[01:10] <phillw> Noskcaj: just the person I need to chat to! Are you available for about an 15 min chat in ~ 5 minutes?
[01:19] <Noskcaj> phillw, yeah, should be
[01:19] <Noskcaj> what's it about
[01:21] <phillw> classroom session
[01:21] <Noskcaj> ok
[05:40] <gema> hey guys
[05:40] <gema> good morning
[05:40] <gema> or evening
[15:30] <balloons> ade you about?
[15:32] <Ade> balloons, yes I am, how are you?
[15:33] <balloons> a bit late, or perhaps right on time, depending :-)
[15:34] <balloons> anyways.. sat morning, I'm doing well :-)
[15:43] <smartboyhw> balloons, yo?
[15:45] <balloons> smartboyhw, hello!
[15:45] <balloons> evening to you
[15:46] <smartboyhw> balloons, good night, gotcha go. Receive my message yesterday?
[15:46] <balloons> yes I did.. I would schedule yours according to your schedule
[15:46] <balloons> if others can't go before you, I wouldn't worry so much about it
[15:47] <balloons> I don't want to keep you in limbo
[15:47] <smartboyhw> balloons, lol
[15:47] <smartboyhw> I will make one, probably in 5/2/2013 13:30 UTC
[15:47] <balloons> sounds good
[15:48] <balloons> that's later than everyone else should be going anyway
[15:48] <balloons> everything going well for you?
[15:48] <smartboyhw> Good. Bye!
[17:00] <Ade> balloons, you around?
[17:11] <balloons> yes
[17:15] <Ade> balloons, in step one of most testcases the testcase states the application should be launched via the dash, but almost all the autopilot test cases launch the application separately??
[17:17] <balloons> ade you mean the manual tests?
[17:17] <balloons> yes, obviously if your converting a manual test, you should launch it via command line
[17:18] <balloons> err, lol, launch it via the autopilot framework
[17:18] <balloons> plus we don't want things to be unity specific per say
[17:23] <Ade> balloons, sorry got disconnected...again!
[17:23] <Ade> balloons, I know anything but unity needs to be launched from within the framework but thats definitely an issue there
[17:24] <Ade> balloons, do you see where I'm coming from?
[17:26] <balloons> ade, I'm a bit confused by what you mean
[17:26] <balloons> there are unity tests already.. so for instance, if I'm writing a gedit test, I'm concerned with how gedit works, not with the launcher
[17:27] <Ade> balloons, right ok, so we're not concerned with testing to see if the application can be launched via the dash, only with it's functionality afterwards?
[17:28] <balloons> right, exactly
[17:28] <balloons> and for that reason, we can run the tests on xubuntu, lubuntu, ubuntu , etc
[17:28] <balloons> so that's nice too
[17:28] <Ade> balloons, righty no problem :o)
[17:51] <Ade> balloons, Where is all the documentation for the autopilot API?? The (very brief) tutorial is there but not a lot more???
[17:51] <balloons> there is docs, umm the link is in the blog post
[17:51] <balloons> let me grab it
[17:52] <Ade> balloons, Yes I have it already, but click on the 'API Documentation' and it appears to be empty
[17:52] <balloons> http://unity.ubuntu.com/autopilot/
[17:53] <balloons> weird..
[17:53] <Ade> balloons, I presume everything was there previously ,right?
[17:54] <Ade> balloons, I haven't viewed it before so i've no idea if it's just down today or something or it's actually incomplete
[17:55] <balloons> tutorial
[17:55] <balloons> http://unity.ubuntu.com/autopilot/tutorial/tutorial.html
[17:55] <balloons> that has stuff in it
[17:57] <balloons> the other stuff is weird
[17:57] <balloons> they pushed out some light docs in there.. I've been bugging the team to get more info in there
[17:57] <Ade> balloons, will see what I can do but it's going to be very difficult to fully complete test cases without IDE hints or API documentation :o)
[17:57] <balloons> in the meantime, you can read the class functions themselves.. but yes I agree
[17:58] <balloons> up until a month ago, everything was unity centric, so now docs with a more generic viewpoint at much needed
[18:00] <Ade> balloons, absolutely. Guess it was designed for unity after all, it will be ok, just might slow things up that's all
[18:00] <balloons> yes, I know.. but do feel free to ask questions
[18:00] <balloons> the autopilot team also haunts this channel :-)
[18:00] <balloons> I still ask them things, trust me :-)
[18:01] <Ade> balloons, :o)
[18:01] <balloons> and if you check out our bzr branch, you can see what we've done so far
[18:01] <balloons> it helps
[18:02] <Ade> balloons, Yes I have been viewing the other testcases to try and elicit some information but it seems at the moment unless an applications function has a keyboard shortcut then that test method just has a big fat #TODO in it lol
[18:03] <balloons> lol
[18:04] <balloons> I believe my first introspection stuff is in gedit
[18:04] <balloons> I think it's checked it
[18:04] <balloons> *in
