[18:01] <jdstrand> hi!
[18:02]  * sbeattie waves
[18:02] <jjohansen> o/
[18:02] <tyhicks> hello
[18:02] <sarnold> hello
[18:03] <jdstrand> #startmeeting
[18:03] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Jan  7 18:03:31 2013 UTC.  The chair is jdstrand. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[18:03] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[18:03] <jdstrand> The meeting agenda can be found at:
[18:03] <jdstrand> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/Meeting
[18:03] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Announcements
[18:03] <jdstrand> Happy New Year and welcome back :)
[18:04] <jdstrand> Thanks to Thomas Ward (TheLordOfTime) provided a debdiff for lucid for znc (LP: #1090195)
[18:04] <jdstrand> Thanks to Christian Kuersteiner (ckuerste) provided a debdiff for lucid-precise for dtach (LP: #1088355)
[18:04] <jdstrand> Your work is very much appreciated and will keep Ubuntu users secure. Great job! :)
[18:04] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Weekly stand-up report
[18:04] <jdstrand> I'll go first
[18:05] <jdstrand> I'm in the happy place this week
[18:05] <jdstrand> before (and during) the break I took some time to play with the dbus apparmor patches
[18:06] <jdstrand> it's working really well for me and I am starting to see patterns for abstractions
[18:06] <sbeattie> nice!
[18:06] <jdstrand> it is inconvenient that aa-notify can only read one logfile at a time though
[18:06] <tyhicks> \o/
[18:06] <jdstrand> so I started poking at a python rewrite that would allow reading multiple logfiles
[18:07] <sbeattie> woo
[18:07] <tyhicks> jdstrand: I can flip the switch on enabling auditd support in the dbus-dev ppa's dbus package
[18:07] <tyhicks> we can talk about it offline
[18:07] <jdstrand> all this got me rather excited about the work the security team has been doing, so I started to write up a multipart blog series for apparmor
[18:08] <jdstrand> tyhicks: yeah, I thought about that too-- yes let's talk later
[18:09] <jdstrand> the idea behind the blogging is to basically say what we have done, how we use it in Ubuntu, what we are currently working on, then talk about my experiences with dbus specifically
[18:09] <jdstrand> that should set it up such that any of us (or me) could blog about the other bits
[18:09] <jdstrand> that the team is working on
[18:09] <jdstrand> thanks to sarnold and jjohansen for reviewing my 1st draft
[18:10] <jdstrand> jjohansen: btw, let's talk about your comments offline since the upstream wiki also needs to be updated
[18:10] <jdstrand> beyond that
[18:10] <jjohansen> jdstrand: sure
[18:11] <jdstrand> I am patch piloting this week (supposed to be today, but I need to push that to later in the week because... )
[18:11] <jdstrand> I'm also working on an nss update, testing/sponsoring firefox and thunderbird, and hopefully chromium-browser
[18:11] <jdstrand> I need to follow-up with chad on chromium-browser, since I think all that is left is lucid
[18:12] <jdstrand> mdes laur returns tomorrow. he will be on triage
[18:12] <jdstrand> sbeattie: you're up
[18:13] <sbeattie> I'm still an apparmor monkey this week
[18:13] <sbeattie> I'm still working on the display manager prototype as well as doing prep work for the 2.8.1 release, the upcoming alpha, and for the apparmor meeting tomorrow.
[18:13] <sbeattie> that's pretty much it for me.
[18:14] <sbeattie> tyhicks: you're up
[18:14] <tyhicks> I'm working on an embargoed item, the AppArmor kernel policy interface, and I need to review my objectives
[18:14] <tyhicks> jjohansen: you're up
[18:15] <jjohansen> I am getting back into apparmor this week as well
[18:16] <jjohansen> there are a couple bugs that where reported over the holidays that need some more looking into, I need to get some stuff together for the meeting tomorrow, and I need to get the labeling/alpha1 stuff out this week
[18:16] <jjohansen> I suppose I need to review objectives too
[18:16] <jjohansen> sarnold: your up
[18:17] <sarnold> I'm still working on the libvirt/dnsmasq update; I didn't make much progress on it last week, and I'm starting to lean towards not having a reproducer for the specific bugfix that we're looking at integrating.
