| shadeslayer | I'm not entirely sure how this is happening, but does anyone have kdelibs5 on their systems? kubuntu-desktop doesn't pull it in I think | 02:05 |
|---|---|---|
| JontheEchidna | kdelibs5 is a transitional package | 02:10 |
| JontheEchidna | or rather, it used to be. doesn't exist anymore | 02:12 |
| jlittle | over on KFN it's been suggested to drop in here to say thanks! Kubuntu is fantastic, and really appreciated. | 05:00 |
| ScottK | jlittle: Thanks. | 05:38 |
| === Jonno_ is now known as Jon_Severinsson | ||
| === Jon_Severinsson is now known as Jonno_ | ||
| Martiini | 1. How do i delete all my submitted bugs on kde bugtracker? 2. how do i delete kde bugtracker account, please. https://bugs.kde.org/userprefs.cgi | 09:46 |
| yofel_ | Martiini: if that's possible someone in #kde-sysadmin should know how you can delete your account | 09:53 |
| apachelogger | rdieter: is that the thing that shows stuff via a kio slave that generates html? | 12:48 |
| apachelogger | oh yes, I find that totally scary, for reasons like connectDCOPSignal ^^ | 12:49 |
| apachelogger | and the html one of course | 12:49 |
| apachelogger | ScottK: bug 1040259 actually breaks things? | 12:51 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1040259 in skype-wrapper "FFE: libmessaging-menu transitions for quantal" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1040259 | 12:51 |
| apachelogger | ScottK, JontheEchidna, Riddell: thoughts on bug 1077538 | 13:19 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1077538 in KdeSudo "Entered kdesudo apt-get -f install in Konsole. kubuntu 12.10" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1077538 | 13:19 |
| * apachelogger thinks his kcm has too many frames :@ | 13:44 | |
| apachelogger | should have done it in qml, JontheEchidna was right after all -.- | 13:44 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: ping | 14:28 |
| BluesKaj | Hi all | 15:14 |
| CQ | hello, I upgraded to quantal and can't log in, it jumps back to the login screen. Logging in on a console works fine, home is mounted... any ideas? | 15:43 |
| apachelogger | for support please use #kubuntu | 15:44 |
| CQ | Same thing happens with xfce and xubuntu-desktop and I"ve tried --reinstall'ing kdm and kubuntu-desktop | 15:44 |
| apachelogger | most likely something with your graphics driver is broken though, that behavior sounds like X is crashing | 15:44 |
| JontheEchidna | apachelogger: pong | 15:44 |
| CQ | apachelogger: nobody answers there so I figured I'd try here before filing a bug | 15:44 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: now I forgot it all :P | 15:45 |
| CQ | the X logs show nothing weird though, I've looked there | 15:45 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: wouldn't it be better for kubuntu-notification-helper to actually use qapt rather than using qapt-batch? | 15:45 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: also is there a way to track when qapt is doing stuff? | 15:45 |
| apachelogger | latter would be to prevent reboot notifications from popping up while stuff is still being installed | 15:46 |
| apachelogger | unless you have a better idea on how to achieve that | 15:46 |
| apachelogger | the update-notifier crap is somewhat underdocumented -.- | 15:46 |
| JontheEchidna | heh | 15:46 |
| JontheEchidna | So since k-n-h is a KDED module, it in theory should do as little as possible. That probably shouldn't include MMap-ing a 42 MiB cache file and spending 2-5 seconds (depending on how fast your computer is) building dependency caches | 15:48 |
| apachelogger | oh, that is a good point | 15:48 |
| JontheEchidna | delegating it to a detached process seems to be the proper way (tm) to do it | 15:49 |
| JontheEchidna | as for tracking | 15:49 |
| JontheEchidna | the best way would probably be to monitor the lock file in /var/lib/dpkg/ | 15:51 |
| JontheEchidna | since a process installing something will hold that lock until they are finished | 15:51 |
| JontheEchidna | perhaps k-n-h should try to (briefly) grab it when it wants to do reboot notify, and only notify when it can grab it and release it | 15:52 |
| apachelogger | that sounds only remoetly spooky :P | 15:52 |
| JontheEchidna | welcome to 1998 :P | 15:52 |
| JontheEchidna | the good thing about that method is that it will work with anything using apt/dpkg, not just custom signals the qaptworker could emit | 15:53 |
| JontheEchidna | & also reboot notify stuff should probably get moved to the muon-notifier KDED | 15:54 |
| apachelogger | so should hooks then :P | 15:54 |
| apachelogger | they are part of the same 'spec' | 15:54 |
| apachelogger | also they are both in ubuntu's update-notifier thing | 15:54 |
| JontheEchidna | yeah | 15:55 |
| JontheEchidna | that actually only leaves k-n-h as a plugin installation notify thingy | 15:55 |
