[00:24] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: that wasn't nice :P
[15:09] <xTEMPLARx> I was a grouch last night, wrst
[15:09] <xTEMPLARx> arch butchered my home machine
[15:09] <xTEMPLARx> I blame arch
[15:09] <xTEMPLARx> :D
[15:10] <wrst> ha ha xTEMPLARx did you follow the isntructions?
[15:10] <wrst> *instructions
[15:11] <xTEMPLARx> to the letters
[15:11] <xTEMPLARx> even went back and repeated
[15:11] <xTEMPLARx> I got a bootable system out of it
[15:11] <wrst> what did you have trouble with
[15:11] <xTEMPLARx> even got networking back
[15:11] <xTEMPLARx> got x installed, along with gnome, xfce and kde
[15:11] <xTEMPLARx> but x wouldn't run to save it's life
[15:12] <xTEMPLARx> it was like I'd compiled from source and there were no existing default configs
[15:12] <xTEMPLARx> which didn't surprise me, but was counter to what I'd read that I should expect
[15:12] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: did you follow the instructions on getting x running?
[15:12] <wrst> and install the needed video driver?
[15:13] <xTEMPLARx> besides that, little things like getting an error message at login that tells me that my /etc/locale.conf is "access denied" to me
[15:13] <xTEMPLARx> wrst:  according to two of the sites, I did more than I should have had to
[15:13] <wrst> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Xorg
[15:13] <wrst> xTEMPLARx:  you can't look at sites gotta follow the arch wiki
[15:13] <xTEMPLARx> they made it seem like it should essentially run at least in a basic mode after installation
[15:14] <xTEMPLARx> regardless, X was the least of my worries with all the other weirdness going on
[15:14] <xTEMPLARx> things that even arch's wiki instructions said should be there weren't
[15:14] <wrst> did you use the arch wiki xTEMPLARx?
[15:14] <xTEMPLARx> of course
[15:14] <wrst> did you set up systemd ?
[15:14] <xTEMPLARx> I started there and only branched out when trying to figure out why *I* was having trouble and nobody else was
[15:15] <xTEMPLARx> don't believe I touched systemd specifically... doesn't mean it wasn't installed :\
[15:15] <wrst> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Systemd#Native_configuration
[15:15] <wrst> its installed by default but you ahve to set things like the hostname, locale etc that were handled by rc.conf when sysv init was used
[15:16] <xTEMPLARx> I did all those things :\
[15:16] <wrst> ok i'm not for sure then, but i'm sure YOU messed up :P
[15:16] <xTEMPLARx> bet I didn't do the 644
[15:16] <xTEMPLARx> nope couldn't have been me
[15:16] <xTEMPLARx> i'm perfect in every way
[15:16] <xTEMPLARx> ;)
[15:18] <xTEMPLARx> I will admit, however, that I DID mess up on two points:
[15:18] <xTEMPLARx> a)  it is my primary machine at home.  I shouldn't have jacked my primary machine to that degree to play around with arch.
[15:18] <xTEMPLARx> b)  I am an impatient person these days.  redhat, then ubuntu, installers have spoiled me into thinking it shouldn't take long
[15:19] <xTEMPLARx> I still have my little stack of Slackware install floppies from back in the day, but I do NOT have the little stack of patience that is necessary to get it going with them
[15:57] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: i would suggest you do arch in a VM to start with
[15:57] <wrst> then move to bare metal
[16:21] <xTEMPLARx> see that's the funny thing, wrst... my vm install of arch here went pretty smoothly
[16:21] <wrst> well you should know what you are doing, and I trust you are using the latest download?
[16:21] <xTEMPLARx> the primary difference I can think off right off the top of my head here, though, was that I used syslinux rather than grub, but that shouldn't be a factor downrange from that point of the install, really
[16:21] <xTEMPLARx> but of course
[16:21] <wrst> no if you are booting you should be good to go
[16:21] <wrst> so what is your problem?
[16:21] <xTEMPLARx> freshly downloaded and burned just prior to install
[16:22] <wrst> no x or that worning?
[16:22] <xTEMPLARx> that warning, I'm sure, is a sign of other things broken.
[16:22] <wrst> so you have x running?
[16:22] <xTEMPLARx> that and certain other things not being present.. for example, there were networking profiles that were claimed to be there in the instructions, that were nowhere on the system.. had to dig other sites to discover where they came from
[16:22] <xTEMPLARx> nope, no x
[16:23] <xTEMPLARx> but honestly, I just stepped away from it after a couple of hours of tinkering, as I knew I was becoming more and more impatient
[16:23] <xTEMPLARx> and I had a wife and son to attend to
[16:23] <xTEMPLARx> my son got to hear me say "later" and "after a while" way too often yesterday
[16:23] <xTEMPLARx> :(
[16:24] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: yeah something isn't right somwhere, but of course you already knew that great bit of wisdom
[16:24] <wrst> i can generally have arch running and a desktop in play in an hour inlcuding download time
[16:24] <xTEMPLARx> okay then something is definitely broken
[16:25] <xTEMPLARx> I should set up ssh for you and let you remote in to save the day :P
[16:25] <wrst> ha ha or destroy your system more likely :)
[16:25] <xTEMPLARx> I'll hopefully get to tinker with it some more later tonight, but we have christmas presentation practice tonight so I don't know how much energy I'll have when I get home
[16:26] <wrst> did you set the locale with the localectl command?
[16:30] <xTEMPLARx> nope I did it manually per some other instruction in the wiki installation guide
[16:31] <xTEMPLARx> I hadn't heard of the localectl command till I looked at your link a few minutes ago
[16:32] <xTEMPLARx> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Locale#Setting_system-wide_locale
[16:38] <wrst> I think that should have worked, but some of the documentation is lagging behin with systemd
[16:38] <wrst> i would try setting it with systemd just to be sure, maybe erase the file and start over again with it
[16:39] <xTEMPLARx> using localctl?
