[08:05] <diplo> Morning
[08:09] <TheOpenSourcerer> morning
[08:44] <daubers> 3Morning
[09:02] <JamesTait> Happy Friday, folks! :-D
[09:03] <daubers> Happy--
[09:22] <AlanBell> morning
[09:33] <popey> morning
[09:43] <Laney> yo
[09:44] <Laney> http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/tree/camera1357292581.png
[09:48] <brobostigon> good morning everyone,
[09:50] <SuperMatt> good morning me brobostigon
[09:51] <brobostigon> good morning SuperMatt
[09:51] <popey> Laney: those "decorations" need to come down before the 6th! Or a plague of locusts be upon you or something
[09:51] <Laney> that'll be a timelapse at the end of the day
[09:52] <Laney> it's one of those magic trees :D
[09:52] <popey> magic?
[09:52] <Laney> like http://www.instructables.com/id/Grow-your-own-Magic-Crystal-Tree-or-any-other-sha/
[09:52] <popey> i have a "magic" meerkat round here somewhere
[09:52] <popey> oh haha
[09:52] <popey> like the stupid bird one I did recently
[09:52] <Laney> although not home made (that's a cool idea)
[09:52] <czajkowski> Aloha
[09:52] <czajkowski> oh a laney
[09:53] <czajkowski> welcome back Laney
[09:53] <Laney> ello
[09:53] <Laney> getting up early today has hurt me
[09:55] <czajkowski> Laney: have you put away the christmas jumper?
[09:55] <Laney> I got a new one :D
[09:57] <czajkowski> dpnt put it in the washing machine :)
[09:57] <Laney> this one can be washed
[09:57] <Laney> it's not 100% wool ... ¬_¬
[09:58] <Laney> http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/jumper.jpg
[09:58] <Laney> ignore the weird face
[09:59] <czajkowski> heh
[09:59] <czajkowski> Nice jumper
[09:59] <diplo> Laney: That is awful! :)
[10:00] <popey> nice face ☺
[10:00] <Laney> >:|
[10:01] <Laney> I found out the pattern is called "fair isle"
[10:01] <Laney> so now I know what to look for to buy LOADS MORE
[10:02] <Laney> these left handed pens feel weird
[10:09] <mungojerry> left handed pen?
[10:10] <diplo> What does your better half think of them Laney ?
[10:10] <Laney> she gets me them
[10:10] <Laney> well, this one was from her parents actually
[10:11] <Laney> so I think it's a seal of approval :P
[10:13] <diplo> Oh dear....
[10:13] <diplo> :P
[10:19] <diplo> BigRedS: Did you have any luck with that app for android ?
[10:20] <BigRedS> I found something that claimed to do it, and have installed it, but haven't tested it yet
[10:20] <BigRedS> can't remember off the top of my head what it was, though :)
[10:20] <BigRedS> 'Setting Profiles Lite'
[10:22] <diplo> I'll let you test and let me know
[10:22] <diplo> :P
[10:22] <diplo> I'm very limited for space, really must try the hack mungo or someone in here tried expanding fs to sd card
[10:23] <mungojerry> yes that was me
[10:24] <mungojerry> brought new life to my phone
[10:25] <diplo> Will try soon
[10:25] <diplo> Wasn't sure if it was you so didn't want to highlight :P
[10:25] <mungojerry> somehow i've nearly used the extra 100mb i added :S
[10:27] <diplo> My sd card, say once amonth seems to unmount, what damage would that do to the phone ?
[10:28] <dwatkins> Is this 'Setting Profiles Lite', mungojerry, or just moving apps to the SD card?
