P
[11:05] <davmor2> czajkowski: I hope you took in a note to explain your 18 year absence?
[11:05] <jussi> davmor2: hehe
[11:05] <mgdm> jussi: the really rather nice 27" screen is compensation enough. Though I do like cookies
[11:05] <czajkowski> mgdm: welcome to my world of misspelling surnames!
[11:05] <czajkowski> davmor2: :p
[11:06] <jussi> mgdm: I have a nice 26" screen :P
[11:06] <davmor2> czajkowski, mgdm: no one can spell mine right unless I happen to be near Leeds
[11:07] <mgdm> without looking it up, Morley?
[11:07]  * mgdm isn't near Leeds
[11:08] <christel> COOKIES
[11:08] <bigcalm> And cream
[11:08] <christel> nah just cookies
[11:08] <jussi> definitely cream also
[11:09] <jussi> or scones, with jam and double cream.... mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
[11:10] <bigcalm> Clotted cream!
[11:10] <jussi> +++++++++++++++++++++
[11:11] <daubers> jussi: With a nice mug of freshly brewed leaf tea?
[11:11] <jussi> daubers: yup
[11:11] <daubers> ace
[11:11] <davmor2> mgdm: Yeap but I get Moorly, Morely, Moreley, Mooreley, Morlee, Morliegh (once) but the first 3 are the most common
[11:11] <jussi> I just wish we could get clotted cream here....
[11:12] <jussi> davmor2: yeah, I would make the morely mistake :P
[11:12] <mgdm> davmor2: blimey
[11:12] <mgdm> I bet czajkowski gets some funny spellings
[11:12]  * mgdm hugs the tab key
[11:12] <czajkowski> lol
[11:13] <jussi> most people forget the c in my name, and put nik instead of ink
[11:13] <davmor2> jussi: there is a place in cornwall that will ship a cornish scone teas complete with clotted cream :)
[11:13] <jussi> oh, and people outside of finland can rarely spell jussi
[11:13] <jussi> davmor2: to finland?
[11:14] <czajkowski> davmor2: when down in dorset during the summer I was given clotted cream I said no thanks, got a lotta strange looks for that
[11:14] <davmor2> jussi: they don't specify a destination but they get a lot of Americans visit
[11:14] <jussi> davmor2: link pls
[11:15] <davmor2> jussi: it's just a shop I've been in on holiday there I'll ask the wife and see if we can find you a link
[11:15] <jussi> ok, thanks.
[11:18] <christel> people seem to struggle more with saying my name than writing it
[11:19] <davmor2> jussi: you can try these guys direct https://shop.roddas.co.uk/ they currently say → We can deliver to all UK postcodes, including Northern Ireland and the Channel Islands. We’re afraid to say we’re not able to deliver outside the UK right now, but we’re working on it. while I continue tracking down the shop
[11:20] <bigcalm> Or you could go to a super market and buy some scones, clotted cream and strawberry jam
[11:20] <bigcalm> Which I'm tempted to do now
[11:20] <jussi> bigcalm: no clotted cream here...
[11:20] <davmor2> bigcalm: he's not in the UK dude
[11:20] <bigcalm> jussi: ah, you're back in Soumi?
[11:21] <jussi> suomi, yes
[11:21] <bigcalm> Gah
[11:21] <bigcalm> My spelling really sucks, sorry
[11:21] <jussi> lol
[11:22] <bigcalm> It was amazing when we found a baker in Kyoto that sold Finnish savouries
[11:23] <bigcalm> Which I now want
[11:23] <bigcalm> Damn it
[11:23] <bigcalm> And I can't remember what they are called
[11:25] <davmor2> jussi: http://www.cornishcream.com/ you might want to try these guys I checked their http://www.cornishcream.com/t/termsandconditions#shipping and it list outside the UK
[11:25] <bigcalm> http://www.cornishpasties.org.uk/otherpasties/finnish/finnishkarelianpasty.jpg
[11:25] <bigcalm> I'm a sucker for those
[11:25] <jussi> lol
[11:28] <bigcalm> Aha, there it is Karelian Pies
[11:28] <bigcalm> Oops
[11:28] <bigcalm> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karelian_pasties
[11:30] <bigcalm> In cooking measurements, what's dl?
[11:31] <Darael> decilitres, at a guess.  100ml.
[11:32] <jonathonf> 10ml, isn't it?
[11:32] <jonathonf> 100ml is 1cl?
[11:32] <mgdm> 10ml, yes
[11:32] <Darael> Um.  No, 10ml is 1cl.
[11:32] <jonathonf> ah yes
[11:33] <jonathonf> 70cl bottle of whisky
[11:33] <jonathonf> :D
[11:33] <Darael> Centi- is 1/100.
[11:33] <mgdm> yeah, brain not working this morning
[11:33] <bigcalm> Going to have a go at making these tomorrow: http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cookbook:Karjalanpiirakat
[11:34] <jonathonf> so why in a recipe use 1dl instead of saying 100ml? -.-
[11:34]  * bigcalm shrugs
[11:34] <Darael> Different conventions?  Save two characters?  Who knows.
[11:35] <bigcalm> So 3dl is 300ml?
[11:36] <Darael> Assuming my guess that dl means decilitres is correct, yes.
[11:36] <bigcalm> Darael: in the context of the URL I just pasted...
[11:36] <Darael> Is a volume measurement (as opposed to, say, a weight one) plausible?
[11:36] <bigcalm> Sounds about right
[11:37] <Darael> Loving the random use of 1,5 litres for the first ingredient when the next two are in dl.
[11:38] <Darael> Oh, I'm sorry.  0,5, which is even odder.
[11:39] <bigcalm> Time to go shopping ;)
[11:41] <christel> a decilitre is 100 ml yeah
[11:41] <christel> continental europe loves decilitres
[11:43] <davmor2> bigcalm: no a decilitre is only 10ml so 3dl would be 30ml surely
[11:43] <christel> davmor2: no a dl is 100ml, there's 10 decilitres in a litre
[11:44] <Darael> davmor2: A /centi/litre is 10ml.  The prefixes refer to fractions of a litre, not numbers of ml.
[11:44] <christel> indeed, what Darael says
[11:45] <Darael> Besides, 30ml of pudding rice doesn't sound plausible for even /one/ pastie, let alone several, which is what the recipe seems to be for.
[11:47] <davmor2> christel: ah I know why I was think CM DM is 10 centimetres but would indeed be 100MM I stand corrected
[11:47] <jonathonf> i hate centimetres
[11:48] <AlanBell> furlongs ftw
[11:48] <jonathonf> millimetres is a proper unit
[11:48] <jonathonf> :D
[11:49] <jonathonf> though a metre isn't a proper constant
[11:49] <christel> AlanBell: no, i am really short in furlongs :(
[11:50] <daubers> jonathonf: It really is these days
[11:50] <jonathonf> oh, wait, they're defined it by the speed of light
[11:50] <davmor2> jonathonf: technically micron is the units we should all use but then you can't see them MM are pretty small too which is why CM is the default :)
[11:50] <AlanBell> christel: 0.00896464646 furlongs
[11:50] <daubers> Pah, if you want to use _real_ units, start using planck lengths instead
[11:51] <davmor2> christel: we are all really short in furlongs
[11:53] <christel> AlanBell: you win!
[11:53] <christel> i am impressed with your most accurate knowledge of my height in furlong!
[11:55] <AlanBell> accurate to within a few tenths of a microfurlong I believe
[11:55] <TheOpenSourcerer> 1 furlong = 1.24469821 × 1037 planck lengths
[11:56] <Darael> 1037 or 10^37?
[11:56] <AlanBell> my favorite unit of length is the smoot
[11:56] <TheOpenSourcerer> ^
[11:56] <zleap> is 1 micron something like 10-3mm
[11:56] <zleap> 10^-3 i meant
[11:56] <TheOpenSourcerer> 1 furlong = 118.208955 smoot
[11:57] <daubers> AlanBell: My favourite unit ever is the Barn
[11:57] <davmor2> christel: if you feel any better 6 feet 2 inches = 0.00934343434 furlongs
[11:57] <Darael> micron == micrometre, so yes, zleap.
[11:57] <zleap> thanks
[11:58] <TheOpenSourcerer> 1 (sq furlong) = 4.04685642 × 10^32 Barn
[11:58] <zleap> i am sure engineering = mm anyway or you would express things in mm
[11:58] <jussi> so theres a unit called a barn... how about a barn door? :P  :P :P
[11:58] <zleap> so what is a barn (in terms of units)
[11:59] <Darael> It depends on what one is engineering, surely!  For a lot of structural work, metres makes more sense, to avoid ludicrous numbers.
[11:59] <daubers> TheOpenSourcerer: I just like the history :) 1 Barn is ~ the size of a uranium nucleus as people on the Manhattern project referred to it being "As big as a barn"
[11:59] <AlanBell> 10^-28 m^2 zleap
[11:59] <zleap> Darael, yeah but for small things
[11:59] <davmor2> my step son prefers to work in millions of an inch to microns it's more accurate for a measure apparently I know nothing of these things though
[11:59] <Darael> zleap: Still depends.  In elec-eng it can be useful to use um or nm, no?
