[08:58] <MooDoo> morning all
[09:15] <Ivanka> morning
[09:16] <czajkowski> aloha
[09:16] <czajkowski> Ivanka: morning hows your week looking
[09:16] <Ivanka> czajkowski: morning
[09:16] <Ivanka> czajkowski: nightmare! :-)
[09:17] <czajkowski> heh
[09:19] <czajkowski> 3.day.week++
[09:34] <christel> 5
[09:35] <Laney> 5 then 3 then 0!
[09:38] <lornajane> people - I'm organising a fosdem devroom, and I haven't actually been to the event before
[09:38] <JamesTait> Good morning all! :-D
[09:38] <lornajane> can anyone remember how late the devrooms usually run?  I'm not sure how many slots I should fill
[09:39] <JamesTait> 40 years to the day since Apollo 17 landed on the moon!
[09:41] <gord> sounds like something czajkowski might know
[09:43] <czajkowski> lornajane: what do you mean  ?
[09:43] <czajkowski> late?
[09:44] <lornajane> czajkowski: well some of last year's schedule seem to run til like 7pm, which seems late to me
[09:45] <czajkowski> lornajane: oh right yes the day is long used to be 6pm
[09:45] <czajkowski> but I think that was room constraints
[09:45] <czajkowski> lornajane: if you ask in #fosdem on freenode they'll help
[09:45] <lornajane> czajkowski: okay, I will do that.  Thanks!  I figured the people here are my best overlap with fosdem
[09:45] <lornajane> so excited that I get to go this year - Kevin's coming with me, and we had some nice submissions for the PHP room
[09:46] <czajkowski> I LOVE FOSDEM!
[09:50] <lornajane> czajkowski: I've been to froscon, but not fosdem, really looking forward to it
[09:50] <lornajane> I did oscon last year and all the europeans talked about fosdem so I decided I couldn't miss it!
[10:16] <daubers> daftykins: ?
[10:21] <brobostigon> good morning everyone,
[10:29] <Laney> ♥ bourbons
[10:31] <JohnRobert> hello
[11:07] <bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
[11:14] <davmor2> Morning all
[11:29] <bigcalm> Hi davmor2
[11:29] <bigcalm> davmor2: on for Thursday?
[11:34] <davmor2> bigcalm: I was going to ask around today, I am, but it is getting hold of moreati so I think a trip to the twittersphere
[11:45] <davmor2> bigcalm: tweet tweeting
[12:33] <popey> yo
[12:40] <JohnRobert> word
[12:41] <davmor2> up
[12:44] <davmor2> Wii wish ewe a merry christmas, there's something about this song doesn't feel right, I think it is sung by carboot enthusiasts  :D
[13:14] <popey> http://www.icrobotics.co.uk/wiki/index.php/Turning_the_Raspberry_Pi_Into_an_FM_Transmitter
[13:15] <JohnRobert> cool
[14:54] <czajkowski> Join us in 15 minutes (15:00 UTC) on ubuntuonair.com when we talk to Iain Lane ubuntu and debian hacker
[14:54] <czajkowski> for those who want to see Laney in action
[14:54] <Laney> ¬_¬
[14:55] <czajkowski> Laney: just sharing :)
[14:56] <Laney> heh
[14:56] <davmor2> whose this iain lane bloke, should we know him?
[14:56] <davmor2> :D
[15:00] <directhex> has anyone seen debconf being all weird & green before?
[15:01] <davmor2> Laney: good luck dude have a blast :)
[15:18] <Daviey> Laney: I love your jumper.
[15:20] <Azelphur> just listened to a hilarious call from my brother to sky
[15:20] <Azelphur> "Does your block of flats have less than 6 or more than 6 flats"
[15:20] <Azelphur> "No"
[15:21] <Azelphur> rinse and repeat a few times before they got the idea
[15:21] <Azelphur> xD
[16:03] <Laney> Daviey: merci
[16:04] <Laney> I asked for a Christmas jumper and that's wot I got
[16:09] <SuperEngineer> powers to monitor email and internet use need a "fundamental rethink", Nick Clegg says.
[16:09] <SuperEngineer> agreed...