[10:28] <BigRedS> I've tried app2sd which seems to have had no ill effect on the apps
[10:29] <mungojerry> it's S2E where you partition your SD card as SD-ext and your phone treats it has proper internal storage
[10:29] <dwatkins> Cyanogenmod has a built-in option to move an app to the SD card, I use it a lot to save internal space
[10:29] <mungojerry> app2sd still keeps filling up /data
[10:29] <mungojerry> the only proper fix is s2e ,
[10:30] <mungojerry> the only downside is seems to use a bit more battery, probably sd card gets spun down more often in normal use
[10:30] <diplo> dwatkins: yeah, I still don't have enough space, that's why I like mungojerry option
[10:30] <diplo> Must get off my arse :)
[10:31] <mungojerry> i wrote some instructions
[10:31] <mungojerry> did i send them to you?
[10:32] <diplo> Wrote some on here a while ago, but I didn't save them off :)
[10:32] <diplo> Was going to google s2e when I was ready
[10:34] <BigRedS> diplo: when you say it unmounts is that pure software? I keep having the SD card physically eject on my galaxy S2
[10:34] <BigRedS> which I suspect is the cause of it dying the other week
[10:40] <diplo> Software based yeah, my wildfire is all encased
[10:40] <diplo> Reboot the phone and it's fine
[10:42] <mungojerry> is anyone good at long words? i'm trying to think of a word and it's annoying me
[10:43] <mungojerry> it's a slightly obscure one, but my google-fu is failing me
[10:44] <popey> !ask
[10:44] <popey> ☺
[10:45] <mungojerry> :P
[10:46] <mungojerry> i was getting to it, but someone came to my desk
[10:46] <mungojerry> it's a word (long) that describes the radio5 type attitude of giving equal credence to views of a professor who has researched the subject for years, and a binman who has just phoned up while doing his rounds
[10:48] <popey> happy new year aptanet
[10:48] <popey> "balance" ☺
[10:49] <popey> sounds like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_man_on_the_Clapham_omnibus
[10:50] <mungojerry> its a long word like postsupralapsarian
[10:50] <aptanet> likewise popey  -  scary, I tried to put an @ before your nick then!!
[10:50] <popey> hah
[10:52] <Laney> beautiful south ♥
[10:52] <mungojerry> popey, got it
[10:52] <mungojerry> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultracrepidarianism
[10:53] <popey> blimey
[10:53] <mungojerry> its a useful word
[11:04] <mungojerry> the other word for the day is Zugzwang
[11:04] <popey> Numberwang™
[11:04] <davmor2> morning all
[11:30] <neuro> Wordwang!
[11:37] <mungojerry> how can i get weechat working on the command line with ssl?
[11:44] <dwatkins> I'd almost forgotten that IRC does SSL.
[11:44] <mungojerry> irc: cannot connect with SSL because WeeChat was                            | not built with GnuTLS support
[11:44] <mungojerry> meh, answers my que
[11:44] <mungojerry> this is not for freenode
[11:44] <dwatkins> ah ok
[11:45] <dwatkins> I'll just paste the link I was reading in case anyone else is curious: http://www.weechat.org/files/doc/devel/weechat_user.en.html
[11:50] <mungojerry> hmm irssi on these RH boxes doesn't seem to do it either
[11:50] <mungojerry> was trying to move to screen on an ssh host instead of using a bouncer
[11:52] <czajkowski> screen + irssi = win!
[11:53] <mungojerry> czajkowski, i'm not used to irssi, how do i do a simple one liner to connect?
[11:53] <kvarley> czajkowski: +1
[11:54] <mungojerry> on weechat i can do weechat-curses irc://user:pass@server
[11:54] <BigRedS> mungojerry: rhel? ew
[11:54] <BigRedS>  /connect <server name>
[11:54] <czajkowski> mungojerry: /connect irc .whatever
[11:54] <mungojerry> user/pass?