[18:18] <sarnold> I'd very much like be unstuck on this :)
[18:18] <sarnold> I'm going to repoke the axis2/c upstream bugreport I filed before the holidays before refiling my CVE request for not-checking-hostnames
[18:19] <jdstrand> sarnold: well, automating dhcp reproducers is always tricky. it's ok to fallback to testing that you didn't regress (even if some of that is manual)
[18:19] <sarnold> but I feel like that should be finished this week
[18:19] <jdstrand> it's just like that sometimes
[18:19] <sarnold> I've also got objectives to do, presumably this week, I assumed jdstrand and I would discuss them elsewhere
[18:20] <jdstrand> sarnold: indeed :)
[18:21] <sarnold> and in good news, I think I may have finallylicked the last of my "where does my email go?" quandry -- I've switched to using dovecot/delivre to deliver my inbox mail instead of allowing it to fall off the end of procmail into a file
[18:21] <sarnold> jdstrand: back to you :)
[18:22] <jdstrand> nice :)
[18:22] <jdstrand> it is certainly distressing when you aren't sure you are getting your mail
[18:22] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Highlighted packages
[18:22] <jdstrand> The Ubuntu Security team will highlight some community-supported packages that might be good candidates for updating and or triaging. If you would like to help Ubuntu and not sure where to start, this is a great way to do so.
[18:22] <jdstrand> See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures for details and if you have any questions, feel free to ask in #ubuntu-security. To find out other ways of helping out, please see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/GettingInvolved.
[18:22] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/exif.html
[18:22] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/ruby-rails-3.2.html
[18:22] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/libguac.html
[18:22] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/activemq.html
[18:23] <jdstrand> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/ruby-activerecord-2.3.html
[18:23] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Miscellaneous and Questions
[18:23] <jdstrand> There are a lot of merge opportunities for packages listed in http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/d2u/. Performing these updates is a great way to help Ubuntu and bolster your developer application.
[18:23] <jdstrand> Does anyone have any other questions or items to discuss?
[18:31] <jdstrand> sbeattie, tyhicks, jjohansen, sarnold: thanks!
[18:31] <jdstrand> #endmeeting
[18:31] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Jan  7 18:31:58 2013 UTC.
[18:31] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-07-18.03.moin.txt
[18:31] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-07-18.03.html
[18:32] <sarnold> thanks jdstrand :)
[18:32] <sbeattie> jdstrand: thanks!
[18:32] <jjohansen> thanks jdstrand
[18:59] <stokachu> o/
[19:00]  * Sweetshark waves back at stokachu.
[19:01] <Laney> !dmb-ping
[19:01] <Laney> ARISE
[19:01] <cody-somerville> Hi
[19:03]  * stgraber waves
[19:05] <cody-somerville> #startmeeting
[19:05] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Jan  7 19:05:43 2013 UTC.  The chair is cody-somerville. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[19:05] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[19:06] <cody-somerville> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard/Agenda
[19:06] <cody-somerville> #topic Review of previous action items
[19:06] <cody-somerville> Before we begin, do we have quorum?
[19:07] <micahg> o/
[19:08] <Laney> |o_
[19:08] <cody-somerville> Cool. Looks like we do.
[19:08] <cody-somerville> #subtopic laney to describe criteria and process for lightweight amending of ppu rights (for dds)
[19:08] <Laney> #link http://people.ubuntu.com/~laney/dynamic-ppu-procedure.txt
[19:09] <Laney> Since I just did this now, we should talk about it next meeting once everyone has had the chance to read it
[19:09] <cody-somerville> Agreed.
[19:09] <cody-somerville> #action DMB members to read proposal and be prepared to vote next meeting on next action
[19:09] <meetingology> ACTION: DMB members to read proposal and be prepared to vote next meeting on next action
[19:09] <cody-somerville> #subtopic micahg to ask docs people if they want to apply for a packageset
[19:10] <micahg> done by e-mail
[19:11] <cody-somerville> #topic PerPackageUploader Applications
[19:11] <cody-somerville> #subtopic Bjoern Michaelsen for libreoffice
[19:11] <cody-somerville> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BjoernMichaelsen/DeveloperApplication
[19:12]  * Sweetshark reporting in.
[19:12]  * bdrung arrives
[19:12] <Laney> ah good
[19:12] <cody-somerville> Sweetshark: Hello. Please introduce yourself and your application.
[19:12]  * micahg though stokachu was first..
