[00:27] <G> ajmitch: I gave up on that when I saw Chorus' ADSL cabinet planning
[00:28] <G> "Yeah, lets do suburb X and Y now, and come back in two years time and do the two major exchanges in between then"
[00:31] <ajmitch> G: it was just amusing putting in my friend's address & seeing them right in the middle of a blank area for UFB
[00:35] <G> the problem (imo) with UFB/RBI is the misinformation, Orcon insist I'll be able to get Fibre 'sometime not too far away' yet I'm outside the UFB zone, and the fibre running down the road won't be upgraded for RBI
[00:35] <ibeardslee> "UFB deployment dates for your area are still being developed"
[00:35] <ibeardslee> sigh
[00:35] <ibeardslee> mind you, I do have TelstraClear cable
[00:36] <ajmitch> G: yeah I've had the advertising from snap saying that UFB is available, but it's not yet
[00:37] <G> exactly, only upgrade I know for certain I'm getting is a RBI Cabinet in ~14-15 months
[00:38] <G> Joe Bloggs down the street would see the Orcon thing and go "Oh neato, this is great" with massive disappointment down the line
[00:38] <ajmitch> I know that UFB will be available on my street at some point in the coming months
[00:39] <ajmitch> undecided whether it's worth me going for it or not
[00:39] <G> ajmitch: actually your example is worse, because someone could see that and put it in a Real Estate listing not realising it's not true yet, and effectively lie (without realising it)
[00:56] <ojwb> something untrue is a real estate listing?
[01:07] <hads> ajmitch: For me UFB is cheaper than a phone line and DSL connection
[01:12] <ajmitch> hads: it might be for me, I'm on a 12-month lease at the place I'm living so it might depend on whether UFB is available before the lease needs renewed
[01:15] <hads> Phoneline ($50) & Telecom 60GB ADSL ($115) so $165 total compared to 100GB UFB at $110
[01:17] <ibeardslee> hads: is a voip account extra on top of that?
[01:17] <ajmitch> phone & 125GB cap on DSL for $95 for me with snap
[01:18] <hads> 30/10 UFB with Snap is $75/month
[01:18] <ajmitch> hads: who are you going with for UFB provider?
[01:18] <hads> Snap, only real option at the moment.
[01:18] <hads> ibeardslee: There's VoIP included in that.
[01:18] <ajmitch> yeah, I thought there might be a few more options by now, but I guess it's still early days
[01:19] <hads> I'd be interested to see what Telecom offer, they seem to be the ones with International bandwidth
[01:19] <hads> I'm not confident that Snap are going to be any good in that respect.
[01:20] <ajmitch> they always say that they've got enough & that they don't saturate the links, but I see a few people complaining about bad international speeds
[01:20] <hads> Yeah, I was one of them in 2009 before I switched to Telecom
[01:20]  * ajmitch doesn't download enough when watching the speed
[01:21] <hads> I transfer media over to the US and AU for people and notice it quite a lot.
[01:21] <hads> Being able to hit line speed with Telecom DSL is nice e.g. 1.8MB/s down from Linode
[01:23] <ajmitch> yes, that is nice
[01:36] <G> hads: $115 in total for Telecom? Wowah, ~$100 for ~150GB iirc atm
[01:36] <G> errr 165
[01:41] <hads> G: Telecom "Business" DSL
[01:48] <G> hads: ahh right of course
[02:02] <lifeless> oh good ISP discussion
[02:03] <lifeless> hads: Telecom lets you hit line speed?
[02:03] <lifeless> hads: I've *never* gotten line rate out of Telecom beyond noddy speed tests, and *never* during peak period.
[02:03] <lifeless> AFAICT their backbone to Rangiora is saturated, but try getting them to own up to it.
[02:10] <chilts> does a "Business" plan actually mean anything more than higher prices?
[02:10] <chilts> I've never been sure
[02:12] <G> chilts: iirc it goes through a different internal network at Telecom once it crosses their border
[02:23] <hads> lifeless: Yup, that 1.8MB/s is rsync+SSH so no weird results from HTTP speedtests.
[02:24] <hads> chilts: You get to call people in NZ when something goes wrong.
[02:25] <chilts> I guess it's the support that's different
[02:25] <chilts> ah, I see, different network too
[02:25] <chilts> maybe more reliable :)
[02:26] <hads> I don't recall any downtime in the last 2.5 years actually. Not sure if their residential has had any.