[11:54] <czajkowski> then /j to #channelname
[11:54] <kvarley> mungojerry: http://askubuntu.com/questions/61549/how-do-i-configure-irssi
[11:55]  * kvarley recently switched using that guide and a few searches on how to detach/reattach
[11:56] <czajkowski>  ctrl a+d to detach screen-r reattach
[12:00] <kvarley> Naming the sessions is useful too, I have a bunch of scripts on my pi to create a named session for irc, etc
[12:01] <kvarley> czajkowski: Is there any way for the terminal window to notify me when somebody mentions my name in chat though? That's one thing it's missing.
[12:02] <mungojerry> and does irssi have colours?
[12:02] <czajkowski> kvarley: yes highlight
[12:03] <kvarley> mungojerry: Yes, but you have to configure them yourself AFAIK
[12:03] <mungojerry> :(
[12:03] <czajkowski> mungojerry: I'm sure it does I dont really bother about them
[12:03] <mungojerry> weechat seems superior
[12:03] <czajkowski> name changes are highlighted yellow for me
[12:03] <AlanBell> you need more plugins mungojerry
[12:03] <kvarley> mungojerry: I'm sure people will have posted their own colour configs online tho
[12:03] <mungojerry> how to switch between channels ?
[12:04] <AlanBell> nickcolor.pl does colours
[12:04] <AlanBell> alt+left/right
[12:04] <kvarley> czajkowski: Ah yeah. I meant is there anyway for the window to take focus when my name is mentioned or something along those lines. It's the only thing I miss about Pidgin.
[12:04] <mungojerry> thanks
[12:04] <dwatkins> wow, I never knew about alt+left/right, thanks AlanBell :)
[12:04] <czajkowski> kvarley: god no!
[12:04] <czajkowski> :)
[12:05] <czajkowski> or ctrl p or n is handy
[12:05] <AlanBell> adv_windowlist.pl mouse.pl chanact.pl hilightwin.pl are all good things too
[12:05] <mungojerry> i want coloured nicks
[12:05] <czajkowski> but I;ve all my windows aliased so alt t goes to a spefic channel as does alt q,s,d,f,etc
[12:05] <czajkowski> mungojerry: I'm sure there is a plugin
[12:06] <mungojerry> yeah will have a look over lunch cheers guys
[12:06] <AlanBell> scriptassist.pl is a thing that you should install first then you can easily install other scripts
[12:07] <AlanBell> http://scripts.irssi.org/ is where they all come from
[12:08] <mungojerry> how to apply it please AlanBell ?
[12:08] <mungojerry> ah, i see top of that page
[12:11] <mungojerry> ok one more pleas..
[12:11] <mungojerry> how to scroll up?
[12:11] <AlanBell> page up or mousewheel if you have mouse.pl
[12:11] <mungojerry> it scrolls my command history
[12:12] <kvarley> czajkowski: Found this - https://code.google.com/p/irssi-libnotify/wiki/MainPage - could be interesting :)
[12:12] <AlanBell> oh, move it about or wait a few seconds until the mouse cursor changes to a pointer rather than an I beam
[12:14] <mungojerry> can't replicate that behaviour, stange
[12:15] <mungojerry> oh silly me, page up works, (mouse wheel not)
[12:19] <solarcloud_3scrn> AlanBell, Was there a note in with the envelope or did you just see the paper-money-note ??
[12:24] <AlanBell> solarcloud_3scrn: got the note as well, thanks
[12:31] <solarcloud_3scrn> Oh, OK . brilliant .. thought I'd Deadmau5'd again , thanks-again !!