[19:13] <Sweetshark> cody-somerville: Hi, Im Bjoern Michaelsen, Im maintaining LibreOffice since Natty and apply for package upload right now. ;)
[19:13] <Sweetshark> You will find the details in the link.
[19:14] <Sweetshark> (Probably more than enough, If you have questions to something specific, please ask)
[19:15] <cody-somerville> Sweetshark: Do you have any other upload permissions to Ubuntu at this time?
[19:15] <Sweetshark> cody-somerville: no.
[19:15] <Laney> just FYI, I think I better abstain from this since we're on the same team. There's quorum without me anyway so it doesn't matter.
[19:15] <cody-somerville> Sweetshark: Have you applied for upload permissions previously?
[19:15] <Laney> and I have to go out hopefully not for long, as I just explained in private
[19:16] <Sweetshark> cody-somerville: yes: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/03/26/%23ubuntu-meeting.html#t19:01
[19:17] <barry> Sweetshark: can you talk a little bit about what you've done since then, that address some of the issues brought up in the last meeting?
[19:20] <Sweetshark> barry: well, for micahgs library version bump question, I think I just misunderstood the question. We discussed it quickly on the day after IIRC. Note that in
[19:20] <Sweetshark> an ironic twist of history LibreOffice will get ABI incompatible _without_ bumping the so version (a long tale).
[19:21] <barry> Sweetshark: is that documented anywhere?
[19:22] <Sweetshark> as for more endoresements: you now have seb128 and didrocks in addition, plus the debian maintainer indirectly (its kinda hard to get a direct commitment to anything ubuntu from rene: he is still rather hostile to ubuntu -- he stated 'ubuntu must die' before and after I joined Canonical on public mailing lists to me. Things are getting a lot better now though)
[19:22] <bdrung> ABI breakage without so version bump?
[19:23] <Sweetshark> barry: the conversation with micahg or ABI breakage without version bump?
[19:23] <barry> Sweetshark: abi
[19:24] <barry> (although maybe you can also update us on the discusion w/micah)
[19:24] <Sweetshark> barry: sure -- it was discussed on the LibreOffice ESC meeting over at least a few weeks. I can try to find link for it -- its a complex issue.
[19:27] <bdrung> Sweetshark: do you see yourself as Ubuntu representative?
[19:27] <Sweetshark> barry: tl;dr: LibreOffice tries to do minimal changes to the ABI, thus most stuff wont break, but as there is a big ecosystem of (closed source or inhouse) extension for LO/OOo it would be unhelpful to break them indescriminatly esp. if that makes LO and OOO extensions uncompatible,
[19:27] <Sweetshark> bdrung: sure
[19:29] <Sweetshark> bdrung: see me wearing Ubuntu shirts at the LibreOffice conference. Or staying longer to also take part in the Ubucon representing all of Ubuntu/Canonical and LibreOffice.
[19:29] <bdrung> Sweetshark: the upload history indicates a different perspective. the last uploads to raring was 1.5 month ago.
[19:29] <Sweetshark> (LibreOffice conference and Ubuncon happened back to back in Berlin last year)
[19:30] <cody-somerville> Five more minutes for questions.
[19:30] <bdrung> we have a rc2 version in the archive instead of the latest release (which is a bug fix release)
[19:31] <Sweetshark> bdrung: Raring will ship LO 4.0 thus I will upload that. I am working on preparing that package. As LO 4.0 is still in beta, I do that in the LO prereleases PPA until it is deemed stable enough.
[19:32] <Sweetshark> bdrung: rc2=final
[19:32] <Sweetshark> final is a renamed rc2
[19:32] <bdrung> libreoffice has a MRE, but precise stays at 3.5.4 instead of getting 3.5.7 and quantal has 3.6.2 instead of 3.6.4
[19:33] <Sweetshark> bdrung: Im currently working on 3.5.7. 3.5.7 has a regression against 3.5.4 thus cant be uploaded as is. The 3.5.7 is actually in precise-proposed.
[19:34] <bdrung> Sweetshark: ah, i didn't saw 3.5.7 in precise-proposed, because it's stuck in the unapproved queue
[19:35] <cody-somerville> #vote Bjoern Michaelsen for libreoffice PPU
[19:35] <meetingology> Please vote on: Bjoern Michaelsen for libreoffice PPU
[19:35] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
[19:35] <Sweetshark> bdrung: same essentially for 3.6.4/quantal IIRC ...