| apachelogger | incidentially that makes me then wonder whether the knh should remain a kded | 15:55 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: apport too | 15:55 |
| JontheEchidna | oh yeah | 15:55 |
| apachelogger | although that one is broken beyond repair anyway | 15:55 |
| JontheEchidna | that silly thing | 15:55 |
| apachelogger | install could be a script though | 15:55 |
| apachelogger | as that is on-demand anyway | 15:56 |
| apachelogger | well script/tinyapp | 15:56 |
| JontheEchidna | in-GUI notifications (using KMessageWidget) would probably be better than popping up a tray icon/notification | 15:56 |
| apachelogger | obersavtion of the day | 15:56 |
| apachelogger | /var/lib/update-notifier/dpkg-run-stamp is not actually touched when dpkg runs :P | 15:56 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: hm... would require some serious meta widgeting going on | 15:57 |
| apachelogger | even then you either patch that into kdecore or have to also patch cmakelists | 15:58 |
| apachelogger | :S | 15:58 |
| JontheEchidna | you'd have to patch each of the apps that wanted notifications for installing stuff to have a KMessageWidget in their main gui | 15:58 |
| JontheEchidna | so actually that's a bit invasive... | 15:58 |
| apachelogger | ~ | 15:58 |
| apachelogger | ultimately it mostly amounts to KMW(visual parent) | 15:59 |
| apachelogger | most of the time visual parent is a layout, so you can hide most of the invasiveness | 15:59 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: http://paste.kde.org/603950/ | 16:07 |
| JontheEchidna | apachelogger: reboot on kde major version change? | 16:08 |
| apachelogger | any upstream version | 16:08 |
| JontheEchidna | ah, k | 16:08 |
| apachelogger | IIRC bug 553182 was primarily about konqueror going all ninja on the user because it could not load the file plugin anymore in a minor update | 16:09 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 553182 in kde4libs (Ubuntu) "kdelibs point updates should suggest reboot" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/553182 | 16:09 |
| apachelogger | minor/patch | 16:09 |
| apachelogger | (file plugin = file kio slave) | 16:09 |
| * apachelogger needs something to eat :O | 16:09 | |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: also I hope the muon notifier features better code | 16:10 |
| apachelogger | the module init code should have been refactored 3 times over | 16:10 |
| JontheEchidna | muon notifier is based on that Event class :P | 16:10 |
| apachelogger | line 8 of the patch being where it was made me go :'( | 16:10 |
| JontheEchidna | lol | 16:11 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: well,my architecture is fine :P | 16:11 |
| apachelogger | only the implementation is spooky | 16:11 |
| apachelogger | also after having dealt with overload problems in phonon I'd not overload the event base functions/slots themselfs anymore but provide stubs that can be overloaded | 16:14 |
| apachelogger | the event functions ought to then call the stub | 16:14 |
| apachelogger | thus forcing the event code always to be executed prevent people from forgetting super::func | 16:15 |
| apachelogger | always fun to look at old code ^^ | 16:15 |
| JontheEchidna | ^^ | 16:15 |
| apachelogger | notify->setPixmap(KIcon(icon).pixmap(NOTIFICATION_ICON_SIZE)); | 16:16 |
| apachelogger | knotification api is somewhat fail | 16:16 |
| apachelogger | oh now I forgot the lock file | 16:34 |
| apachelogger | meh | 16:34 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: did I mention that we then need to keep checking? | 16:34 |
| freinhard | hi! | 16:34 |
| apachelogger | ahoy freinhard | 16:35 |
| freinhard | can one interface muon over dbus to trigger package installations? | 16:35 |
| freinhard | (easily?) | 16:35 |
| apachelogger | depends on whether it is a local deb file or not I think | 16:36 |
| freinhard | background: i once started a patch for kde-telepathy to install additional packages, but that one was depending on packagekit which kubuntu doesn't use | 16:36 |
| freinhard | no local file, something from an existing repository | 16:37 |
| apachelogger | IMHO it would be better to create a plugin infrastructure | 16:37 |
| freinhard | were talking about packages like telepathy-gabble, telepathy-haze which are not part of kde-telepathy | 16:38 |
| apachelogger | well | 16:38 |
| apachelogger | freinhard: qapt-batch is your friend | 16:38 |
| freinhard | it's the same situation like with amarok: basic functionality is there but if you wan't to play mp3's install some more packages | 16:39 |
| apachelogger | I am still not sure this is a durable implemenation | 16:39 |
| freinhard | the one amarok uses? | 16:39 |
| apachelogger | nah, yours | 16:39 |
