[06:12] <pitti> Good morning
[07:03] <jibel> good morning
[09:05] <Laney> hey
[09:43] <seb128> hey desktopers
[09:48] <seb128> pitti, hey, is https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/raring-adt-gvfs/ something you are looking at (it seems unhappy)?
[09:52] <pitti> seb128: bonjour
[09:52] <pitti> seb128: yes, it is; the new version's test seem to have a race condition
[09:53] <seb128> pitti, salut, ok, merci
[10:40] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[10:40] <seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
[10:40] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks. how are you?
[10:44] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
[10:53] <didrocks> good morning
[10:54] <didrocks> seems I'm still jetlagged :)
[10:55] <seb128> oh, a didrocks
[10:55] <didrocks> hey seb128
[10:55] <seb128> didrocks, good morning, sil2100 was looking for you, nux broke abi and the daily ppa segfaults, they need an unity rebuild and don't know how to trigger one
[10:56] <sil2100> didrocks: indeed
[10:56] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, should the launcher and panel be visible when the screen is locked btw?
[10:56] <chrisccoulson> i noticed that this morning
[10:56] <chrisccoulson> hi btw :)
[10:56] <seb128> chrisccoulson, no they shouldn't, compiz stacking issue?
[10:56] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: not really, please file a bug
[10:56] <sil2100> didrocks: I prepared a branch for bumping the nux ABI, but the daily PPA already has a nux that has an old ABI version but an ABI breakage
[10:56] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, ok, will do if i can reproduce it again
[10:57] <didrocks> sil2100: yeah, please get the branch merge, we'll skip today's release then
[11:14] <Laney> sil2100: Yo, I'm looking at your unity-2d SRU request
[11:14] <Laney> is there some special process for Unity SRUs?
[11:14] <Laney> asking because I don't see the standard SRU info in the bug
[11:14] <Laney> or do the sub-bugs have it?
[11:15] <Laney> aha
[11:27] <jibel> chrisccoulson, hey, I added firefox PPAs to autopkgtest
[11:27] <jibel> here is the result for trunk https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Raring/view/All/job/raring-ppa-adt-ubuntu_mozilla_daily_ppa-firefox-trunk/
[11:27] <jibel> chrisccoulson, aurora is running
[11:38] <chrisccoulson> jibel, awesome, thanks! i'll take a look through those results
[11:43] <chrisccoulson> ah, TEST-UNEXPECTED-FAIL | chrome://mochitests/content/browser/browser/base/content/test/social/browser_social_chatwindow.js | can't do any tests without this width
[11:43] <chrisccoulson> i probably need to tell xvfb to make the screen a bit bigger
[11:45] <chrisccoulson> ah, and some spellcheck / hyphenation reftest failures too. i probably need to install dictionaries and hyphenation patterns for those to work
[11:45] <chrisccoulson> ok, should be easily fixed :)
[12:15] <Sweetsha1k> seb128: ping?
[12:29] <seb128> Sweetsha1k, hey
[12:49] <notgary_> Does anyone know how I can add events to the Fridge calendar http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendars/
[12:51] <seb128> notgary_, try asking on #ubuntu-devel , you have a better chance there to have somebody who knows about that
[12:55] <notgary_> seb128: Thanks, I'll do just that
[13:13] <jibel> notgary, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Calendar#Adding_Events_to_the_Calendar
[13:16] <sil2100> Laney: the sub-bugs should have SRU-ed descriptions
[13:16] <Laney> sil2100: yeah, I saw and uploaded it
[13:16] <sil2100> Laney: this one bug I made specifically for sponsoring purposes ;)
[13:16] <sil2100> Laney: thank you!
[13:17]  * sil2100 hugs Laney 
[13:17] <Laney> don't count your chickens until the SRU team have responded :P
[13:18] <sil2100> ;)
[13:33] <chrisccoulson> ah, dbusmenu, i hate you
[14:24] <cyphermox> good morning desktoppers!
[14:24] <cyphermox> and dbusmenu haters! ;)
[14:25] <mterry> cyphermox, morning!
[14:26] <seb128> hey cyphermox, mterry
[14:26] <seb128> how are you?
[14:28] <mterry> Good
[14:28] <mterry> Wel
[14:28] <mterry> Getting over a cold that wiped me out most of the weekend
[15:21] <lool> Hi folks
[15:23] <lool> bryce, seb128: Rick mentioned to me that upcoming Xorg updates might be incompatible with whatever we're using on the Nexus 7; I wonder whether we have a channel to request updated drivers (to Nvidia I guess?), would one of you two know?
[15:25] <ogra_> lool, achiang had the task to talk to nvidia
[15:25] <achiang> lool: ogra_: should be pat now
[15:25] <ogra_> k
[15:50] <pgraner> seb128, I noticed after updating today (raring) that the battery indicator is telling me I don't have a mouse or keyboard and that they have empty batteries, but yet I do and they have changed batteries... http://frylock.redvoodoo.org/~pgraner/indicators.png
[16:04] <jasoncwarner> morning all
[16:06] <mlankhorst> morning
[16:08] <didrocks> hey jasoncwarner
[16:09] <kenvandine> hey jasoncwarner!
[16:12] <jasoncwarner> hey kenvandine didrocks  and mlankhorst  :)
[16:12] <dobey> pitti: hey, what is the "pygtkcompat" module for exactly? twisted is using it, and latest pygobject apparently breaks it (not sure if previous twisted in ubuntu had this code though)
[16:19] <seb128> jasoncwarner, hey, welcome back in a sane tz ;-)
[16:20] <seb128> pgraner, it doesn't seem there was code changes recently to indicator-power, did you have icons for those devices before the update? did you have a kernel update in that run?
