/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/10/30/#ubuntustudio-devel.txt

=== smartboyhw is now known as sbhw-m
stochasticIs Ubuntu Studio getting involved in the Movember campaign at all?09:09
=== ailo is now known as ailo-uds
ailo-udsSeems like my server crapped out at home09:11
ailo-udsI'm at a session about automated tests09:11
ailo-udsUTAH09:11
contrapunctusO_o09:11
ailo-udshttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/AutomatedTesting09:34
ailo-udsfalktx: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppDevUploadProcess09:42
micahgFYI, that process won't allow those packages to be used on UbuntuStudio images09:44
falktxit's a nice read09:47
falktxailo-uds: are you at uds now, i suppose?09:48
falktxailo-uds: are you at uds now, i suppose?10:05
ailo-udsfalktx: yep10:06
falktxah, cool10:06
falktxailo-uds: i read the wiki page, nice stuff in there10:06
falktxailo-uds: that is just a plan for now, right?10:07
falktxie, it's doesn't work that way just yet10:07
ailo-udsfalktx: Seems like work in progress, to make it easier for people to add apps to Software Center10:07
ailo-udsfalktx: Since they are going towards mobile phones, etc, they need that kind of framework10:07
ailo-udsfalktx: I still think pushing to Debian is the best way for desktop software10:08
micahg_mobileYeah, these apps will be very restricted in what they can do10:30
ailo-udsTip for anyone wanting to reinitialize group membership without logging out and in again: newgrp10:44
ailo-udsOnly, it doesn't seem to work as expected10:47
smartboyhwlen-dt, you actually merged the Ubuntu Studio"13.04" plymouth text theme code? I am surprised:P13:16
len-dtsmartboyhw, not a big deal either way. I could think of some things where it may be useful.13:17
smartboyhwOK13:17
smartboyhwstochastic, what November campaign that you talked before?13:18
astraljavasmartboyhw: Movember. Bit different. :)13:25
smartboyhwastraljava, what is it then?:P13:26
smartboyhwhi scott-work 13:50
astraljavasmartboyhw: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movember13:55
smartboyhwastraljava, good I don't have a moustache;P13:56
knomeastraljava, you going to have a movember?14:01
astraljavaNah.14:01
knomebah.14:02
smartboyhwSo no for me14:03
smartboyhwknome, how is your backache?14:03
smartboyhwBetter?14:03
knomeit's there.14:03
scott-workhi smartboyhw and everyone14:04
knomehey scott14:04
knomescott-work, too bad you aren't around here14:05
scott-workhi knome , yeah, i'm wishing i was there too14:05
scott-workbtw knome, i think xubuntu 12.10 looks really good, is this due to xfce 4.10?14:05
scott-workLen-nb: ailo, astraljava , micah, smartboyhw - i should also note that i think ubuntu studio really looks good this cycle as well, quite a large leap from 12.04 in my opinion14:06
smartboyhwscott-work, :D14:06
knomescott-work, i don't think xfce 4.10 has much to do with the looks14:07
knomescott-work, mostly some smallish user experience things14:07
knomescott-work, but thanks :)14:07
smartboyhwscott-work, yay finally got my first code merged into a Ubuntu Studio code branch:D14:09
* smartboyhw wonders where is aiLO14:09
contrapunctussmartboyhw14:12
smartboyhwmicahg, having a great time at UDS heh?14:12
contrapunctusHow do you do that? O_o14:13
smartboyhwcontrapunctus, what do you mean, how do you do that?14:13
contrapunctus'action' lines.14:13
smartboyhwcontrapunctus, you mean the action items on blueprints?14:13
* len-dt is off to work14:13
smartboyhwbye len-dt 14:14
contrapunctusI mean this - * smartboyhw wonders where is aiLO14:14
smartboyhwcontrapunctus, I do like "/me wonders where is ailo"14:14
contrapunctus(probably the most asked question on IRC channels)14:14
smartboyhwThat shows up that message14:14
* smartboyhw = the user14:14
* contrapunctus wonders if it's working.14:14
contrapunctusAw yes.14:14
smartboyhwcontrapunctus, yes14:14
contrapunctusThanks sbhw.14:15
smartboyhwHey ailo-uds how is uds?14:23