| apachelogger | then again I do not know the detaisl of your approach | 16:40 |
| apachelogger | but... | 16:40 |
| freinhard | at the moment there is none for kubuntu, i only did an proof of concept implementation for packagekit | 16:40 |
| apachelogger | phonon/gstreamer uses a distribution provided binary to install stuff, so it only calls gstreamer-codec-install with a well defined set of arguments and gstreamer-codec-install does all the distribution dependent work | 16:41 |
| freinhard | uah | 16:41 |
| freinhard | there should.. there needs to be a desktop standard | 16:42 |
| freinhard | thnks for the hint. i'll take a look at gstreamer-codec-install | 16:42 |
| apachelogger | freinhard: note that this is tricky to do on a global scale | 16:42 |
| apachelogger | foo in opensuse may be called bar in debian | 16:42 |
| freinhard | kate stays kate, kopete stays kopete. no need for a 100% solution if a simple one works for 99% | 16:43 |
| apachelogger | freinhard: systemsettings or system-settings? ;) | 16:44 |
| freinhard | packagers... ;) | 16:45 |
| apachelogger | just saying | 16:45 |
| freinhard | i know.. the other way would be to do it the microsoft way | 16:46 |
| freinhard | just install some kind of "standard" which, in that case, would be the package name for the distribution with the biggest userbase | 16:47 |
| freinhard | so if some auto-install doesn't work, people can start yelling at the packagers of some distribution ;) | 16:47 |
| freinhard | or you use some magic with cmake and let the packager override some default package names | 16:48 |
| apachelogger | well, the up and coming trend is to map desktop files to packages | 16:49 |
| apachelogger | which makes sense given that most of the time you'd want to either install a service/plugin or another app | 16:49 |
| apachelogger | so that is a good enough solution for the important use cases | 16:49 |
| apachelogger | (of course that also does not work for gstreamer as codecs don't have desktop files though one could argue they should ) | 16:50 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: update-notifier actually watches the apt cache, lib and dpkg lib dirs to detect activity Oo | 16:52 |
| apachelogger | really shitty | 16:52 |
| JontheEchidna | yup | 16:52 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: I take it if the reboot stuff were to move to muon it'd be easier to check whether stuff is doing stuff? | 16:53 |
| JontheEchidna | muon-notifier is really just k-n-h with a different set of Event subclasses | 16:53 |
| JontheEchidna | so not really | 16:54 |
| apachelogger | meh | 16:54 |
| apachelogger | ohohoh | 16:54 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: don't you need to be root to lock the lockfile? | 16:54 |
| JontheEchidna | yeah | 16:54 |
| apachelogger | no solution then | 16:55 |
| JontheEchidna | you could probably see if you could lock it with osstat? | 16:55 |
| apachelogger | unless we make a dbus helper :S | 16:55 |
| JontheEchidna | *os.stat | 16:55 |
| apachelogger | -rw-r----- 1 root root 0 Nov 11 17:25 /var/lib/dpkg/lock | 16:55 |
| apachelogger | you can't do anything with that file | 16:55 |
| JontheEchidna | aptdaemon has this fancy bit of pyth0rn to determine who holds the lock: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1351080/ | 16:57 |
| apachelogger | hrrrhrr | 16:58 |
| apachelogger | to the hacking lab | 16:59 |
| * apachelogger wonders if one can kdirwatch that file | 16:59 | |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: looks fancier than it is :P | 17:16 |
| ScottK | apachelogger: re 1040259: Apparently if you're in Unity using Quassel the messaging stuff no longer works. | 17:17 |
| apachelogger | nice | 17:17 |
| apachelogger | post mortem seems appropriate :P | 17:17 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: doesn't help though, as I cannot open the file | 17:18 |
| ScottK | apachelogger: re 1077538, I think it's quite ugly as is and if it wouldn't be hard to make it nicer, it should be. | 17:19 |
| apachelogger | bug 1077538 | 17:19 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 1077538 in KdeSudo "Entered kdesudo apt-get -f install in Konsole. kubuntu 12.10" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1077538 | 17:19 |
| apachelogger | ScottK: needs new strings though | 17:20 |
| * apachelogger notes that kdesudo probably should be refactored | 17:20 | |
| apachelogger | really silly code at parts | 17:20 |
| apachelogger | like right after that kFatal there it runs exit(1) rather than qapp->exit() | 17:20 |
| ScottK | Right, but even if there's an nice box with an untranslated string, that's still better than a traceback. | 17:21 |
| apachelogger | users who don't speak english will go :? eitherway ;) | 17:25 |
