/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/11/13/#kubuntu-devel.txt

ScottKIs kdevelop 4.3.90 -> 4.4.1 something that'd be manageable with an SRU?02:26
shadeslayerIt should02:26
shadeslayerI already have it filed02:26
shadeslayerwas going to get to it tomorrow02:26
shadeslayeralready uploaded it to raring02:27
ScottKOK.02:27
ScottKAny more word on Dantti?02:40
shadeslayerlast I heard his wife was flying out02:42
ScottKOK.  Thanks.02:58
* shadeslayer found a silly bug04:00
shadeslayerthe wallpapers in the wallpaper ui chooser are sorted by the dir names instead of the name provided by the desktop file04:01
shadeslayerhooray for silly code04:01
jussiMorning all07:52
Tm_Tmorning07:56
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apacheloggerJontheEchidna: please be filing a removal request or something for the old gtk kcm09:50
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BluesKajhowdy all10:16
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: http://paste.kde.org/605492/ yay or nay?10:56
apacheloggerah nvm, that is not new anyway10:58
apacheloggerstill spook yIMHO10:58
apacheloggerhm11:22
apacheloggerJontheEchidna: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~cyberspace/muon/1.4/revision/1522  vs. http://quickgit.kde.org/?p=phonon-vlc.git&a=blobdiff&h=49de65a603128cdcb2281d60f6235ef8fc61bcf7&hp=0f31b4d7141e54c367036feedab6d83bdbe4a1d2&hb=3f87eafda1efc9a3eba6c7d92263a93673b67dad&f=CMakeLists.txt11:23
apacheloggerwhat I am saying is: please define your version via cmake in your top level cmakelists or I'll start crying11:23
yofel_wth...? bug 106374111:33
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1063741 in Kubuntu PPA "gwenview crash due to libkipi incompatibility" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/106374111:33
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yofelis it just me or is kde library handling broken by design?11:34
apacheloggerno11:34
apacheloggerdigikam library handlign is broken by design11:34
apacheloggeryofel: if you want some entertainment mention digikam to sune11:34
yofelwell, I remember similiar stuff with marble a while back...11:34
apacheloggerhe goes :@ 90% of the time followed by a brief :( followed by more :@11:34
yofellol11:35
apacheloggeryofel: well, they are all doing it wrong :P11:35
yofelwell, I know the digikam packaging, so... :@11:35
apacheloggerno clue what marble's problem was, but with kipi it's basically that they keep breaking BIC while not addressing that in the plugin part11:36
yofel. . .11:36
yofelguess I'll put a rebuild of digikam into backports, should "fix" this11:37
apacheloggerthat's what we do traditionally11:37
yofelyeah -.-11:37
apacheloggeractually that crash is weird11:38
apacheloggerhow do you get that11:38
apacheloggeroh11:38
apacheloggerif ye don't bump your so you don't get no error11:38
apacheloggerharrr11:38
apacheloggersee11:38
apacheloggerthey are using it wrong11:38
apacheloggernext year at akademy: Phonon: how to not make puppies die from BIC changes and how to use qplugn properly11:39
yofelwell, libkipi does usually bump the so, as this is about a libkipi8 <-> libkipi9 conflict11:40
yofel*unless* digikam ignores that, which would't really surprise me11:40
yofel+n11:41
apacheloggerlatter is actually fun because if you can run into a scenario where you definitely want to load a plugin buitl against foo1 into an app using foo2 you have to know how qinterfaces *actually* work11:41
apacheloggerand interestingly enough phonon in theory supports loading new plugins into old libraries although until I took over plugins were distributed alongside libphonon so you could not even get to a point where you'd have an old libphonon and a new plugin ^^11:42
apacheloggeryofel: there is no conflict11:42
yofelthen how would it crash?11:42
apacheloggerwell, there would be a conflict if you try loading both at the same time11:43
apacheloggerwhich could happen if they are using it wrong :P11:43
yofellooks like that happens.11:43
apacheloggerbroken by design11:44
apacheloggerI imagine it goes like this11:44
apacheloggerlibkipi9 -> loads plugins -> plugins load libkipi811:44
apacheloggerhow do you prevent that ... plugins mark the soname they were built against11:45
apacheloggerlibkipi9 -> can only load plugins built against libkipi9 -> plugins need not laod libkipi9 (already in address space)11:45
apacheloggerin the simplest of implementations the plugin desktop file would have X-KDE-BC=911:46
yofel... meaning you would still end up with having to rebuild everything?11:46
apacheloggeryofel: you always do, that is why good libaries need not break their BC all the time11:46
