[14:41] ok, so the point was (now for everyone to read): do we want a png-icon-theme by default [14:41] whats the difference with non png icon themes? [14:42] png is much faster [14:42] thats good [14:42] it increases performance visibly [14:42] more good [14:42] but there are two problems with it: [14:42] 1) it doesn't get scaled, so i have to draw lots of missing icon-sizes [14:42] 2) it's much larger in filesizes, ~2times the size [14:42] so it'd be ~55mb instead of 27mb [14:43] What is the speed difference. [14:43] I think strategy document wise, we stick with non-png [14:43] so that brings up the question whether we should go for a 1gb image instead of the CD image [14:43] because making 25 extra mb isn't all-too-realistic [14:43] we're not going for fast over usability, I can imagine all the "missing icons" bugs :\ [14:44] I do not think after the search for bites for the last release we can afford it [14:44] (nick was able toto see a visible speed increase even with an i5 or something very recent) [14:44] pleia2: well, no missing icons, they'd just be e.g. too large :} no, but i'm willing to work on that [14:44] Can we update ubottuto relay all them bug reports to ochosi [14:45] ochosi, oh... but space its a HUGE concern, unless we choose to go dvd and no cd size anymore [14:45] i mean, we drop languages for space, languages [14:45] I second that [14:45] GridCube: well yes, that's the point of the discussion [14:45] not only languages [14:45] ochosi: I use a lot of wrong size icons that scale nicely, I imagine a lot of people do and it would be a pretty obvious visual regression [14:45] SkippersBoss: all theme and icon-bugs already go to me [14:45] :-) [14:45] im sorry bug space its more important than speed on my book [14:45] pleia2: what do you mean? you _consciously_ use wrong-size icons? =) [14:46] ochosi: I just clicky clicky to find a nice icon to match what I put in my panel, I don't much pay attention to the size [14:46] i usually just get 256x256 icons and they scale nicely [14:47] pleia2: in the panel they'd be scaled i think. it's more about menus [14:47] pleia2: so it's less about app-icons than gtk-actions and gtk-stock in general [14:47] and I think it would be impossible to track down every use of every size of icon in whatever people are using for panels/docks/whatever additional thing they're adding to make xfce work they way they want it to [14:47] (plus it would increase the size even more) [14:48] the faenza-icon theme proves you wrong [14:48] (i mean faenza icon-theme :)) [14:49] it's definitely not impossible [14:49] ok [14:50] but i'm not willing to even start working on this unless we have a clear decision, that's why i thought i'd bring it up (again) [14:50] partly also because NSchermer wrote a script to convert the theme to png [14:50] if its more space consuming, no. [14:50] which means we can maintain it as svg and ship it as png [14:51] GridCube: you're worrying about 25mb of free space? [14:51] the thing is, we decided that we should fit a CD for Q, meaning we should try to do that for the next LTS too [14:51] ochosi, not if the next release will be on DVD [14:52] ochosi, the problem is, im sure there are going to be lots of other space consuming things, if there are, every bit counts [14:52] it is of course open for discussion, but we already have done one release with the CD-target [14:52] we might be able to drop python2 from R [14:52] euh ?? hmm [14:52] id prefer less speed, for more options on the install cd, namely langs [14:53] the point is that xubuntu will be always slow, not just on the install-cd [14:53] depends on the speed difference [14:53] the options you're talking about only affect the one-time process of installing [14:53] Knome has a point in does R need to be released on CD [14:53] (juist saying) [14:54] ochosi, i do understand that. Can't it be made a -png package that you can install to replace -svg icons? like "for reasons of space we ship this svg icons that make the system slower, if you want fastiness, try xubuntu-icons-png" [14:55] that sounds like something i wouldn't want to do [14:56] +1 [14:57] k, g2g now, prolly bbl [18:49] oh how far we have come. http://chrishaney.com/?linux&release=Xubuntu%206.10 [18:51] heh [18:51] oh nice, knome already made the switch to 12.10 on our website [18:51] <3 [18:52] haha, sure [18:52] http://www.everydaylinuxuser.com/2012/11/xubuntu-1210-day-1-first-impressions.html [18:52] feel free to add to the press page [18:52] and as always http://news.softpedia.com/news/Xubuntu-12-10-Has-Been-Officially-Released-Screenshot-Tour-300260.shtml [18:53] :) [18:53] * pleia2 gets to adding [18:53] thanks [18:53] getting new screenshots is also on my todo list [18:53] I'll try to get to it today [18:54] * astraljava didn't have the privilege of using Xubuntu back in the Edgy times, yet. [18:54] Didn't look _too_ bad. [18:54] pleia2, cheers! [18:54] knome: also will review the mailing list settings [18:54] woohoo