ailo-udssmartboyhw: Pretty ok. I was glad I went to the UTAH session14:23
ailo-udsAs I understand it, we can write tests, and submit them to Ubuntu labs, and they will perform them14:23
ailo-udsWould be perfect for us. 14:23
smartboyhwailo-uds, good. Then I think you can write the tests for us:P14:24
ailo-udsThose tests would be about performance mostly though. Not user/desktop testing, which we will need to keep doing14:24
ailo-udsI've already been working on developing tests. This way I only need to think about what to test. Not how to code it14:25
ailo-udsSaves a lot of time14:25
smartboyhwailo-uds, :D14:25
ailo-udsAlso, performing the tests needs setting up machines, which at least takes a day or two. 14:26
ailo-udsSo, that is also something you'd want to skip14:26
smartboyhwailo-uds, :D14:26
smartboyhwailo-uds, btw can you draw up a list of what we are gonna talk about in that planning session on Thursday?14:29
ailo-udssmartboyhw: I will, don't worry14:31
scott-worksmartboyhw: that is a cool feeling14:31
ailo-udssmartboyhw: I need to think about that. In the meanwhile, ideas are welcome14:31
scott-workailo-uds: i was telling everyone that i thought ubuntu studio 12.10 looks quite a bit better than 12.1014:31
smartboyhwWow wow wow suddenlt you all send messages to me14:31
smartboyhwWait14:31
smartboyhwscott-work, you should:P14:31
smartboyhwailo-uds, yay:D14:32
ailo-udsscott-work: Yea, it looks ok. It's a good time in many aspects. I just can't get over the problems with qjackctl and jackd. In retrospect, we should have handled that. Right now, I'm focused on other things, but I won't want that to happen to next release also14:33
ailo-udsBetter to disable something, if it's not working well, than to ship something that crashes on you14:33
smartboyhwailo-uds, scott-work astraljava len-dt holstein yay we can now decide whether we want to have Alpha and Beta 1 releases14:40
holsteinwhat do we have now? just testing til launch?14:41
smartboyhwholstein, no. 1 beta, then rc, then launch time14:41
holsteini like what we have14:42
smartboyhwWe can decide. Maybe 2 betas, then 1 rc14:42
holsteini dont think we should add anything14:42
ailo-udsUbuntu is changing their routine14:42
smartboyhwOr 2 Alpha, 2 betas, 1 rc14:42
smartboyhwholstein, that is not ADD that is REMOVING milestones14:42
holstein1 beta, 1 rc, and release... 14:43
smartboyhwThat is great I think, should be discussed in the raring planning session on uds.14:43
holstein2betas implies to me that addes a milestone14:43
smartboyhwholstein, yes14:43
holsteini dont care though... whatever you guys need/decide14:43
holsteini just dont want to add things if we dont need to14:43
smartboyhwPossibly scott-work's opinion is needed the most14:43
smartboyhwailo-uds, what is your option?14:44
smartboyhwLet me set up a vote for that14:45
ailo-udssmartboyhw: I think it is too early to decide on this now, as not everyone even knows what is happening yet14:46
micahgsmartboyhw: ubuntustudio-look is maintained in the ubuntustudio branch14:46
smartboyhwailo-uds, oh :P14:46
micahgsmartboyhw: and I thought that it was decided not to do what you just did14:46
smartboyhwailo-uds, can you help to ask the experts what is happening :P14:46
smartboyhwmicahg, oh ok14:47
ailo-udssmartboyhw: There's no hurry. We don't need to decide anything this week even. Let's just get informed first. We need to find out what will happen, what we can do, etc14:47
smartboyhwailo-uds, from what I heard from a Canonical employee is that there will only be a beta and a release candidate for vanilla Ubuntu, and that flavors can decide how many betas and alphas (if applicable) they want14:48
ailo-udssmartboyhw: I've heard about the new release schedule also. What we could do is read more about it, and post about it on the list, and ask for opinions14:49
micahgthe milestones that there will be is still up for discussion, but all flavors (Ubuntu included) can decide to participate or not14:49
smartboyhwWe can also do cadence testing instead14:49
