[01:41] <philipballew> kdub, were you still gonna do the ubuntu hour this month. If not I was gonna throw it next Thursday night.
[02:26] <Darkwing> Hey guys. :)
[02:38] <bkerensa> Darkwing: woah
[02:38] <bkerensa> :D
[02:45] <akk> hiya Darkwing
[02:45] <Darkwing> :D
[02:45] <Darkwing> How is California these days?
[02:50] <akk> Cold!
[02:50] <akk> (relatively speaking, of course)
[02:50] <pleia2> I was wondering whether it was cold or I was just growing soft :)
[02:51] <pleia2> seems cold
[02:51] <pleia2> probably both!
[02:56] <akk> Probably both, yes.
[03:14] <m_anish> grantbow, ping
[03:17] <m_anish> i'll configure bip to stay here
[03:24] <pleia2> welcome m_anish
[03:29] <m_anish> pleia2, hi. did Grant happen to mention my name to you this evening?
[03:30] <pleia2> nope, haven't really talked to him today
[03:30] <m_anish> pleia2, okay. I guess I'll just introduce myself then...
[03:31] <m_anish> pleia2, I met grantbow back in october at the olpc-sf summit (olpcsf.org) ... I've been involved with the olpc project for the last 2.5 years
[03:32] <pleia2> cool
[03:32] <pleia2> I helped out with the first olpcsf summit, but my attention has been elsewhere of late
[03:32] <m_anish> pleia2, and until i started grad school back in aug (at umich, ann arbor), i was part of a startup that provides customized applications, content, and sugar environment
[03:32] <m_anish> pleia2, ok
[03:33] <m_anish> pleia2, i just want to get to know about the edu initiatives in ubuntu better, and with mark's recent announcement for ubuntu on the phone (and i assume by extension, tablets)... what kinds of efforts are on to get ed apps running on it
[03:34] <pleia2> ah, great :)
[03:34] <m_anish> pleia2, thinking both in terms of native apps in the ubuntu env, and sugar running inside ubuntu (which it does quite well right now)

[03:36] <m_anish> pleia2, so would be great if you could help me get that info, or point me in the right direction
[03:37] <pleia2> m_anish: sugar running natively on Ubuntu these days, or still in a VM?
[03:37] <pleia2> (I know the packages in Ubuntu were in a bad state for a while)
[03:37] <m_anish> pleia2, it used to run until recently, i can check with the guys over in sugar-devel
[03:37] <m_anish> (natively i mean)
[03:38] <m_anish> brb
[03:38] <pleia2> unfortunately I don't know a whole lot about "educational programs" - the schools we've worked in use regular Ubuntu and Edubuntu apps or educational things via a web browser
[03:38] <pleia2> ah, good re: sugar
[03:43] <m_anish> ok
[03:44] <m_anish> pleia2, do you know if i could poke anybody to find out what sort of efforts are on (if any) in that direction edu-apps in ubuntu (specifically plans concerning the phone)
[03:44] <pleia2> there isn't even an image yet available for the phone, so I don't think there will be much news about that in the community
[03:45] <pleia2> might try asking on the Ubuntu Education mailing list: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-education
[03:45] <darthrobot> Title: [ubuntu-education Info Page]
[03:45] <m_anish> there was a fair bit of effort by olpc-foundation (boston) to get sugar to run on android, which they concluded would take up a lot of resources and time (but was doable)... doing that in ubuntu might be a whole lot easier (if the ubuntu that is planned for phones is similar to ubuntu as it is)
[03:45] <m_anish> ok
[03:45] <m_anish> pleia2, thanks!
[03:46] <pleia2> there is already an image for the Nexus 7 tablet, and that one is very similar to Ubuntu
[03:46] <pleia2> not sure how similar the phone will be though
[03:46] <m_anish> doesn't seem like an active list 3 messages in december :-/
[03:47] <m_anish> pleia2, ah great!
[03:47] <pleia2> no, it's not an active list, but people chime in when a topic comes up
[03:47] <m_anish> ok
[03:48] <pleia2> have you looked much at Edubuntu?
[03:48] <m_anish> pleia2, frankly no (i tried it a few years ago)...
[03:49]  * m_anish is on f18 right now... just looking to get back to ubuntu ... (12.10 in a VM right now)
[03:49] <pleia2> I did some work in Ghana back in October, deployed 100 Edubuntu systems there, it comes with a bunch of educational software (all open source of course,  not commercial stuff)
[03:49] <m_anish> pleia2, oh great! is there a wikipage/blog which i should look at?
[03:50] <pleia2> edubuntu.org
[03:50] <Torikun> http://www.linux-toys.com  , My new raspberry PI and Linux site=)
[03:50] <Torikun> Sup room
[03:50] <darthrobot> Title: [Linux-toys.com | .....another techy Linux blog.]