[12:32] <kvarley>  I get some sort of DBus error message when loading a script in irssi. Any ideas? http://paste.ubuntu.com/1495216/
[12:32] <kvarley> The script I'm loading is here https://irssi-libnotify.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/notify.pl
[12:33] <mungojerry> hello mungbean
[12:40] <kvarley> Nvm, it was a dependency issue :)
[12:48] <kvarley> Doing "/SET notify_remote 192.168.1.10" in IRSSI results in " Unknown setting notify_remote
[12:56] <popey> hmm, i'd like notifications too
[12:56] <popey> but my irssi is on a remove vps
[13:00] <czajkowski> kvarley: there is an #irssi channel on freenode btw
[13:00] <marxjohnson> afternoon
[13:01] <popey> hello marxjohnson
[13:05] <mungbean> dont you love it when you are called customer services and after 5 mins of ringing you get passed to a message that says sorry, call back later...dead line
[13:28] <kvarley> popey: It forwards them via dbus a libnotify so you can do it to a remote client :)
[13:30] <kvarley> czajkowski: Thanks, asked there :)
[13:30] <czajkowski> kvarley: np
[13:36] <mungbean> quick irssi question again, if i load a script e.g. nicklist, when does it take effect?
[13:46] <dwatkins> when people write things
[13:46] <dwatkins> i.e. previous lines aren't affected
[13:49] <mungbean> nicklist is supposed to create a userlist on the RHS though
[13:49] <dwatkins> oh sorry, I read that as nick_color.pl, my bad
[13:50] <kvarley> popey: Couldn't get notfy.pl to play nice with irssi. Using this method instead http://jonathanbeluch.com/blog/2011/03/remote-notify-irssi-screen/ it works pretty well :)
[13:52] <mungbean> got it, /nicklist screen
[14:27] <bigcalm> Good afternoon peeps :)
[14:28] <kvarley> \o bigcalm
[14:30] <popey> yo
[14:32] <bigcalm> Ooo, a RPi user. Is your password still raspberry? ;)
[14:32] <bigcalm> popey: what's new?
[14:33] <popey> uhhhm
[14:33] <czajkowski> hows the cat
[14:33] <czajkowski> we've not had caturday in a while
[14:34] <bigcalm> I seriously need a UI designer for my photo booth app. It looks horrible right now
[14:34] <bigcalm> czajkowski: I have an URL for you!
[14:34] <czajkowski> oh cool
[14:35] <bigcalm> Which my brain keeps reading as 'regretting' some how
[14:36] <popey> I'll post some caturday pics tomorrow ☺
[14:39] <dwatkins> bigcalm: that makes me wonder how long it will be until someone starts finding Raspberry Pi boxes connected to the internets and hacking into them....
[14:40] <bigcalm> dwatkins: 'hacking' in the same sense as accessing somebody's voice mail account because they haven't changed the default password
[14:52] <dwatkins> bigcalm: yes, although if I had a RPi on my network and someone could log in to it, they would then be potentially able to access my other computers more easily
[14:53] <dwatkins> (see 'total cost of pwnership' or whatever that confusingly-titled document was about the damage a linux machine can do compared to the damage a windows machine can do if it's compromised)
[14:55] <dwatkins> http://www.immunitysec.com/resources-papers.shtml - August 12, 2004 Dave Aitel - Microsoft Windows, a lower Total Cost of Ownership (note the zero in the word '0wnership')
[15:17] <Laney> I think my magic tree timelapse is going to be boring
[15:17] <Laney> still doesn't look magic :(
[15:17] <brobostigon> :(
[15:27] <bashrc> I assume that folks have seen this http://youtu.be/sLtcj7FdIYA
[15:29] <SuperMatt> not yet
[15:29] <bashrc> it's a nice demo
[15:29] <bashrc> definitely looks like something which would sell
[15:29] <SuperMatt> you say that, but lots of people seem to think that mobile manufactures won't buy in to it
[15:30] <bashrc> why not?
[15:30] <SuperMatt> because they already have the choice between android and windows phone
[15:30] <SuperMatt> and symbian
[15:30] <SuperMatt> and now tizen, or whatevs
[15:31] <bashrc> I think the average person who is not obsessed with operating systems will look at this and just think it's Android.  The screen transitions are very similar.
[15:31] <SuperMatt> oh yes
[15:33] <bashrc> But even if manufacturers don't like it (and I don't see why they wouldn't) he says in the video that it will be possible to unstall the Ubuntu phone OS onto existing Android phones.
