=== Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [04:05] hello [04:13] 0o [08:27] mornin [09:45] Morning [10:04] good morning everyone, [11:48] Here's my 27thDec'12 present anyway ... http://goo.gl/7DEur [http://books.slashdot.org/] ... anyone want the xsane-scan ?? === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [12:37] popey: Hmm that Ouya looks neat, nice physical design, sounds cheap, not sure it'll do much for games, but should work nice to run Linux [12:41] penguin42, Best thing is .. 'OUYA' is not registered on ebay as a seller name .. so I guess it's all poster's and buyer's market (in mini-HDMI Leads.) [13:12] penguin42, yeah, I backed it, so keen to see it succeed [13:15] popey: Will the Ubuntu ARM version run on that system? Could make a killer TV/Web Browsing box with that 1.6 GHz Quad Core Tegra in it [13:15] could do [13:16] could be a better set top box than rpi [13:17] but I'm more interested in it as a games machine [13:17] tricky though given it's not got touch at all, so many games will need some thought [13:17] popey: That's just down to lazy devs not considering different input methods so if game devs wake up and start considering stuff it could be very good [13:18] not really [13:18] Android always was designed for phones and tablets [13:18] so not "lazy" for devs to think their games would have a touch screen [13:18] Yeah but for years now you've been able to have keyboards and mice connected [13:18] but nobody does [13:18] True, lazy was the wrong word. I mean, they may have otherlooked it [13:19] nobody connects a keyboard/mouse to their phone! [13:19] True, I do on my tablet tho [13:19] that's only happened in the last 18 months [13:19] since the TF101 and friends arrived [13:19] Thought it was longer, sorry [13:20] yeah, feels like it doesn't it? [13:20] android seems to move on pretty quick [13:20] Haha yeah, I'm just happy that Linux based stuff is getting more and more common [13:20] I keep overlooking how short a time it's actually been prominent in the market [13:20] easy to do when you use it daily [13:22] Interesting project anyway, hope it takes off because it could be really special. The pricetag is very attractive, I know a lot of casual gamers who'd probably be interested. Are you getting a developer edition one? [13:23] no [13:34] popey: Well I suppose the keyboard/mouse thing was there on the early transformers and on the early Toshiba netbook thing [13:34] yeah, the AC100 didn't even have a touch screen [13:35] * popey looks at the ac100 under his desk [13:35] yeh, that's why it died a death [13:35] popey: Thing is the ARM stuff moves pretty quickly so those guys are going to have to make sure it lands on time, otherwise it's going to look **yawn** compared to quad A15 things with more RAM etc [13:37] Good afternoon peeps :) [13:40] yeah [13:40] it's a shame that netbooks are apparently dead. I use one quite regularly [13:46] popey: I didn't know you have an ac100 [13:46] yeah, it's running ubuntu for testing compiz on arm [13:46] popey: Japanese keyboard? [13:46] no, uk [13:47] ! [13:47] How the heck did you get that? [13:47] we had to get ours from Japan IIRC [13:48] ebay 2nd hand [13:48] ah [13:49] i wouldn't taint myself with second hand wares. :) [13:49] model AC100-10U [13:49] tempted to make it an all-text machine [13:49] remove the GUI completely and just use text based apps [13:50] Model: PDN01-00HO1C [13:50] mine has X, but is mostly accessed via ssh TBH === kdjd is now known as GentileBen [14:58] Why doesn't copying 300Gb to an external USB drive happen instantly...I've run out of patience, I want to get it properly installed, but need to wait until I've copied a stack of data over [14:58] because it's a USB-2 spinny disk? === Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away [15:01] Heh [16:30] So I tried clicking the upgrade button on the update manager to go to 12.0.4 and it sort of worked, but a bunch of my programmes are broken. So I downloaded a disk image to reinstall from the DVD instead. The disk is