apacheloggerBUT11:46
apacheloggeryour app would not crash11:46
yofeltrue11:47
apacheloggerit would perhaps not have an plugins to load11:47
apacheloggerbut it would not fucking crash11:47
apacheloggerq.e.d they are using it wrong :P11:47
apacheloggernow imagine digikam where to static link libkipi and runtime load plugins from the sytem :D :D :D11:48
* apachelogger sees that totally happen in the future :P11:48
yofelapachelogger: please stop, I would like to keep the bit of sanity I have left11:48
yofeland explain that to gilles.....11:48
yofelkde bug 308019 if you ever feel like ranting11:50
ubottuKDE bug 308019 in BatchProcessImages "Gwenview crash after using Plugins->Collections->Border images" [Crash,Resolved: waitingforinfo] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30801911:50
apacheloggeryeah at next years akademy in my keynote about not messing up that library crap ^^11:50
yofel:D11:50
yofelseems like I should be rebuilding kamoso and kphotoalbum too while at it11:51
apacheloggerScottK, Riddell: council approval still pending for specs right?11:58
Quintasan_Riddell: Did you happen to post our Kubuntu Team photo somewhere? I'd like to include it in my blog post if I ever get to it12:01
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yofelQuintasan: https://www.flickr.com/photos/jriddell/816937749312:02
Quintasanyofel: thanks12:02
* Quintasan goes back home to learn algebra12:02
Quintasantest tomorrow :l12:02
Quintasanhurrr too much stuff pilling up12:04
Quintasangotta take care of it fast or it will kill me12:04
Riddellapachelogger: yes I want to tidy up the work items and organise a meeting todady12:05
apacheloggergoody, I have meeting topics too ^^12:05
QuintasanRiddell: as in meeting today or just setting up a poll?12:08
apacheloggerQuintasan: today ofc12:08
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RiddellQuintasan: setting up a poll12:16
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ScottKapachelogger: Yes.  We need a meeting yet.13:36
apacheloggerScottK: transitional packages for settings yay or nay?14:21
apacheloggeroh lol, 12.04 is supported until 17.04 so the transitionals would not be removalable until 17.10 ^^14:25
debfxquestion is if LTS -> LTS+2 upgrades will be supported (which I doubt)14:30
debfx12.04 -> 17.04 will certainly not be supported14:31
apacheloggeru sure about htat?14:31
apacheloggerperhaps it is just me but it would sorta defeat the purpose if in 2017 I then have to upgrade to 15. to get to 17.14:32
debfxyes, unless the LTS schedule changes14:33
apacheloggerdebfx: what does this have to do with the schedule itself?14:34
debfxit seems unlikely that you stick with an LTS for 5 years and then want to upgrade to the latest non-LTS release14:34
apachelogger17.05 would be LTS14:34
apachelogger17.0414:34
apacheloggeror am I getting it wrong14:34
apacheloggerwhat year do we ahve?14:34
apacheloggerOo14:34
* Quintasan needs his burndown chart14:34
debfx16.04 would be an LTS14:35
apachelogger12.04 -> 14.04 -> 16.0414:35
apacheloggerah yes14:35
QuintasanWhat debfx said14:35
apacheloggerdebfx: so we have 16.10 as removal point for transitional packages...14:35
debfxor 14.10 if LTS -> LTS+2 won't be supported (atm they aren't)14:36
apacheloggeractually I fail to find documentation on that in general14:39
apacheloggerseems we just happen to be nice enough to allow an LTS2LTS upgrade path14:39
yofelwe do support LTS upgrades (at least I try to), but I'm not keen  on supporting LTS -> LTS+214:41
yofelthat'll probably too many system architecture changes to support 14:42
apacheloggermy point is there is no official documentation saying we/ubuntu does that14:42
yofelinsert be somewhere14:42
apacheloggeror maybe I can't find it14:42
yofeluh... update-manager defaults to LTS upgrades if you run a LTS release?14:43
yofelwhy would it do that if that weren't supported14:43
apacheloggerdunno14:43
apacheloggerthere still is no statement14:43
Riddellit's always been the case that release to release+1 and LTS to LTS+1 upgrades are supported and nothing else14:44
apacheloggerthere still is no statement14:46
apachelogger"Upgrades to new versions of Ubuntu are and always will be free of charge." what it says on the LTS wiki page about upgrades14:46
apacheloggerRiddell, ScottK: the mighty release team probably should issue a statement to clearify 14:47
apacheloggeralso documentation should then be updated accordingly14:47
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yofelScottK: we should probably hold of 4.9.3 for quantal until kde bug 309787 gets looked into15:13
