[06:37] <smartboyhw> xnox, you here? I want some bit of help...
[07:49] <smartboyhw> xnox, forget about the help now
[14:24] <smartboyhw> cjwatson, er can you approve the Ubuntu Studio -> Wubi code merge?
[14:31] <cjwatson> smartboyhw: done, and bumped everything to 13.04 since I don't think it makes sense to build more versions for quantal at this point
[14:31] <smartboyhw> cjwatson, thank you:D
[14:31] <cjwatson> ev: could you build wubi r275 for raring, please?
[14:49] <ev> cjwatson: will do now
[14:49] <cjwatson> ta
[15:08] <ev> cjwatson: done
[15:09]  * ogra_ still waits for the first wishlist bug for wubi on win RT :)
[15:12] <cjwatson> ogra_: which reminds me, I was wondering how totally insane it would be to use something wubi-esque as a way to dual-boot android and ubuntu on the nexus7
[15:12] <cjwatson> conditional on having the grub port working of course
[15:13] <cjwatson> it almost makes more sense on a constrained device than on a full desktop/laptop system, in some ways - fewer worries about upgrade / disk growth / etc.
[15:13] <ogra_> heh, well, might be possible though there are easier ways for dual boot (just flash the bootimg to the recovery partition) that simply the userspace (flash-kernel) doesnt cover
[15:13] <ogra_> doesnt lupin use a readonly squashfs ?
[15:14]  * ogra_ has never looked deeply into wubi
[15:14] <cjwatson> no, it's an ordinary filesystem
[15:14] <cjwatson> the weirdness is that it's all loop-mounted on a single file in the containing fs
[15:14] <cjwatson> and the boot loader and initramfs conspire to make that as invisible as possible
[15:15] <ogra_> needing overlayfs ?
[15:15] <cjwatson> no
[15:15] <cjwatson> it's just ext4
[15:15] <cjwatson> the inner filesystem doesn't actually matter
[15:15] <ogra_> ah, great, since thats usually missing in the kernels on these devices
[15:15] <cjwatson> it does need a smart boot loader, and it needs the loop module, but aside from that the required kernel support is not desperately advanced
[15:16]  * ogra_ will take a look, is grub an actual requirement ? 
[15:16] <cjwatson> realistically yes
[15:16] <ogra_> hmm
[15:16] <cjwatson> but the grub arm port was coming along quite well last I looked
[15:16] <cjwatson> (need to find time to go back and supply more review feedback)
[15:16] <ogra_> well, you will likely need to chainload it somehow, else it would need very close HW support
[15:17] <cjwatson> it's grub on top of uboot
[15:17] <cjwatson> the linaro guys are doing it
[15:17] <ogra_> hmm, so the question is if it also works on fastboot
[15:17] <cjwatson> so it only needs a relatively small amount of hardware-specific gubbins
[15:17] <cjwatson> that I don't know
[15:17] <ogra_> i would guess so, but needs to be verified
[15:17] <cjwatson> you can sort of do it without grub if you're prepared to tolerate copying the kernel and initrd out of /boot to somewhere the loader can read it - but for dual-boot support you still want a menu anyway
[15:18] <ogra_> which then gets hairy on something like the nexus7
[15:18] <cjwatson> and the userspace support for wubi without grub2 has almost certainly atrophied
[15:18] <cjwatson> (grub legacy wasn't smart enough to do the loop-mount dance)
[15:18] <ogra_> we would need sme HW key support for the vol up/down keys
[15:18] <cjwatson> you'd need a touch driver or hw key support, yes
[15:18] <cjwatson> how do they present?
[15:18] <ogra_> and some trick to generate an "enter" as well
[15:19] <ogra_> just /dev/input
[15:19] <cjwatson> I mean to the kernel
[15:19] <cjwatson> just gpio pins or something?
[15:19] <ogra_> hmm, i would have to check, but likely
[15:19] <cjwatson> probably wouldn't be that hard to write a really stupid grub input driver for them if it came to it
[15:20] <ogra_> yeah, just saying, menus arent easy on tablets in console mode :)
[15:21] <ogra_> the annoying thing about switching image models is sadly that flash-kernel is still living off a hardcoded DB without even the capability to override, so it currently can only support one type of booting per device
[15:24] <ogra_> though i guess when we use grub we can completely skip flash-kernel and rely on having the right stuff in /boot
[15:27] <cjwatson> sadly it just moves the goalposts
[15:27] <cjwatson> yes, you don't need to tell uboot where to find the kernel/initramfs
[15:27] <cjwatson> but you do still need to tell it where to find grub
[15:27] <cjwatson> which is an equivalent problem and you'd almost certainly end up using nearly all of the same code
[15:30] <ogra_> well, i wont change the fastboot/u-boot config after install and grub is unlikely to move around, so that part is fine
[15:31] <ogra_> the only thing a user might touch is the cmdline and thats living in grub-land
[15:34] <cjwatson> it won't move around, but the installer still needs to know how to put it in place
[15:34] <cjwatson> and afaics that's still going to involve something that looks startlingly like flash-kernel
[15:41] <ogra_> heh, yes, well, it could just use flash-kernel (or some of its functions)
[15:42] <ogra_> that missing override functionality is definitely a bug i want to fix before release, but its more whishlist than task