[16:09] <SuperEngineer> I'll do the re-work for them [cheap]
[16:09] <SuperEngineer> ...change the word "needed" to "not needed"!
[16:10] <SuperEngineer> ...change the word "required" to "not wanted"
[16:11] <SuperEngineer> ...change the word "monitoring" to "offensive intrusion".
[16:11] <SuperEngineer> ...that'll be £10,000 for the consultancy, Mr. Clegg!
[16:12] <BigRedS> Anyone know the 'standard' means of adding vhosts to apache in CentOS etc., in lieu of a sites-available/sites-enabled setup?
[16:12] <BigRedS> I know I can stick it anywhere, but the next guy to look at this server might know where I live
[16:14] <SuperMatt> I guess you just do what feels right :/
[16:14] <SuperMatt> I know it loads everything from conf.d so you could stick something in there
[16:14] <SuperMatt> that's what subversion did automatically
[16:15] <BigRedS> what feels right rarely involves centos :)
[16:16] <SuperMatt> well no
[16:16] <SuperMatt> I happen to agree with you there
[16:16] <SuperMatt> seems a bit weird that redhat hasn't picked up the whole "stick the enabled sites into the sites-enabled folder" but I think I know why
[16:17] <SuperMatt> debian likes to separate config files into "system" stuff and then the stuff the user is likely to modify
[16:17] <SuperMatt> this means when there is an update, the system stuff may get changed, but the user stuff doesn't
[16:17] <SuperMatt> but redhat doesn't really get *upgraded* from one version to another
[16:18] <SuperMatt> once your redhat box is running, it just sits there until you get a new one
[16:18] <SuperMatt> at which point you just copy your old config across
[16:18] <SuperMatt> so just one config file is fine
[16:19] <BigRedS> the sites-enabled/sites-available thing does annoy puppet types
[16:19] <SuperMatt> I'll bet it does
[16:19] <BigRedS> but it's brilliant for automating things in shared hosting environments
[16:20] <SuperMatt> indeed
[16:23] <SuperMatt> I think it's silly that red hat changes the bloody names of things too
[16:23] <SuperMatt> oh apache2 is too complicated to remember
[16:24] <SuperMatt> it's gotta be httpd
[16:24] <SuperMatt> despite the fact that mysqld, postgresqld etc all keep their names
[16:24] <SuperMatt> who knows, maybe in redhat 7, mysql will be called databased
[16:34]  * Azelphur just ordered BT Infinity 2 - 76mbit
[16:45] <MartijnVdS> Azelphur: *yawn* :P
[16:48] <MartijnVdS> Azelphur: not 100/100? :)
[16:53] <Azelphur> MartijnVdS: unfortunately not :(
[16:53] <MartijnVdS> Azelphur: just come to the right side of the water ;)
[16:54] <Azelphur> hehe
[17:04] <SuperEngineer> Anyone know of a way to shorten the time a "notification" in Unity displays itself?  Hunted in dconf, sys settings etc all to no avail.
[17:05] <SuperEngineer> [in 12.04]
[17:07] <SuperMatt> SuperEngineer: I don't think it's possible because I think the app controls how long it's there fore
[17:08] <SuperEngineer> SuperMatt: that's what feared... thanks
[17:23] <AlanBell> SuperEngineer: it is hackable
[17:25] <SuperEngineer> AlanBell: ooo, go on - givus a clue pretty please
[17:25] <AlanBell> just having a gander at timings.c
[17:25] <SuperEngineer> ah hah!
[17:25] <SuperEngineer> me likey
[17:27] <AlanBell> the time they stay there is complicated
[17:27] <AlanBell> there is a scheduled duration, a max duration and conditions that extend the timing
[17:27] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: And space is big. Really big.
[17:27] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: You just won't believe how vastly hugely mindbogglingly big it is.
[17:27] <AlanBell> space is somewhere in which thing can be big
[17:27] <SuperEngineer> cheers AlanBell
[17:28] <SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: not if you have an infinite motion drive!
[17:28] <MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: sure, or no mass.
[17:28] <MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: but as I have neither..