teling me that if I reinstall, it will delete all my photos and data. Does it actually wipe out my home directory? I've made a backup, but would really prefer it if I could just keep the home dir. Does anybody have exp [16:30] erience with this? [16:43] celesteh, hi [16:44] if you reinstall and choose to manually partition and choose _not_ to format the partition, it will reinstall over the top, keeping whatever you have in /home [16:45] cheers, popey. when it asks me to create a user later on, do i have to make sure to pick a new user name? [16:45] no, use the same username and password as your previous install [16:54] cheers! [16:58] my nexus 4 arrived [16:58] * Azelphur does happy dance [17:00] * MartijnVdS waits for an LTE Nexus [17:15] and already got a buyer for my Galaxy S3, 3 hour turn over xD [18:48] MartijnVdS: nexus 4 is already kind-of LTE, but it only supports half the frequencies [18:48] so it only works in some countries on some providors [18:50] ali1234: it is? interesting [18:51] you need rom hack too of course [18:51] cool [18:51] LTE is rubbish anyway [18:51] yea, it's a bit useless in this country as of yet [18:51] over priced, over hyped [18:51] I ain't payin £40/mo for mobile [18:51] £12.90 is more my speed :P [18:52] it won't actually improve speeds for individuals anyway, not when everyone has it [18:53] hehe [18:54] Azelphur: what app were you using to play with NFC? [18:54] ali1234: to read credit cards? squareless [18:55] is it free? [18:55] yep [19:12] Azelphur: it does not work on my cards [19:12] it makes a funny noise when i move the card near but then it says "read failed" [19:16] ali1234: might not be holding it near it for long enough, it can be fiddly [19:16] it's worked on every credit card I've tried [19:22] did you find somehwre to buy blank nfc tags? [19:23] ali1234: nope [19:23] rapidnfc.com looks good they have all kinds of stuff with nfc tags in them [19:27] nice [19:29] blackadder the third, bbc2, now, :) [20:13] Anyone know how I can tell if my computer is connected on 802.11g or 802.11n? [20:13] Trying to debug a network speed issue, doing ssh root@dd-wrt cat /dev/zero and only getting 40-400KB/sec mostly [20:15] something like iwconfig? [20:15] says it's connected at 144.4Mb/s with a link quality of 65/70 [20:15] you could test with netcat to rule-out the encryption as the cause [20:16] dwatkins: how would I do that? :P [20:16] or ttcp, that's even easier Azelphur - are the machines accessible directly, i.e. can you open a port on one that's visible on the other? [20:17] dwatkins: I got my computer (Linux) connected to a DD-WRT router [20:17] that's what I'm using to test, although my end goal is to make 1080p streaming work off my HTPC [20:17] Azelphur, intel wifi? [20:17] Belkin Components F5D8053 N Wireless USB Adapter v1000/v4000 [Ralink RT2870] [20:18] Azelphur: do you have another machine on the same network to test with? [20:18] yes [20:18] not sure if my laptop does N, I'll take a look. [20:20] I'd just click on network manager and connection info [20:20] to see what speed it's connected at [20:21] or run nm-tool [20:21] ethtool should tell the link speed, too [20:21] ...if you're a command line junkie like me ;) [20:22] my laptop only connects at 54mb/sec, but it gets 1MB/sec throughput with ssh cat /dev/zero [20:22] although it is very spikey, much like how it is with my PC only a bit faster [20:23] looking very similar basically, so the problem is likely in the router [20:24] guess I'll update dd-wrt and see if that resolves it [20:25] ah, it's called 'nttcp' now [20:25] that should test the bare throughput [20:26] i use iperf to test connections [20:26] or not, seems I'm already on the latest build [20:27] I'm using wireless 'n' but also 100 MBit, so I only get about 5 Megabytes per second between machines. [20:28] yea, I'd be fine if I could stream 1080p video via lan :P [20:28] I can stream 1080p on this connection. [20:29] ooh, nice - iperf gives much easier to read output, cheers popey [20:29] yea I'm in the process of