ubottuKDE bug 309787 in general "Krunner does not execute program when press ENTER" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30978715:13
shadeslayeraye, I have hit that as well15:14
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apacheloggeroh15:16
apacheloggerworks here Oo15:17
tsimpsonI've seen it "sometimes"15:17
yofeltype 'konso' for konsole15:17
tsimpsonmost of the times it works, sometimes not15:17
apacheloggeryeah15:17
apacheloggernever seen it not work15:17
yofelyeah, it's a bit random here too15:17
apacheloggerthough I really mostly launch apps via a terminal15:17
shadeslayerdunno, doesn't work for me15:17
apacheloggerbad experiences with krunner made me not want to use it15:17
shadeslayerheh15:18
yofelactually15:18
apacheloggerordering is all off if you ask me15:18
apacheloggerhalf the time I got some other crap listed 15:18
yofelI can open something *once* with a keyword15:18
apacheloggerkeyword?15:19
yofeltyping 'kons' opens, konsole, but doesn't work a second time15:19
yofel-,15:19
apacheloggercan do it as often as I want15:19
apacheloggerhaha :P15:19
yofelgrrrr15:19
apacheloggeryofel: gdb trace that I'd say15:19
tsimpsonI think it's a focusing issue, I type "kons" and Konsole shows up, but I can't interact with the menu via the keyboard. but, if I press Up then Down the text box looses focus and the menu gains it15:20
yofelhm, no time for that now, but I would sure like to know why my xsession-errors is full of 15:21
yofel(Parent is Solid::Backends::UDisks::UDisksDevice(0x21dd0c0), parent's thread is QThread(0x1c09260), current thread is ThreadWeaver::Thread(0x1c30ec0)15:21
yofelQObject: Cannot create children for a parent that is in a different thread.15:21
kubotu::qt-bugs:: [1077965] qt4 applications over X forward run slower than with Ubuntu 10.04 LTS @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1077965 (by Stefan Pielmeier)15:21
apacheloggerbecause that is a qdebug15:21
* apachelogger wants award for most correct but useless answer of the day15:22
apacheloggeryofel: don't see that either *shrug*15:23
yofelhm, no wonder christoph blames aseigo with a commit like this: http://paste.kde.org/60569615:23
tsimpson-pedantic mode enabled15:23
tsimpsonit's actually a qWarning()15:23
yofelah, nvm then I guess15:23
apacheloggerstill bogus code15:28
apacheloggerwe should totally force QT_FATAL_WARNINGS while in development15:29
apacheloggerannoy upstream into fixing their codez15:29
yofelwe should also be building tests. Quintasan: any progress on that side? (or I guess not yet had any time to look at it?)15:32
shadeslayeryofel: is the janitor online?15:33
yofeldidn't hear anything yet, you would have to ask czajkowski or wgrant15:33
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Quintasanyofel: What tests?15:34
apacheloggerbuilt from 4.9 branch still not broken15:35
apachelogger....15:35
Quintasanyofel: Tests for Qt or kdelibs or what?15:35
QuintasanI don't think we can get anything to build in neon ppa15:35
QuintasanxD15:35
Quintasanwow15:36
Quintasanyofel, shadeslayer: 55k builds15:37
Quintasanand only 4,6k failuers15:37
Quintasanapachelogger: 67.2 GiB (100.00%) of 32.0 GiB15:37
Quintasansup15:37
shadeslayerxD15:37
apacheloggerlaunchpad15:37
apacheloggerthat's what's up15:37
yofelQuintasan: any tests (though I meant kde)15:38
QuintasanThis makes me giggle everytime I see it15:38
yofelQuintasan: and as the recipes still build who cares :P15:38
Quintasanyofel: not today, preparing for test15:38
yofelsure, was just curious15:38
Quintasanwill look at maliit tomorrow and kdelibs later on15:38
Quintasanmaliit is my priority list now15:38
apacheloggeryofel: time to ask for more spaces15:38
Quintasanapachelogger: Guess what I did at UDS15:38
apacheloggereither they run out of spaces or fix it15:39
apacheloggerformer would be more fun TBH15:39
Quintasanapachelogger: I asked Laura if she could increase the size to 16GB, instead she gave us ADDITIONAL 16GB15:39
QuintasanGuess being vague about that was a good thing15:39
apacheloggerQuintasan: unused U1 resources need to go somewhere :P15:40
QuintasanWell, we are using that space pretty freely15:40
Quintasanmore than 200% of the size allocated15:41
Quintasan:P15:41
QuintasanA total of 59927 builds have been dispatched for this PPA.15:41
Quintasanalmost 60k build15:41
apacheloggerwhich is why you should request more spaces15:41
apachelogger:P15:41
yofelI should request more space for the scribus ppa15:42
yofelthat uses 16GiB of 2GiB :D15:42
Quintasanapachelogger: Go ahead and try doing that15:42
QuintasanI so DON'T want to see their reaction to "Hey guys, we'd like some more space for Project Neon PPA"15:43
