[00:01] <mishagale> Just found excellent workaround: $ xrandr --output LVDS1 --panning 1024x800
[00:01] <penguin42> what does --panning do ?
[00:01] <mishagale> Now have extra 200 lines of "virtual" desktop
[00:01] <penguin42> ah, that
[00:01] <mishagale> penguin42, it makes your desktop larger than your physical display, moving mouse to edge pans view
[00:05] <penguin42> ok
[00:05] <daftykins> happy Christmas Eve's Eve all >:)
[00:06]  * penguin42 pre-jingles
[00:06] <daftykins> ^_^
[00:06] <mishagale> Here in Mexico it is still the 22nd
[00:08] <daftykins> :)
[00:17] <BigRedS> I need to install Ubuntu on an early Intel mac mini. I guess the standard amd64 CD image will work - is there a more appropriate one to use?
[00:18] <daftykins> wouldn't have thought so, could be worth trying to hit up some guides though
[00:18] <BigRedS> googling's actually made me less sure that it should work
[00:18] <daftykins> have you got finite CD-R's?
[00:19] <BigRedS> yeah, but I have a USB stick and unetbootin
[00:20] <daftykins> ah
[00:20] <BigRedS> I don't have an apple keyboard which I think did confuse things with this machine once before
[00:20] <daftykins> i suppose you'll have to see how friendly the EFI is :)
[00:20] <BigRedS> Lots of people reckon it'll Just Work on recent Apple hardware and I don't suppose BIOS emulation's something they've particularly worked on
[00:20] <daftykins> ah
[00:20] <BigRedS> haha, yeah
[00:20] <penguin42> BigRedS: I'm not sure you can get to the boot on them without an apple keyboard
[00:21] <penguin42> BigRedS: Also, just check it's 64bit, I'm fairly sure the first Intel macs were 32bit only
[00:21] <daftykins> alt should work fine, that's your key to hold down for different boot devices
[00:22] <shauno> unetbootin may confuse issues more than it doesn't.  their bios emulation only targets a few narrow use-cases
[00:23] <BigRedS> penguin42: it's a c2d I think. But it does have a working OS, so it's worth checking for certain
[00:23] <BigRedS> shauno: I guess it's basically there for Windows to work?
[00:24] <penguin42> they didn't have bios emulation on the 1st ones
[00:24] <shauno> right.  so it'll do legacy-emulation from internal optical, bios/mbr emulation from internal hdd, and usb may as well not exist
[00:24] <BigRedS> ahhh
[00:24] <BigRedS> cool
[00:24] <BigRedS> better get some CDs tomorrow!
[00:25] <shauno> ymmv, of course, just don't give up straight away if unetbootin doesn't render bootable results
[00:32] <daftykins> wow, asked my friends in the US to text that guy that kept signing me up to his email. he gave them a call and it turns out *drumroll* his email is mine with '8' on the end :>
[00:33] <daftykins> oops signing my email up to his stuff, rather
[00:33] <dwatkins> daftykins: so he just keeps getting his e-mail address wrong?
[00:33]  * dwatkins suspects this is the case with his namesake
[00:34] <daftykins> seems it somehow gets lost in translation either over the phone or in person at shops
[00:34] <daftykins> as i'm a Dave, i see spam for 'Dotty', requests for 'Dustin' (this guy) to go and provide after-school tuition for kids
[00:35] <daftykins> in the past i discovered some other guy who i managed to find the real email for, somehow, who then started asking me what my family tree was like to see if we were related
[00:35] <daftykins> think that was a Daniel
[00:35] <daftykins> heh
[00:36] <daftykins> definitely seems interesting being quick on a new email service (this was gmail back in the early invite days)
[00:37] <daftykins> dwatkins: do you get something similar? :)
[00:38] <shauno> I used to quite persistently get something similar.  although my address was first.last, and although we shared a surname, this chap called kevin kept using my address
[00:38] <daftykins> ! weird
[00:39] <daftykins> heh, oops sorry lubotu3 :P
[00:39] <shauno> eventually he had it attached to his vodafone account, so I logged in and sent him a webtext from his own number asking him to quit it.  and he did
[00:40] <daftykins> :D
[00:40] <daftykins> i've heard that so many times, you eventually have to just use their accounts ja
[00:40] <daftykins> this time i got a Best Buy email with his mobile # so i just set about trying to contact :D
[00:41] <shauno> well when it's the only communication you have with them, it's the only avenue past simply ignoring it
[00:50] <mgdm> is it possible to disable Unity's behaviour on hitting alt?