trying out iperf :P [20:30] 2.26mbit/sec between me and my HTPC [20:30] although my HTPC is only connected at 802.11g [20:31] 1080p is a massive bandwidth hog [20:31] Azelphur: How's the TV? [20:31] penguin42: the 55"? it's good, I like it [20:31] I hooked up XBMC and it's all going well [20:31] cool - I need to forcibly find some more wall room [20:31] it takes like 15 seconds to turn on which is a little annoying. [20:31] ouch [20:31] Azelphur: So does our Sony [20:32] Azelphur: I think that's it's Linux boot for some reason [20:32] most of that is showing a furrion logo, which is odd seens as it's not even a smart TV. [20:32] does it have freeview? (of course it does) [20:32] that epg takes a while to boot up... [20:33] yea it does [20:33] even my monitor takes about 5 seconds to turn on [20:34] please wait: percolating naval [20:34] * penguin42 blames it all on Flash [20:35] (the hardware not the software) [20:35] where does that "please wait: reticulating splines" gag come from? [20:35] oh right, sim city 2000, of course [20:36] just timed it, 16.6 seconds to turn on [20:36] Azelphur: nice [20:36] that's not from cold, that's from standby [20:36] aw [20:36] lol [20:37] that's not bad for a completely unoptimized linux firmware [20:38] but yea I'm happy with it, and most of the people who see it think it's awesome [20:38] definitely good bang for buck at only £400 :P [20:38] nod, I really don't have room for it unfortunately [20:38] when someone tells me I don't have room for screens I buy more screens [20:39] well a jumbo jet is awesome too, doesn't mean i want one in my living room :P [20:39] haha [20:39] Azelphur: Well I think I'd have to move the door to get enough wall space for it [20:39] it looks fine :P [20:39] * penguin42 wonders what the size of a 1920x1080 pixel is on a 55" set [20:40] I'm uploading a photo of it now [20:40] 33^2 + 44^2 = 55^2 [20:41] oh wait I already have some of up close [20:41] except it's 16:9 [20:41] good try :-) [20:41] https://www.dropbox.com/s/3ua8iy2hp6z8ytw/2012-12-27%2004.49.39.jpg?m [20:41] (good news everyone, I've made an invention that displays IRC highlights on my TV!") [20:42] but also gives you a good idea what it looks like :p [20:42] 40dpi? [20:43] (16*x)^2 + (9*x)^2 = 55^2 -> x = 2.996 [20:43] nod and *16=47.9 [20:43] then 1920/47,9 gives 40 [20:43] yeah, 40dpi [20:44] https://www.dropbox.com/s/3ua8iy2hp6z8ytw/2012-12-27%2004.49.39.jpg?m is what it looks like from the couch (excuse the mess, just moved in and still unpacking/sorting things :p) [20:45] 0.6mm [20:46] Azelphur: It's the same link. Copy/Paste error? [20:46] whoops [20:47] https://www.dropbox.com/s/6si28g9slvjw55x/2012-12-28%2020.40.23.jpg [20:47] Azelphur: Oh yea, you need to clean your room sir [20:47] lol [20:47] i was just about to say the same thing [20:47] indeed, I'm sorting through all the boxes of stuff, havn't really got any storage units to put anything into yet [20:48] ikea is set to deliver me some drawers and stuff after new years, then I'll have places to put things [20:48] kinda hard to tidy up in an unfurnished apartment :p [20:48] excuses [20:48] "this goes...on the floor...that goes...on the other floor" [20:48] heh [20:49] Azelphur: Of course with a TV that big you could just hide it all behind it [20:49] penguin42: true [20:49] "these cloths go in the chest of---floor." [20:49] or at that price just buy a few more and make a false wall [20:49] xD [20:49] haha [20:50] hmm, you could do a 'cave' - i.e. a 5 sided cube with your head in the middle [20:50] penguin42: you havn't seen the desk I've got on the way from ikea :P [20:50] https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/misc/2012/December/layout.png [20:51] hmm, not IPs, hmm what are those numbers? [20:51] w/h/d ? [20:51] ikea part numbers [20:51] ah [20:51] I thought they just called everything Fnuglehurfs or something [20:51] they have names too [20:51] all of that is galant [20:52] (That's probably very unfamily friendly in some language, in which case I apologise) [20:53] but