/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/11/08/#xubuntu-devel.txt

=== ubott2 is now known as ubottu
ZoraktarI'm having worst luck of getting some Linux help... I have tried almost all forums links about Non-pae linux and still not getting any... Last downloaded were Xubuntu 12.04.1 what i was told is for Non-Pae computers... Any suggestions?  Ps. Not 100% sure about if this is right room. 10:59
ochosiZoraktar: the right room would be #xubuntu, this is the development (not the support-) channel11:03
ZoraktarThank you. Leaving room and going to ask. Have good day.11:04
ochosiZoraktar: also, i'm not 100% sure what the problem is. you say you need a distribution with non-pae kernel support (which xubuntu 12.04.1 is)11:04
fobosHello!12:42
ochosihi12:42
fobosi am from Russia. How are you?12:43
ochosinot in a chatty mood12:44
malaverdiereGood morning *15:05
malaverdiereI wanted to know if the fix to that bug was included in xubuntu 12.10 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-xkb-plugin/+bug/94446815:05
ochosimorning15:05
ubottuLaunchpad bug 944468 in xfce4-xkb-plugin (Ubuntu) "keyboard layouts plugin forgets all settings at random times" [Undecided,Confirmed]15:06
ochosii don't see a definitive patch there tbh15:07
* malaverdiere remembered something on the Arch side of things15:08
ochosiyes, but you yourself disconfirmed the arch-workarounds :)15:08
malaverdierehttps://bugs.archlinux.org/task/1674215:08
malaverdierethere is a patch buried somewhere15:09
malaverdierehttps://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?pid=63945115:09
ochosiyou mean one that actually works?15:09
malaverdiereApparently15:10
malaverdiereI switched to KDE way before that15:10
* malaverdiere doesn't like building too many thigns from source15:10
ochosithen i urge you to file a bugreport upstream and attach the patch there15:10
ochosiit doesn't make sense to fix these things in one distro only15:11
malaverdiereI first put it on lp15:14
malaverdiereUpstream had a bug, which I updated: https://bugzilla.xfce.org/show_bug.cgi?id=769215:19
ubottubugzilla.xfce.org bug 7692 in General "the current layout per window are forgotten every couple of minutes" [Normal,Assigned]15:20
malaverdiereI am not sure how to put upstream in lp... any clue? 15:21
ochosino, if it's in xfce's bugzilla, that's upstream enough15:21
ochosiif it gets fixed upstream, it'll trickle down to debian and ubuntu15:22
ochosii guess partly we're not using that plugin by default in xubuntu because it's buggy15:22
ochosiand partly it's buggy, because no-one uses it by default (so most don't consider it important enough)15:22
malaverdiereIs there a good alternative?15:23
ochosithere is an indicator, but i don't know whether it still supports gtk215:23
ochosi(maybe not)15:23
malaverdiereI have to type in fr_CA and en_US, and must switch back and forth all the time15:24
ochosiyeah, i can see how/why the plugin is useful15:24
ochosibut there are quite a few plugins that are not well maintained at the moment15:24
malaverdiere:(15:25
ochosifeel free to pick it up :)15:25
malaverdiereThanks for the suggestion, but I'll skip15:25
malaverdiereI have enough to do in LO :P15:25
malaverdiereI'll see the updates to the bug trackesr15:26
malaverdiereThanks for your time15:26
ochosilibreoffice?15:26
malaverdiereyup15:26
ochosiinteresting15:26
* malaverdiere is a tdf member15:26
ochosinice15:26
ochosiunfortunately we can't install it by default in xubuntu15:26
ochosinot enough space in the image15:26
ochosi(at least to fit on a CD)15:26
malaverdiereI understand all that. But that's okay15:26
malaverdiereOpen source FTW15:26
malaverdiereciaaaaaaaaao15:27
ochosiseeya15:27
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
xnoxare you happy to drop CLI ndiswrapper utils from kubuntu seeds? kernel module is not shipped so they are useless...19:35