[02:27] <hads> https://twitter.com/nicegear/status/272888056141471744/photo/1
[02:28] <hads> https://twitter.com/nicegear/status/272889319256100864/photo/1
[02:28] <ajmitch> hads: let's hope you don't have too many horror stories with snap & UFB
[02:28] <hads> Fingers crossed. I'm keeping one of the two DSL lines for the moment :)
[02:29] <lifeless> hads: what city are you in ?
[02:29] <hads> Timaru
[02:29] <lifeless> interesting
[02:29] <hads> s/city/town/
[02:29] <lifeless> hads: Timary is a city, surely
[02:29] <hads> Not quite, ~27k or so.
[02:31] <G> To be fair to Telecom, all the issues I've had w/ ADSL lately have been physical line issues (and you can't really blame them today for the silly decisions made 10-20 years back)
[02:32] <chilts> too unclear here as to whether you are a town or a city. In Blighty you are a city if you have a catherdral, else you're a town (or less)
[02:32] <chilts> of course, this was the original rules - that has now changed
[02:32] <chilts> I believe Milton Keynes is now considered a city
[02:33] <chilts> or maybe not "Milton Keynes competed for formal city status in the 2000, 2002 and 2012 competitions, but was not successful." -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milton_Keynes
[02:34] <chilts> so you 'compete' to become a city
[02:35] <ajmitch> I think it used to be 20k people was considered a city here
[02:35] <hads> I think it's 30k?
[02:36] <ajmitch> if you can believe wikipedia, it says 20k prior to 1989
[02:36] <lifeless> wikipedia is always right
[02:37] <ajmitch> sure
[02:37] <lifeless> ajmitch: add a /!\ cite ? :)
[02:41] <chilts> if Palmerston North is 75k, maybe that's a city too
[02:42] <ojwb> chilts: the "has a cathedral" thing in the UK hasn't been entirely true for ages
[02:44] <ojwb> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_status_in_the_United_Kingdom
[02:45] <chilts> yeah, fair enough
[02:45] <chilts> ages being?
[02:45]  * chilts reads
[02:46] <chilts> "In the twentieth century ..."
[02:46] <chilts> so somewhere between 1900-1999 it changed :)
[02:47] <ojwb> probably 1907, if you read further
[02:48] <chilts> ah yeah, minimum 300,000 etc
[02:51] <ojwb> the first city which didn't happen to also have a cathedral is hard to determine from that article, but Cambridge doesn't have one
[02:52] <chilts> interesting reading though
[02:56] <ojwb> (to be uncharacteristically pedantic, 20th century would be 1901-2000)
[09:34] <chilts> fmarier: wow, pretty much everyone on NodejsNZ missed my humour on that post! :(
[09:34] <chilts> except you
[09:34] <chilts> hmm
[09:43] <fmarier> chilts: yeah and that last post is so wrong. web performance matters, a lot
[09:43] <fmarier> unless of course your site doesn't matter :)
[17:50] <ojwb> morning
[18:31] <mwhudson> morning
[18:36] <ibeardslee> morning
[18:52] <hads> So far not a great start to UFB. Was on hold to Snap for 25 minutes to ask about low speed (20Mbit/s national) and they said to wait 48 hours.
[18:55] <ojwb> stupid updater
[18:55] <ojwb> wifi drops and it instantly gives up
[18:55] <ojwb> at least the downloaded packages seem to be cached
[18:55] <ojwb> is that fixed in a newer version?
[18:56] <ojwb> this is upgrading from whatever the one is which has recently gone out of support
[19:13] <ajmitch> morning
[19:13] <ajmitch> hads: I suppose you got the 100/50 plan?
[19:22] <Atamira> good morning
[19:23] <Atamira> hads, you're on snap? how do you find it?
[19:24] <ibeardslee> hads: is that to warm up the wires properly?
[19:30] <ojwb> stupid thing died again
[19:33] <hads> ajmitch: Yeah 100/50
[19:33] <hads> Atamira: I've been on Snap for about 12 hours, not excited so far.
[19:33] <hads> ibeardslee: Yes I think it must be
[19:34] <Atamira> ahh, my friends been trying to talk me into it. its cheaper than orcon for the amount of gigs i use
[19:34] <Atamira> swears its worth it
[19:34] <ajmitch> 20Mbps national on a line that can do 100 is pretty poor, I hope that's a simple fix
[19:34] <Atamira> but then again, he swore that telecom was it as well
[19:35] <hads> ajmitch: Me too, last night they told me to call back today, today they told me to call back in 48 hours.
[19:39] <ajmitch> it wouldn't be so bad if they explained why, e.g. looking for congestion or problems
[19:40]  * ajmitch has always had good dealings with snap support, but has heard from others that they seem disorganised & don't communicate well
[20:25] <chilts> morning