[12:00] <zleap> yeah
[12:00] <zleap> esp for circuit boards
[12:00] <AlanBell> Microsoft made up a relatively clever one for OOXML (problem was they invented it and stuffed it in the standard, not that it was a bad idea)
[12:00] <TheOpenSourcerer> as a cabinet maker I used to work in 10ths of a millimetre or, occasionally ,thousandths of an inch
[12:01] <AlanBell> the EMU, English Metric Unit
[12:01] <daubers> AlanBell: Surely defining an EIU and AIU would be a better idea? (Since a lot of american imperial measurements don't match english ones)
[12:01] <AlanBell> http://www.oreillynet.com/xml/blog/2007/04/what_is_an_emu.html
[12:01] <zleap> i don't mind either imperial or metric
[12:02] <christel> davmor2: no, i am stil lshorter :(
[12:03] <AlanBell> daubers: it *could* have been an interesting unit to have as an SI standard thing that would have been referenced in OOXML, but they defined it inside OOXML instead
[12:04] <daubers> meh, just use nm/mm/cm/m :) Much more sensible
[12:07] <Darael> Let's mess with /everyone/ and use metric inches.
[12:08] <Darael> Or attoparsecs.
[12:09] <daubers> Darael: But if you really want to mess with people, use Parsec as a measurement of time (a la star wars
[12:09] <daubers> )
[12:10] <jonathonf> pah, i measured star wars in less than 12 parsecs...
[12:21] <jacobw> parsecs?
[12:21] <jacobw> nevermind me :)
[12:28] <davmor2> christel: but it's a lot harder to tell :D
[12:33] <gord> websites that show a popup asking if you want to go to the "Uk site as its super cool and awesome!" then just take you to the .co.uk site without taking you to the bit you were on, are basically the worst thing in the world ever
[12:34] <jonathonf> it is kind of accurate, though. they only ask if you want to go to the uk site, not the uk page
[12:35] <ali1234> grooveshark did that to me earlier
[12:36] <popey> hey video card nerds...
[12:36] <popey> i want to put a cheap nvidia card in my desktop
[12:36] <ali1234> "it looks like flash stopped responding, want to try the html5 version?" and then it just takes you to the top of the site, not the song you were trying to listen to
[12:36] <popey> i have an old 7900GT, but that needs a 6 pin power connector
[12:37] <popey> my psu doesn't have one
[12:37] <daubers> jacobw: A parsec is an astronomical measure of distance
[12:37] <popey> is it safe to just get an adapter?
[12:37] <popey> to convert 4 pin or something/
[12:37] <daubers> Can't remember what voltage the 6 pins run on...
[12:38] <ahayzen> popey, my old one didn't have one i just got a Molex -> 6 pin and that worked fine :)...but i am no 'video card nerd'
[12:39] <popey> http://www.maplin.co.uk/pci-express-power-converter-46857
[12:39] <ahayzen> popey, i had something similar to that for my 8800 GTS
[12:40] <ali1234> my 5870 has two of the 4 pin ones
[12:40] <popey> yeah, my newer card has two
[12:40] <ali1234> and it came with two dual moxel -> 4 pin adapters
[12:40] <popey> hence me using this old one
[12:40] <popey> hmm, wonder if there's a converter in my old desktop
[12:40] <ali1234> i plugged all 4 of the molex into the same branch from the power supply and it works fine
[12:41] <ali1234> actually i only used one, because the branch had 2 molex and a 4 pin thing on it
[12:41] <daubers> Yeah, you'll need dual molex as it wants moar lots of 12v than a single molex
[12:41] <ahayzen> popey, the only thing I would say it is probably fine using a converter as long as the wattage of the PSU is high enough my one was only 550W which wasn't enough
[12:43] <ali1234> i have a 400W power supply
[12:43] <ali1234> i use the system for bitcoin mining
[12:43] <ali1234> it never goes over 200W at the wall
[12:43] <ali1234> 550W PSU is for people who have two video cards and 8 hard drives
[12:43] <popey> 350W
[12:43] <daubers> heh, wondered how they got away with 2 molex when it should have 3 +12v lines, and 2 molex gives you two. That maplin adapter misses out the middle +12v
[12:43] <gord> 350w sounds low
[12:43] <ahayzen> ali1234, my 550W died :(
[12:43] <popey> yeah,it's an el-cheapo zoostorm thing
[12:43] <gord> plug it in and see what happens
[12:43] <popey> I'll skip it for now
[12:43] <gord> keep a bag nearby to catch the magic blue smoke just incase
[12:43] <ali1234> well... i have a relatively good 400W
[12:43] <popey> heh
[12:44] <popey> was just a thought
[12:44] <ali1234> not a 250W labelled as a 800W :)
[12:44] <popey> sounds like something Azelphur would buy on ebay :)
[12:44] <ali1234> but seriously though
[12:45] <ali1234> i'm running it off effectively a single wire
[12:45] <ali1234> they might as well not have bothered with the multiple connectors
[12:45] <ali1234> and it's been running 24/7 for over a year
[12:46] <ali1234> so if it was going to catch fire it would have by now
[12:46] <gord> also the worst thing in the world? websites that claim my gmail address +foobar is not a valid email address
[12:46] <popey> gord+1
[12:46] <ali1234> gord: yes that happened to me too, i complained to the website owners and they fixed it
[12:46] <popey> worse is when they do accept it, then later redesign their site so they don't
[12:46] <popey> and you can't login
[12:46] <ali1234> yeah, that's what happened to me
[12:46] <gord> ha
[12:47] <ali1234> you can insert extra random . into your gmail address btw
[12:48] <ali1234> eg a.j.b.u.x.t.o.n@gmail.com
[12:49] <ali1234> this can be used on websites that don't accept + although obviously you are limited to 2^(n-1) combinations
[12:52] <DJones> bigcalm: How are you finding your S3? just debating whether to upgrade to one
[12:59] <popey> are there any PCIE cards worth having which have passive cooling?
[12:59] <popey> over and above an i7
[12:59] <popey> http://www.anandtech.com/show/5150/zotac-introduces-passively-cooled-gts-450-zone-edition   #lolsink
[13:00] <gord> gpus do too much to passively cool really
[13:01] <gord> unless you downclock like crazy maybe
[13:01] <popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Zotac-Express-600MHz-1200MHz-Graphics/dp/B006E0WSR8/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1350046864&sr=8-3
[13:01] <gord>  but that feels like a waste of money
[13:02] <popey> I just want something better than i7 really
[13:02] <popey> nothing stupid
[13:02] <gord> y'know what, i have a spare gtx260, maybe i could bring that to ... uh... wherever we are going
[13:02] <gord> i forget
[13:02] <77CABNA9J> rocking Jonathan Coulton the 30 last minutes at work before the weekend :)
[13:04] <77CABNA9J> IKEA IKEA IKEA!, if you don't have a home you can buy one there (music)
[13:06] <jonathonf> meatballs... tasty...
[13:10] <77CABNA9J> http://open.spotify.com/album/0eW4vkDVxqS4U60ExzsKhR
[13:11] <bigcalm> DJones: I really enjoy having it as a mobile computer device in my pocket. On the rare occasions that I do make phone calls, it works very well. The screen is bright and clear. I haven't had any storage problem yet and still use the internal memory. Only annoyance is having to use a window machine to upgrade the firmware
[13:12] <davmor2> popey: so what you want is an i8u-butler
[13:12] <Flashtek> anyone in here make use of a dsl modem attached to an ethernet router ?
[13:13] <jonathonf> yes
[13:14] <bigcalm> I used to
[13:14]  * bigcalm hugs cable
[13:14] <jonathonf> or in my case, a wnr3500l connected to a wrt54gl connected to a billion 7800n modem
[13:15] <davmor2> bigcalm: I'd hug my cable too but it would likely meet up at some junction box and kill both of our connections :D
[13:17] <bigcalm> davmor2: that does sound a little creepy
[13:26] <Flashtek> I am going to, later on today or tomorrow morning, remove my Netgear "thing" and put a tp-link TD-8816 on the WAN end of my RB2011UAS-2HnD-IN
[13:26] <AlanBell> http://ubingo.libertus.co.uk/cam/ spot what is missing
[13:27] <popey> the cam?
[13:27] <TheOpenSourcerer> The trampoline
[13:28] <popey> i see no image
[13:28] <AlanBell> yup
[13:28] <AlanBell> popey: refresh and you should proably see the back of the tumble dryer
[13:29] <AlanBell> trouble is with that camera you need a 240 degree cone of clean
[13:31] <ahayzen> AlanBell, your camera makes weird affects when looking at the sun lol...it goes black ;)
[13:32] <popey> dont look into the sun!
[13:32] <ahayzen> it wasn't me!
[13:32] <AlanBell> do not look at sun with remaining eye
[13:32] <ahayzen> someone else is in control =-O
[13:32] <77CABNA9J> home i go!
