=== zz_chihchun is now known as chihchun === chihchun is now known as zz_chihchun === zz_chihchun is now known as chihchun === chihchun is now known as zz_chihchun === zz_chihchun is now known as chihchun === chihchun is now known as zz_chihchun [17:34] er telling cario dock that there is a button to open the dash is hard and also having cario dock on open on certian forFactors is even harder ! [17:49] bobweaver, I've got my scope back up to where it was previously, so I'll be working on a lens/scope for guide data next [17:49] tgm4883, that is hard to talk about ;) [17:49] yea [17:49] But that is also good news that it is back up to where it was [17:49] you got a minute ? [17:50] I think I'll be able to just use the same layout as the video layout, then hopefully it's just an easy change for when we get guide layout [17:50] yea [17:50] I am wondering so there is a couple of ways that previews can be called [17:50] guide layout is done [17:50] sidenote ^^ [17:50] ok [17:50] one way that I like is by mimi [17:51] the only mimi i know of is from the drew carey show [17:51] lol [17:52] ok so take a look at this [17:52] http://paste.ubuntu.com/1427999/ [17:52] k [17:52] so what that does is run a if statement to see 1 if formfactor is tv and 2 too look if path has this in it mimetype.indexOf("video/") [17:53] If the formfactor is that and there is that in the path then it returns previews on selction [17:53] right, so it shows a preview if it's in the video lens with a video mimetype [17:53] correct [17:54] no I have to figure out a better way of passing more info "notice the Fixme tag " [17:54] that is not stable and needs to be re-wrote [17:54] now there are a bunch of options that can be used [17:55] one of the ons that I like is onCLicked: if button 3 load blah blah blah [17:55] that would go into the render page. itsself [17:56] so thouse are the only two options that I can figure out at this time. I am not sure how dbus is reading lens [17:56] tgm4883, you have a virtual box with 12.04 installed ? [17:56] why are we guessing when we should open a preview vs playing the video. Shouldn't the lens/scope/user be specifying this? [17:56] bobweaver, I could get one installed [17:56] tgm4883, that would be cool ! [17:57] so the scope passes to the lens whether a specific item has a preview available [17:57] then the user would have 2 buttons. one for play, one for info [17:57] tgm4883, so you think that it should be play is right click and left is previews just like unity 6 + [17:58] button clicks is fine, but I'd think a remote is more likely [17:58] so KEY_PLAY would play, KEY_INFO would open a preview (if available) [17:58] if not available, then either A) do nothing (Bad), B) Open a preview saying "no preview available", C) do playback [17:58] correct and if not avilable then what should it be ? has to have a backup [17:59] what about like a button if not there then user can make his/her own? [17:59] I say B, since it is more similar to what happens if a preview is available [17:59] maybe for the future [17:59] I think that gets into a weird situation as well [18:00] I have to figure out how to read the info that is being passed via dbus [18:00] that might take me some time as it is pulling teeth to get questions abut unity [18:01] answered that is (It is me I ran my mouth to much ) [18:01] Saviq, maybe you can look at this ? [18:02] or give us a hint if you know anything about this maybe mhall119 also ? or jhodapp [18:02] or hook me up with someone [18:03] tgm4883, If it was me I would just query tvdb and tmdb from unity 2d itsself [18:03] but that is a waste sence there are scopes and lens that allready have preview stuff [18:03] bobweaver, for previews? [18:03] bobweaver, not sure I get the question, but the flow is this: search results go scope > lens > shell [18:03] bobweaver, shell then requests for a preview for a URI [18:04] bobweaver, it gets the preview back, which has data and possible actions [18:04] then, upon click, the shell tells the lens to invoke an action [18:04] Saviq, do you know javascript ? something that I can say er.. let me make example [18:04] bobweaver, remember I wrote that code? yes, I know JS :P [18:05] say file name is /path/to/foo.mpg I want to just indexof foo.mpg to come back [18:05] like a function that can go in utils.js [18:06] like the opisite of function removeExt(uri) { [18:06] return uri.substring(0, uri.lastIndexOf(".")) [18:06] } [18:06] sorry [18:06] function removeExt(uri) { return uri.substring(0, uri.lastIndexOf("/"))} [18:06] but the opistite [18:07] so it does not retun in this example /path/to/ for the uri but instead foo.mpg [18:13] happy 12/12/12, or as you non-americans say, 12/12/12 [18:13] lol