xnoxare you happy to drop CLI ndiswrapper utils from xubuntu seeds? kernel module is not shipped so they are useless...19:35
* xnox copy & paste error =)19:35
knomeif it's not working and not going to be fixed, i don't believe we need it ;)19:36
xnoxknome: it's working, it's just the module is not shipped on the image, so if you need it you must get the module over the network... and you can get the utils at the same time.19:37
xnoxthe utils are shipped and the first thing they do is "hmm... you don't have module installed, please install it"19:37
xnoxthe other option is to ship dkms module which will increase the cd size.19:38
knomexnox, hmm. i thought we were shipping ndiswrapper in the ISO too installable, but not usable on live disc19:38
knomehow much approximately?19:38
xnoxknome: ndiswrapper-dkms is not seeded anywhere, so no, you are not shipping the kernel module.19:38
knomei was talking about ndiswrapper19:39
knomebut how much is -dkms?19:39
xnox176 kB is the deb19:39
knomethat's not too much.19:39
knomedo we need anything else?19:39
xnoxinstall size is 76019:40
xnoxI believe you already have everything else.19:40
knomebut i think we're shipping only the ndiswrapper deb too19:40
knomebut seriously, you should talk with mr_pouit or micahg :)19:40
xnoxthe point is - did you have complaints about ndiswrapper not working in precise & quantal?19:40
knomei can't remember too many at least19:40
xnoxbecause without network it didn't in precise & quantal.19:40
knomewell, the thing is, you most probably want network anyway, to download the actual drivers19:41
knome(unless you have them on some media)19:41
xnoxexactly the wiki instructions to get windows drivers (that you install with ndiswrapper) is over the network.19:41
* xnox wants to drop ndiswrapper from images.19:42
knomei think that'd work for me too19:42
xnoxubuntu is shipped pre-install by all major manufacturers these days =)19:42
xnox;-)19:42
knomeif you want to be nice, could you send an email to xubuntu-devel@ ML ?19:42
xnoxack.19:42
knomethanks19:42
knomei'll make somebody more knowledgeable answer the mail in a reasonable timespan19:43
Unit193Hah, gave xnox good news both places. :P19:45
astraljavaIf wired networking is present during install phase, but intention is to move to wireless afterwards, will that hit those users?19:45
xnoxastraljava: no.19:45
knomeas long as wired works without ndiswrapper, no problem;)19:46
xnoxknome: by definition it did =)19:46
knomexnox, it most definitely should unless you have really weird hardware :P19:47
astraljavaxnox: Why? If they need ndiswrapper for the wireless, would they get the -dkms module if they get online during installation?19:48
xnoxastraljava: not automatically, only by hand following the instructions from the wiki.19:49
astraljavaxnox: So then it _would_ hit them, if they didn't know about it while they were wiredly online.19:49
mr_pouitfine by me, just drop it19:50
xnoxastraljava: it _would not_ hit them, as it is already the case _currently_19:50
knomexnox, ^19:50
xnoxno change =)19:50
knomexnox, and no need to send an email19:51
xnoxmr_pouit: knome: ack. thanks.19:51
knomexnox, and thanks for asking.19:51
astraljavaxnox: Ok. Thanks. :)19:52
* xnox :P tongue in cheek19:52
astraljavaxnox: No, seriously. It's great that people still care enough to ask, and even explain when questioned. :)20:18
mr_pouitanyone who could test xfce4-settings from quantal-proposed? (Bug #354830)20:19
ubottuLaunchpad bug 354830 in xfce4-settings (Ubuntu Precise) "xfce4-settings-helper crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_create_instance()" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/35483020:19
mr_pouit(someone for who it crashed before)20:19
mr_pouit(for whom* maybe?)20:19