[13:32] <popey> so cool
[13:33] <ahayzen> AlanBell, anyways that camera is pretty awesome :)
[13:34] <AlanBell> I am staggered at the price of the thing still
[13:35] <ahayzen> AlanBell, it is awesome :) ..should set up one @ my uni hall window. Who know wht u would see out the window ;)
[13:35] <AlanBell> for a computer running linux, plus a camera, plus two motors, plus the night vision, plus two way audio, plus all the plastic and stuff, shipped from the far east for £35
[13:35] <ahayzen> blimey
[13:36] <popey> £33.76
[13:37] <davmor2> AlanBell: I like the new and improved clicky guidance however you might want to think about puting a marker on each of the 0 points for up, down, left and right
[13:38] <popey> Thank you, your order has been placed.
[13:38] <AlanBell> davmor2: there are 192 points on the overlay
[13:38] <AlanBell> 16x12 grid clickable image map over a 640x480 image
[13:39] <AlanBell> but yeah, there is more UI stuff that could be done
[13:41] <bigcalm> AlanBell: is there a reason why you don't mention the make/model of the camera in your blog post? Or you have and I've missed it
[13:41] <popey> there's loads of el-cheapo cameras from .cn in that form factor
[13:41] <popey> lots of different chipsets inside too
[13:42] <AlanBell> bigcalm: no particular reason, I linked to the specific model on the cam page
[13:42] <bigcalm> Oh
[13:42] <bigcalm> Ok
[13:42] <popey> you're better off buying one from a link that you know someone else has bought
[13:43] <popey> guy at ex-work had one, and managed to brick it very easily
[13:43] <bigcalm> Thank you, your order has been placed.
[13:43] <AlanBell> \o/
[13:44] <bigcalm> AlanBell: you need to wash your windows ;)
[13:45] <bigcalm> As do I :S
[13:45] <AlanBell> yeah, the light isn't great there either
[13:45] <AlanBell> http://www.rewont.com/web/firmwaredownload.html is the firmware, (actually the camera reports a higher version number than published)
[13:45] <bigcalm> So the IR works but not though a window?
[13:46] <bigcalm> Somebody is casing the joint
[13:46] <AlanBell> https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=d4da438e8557806d&id=D4DA438E8557806D!153 jqr_3.2.2.18.bin is kind of like a tar file, anyone know what exactly it is?
[13:48] <bigcalm> I wonder if it would cope outside but in an enclosure
[13:48] <AlanBell> it would cope fine I expect, if you can get power to it
[13:49] <AlanBell> I was thinking of putting it outside, I might do so now for a bit . . .
[13:51] <bigcalm> The alternative is to set up IR lights outside and keep the cam in the garage looking though the windows
[13:51] <ahayzen> the camera is being attacked!
[13:53] <Flashtek> lol
[13:53] <AlanBell> hmm, might be out of wifi range
[14:24] <soreau> AlanBell: cool
[14:26] <soreau> now go outside and do a dance for us ;)
[14:37] <gord> wouldn't that just make it rain?
[14:47]  * mattt makes it rain
[14:50] <SuperMatt> I WANNA KNOW WHAT LOVE IT
[14:50] <SuperMatt> I WANT YOU TO SHOW ME
[14:50] <SuperMatt> sorry, the radio in the office took over my soul
[14:54] <SuperMatt> http://ubuntuone.com/0wSvJvmxB9JvDv8zVf4k1A <- I hate this
[14:55] <davmor2> SuperMatt: Why?
[14:55] <SuperMatt> I'm running the beta, and I like *new* things
[14:55] <SuperMatt> I always despise the months after a release becasue I rarely get new shinys
[14:56] <davmor2> SuperMatt: you dipstick
[14:57] <SuperMatt> yes?
[14:58] <popey> haha
[14:58] <popey> we'll add some shiny for you SuperMatt
[14:59] <SuperMatt> hooray!
[14:59] <bigcalm> I like a stable system :D
[15:00] <popey> stable shmable
[15:00] <popey> we should switch to rolling release
[15:01] <popey> developer submits a patch, we build immediately and roll that sucker out!
[15:01] <gord> as a part of my job for the last three years i've constantly been on the bleeding edge of ubuntu, just as it gets stable they make me switch out for the dev version... its not fun
[15:02] <davmor2> gord: you love it you know you do
[15:07] <SuperMatt> I normally jump on to the alphas around alpha 2. I don't care if it's a little flaky
[15:07] <popey> % <---- world's smallest ASCII violin for gord
[15:08] <SuperMatt> hurr
[15:08] <SuperMatt> I can make it smaller
[15:08] <SuperMatt> ctrl+-
[15:11] <gord> no unicode character?
[15:11] <davmor2> popey: damn you now I will always see that as a violin
[15:11] <bigcalm> http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/1f3bb/index.htm
[15:31] <Azelphur> popey: :o, I don't buy cheap PSUs, I'm captain overkill remember
[15:31] <Azelphur> corsair AX1200 \o/
[15:32] <popey> :)
[15:32] <Azelphur> I also have a bunch of CX600's for my bitcoin rig
[15:35] <directhex> overkill on PSUs is bad
[15:35] <directhex> power supplies have an optimal load level, if the load is below that then their efficiency drops off pretty fast
[15:35] <directhex> also above a certain level
[15:35] <Azelphur> directhex: yea, it's around 60% isn't it? I reckon I'm hitting that.
[15:36] <Azelphur> http://www.overclock.net/lists/display/view/id/4482079
[15:36] <directhex> yeah, ~60, good guess
[15:36] <directhex> http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/fullimage.php?image=10583
[15:36] <Azelphur> it's a juice guzzler :P
[15:37] <directhex> hah. still tied to socket 1366 too, eh?
[15:37] <Azelphur> yea, I built it a couple days before sandy bridge was announced
[15:37] <Azelphur> xD
[15:38] <directhex> price on socket 1366 chips = craaaazy :'(
[15:38] <Azelphur> but can always upgrade
[15:38] <directhex> i'm enormously tempted to treat myself to a new 1440p monitor
[15:38] <directhex> and a gpu to drive it
[15:39] <davmor2> Azelphur: how is your bitcoin rig going by the way
[15:39] <Azelphur> davmor2: great, I ordered new ASICs which will be up and running soon, so the current hardware is obsolete and I'm selling it off.
[15:41] <bigcalm> Is it wrong to nom Rennie like sweets?
[15:41] <christel> yes
[15:41] <davmor2> bigcalm: yes
[15:42] <bigcalm> Oh well :)
[15:42] <bigcalm> Not treating them as sweets, just seem to be getting through a lot of them
[15:44] <davmor2> bigcalm: I'd change your diet if you are getting through that many
[15:45] <bigcalm> davmor2: tis the work :)
[15:45] <bigcalm> I look forward to doing nothing at all this weekend
[15:45] <davmor2> I bet you do something in the end
[15:46] <bigcalm> Humf
[15:46] <bigcalm> I might breath a little
[15:47] <davmor2> bigcalm: and sleep, and eat, and blink, and heart beat, and move about, and drink, and...........
[15:47] <bigcalm> Maybe, we'll see how I feel
[15:49] <bigcalm> I should get around to replacing my router with the one I configured last night. I can now share my phone's 3g connection across the whole lan (or will be able to once I move over to it)
[15:52] <bigcalm> It's now 16:53 and I have only just opened a terminal to my dev server - one of those days :S
[15:59] <dogmatic69> bigcalm: 7 minutes to get some work in...
[16:00] <bigcalm> dogmatic69: my day is contracted to finish at 6pm
[16:00] <dogmatic69> bigcalm: bah
[16:00] <bigcalm> dogmatic69: very much so
[16:02] <popey> arent rennie basically just chalk?
[16:03] <bigcalm> popey: as far as I know, yes
[16:03] <bigcalm> I'm guessing that it's better than drinking lots of Gaviscon
[16:04] <gord> they should really make medicine in cake form
[16:05] <popey> or japanese sweets
[16:05] <popey> you'd be set
[16:06] <gord> the last delivery was a DIY rice panda, you made a panda out of chemicals that made a rice like substance and then had more chemicals that made a water substance that tasted like soy sauce, then you dipped the panda into the "soy sauce", it was great
[16:08] <davmor2> gord: we obviously need to find you more to do if you have that kinda freetime ;)
[16:16] <DefoeNo5_> Hi
[16:16] <AlanBell> hi DefoeNo5_
[16:17] <DefoeNo5_> Thanks for letting me know about this channel!
[16:20] <DefoeNo5_> What is the current /topic on here?
[16:20] <AlanBell> chickens \o/
[16:21] <AlanBell> but other people talk about Ubuntu too
[16:21] <DefoeNo5_> I was wondering about UK events or meetups that take place?
[16:21] <AlanBell> ooh, and parties
[16:21] <AlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2006/detail/
[16:21] <AlanBell> 27 people coming to the one next week
[16:21] <DefoeNo5_> I want to get more involved but don´t know where to begin
[16:25] <directhex> hm, i can't find the order for when i bought the RAM for my PC
[16:29] <Azelphur> anyone know where to get some nice cheap nfc stickers?