indeed [18:14] tgm4883, and it's the last one this century! [18:14] it is! [18:14] what is that ? [18:14] bobweaver: what's the question you have? [18:14] 12/12/12 [18:15] Saviq, although for the non-americans, you will still have 20/12/2012 [18:15] it is about unity previews and how the I can make a bettter system for it [18:15] which is kinda repeating [18:15] mhall119, PM ? [18:15] bobweaver: sure [18:15] bobweaver, nested previews/other preview layouts [18:15] thanks [18:17] tgm4883, nested and all that is simple it is the reading of the scopes and lens that I do not understand how to implant [20:39] hello aaas [20:39] anyone know why this happens http://paste.ubuntu.com/1428324/ [20:39] hey bobweaver [20:39] tgm4883, what do you know about tvhead ? [20:40] i think ultimately it's a problem with tvheadend, but it's strange that upstart does this [20:40] aaas, what does tvheadend offer that myth-tv does not or it is just faster ? [20:40] sorry I just hear about this today [20:40] not much [20:40] bobweaver pros and cons like everything [20:41] bobweaver switches channels faster [20:41] bobweaver but no great timeshift yet [20:41] aaas, what os / version of Ubuntu are you running ? [20:41] bobweaver also a nicer web config which works for headless people like me... dont care for the mythtv gui [20:41] bobweaver 12.10 [20:42] sudo service tvheadend status [20:42] Oh it is a service ! [20:42] tgm4883 'tvheadend start/running' [20:42] aaas, restart it [20:42] aaas, sudo service tvheadend restart [20:42] bobweaver i did and this-> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1428324/ [20:42] aaas, sudo service tvheadend restart [20:43] aaas, you shouldn't do killall on a service that uses upstart [20:43] tgm4883, so it also use's sql for storage and has api ect ? [20:44] tgm4883 bobweaver http://paste.ubuntu.com/1428348/ [20:44] still no pid is this an upstart thing? [20:44] * tgm4883 knows jack crap about tvheadend [20:44] well i think this problem is just a reporting thing ...tvheadend independent [20:45] it's just very strange that it says it's running but no pid [20:45] aaas, try ps aux | [tTvV] [20:45] woops [20:45] aaas, try ps aux | grep [tTvV] [20:45] bobweaver, grep -i tv [20:45] makes it case insensitive [20:45] same thing [20:45] nothing [20:46] aaas, is it possible it's not called tv [20:46] that is what [TtVv] regex does it looks for both cap and not cap letters I could be wrong on that [20:46] tgm4883 im almost certain it is... i had it working earlier [20:46] tgm4883, that is also what I was thinking . aaas did you upgrade or anything ? [20:46] bobweaver, right, but if you are doing thisisareallylongonethatwouldtakeforevertodoyourregexon [20:46] i think it's some weird upstart thing..it's in limbo where upstart thinks it's up bu the sytstem doesnt [20:46] what cause breakage ? [20:47] aaas, most likely it's an issue with tvheadend somewher [20:47] aaas, why not mythbuntu ? [20:47] I love it myself [20:47] bobweaver, some people like old school tv and no dvr ;P [20:47] tgm4883 well that's what's causing the problem but I think upstart and pid is not a tvheadend issue [20:47] aaas, where did you install tvheadend from? [20:48] bobweaver the channel switching is really slow for me [20:48] and it has pvr [20:48] tgm4883 ubuntu repos [20:48] aaas, takes no time for me on myth.26 like ten seconds [20:48] aaas, if tvheadend uses upstart, then it most certainly made it's own upstart job [20:48] well not 10 seconds lol [20:48] aaas, what is the package name? [20:49] bobweaver 10 is way too much.. but I'm using hdhomerun so it might take longer..i think it's down to 1 or 2 now [20:49] tgm4883 let me check maybe im wrong it might be a ppa [20:49] yea [20:49] Oo [20:49] bobweaver, why am I here? [20:49] tgm4883, there is that hdhomerun again hat you where talking about [20:50] bobweaver, yea it's nice [20:50] tgm4883, you are here because you are awesome [20:50] eh true [20:50] I can't argue with that logic [20:50] not sure what you meant by that but I think you are awesome ! [20:50] https://www.lonelycoder.com/redmine/boards/14/topics/3368 [20:50] so thats what i used [20:51] so it was a ppa [20:51] http://ppa.launchpad.net/alexandr-surkov/dharma-pvr/ubuntu/pool/main/t/tvheadend/ [20:51] Wow that is a alot of stuff to do to get tv working [20:51] yea [20:52] bobweaver less than xbmc if you have backend + frontend + hdhomerun [20:52] less than mythtv* [20:52] it's a lot to setup no matter what [20:52] aaas, no it's not [20:52] it's not an internal pci card [20:52] tgm4883 i just set it up [20:52] mythtv too [20:52] its basically the same [20:52] aaas, no it's not [20:52] the drivers for hdhomerun are the same no matter what [20:53] the