astraljavamr_pouit: I can, hold on.20:21
astraljava...if I could type my passwd correctly...20:21
astraljavamr_pouit: That's probably universe only, right?20:21
knomeastraljava, s-a-u-s-a-g-e20:21
astraljavaknome: w-i-e-n-e-r20:22
knome:)20:22
astraljavaOh, I'm not sure it crashed before. (yes, I know it might help to read the whole assignment thoroughly before acting on it).20:23
astraljavaGoddamn. I have to downgrade now.20:33
Unit193Single application is very easy.20:38
astraljavaYes, that's fortunately true.20:39
astraljavaWhat do I have to do to make VNC connections work?20:40
astraljavaI installed the client on this POS Mac laptop, but it won't work. Do I need to install a server on the desktop?20:40
Unit193I use x11vnc -safer -forever -display :0  on LAN for the server.20:40
astraljavaThese are different subnets. The laptop is on 192.168.0.*, the desktop is on 192.168.1.*20:41
astraljavaBut routing works from laptop to desktop. Desktop won't see laptop, though. :D Don't ask, I don't have interest.20:42
Unit193(Saying on LAN as I tunnel over ssh to get to that, and it doesn't ask for a password)20:42
astraljavaYes, but I don't think this works the same way. I could ssh in, but then I doubt the client app is able to use that tunnel.20:43
Unit193LocalForward 35900 192.168.100.6:5900  UltraVNC doesn't either, I connect to port 35900 (or -L bleh from command rather than config)20:44
astraljavaOh that's sweet. tightvncserver on *buntu (possibly due debian) by default listens on post 5901, NOT on 5900 (as documented on upstream website). :D21:11
astraljavaWhat?! Now it wants to open session 'ubuntu', which obviously isn't available. Silly, this is a Studio machine!21:13
=== Noskcaj is now known as Noskcaj-at-schoo
=== Noskcaj-at-schoo is now known as Noskcaj-school
adnan__hello :21:55
adnan__:)21:55
ochosihullo21:55
adnan__how would one go with contributing wallpaper artwork for xubuntu21:55
ochosiwell the main problem with that is that we don't have any free space on our image for additional wallpapers21:56
ochosiwe discussed that recently @UDS21:56
adnan__I see :D21:56
knomethe best way would be to send a mail to the mailing list proposing something21:56
knomethat way it can at least be discussed21:57
ochosior if we're around, you can also pastebin stuff here21:57
ochosior imagebin, if you wil21:57
ochosil21:57
adnan__:-)21:57
knomethat too, but in the long run, mail is better21:57
adnan__well thing is, I do not have any artwork yet, was thinking of making something in blender21:58
ochosiright21:58
adnan__and since I love xubuntu, I might try and make something21:58
Unit193xubuntu-artwork-extras :D21:59
ochosiyeah, we could do such a package, but who would find and install it?21:59
adnan__hahah21:59
ochosieven with xubuntu-restricted-extras the problem is that they're not discoverable enough imo21:59
adnan__true22:00
bluesabreespecially when the newest artwork is easily the best22:00
bluesabre:D22:00
ochosihehe22:00
* bluesabre hides22:00
* ochosi bows22:00
adnan__well xfce-look could be a start point for me tho :)22:00
ochosiyeah, but xfce-look is a messy messy place22:00
knomeochosi, wait, who was it again who did the wallpaper?22:00
adnan__yes it is22:00
adnan__:(22:00
ochosiknome: you? :) (bluesabre said "artwork", not wallpaper ;))22:01
knomehmm, he hasn't got a screen?22:01
ochosino22:01
knomeochosi, wallpaper is an integral part of the artwork :P22:01
ochosiwe should give him one somehow22:01
adnan__:))22:01
knomei don't have any reliable services now22:01
ochosiadnan__: if you wanna help with other artworky aspects of xubuntu you're welcome to though22:02
knomeadnan__, ^ yup22:02
ochosiknome: me neither :(22:02
adnan__I would love to contribute any way I can22:02
ochosik22:02
adnan__any links on those aspects :D22:02