[17:28] <AlanBell> ok, it is in defaults.c
[17:29] <AlanBell> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~notify-osd-developers/notify-osd/main/view/head:/src/defaults.c#L148
[17:29] <AlanBell> right there
[17:30] <SuperEngineer> AlanBell: looking at that now
[17:31] <AlanBell> it is a hard coded bunch of stuff that complies with startling precision to the design team specification
[17:32] <MartijnVdS> configurability > compiled-in constants
[17:32] <AlanBell> this is all part of the "one true design" thing
[17:32] <MartijnVdS> The Thousand-Year Design?
[17:33] <AlanBell> something like that
[17:33] <MartijnVdS> One Design to Rule them All?
[17:33]  * SuperEngineer loves the line "#define DEFAULT_GRAVITY"
[17:33] <AlanBell> all the constants are defined in one place, I suspect the design team didn't want them in dconf
[17:33] <MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: is it set to 9.8?
[17:33] <AlanBell> nope, NORTH_EAST I expect
[17:34] <AlanBell> they also implemented EAST
[17:34] <SuperEngineer> nah! nor 4,4so obviously never been to my planet  ;)
[17:34] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: nah, I suspect it was a last-minute rush job, so constants are easier
[17:34] <AlanBell> but no other ordinals because the design specification didn't call for notifications to be anywhere else
[17:34] <AlanBell> MartijnVdS: nope, it wasn't
[17:34] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: they never bothered to change it because nobody asked and just before release, there wasn't time
[17:35] <MartijnVdS> (cynical? me? nah!)
[17:35] <AlanBell> no, this was unconfigurable by design, the jaunty-notification design specified the number of seconds for notifications, deviation from the design wasn't really allowed at all
[17:36] <MartijnVdS> Neither was focus-follows-mouse
[17:36] <MartijnVdS> it still exists
[17:37] <SuperEngineer> we *will* not tolerate any deviation from the design!
[17:37] <SuperEngineer> you will *not* complain
[17:38] <SuperEngineer> resistance is futile?
[17:38] <SuperEngineer> well - I resist!
[17:40] <SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: I implemented focus-follows-mouse but oh so easy to give away a ppassword if not careful
[17:41] <MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: password-asking apps should grab the focus if they need it
[17:42] <SuperEngineer> agreed! what is needed for focus is "focus-to-latest-dialogue" [or whatever it is called]
[17:42] <marsilainen_> hi, is there a way to turn off the message that gets displayed (around once a day?) telling me that the version of Ubuntu I'm using is out of support? (11.04)
[17:43] <SuperEngineer> [as per can be implemented in, sorry for the swear word, WinXp]
[17:45] <jacobw> evening
[17:47] <davmor2> marsilainen_: disconnect from the internet possibly.  other than that not that I am aware of.
[17:48] <marsilainen_> hmmm :/
[17:48] <marsilainen_> I want to do the upgrade, but I don't have the time to risk it ATM
[17:48] <SuperEngineer> marsilainen_: in update manager - is there not the option to turn off such notifications?
[17:48] <marsilainen_> so it's likely to be a few weeks before I get the chance
[17:49] <marsilainen_> and it's a MythTV front-end box so a little annoying
[17:51] <SuperEngineer> marsilainen_: sorry - didn't realise you were using Myth - don't know about that
[17:51] <marsilainen_> I think it's still using the same update manager
[17:51] <marsilainen_> I will check the settings, maybe I missed something
[17:52] <SuperEngineer> marsilainen_: then try setting "notify me for..." to "never"???
[17:52] <SuperEngineer> ['m only guessing btw]
[17:54] <jacobw> upgrading is not a risk
[17:58] <SuperEngineer> In case anyone ever doubts their instincts, have a quick fable on me:
[17:59] <SuperEngineer> when you suspect a thermistor in a boiler has failed - don't change the thermocouple just because you can't find the thermistor!
[17:59] <marsilainen_> jacobw: staying on the 11.04 release is a risk (no more security updates etc) but upgrading is a risk surely - are you saying that no-one encounters issues when they upgrade?
[18:00] <SuperEngineer> heating engr arrived today, certified & congratulated work on thermocouple
[18:00] <SuperEngineer> told him my suspicions...
[18:01] <jacobw> marsilainen_: i thought you meant apt-get upgrade
[18:01] <SuperEngineer> he pointed to excatly where the thermistor was and proved I was right :(  doh!