xbmc is the same no matter what (for me) [20:53] the tvheadend/mythtv difference is marginal [20:53] set up video source [20:53] channels [20:53] mapping [20:53] scanning [20:53] all similar [20:53] aaas, you are in the US? [20:53] yes [20:53] they why scan? [20:54] what ever your'e about to say (schedules direct) same for both [20:54] aaas, getting info via SD ? [20:54] wait sd? stadnard def? [20:54] s|sd| (schedules direct [20:54] oh hehe [20:54] yes [20:55] aaas, ever think about using ubuntu tv ? [20:55] aaas, I'm looking though these instructions, and even just comparing mythtv to tvheadend, no it is not the same [20:55] tgm4883 well not the same, but similar.. there is not THAT much difference [20:55] bobweaver ubuntu tv? [20:56] It is not done yet aaas but there is talks of it being worked on [20:57] it uses myth as backend though [20:57] because myth tv is awesome [20:57] aaas, do you mainly view channels live or recored and then watch ? [20:58] bobweaver, it's live [20:58] bobweaver i like myth but the problem i have with them is that it is kind of a hacked together pvr... the added on live tv as an afterthought... the developers do not want to fix the long time for channel changes, and i hate using a gui for a headless machine, but myth has a lot of neat features, yes [20:58] bobweaver im not sure..this is for a household setup...personally i record, not sure of my gf will though shes more of a 'broswer' [20:58] aaas, try to keep it rational and fact based now [20:58] "hacked together pvr"? [20:59] tgm4883 citation available upon request [20:59] sure i can find the thread [20:59] aaas, "hacked together pvr"? [20:59] yes [20:59] I was alspo wondering what that was all about ? [20:59] yes I want to see that thread [20:59] ok one sec [21:00] aaas, you have seen that there is a mythtv scope for the unity video lens ? [21:00] bobweaver i dont use unity [21:00] boooo ! :) [21:00] aaas, just out of curiosity what DE do you use ? [21:01] [21:02] tgm4883 here's the thread http://www.mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/2008-August/231728.html [21:02] bobweaver this is a headless server [21:03] bobweaver so i try not to use anything unless i have to [21:03] aaas, he means for your FE [21:03] bobweaver which is what makes it annoying to loging and setup myth [21:03] which I'm assuming is a TV/PS3/etc [21:03] tgm4883 no read the entire thread [21:03] aaas, which is going away in the next version [21:03] and the devs resistance...which may be well founded [21:03] aaas, I'm.... never mind [21:04] it would be a lot of work to get it working that way [21:04] aaas, i'm reading the thread, and also explaining what bobweaver was asking [21:04] oh hehe [21:04] no xbmc [21:04] yeah I meant on your front ends what is DE [21:04] when you said de i thought you meant desktop environment [21:04] I do [21:04] windows, linux, raspberry pi [21:04] all sorts of stuff [21:05] but all xbmc [21:05] aaas, I'm still reading this thread, but it seems to be about slow channel changes, not about "hacked together pvr" [21:05] ahh xbmc is kinda cool try out qtmediahub ? [21:06] tgm4883 well 'hacked together pvr' = 'live tv as an afterthought' as they say [21:06] bobweaver qtmeadiahug? [21:06] * tgm4883 sighs [21:06] * aaas sighs [21:07] ;) [21:07] aaas, not to mention this is a thead from 2008, which is 5-6 major versions of mythtv ago [21:07] that is what I thought also when I was reading that [21:08] tgm4883 if it is a structural difference then it's there for a longn time... but i just installed myth and i can tell you it's that way for me [21:09] aaas, oh I know it takes a few seconds to change channels, I'm not denying that [21:10] aaas, my crazy frontend -> http://imagebin.org/239065 [21:10] I'm just waiting for the part where someone says this is a "hacked together pvr" [21:10] what is difference between pvr and dvr ? [21:10] bobweaver, the first letter? [21:10] tgm4883, er [21:11] is like one faster or can record more channels ? [21:11] tgm4883 i know you want to define that in some malicious way, but i just meant that it was hacked (not put on as a initial design decision) [21:12] aaas, no, what you meant to say was "While MythTV does have awesome features, the LiveTV portions of it do not live up to the rest of the program and feel as if they were added on as an afterthought" [21:12] aaas, that isn't what you said though [21:12] not hacked togeather [21:12] together [21:13] no you are interepreting it wrong because you are emotionally connected to mythtv and i said something so rather than trying to unsertand what i mean you went for the worst possible definition [21:13] well good luck with tvheadless or what ever it is called. but if you like