[16:29] <davmor2> directhex: I can help you there, it will be in the last place you look and find it....hope that helps
[16:29] <AlanBell> Azelphur: got some business cards the other day from moo and they came with an nfc card
[16:30] <AlanBell> I have nfc what to do with it :)
[16:30] <directhex> Date   	16/01/2009 14:39:07
[16:30] <directhex> Intel i7 920, Socket 1366 (B), Neha       1      £204.99
[16:30] <Azelphur> AlanBell: you can use them for profiles which would be cool, I'd like to put a sticker on my Nexus 7 stand so it starts up the clock app (I use it as a bedside clock)
[16:30] <AlanBell> don't think Galaxy S2 does nfc
[16:31] <Azelphur> and perhaps one on my desk to shut up what I like to call the megaping.
[16:31] <Azelphur> get message on google talk -> OH GOD EVERY SINGLE DEVICE IN THE ROOM IS PINGING AT ME
[16:31] <popey> my phone is rarely out of silent mode
[16:32] <Azelphur> popey: haha, I really want to be able to route calls through my PC's headset
[16:32] <Azelphur> that'd make me a happy camper
[16:32] <gord> could you not get a bluetooth .. thing. and just tell the phone that your pc is a bluetooth headset?
[16:33] <Azelphur> gord: Windows can do it, Linux is bugged atm so can't
[16:34] <Azelphur> although apparently that's been fixed now, so I should try again
[16:34] <Azelphur> bug 1026378
[16:34] <Azelphur> nope, bot doesn't like me
[17:04]  * AlanBell voids warrantees
[17:06]  * Azelphur voids AlanBell
[17:06] <directhex> aha. kingston valueram.
[17:06] <directhex> huh, never thought i'd be using that
[17:07] <Azelphur> I have piles of it XD
[17:08] <shauno> Azelphur, you seem just the person for this one ;)  any suggestions for a household material for creating a cooling duct?  (about to try notepaper, but I suspect good odds of smoke)
[17:08] <directhex> so for an upgrade, i need 3x2GB PC3-8500 CL7 DDR3
[17:08] <Azelphur> shauno: moving heat around is very difficult
[17:08] <directhex> Azelphur: i totally don't remember what RAm i bought in early 2009
[17:09] <Azelphur> generally any piping type effort just results in heating up the pipe and then heating the room that the heat was already in anyway.
[17:09] <directhex> heh, it was probably http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kingston-Valueram-1066MHz-Registered-Thermal/dp/B001O7XA1Y/ref=sr_1_9?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1350061735&sr=1-9
[17:09] <shauno> I have a chassis fan 2" away from a 'fanless' cpu.  the machine originally had a plastic duct that tunnelled the two.  I appear to have lost one of said ducts :/
[17:10] <Azelphur> ah, so your only looking short distance
[17:12] <directhex> cen't believe i paid for CL7 when DDR3 was still newish
[17:12] <directhex> then got *low budget* CL7 :D
[17:12] <directhex> then again i originally got a low-budget X58 board
[17:12] <directhex> which didn't work
[17:12] <directhex> all three times
[17:13] <Azelphur> shauno: then yea, maybe PVC from a plumbing store or something
[17:13] <Azelphur> I bet you could find a good replacement there
[17:13] <directhex> might be easier/cheaper to get 3x4GB of CL9 nowadays rather than trying to source another 3x2GB 7-7-7-20 on the cheap
[17:15] <Azelphur> directhex: you need that kingston valuram 1066?
[17:15] <Azelphur> I have piles of it for sale
[17:15] <Azelphur> literally exactly that ram
[17:16] <directhex> Azelphur: which stuff *exactly*?
[17:16] <Azelphur> lemme get the box, one sec
[17:17] <directhex> trade for a used 120G SSD :p
[17:17] <Azelphur> KVR1066D3N7/2G, 2GB PC3-8500 CL7
[17:18] <Azelphur> DDR3 1066
[17:18] <directhex> huh, yeah, whodathunkit?
[17:18] <directhex> 1.5V?
[17:19] <Azelphur> I'd imagine so, that's the model number there so you should be able to look everything up
[17:20] <directhex> yes. http://www.valueram.com/datasheets/kvr1066d3n7_2g.pdf
[17:20] <Azelphur> :)
[17:20] <Azelphur> I have 6 of them
[17:20] <directhex> that is exactly the ram i'm using. weird ._.
[17:20] <Azelphur> they are in my bitcoin rigs, that I'm selling off
[17:20] <Azelphur> :)
[17:20] <Azelphur> what SSD is it?
[17:21] <directhex> er, ocz agility 3. cash is fine too
[17:21] <Azelphur> yea, don't like agility particularly
[17:21] <Azelphur> I'm asking £5 a chip + pnp, I'm also selling all this stuff if any of it takes your fancy http://www.reddit.com/r/hardwareswap/comments/106y5z/uk_selling_loads_of_assorted_parts_5870s_6990/
[17:22] <directhex> £5 a stick? i'll take 3.
[17:22] <Azelphur> cool :)
[17:23] <shauno> hm, I think trying to get plumbing materials to fit would be a tight squeeze.  there's not a whole lot of room  (1U boxes)  (looks like http://cl.ly/image/2B3F0v1z0305 - original duct looks like http://cl.ly/image/2f1B252Q0E1m )
[17:23] <directhex> about five quid for RMSD?
[17:23] <Azelphur> RMSD?
[17:24] <directhex> royal mail special delivery
[17:24] <Azelphur> ah yea, something like that
[17:24] <directhex> bump the rig up to 12G, that'll be fancy pants!
[17:24] <directhex> so twenty squid. paypal?
[17:24] <Azelphur> sure, anything else on that list interest you? XD
[17:25] <directhex> not unless you have a socket 1366 chip cheap ;)
[17:25] <Azelphur> not right now, I might do in the future
[17:25] <directhex> currently thinking i'll buy a gtx670 and 1440p monitor for xmas
[17:25] <Azelphur> oO, one of the korean imports? I have 4 of those
[17:25] <directhex> paypal address?
[17:25] <Azelphur> azelphur@azelphur.com
[17:25] <Azelphur> I won't be able to send it out until monday most likely
[17:26] <directhex> Azelphur: the korean imports don't do hdcp etc, so no. but you can get a "proper" one from ocuk with the same panel for £400
[17:26] <Azelphur> Post offices close real early on saturday, and not at all on sunday here
[17:26] <Azelphur> directhex: ah, I paid £200 for mine
[17:26] <directhex> Azelphur: yeah, but i *need* multiple inputs incl. displayport and need hdcp
[17:26] <Azelphur> directhex: you can get those from korea too
[17:28] <Azelphur> http://www.ebay.com/itm/27-Inch-Matrix-Neo-270WQ-Multi-DP-Port-HDMI-1-4a-2560x1440-WQHD-S-IPS-Monitor-/150866560995?pt=Computer_Monitors&hash=item23205907e3
[17:28] <Azelphur> this is the same monitor from the same guy I bought from, but the version with displayport
[17:28] <directhex> Jo, you have sent £20.00 GBP to Alfie Day.
[17:28] <Azelphur> :)
[17:28] <Azelphur> yep got it, I'll aim to get those chips out to you on Monday
[17:29] <Azelphur> people need to buy my other things, those 5870s are so cheap, cheapest on ebay is £100+pnp lol
[17:30] <directhex> got a 5850. otherwise i'd get one for crossfire /o\
[17:32] <Azelphur> hehe
[17:32] <directhex> wifey has a 6970
[17:32] <Azelphur> I sold a couple of them already, did people little i3-3220 gaming rigs with my 5870 and CX600 corsair psus, great bang for buck XD
[17:32] <Azelphur> works out at like £350 for a decent gaming rig
[17:34] <directhex> Azelphur: so, is your OSD all in hangul? :D
[17:34] <Azelphur> I don't think it actually has an OSD, just buttons
[17:34] <Azelphur> I've never used it
[17:35] <Azelphur> I think even the buttons don't work
[17:35] <Azelphur> xD
[17:35] <Azelphur> the power light flashes when I press them, that's about it.
[17:36] <directhex> these korean screens always advertise an OSD, and never really have one
[17:36] <Azelphur> the monitors are perfect though, I got the zero dead pixel guarenteed ones, I'm very happy and if I buy more monitors in the future, it'll most likely be these again
[17:36] <directhex> sounds identical to the last korean screen review i read ;)
[17:38] <dubaco> anyone here_
[17:38] <Azelphur> if I end up switching to ATI
[17:38] <Azelphur> I will go on a monitor binge.
[17:38] <dubaco> I really need to resize my partitions can anyone help please
[17:38] <Azelphur> nope, nobody here.
[17:39] <Azelphur> have you tried gparted?
[17:39] <dubaco> i am on a live disk with gparted open and im scared of getting it wrong
[17:40] <Azelphur> you should backup before repartitioning anyway
[17:40] <Azelphur> regardless of if you're new or a seasoned professional
[17:40] <dubaco> i tried google but with my dyscalcia and dyslexia its a bit scarey reading all that technical stuff that expects me to know it all already
[17:40] <dubaco> i have
[17:40] <Azelphur> if you've backed up, then you've got nothing to worry about
[17:40] <Azelphur> if you mess up, restore the backup and try again
[17:41] <dubaco> Azelphur: i duel boot
[17:41] <Azelphur> that's ok as long as you've backed up
[17:42] <Azelphur> if you have any specific questions about partitioning, feel free to ask
[17:42] <dubaco> i have EVERYTHING to worry about as i cant get the bank id login if i do mess up
[17:43] <Azelphur> dubaco: but surely you would back that up?