knomeadnan__, you're actually talking to the right people now. ochosi is the artwork lead and i'm the project lead22:02
adnan__oo22:02
knomeadnan__, hang around in this channel, subscribe to our mailing list22:03
adnan__what are the odds haha :)22:03
ochosiwell actually there's a new project that we're thinking of undertaking for 13.0422:03
knomehttp://xubuntu.org/contribute/ for more information22:03
ochosiit's related to our icon-theme22:03
knomeadnan__, well, quite good. we're here always :P22:03
ochosithere are quite a few sizes missing of prominent icons22:03
adnan__knome, thought so :))22:03
ochosie.g. trash-full only has a 48px variant22:03
ochosiand we don't like scaled stuff, we prefer it crisp22:03
knomeyeah, people who can draw icons is ++22:04
ochosiso if you're good with vectors, that'd be a nice chnace22:04
knome..or if you want to learn vectors22:04
adnan__nothing wrong in trying :)22:04
adnan__inkscape should do it for me22:05
ochosiyup22:05
knomeyes, that's it22:05
ochosithat's what i'm using too22:05
ochosiwe're currently using git for our icon-theme22:06
adnan__awesome22:06
ochosior actually github to be exact22:06
ochosiit's a fork of the elementary icon theme, back when it still supported other flavors than their own DE22:07
astraljavaWait, someone's using a computer without a screen _whatsoever_?22:07
ochosii talked to them, but a modular approach wasn't really so much in their interest22:07
ochosiso the fork was the logical choice22:07
knomeadnan__, say hi to astraljava, the guy with bad jokes here22:07
astraljavaMan, does he have an ethernet port in the back of his skull or something?22:07
* astraljava bows22:07
adnan__hahaha hello astraljava :)22:08
astraljavao/22:08
adnan__\o22:08
knomeadnan__, anyway, welcome to the community22:10
knomeadnan__, if there's anything we can help you with, just ask in IRC or the mailing list22:10
adnan__thank you, and I sure will22:10
adnan__I hope I'll be able to contribute at least something 22:10
knomethere's always something22:11
adnan__:)22:11
adnan__I guess every bit counts22:11
knomedefinitely22:11
knomewe're not a big team22:11
knomeless than 10 people22:11
adnan__yeah I was wondering about the size, you guys really do a great thing with this :)22:12
ochosinice to hear, thanks :)22:12
knomethanks!22:13
adnan__I reckon xubuntu will gain popularity with all this unity/gnome3 thing going around22:13
ochosiwell ppl have been reckoning that for a while now22:13
ochosii haven't noticed too much of that though tbh22:13
knomeyeah, there's some people migrating, but not tons22:13
ochosiknome: here's the latest shot of my weather-icons: http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-11082012-111405pm.php22:14
adnan__well all my friends were ranting about unity and gnome-fallback-session being ugly22:14
adnan__but they're just inexperienced and don't really know much about linux in general22:14
knomeochosi, mmhmm22:14
knomeochosi, not bad22:14
adnan__looks nice :)22:15
ochosithanks22:15
ochosiit needs quite a few tweaks still, but i hope i'm getting there till next week22:15
adnan__anyway, after showing them xubuntu and that xfce can actually look like their old gnome (and that it's faster as well) they really got hooked up :D22:16
knomecould the sun rays have a bit more variation?22:16
ochosiknome: oh, you're talking to me? (i thought that was a metaphor for xubuntu or something...)22:17
knomethey almost look like small balls around the sun22:17
knome:D22:17
knomei'm not feeling *that* poetic22:18
adnan__hahaha22:18
ochosiok :)22:18
ochosiso color variation or what kind of variation were you thinking of?22:18
ochosior in length of ray?22:19
adnan__streak length maybe?22:19
knomelength, maybe some of the rays could be integrated with the sun itself22:19
ochosiyeah, i could try that22:19
knomeand please, not symmetrically!22:19