stay up-to-date with Ubuntu-tv we have google + facebook and all sorts of stuff [21:14] aaas, but again we are going to use myth tv as a backend but there is always room for improvement. Like the things that you are talking about [21:14] aaas, if it had zero live tv functionality, would it still be "hacked together"? [21:15] personally, I'd like to see live tv functionality dropped completetly [21:15] tgm4883 no..... if you add the 'pvr' portion of it as an afterthought ('hack) then it is [21:15] aaas, Ubuntu tv is going to rock [21:15] bobweaver have you used xbmc [21:16] * bobweaver does not like xbmc there rendering and also there options are umm.. [21:16] aaas, "hacked together" implies that it was done incorrectly. My favorite part of the thread you posted is "We all agree it's a problem. We would all like faster channel changing times. The issue is that no one wants it enough to fix it. These threads typically go on for a few days and then someone says, "I'm going to look into the code and see where I can optimize it to have channel change times under a second!" and then we never [21:16] hear from them again." [21:16] aaas, like how they gather metadata and what not.not to say that xbmc is not good but I can get all the stuff that it offers in Ubuntu tv or just stright up Ubuntu [21:16] tgm4883 well it was done incorrectly from the perspective of someone who wants a solution integrated from the ground up [21:16] Unity that is [21:17] bobweaver rednering and options? [21:17] aaas, and yet nobody has stepped forward with any patches [21:17] aaas, yeah it is not easy to connect to to use there services . wait I do not think that they have services [21:17] tgm4883 yeah the problem might be so hard to fix.... i dont fault them for not fixing something that is super hard to fix, but it just doesn't work for some people is all [21:17] you have to export all the libs if you want to use .nfo [21:17] bobweaver it's a frontend mostly [21:18] that is what I mean I like it. but it is just not powerfull enough [21:18] bobweaver wait a sec..export the libs? [21:18] aaas, yeah but not ayscronisticly [21:18] bobweaver .nfo from what [21:18] metadata [21:19] of uou movies and your tv and what not [21:19] bobweaver the meta data is dynamically scrapped from the internet [21:19] Yeah I know that. [21:19] what I am saying is that there is nothing to read it asycronisticly [21:19] like I can not go to webbrowser and put in something that I am looking for on backend and get it [21:20] aaas, so other than livetv taking a few senconds to change channels (which apparently is what you mean by it being completely an afterthought), you think that mythtv has no faults based on the upcoming release [21:20] with myth you can do these types of things [21:20] bobweaver like search for a movie? [21:20] bobweaver, xbmc is a frontend, not a backend [21:20] by definition, it does not serve content [21:21] tgm4883 well im sure it has faults, but it works for some people, it just doesn't work for me, the gui config was annoynig for someone like me with a headless server [21:21] aaas, kinda but there is more to it then just that. lets take adding new things to xbmc like a new lens in unity you can not just add things [21:21] aaas, I just said that was going away in the upcoming release, being replaced with web setup [21:22] tgm4883 sure and that would be great, but im doing my setup now... and tvheadend is getting timeshifting in the next release too [21:22] bobweaver, i'm not going to knock on xbmc, for what it is, it's a solid piece of software [21:22] bobweaver you need to get away from this unity lenes stuff...what is the benefit of integrating it with unity? [21:22] aaas, i thought you said that tvheadend was already a pvr? [21:22] tgm4883 yes it is but it doesn't have timshifting in stable (though I htink it's in head or a branch somewhere) [21:23] where myth tv can be queryed and xbmc can not. also well there are just so many options. but the services api is the big one that makes myth real real good not just for one front end but all like even unity ot xface a app that you want to write. xbmc is standalone and is not working with other DE that is [21:23] aaas, bobweaver drop the unity talk. Both Unity and XBMC are similar in that they both allow plugins [21:23] yeah but not like it should be [21:23] aaas, err, define timeshifting for me since you don't think that is the same as a PVR [21:23] I like xbmc but there is just not enough things that say hey use me. But I am weired [21:24] bobweaver, right, but XBMC isn't a backend/server [21:24] tgm4883 well maybe im wrong but pvr is a personal video recorder, it's for recording video, timeshfiting is the ability to pause live tv