ailo-udssmartboyhw: Perhaps you could take the initiative on finding more out about the release schedule, and posting about it on the mail list. 14:57
smartboyhwailo-uds, did:P14:58
ailo-udsThis way we will all get to learn more about it, and can discuss what we should do. I personally have no idea about what would be best atm14:58
smartboyhwailo-uds, OK15:01
scott-workto be honest, my first reaction is to align our testing schedule with whatever ubuntu is using, having the same cadence certainly has benefits15:18
knomeyup15:19
scott-workof course, that doesn't mean we _have_ to have the same schedule. having a different testing schedule might address particular issues for us15:19
holsteinif we have to hustle and do official tests for each milestone, that could be problematic15:20
knomeonly if you plan to break something and need a freeze that is longer than one day ;915:20
ailo-udsI suggested here at uds to create a unified team between flavors for developing docs, and keeping it at the same place.15:36
ailo-udsSince we do more or less exactly the same type of tasks, would be good to save energy this way15:36
knomethat sounds good, but i'm not sure if xubuntu, for example, would have the workforce to do that15:37
ailo-udsI'm not worried about if everyone will participate in creating docs. Just that if the docs would be helpful for everyone. I can imagine do a bit of work for this. 15:40
ailo-udsFeedback would be just as important as writing docs15:43
ailo-udsIf none of the flavors care, of course, that would not be great15:43
knomemmh15:46
ttoinescott-work, I was looking for the blueprints, can someone give a link where I can look at them and edit them ?15:53
ttoineoh, and of course, Hi everybody !15:53
ailo-udsttoine: I posted a couple of emails about that15:54
ttoineis Kaj on irc sometimes ?15:54
ailo-udslet's see..15:54
ailo-udsttoine: That's me15:54
ailo-udshi15:54
ttoineailo-uds, I saw a lot of emails, but no link...15:54
ailo-udsttoine: I posted the link many times :). There's an overview at the wiki for all the blueprints here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/RaringBlueprintsCategories.15:56
ttoineailo-uds, you are kaj ? great to know that ;-)15:56
ailo-udsttoine: If you click the links on that page, you get to each blueprint15:56
ttoineailo-uds, ok. it is not listed (or maybe I missed it) on the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio page15:56
ailo-udsttoine: The wiki frontpage we will need to rework a bit, but if you follow the Team Resources link, you get to blueprints that way15:57
ailo-udsI'll be wanting to change the wiki so it's more developer orientated15:58
ailo-udsLess user related links on the front page, and quicker access to dev pages15:58
ailo-udsttoine: I assume you are going to participate in creating blueprints? :)15:59
ttoineailo-uds, yes, that's the aim16:01
ailo-udsttoine: Which areas do you think you will be interested in?16:02
ttoineailo-uds, for public relation, may I suggest that we use mainly the wordpress news possibilities. and then, use Twitter Feed for automatic post to Facebook and Twitter ? It would save a lot of time16:02
ttoineailo-uds, I can work on user documentation, mainly audio and publishing. I know a linux video producer and will do my best to have contributions from him16:03
ttoineprogramming etc is not my stuff16:04
ailo-udsttoine: One of the things I personally am trying to achieve is to try make suggestions as public as possible, so either post about it on the mail list (which is very good, if you know people will want to discuss it), or just make a blueprint about it,.16:05
ailo-udsttoine: On public relations, I think this will depend on who will be interested in making and posting news16:05
ailo-udsttoine: If someone is very active, I wouldn't mind seeing news all over the place16:05
ailo-udsttoine: If we don't have someone active, I think your suggestion is very good16:05
ailo-udsThat's just my opinion16:05