[00:52] <ali1234> yes
[00:53] <ali1234> it's done in ccsm
[00:53] <mgdm> ah, I dn't have that installed as I wasn't sure if it worked
[00:53] <ali1234> it does
[00:53] <ali1234> 99% of configuration of unity is done there
[00:53] <mgdm> I had 'MyUnity', which served to sort some things
[00:54] <ali1234> that's useless
[00:54] <ali1234> it just hits some of the same config keys
[00:57] <mgdm> ooh, toys
[00:57] <mgdm> any idea which setting governs that?
[00:57] <ali1234> what, the alt key? "key to show the HUD" or something
[00:57] <mgdm> oh, got it
[00:58] <ali1234> i can't check because i don't have unity plugin installed
[00:58] <mgdm> s'fine
[00:59] <mgdm> now alt does nothing, which isn't brilliant, but certainly better than it was
[00:59] <ali1234> well you can map it to a different plugin quite easily
[00:59] <ali1234> what do you want it to do?
[00:59] <ali1234> open the first menu on selected window?
[00:59] <mgdm> essentially, yes
[00:59] <mgdm> 'do what it has done since Windows was invented'
[00:59] <ali1234> hmm
[00:59] <ali1234> yeah would be nice
[01:00] <ali1234> that might be the one thing it can't do
[01:00] <mgdm> well, nothing is closer to what i want than the HUD is, so I'll survive
[01:00] <ali1234> yeah i disabled it too
[01:00] <mgdm> I wouldn't mind so much, if it took less than 4 seconds to show up
[01:01] <ali1234> then i forgot because i never even accidentally activated it
[01:01] <ali1234> i reported a bug about that the day after it was released
[01:01] <mgdm> I'm using a Mac keyboard, which means i hit the wrong button fairly frequently
[01:03] <Azelphur> ali1234: that remote of mine, the color buttons don't even show up when I'm catting /dev/input/eventx, is it meant to do that?
[01:03] <ali1234> i think showing first menu by alt would be a gtk responsibility (or qt or whatever)
[01:03] <ali1234> Azelphur: i dunno. at the very least you should see "unknown event"
[01:04] <ali1234> or "unmapped key" or "unknown key" errors or something
[01:04] <Azelphur> I'm doing cat /dev/input/eventX and looking at it raw, it shows up for the number keys, but nothing at all for the colors
[01:04] <ali1234> well don't do that
[01:04] <ali1234> use evtest or whatever
[01:04] <ali1234> and look at the driver too
[01:04] <ali1234> look at the hid descriptors
[01:05] <ali1234> this is all same as we did on the g19 stuff
[01:05] <Azelphur> yea, it doesn't show up in evtest either
[01:05] <Azelphur> indeed, it's similar, not sure how to look at hid descriptors though.
[01:06] <Azelphur> this is interesting...the volume control keys on the remote work
[01:06] <Azelphur> but they don't show up in evtest
[01:07] <Azelphur> the remote is split into two devices, haha, but neither of them pick up the colors
[01:08] <ali1234> is it using the standard hid device?
[01:08] <ali1234> check dmesg
[01:09] <Azelphur> what am I looking for in dmesg? evtest says that both devices are a mouse xD
[01:10] <dwatkins> daftykins: no, I don't think the set designer with my name is aware I exist - hopefully he hasn't lost any work as a result of giving out the wrong e-mail address - I did tell the people involved
[01:14] <daftykins> dwatkins: heh, set designer? for films etc?
[01:16] <dwatkins> daftykins: yeah, I think so - you can even look up the other Dominic Watkins on imdb.
[01:17] <dwatkins> This is not me: http://uk.imdb.com/name/nm0914291/
[01:18] <dwatkins> oh sorry, Production Designer and Art Director
[01:19] <penguin42> you mean you weren't born into a family of legendary stilton makers?