[17:43] <Azelphur> you just said you did a backup, have you not done a backup?
[17:43] <dubaco> Azelphur: you cant back them up
[17:43] <Azelphur> sure you can
[17:43] <dubaco> Azelphur: you know what bankid is
[17:43] <Azelphur> dubaco: do you have a large external drive to backup onto?
[17:44] <Azelphur> dubaco: you can take an image of the entire drive, and restore it back to exactly how it was, what data is on the drive is irrelevant
[17:44] <dubaco> ok so from a live cd how\s i do that_
[17:45] <Azelphur> do you have a large external drive or something to backup to?
[17:45] <directhex> so, from the original PC built in January 2009, what's still original here?
[17:45] <directhex> hm.......
[17:45] <dubaco> yes a 1tb western digital hdd
[17:45] <Azelphur> awesome
[17:45] <Azelphur> dubaco: your computer has one hard drive, /dev/sda?
[17:45] <directhex> the CPU, the motherboard, the PSU
[17:45] <directhex> need to replace the monitor
[17:45] <dubaco> i warn you i am a n00d
[17:45] <directhex> RAM doesn't count once i add what Azelphur is mailing me
[17:46] <Azelphur> directhex: :)
[17:46] <directhex> keyboard is a hand me down from her wifeliness
[17:46] <dubaco> and the keyboard is swedish but set to us english
[17:46] <Azelphur> dubaco: yea, but answer the question? xD
[17:46] <directhex> the mouse, is that original? it's a warranty replacement, but i think it is
[17:46] <directhex> oh, speakers! the connection's a bit fuzzy between speakers and sub, but they sound fine
[17:46] <dubaco> Azelphur: i have a 1tb hdd external
[17:47] <Azelphur> (18:45:12) Azelphur: dubaco: your computer has one hard drive, /dev/sda?
[17:47] <shauno> I forgot how much I hate tray-loading DVDs.  I keep ending up in a arm-wrestling match with the thing :/
[17:47] <Azelphur> we're talking about the internal drive(s) now
[17:49] <dubaco> Azelphur: it is a asus k53u with 1 hdd
[17:50] <Azelphur> ok, so you do have one hard drive inside, and that hard drive is /dev/sda?
[17:50] <Azelphur> gparted can tell you this
[17:50] <Azelphur> if you look at the drop down box at the top right of gparted, answering that question should be pretty straightforward
[17:51] <dubaco> dev sda 298gb
[17:51] <Azelphur> and you probably have a dev sdb too, which would be your external drive?
[17:52] <Azelphur> or not if it isn't plugged in yet
[17:52] <dubaco> I have that drive now plugged in
[17:52] <Azelphur> ok
[17:52] <Azelphur> hit ctrl+r in gparted
[17:52] <Azelphur> so it refreshes
[17:53] <Azelphur> do now you should have /dev/sda 298GB (this is your computers internal drive) and /dev/sdb which will be 9xxGB, and that is your external drive, correct?
[17:54] <Azelphur> so*
[17:54] <dubaco> I have a new drive in gparted ending in the letter b  meaning sda and sdb drives are registered
[17:54] <Azelphur> cool
[17:55] <Azelphur> so what I said ^ is correct?
[17:55] <dubaco> Azelphur: not as cool as you *smiles*
[17:55] <Azelphur> hehe
[17:55] <dubaco> yes
[17:55] <Azelphur> dubaco: ok, do you know where your external hdd is mounted?
[17:55] <Azelphur> it'll be /media/something
[17:56] <dubaco> it-s called New Volume as i couldnt be bothered to name it
[17:56] <Azelphur> ok
[17:56] <dubaco> it wont mount in nautilus
[17:56] <christel> ./7
[17:56] <christel> er
[17:56] <Azelphur> lol, you'll need to get it to mount
[17:56] <Azelphur> can't back up to it if we can't mount it
[17:58] <dubaco> Azelphur: you cant mount a drive while in gparted
[17:58] <Azelphur> dubaco: if you wanted I could remote control your PC and make sure it's all correct, would probably make you happier
[17:58] <Azelphur> ah, close gparted
[18:00] <dubaco> ok have done just to let you know 2 things I cant format the 1tb drive as that has my life on it... and i need the ladies room so one sec... or 120
[18:00] <Azelphur> yea, wasn't intending on formatting the 1tb
[18:03] <dubaco> do you work for ubuntu
[18:04] <dubaco> Azelphur: you seem ok.. but i am unsure about how permissive studentcoms firewall is
[18:05] <Azelphur> dubaco: ubuntu isn't a company, and nah I'm just a voulenteer who helps out in here :)
[18:05] <Azelphur> I doubt the firewall will block it xD
[18:05] <Azelphur> sudo apt-get install x11vnc && x11vnc --connect home.azelphur.com
[18:05] <Azelphur> will let me see your screen and take over your mouse / keyboard, you can stop it simply by closing the terminal window :)
[18:06] <dubaco> you have a US keyboard
[18:06]  * Azelphur shall make sure the backup is all good then you can go nuts in gparted
[18:06] <Azelphur> nope, UK
[18:07] <dubaco> Ok well its possibly better either way as I have a swedish one and live cd is set to american keyboard
[18:07] <Azelphur> hehe
[18:07] <Azelphur> your keyboard layout settings will make no difference to me
[18:08] <Azelphur> so yea, go run that command in a terminal
[18:09] <dubaco> unable to locate xvnc
[18:09] <dubaco> x11vnc rather
[18:09] <Azelphur> oh yea, livecd has universe disabled
[18:09] <Azelphur> go into the software center, go edit, software sources, tick "Community-maintained free and open-source software (universe), then click close
[18:09] <Azelphur> then in the terminal type sudo apt-get update
[18:10] <Azelphur> then you'll be able to run the first command :p
[18:11] <dubaco> ok tack Azelphur
[18:12] <Azelphur> tack?
[18:12] <Azelphur> there we go, I'm on :)
[18:12] <dubaco> im totally skipping meditations to do this lol
[18:12] <Azelphur> hehe
[18:12] <Azelphur> ok so show me your backup drive
[18:12] <Azelphur> cool
[18:12] <Azelphur> so that's at /media/New Volume
[18:13] <dubaco> i have a blank partition called New Volume where i wiped the Windows back up from the system
[18:13] <Azelphur> yea, is /media/New Volume your 1TB external drive?
[18:14] <dubaco> I wish to keep a copy of windows so when i go to university next year i dont end up paying the evil deamon that is windows more money
[18:14] <Azelphur> hehe
[18:14] <Azelphur> looks like it, it has the funky usb icon on it
[18:14] <Azelphur> so to do a full image of your internal drive
[18:14] <dubaco> you can do it
[18:14] <Azelphur> ok xD
[18:14] <dubaco> take over my pc for a bit
[18:15] <dubaco> wait
[18:15] <Azelphur> that'll take a while to run
[18:15] <popey> evening all
[18:15] <dubaco> that wont format newvolume will it
[18:15] <Azelphur> nope
[18:16] <Azelphur> your entire hard drive just gets stored on a file in /media/New Volume/backup.dd.bz2
[18:16] <dubaco> so i will have my childrens film collection on there still
[18:16] <Azelphur> yep
[18:16] <Azelphur> no changes besides a new file
[18:16] <Azelphur> you can go look at it in the file browser
[18:16] <Azelphur> :)
[18:17] <Azelphur> it takes the contents of /dev/sda, zips them up, and stores them in /media/New Volume
[18:17] <Azelphur> then if your repartition goes sideways, you can simply restore your entire hard drive, exactly as it was, from that backup
[18:17] <dubaco> i see... i was going to ask about the new volume partition on my drive
[18:18] <Azelphur> haha
[18:18] <dubaco> Azelphur: tack tack
[18:18] <Azelphur> anyway, that backup will take a few hours or so to complete
[18:19] <Azelphur> so, I'mma go get some food
[18:20] <dubaco> cool ,
[18:20] <dubaco> what vegan food you havin - it\s world vegan month
[18:20] <Azelphur> probably bolognase with beef xD
[18:20]  * Azelphur isn't vegan
[18:21] <dubaco> Azelphur: have you ever eaten a vegan meal >D
[18:21] <davmor2> It was only a matter of time http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CayMeza487M
[18:21] <Azelphur> sure
[18:21] <Azelphur> I've had quorn and stuff, zero sugar cakes too, etc
[18:21] <dubaco> cool
[18:21] <Azelphur> I jumped off the remote control now btw, the terminal will just drop back to a prompt when it's done
[18:21] <dubaco> umm can you do me a favour pleas
[18:22] <Azelphur> go on?