ailo-udsttoine: Sounds great about docs. I hope you won't mind me having opinions about docs, since I'm doc lead. I might do nothing, or I might want to reedit. I'll always discuss things with you first16:06
ttoineailo-uds, the aim with public relation would not be to post everyday. But post once or twice a month would be great16:06
ttoineit would show that we are active16:07
ttoineand so we could create a community of followers on twitter, facebook etc...16:07
ailo-udsttoine: I definately agree that we should post at least a few times a cycle, but wouldn't mind several posts a week either, if someone wants to do it16:07
ttoineI think i can handle the public relation part, I do that in my job16:07
ailo-udsThe content of the news would depend entirely on how much energy goes into it. The more energy, the broader the content16:08
ttoineailo-uds, there are different kind of posts. for example, the distro relative post, of course, are not very often16:08
ailo-udsWe should create a public relations team16:08
ttoinebut for example, if a major application is updated, it could be good to communicate a PPA, etc..16:08
ailo-udsI think so far, we have ttoine, holstein and smartboy as candidates for that team16:09
ttoineailo-uds, we can use too the editor / author roles of wordpress16:09
ttoineso maybe let some people suggests posts.16:10
ailo-udsWe need to see about adding users with posting privileges to the website. knome Do you know anything about that?16:10
ailo-udsttoine: I think for the content of news, there can be a lot of creativity. We can link to blogs that other people have written about Ubuntu Studio, or just multimedia on Linux in general. 16:11
knomeailo-uds, yes. can we get to that after the sessions?16:11
ttoineailo-uds, just to understand, there are 3 places to edit stuff about blueprints : whiteboard, work items, and of course, the relative wiki page. First point, if I want to start a documentation, what is the best to do ? And second point, if I want to add a suggestion (eg: twitterfeed), where should I put it ?16:11
ailo-udsknome: Absolutely, thanks16:12
knomenp16:12
ttoineailo-uds, we could display all #ubuntustudio on twitter on the website, too16:12
ttoineoh sorry, I was thinking you have some time now.16:12
ailo-udsttoine: There is no longer a wiki space for adding blueprints. If you know an workitem you want to add, add it to workitem. If you are just thinking out loud, you can use the whiteboard16:13
ttoineok16:13
ailo-udsI have time, but I'm also sitting at a session :).16:14
knomehttps://twitter.com/Xubuntu/status/26331215778403532816:16
ttoineailo-uds, wich email adress can I use to create a twitter account ?16:20
ttoineor maybe knome or scott-work can tell me ?16:20
ailo-udsttoine: For UbuntuStudio? Maybe let scott-work create one? Would be good also to think about how to coordinate the channels, so that many people can post, if needed16:21
knomei don't think twitter supports multiple email accounts16:23
knomejust use one and be ready to share the account password16:23
knomethat's what we did for xubuntu16:23
ailo-udsSome channels could just be used as forwarding channels16:24
ailo-udsYou do one post, and it ends up in multiple places16:24
ttoineailo-uds, that's why I would like us to have a Twitter account : to send the rss feed of ubuntustudio.org on it16:26
ailo-udsttoine: If you like, you could make up some plan on how to coordinate everything. We have facebook and g+ already set up (g+ seems difficult to use in comb). And we have the website16:27
ailo-udsThey don't all support the same kind of posts16:28
knomeif you want wordpress to send the posts to twitter, you will need to get ahold of IS to get a plugin installed.16:28
ttoineknome, not at all16:30
ttoineit is possible to share the rss through twitter and facebook, and Linkedin with twitterfeed16:30
ttoineFor facebook, you just need to add me to the admin of the ubuntu studi page16:31
ttoinefor twitter, it seems that there is already a @ubuntustudio account... 16:31