ochosiactually my problem atm is more with sleet and stuff like that22:19
ochosijust too many elements sometimes22:20
ochosiwill have to find a way to deal with that22:20
knomemmh, i see. you need something that says "raindrop" and "snowflake"22:20
adnan__maybe substitute place for one water drop and one snow drop22:20
knomewith one thing22:20
adnan__so they're not grouped together but rather mixed22:20
knomeochosi, what about a blueish snowflake?22:20
knomeochosi, with maybe a bit "fatter" look?22:21
ochosiyeah, well now i put the snowflakes on top and the drops below, because that's how sleet happens22:21
knomewell... yeah.22:21
adnan__true22:21
ochosiactually the sleet icon itself is not so bad imo22:22
ochosiit's the sleet-thunder where things get more hairy22:22
knomei'll boot the desktop22:22
adnan__yeah, I was looking at that one 22:22
knomei don't like rain-thunder much either22:23
ochosiyeah, i know22:23
ochosii mean i have the same feeling about those22:23
knomedid you have the sources somewhere?22:23
ochosii originally considered doing the thunder-combinations without cloud22:23
ochosibut it just gets a bit too inconsistent maybe22:23
ochosii can email them, or i can quickly git them if you want22:24
ochosiyeah, git it is22:24
ochosione sec22:24
=== adnan__ is now known as adnanh
knomedell's <322:25
knomeochosi, just paste me the git-url22:26
knomeadnanh, wise choice (nick without underscores)22:27
knomeadnanh, do you know git?22:27
ochosihttps://github.com/ochosi/weather-icons.git22:27
knomecloning22:27
knomedone22:27
adnanhI used it few times22:28
knomeadnanh, doesn't hurt to know it22:28
adnanh:-)22:28
knomeochosi, meh, messy svg22:28
ochosi?22:28
knomenvm me22:28
ochosiare you messing with the xml again? :)22:28
Unit193knome: Yes, Dells are nice.22:28
ochosiUnit193: he said "dell's" :)22:29
Unit193Dell computers, I am lead to think.22:29
ochosiyeah, although knome is referencing his monitors22:29
astraljava"I guess every bit counts" - We're not there yet, but AI gets better almost daily.22:30
knomeyeah, the monitors22:30
knomeochosi, partlycloud-night has more cloud than cloud-night?22:32
ochosiyes22:32
ochosiwait, i guess i have to share the spec with you22:32
knomeif it's as the spec says... fine22:33
ochosihttps://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AtoE1C1siCX6dEYtR0VlMzBLMzVNdGRNR05xMFhqTEE22:33
knomejust wondering if that's a mistake22:33
ochosinop22:33
ochosie22:33
ochosiactually the list isn't 100% up-to-date22:35
ochosii wanted to use it to track the todo-status22:35
ochosibut i think i'll just do that in the readme in git now22:35
knomehttp://temp.knome.fi/shimmer/weather-icons/sleetthunder.svg ?22:35
knomei know that's a bit boring but...22:36
ochosiNo such file or directory22:36
knomehuh??22:36
ochosistrange22:36
ochosisays wget22:36
ochosiff can load it fine22:36
knome:)22:36
ochosiyeah, that'd be a way to do it22:36
ochosiless cruft22:36
ochosiboring but fine imo22:36
ochosiknome: added you as a collaborator, so you can push that icon to git now22:37
ochosigithub is _so_ awesome22:38
knome:)22:38
knomeochosi, http://temp.knome.fi/shimmer/weather-icons/sun.svg22:39
knomesomething like that, maybe a bit less "pronounced"22:39
ochosihmm, that doesn't really convince me22:39
knomehehe22:39
ochosii mean i get the point22:39
ochosibut...22:39
ochosi:)22:39
knomeyeah.22:39
knomethat wouldn't convince me either.22:39
ochosigood to hear :)22:39
ochosii actually did try different things with the sun22:40
ochosii tried to make the rays attached to it22:40
ochosibut that made it look very spiky22:40
ochosi(or spikey?)22:40
knomeuah22:40
knomewhat's the ssh push location :P22:40
ochosioh22:40
ochosii gave you the https link :)22:41
ochosigit@github.com:ochosi/weather-icons.git22:41
knomeupped the new sleet/thunder icon22:42