[19:36] <barry> +1 [on the strength of the endorsements]
[19:36] <meetingology> +1 [on the strength of the endorsements] received from barry
[19:36] <micahg> -1, lack of devel release uploads, still problems with with some uploads
[19:36] <meetingology> -1, lack of devel release uploads, still problems with with some uploads received from micahg
[19:37] <bdrung> +0 lack of devel release uploads, i want to be more confident when granting PPU rights for libreoffice. i am willing to sponsor that package.
[19:37] <meetingology> +0 lack of devel release uploads, i want to be more confident when granting PPU rights for libreoffice. i am willing to sponsor that package. received from bdrung
[19:38] <Sweetshark> micahg: what devel-release upload did you want to see? 4.0 alpha and beta?
[19:38] <cody-somerville> +1 Based on endorsements despite concerns shared by colleagues on DMB. Length of contribution and demonstrable experience with upstream project also contributing factors.
[19:38] <meetingology> +1 Based on endorsements despite concerns shared by colleagues on DMB. Length of contribution and demonstrable experience with upstream project also contributing factors. received from cody-somerville
[19:39] <stgraber> +0 [I don't like the idea that we should grant PPU just because nobody wants to actually take the time to review this package. If we never had an issue with it, that'd be fine, but that's far from being the case.]
[19:39] <meetingology> +0 [I don't like the idea that we should grant PPU just because nobody wants to actually take the time to review this package. If we never had an issue with it, that'd be fine, but that's far from being the case.] received from stgraber
[19:39] <micahg> Sweetshark: well, if not that, 3.6.4
[19:39] <bdrung> Sweetshark: either 3.6.4 or a pre-release of 4.0 that is stable enough for wider testing
[19:40] <cody-somerville> #endvote
[19:40] <meetingology> Voting ended on: Bjoern Michaelsen for libreoffice PPU
[19:40] <meetingology> Votes for:2 Votes against:1 Abstentions:2
[19:40] <meetingology> Motion carried
[19:40] <cody-somerville> Sweetshark: Unfortunately based on the DMB voting procedure, your application was not successful at this time.
[19:41] <bdrung> Sweetshark: ping me if you need a sponsor
[19:42] <cody-somerville> Sweetshark: A member of the DMB will be in contact to help provide you with pointers on what is required for a subsequent application to be successful.
[19:42] <cody-somerville> #topic Ubuntu Core Developer Applications
[19:43] <cody-somerville> #subtopic Adam Stokes for Ubuntu Core Developer
[19:43] <cody-somerville> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AdamStokes
[19:43] <cody-somerville> stokachu: Hello. Please introduce yourself and your application.
[19:44] <stokachu> Hi, names Adam Stokes, I work in Canonical's Sustaining Engineering(SEG). Im applying for core dev in order to further SEG position in maintenance of existing Ubuntu technologies.
[19:45] <stokachu> As the wiki states I've been contributing to opensource for roughly 8 years and am familiar with processes from both RHEL, Fedora, and Ubuntu
[19:45] <stokachu> Obiously, since joining Canonical it has been all Ubuntu
[19:46] <bdrung> stokachu: anything you dislike at Ubuntu and we could learn from RHEL and Fedora?
[19:46] <stokachu> To be honest, the build system at Fedora is pretty cool
[19:47] <bdrung> what makes the build system cool?
[19:48] <stokachu> They use git exclusively with some lookaside caches for the source, a clean interface for creating updates (bohdi), and the build system (koji) which seems to handle builds in almost realtime
[19:49] <stokachu> For RHEL specifically there are a set of tools which automated RPM verification and errata updates which streamlines the package update process
[19:50] <cody-somerville> That does sound very interesting.
[19:50] <stokachu> FYI I dont dislike Ubuntu way of doing things either
[19:50] <stokachu> :)
[19:50] <cody-somerville> Any thoughts of getting involved with the Ubuntu build side of things?
[19:51] <stokachu> Honestly, I have this idea of trying to replicate a build system using git for Ubuntu
[19:51] <stokachu> but thats a task that'll have to wait until I have more time
[19:51] <micahg> we've had a blueprint item of sorts from building out of bzr for several cycles
[19:52] <stokachu> One thing I do think we need since we are entering more of the enterprise market is for an errata system of some sort
[19:52] <stokachu> that could be attached to package updates for customers/community to understand more clearly
[19:52] <bdrung> what's the advantage of an errata system over a bug tracker?