[18:04] <balloons> in short, launch an app like this:
[18:04] <balloons> autopilot launch gedit
[18:04] <balloons> then run
[18:04] <balloons> autopilot vis
[18:04] <balloons> this will launch the app, and then launch the visualization tool
[18:05] <balloons> you'll see the dbus session for the application you launched if you select the 'root' connection
[18:05] <Ade> balloons, I was literally JUST reading that as you said it :o)
[18:05] <balloons> now, it's annoying because gtk apps spawn SO much nodes
[18:05] <balloons> for no apparent reason.. I asked them to implement a search in the vis tool
[18:06] <Ade> balloons, that going to be really helpful for point and click, just need to work out how to test the application correctly for assertions now
[18:06] <balloons> anyways, once you find the property you want, it's not too hard to check and assert for it
[18:07] <balloons> however, the final piece of the puzzle is going to come by doing pixel reading
[18:07] <Ade> balloons, That's definitely the way forward. Pixel reading... that sounds like a nightmare
[18:08] <balloons> there's a sikuli like tool called xpressor that we can use as stop gap
[18:08] <balloons> lol, introsection is better, but if nothing else will work
[18:08] <balloons> you can fallback to it
[18:09] <balloons> basically between the too, shouldn't be anything you can't automate
[18:09] <Ade> Ok I will figure out this first and then research xpressor :o)
[18:10] <balloons> we haven't messed with it yet.. since again, we'd like to avoid pixel reading
[18:11] <Ade> Ok, will crack on and hopefully come back to you with a working testcase
[18:12] <balloons> fire questions if you have them
[18:12] <Ade> balloons, will do :o)
[18:15] <Ade> balloons, How do you enable autopilot support in an application? when I 'autopilot launch gedit' I get an error stating no logger could be found??
[18:16] <balloons> i believe you can ignore that for the moment
[18:16] <balloons> it should still work
[18:16] <balloons> thomi literally just added support
[18:16] <balloons> so if you do see anything like that, we can report it as a bug
[18:17] <balloons> the old way is to just export the module before launching
[18:17] <Ade> balloons, gedit will then launch and when all has settled down I type 'autopilot vis' but the drop down is empty and it states 'waiting for a DBus connection..'
[18:17] <balloons> autopilot launch is supposed to to thsat for you
[18:18] <balloons> let me see
[18:18] <balloons> GTK_MODULES=autopilot-gtk:$GTK_MODULES gedit
[18:19] <balloons> that's the manual method
[18:20] <balloons> so if autopilot launch isn't working, do it that way
[18:22] <Ade> balloons, http://paste.ubuntu.com/1549760/
[18:23] <balloons> ugh
[18:23] <balloons> that's a problem
[18:23] <balloons> you running the autopilot ppa?
[18:23] <balloons> raring?
[18:24] <balloons> just tried again.. it does work for me here
[18:24] <balloons> hmm
[18:24] <Ade> 12.10 LTS and just checking now to see where I got autopilot from, I am sure it's the ppa
[18:24] <balloons> GTK_MODULES=autopilot-gtk:$GTK_MODULES gedit
[18:24] <balloons> try launching it that way
[18:24] <balloons> in the meantime
[18:25] <balloons> all autopilot launch was intended to do was to make it easier.. so you don't have to manually load the module
[18:25] <balloons> so I ran GTK_MODULES=autopilot-gtk:$GTK_MODULES gedit and then autopilot vis and got a connection that way as well
[18:26] <Ade> balloons, Yes, ppa:autopilot/ppa repository by the way.
[18:26] <balloons> ok good, that's correct
[18:26] <balloons> does manually loading the module work for you?
[18:26] <balloons> I've got to run in a sec
[18:29] <Ade> balloons, I just type that in terminal right?? I got failed to load module "autopilot-gtk"
[18:30] <Ade> balloons, Either way it's not having any of it, this is pretty fustrating
[18:38] <balloons> ohh
[18:39] <balloons> if it doesn't find it, you might not have the module installed
[18:39] <balloons> install libautopilot-gtk0
[18:40] <balloons> and perhaps libautopilot-gtk-dev as well
[18:40] <balloons> that might be needed for the manual way
[18:40] <balloons> ade, sorry your having troubles..
[18:44] <Ade> balloons, ok will give that a try..
[19:13] <Noskcaj> phillw, I have made a basic wiki page for my testdrive session
[19:16] <Ade> balloons, I am getting the same in a vm of raring, tried manually and also got exactly the same error.
[19:36] <balloons> wow.. well ade, I guess no introspection for you.. even after installing the packages eh?
[19:38] <Ade> balloons, doesn't look like it today I am disappointed to say. Can I double check how you install those packages... sudo apt-get install libautopilot-gtk0 ...is that correct??
[20:15] <dkessel> good evening. has any of you already reported the xdiagnose installation failure?
[20:20] <dkessel> ah nevermind. i found it