[18:23] <dubaco> take over my machine and copy the out put of the terminal to paste.ubuntu.com and paste the link here as studentcom want me to log on but i cant get to my encrypted volume to get the required password and would like to paste it
[18:24] <dubaco> that output
[18:24] <Azelphur> lol, you'll need to reconnect me to vnc again (just press up then enter in the relevant terminal)
[18:25] <Azelphur> looks like you've been eaten by the scrollback monster
[18:25] <Azelphur> lol
[18:25] <Azelphur> if you install pastebinit you can pastebin right from the terminal
[18:26] <Azelphur> want me to do that?
[18:27] <dubaco> ye sure
[18:28] <dubaco> tack (thanks)
[18:28] <Azelphur> :)
[18:29] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/quantalinstall.png should those be capital Q?
[18:29] <dubaco> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1275394/ that' the lspci
[18:29] <Azelphur> :)
[18:29] <Azelphur> dubaco: so yea, going to get some food, once that backup has finished give me a ping and we'll do the gparted thing
[18:30] <Azelphur> protip, Azel then press tab :p
[18:30] <dubaco> thank you Azelpher - one last tiny thing If i do a backup like this does it mean i can remove windows and keep it as a virtual machine in linux
[18:31] <Azelphur> not really, this type of backup is an entire image of your drive, to get any use out of it, you'd have to restore it back onto your drive again
[18:31] <davmor2> wopum wopum wopum Klingon style
[18:31] <dubaco> the same drive
[18:31] <dubaco> i guess
[18:31] <Azelphur> yea
[18:31] <dubaco> o.0
[18:31] <dubaco> ok
[18:31] <Azelphur> it's good in that you can take your drive out, stamp on it, buy a new drive, and then restore your backup and nothing will have changed
[18:31] <Azelphur> but that's about all it's good for
[18:31] <Azelphur> xD
[18:32] <AlanBell> stamping on drives is not an official recommendation
[18:32] <dubaco> well... I did make the mistake of installing Windows in Swedish when i hardly speak swedish
[18:32] <dubaco> lol
[18:32] <Azelphur> indeed, we the folks at #ubuntu-uk do not recommend stamping, stabbing, punting or submerging any parts of your computer.
[18:33]  * AlanBell files bug 1066076
[18:33] <Azelphur> so yea, brb gonna drop some food in the microwave
[18:33] <dubaco> Azelphur: No, datestamping is good *giggles*
[18:33] <Azelphur> xD
[18:33] <dubaco> kk
[18:33]  * xnox for f sake.
[18:33] <xnox> AlanBell: thanks. ubiquity upload is pending.
[18:34] <dubaco> xnox: be mindful. take a breath count to 20 and release that breath slowley
[18:36] <AlanBell> xnox: on the plus side I just installed ubuntu using orca
[18:37] <AlanBell> not entirely eyes free or I wouldn't have spotted the lower case "q"
[18:37] <dubaco> **robot voice** welcome to Orca
[18:37] <davmor2> AlanBell: but did it repeat everything for the sake of it just to confuse you?
[18:37] <AlanBell> davmor2: so much better than not saying it at all
[18:37] <dubaco> they should get stephen fry to be the voiceof Orca
[18:37] <AlanBell> but yes, we can now file little bugs
[18:37] <davmor2> AlanBell: it's true
[18:38] <AlanBell> dubaco: you can change the voice, orca doesn't speak as such
[18:38] <AlanBell> it just decides what to say
[18:38] <AlanBell> espeak is the default synth which is small and covers all languages and sounds like a computer
[18:39] <xnox> AlanBell: meh, not a bug =) not a serious one anyway.
[18:39] <AlanBell> there are *much* better sounding options available, but they wouldn't fit on the CD and are language specific
[18:39] <AlanBell> xnox: what, the "q"! I consider it a critical release blocker :)
[18:39] <davmor2> AlanBell: balck country is an amusing voice for orca
[18:39] <dubaco> AlanBell: my Professor has MS and within a few years may be a wheelchair user he loves working I wonder Would Ubuntu have a speech to command thing where he speaks to a headset and then it does something like "save document"
[18:40] <AlanBell> yeah, it does all kinds of dialects
[18:40] <AlanBell> dubaco: ok, so that is called voice control, and the best application I know of to do that is called Simon Listens
[18:40] <AlanBell> it is a Qt based application, but works fine in Ubuntu
[18:41] <AlanBell> there was some problem with the packaging or licensing of it's recognition engine which is called Julius and that was blocking it getting into debian
[18:41] <AlanBell> http://www.simon-listens.org/index.php?id=122&L=1
[18:42] <AlanBell> debian bug 597065
[18:43] <AlanBell> err, debian bug 596511
[18:54] <Azelphur> dubaco:
[18:54] <Azelphur> with voice control, afaik Ubuntu isn't so good
[18:55] <Azelphur> although maybe it has improved since I last investigate
[18:57] <AlanBell> voice control is OK with Simon
[18:57] <AlanBell> continuous speech dictation is far from OK
[18:58] <dubaco> AlanBell: it's gotta be better than bluez in ubuntu /it works a little whereas bluez does not
[18:59] <AlanBell> pocketsphinx is a reasonable recognition engine, if you give it a small vocabulary of words it is expecting
[18:59] <AlanBell> !info bluez
[18:59] <AlanBell> what has that got to do with speech recognition?
[19:00] <dubaco> AlanBell: he's a senior professor of law /BIG/words will be used and lots of em <D
[19:00] <AlanBell> dubaco: ok, in that case it won't work
[19:00] <dubaco> I am frustraghted at it not worling
[19:00] <AlanBell> "save document" type commands will work
[19:00] <AlanBell> it knows what commands to expect
[19:01] <dubaco> bluez used to work in 10.04
[19:01] <dubaco> 11.04 rather
[19:01] <dubaco> has not worked at all for me on either of my machines since 11.10
[19:03] <AlanBell> probably the best stab you will have at continuous speech recognition is to use an android app that farms out the recognition to Google's servers and then pipes the results back to the desktop
[19:04] <Azelphur> I bet you could just write a client for a PC that did it
[19:04] <Azelphur> or if push came to shove, use the android sdk
[19:04] <dubaco> 300 student laptops * 2.3ghz is equivilant to a supercomputer right?
[19:05] <Azelphur> dubaco: you'd need control over all of them, and cooling
[19:05] <dubaco> Azelphur: i dream. a lot.
[19:05] <Azelphur> you dream, I build https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/Photos/2011/May/IMG_20110520_150522.jpg :P
[19:05] <dubaco> but for a buddhist nun that's to be expected
[19:07] <dubaco> (im a novice nun...)
[19:07] <Azelphur> :)
[19:12] <dubaco> there are not many nuns in the uk, fewer still who use Linux
[19:13] <Azelphur> I imagine so, two niches :)
[19:28] <AlanBell> xnox: that "q" bug was invalid, it now calls it 12.10
[19:30] <xnox> AlanBell: I know =)
[19:30] <xnox> AlanBell: I invalidated it.
[19:30] <AlanBell> so you did, I was about to do so
[19:30] <xnox> AlanBell: but I let relevant people know that rseries should open as Rseries
[19:30] <AlanBell> Rabid Raccoon
[19:31] <xnox> AlanBell: we don't call it by numbers until release, in case release slips.
[19:31] <AlanBell> yeah, that is fair enough
[19:31]  * AlanBell likes names
[19:31] <xnox> AlanBell: and also prevents people from testing pre-release & thinking it's final.
[19:31] <xnox> code names is fun stuff for developers. version numbers is for boring corporates =)
[19:33] <AlanBell> boring corporate Amazon lens using Rhythmbox listeners
[19:33] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: is that a new insult? :)
[19:33]  * AlanBell likes to have a well defined target market
[19:39] <AlanBell> bug 1066096
[19:40] <MartijnVdS> grammar, what it is?
[19:40] <xnox> AlanBell: =))) lol.
[19:40] <xnox> AlanBell: about the push push button button. I have actually no idea, why it's doing that.
[19:41] <MartijnVdS> it it likes likes to to make make sure sure you you heard heard it it correctly correctly
[19:55] <dubaco> Azelphur: bzip2: I/O or other error, bailing out.  Possible reason follows. bzip2: File too large 	Input file = (stdin), output file = (stdout)
[19:57] <AlanBell> xnox: it will be a focus issue as the rest of the page draws or something, it is a bit odd
[19:58] <Azelphur> dubaco: that's annoying
[19:59] <Azelphur> delete the backup we created since it didn't go too well
[19:59] <Azelphur> we'll use gzip instead, silly bzip2
[19:59] <Azelphur> sudo dd if=/dev/sda | gzip > /media/New\ Volume/backup.dd.gz
[20:00] <xnox> AlanBell: while radio button has focus, pressing enter will activate install now push button (it was "action" "focus"?!)
[20:00] <dubaco> ok, is it wise to coonect to your server again>?
[20:00] <xnox> AlanBell: and we do flip between the two....
[20:00] <AlanBell> ooh
[20:01] <AlanBell> I normally navigate around the page, not tried just hitting enter on a radio button
[20:01] <dubaco> Azelphur:  i deleted it as you said,
[20:02] <AlanBell> is there a bug for the two keyboard icons in the indicators for the install session?
[20:02] <dubaco> Azelphur: is there anything next?