[19:53] <stokachu> Errata system would be simpler overview of what was addressed and would list the bugs associated with the fix
[19:53] <stokachu> also any cve's addressed etc
[19:53] <stokachu> along with documentation on how to get those updates and where to go for support
[19:54] <barry> stokachu: have you used udd and bzr much?  dvcs details aside, are they comparable?
[19:54] <stokachu> Also we could integrate with documentation team to write a more user friendly sysnopsis of what was fixed
[19:54] <bdrung> yes, some changelog entries are not user friendly :)
[19:55] <stokachu> barry: there are similarities and I can say they are comparable as it was easy for me to migrate from a Fedora environment to Ubuntu development
[19:57] <stokachu> As far as changes go i would like to see a formal procedure for sru's whether it be through merge proposals or debdiffs
[19:57] <stokachu> seems to be the preference of the one doing the sponsorship
[19:57] <bdrung> stokachu: have done any sync or merges? do you collaborate with Debian?
[19:58] <bdrung> stokachu: some sponsors prefer merge proposals and others prefer debdiffs. getting a consensus is hard
[19:58] <stokachu> I haven't done any collaboration with Debian yet, however, I do contribute heavily to sosreport and did the addition of Debian support. Eventually, I was going to send that to Debian for inclusion
[19:58] <cody-somerville> stokachu: The DMB would like to ask if you'd consider changing your application today from core-dev to Ubuntu Contributing Developer.
[19:59] <stokachu> Ive been given mixed directions on which one to apply for
[19:59] <stokachu> Contributing Developer doesn't have upload rights I was told
[19:59] <cody-somerville> It does not. However, we think it would be a good stepping stone.
[19:59] <cody-somerville> An application for UCD today would have a higher probability of success.
[20:00] <cody-somerville> It's unanimously agreed (albeit unofficially ofcourse) that you're core-dev material but your application is unfortunately lacking at this time.
[20:00] <stokachu> So what would that get me for UCD? And how would that help me in providing a better support experience to our paying customers?
[20:00] <micahg> it grants Ubuntu membership and acknowledges your dev contributions to date are worthy of that membership
[20:01] <micahg> stokachu: why did you apply for membership in the first place?
[20:02] <bdrung> core-dev are expected to be generalist with experience from syncs/merges to SRUs
[20:03] <stokachu> It is part of my goal to not only benefit the community from my contributions but more importantly give customers added benefit of having an active Ubuntu engineer fixing their issues
[20:04] <stokachu> I guess im applying for UCD at this time
[20:04] <cody-somerville> stokachu: The developer membership board is a body that recognizes contributions to the Ubuntu project and are stewards of upload privileges to the benefit of the Ubuntu project. Providing support to Canonical's paying customers is not under our purview or within our scope of direct consideration though is recognized.
[20:05] <stokachu> Ill reapply for core-dev when I have more syncs/merges from Debian then
[20:05] <cody-somerville> stokachu: I think such an endeavour would be HIGHLY successful. Thank you. :)
[20:05] <cody-somerville> The board will now consider your application for UCD and vote.
[20:06] <cody-somerville> #vote Ubuntu Contributing Developer for Adam Stokes
[20:06] <meetingology> Please vote on: Ubuntu Contributing Developer for Adam Stokes
[20:06] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
[20:06] <barry> +1
[20:06] <meetingology> +1 received from barry
[20:06] <micahg> +1
[20:06] <meetingology> +1 received from micahg
[20:07] <cody-somerville> +1 Excellent application. Strong endorsements. On clear path to becoming core-dev in the future.
[20:07] <bdrung> +1 [ i will be happy to see you again in some months applying for core-dev with some experience with syncs/merges ]
[20:07] <meetingology> +1 Excellent application. Strong endorsements. On clear path to becoming core-dev in the future. received from cody-somerville
[20:07] <meetingology> +1 [ i will be happy to see you again in some months applying for core-dev with some experience with syncs/merges ] received from bdrung
[20:07] <stgraber> +1
[20:07] <meetingology> +1 received from stgraber
[20:08] <cody-somerville> #endvote
[20:08] <meetingology> Voting ended on: Ubuntu Contributing Developer for Adam Stokes
[20:08] <meetingology> Votes for:5 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
[20:08] <meetingology> Motion carried
[20:08] <cody-somerville> Congratulations stokachu.