[15:33] <SuperMatt> one thing that would be nice of Upho: dial boot
[15:33] <bashrc> *install
[15:35] <SuperMatt> *dual
[15:35] <SuperMatt> bashrc: the thing is that you need to root the phone before you can install ubuntu
[15:36] <SuperMatt> I have an s3, and I belive that samsung have locked it down quite hard
[15:36] <bashrc> yes, but I think that's common
[15:37] <bashrc> I guess that's a question of judicious purchasing.  If you buy a device knowing that you won't be able to have root access on it then I suppose that you deserve to live in a digital prison.
[15:37] <SuperMatt> well, when I bought the s3 it was because it was the best, not because I knew ubuntu phone was coming
[15:38] <bashrc> which goes back to the Stallman quote about "perceived convenience"
[15:38] <kvarley> SuperMatt: Samsung may try to lock it down but there are countless guides on how to unlock it.
[15:39] <bashrc> yes that does seem to be the case
[15:39] <popey> 15:29:48 < SuperMatt> you say that, but lots of people seem to think that mobile manufactures won't buy in to it
[15:39] <popey> not in our experience
[15:39] <popey> we've had very positive feedback from handset manufacturers
[15:39] <SuperMatt> oh sweet
[15:39] <SuperMatt> I should of course stop reading slashdot
[15:40] <bashrc> ;-)
[15:40] <bigcalm> I'm surprised that people still do read /.
[15:40] <popey> ditto
[15:40] <mungbean> popey: how does launcher work in ladscape mode
[15:41] <popey> dunno, not turned one sideways ☺
[15:41] <mungbean> never seen a clip yet of it sideways
[15:41] <mungbean> or making a phone call
[15:42] <bashrc> maybe it doesn't have a landscape mode...yet
[15:42] <SuperMatt> /. is ok for getting some news articles, but the problem is that the comments are akin to those on the daily mail website
[15:43] <bashrc> the daily fail
[15:43] <SuperMatt> mostly misinformed or out of date
[15:44] <popey> mungbean: when they got the phone stack working, they immediately called Jane Silber, the CEO, from across the office. Was a happy day ☺
[15:46] <SuperMatt> nice!
[15:46] <SuperMatt> how long has it been in development for?
[15:47] <SuperMatt> also: what does the phone stack stuff mean for desktops? if we plug in a sim card, will we be able to make calls?
[15:47] <SuperMatt> no, of course not
[15:47] <SuperMatt> don't be so stupid matthew
[15:47] <Laney> https://twitter.com/avoidcomments
[15:48] <dwatkins> is the Ubuntu phone kernel the 'standard' linux kernel, Android or something else?
[15:48] <SuperMatt> Laney: awesome!
[15:49] <SuperMatt> though I do tend to read anything ubuntu related on /. to see just how malinformed people are
[15:49] <SuperMatt> I get a bit of a kick out of it
[15:49] <bashrc> "The problem with internet comments is that you can never really know who's saying them." -- Winston Churchill
[15:49] <mungbean> comments from dinotards on ubuntu realted slashdot articles are funny
[15:50] <popey> SuperMatt: 2 years or so
[15:50] <SuperMatt> "I USED UNITY BACK WHEN IT WAS IN DAPPER AND IT WAS RUBBISH THEN SO I HAVEN'T TRIED IT SINCE"
[15:50] <bashrc> haters gonna hate
[15:50] <SuperMatt> popey: has it been a constant thing, or has it ramped up recently?
[15:51] <popey> ramped up for CES
[15:51] <mungbean> my mouse keeps stopping working, requiring reseating in usb slot..weird
[15:51] <dwatkins> "The probably with making up quotes is that anyone can do it" - Margaret Thatcher
[15:51] <mungbean> slashdot commenters are so ultracrepidarian :D
[15:52] <bashrc> that's a new word
[15:53] <bashrc> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultracrepidarianism
[15:54] <popey> its mungbean's word of the day
[15:56] <bigcalm> It's what happens to me when I get drunk
[15:56] <bigcalm> I try not to get too drunk for this sort of reason
[15:57] <mungbean> lol
[16:02] <SuperMatt> oh fedora, why do you keep slipping?