[20:02] <Azelphur> dubaco: did you start the new backup like I said too?
[20:03] <dubaco> unsure how this is to be done
[20:04] <Azelphur> (20:59:51) Azelphur: sudo dd if=/dev/sda | gzip > /media/New\ Volume/backup.dd.gz
[20:04] <dubaco> Azelphur: sorry, missed this
[20:05] <Azelphur> np :)
[20:06] <AlanBell> someone want to confirm bug #969566
[20:07] <AlanBell> just boot a live CD, hit ctrl+s when you hear the drums
[20:07] <AlanBell> then wait a bit and hit ctrl+s again. If nothing happens the first time, and it starts talking the second time then mark it as affects me too
[20:08] <dubaco> the command has been typed :")
[20:09] <AlanBell> xnox: Bug #1045803 appears to be fixed
[20:09] <xnox> AlanBell: without tabbing to the label?
[20:10] <AlanBell> xnox: it just read it all out to me
[20:10] <xnox> AlanBell: it would read "Reboot Now", and I had to do alt-tab twice or tab to get it.
[20:10] <xnox> AlanBell: can you take a screenshot and attach it & comment on the bug?
[20:10]  * xnox didn't do anything to fix it....
[20:11] <AlanBell> Installation complete. Installation is complete you need to restart the computer in order to use the new installation
[20:11] <AlanBell> restart now push button
[20:11] <Azelphur> dubaco: back to waiting
[20:11] <xnox> AlanBell: ok then. Comment on the bug, and mark it fix-released. If you can't mark it, I'll mark it.
[20:13] <AlanBell> this might be the first a11y testing session where I am closing more bugs than I am opening
[20:14] <dubaco> :~$ sudo dd if=/dev/sda | gzip > /media/New\ Volume/backup.dd.gz  gzip: stdout: File too large
[20:14] <dubaco> Azelphur: ping
[20:14] <Azelphur> :S
[20:14] <Azelphur> does anyone know what on earth that error is about
[20:15] <Azelphur> is your external HDD fat32?
[20:16] <dubaco> not sure, i need to check
[20:16] <dubaco> msdos
[20:17] <xnox> AlanBell: =)))))) /me tried
[20:18] <Azelphur> yea, fat32 I imagine, I think that error is because you hit the file size limit on your filesystem
[20:18] <Azelphur> that's annoying xD
[20:20] <Azelphur> dubaco: either you gotta do a file shuffle around and reformat your external hdd to a sane filesystem, or just dive into gparted and hope it goes ok lol
[20:24] <dubaco> ok heres what i could do- I could make a live usb boot to my netbook wipe the files on the netbook use the hard drive on the netbook as storage as that is 250gb then have enough to make a partition on the 1tb hdd of about 750gb
[20:25] <dubaco> Azelphur:  would that be big enough
[20:25] <Azelphur> falls under the same thing, if you have 100% critical files you shouldn't repartition without a backup
[20:25] <dubaco> i need to do it anyway
[20:26] <dubaco> i need the 1tb drive to back up the entire drive not just one partition
[20:26] <Azelphur> yea, but in order to do that you need to completely wipe and reformat the 1TB hdd
[20:26] <Azelphur> FAT32 can't do >4GB files
[20:28] <Azelphur> in other news, a huge moth has invaded my room
[20:28]  * Azelphur puts it back outside again
[20:30] <dubaco> Azelphur: Karma is an ever encompassing circle.
[20:30] <Azelphur> :)
[20:31] <Azelphur> dubaco: what's the buddhist view on putting moths back outside? I'm curious
[20:32] <dubaco> Buddhist view? I am guessing you may mean what Dharma says about the preservation of life?
[20:32] <Azelphur> I suppose so :)
[20:32] <Azelphur> I don't hurt my continual stream of moth visitors, I just catch them and put them back outside
[20:33] <dubaco> Perhaps the concise answer is that, Many Buddhist's are very strict veggetarians.
[20:33] <Azelphur> :)
[20:34] <dubaco> Buddha was the embodiment of an enlightened being, and of compassion it's self
[20:35] <Azelphur> dubaco: does your laptop have a key on the bottom for windows?
[20:36] <dubaco> the super key (all keys are super, yet this is what i know it toi be known as)
[20:36] <dubaco> Yes, this one does
[20:36] <Azelphur> noooo lol
[20:36] <Azelphur> I mean, a license key sticker
[20:39] <dubaco> I took those off
[20:39] <dubaco> No reason, just simplicity
[20:40] <Azelphur> ah haha
[20:40] <Azelphur> was gonna say if you had that, and the partitioning failed, push come to shove you could reinstall
[20:41] <dubaco> yes, the aim of this is to get windows down to 20gb or the bare minimum
[20:42] <Azelphur> in 99% of cases it's fine, sometimes stuff can go wrong though
[20:42] <dubaco> is it possible to get a bootable windows drive?
[20:43] <Azelphur> you can make windows usb sticks but it's a bit of a mission
[20:46] <dubaco> i have 4 iso\s that where made when i first used the windows install
[20:46] <dubaco> original settings they said it was
[20:47] <xnox> AlanBell: I am confused about bug 408949
[20:48] <xnox> because I do not believe that the "Install alongside resize widget" the draggable slider is accessible.
[20:48] <xnox> but the bug title != bug contents.
[20:48] <xnox> do you know bug # for the auto-resize widget?
[20:49] <AlanBell> hmm, maybe I missunderstood that one
[20:50]  * AlanBell goes back and tries again
[20:50] <xnox> AlanBell: I think A new bug should be open to be honest.
[20:50] <xnox> AlanBell: the title is as if about automatic resize. yet the contents is about as if manual.
[20:51] <AlanBell> yeah, I thought it was about the something else option
[20:51] <xnox> AlanBell: so two bugs: the graphical sausage in something else is not accessible.
[20:51] <AlanBell> ah, I think I don't have enough space to trigger the side by side option
[20:52] <xnox> AlanBell: and: the auto-resize (install along side) resize widget (allocate drive space?!) is also inaccessible.
[20:52] <AlanBell> graphical sausage in something else isn't clickable
[20:52] <xnox> AlanBell: yes, you need a VM with 16GB disk attached. And do one full disk install & boot again.
[20:52] <AlanBell> it is just a display as far as I can tell, not a widget
[20:52] <AlanBell> ok, will make a bigger disk vm
[20:53]  * AlanBell rattles through the installer again
[20:54] <xnox> AlanBell: well actually it is a Gtk Paned widget, which is used to drag parts of a window e.g. channel buffer & nick list separator
[20:54] <AlanBell> ah, ok
[20:54] <xnox> but dragging & resizing windows is really a sighted operation..... and I don't know if it has any a11y in standard gtk. (and it is a standard gtk widget, with funky CSS graphics =) )
[20:55] <AlanBell> yeah, as long as you can do it by the numbers in different widgets I think that is fine
[20:55] <AlanBell> I think I will do this install with the monitor off
[20:56] <xnox> hmmm....
[20:56] <xnox> AlanBell: I am thinking to replace the auto-resize widget with the http://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/3.2/GtkScale.html
[20:56] <xnox> when a11y is enabled.
[20:57] <AlanBell> hmm, I am not keen on things changing when a11y is enabled
[20:57] <AlanBell> especially as it will be on by default at some point
[20:58] <xnox> what do you mean "on by default" ?
[21:01] <AlanBell> gnome bug 678095
[21:02] <AlanBell> gnome bug 677491
[21:03] <dubaco> Azelphur:  this is odd Bus 002 Device 003: ID 1058:1021 Western Digital Technologies, Inc. Elements 2TB
[21:03] <dubaco>  2tb but i see 1tb
[21:03] <Azelphur> hehe, sounds like it's bigger than you thought it was :)
[21:03] <Azelphur> dubaco: shall I have a look at it
[21:05] <dubaco> Sure
[21:06] <AlanBell> xnox: I got to the end of the installer without turning on the monitor
[21:06]  * xnox \0/
[21:06] <xnox> did it yell your passwords as well?
[21:06] <AlanBell> asterisk asterisk asterisk
[21:06] <AlanBell> oh, then reselect them "black circle black circle black circle"
[21:06] <Azelphur> dubaco: looks like a 1TB, also did you wipe your drive?
[21:07] <Azelphur> gparted says there's nothing there o.O
[21:07] <xnox> i hope that Digium Inc will not complain about advertising asterisk ;-)
[21:07] <Azelphur> gparted be weird
[21:07] <dubaco> nah see there are files there
[21:08] <Azelphur> yup, that's oddness
[21:08] <Azelphur> but yea, it's definitely a 1TB drive
[21:08] <dubaco> I just unplugged a usb pendrive
[21:08] <Azelphur> I guess that's an error in the usbids database
[21:09] <dubaco> ok i\m on a 12.04 live disk
[21:09] <Azelphur> :)
[21:09] <AlanBell> people on the internet are looking at me
[21:10]  * Azelphur looks at AlanBell
[21:10] <AlanBell> probably Myrtti again
[21:11] <Azelphur> AlanBell: how are people looking at you
[21:11] <AlanBell> http://ubingo.libertus.co.uk/cam/
[21:11] <Azelphur> that's fun
[21:11] <AlanBell> I put it in my office so people can watch me install Ubuntu with the screen off
[21:11] <Azelphur> xD
[21:11] <AlanBell> (slight logic fail there)
[21:11] <Azelphur> AlanBell: you know about ustream right?