[20:09]  * barry has to leave
[20:09] <stokachu> sweet! thanks all
[20:09] <Laney> congrats
[20:09] <stokachu> Will someone email me any recommended paths I should look at wrt Debian syncs/merges?
[20:09] <stokachu> My thinking is to go 4-6 months and re-apply after I've done some of that work
[20:10] <cody-somerville> stokachu: A member of the DMB will send you a quick e-mail after the meeting with some tips.
[20:10] <cody-somerville> #topic Any Other Business
[20:10] <stokachu> awesome, thanks for everyone's time
[20:10] <bdrung> stokachu: i think we should continue this discussion on #ubuntu-devel
[20:11] <cody-somerville> Any other business before I close the meeting?
[20:11] <bdrung> yes
[20:11] <bdrung> 4 DMB members expire on 2013-02-13
[20:11] <bdrung> we need to have a selection for new members till then
[20:12] <Laney> Call for nominations now, start voting 2 weeks beforehand
[20:12] <Laney> or 10 days, or whatever
[20:12] <Laney> bdrung: do you want to run it?
[20:12] <Sweetshark> bdrung: I never fail to get sponsors ;). They are just increasingly annoyed by having to sponsor other peoples work, thus asking me to apply. The only thing I _personally_ want the rights for that it also lets me on planet ubuntu.
[20:12] <Sweetshark> bdrung: there is no time for that. uploading 3.6.4 would require forwardporting (and developing 3.6 on raring in addition to 4.0 on raring, 3.6 on quantal and 3.5 on precise), as seen from the naive uncoordinated update upload of 3.6 to raring which instantly broke (NOT by me). Uploads to a mismatching series (that is anything other than 4.0/raring, 3.6/quantal, 3.5/precise) have to be optional unless we change our policy on the version we 
[20:12] <Sweetshark> bdrung: there is no time for that. uploading 3.6.4 would require forwardporting (and developing 3.6 on raring in addition to 4.0 on raring, 3.6 on quantal and 3.5 on precise), as seen from the naive update upload of 3.6 to raring which instantly broke (not by me). Uploads to a mismatching series (that is anything other than 4.0/raring, 3.6/quantal, 3.5/precise) have to be optional unless we change our policy on the version we want in the re
[20:12] <Sweetshark> So there were intentionally no uploads to the dev release up until now and only uploads to the prereleases PPA. And that is published and accepted policy.
[20:12] <bdrung> we had 2 weeks voting time
[20:13] <Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncil/Restaffing
[20:13] <bdrung> Laney: no :)
[20:13] <Laney> what
[20:14] <bdrung> i don't want to run the election if someone else will do it
[20:15] <Laney> oh, ok sure I don't mind
[20:15] <Laney> unless someone else wants to
[20:15] <cody-somerville> Sounds good.
[20:15] <cody-somerville> or wait
[20:15] <bdrung> thanks Laney for volunteering
[20:15] <Laney> I am one of those expiring though, if that makes a difference
[20:16] <cody-somerville> Should election be run by someone expiring/possibly running again?
[20:16] <Laney> if I decide to run again I'll let someone else do the poll
[20:16] <cody-somerville> Laney: I think you should run again. :)
[20:16] <cody-somerville> #action DMB to sort out re-election stuff.
[20:16] <meetingology> ACTION: DMB to sort out re-election stuff.
[20:16] <cody-somerville> Thanks folks. Great meeting. Look to ml for minutes and what not later today.
[20:17] <cody-somerville> #endmeeting
[20:17] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Jan  7 20:17:03 2013 UTC.
[20:17] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-07-19.05.moin.txt
[20:17] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-07-19.05.html
[20:54] <pitti> o/
[20:58] <soren> o/
[20:59] <cjwatson> hi
[21:00]  * soren finally managed to align his calendar with reality
[21:01] <soren> Who's driving? Me?
[21:01] <pitti> I drove the last two times
[21:01] <pitti> not that there's much to drive anyway
[21:01] <soren> True.
[21:01]  * soren volunteers
[21:01]  * stgraber waves
[21:02] <soren> Alright, let's get this show started.
[21:02] <soren> #startmeeting
[21:02] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Jan  7 21:02:34 2013 UTC.  The chair is soren. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[21:02] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[21:02] <soren> I don't see any apologies on the ML.