knomeis that active?16:32
ttoineno16:32
ttoinebut is it not possible to use the account16:33
ailo-udsDoesn't seem to be someone we know16:33
ttoineand I can find it on twitter...16:33
ttoinehttps://twitter.com/ubuntustudio16:33
ttoineI send a mail to twitter admins to try to get it for us16:34
ailo-udsWe could just use another name, like ubuntu-studio. The important thing is we put up a list of "official" accounts on the website, once we have this all sorted out16:34
ailo-udsttoine: Ah, great16:34
ttoineis ubuntu studio a registered trade mark? maybe by canonical ?16:38
ailo-udsscott-work: ^16:40
knomemost probably is16:40
ttoineI think that if we are not allowed to sell ubuntu studio t-shirts... it is pretty sure16:41
knomettoine, you can actually sell, but you can't make any money out of it.16:41
ttoineailo-uds, knome if you are at the uds, you may find someone of the marketing / brands / managment ?16:41
ailo-udsttoine: We got a tip on who to email about it. If scott-work doesn't know, we should probably find out :)16:43
ailo-udsscott-work: I got a message now saying that Ubuntu Studio is not a registered trademark.16:46
ailo-udsttoine: ^16:46
knome...in united kingdom16:49
ailo-udsknome: The guy next to me just checked US too16:49
knomeok :)16:50
knomebut the ubuntu part is trademarked, so...16:50
knome:)16:50
ailo-udsYeah, how does that work? Ubuntu is a word though, so not like a name16:51
knomeno idea16:51
ttoineI will try to manage that16:57
ttoinefirst of all i will contact the owner of @ubuntustudio16:57
knomettoine, if the account is active, twitter can delete it for you16:57
knomettoine, we did that with @Xubuntu16:57
ttoineand then contact twitter to see if as a community name, we can ask to get the name16:57
knomettoine, (we used to be @XubuntuLinux)16:57
ttoineknome, great. how did you do that ?16:58
knomettoine, you should ask pleia2, she handled that16:58
knomei don't think twitter has a hard policy on not allowing to reigster names that are not trademarked for "you" unless it's something like @microsoft16:58
knomeanyway, i think you might need a *good* reason to delete an account that is not yours16:59
ttoineyes17:12
ttoineknome, for xubuntu, you have some email@xubuntu.org email address 17:16
ttoine?17:16
knomettoine, nope17:21
ttoineok17:21
knomettoine, just the ubuntu.com addresses for normal ubuntu members17:21
knomei think we ould look into it though17:21
ttoineI don't have an @ubuntu.com email address...17:27
knomettoine, are you a ubuntu member?17:28
ttoineknome, how I know that ?17:28
knomettoine, do you have the ubuntu irc cloak? :P17:28
knomettoine, if you don't know, you most probably aren't17:28
knomeyou specifically need to apply to be one and be accepted17:29
ttoineand how I do that ?17:29
knomettoine, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership17:30
ttoinethe other problem is that there is no physical address for Ubuntu Studio17:46
scott-workailo - yes, i believe all derivatives of ubuntu currently used are trademarked17:49
scott-workoh, i see that ailo said someone checked at it was not17:50
knomeyeah17:50
scott-worki have an email from someone at canonical (marianna i thought) that said it was....checking17:51
knomemmh, right17:51
knomeif that's marianna raffaele, i'm most certain she's here and ailo can get a hold of her17:51
knomei mean, not literally...17:52
scott-workoh, well. i'll search again for the email later17:52
scott-worki had asked about selling merchandise to support development and was basically told "no" but in a very roundabout, circuitous way17:52
scott-workknome: can't we control website access via a launchpad team?17:53
scott-work..17:53
knomescott-work, yes17:54
scott-worki see that lightworks beta is going on, but it a very limited closed beta though :(17:54
scott-workor, i guess this is an alpha release of lightworks17:54
knomescott-work, well, we asked the canonical legal too, and they said we can sell merchandise *as long as we don't make any money out of them*17:55