[03:50] <pleia2> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/ghana/Edubuntu%20Lesson%20Plans.pdf was written by a teacher who came with us, outlines some of the educational details of some of the software
[03:50] <m_anish> ok
[03:50] <darthrobot> Content type: [application/pdf] Size: [72438]
[03:52] <m_anish> pleia2, this is great! I'll try it out. My motive for asking these questions was twofold (1) to get to know edubuntu and similar efforts some more, and the ecosystem around them... (2) with ubuntu-phone (Atleast from their marketing on the website), it seems like a big-specific effort by canonical to get ubuntu running on phones... so i was wondering was edu apps a part of them
[03:53] <m_anish> re: (2) there would be all sorts of issues, like touch compatibility... etc...
[03:53] <pleia2> unfortunately the phone thing is very much a marketing move at this point, hopefully they'll actually have images for testing within the next couple months
[03:53] <m_anish> and (3) sugar runs well on ubuntu, is ubuntu runs on phones, sugar can be made to run on phones alongside ubuntu and it will be perfect for early-education (with edubuntu apps being more of higher ed)
[03:53] <m_anish> okay
[03:54] <m_anish> so it's all internal at this moment?
[03:54] <pleia2> the nexus 7 images came out in October though, if you can get your hands on a device it might be worth a spin so see where the state of touch is: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7
[03:54] <darthrobot> Title: [Nexus7 - Ubuntu Wiki]
[03:54] <m_anish> fwiw /me didnt know ubuntu ran on nexus-7
[03:54] <pleia2> yeah, all internal so far
[03:54] <m_anish> :)
[03:54] <m_anish> okay
[03:54] <m_anish> i'll see if i can get access to one
[03:55] <m_anish> pleia2, have you had the chance to see one running ubuntu?
[03:55] <m_anish> (the tablet i mean)
[03:55] <Torikun> i would love to see that
[03:55] <Torikun> on my nexus 7
[03:56] <Torikun> might make it useful
[03:56] <pleia2> oh yes, attended a whole session on it at the developer summit in copenhagen, and my roommate there let me play with hers after hours :)
[03:56] <pleia2> http://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/8141994476/
[03:56] <darthrobot> Title: [Playing with Ubuntu on Nexus 7 #uds #ubuntu #nexus7 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!]
[03:56] <Torikun> look at that keyboad!
[03:56] <m_anish> pleia2, how was it in your experience (any major glitches)?
[03:56] <Torikun> looks so useful!
[03:57] <pleia2> Torikun: that keyboard application is called "onboard" - very nice :)
[03:57] <Torikun> how does one install ubuntu on the nexus 7
[03:57] <pleia2> m_anish: it's actually a bit hard to use on a 7" screen :( the close window buttons are so tiny
[03:57] <pleia2> Torikun: the wiki link I gave has details
[03:57] <m_anish> pleia2, nothing that can't be solved? i hope!
[03:57] <Torikun> ty
[03:58] <pleia2> m_anish: yeah, they're working on it :) the first images had Ubuntu 12.10, but they've got the 13.04 ones out now for testing and development
[03:58] <pleia2> I think the aim is to have something really solid by LTS time next spring (2014)
[03:58] <m_anish> pleia2, awesome (and bad, you might end up making me spend $$$ :-) )
[03:58] <pleia2> lol
[03:59] <pleia2> but only $199 :) it won't work on the nexus 10 (much different hardware)
[03:59] <m_anish> pleia2, this is pretty interesting stuff!, if all the native libs (gtk stuff) is there, i see no reason why sugar shouldn't run... all the arm packages within fedora are available... should not be too hard to compile them as .debs
[03:59] <m_anish> pleia2, ok
[04:00]  * Torikun likes Unity now
[04:00] <pleia2> m_anish: it is the ARM architecture, which most packages build for
[04:00] <m_anish> pleia2, +1
[04:04] <m_anish> pleia2, thanks a lot, this is quite useful stuff (perhaps enough to start a serious discussion on sugar-devel, although people are pro-fedora there)
[04:04] <pleia2> you're welcome :)
[04:08]  * grantbow blinks
[04:08] <m_anish> pleia2, fwiw, sugar seems to compile on ubuntu see http://buildbot.sugarlabs.org/waterfall
[04:08] <m_anish> grantbow, hey!
[04:08] <grantbow> hi m_anish
[04:08] <m_anish> :)
[04:08] <darthrobot> Title: [BuildBot: Sugar]
[04:08] <Torikun> Yo grantbow
[04:08] <grantbow> hi Torikun
[04:09] <pleia2> m_anish: I think it always built, was just buggy and didn't get a lot of love from maintainers
[04:09] <grantbow> talked to #ubuntu-sugarteam?
[04:10] <m_anish> pleia2, true, but we've had the heroic efforts of daniel navarez to come up with a good build system for sugar so that it doesn't crash every 3 mins...
[04:10] <m_anish> it's still not system packages, but a lot lot better than what it used to be (jhbuild)
[04:10] <pleia2> ah great :) using jenkins?