[16:03] <bigcalm> SuperMatt: head not big enough?
[16:03] <SuperMatt> hah
[16:03] <SuperMatt> no, it's their new bloody installer
[16:04] <SuperMatt> Even when ubuntu changed theirs, it didn't make a differnce to the release date
[16:05] <davmor2> mungbean: the thoughts count for floccinaucinihilipilification
[16:08] <mungbean> we need a bot which automatically explains the meaning of long words
[16:08] <SuperMatt> anything over 12 characters?
[16:09] <davmor2> this is the biggest real word I know to pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis
[16:09] <SuperMatt> better make it 15 characters as automatically is 13 :P
[16:11] <dwatkins> floccinaucinihilipilification
[17:08] <ubuntubhoy> Got hold of a cheapo USB 2 data link cable, and wan't to transfer a shitload of data from a Ubuntu install to a Win8 machine, is there any easy way to use this thing ?
[17:17] <bigcalm> !ohmy | ubuntubhoy
[17:18] <solarcloud_3scrn> ubuntuboy Errata . Use shedload next time.
[17:18] <davmor2> http://t.co/MB7fYmBn muhahahaha
[17:18] <bigcalm> ubuntubhoy: quickest way would be to take the HDD out of the Windows machine and hook it up to the Ubuntu one. Mount it there and copy your load
[17:21] <solarcloud_3scrn> davmor2, I thought mwahahaha or variants was saved for !Batman posts although the addition of a 'u' would indicate a #hashtag logg.
[17:22] <davmor2> solarcloud_3scrn: I think a big cat killing a snowman is evil so it gets an evil laugh, his next plan is to take over the world
[17:27] <solarcloud_3scrn> .. I don't think his hund legs will last the arthritis. davmor2, All cats come from a gemini Siaese cat called Congress.
[17:27] <solarcloud_3scrn> **Siamese
[17:27] <ubuntubhoy> bigcalm: laptop's, and no external HDD caddy :(
[17:28] <davmor2> ubuntubhoy: would a simply crossover cable not of been much cheaper?
[17:29] <ubuntubhoy> had the data cable lying around
[17:29] <ubuntubhoy> ethernet cable might be better though
[19:49] <Azelphur> well, that was unexpected
[19:49] <locodir-user> hello ?
[19:49] <Azelphur> I just announced to my gaming community that my upstream advertiser was forcing us to play 18 second adverts, this was met with a 100% positive response o.O
[19:49] <Azelphur> locodir-user: hi
[19:49] <locodir-user> i got a question
[19:50] <locodir-user> i am new to ubuntu
[19:50] <Azelphur> !ask | locodir-user
[19:50] <locodir-user> ok
[19:50] <ali1234> Azelphur: i found this option in tf2 "show text only motd" and i haven't seen an advert on any server since. what's that all about?
[19:50] <Azelphur> ali1234: does what it says on the tin
[19:50] <davmor2> locodir-user: welcome ask away
[19:51] <ali1234> so um, why does anyone even bother putting ads on there?
[19:51] <Azelphur> ali1234: vast majority of users don't press that button, servers cost money.
[19:51] <ali1234> really?
[19:51] <locodir-user> i want to install the driver for my videocard (gtx610m laptop) i know a bit how the terminal works
[19:51] <Azelphur> ali1234: yep
[19:51] <Azelphur> locodir-user: 12.10?