[16:39] <xTEMPLARx> argh
[16:39] <xTEMPLARx> so if the documentation is lagging
[16:39] <xTEMPLARx> what's a fellow supposed to do?
[16:39] <xTEMPLARx> guess I'll shoot myself in the foot
[16:39] <xTEMPLARx> :D
[16:52] <wrst> ha xTEMPLARx well you just have to be sure you are following systemd stuff if you are using systemd some people are still on sysv init
[16:54] <xTEMPLARx> see, I believe the system has installed sysv by default
[16:54] <xTEMPLARx> or that's how it's set up anyway, mebbe
[16:54] <xTEMPLARx> I dunno
[16:55] <xTEMPLARx> seems like they'd pick one and go with it by default, and let you change it if you like
[16:55] <xTEMPLARx> or maybe that's the problem
[16:55] <xTEMPLARx> I dunno
[16:55] <xTEMPLARx> ooo deja vu
[16:55] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: systemd is the default, they are going to remove sysv out of the repos but its a time of transition
[16:55]  * wrst goes into #archlinux mode
[16:56] <wrst> however if you didnt' read that you obviously didn't read the manual as you should nad its YOUR fault :)
[16:57] <wrst> https://www.archlinux.org/news/systemd-is-now-the-default-on-new-installations/
[16:57] <wrst> https://www.archlinux.org/news/end-of-initscripts-support/
[16:57] <wrst> etc etc
[16:59] <xTEMPLARx> I started with their installation guide, following the instructions given me.  Shouldn't have to have to pick and pluck random details from all over the place to make it work when they're giving you step-by-steps.
[16:59] <xTEMPLARx> have to have to lol
[16:59] <wrst> you have to be sure you are following systemd instructions
[16:59] <xTEMPLARx> granted, there are many spots in the instructions which are choose-your-own-adventure style
[16:59] <xTEMPLARx> but still
[17:00] <wrst> many places have both, its confusing but well if you are going to be an arch user...
[17:00] <xTEMPLARx> So someone needs to update https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Installation_Guide then?
[17:00] <xTEMPLARx> hrm
[17:00] <xTEMPLARx> <--- probably being difficult
[17:00] <xTEMPLARx> but
[17:00] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: here is the answer for you http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_rbeqbj-n1Z0/Skeak1qBGyI/AAAAAAAAAeM/3k_ntrDWmOw/s1600-h/ubuntu.png
[17:00] <xTEMPLARx> I don't remember having this much problem the first time I tried following it a while back.  and that better not be their snarky graphic :P
[17:01] <xTEMPLARx> worries me that you have it so readily available
[17:01] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: i follow that guide everytime and had no issues
[17:01] <wrst> but for instance when you get to grub you have o click on the grub section and go to the grub wiki
[17:01] <xTEMPLARx> but of course
[17:01] <xTEMPLARx> if you don't, you won't boot :D
[17:02] <wrst> and its linux there are 15 different ways to accomplish the same task :)
[17:02] <wrst> i actually installed on my desktop without any of the install scripts
[17:02] <wrst> just chrooted and did everything manual it wasn't bad either, but i used an external website and expected it to fail but it didn't
[17:02] <xTEMPLARx> external website?
[17:03] <xTEMPLARx> I was doing everything manually as well
[17:03] <xTEMPLARx> which is why it seemed like there were missing steps in there
[17:03] <xTEMPLARx> but like you say, if I didn't follow every rabbit hole, I probably missed things that were easily skimmed over
[17:03] <wrst> that is what usually happens to me
[17:05] <xTEMPLARx> it's not good to be borderline A.D.D. during installation, either, I'm assuming
[17:05] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: i think truth be known the arch devs don't care about adoption and i think they were feeling it was almost too easy for people to get it running, now they won't say that but I think that's what they have done
[17:05] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: NO! and I'm borderline add but i have to completely zone in to do it
[17:06] <xTEMPLARx> that's a difficult thing to do in my house
[17:06] <xTEMPLARx> either my wife or my son are always tugging at me while I'm at home
[17:07] <wrst> this i know i wait until they sleep
[17:07] <xTEMPLARx> I started to make a comment about that, too, as I usually end up feeling guilty even then and can't focus.
[17:07] <xTEMPLARx> hard to explain I guess
[17:07] <wrst> i'm a heartless arch user what is guilt? :)
[17:07] <xTEMPLARx> I could, but it'd probably sound weird
[17:08] <xTEMPLARx> :P
[17:08] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: I am weird by definition so nothing is probably going to sound weird to me
[17:26] <xTEMPLARx> =]
[18:48] <wrst> xTEMPLARx: when you will get arch running you won't go back because you will have to justify all the time you spent on it :)
[18:54] <xTEMPLARx> wrst:  Pfft!
[18:54] <xTEMPLARx> I can always justify my bad decisions
[18:54] <wrst> ha you know its true
[18:54] <xTEMPLARx> at least for the first 24 hours
[18:54] <wrst> good point me too
[19:05] <wrst> ha xTEMPLARx
[19:05] <wrst> greetings chris4585
[19:08] <chris4585> hey wrst
[19:08] <xTEMPLARx> good morning chris4585
[19:08] <chris4585> hey xTEMPLARx
[19:09] <wrst> howdy howdy
[20:05] <chris4585> reinstalled arch/bang
[20:05] <chris4585> I wanted to but at the same time my manjaro updated and something was off with the drivers
[23:48] <wrst> wb chris4585
[23:57] <chris4585> thanks