[01:19] <dwatkins> hehe no
[02:10] <daftykins> i'd have totally asked for free cheese :(
[03:06] <daftykins> http://i.imgur.com/IAAao.jpg
[03:06] <daftykins> aww yeah, a bit of old Peculier
[10:31] <brobostigon> good morning everyone,
[10:32] <daftykins> heyup
[10:32]  * daftykins tips hat
[10:32] <brobostigon> morning daftykins
[10:36] <jacobw> morning
[10:36] <brobostigon> morning jacobw
[10:54] <AlanBell> morning all
[10:54] <brobostigon> morning AlanBell
[10:57] <jacobw> how the festive period?
[11:16] <daubers> Morning
[11:19] <daftykins> daubers: yo
[11:19] <daftykins> daubers: the lovely situ you'd enjoy is the dying of 4 disks at once in an 8-disk RAID6 :>
[11:19] <daftykins> 1500 bad sectors on one, 50-ish on a second, ECC error on a third and ~12 bad sectors on a fourth
[11:19] <daftykins> aww ye
[11:20] <daubers> daftykins: Lovely! Hope you had a backup :)
[11:21] <daftykins> 8D for the important stuff yup. client elected not to be worried about backing up the 6TB of imaged DVD films of his collection
[11:21] <daubers> heh :)
[11:21] <daftykins> it may still be rescued mind, waiting on RMA's from WD
[11:21] <daubers> Good luck
[11:21] <daftykins> ^_^ thanks
[11:22] <daubers> That's the reason I tend to not use WD drives. I've seen that happen a few times in RAIDs of WD
[11:22] <daftykins> aww :(
[11:22] <daftykins> they seem the best for warranty length still
[11:22] <daftykins> they're WD2002FYPS' that are going wonky
[11:22] <daftykins> they email'd to ask if it's alright that the replacements will be WD2003FYYS :>
[11:22] <daftykins> bit of a laugh to ask imo
[11:23] <daubers> heh :)
[11:23] <daftykins> i'm not even sure the approach i might take
[11:24] <daftykins> i guess pull just the worst hit with bad sectors to start, and watch it rebuild
[11:24] <daftykins> then pull the next worst, etc
[11:24] <daftykins> i suppose with the double parity of 6, i could pull two at once and rebuild, but something about it seems risky
[11:24] <daubers> Yeah. You should get away with just 12 bad sectors on one of them
[11:25] <daubers> I'd do it one at a time!
[11:25] <daubers> Just in case
[11:25] <daftykins> :)
[11:25] <daftykins> ta
[11:25] <daftykins> once they eventually show up :D
[11:26] <daubers> I have rescued RAIDs in that kind of state by DD'ing a bad-ish disk to a good one before
[11:26] <daubers> Sometimes works
[11:26] <daftykins> ah-har
[11:27] <daftykins> full on dd or that dd-rescue that can dance over bad sectors?
[11:27] <daubers> dd-rescue might be better in this instance
[11:27] <daubers> I've used both at times :)
[11:28] <daftykins> he's considering getting more storage next
[11:28] <daftykins> though now this has happened he might be put off, as i advertised it as a nice safe system XD
[11:28] <SuperEngineer> daftykins: FIO... www.grc.com/sr/spinrite.htm some claim superb results but zero experience of it myself
[11:29] <daftykins> mmm i know the name
[11:29] <daubers> I've used both at times :) For a "safe" RAID I'd use different batches of drives from different manufacturers. For a fast RAID I'd use matched.
[11:29] <daftykins> thanks
[11:30] <daubers> Hmm, silly keyboard
[11:30] <daubers> Could do with a new one in the sales
[11:30] <daftykins> i'm almost curious as to whether the WD Red drives are worth considering, only 3 yr warranty as opposed to enterprise grade 5yr though
[11:30] <daftykins> and... would mean going WD again ;)
[11:31] <daubers> I'd get Hitachi ones....
[11:31] <daubers> Hitachi 2TB enterprise drives seem to be quite reliable. 3TB are ok, but we see a lot of those fail in the first year or so
[11:32] <daubers> Though I doubt your customer is abusing it as much as our end users do...