[19:51] <locodir-user> no downgraded to 12.04
[19:52] <locodir-user> tought it was easier
[19:52] <Azelphur> ubuntu button > hardware drivers
[19:52] <Azelphur> press button receive driver
[19:52] <locodir-user> i have it in dutch language
[19:53] <Azelphur> !nl | locodir-user
[19:53] <locodir-user> haha
[19:53] <davmor2> locodir-user: look for jockey-gtk is the apps name you may still find that
[19:54] <Azelphur> I scared him off :P
[19:54] <davmor2> Azelphur: not surprising have you looked in a mirror lately ;)
[19:55] <Azelphur> Yea, a handsome man stared back at me xD
[19:55] <davmor2> Azelphur: Mirrors tend to be silver dude you were looking in a window :D
[19:55] <Azelphur> lol
[20:07] <davmor2> well ladies and gentlefolk it is that time of day have a great weekend everyone
[20:56] <ali1234> ok, how do i report bugs on the ubuntu phone preview sdk?
[21:00] <popey> ali1234: problems with the kit or qt5?
[21:00] <ali1234> yes, and problems with the instructions on the website
[21:01]  * popey finds out
[21:01] <popey> standby!
[21:07] <ali1234> why do we have to use qmlscene instead of qmlviewer?
[21:08] <ali1234> oh, they just renamed it in Qt5
[21:14] <ali1234> what's a gu?
[21:15] <AlanBell> resolution independent distance
[21:17] <AlanBell> ali1234: http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/qml/mobile/resolution-independence.html
[21:17] <ali1234> so it's like points, xcept different?
[21:18] <AlanBell> a bit, yeah
[21:18] <AlanBell> points are supposed to be a fraction of an inch and should know about dpi
[21:18] <AlanBell> but they are hardly ever right
[21:18] <ali1234> and not actually resolution independent :(
[21:18] <AlanBell> I don't think this claims to be size consistent across devices
[21:19] <ali1234> exactly
[21:19] <ali1234> so it isn't resolution independent
[21:19] <ali1234> it's just arbitrary
[21:19] <AlanBell> yes, it is a device appropriate unit of smallness
[21:19] <ali1234> yes. but not independent of resolution. it depends on resolution and also another thing
[21:20] <AlanBell> yeah, it is going to be smaller on a smartphone than on a laptop screen
[21:20] <ali1234> what does it do on a 7" tablet?
[21:20] <ali1234> what about 10"?
[21:20] <AlanBell> actually I am not sure it is going to be smaller on a smartphone
[21:21] <AlanBell> I dunno, it doesn't look massively well thought out does it.
[21:21] <ali1234> no
[21:21] <ali1234> it looks like it has all the problems of using pixels and all the problems of using points combined into one system
[21:22] <AlanBell> yes
[21:22] <ali1234> thanks, but no thanks. i will just use pixels
[21:22] <ali1234> as a bonus that means my app won't rely on ubuntu components, thus it will run on other mobiles as well
[21:24] <AlanBell> if I was going to do such a unit I would define it as 1/1024 of the longest dimension of the screen
[21:24] <AlanBell> or something like that
[21:24] <ali1234> well yu can trivially do that in qml anyway
[21:24] <ali1234> well, based on top level parent actually
[21:24] <ali1234> i dunno, maybe it's not so easy
[21:26] <AlanBell> "For example, if the destination size of the bitmap is 10 gu * 10 gu and the developer targets a Smart Phone (1 gu = 18 px) and a laptop (1 gu = 8 px) then he/she only needs to create a bitmap of 144 px * 144 px to support both devices."
[21:26] <AlanBell> erm. . .
[21:26] <AlanBell> someone is smoking the strong stuff there I think
[21:27] <AlanBell> 8*18 is indeed 144, but that means it gets upscaled to 180x180 on the smartphone and downscaled to 80x80 on the laptop, neither of which is a clean scale of 144px
[21:27] <ali1234> yeah
[21:28] <AlanBell> well when popey finds where the bugs go, that one will be added to the collection
[21:29] <ali1234> qml simply isn't meant to be cross platform anyway
[21:29] <ali1234> it's meant to be so easy you just make a different version of your interface for laptop, desktop, phone, tablet...