[18:01] <jacobw> marsilainen_: have you tried a live environment yet?
[18:01] <davmor2> marsilainen_: open software-sources, open the updates tab, change notify about new ubuntu versions to never.  that's about the only thing I can see to suggest you may still get bugged about it though
[18:02] <jacobw> or `sudo do-release-upgrade` :)
[18:02] <davmor2> marsilainen_: also once on precise you are on an lts so you will have at least 2 years before you are bugged again
[18:03] <marsilainen_> jacobw: well I guess even that has some risks (though I agree fairly low) but I'll be upgrading through a few releases (to 12.04). This is something I want to do in a few weeks when I have the time to test with a live version and backup first etc so just looking to stop nags for a few weeks
[18:03] <marsilainen_> davmor2: thanks, I've just done that - wasn't clear if it will stop them or not but worth a try
[18:04] <marsilainen_> and yes, will get it onto LTS and I believe that the future mythbuntu plan is to stick to LTS releases only from now
[18:04] <davmor2> marsilainen_: the other thing you can do is change the daily to weekly then you are only bugged once a week rather than daily
[18:04] <jacobw> marsilainen_: you don't have to upgrade through releases to keep your home directory, if you do an install without formating the home filesystem the installer will leave it intact
[18:05] <marsilainen_> jacobw: I understand that the upgrade should work fine and I want to do it, but I don't want to do it right now as I don't want to risk breaking things
[18:05] <marsilainen_> I realise that likely there will be no probalems
[18:05] <marsilainen_> but if there are problems I don't have time to fix them right now
[18:05] <jacobw> marsilainen_: that's sensible :)
[18:05] <marsilainen_> and I don't want to be without a working TV setup until I have time to fix them
[18:06] <marsilainen_> I'm totally reliant on MythTV for all TV watching for the last year and a half now
[20:03] <stevepdp> evening all
[21:08] <jacobw> until the end of the 18th century the majority of books were written in Latin.
[21:08] <jacobw> sorry, i genuinely have no idea how i just pasted that
[21:10] <AlanBell> the internet would be a much more civilized place if it was all in latin :)
[21:13] <dutchie> ita vero
[21:13]  * jacobw →  sleep
[21:19] <solarcloud_3scrn> AlanBell, E Veritate Potens .. althou. solarcloud_3scrn has said this before .... :)
[21:27] <RaycisCharles> AlanBell: or people had to use their real names...
[21:27]  * RaycisCharles stares at AlanBell
[21:28] <AlanBell> actually people are mostly cool with being obnoxious under their real names, they are on Facebook
[21:32] <neuro> Si omnes coactus lingua Latina uti, omnia quae ventura est augmentum in traffic ad Google Translate.
[21:34] <neuro> Multus magis vertitis a Monty Python.
[21:34] <neuro> (that one didn't quite work)
[21:36] <solarcloud_3scrn> Latin .. the only 'tin' is on my kitchen cabinet  .. it keeps the teabags from going off :)
[21:46] <solarcloud_3scrn> Anyone here tonight ??
[21:53] <popey> maybe
[21:55] <Laney> time for christmas shopping
[21:59]  * Laney runs outside to chase squirrels
[22:03] <Ruint> i'm here
[22:03] <Ruint> XD
[22:05] <Laney> instead i got distracted by watching simpsons clips on youtube
[22:05] <Laney> http://youtu.be/JcSUWP0QNeY
[22:05] <Ruint> is everyone here actually british ?
[22:05] <AlanBell> no, but this is a UK focussed channel
[22:05] <Ruint> o
[22:06] <AlanBell> everyone is welcome
[22:06] <Ruint> apart from the 27 people in the banlist, i assume
[22:07] <AlanBell> naturally
[22:09] <Laney> Ruint: Complete the following sentences to determine whether you can stay. Tea is (a) great, (b) crap. Pip ___. Tally __. When I see a queue I (a) join it, regardless of where it goes (b) ignore it and go straight to the front. Damn those fools waiting in line. And tell us the second verse of the national anthem.