[21:12] <AlanBell> Azelphur: hmm, a little bit about it
[21:12] <AlanBell> so, how would I pipe an .asf feed into ustream?
[21:13] <AlanBell> xnox: ok, so the fail is that I can't tab to the link for advanced partitioning tool
[21:14] <Azelphur> AlanBell: you wouldn't, it just reads from your webcam and broadcasts it onto the internets
[21:14] <Azelphur> I use it all the time
[21:14] <Azelphur> it can work on my phone too
[21:15] <xnox> AlanBell: you don't tab to it, you left-arrow to it.
[21:15]  * xnox or maybe it was right-arrow....
[21:15] <xnox> because you are changing the radio button group item.
[21:16] <AlanBell> oh right, I will try again
[21:17] <AlanBell> Azelphur: ok, this is an IP webcam, not one attached to my computer
[21:18] <AlanBell> gah, I need to nuke both failed installs and install again to get back to that screen
[21:18] <Azelphur> AlanBell: http://www.ustream.tv/channel/Azelphur ustream :)
[21:18] <Azelphur> although it seems like my phone is having a funny, one sec
[21:19] <AlanBell> yeah, but I can't click that to steer it
[21:19] <Azelphur> hehe
[21:19] <AlanBell> try clicking on mine
[21:19] <Azelphur> it's all "Yes, a black image is exactly what I see"
[21:19] <Azelphur> AlanBell: fun
[21:20] <dubaco> Azelphur: dejuvu is ubuntu backup tool, can it back up a windows sistem that wont boot or make a disk image from that?
[21:20] <Azelphur> it's an AlanBell
[21:20] <Azelphur> *waves*
[21:20] <Azelphur> dubaco: I know nothing about dejuvu
[21:20] <Azelphur> AlanBell: http://www.ustream.tv/channel/Azelphur there we go, now ustream :D
[21:21] <AlanBell> xnox: ok, found a funny one
[21:21] <Azelphur> It's an azelphur :O
[21:21] <AlanBell> when typing in the username field it reads the letters one by one and this slows things down so if you type fast it can get the letters out of order
[21:22] <AlanBell> which can go badly wrong if your name is alan
[21:23]  * xnox *giggles*
[21:23] <xnox> maybe it's trying to tell you something.....
[21:23] <AlanBell> maybe so
[21:24] <AlanBell> I think that is just an artifact of it being in a VM and not having enough performance or something
[21:53] <AlanBell> xnox: hmm, I can't get to it
[21:53] <xnox> =(
[21:54] <AlanBell> not from that page, I can go back to the installation type page and choose "something else"
[21:54] <AlanBell> but I can't get to the link on the install alongside page that takes me to advanced partitioning
[22:01] <AlanBell> so bug #1066102 and bug #1066152 are not really a11y bugs but I found those
[22:02] <AlanBell> bug #1066154 is keyboard navigation which also impacts a11y
[22:03] <xnox> AlanBell: you can't get to the link, or the link is not there at all? it's only shown if there are small partitions that are deleted.
[22:03] <AlanBell> can't get to the link
[22:03] <xnox> but it is there. ok.
[22:03] <AlanBell> without using the mouse
[22:06] <AlanBell> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bugs?field.tag=a11y was down to 8 earlier, now back up to 15
[22:07] <xnox> but for example bug 1066102 is not really a11y =) it's just confusing. but with a screen-reader does it announce indicator icon type?
[22:07] <AlanBell> yeah, that one isn't a11y, just something I saw
[22:07] <AlanBell> not sure you can navigate up there with the keyboard anyhow
[22:08] <AlanBell> which isn't that critical because if you want to start the on screen keyboard or high contrast stuff you can be assumed to have a mouse or pointing device
[22:10] <AlanBell> probably should allow access to the ibus/keyboard layout things actually
[22:11] <AlanBell> you don't need access to the network indicator as the installer guides you through setting up wifi if you have that
[22:13] <AlanBell> ok, so I can't get to the indicators without using a mouse, but once I do they appear to be more accessible than the real indicators :)
[22:18] <AlanBell> eww, really nasty unity one :(
[22:18]  * AlanBell tests carefully
[22:25] <AlanBell> ok, so this is fun, and a bit of a popey one I suspect
[22:25] <AlanBell> orca does not speak the buttons in the dash for applications on your computer
[22:26] <AlanBell> but it does speak amazon shopping results \o/
[22:26] <AlanBell> zomg conspiracy!
[22:26] <AlanBell> it also speaks videos and files and folders
[22:27] <AlanBell> and application names from the software center
[22:27] <AlanBell> but not applications from your computer
[22:29] <AlanBell> bug 1066157
[22:29] <shauno> bizarre question, what's the easiest way to create a file in /proc ?
[22:30]  * AlanBell suspects this is a compile your own kernel kind of question
[22:30] <AlanBell>  /proc isn't a real file system
[22:30] <shauno> ah.
[22:31] <shauno> yeah.  I need to pretend some hardware exists.  or I need to make a specific set of data appear in /proc/nvram, at least (and not reflect what's actually on the board)
[22:32] <AlanBell> would be nice to cat /proc/cpuinfo >> /proc/cpuinfo to make your computer twice as powerful ;)
[22:32] <shauno> heh
[22:32] <shauno> still trying to migrate these machines to VMs.  mostly because I'm informed that a few people have already tried, and it's "not possible"
[22:33] <AlanBell> sudo cat /proc/cpuinfo >> /proc/cpuinfo
[22:33] <AlanBell> bash: /proc/cpuinfo: Permission denied
[22:33] <AlanBell> see, can't be done ;)
[22:33] <shauno> turns out the licensing code is checking a serial number that's stored on the board
[22:34] <Azelphur> anyone here happen to be a wizard with mupen64plus? I'm trying to get 4 player mario kart running on my netbook and need some help getting the performance to an acceptable level
[22:34] <AlanBell> shauno: I can see what you are trying to do, I suspect it will involve some scary stuff with mount, or a new kernel
[22:35] <AlanBell> like mounting proc somewhere else and fixing/remapping the stuff that breaks
[22:35] <shauno> actually, that's not a bad idea.  does linux do union mounts?
[22:36] <AlanBell> shauno: you might be better off with a preload library that lies to the software
[22:38] <shauno> it's all java, so would be easier to decopmile & edit if I was going to go that direction
[22:38] <AlanBell> oh ok
[22:38] <AlanBell> or a chroot
[22:38] <AlanBell> you can lie to it in a chroot
[22:39] <shauno> I'm just trying to leave the software stack as untouched as possible, because it's our software we're meant to support.  so bugs & quirks should reflect real life as closely as possible
[22:40] <AlanBell> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BasicChroot
[22:40] <shauno> legacy devices where we're running out of running samples, but customers won't give up because the current "offer" adds a zero or two to the price tag
[22:40] <AlanBell> sudo mount -o bind /proc /var/chroot/proc is the normal way to get /proc into the chroot environment
[22:41] <AlanBell> I suspect if you mucked about with that and unionfs or some overlayfs you could get it to work
[23:05] <daftykins> shauno: what's so special about these systems?
[23:05] <Azelphur> does anyone know if the open source drivers for AMD chips are better than the proprietary driver yet, in terms of game performance?
[23:06] <shauno> daftykins, they're a product we used to sell ~10 years ago.  so it's nice to keep some alive to help support customers who still have them
[23:06] <daftykins> ah i see
[23:06] <shauno> but they were sold as an appliance.  the software on some weird pc104 boards
[23:06] <daftykins> may i ask what kind of device?
[23:07] <shauno> it's basically snmp management on steroids
[23:08] <daftykins> heh
[23:08] <shauno> with a bunch of odd extensions for pushing firmware to our own devices, etc
[23:08] <daftykins> sounds fun
[23:09] <daftykins> i used to fiddle with a bit of SNMP lark like spiceworks, but have never really been on a proper sizeable network to see the benefits it can give
[23:10] <shauno> our best working example at the moment is a customer who has nearly 3000 of our devices, but each at a different site  (all US & canada, but spread as far as guam & puerto rico)
[23:10] <daftykins> wowzer
[23:11] <shauno> so managing/monitoring them from one place makes a huge difference  (it's a retail shop, so the staff at each site aren't so technical)
[23:12] <daftykins> mmm makes sense
[23:12] <daftykins> i overheard staff talking about a downed till at a local supermarket only the other day
[23:13] <daftykins> i'd bet that'd come in handy there
[23:13] <shauno> we're more on the power side.  so if we break, their POS & telcomms all go down together
[23:13] <daftykins> ah
[23:17] <shauno> these are all under the APC brand, which probably gives you a better idea what the end devices end up as
[23:46] <daftykins> err
[23:46] <daftykins> think i'm being pretty stupid to connect the dots to be honest
[23:52] <shauno> oh .. they make/sell UPSes