yofel:D15:43
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apacheloggerQuintasan: move to OBS then15:47
apacheloggeras I see it software is broken and until software is fixed we needs moar spaces to keep production rolling15:47
xnoxapachelogger: OBS does not have universe and debian main is "filtered" as well.15:47
xnoxplus they install build-deps - one package at a time which kills dpkg......15:48
shadeslayer@_@15:48
* apachelogger actually has fixes for latter15:48
apacheloggerfixes/rewrite15:48
Quintasanapachelogger: Fancy rewriting everything for OBS?15:48
apacheloggerrewrote15:48
apacheloggerI am not copyright holder though so those changes will rot somewhere I am afraid15:49
Quintasanapachelogger: I mean neon recipes15:49
apacheloggerQuintasan: oh, hardly an effort with OBS15:50
yofelthat shouldn't be much work, I mean all you need is a cronjob to push the packages, and a bzr-builder replacement to create them15:51
shadeslayerwe have a good thing going with LP15:51
shadeslayerwhy screw everything15:51
apacheloggerbecause Quintasan refuses to ask for more spaces :P15:51
yofelOBS doesn't support the dev release though, so I'm not too keen on using it15:51
shadeslayerdo we even need more space?15:52
yofelapachelogger: should be fixed soon anyway once lp is fixed15:52
shadeslayerwe have like 30 GB's of it15:52
apacheloggeryofel: s/support/import15:52
apacheloggerit's not a matter of support it is a matter of import ;)15:52
QuintasanI don't care about OBS15:52
QuintasanHopefully once lp is fixed we will be having a surplus of space15:53
yofel32GiB is plenty, if the janitor would be running15:53
QuintasanMEANING for builds15:53
apacheloggeryou can give some back then ^^15:53
Quintasan>apachelogger15:53
yofeland it's not like anything is actually FAILING15:53
Quintasan>implying I'm going to give space back15:53
QuintasanNo way that's going to happen15:53
QuintasanI'm going to use it15:53
yofelyeah, extragear and playground have lots of stuff in it ^^15:54
apacheloggernext on project neon prn_1_all.deb15:54
Quintasan+115:54
apacheloggeroh, that's what you meant15:54
yofelcome to think of it, someone add muon to neon15:54
apacheloggerworks too I guess15:54
apacheloggerthough playground is a much more headache build source15:54
apachelogger*headachy15:54
yofel*shrug*15:54
* apachelogger hungy :(15:54
QuintasanWho'd be insane enough to stuff prn in deb package?15:55
yofelif we already can't have qt5 builds we'll go with playround15:55
yofelQuintasan: why are you asking a rhetoric question?15:55
apacheloggerxnox: does one still have to sign canonical's CA to commit to ubiquity?15:55
Quintasanyofel: It's not like we are both hiting at the same person, are we?15:55
Quintasanhinting*15:55
apacheloggerwell15:56
apacheloggeras I pointed out earlier on g+, I could totally build a deb with prn without much effort15:56
QuintasanOf course it is doable15:56
QuintasanThe question is, why would you do that15:56
apacheloggereasy to install15:56
QuintasanDepends: mplayer?15:57
apacheloggerewww15:57
xnoxapachelogger: yes, as per http://www.canonical.com/contributors . And well "sign" is actually a web-form and push-button.15:57
apacheloggervlc ftw15:57
Quintasan>vlc15:57
QuintasanNo thanks15:57
QuintasanOnly once you fix mkv15:57
Quintasanactually15:57
Quintasans/mplayer/mplayer215:57
apacheloggermkv is working15:58
xnoxapachelogger: you know, such that when installer installs crap by accident, you are not liable for it at all. canonical is.15:58
apacheloggerperhaps the ubuntu build is broken again :P15:58
Quintasanapachelogger: 10bit encodes?15:58
apacheloggerpeople always come into #videolan complaining about the broken ubuntu build ^^15:58
apacheloggerQuintasan: *shrug*15:58
apacheloggerxnox: oh, never looked at it that way ^^15:58
* Quintasan thinks apachelogger should do something about that if he likes vlc so much15:58
xnoxapachelogger: it's _the_ only reason why it's there. such that individual developers are never sued in court.15:59
xnoxapachelogger: and if you run ubuntu and don't want to be sued, you buy ubuntu advantage, which gives/covers you from legal litigations. which is a service "around ubuntu".16:00
yofelxnox: why would you be sued for running ubuntu?16:02
xnoxyofel: i wouldn't know. but if somebody thinks they can be sued, they can buy protection.16:03
xnoxyofel: who knows what other people do...16:04
yofeltrue16:04
xnoxyofel: I mean look at current lawsuits: apple vs android companies, it seems they sue each other with & without reason...16:05
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apacheloggerhttp://paste.kde.org/605774/16:07