[22:10] <Ruint> nobody knows the second verse, we're just aware it's humourously anti-scottish
[22:11] <Ruint> i don't like tea; pip-squeak, tally-ho, join queue
[22:11] <Ruint> it's not my fault i don't like tea, don't judge me :9
[22:11] <Ruint> :(
[22:11] <AlanBell> I would have gone for pip pip, but pip-squeak works too
[22:12] <Ruint> Laney: i normally ask people 'what is your impression of go-compare's tv adverts'
[22:12] <Laney> you mean that there are people who like them?
[22:12] <Ruint> no
[22:12] <Ruint> THAT FFFFKNG OPERA SINGERDFSDFF
[22:13] <Ruint> is the standard response
[22:13]  * Laney approves of that
[22:13] <Ruint> http://realcitizenshiptest.co.uk/quiz.php?n=1 works too
[22:14] <Ruint> i have a uk focused channel too, so i'm more used to asking than i am being asked
[22:18] <AlanBell> 9/10.
[22:18] <AlanBell> I got the Greece one wrong apparently
[22:18] <Ruint> o
[22:18] <Ruint> i only got 7/10
[22:19] <Laney> HAH. TEN.
[22:19] <Ruint> :(
[22:28] <solarcloud_3scrn> popey Et All..,Oh people are here !
[22:28] <Ruint> yup
[22:29]  * Laney scoffs bourbons
[22:29] <solarcloud_3scrn> I was just looking at the Manx Tax sharing agreements.. Perhaps MrShuttleworth will be leaving soon , dunno.
[22:35] <solarcloud_3scrn> Anyone tried Tong lately ? http://www.nongnu.org/tong/
[22:38] <solarcloud_3scrn> http://www.ubuntu.com/devices/android geting there ..
[22:43] <solarcloud_3scrn> Awesome !! https://plus.google.com/108929111533659263063/posts/Ro6eSCPy5JL
[22:47] <solarcloud_3scrn> ... everyon'e gone again .
[22:47]  * solarcloud_3scrn checks his breath.
[22:49] <solarcloud_3scrn> oh BTW Fosted shredded wheat is on sale again in Tesco for 70p a pack !
[22:49]  * solarcloud_3scrn bought 12 boxes today, alone !
[22:50] <solarcloud_3scrn> **that is Frosted Shredded Wheat...
[23:02] <Ruint> that's a lot of wheat
[23:02] <RaycisCharles> solarcloud_3scrn, that's good value.
[23:03] <RaycisCharles> Is it a 500g pack though?
[23:03] <Ruint> depends on the box sixe
[23:03] <Ruint> you must be a veritable shit machine
[23:03]  * solarcloud_3scrn is looking in kitchen ..
[23:03] <Ruint> so much wholegrain cereal
[23:03] <solarcloud_3scrn> yep it's 500g A-OK .. !!
[23:04] <Ruint> might invest in that
[23:04] <Ruint> do they stil have terrys chocolate oranges £2.98 buy one get two free?
[23:04] <solarcloud_3scrn> good thing is .. is that you can have it in snacks without milk ..
[23:04] <solarcloud_3scrn> yep, its that good !
[23:05] <Ruint> solarcloud_3scrn: that's true, but the king of snack cereal is those oat cluster things
[23:05] <solarcloud_3scrn> they do those too..
[23:05] <solarcloud_3scrn> but they cost 50p a pack more ... :(
[23:06]  * solarcloud_3scrn noticed some packs of cereal that cost a whoping £4.50 today .. like WTF ?
[23:06] <Ruint> mm jordan's country crisp
[23:06] <Ruint> o
[23:06] <solarcloud_3scrn> it's just energy to e .
[23:06] <Ruint> tesco finest granola stuff ?
[23:06] <solarcloud_3scrn> **me.
[23:07] <Ruint> i think the price point only exists because enough people are dumb enough to buy it
[23:07] <solarcloud_3scrn> .. cant remember the 4-50 stuff but i think it was a kelloggs brand .
[23:07] <Ruint> if you put a premium product in a category that didn't have one, 205 of people will buy it to feel good about themselves
[23:07] <solarcloud_3scrn> .. eah, some people are dumb, tru.
[23:07] <Ruint> 20% ^
[23:08] <solarcloud_3scrn> ~~**yeah , sorry new keyboard.