yea when the desk arrives I'll have lots of space to put things [20:53] http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/categories/departments/workspaces/18960/ [20:53] galant! [20:53] * soreau stomps off in disgust [20:53] don't hate my galant :o [20:54] was the only thing I could find that would give me the shape I wanted at reasonable quality [20:54] and a sane price [20:54] * penguin42 has contiplas and the metal wall strips+brackets [20:55] hehe I'm not much on DIY so didn't like the ikea of my first project being a desk to hold ~£2000 worth of computer equipment [20:55] s/ikea/idea [20:55] nod [20:56] apparently you can get old 'brown' furniture quite cheaply - some of it's built like a tank; I'd be tempted to use that [20:56] yea, the stuff I ordered is the black/brown ikea galant :p [20:56] Azelphur: I was thinking more about pre-50s real wood stuff that's way out of fashion [20:58] ah [20:58] doubt I could get anything in that shape though, it actually measures down to a few mm off the sides of the room [20:58] perfect fit :p [21:03] we have a fair amount of ikea furniture, it's worked out well for us [21:09] good to hear :D === Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte [21:35] I'm trying to connect to sipgate (port 5060 UDP) but my brother has that port forwarded to himself, any suggestions on how I can workaround this? [21:36] Azelphur: Get your brother drunk and reconfigure your router? [21:36] haha, nah, he has those ports forwarded for the exact same reason i want them [21:37] and, I'm borrowing his internet connection until mine gets activated in February, so he gets priority. [21:50] Azelphur: router is too rubbish to forward an alternate one is it? [21:50] differing source and destination ports i mean [21:51] it's a client rather than a server [21:51] I need to connect to port 5060 elsewhere, so there can only ever be one port involved [21:51] ah [21:51] and the routers NAT is crap in that it doesn't work properly making it break :P [21:53] my minds drawing a blank [21:54] fun [21:55] today we mourn the loss of my Pioneer optical drive, in my desktop [21:55] no longer is it detected :( [21:55] may it rest in pieces (throw it out the window for fun) [21:56] ^_^ [22:00] is it me or was Ubuntu 10.4.4 too old to handle a SATA device being plugged in after boot? (LiveCD mode) [22:03] Unity's alt-tab thing is not exactly intuitive :( [22:10] this is amusing http://i.imgur.com/JqdVT.jpg [22:10] haha [23:02] that's great [23:03] i want a tiny couch for inside my computer now [23:04] Azelphur: what you need is a asterisk server to recieve incoming sip calls and then forward them to which ever computer... i guess... i never used sip [23:04] sounds long and complicated, probably better to just wait till feb when my net comes back \o/ [23:04] yes [23:04] nobody uses sip anyway [23:04] just get skype [23:05] speaking of skype, i wish canonical would just license the collabora skype stuff and integrate it properly into empathy [23:05] i might actually use empathy if they did that [23:05] of course collabora already integrated it, i mean integrate it properly into ubuntu [23:07] Microsoft haven't stopped Skype updating the Linux client then? [23:07] no, not that it matters [23:07] the collabora stuff doesn't need the skype client running that's why it is great [23:08] why avoid it? [23:08] it uses the libskype, which is only available under a specific paid license [23:08] because the client is horrid [23:08] it doesn't integrate properly into anything else [23:08] did you ever use a N900? [23:09] the old school Nokia phone? nah [23:09] notice that when you get a telephone call vs a skype call, the UI is exactly the same? [23:09] and a single address book too [23:09] you don't even have to think about it [23:09] same for skype chat vs text messaging vs anything else [23:09] they all appear in one place [23:10] i'm not sure that's important to me right now [23:10] well if you dn't use skype it wouldn't be [23:10] i have done but don't really plan to skype