[21:03] <soren> So next item on the agenda is action items.
[21:03] <soren> pitti: Brainstorm review?
[21:03] <pitti> my review resulted in 7 items, 3 of which got a response
[21:03] <pitti> the other four are still outstanding
[21:03] <pitti> [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoard/BrainstormReview/Dec2012
[21:04] <pitti> not very surprising with the holidays in between, etc. I asked for a response until mid-january
[21:04] <cjwatson> Sorry, one of those is mine
[21:04] <cjwatson> Still outstanding - plan is to simply fix the problem described
[21:04] <soren> cjwatson: How radical.
[21:05]  * soren still trying to find the irc log from last meeting.
[21:05] <soren> ...to find action items.
[21:05] <pitti> it's not a hard deadline anyway; I also didn't have a very formal way of strictly picking the top ten or so, I just grabbed the ones which seemed interesting and not already obsoleted by design
[21:05] <pitti> soren: there weren't any except the brainstorm review
[21:05] <cjwatson> soren: gotta happen occasionally
[21:05] <soren> Cool.
[21:06] <soren> pitti: Did you comment on the ones you intentionally skipped?
[21:06] <soren> Saying that they're obsolete or whatever?
[21:06] <pitti> I didn't, no
[21:06] <soren> Can we expire things from brainstorm?
[21:06] <pitti> many are about software-center, which is currently being rewritten the upteenth time
[21:06] <soren> Or do their popularity decay over time?
[21:07] <pitti> if nobody votes them up any more, they decline, yes
[21:07] <pitti> I looked at "most popular in the last 6 months"
[21:07] <soren> Ah, cool.
[21:07] <pitti> that said, even the most popular one wasn't very popular
[21:07] <pitti> it seems the whole thing is losing momentum
[21:07] <soren> As long as they (probably) don't wind up beig the same ignored one next time we do the review, that's fine.
[21:08] <soren> pitti: I'm sure one could draw number of conclusions from that fact.
[21:08] <pitti> nah, that's where the "subjective filter" comes into play :)
[21:09] <soren> pitti: Right, right, I was just concerned we'd end up with the same stale ones at the top every time and we'd have to routinely start at item 37 before we got to anything that was still remotely current :)
[21:09] <pitti> no, that didn't seem to happen
[21:09] <soren> Yay.
[21:09] <soren> Ok, moving on.
[21:09] <soren> Er..
[21:10] <soren> #topic Stuff from the mailing list.
[21:10] <cjwatson> that wasn't my experience in doing the review a while back, either
[21:10] <soren> There's the MRE for sssd.
[21:10] <soren> That was tjaalton's one, wasn't it?
[21:10] <cjwatson> Timo's reply is satisfactory enough; I'm minded to approve if nobody objects
[21:10] <cjwatson> (it only takes one)
[21:11] <soren> If someone actively cares for it, I'm perfectly fine with it.
[21:11] <pitti> I have no strong opinion on that one TBH, as I don't know at all what that package does and how bad regressions would be
[21:12] <soren> Anything else we've missed?
[21:12] <soren> I don't think so.
[21:12] <soren> #topic Community bugs
[21:12] <soren> None.
[21:12] <soren> #topic AOB?
[21:13] <pitti> nothing from me
[21:13] <soren> 3
[21:13] <soren> 2
[21:13] <soren> 1
[21:13] <soren> Sold
[21:13] <soren> #action Next meeting
[21:13] <meetingology> ACTION: Next meeting
[21:13] <soren> That'll be Jan 21st.
[21:14] <soren> At 2100 UTC.
[21:14] <soren> Who's chairing?
[21:14] <cjwatson> rotation would be stgraber
[21:14] <soren> I can do it again. I probably owe a few times.
[21:14] <stgraber> I'm fine with that
[21:14] <stgraber> (as in, me doing it)
[21:14] <soren> Thanks for clarifying :)
[21:15] <pitti> what happened to the "barely can fit that meeting in an hour, with heated discussion" times? :-)
[21:15] <pitti> (not that I miss them at that late hour)
[21:15] <pitti> thanks soren
[21:15] <soren> #endmeeting
[21:15] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Jan  7 21:15:41 2013 UTC.
[21:15] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-07-21.02.moin.txt
[21:15] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-01-07-21.02.html
[21:15] <soren> Adjourned.
[21:16]  * pitti waves good night