apacheloggerI am not sure it improved16:08
Quintasanshadeslayer: gibe bsns cards designs pls16:08
yofelyou guys have card designs?16:09
apacheloggerif one were to run fancy world changes algorithm ideas over the kubuntu-devel list canonical would be free to use them in what ever way they want16:09
xnoxapachelogger: it means patches on the mailing lists....16:10
yofelgeh, sofware-properties falls under the CA as well :/16:10
xnoxapachelogger: and kubuntu-devel mailing lists are not part of the contributor projects.16:11
xnoxapachelogger: so wtf dude =)16:11
apacheloggerxnox: it says any work of authorship and it says submitted by any form to canonical or someone acting on behalf of canonical16:11
apacheloggerany work of authorship includes a mail in which I explain an algorithm solving some NP stuff, and I am reasonable certain kubuntu-devel is run by someone acting on behalf ov canonical16:12
xnoxapachelogger: please read the definition of "Material" and specifically that "submissions" are to the purpose of importing "material"16:13
yofelwell, as I understand it "on behalf of canonical" could just be someone reading the ML as well16:13
xnoxs/importing/improving/16:13
kubotuxnox meant: "apachelogger: please read the definition of "Material" and specifically that "submissions" are to the purpose of improving "material""16:13
xnoxand the agreement covers the software projects only as listed on the contributors page....16:14
apacheloggerwhere does it say that?16:15
apacheloggeri.e. I know that it used to say that, I cannot find it in the present version16:15
xnoxread carefully and the full thing, and please do not post snippets without full context and spread fud.16:16
apacheloggerxnox: it does not say this is limited to the contributors page16:20
xnoxapachelogger: preable of the pdf second paragraph, last sentence + http://www.canonical.com/contributors list of projects that are covered by the contirbutor agreement.16:21
xnoxit's a many projects -> to one agreement text, but you establish it for individual "material" or multiples of thereof.16:21
xnoxkubuntu, nor kubuntu-devel is not included.16:22
xnoxs/is/are/16:22
kubotuxnox meant: "kubuntu, nor kubuntu-devel are not included."16:22
* xnox is not a lawyer and not giving any advice.16:22
apachelogger"The Agreement may cover more than one software project managed by Us."16:23
apacheloggerxnox: yes, it does not outline which those are and what point of time16:23
apacheloggeroh my , language broken, I think I need something to eat16:24
apachelogger*and at what point in time16:25
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TygartI am on 13.04... Where would I submit a bug or if it has already been submitted? 20:17
TygartIn (Application>Help) 20:17
TygartKinfoCenter> Glossary> Alphabetically, it is not in Alphabetical order? 20:17
RiddellTygart: sounds like upstream go to bugs.kde.org20:17
TygartUpstream? 20:18
TygartI will go there. Thanks? 20:18
Riddellupstream means the original authors, we're the packagers and integrators20:21
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TygartRiddell: Ok I see. So you don't you also do any editing to the code? 20:38
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RiddellTygart: as little as possible21:11
ScottKyofel: OK.  Thanks.21:34
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ScottKapachelogger: It's a wiki page.  Please go ahead and fix.21:34
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shadeslayerScottK: I'll be uploading KDevelop to quantal-proposed in a couple of minutes, please accept21:47
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Riddellshadeslayer: what's the SRU bug?21:55
shadeslayerbug 106761121:55
ubottuLaunchpad bug 1067611 in kdevelop (Ubuntu Quantal) "[SRU] Meta bug for tracking KDevelop SRU" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/106761121:55
RiddellOK: kdevplatform21:59
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shadeslayerRiddell: all done :)22:01
Riddell kdevelop-php-docs too?22:02
shadeslayeryah22:02
RiddellI'll go and brush my teeth while I wait for launchpad to make the diffs22:02
shadeslayerheh okay :D22:03
Riddellaccepted22:09
shadeslayer\o/22:09
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shadeslayerRiddell: could you also sponsor yakuake? I don't think I have upload rights for that23:16
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kubotu::workspace-bugs:: [1061073] Desktop effects are slow and desktop corruption using mesa 9 @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1061073 (by Stefan Freyr)23:33
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