[04:11] <m_anish> http://sugarlabs.org/~dnarvaez/sugar-docs/build.html
[04:11] <darthrobot> Title: [Building from sources — sugar documentation]
[04:12] <pleia2> I see
[04:12] <grantbow> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/Ubuntu-sugarteam
[04:12] <darthrobot> Title: [Ubuntu-sugarteam Info Page]
[04:13] <grantbow> https://launchpad.net/~sugarteam
[04:13] <darthrobot> Title: [Sugar Team in Launchpad]
[04:14] <m_anish> grantbow, not very active (again :-/)
[04:14]  * pleia2 nods
[04:14] <grantbow> true
[04:15] <grantbow> the Fedora sponsorship helped fund a lot of momentum
[04:15] <grantbow> on the Fedora side
[04:15] <m_anish> I've known David for a while, that effort is quite old... i think the sugar community finds all communication done over one m-l easier than spreading over many, because it's not a very big community at this moment
[04:15] <m_anish> grantbow, +1
[04:15] <grantbow> it's all about allocation of resources
[04:16] <m_anish> grantbow, i was talking with pleia2 about the recent ubuntu announcement of running on phone... it seems like all marketing at this point.but the fact that it runs on nexus7 is very encouraging
[04:16] <m_anish> grantbow, cscott (olpc-foundation) spent a lot of time trying to get sugar to run on android (with the hope that more people would have access to it)
[04:16] <grantbow> Galaxy Nexus is another targeted platform as I recall
[04:17] <grantbow> aka Samsung Galaxy III
[04:17] <m_anish> grantbow, but he concluded that it would require significant resources and time to do that
[04:17] <grantbow> interesting
[04:17] <pleia2> yeah, the galaxy nexus is the rumored target for the images coming out in a couple months
[04:17] <m_anish> grantbow, so sugar on android has been pushed to the backside a bit... but ubuntu running on nexus and possibly on cellphones is news to me
[04:18] <m_anish> grantbow, and might provide a much easier path for sugar
[04:18] <m_anish> grantbow, so my interest is because (1) sugar may be able to run on phones and tablets (finally) in a native fashion and (2) interested to know if any dedicated edu efforts are on within the ubuntu space (like edubuntu)
[04:19] <m_anish> and the kind of ecosystem behind them
[04:19] <m_anish> we're starting to see (especially  developing) countries focus on edu android tablets...
[04:19] <grantbow> edubuntu has been the work of about three people, hasn't it?
[04:19] <m_anish> ubuntu might be a much more open and democratic platform than android, to be fair
[04:20] <m_anish> so naturally, i'm excited at the prospect :-)
[04:20] <m_anish> (does it make sense?)
[04:20] <grantbow> yes, makes sense
[04:20] <pleia2> the core of edubuntu is 5 people (the edubuntu council), but there are others who make smaller contributions (like many of the flavors :))
[04:21] <grantbow> kk
[04:21] <m_anish> grantbow, also looking in terms of price... i guess OLPC XO laptops sell for around $200, and we have top of the line android tablets running the same thing with more memory, ram, better processor for the same price!
[04:22] <grantbow> and lots of fees to carriers to subsidize the hardware
[04:22] <m_anish> obviously the advantages olpc xo laptops bring are different, like being rugged, easy repairbility, but they are not so important everywhere
[04:22] <m_anish> umm, aren't the tablets free of any carriers, and unlocked?
[04:22] <grantbow> matters to a kid who drops one, lol
[04:22] <m_anish> https://play.google.com/store/devices/details?id=nexus_7_16gb
[04:22] <grantbow> some yes, some no
[04:22] <darthrobot> Title: [Nexus 7 (16GB) - Google Play]
[04:22] <m_anish> ok
[04:23] <m_anish> grantbow, haha
[04:23] <m_anish> grantbow, pleia2 did you know that OLPC recently announced an XO-learning tablet at CES...
[04:23] <m_anish> it's basically an android tablet with an "educational UI with some free and proprietary apps"
[04:24] <m_anish> everyone within the sugar community, and most of the devs in OLPC_Association, Miami have little idea as to when/where did it happen.
[04:24] <pleia2> that's a bit troubling
[04:24] <m_anish> it does not run sugar, olpc didn't design the h/w, no one know's what's happening
[04:25] <grantbow> where are you again, m_anish? olpcsf.org meeting is just over two weeks away.
[04:25] <m_anish> at the same time the community is committed to the latest olpc "laptop" version the XO-4
[04:25] <grantbow> sameer will know almost as much as there is to know about what's up.
[04:25] <m_anish> grantbow, ann arbor, enjoying the (below) freezing weather
[04:26] <m_anish> grantbow, i doubt that, he's been in india this whole time with limited connectivity
[04:26] <m_anish> even folks within olpc (like john watlington, cscott) have no ideas
[04:26] <grantbow> phone call, brb
[04:26] <m_anish> np
[04:26] <m_anish> grantbow, my laptop battery might run out, so i'll have to run to my apt shortly, will be dc for 10 mins too
[04:38] <pleia2> wb davidv1
[04:40] <davidv1> lol same as the without the 1
[04:40] <pleia2> :)
[04:40] <davidv1> im on pidgin now
[04:40] <pleia2> you can /nick davidv
[04:42] <m_anish> grantbow, in 4 weeks i'll hopefully be somewhere close to toronto, there's a olpc community xs (server) summit happening there.