[21:30] <AlanBell> I expect that is the plan, I think the "One system for all platforms" thing is marketing
[21:31] <ali1234> can i use qt mobility stuff or is there a special ubuntu version of it?
[21:32] <AlanBell> pro tip http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/qml/mobile/
[21:32] <einonm> AlanBell: If you were designing the perfect "One system for all platforms", you'd need different images in that case, or be happy to rely on intensive scaling in places anyway? Isn't there no easy way to fix that issue?
[21:34] <AlanBell> einonm: scaling images isn't a big deal, the problem is getting a fully responsive design that reflows and works with touch vs mouse/keyboard
[21:34] <ali1234> einonm: yeah exactly. you're supposed to use different images and different QML with all the backend in a C++ library
[21:34] <ali1234> also you are supposed to use vector graphics as much as possible :)
[21:37] <einonm> AlanBell: ah yes, like windows 8... :-/
[21:39] <AlanBell> haven't seen that yet
[21:42] <popey> seems the project doesn't have a bug tracker configured, might have to wait till monday, keep a note of the issues pls
[21:42] <AlanBell> ok
[21:43] <AlanBell> is the project separate to the documentation?
[21:49] <ali1234> AlanBell: that's the ubuntu stuff, but you'll need to use qml standard stuff too. some of which is in add on modules which may or may not be available
[21:51] <AlanBell> Captain Jack should not be lowering himself to panto http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-20915946
[21:51] <ali1234> wat
[21:52] <ali1234> hmm QtMultimedia doesn't like ogg files
[21:58] <einonm> AlanBell: Because Captain Jack should be lowering himself to Ianto?
[21:58] <AlanBell> oooh clever :)
[21:58] <einonm> sorry. Couldn't resist
[22:00] <ali1234> jono's head is too fuzzy
[22:02] <popey> lots of options
[22:02] <popey> https://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=jono+bacon
[22:02] <popey> image search turns up lots
[22:04] <ali1234> yeah but he's still got a fuzzy head
[22:13] <bigcalm> popey: Is that a 'yes' then? :)
[22:14] <bigcalm> Requirements: Ubuntu and a webcam. Optional is a DSLR that works with gphoto2 (my Canon EOS 350D does) but not vital at this stage
[22:37] <popey> czajkowski: saw http://imgur.com/gallery/OWtoF and thought of you
[22:39] <czajkowski> popey: BOING!!!
[22:39] <czajkowski> so want a pug!
[22:40] <bigcalm> czajkowski: dress Jon as one good enough for now?
[22:42] <czajkowski> I think he might argue against that
[22:43] <bigcalm> I wonder if I can get Pug type costume bits to go with the photobooth ;)
[22:43] <czajkowski> nn folks :)
[22:44] <bigcalm> Toodles
[23:15] <AlanBell> anyone know what the HUD process is?
[23:15] <AlanBell> the thing that sits on dbus and is not the UI but is the thing that does the menu searching
[23:33] <AlanBell> ah, that is running but it isn't seeing any menus
[23:33] <popey> unity-panel-service running?
[23:34] <AlanBell> no, running in gnome-shell at the moment
[23:35] <AlanBell> I think the applications are not exporting their menu items to the dbusmenu or something
[23:35] <ali1234> well have you got the right environment variables set up so that all that stuff actually runs?
[23:36] <AlanBell> the hud service runs, but doesn't have any content
[23:36] <ali1234> like DESKTOP_SESSION and and one for dbus menu
[23:36] <AlanBell> gdbus call --session --dest com.canonical.hud --object-path /com/canonical/hud --method com.canonical.hud.StartQuery "file" 5
[23:36] <AlanBell> returns an empty result, but it does get an answer
[23:39] <ali1234> hmm
[23:39] <ali1234> qml item has properties scale and rotation
[23:41] <ali1234> LOL