rewide live, speed past commericals [21:24] tgm4883, uses sqllight there is tables [21:25] bobweaver does your unity setup have icefilms, free cable, 1channel, hulu, justintv, navix-x, project free tv stuff like that [21:25] bobweaver that's the likker for me [21:25] but I am not tying to "knock" XBMC it id s great app but not a DE [21:25] aaas, err, this is embarrasing. That should be the same functionality. What you just described as "coming in the next release of tvheadend", is by definition adding timeshifting as an afterthought [21:26] bobweaver i can go watch avatar right now (not to get into all the ethical stuff) [21:26] aaas, yeah lol [21:26] I have a watch sseries lens and project tv and many others and also a browser called chrome [21:27] tgm4883 well i dont think so, you just develop along the way, the timeshifting was always planned, but you take it a bit at a time... first you play back video, then you get an epg, then you scrape content, etc. etc.... i dont fault them for not having developed every feature at the same time [21:27] OMG you too [21:27] aaas, so it's only an afterthought if it's not your project? [21:27] bobweaver are you at a tv? or is it for a desktop [21:28] aaas, for everything [21:28] tgm4883 well it's an afterthought if it's not part of the project timeline [21:28] tv phone desktop tablet remote [21:28] bobweaver you have unity on your phone? or you mean you stream it [21:28] aaas, kinda like changing themes in xbmc but much more powerful [21:28] aaas, have you tested the upcoming tvheadend release yet? [21:29] aaas, I cn not afford a phone [21:29] tgm4883 i think im on stable [21:29] but I would if it was there [21:29] or I could fford it [21:29] bobweaver but hwat are you running this on? [21:29] bobweaver a home tv? [21:29] metacity or wayland [21:29] bobweaver or yoru desktop [21:29] oh everything ! [21:30] tv's desktops everything [21:30] bobweaver on your phone? [21:30] aaas, yes, on his phone [21:30] I can afford a phone or It would [21:30] and his tablet [21:30] and my netbooks [21:30] on his computers [21:30] bobweaver my streaming I mean you're not running unity on your phone right? or tablet [21:30] and my dishwasher [21:30] haha [21:30] yeah I am [21:31] aaas, no, it's not just a UPNP client [21:31] tgm4883 this is ubuntutv? [21:31] mock UP * [21:31] aaas, it might be difficult to explain since you don't use Unity [21:31] aaas, do you have an android phone? [21:31] aaas, maybe you would like to see more in a video ? [21:32] bobweaver im trying to watch one now [21:32] tgm4883 yes [21:32] aaas, ok, then you are familiar with android apps [21:32] ah ok so it's an app to unity [21:32] ok [21:33] aaas, so lets say any android app could run on anything running the android OS [21:33] eh, kinda [21:33] what OS DO you use? [21:33] ubuntu windows debian android [21:34] aaas, it is not a app it is a DE it is just like a new settings [21:34] ok [21:34] bah [21:34] brb [21:34] * tgm4883 stabs sharepoint [21:34] it looks cool [21:34] but if ou do not like Unity then you are not going to like it Well that would be my guess [21:34] I have a way better analogy when I get back [21:35] * bobweaver takes the plastic knife away from tgm4883 [21:35] well thats the thing.... how do your run it on a phone? [21:35] aaas, ubuntu runs on ARM [21:35] tgm4883 so you have to rmove your android rom and install ubuntu? [21:35] ^^ and you can chroot [21:36] aaas, yes [21:36] or via the APP [21:36] no * [21:36] you can chroot and vnc in and have it all [21:36] ok vnc is super slow you should not be streaming your media that way [21:36] correct [21:37] that is why there is work being done but there is also the option of rom but that is not here [21:37] or at least I think that there is [21:37] ok so my setup is like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NR57ELY28s [21:37] those are for all the frontends [21:38] each cost $35 [21:38] wait you are running on pi for frontend ? [21:38] plus $15 for a wifi if you need it [21:38] xbmc [21:38] ubuntu cant run on the pi yet [21:38] it's arm6 [21:38] pi is also slow [21:38] yes [21:38] but... [21:38] aaas, ever look at pandaboards? [21:38] it's $35 [21:38] IIRC, Ubuntu doesn't run on Pi [21:38] too expensive [21:38] no it doesnt [21:38] because it's arm6 [21:38] Ubuntu developers run on Pie though ;) [21:39] but debian does and .... [21:39] so with a $15 wifi [21:39] i can get 1080p [21:39] but it is slow [21:39] works fine [21:39] no [21:39] not at all [21:39] not the wifi [21:39] aaas, that is only h.264 decoding right? [21:39] no anything [21:39] matroska [21:39] nice [21:39] mpeg2? [21:39] windows media center video [21:39] mepg2 you need a codec from the foundation [21:39]