knomescott-work, i'll talk with ailo about the website access, and show him how he can control that17:56
scott-workknome: i found it was michelle at canonical who is on the trademark team17:56
scott-work"Our trade marks policy does not allow the use of UBUNTU or the UBUNTU logo for commercial purposes and we therefore cannot consent to your sale of UBUNTU branded items."17:56
knomeyeah, but you are not asking about ubuntu, just ubuntu studio17:56
scott-workknome: that is very, very interesting, i.e. "as long as we don't make any money out of them"17:57
knomeyou REALLY should talk with pleia2 about this, she's been handling it17:57
scott-workknome: i shall17:57
scott-workthank you17:57
knomeno problem17:57
knomejust trying to be helpful and exchange ideas17:58
ttoinescott-work, as there is ubuntu in the name it is protected18:39
ttoineI will try to chat with the ubuntu-fr loco team : they sell merchandise to help pay for bandwith and servers18:41
ttoinescott-work, the other problem I have with twitter to get the @ubuntustudio for us, is that there is not physical adresse for our "organisation"18:42
knomettoine, again you might want to ask pleia2 how she did that18:48
ttoineknome, where can I find her ?18:52
knomettoine, #xubuntu-devel for example18:52
ttoineok18:53
scott-workttoine: 21:16
scott-workoops21:16
scott-workttoine: i think what knome is saying is that someone registered the 'xubuntu' twitter account with their own email address and then shared the address and password with others in the xubuntu-dev group21:17
scott-workknome: correct me if i am wrong21:17
scott-workthis lets them get around the 'n physical address for the organization' issue21:17
scott-workwow, super long, busy day today. going home21:17
ttoinescott: it is not the same thing. to claim an account for an organisation, on should use an email adresse with the domain of this organisation21:39
knomettoine, that sounds like what we did, but i'm not sure.22:27
ttoineknome, I will try to be a "member". But I don't know if my work for Ubuntu is enough...22:45
ttoineI'll take some time to make my wiki page, first22:46
knomettoine, they will tell you need more, or more sustainable contribution, if that's the case22:46
knomethe membership process isn't there to make obtaining a @ubuntu.com email hard, but there needs to be some guidelines22:47
knomeonce you get the membership though, it will be yours for life22:47
knome(even if you stopped contributing)22:47
ttoineit's okay. It is not only to have an @ubuntu.com22:47
knomeyeah, i know22:47
knomethat's how some people see the ubuntu membership though22:48
ttoinebut after all, I did a lot of stuff for audio production22:48
knomeand the guidelines need to be there partly because those people22:48
knomebut i think also because there needs to be *some* credibility to having that badge22:48
ttoineI don't care of having a ubuntu business card : I run my own activity... But I would appreciate to see my work and my long involvment for ubuntu studio recognised. If it is not possible, It is not a problem22:49
ttoineknome, of course I understand the need of filters and conditions ;-)22:51
knomeit definitely needs to be regocnized and getting a ubuntu membership is one of the ways to achieve that22:58
knomettoine, will you be around sometime tomorrow?22:59
ttoineI guess in the afternoon. Not in the morning, I have things to do.23:00
knomeso that's afternoon for europe? :)23:00
ttoinefrance, yes23:00
knomeok23:01
ttoineor gmt time, too23:01
knomei'll tell her to get ahold of you23:01
ttoineif you are at the UDS, it is quite the same23:01
ttoinethe same time, I mean23:01
knomeyeah, we are23:01
ttoinethink to sleep a bit ;-)23:02
ttoineIt is midnight here, so I go to bed. Have a nice morning/day/afternoon/evening23:03
knomeoki, good night and see you around23:03
knomeheh, yeah, midnight here as well23:03

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