[11:32] <daftykins> :D
[11:33] <daftykins> nah just mass media storage really
[11:33] <daubers> :)
[11:33] <daftykins> in some ways i wonder if i shouldn't be running ECC RAM hosts
[11:35] <daftykins> i'll have to do some burn-in too
[11:35] <daubers> Doesn't make much difference tbh. Mostly with these things it depends how good the RAID cards are, and to some extents your CPU and NICs
[11:36] <daftykins> interesting
[11:40]  * daubers turns off the reprap
[12:39] <popey> pip pip
[12:43] <penguin42> hey Popey
[14:12] <dutchie> o/
[14:17] <solarcloud> Afternoonings.
[14:20] <solarcloud> Bannana's & Frosted SHredded Wheat,300grm = 70p + 32p from Tesco = Good addition to Order list ( Not a euphamism ).
[14:46] <popey> bigcalm, http://blog.gitlabhq.com/gitlab-4-release/
[15:37] <MartijnVdS> Some festive music :) https://soundcloud.com/ed-harcourt/the-devil-came-down-the-chimney
[15:43] <AlanBell> that is rather good MartijnVdS
[15:43] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: Ed Harcourt makes nice music :)
[15:44] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: waiting for his new album
[16:55] <solarcloud_3scrn> Wikimapia .. never a good import .. http://goo.gl/nMzOk
[16:59] <directhex> moo
[17:01] <cliftonts> hi all, anyone have any ideas for a laptop which has worked fine until an upgrade to 12.10 and now the GPU runs hot?
[17:04] <solarcloud_3scrn> cliftonts, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221162835313?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649 bit like this one .. http://goo.gl/3cFDQ
[17:04] <popey> cliftonts, what make/model of laptop?
[17:05] <cliftonts> no idea what I should be looking at there solarcloud
[17:05] <cliftonts> dell studio 1557
[17:05] <solarcloud_3scrn> cliftonts, You didn't click both links :(
[17:05] <cliftonts> we had cpu scaling issues in 12.04 but that seems ok now
[17:06] <cliftonts> there were two links?
[17:06] <solarcloud_3scrn> there you go ...
[17:07] <popey> cliftonts, http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1553968
[17:07] <SuperEngineer> AlanBell, popey re the discussion on -discuss atm. I've watched the questions for a couple of days now, can't get the word "journalist" out of my mind
[17:07] <popey> eh?
[17:07] <cliftonts> solarcloud I see 2 laptops for sale, what does that have to do with me?
[17:08] <cliftonts> Thanks popey
[17:08] <solarcloud_3scrn> cliftonts, "anyone have any ideas for a laptop" .. guess i missread .. You should have said 'used' laptop. :)
[17:22] <cliftonts> I think you're beating up the wrong bush entirely solarcloud
[17:33] <cliftonts> Looks like it's sorted anyway
[17:33] <cliftonts> seems the frequency scaling had died
[18:05] <ubuntubhoy> AlanBell: did you update your shopper extension to include the price ?
[18:07] <AlanBell> I did, yes
[18:07] <AlanBell> oh, didn't update the zip file probably
[18:07] <AlanBell> I also got it to connect to my server over https
[18:09] <ubuntubhoy> fancy throwing it out again ?
[18:29] <neuro> mornin all
[18:34] <popey> lo
[18:41] <AlanBell> ubuntubhoy: sure, I will do an update later
[18:41] <AlanBell> popey: doing your christmas shopping tomorrow?
[18:41]  * neuro wonders if ubuntubhoy is an actual Bhoy
[18:41] <directhex> moo moo
[18:41] <neuro> ancients of
[18:42] <popey> AlanBell, yup
[18:42] <ubuntubhoy> neuro: very much so - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celtic_F.C.
[18:43] <ubuntubhoy> AlanBell: cheers
[18:43] <neuro> mon the hoops :)
[18:43] <ubuntubhoy> :D
[18:44] <neuro> looking forward to juve in feb
[18:44] <ubuntubhoy> yip
[18:44] <ubuntubhoy> kinda think we have a chance
[18:44] <ubuntubhoy> albeit a slight one
[18:44] <neuro> me too but don't want to get hopes up
[18:44] <ubuntubhoy> yeah
[18:45] <neuro> kinda puts all the politics rubbish from the league into perspective :)
[18:45] <neuro> last 16 baby!