| apachelogger | anywho, I guess I am saying .. I have no idea how kdesudo's l10n process works | 17:25 |
| ScottK | WIth a nice error box you can copy and paste the text into google translate. | 17:25 |
| apachelogger | *at all* | 17:25 |
| * ScottK neither. | 17:25 | |
| apachelogger | also I have no clue why I have not moved it to kde | 17:25 |
| apachelogger | JontheEchidna: why did I not force kdesudo onto kde infrastructure? | 17:25 |
| apachelogger | also the lock file business is a dead end | 17:26 |
| apachelogger | one needs to be able to open the file to check if it has locks | 17:26 |
| apachelogger | so either we also start watching every directory and the world or you need to make some nice thing in qapt | 17:27 |
| apachelogger | because really I only care about UI driven updates not triggering the reboot notification ^^ | 17:27 |
| apachelogger | ScottK: you might want to review http://paste.kde.org/604016/ before I break raring | 17:27 |
| ScottK | Does postrm run on package upgrade? | 17:28 |
| apachelogger | yep | 17:29 |
| apachelogger | http://paste.kde.org/604022/ | 17:29 |
| apachelogger | from ppa2 to 3 that is | 17:29 |
| ScottK | OK. | 17:30 |
| ScottK | Next question: Since this is it's own trigger, can we have a different action to restart their session rather than a full reboot? Reboot isn't actually required. | 17:30 |
| apachelogger | we can, that again requires a new string though | 17:30 |
| apachelogger | also somewhat excessive additions to kubuntu-notification-helper | 17:31 |
| ScottK | Yes, but I think it's a good point of differentiation from the competition. One doesn't actually need to reboot. | 17:32 |
| apachelogger | primary issue is ... since we have no means to detect when a package manager is doing stuff we display the reboot notification when the trigger is touched, if we were to have a logout and a reboot we end up with both being displayed | 17:33 |
| ScottK | Also is a restart needed for point release changes, i.e. 4.9.2 -> 4.9.3 or is 4.8 -> 4.9 sufficient? | 17:34 |
| apachelogger | worst case kdelibs would get upgraded -> logout notification, dbus gets upgraded -> reboot notification | 17:34 |
| apachelogger | ScottK: all upstream changes | 17:34 |
| apachelogger | bug 553182 says so | 17:34 |
| ScottK | Right, so you'd have to make sure rebooting clears both the logout and reboot notifications. | 17:34 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 553182 in kde4libs (Ubuntu) "kdelibs point updates should suggest reboot" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/553182 | 17:34 |
| ScottK | OK. | 17:34 |
| apachelogger | and IIRC it was about kio slaves become incompatible due to internal changes or something | 17:35 |
| ScottK | I see. | 17:35 |
| ScottK | Do you trust the bug reporter? | 17:35 |
| apachelogger | not really | 17:35 |
| apachelogger | but it sounds sane enough :P | 17:35 |
| ScottK | OK. | 17:35 |
| apachelogger | also regarding notification clearing ... if I am not mistaken you cannot clear notifications | 17:36 |
| apachelogger | tray icon wise it would work though | 17:36 |
| apachelogger | still a bit of a silly experience | 17:36 |
| ScottK | The reboot notification goes away when you reboot. | 17:36 |
| ScottK | Doesn't matter if you clicked on it or not. | 17:36 |
| apachelogger | nah I mean replace logout with reboot notification | 17:36 |
| apachelogger | once it becomes apparent that we need a reboot rather than a logout | 17:36 |
| apachelogger | as I said the UI experience there will not be sensible until we have found a way to detect when apt is actually done with doing stuff | 17:37 |
| apachelogger | then the helper just needs to evaluate which triggers are there and dispathc the appropiate notifications | 17:37 |
| ScottK | Right. | 17:37 |
| apachelogger | that however entirely depends on JontheEchidna giving me dbus api :P | 17:38 |
| ScottK | I'm sure JontheEchidna can tell you how to do that. He's managed progress dialogues in Muon Updaters, so clearly he knows how to find 100%. | 17:38 |
| apachelogger | ^^ | 17:38 |
| * apachelogger thinks we need a monochrome plasma theme version of the reboot icon | 17:39 | |
| apachelogger | http://wstaw.org/m/2012/11/11/plasma-desktopym2523.png | 17:39 |
| apachelogger | le ugly | 17:39 |
| ScottK | No. I think the fact that's it's so visible is a feature. | 17:39 |
| apachelogger | can be achieved by more sensible means | 17:40 |
| ScottK | OK. | 17:40 |
| * ScottK will bbiab. | 17:40 | |
| ScottK | Or maybe right now. | 17:41 |
| apachelogger | lol | 17:42 |
| apachelogger | http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Tutorials/Plasma/ThemeDetails#.22icons.22_folder | 18:24 |
| apachelogger | it's plasma because it is not working | 18:24 |
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