ochosity22:42
ochosiit doesn't matter if the 22px icons don't have all the details22:42
knomeyes22:42
ochosiwe'll have to do 48px and 128px icons as well...22:42
knomemaybe you want to move the lighning in the other thunder-icons to the same spot as it is in the sleet one22:43
knomeadnanh, too boring, fell asleep? (:22:43
ochosiknome: yeah, good question, not sure22:44
knomethat would help with rain-thunder too.22:44
knomemaybe not move in thunder-only22:44
knome(almost wrote thunar-only)22:44
ochosiyeah, let's do rain-thunder the same way as sleet-thunder22:44
ochosihehe22:44
ochosiyeah, it means the same ;) (thunar = thor = thunder)22:44
knomemm22:44
adnanhhaha, not boring at all, trying some sun streak variations22:45
knomeochosi, pushed new thunder icons22:47
ochosiknome: actually the thunder-only icon might not be used... :'(22:49
ochosieven though it's so pretty22:49
ochosibut there's no such weather in the spec22:49
knome:D22:49
knomeno problem22:49
knomei didn't touch it..22:49
knome;)22:49
ochosiheh22:49
ochosilucky you22:49
ochosiwell since the elements that we need are mainly done, it shouldn't be too hard to recombine them to get all the icons22:50
ochosi20 + night counterparts22:50
knometrue22:50
adnanhdoes this make it look too spiky http://dl.dropbox.com/u/17420410/Xubuntu/sun.svg22:51
ochosihmyeah, that's a bit similar to what i tried22:51
ochosialthough my rays where shorter22:51
knomei'm not sure it's the right way to make all the rays touch the sun22:51
ochosii see knome's point in making the rays with different length, but it's hard to "get it right"22:51
adnanhyeah22:51
adnanhand it just looks weird when some rays are not touching the sun22:52
ochosifeel free to browse for inspiration: http://www.iconfinder.com/search/?q=sun22:52
adnanhwell on the larger icons22:52
knomeochosi, might've shown this to you before, but that is just wonderful art: http://www.boardgamegeek.com/images/boardgameversion/114833/cambridge-games-factory-black-box-edition?username=&sort=hot&date=alltime&gallery=all&licensefilter=&B1=Go22:58
ochosithat's pretty nice!22:59
ochosieven the card-deck is pretty22:59
knomeyes, especially compared to the original art... http://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/1251435/glory-to-rome22:59
ochosioopos23:00
ochosiyeah, that's fugly :)23:00
knomeyeah. as long as the FLGS (friendly local game store) stocks the new version, i'll go running there and tell them to take my money23:00
knomethat game is supposed to be awesome city building, but the art has kept me from buying23:01
astraljavaIf you're that desperate, there's always MEEEEEEE!!!123:01
knomeastraljava, haha.23:01
knomeastraljava, yeah, i'll give you some money too if our schedules meet ;)23:02
astraljavaLovely.23:02
knomehahah. just came around this: http://geekdo-images.com/avatars/avatar_id27376.gif23:04
knome*THAT'S* what i'll do if they have the game tomorrow!23:04
ochosilol23:05
astraljavaHahah!23:05
ochosiknome, adnanh: still working on the sun? :)23:14
knomeochosi, got carried on by the music23:14
adnanhmhm23:14
knomeochosi, and boardgamegeek ;)23:14
ochosiheh23:16
adnanhgah, I have to go now, no luck with this sun23:30
knome:)23:30
ochosiadnanh: no worries23:30
ochosiand feel free to pick an easier icon next time ;)23:30
adnanh:))23:31
adnanhhttp://dl.dropbox.com/u/17420410/Xubuntu/sun_3.svg23:47
adnanhhow does that one look23:47
adnanhochosi, :)23:48
ochosinot too bad23:49
ochosii definitely like it more than the one before23:49
knomemmh, that's good23:49
ochosibut if we want to follow knome's idea, we have to make the rays asymmetrical23:49
ochosioh, he's still around :)23:49
knomeyeah, asymmetrical rays would probably be even better23:49
knomeof course! i'm just browsing BGG23:49

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