[18:45] <ubuntubhoy> haha
[18:46] <ubuntubhoy> miss the old firm games though
[18:46] <neuro> i don't actually
[18:47] <neuro> i don't miss glasgow turning into a fear zone for 24h
[18:47] <neuro> i don't miss the eejits in the stands
[18:47] <neuro> i don't miss the gers trying to foul their way to a win
[18:47] <neuro> granted the spl may be less "exciting", but we have the champs league to make up for it
[18:48] <ubuntubhoy> see, I work in a pub, and I always hated old firm days
[18:48] <neuro> and with the gers out the way, it gives the other spl teams a chance to reach the CL and europa
[18:48] <ubuntubhoy> but I do miss that buzz in the belly
[18:48] <neuro> so they get a nice spread of the cash and the attention
[18:48] <ubuntubhoy> I agree with that
[18:48] <ubuntubhoy> but maybe a little cup final in may to pump them
[18:48] <neuro> and moar cash into the spl means moar good players being either trained up or bought in
[18:49] <neuro> i'd prefer the former, obviously
[18:49] <neuro> grassroots++
[18:49] <ubuntubhoy> yeah
[18:49] <neuro> aye, cup final would be good actually :)
[18:49] <neuro> i must admit
[18:49] <ubuntubhoy> yip
[18:49] <neuro> cos right now they're on easy street (ish)
[18:49] <neuro> i say ish because look at their away record :D
[18:50] <neuro> anyway, don't want to hassle all these good ubuntu people with fitba talk, just glad to see a fellow tim in attendance
[18:50] <ubuntubhoy> +1 ^^
[18:50] <neuro> oh it's a grand old game to play for ... etc ;)
[18:51] <ubuntubhoy> haha
[18:51] <neuro> WHEN!
[18:51] <neuro> YOU KNOW!
[18:51] <neuro> THE HISTORY!
[18:51] <neuro> hearing that in parkhead being sung by like 50,000 people always gives me the goose bumps
[18:51] <neuro> ANYWAY, he said not talking about football anymore ... :)
[18:52] <neuro> anyone know of any good ubuntu/puppet tutorials?
[18:52] <neuro> i'm pondering redoing my home infra from scratch and figure it might be a good way to learn
[18:53] <neuro> new years resolution, replace crusty old 8.04->10.04 bastion host and 10.04 dhcp server :)
[18:56]  * neuro takes the silence as a 'no' :)
[18:57] <cliftonts> evening all. Anybody have any idea why the python command 'from serial.tools import list_ports' is producing the error 'ImportError: No module named tools'?
[19:13] <directhex> hm, gaming press is ablaze with stories about ubuntu
[19:17] <popey> stories full of assumption and misunderstanding
[19:19] <bashrc> scurrilous rumours?
[19:27] <penguin42> popey: How far out from London are you to need to get up at 6?
[19:27] <popey> farnborough
[19:28] <popey> need time for brekkie, dress kids etc :)
[19:28] <directhex> popey, can't go wrong with a good scandal
[19:29] <penguin42> heck, you're practically next to London already
[19:29] <popey> hah
[19:29] <penguin42> not like getting there from Manc
[19:31] <penguin42> as a kid I remember we took one of the old really slow night trains down in the summer, it was great, got in about 5-6am when it was still very quiet, wondered around pretty much deserted landmarks
[19:33] <directhex> i've been quite tempted by a night train to europe through the alps
[19:34] <directhex> like to italy or something
[19:34] <directhex> we don't want to fly with the baby until he's old enough that we're not The Parents Flying With A Baby
[20:01] <AlanBell> 18 then
[20:03] <AlanBell> popey: I am going to london too I think, but you will probably be there before me :
[20:03] <popey> I'm leaving ~7am
[20:13] <penguin42> some of the sales have already started in Manc, I guess London as well - most will probably start boxing day though
[20:19] <penguin42> (I'm one jumper and two towels and one pack of labels into the sales so far :-)
[20:24] <AlanBell> we don't have any shopping to do, I am just taking one or possibly two offspring up to look around and do touristy stuff perhaps
[20:50] <ubuntubhoy> insult the locals, and have your wallet stolen ??
[22:20] <bigcalm> Good evening peeps :)