from my mobile? [23:10] or if you don't use anything else but skype [23:10] i do on the desktop [23:10] i've got irssi, Pidgin for MSN and Skype open right now [23:10] N900 is a desktop practically [23:11] it uses empathy [23:11] i'm 99% sure it uses the collabora libs, but they will never admit it [23:11] so it's all about having all your chat protocols in one client? [23:11] yes [23:12] because why would you want to use 3 different clients all with different interfaces? [23:12] the amazingly good skype integration on N900 is basically it's killer feature [23:12] more through lack of choice :) or effort to find anything [23:13] nobody cares about having X11 on a phone, seriously [23:13] hardly anyone even cares about having it on the desktop any more [23:14] +1 [23:14] "android isn't linux because it doesn't use X11" <- words of silly people [23:14] heh [23:14] i'm not really sure how we got onto that topic from what came before [23:15] i was saying ubuntu should license the same skype integration that wen into the maemo, because it's awesome and it will sell ubuntu [23:17] put it in the software center for paid if necessary, i don't care [23:17] just save me from the stupid skype UI [23:20] 303GB free of 5TB :( [23:21] 4 years later, another RAID setup at the end of its' life [23:21] 4 years isn't a bad life I guess - how many drives? [23:21] youch 28m to build an ubuntu kernel [23:22] delete stuff [23:22] (124 mins of cpu time) [23:23] yeah, probably will delete bad films etc :) [23:23] 6 disk that one, RAID 5 naturally [23:23] am i the only person who has only 1 hard disk? [23:23] (per computer) [23:23] ali1234: I think it's just down to us two [23:24] i am getting good at data recovery [23:24] ali1234: Although even I've got an SSD as well in my main machine [23:24] lol one? [23:24] i know ext3 inside out [23:24] i haven't had an ext4 drive die yet [23:24] ali1234: If you've got multiple machines, then rsync is very good! [23:25] i back up to the cloud [23:25] i've got an rsync setup for backing up a clients data to external HDDs over USB 2.0, i find it takes forever [23:25] * penguin42 backs just the critical stuff up to a small insignificantly sized usb stick, but very rarely [23:25] i was hoping it'd quickly look at the files missing, copy those and be done [23:25] daftykins: It has to figure out which are missing [23:26] sure but this takes hours [23:26] have they got many zillions of files ? [23:27] one set is a photo collection [23:27] but those are a few MB each? [23:27] i found rsync is quite fast at finding the missing files [23:27] yep [23:27] when i ran it in verbose mode, it seemed to be looking at every individual file in quite some detail [23:28] daftykins: That's odd, I wonder if you've got something else that's causing problems with the modification dates on the files [23:28] i took to running it in a screen session overnight to go back and check on [23:28] daftykins: Maybe something adding tags to the photos or the like? [23:28] if i ls -lR > foo.txt the directory i have to rsync, it takes several minutes - hours [23:28] shouldn't be [23:28] but rsync starts transfering files immediately [23:28] i don't know how it does it [23:29] maybe rsync does a lot more than i need it do [23:29] s/do/to/ [23:29] for me it's normally quite sane - it does take a little while to start for me, but never long [23:30] daftykins: Are both filesystems ext or is one fat? [23:30] XFS -> EXT4 [23:30] I'd like to blame XFS, but I can't actually think of a reason to [23:31] i chose it for his RAID as i heard it was good for large files [23:31] it is good for deleting large files [23:31] i always use it for my mythtv [23:31] heh [23:31] because deleting a 4GB file on ext4 takes forever [23:31] and hammers the disk [23:31] mythtv has that option "delete slowly" for this reason [23:32] oh, is that still an issue on ext4 - hmm [23:32] what does it do? zero the LBAs? XD [23:33] penguin42: dunno, might be ext4 only [23:35] i mean ext3 [23:35] apparently ext4 extents fixes it [23:37] ah good