[23:08] <neuro> welcome to #ubuntu-cereal
[23:09] <Ruint> :(
[23:09] <solarcloud_3scrn> it's a reality series !!
[23:09] <Ruint> if it's not an appropriate topic
[23:09] <Ruint> i can steal everyone away to my channel
[23:09] <Ruint> but advertising is likely frowned upon
[23:10] <solarcloud_3scrn> ok , point taken.
[23:10] <RaycisCharles> I'm eating Asda Fruit n' Fibre right now.
[23:10] <RaycisCharles> Ruint, unless you own ##cereal, we're not interested.
[23:11] <solarcloud_3scrn> hash-cereal .. what is that a Seattle brand ?
[23:11] <RaycisCharles> solarcloud_3scrn: I bought 12 boxes of these: http://quaker.co.uk/products/oat-so-simple-kids-will-love
[23:11]  * solarcloud_3scrn patents hash-cereal-bars idea.
[23:11] <Ruint> RaycisCharles: nope :(
[23:12] <solarcloud_3scrn> Wow that link is a bit scary .. is it past the watershed yet ?
[23:15] <Ruint> i normally have a flapjack for breakfast
[23:15] <Ruint> cereal is too time consuming
[23:16] <Ruint> read the metro on the train, eat a flapjack
[23:16] <Ruint> perfect breakfast
[23:16] <RaycisCharles> That's so Scottish.
[23:16] <RaycisCharles> Take it to #ubuntu-scotland
[23:16] <Ruint> but i'm english
[23:16] <Ruint> they were talking about porridge
[23:16] <Ruint> you were
[23:16] <Ruint> even
[23:17] <Ruint> i bet you eat it with salt
[23:17] <Ruint> freak :(
[23:18] <RaycisCharles> Ask not what your oatmeal can do for you, but what you can do for your oatmeal.
[23:18] <Ruint> suggest comic ideas?
[23:18] <Ruint> (theoatmeal)
[23:19] <solarcloud_3scrn> Ruint, Flapjack is for evening !! I make a flapjack mix of microwaved butter (Kerry) , brown sugar and a small amount of Oats in a bowl = flapjack mix !! I always sleep well.
[23:19] <Ruint> o
[23:21] <Ruint> http://www.higatesltd.co.uk/oatsatisfy/?q=oat-bar-almonds-brazils-cranberries-sultanas-topped-dark-chocolate-flavour-coating
[23:21] <Ruint> with a can of sugar free energy drink
[23:21]  * solarcloud_3scrn reaches for his last rollie of the day.(with three filters).
[23:21] <Ruint> is the breakfast of kings
[23:21] <Ruint> you have to try it to believe it
[23:23] <solarcloud_3scrn> maybe , but porridge last you all day .. although it does take skill to make a good bowl :)
[23:24] <solarcloud_3scrn> I bought 1 packs of Oats (Scottish) last month aswell.
[23:24] <solarcloud_3scrn> **10 packs
[23:25] <solarcloud_3scrn> Actually, I am still looking for a service that scans in all of your/my receipts so I can keep them on my computer .. any ideas ?
[23:25] <solarcloud_3scrn> apparently, it is common-place in america.
[23:26] <solarcloud_3scrn> (must be located in U.K., obviously)
[23:29] <Ruint> solarcloud_3scrn: your bank may reccomend one that they will export your financial info to
[23:30] <Ruint> or at least provide a list of the ones they're compatible with
[23:30] <solarcloud_3scrn> Ruint, I just want digital copies of reciepts that is all.
[23:30] <Ruint> o
[23:30] <Ruint> no idea
[23:31] <solarcloud_3scrn> errr, Ok.
[23:31] <RaycisWithChild> I heard 13.04 will let you buy children from China.
[23:33] <solarcloud_3scrn> RaycisWithChild, interesting, but relevant ?
[23:37] <solarcloud_3scrn> https://plus.google.com/communities/110114451726939312635   ::: Looks a good effort.
[23:38] <solarcloud_3scrn> & there is always .. https://plus.google.com/communities/118373692530226998936
[23:48] <solarcloud_3scrn> nightie night all.