[16:20] <seb128> cyphermox, ^
[16:21] <pgraner> seb128, no extra icons before the update, I did get a new kernel tho
[16:29] <seb128> pgraner, that needs debugging, can you report a bug using "ubuntu-bug indicator-power" if that's still an issue after reboot? it might be worth trying if booting the previous kernel fixes it as well
[16:29] <pgraner> seb128, ack, let me reboot into the old kernel
[16:30] <seb128> Sweetshark, qengho, chrisccoulson, didrocks, Laney, jasoncwarner, kenvandine, mlankhorst, cyphermox, mterry, robru, tkamppeter, attente: hey, it's meeting time!
[16:30] <didrocks> hey!
[16:30] <attente> hello!
[16:30] <chrisccoulson> yo!
[16:30] <seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2013-01-22
[16:30] <kenvandine> yo!
[16:30] <qengho> ohayoo.
[16:30]  * mlankhorst still unsure why he joins, ah well
[16:31] <mterry> hi
[16:31] <Sweetshark> o/
[16:31] <seb128> mlankhorst, are you up during the evening meeting with the other xorg guys?
[16:31] <mlankhorst> nah too late for me :)
[16:32] <seb128> k, so that's why you join this one, you need to pick one ;-)
[16:32] <seb128> let's get started
[16:32] <seb128> Sweetshark, hey
[16:32] <robru> hey! I'm awake! whaaaa?
[16:32] <seb128> robru, good morning ;-)
[16:33] <robru> seb128, morning. I may go back to sleep after this meeting though ;-)
[16:33] <mlankhorst> didn't know the other team had a meeting though
[16:33] <seb128> Sweetshark, do you have a weekly summary ready?
[16:33] <Sweetshark> seb128: added on the wiki
[16:33] <Sweetshark> Thanks to jibel, we have a LibreOffice bibisect binrepo at http://people.canonical.com/~j-lallement/libreoffice/binrepo/ being populated from the QA labs
[16:33] <Sweetshark> 3.5.7 SRU still waiting for feedback from SRU-team
[16:33] <Sweetshark> 3.6.5rc2 for quantal in the works (hopefully done today)
[16:34] <Sweetshark> LibreOffice 4.0beta2 in review
[16:34] <Sweetshark> PPA backports policy mess (discussed with pitti and ricotz)
[16:34] <seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
[16:34] <seb128> I will try to ping the SRU guys
[16:34] <seb128> I see you have an agenda item, we will get to it after the updates round
[16:34] <seb128> qengho, hey
[16:34] <qengho>  [desktop-r-chromiumbrowser-improvements]
[16:34] <qengho> 6DONE, 3deferrable / 12
[16:34] <qengho> 1) getting ARM building. NEON support is a bit wonky.  LP:#1084852
[16:34] <qengho> 2) dependent on 1, release new v24 for raring and all stable releases.
[16:34] <qengho> EOF
[16:35] <qengho> That bug describes *a* problem, but it's not really right.
[16:35] <seb128> qengho, that bug you listed in 1) is closed for precise, does it mean you got chromium to build on precise/armfh?
[16:36] <qengho> seb128: No.  Closed state is wrong too.
[16:36] <qengho> seb128: I can't change it, right now.
[16:36] <seb128> ok
[16:36] <seb128> qengho, thanks
[16:36] <seb128> chrisccoulson, hey
[16:37] <chrisccoulson> hi :)
[16:37] <chrisccoulson> right, for me:
[16:37] <chrisccoulson> - Firefox 18.0.1 release
[16:37] <chrisccoulson> - Busy upstreaming a bunch of patches
[16:37] <chrisccoulson> - Working on dropping our menubar addon entirely
[16:37] <chrisccoulson> - Investigating some memory leaks in Firefox
[16:37] <chrisccoulson> and i've just fixed the biggest leak (bug 1103050) ;)
[16:37] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1103050 in libdbusmenu (Ubuntu) "Leak in method call handlers for calls that don't require a reply" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1103050
[16:38] <seb128> chrisccoulson, what will replace the menubar addon?
[16:38] <chrisccoulson> seb128, support in firefox itself
[16:38] <seb128> great!
[16:38] <chrisccoulson> it's getting more difficult to support an addon now, with upstream moving more interfaces to their shiny new DOM bindings
[16:39] <chrisccoulson> eg, https://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/fd642fb004e6 totally broke our addon last week
[16:39] <chrisccoulson> so it's time to get rid of it now :)
[16:39] <seb128> k, makes sense
[16:39] <seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks, and well done on fixing another dbusmenu bug, be careful or you will end up maintaining it ;-)
[16:39] <seb128> didrocks, hey
[16:40] <didrocks> hey hey
[16:40] <didrocks> We now have the unity stack itself as part of the daily release process. \o/ Now still need some components to finish their transitionning and having tests running. Tests are being written for it as documentation (see first blog post at http://blog.didrocks.fr/post/Unity%3A-release-early%2C-release-often%E2%80%A6-release-daily%21)
[16:40] <chrisccoulson> heh, i want to avoid maintaining dbusmenu ;)
[16:40] <didrocks> On another note, finished the work to have one workspace by default with the g-c-c option side and "show desktop" launcher icon support.
[16:40] <didrocks> ..
[16:41] <Laney> Is there any documentation for distro people wanting to land fixes to the daily packages?
[16:41] <seb128> didrocks, thanks, not sure what other things but the unity daily landing being finally on rocks for me
[16:41] <didrocks> Laney: that is coming with the blog posts I'm writing, I'll turn that into a wiki page as well
[16:42] <didrocks> Laney: basically it's just "getting your fix upstream"
[16:42] <didrocks> and wait for the next day
[16:42] <mterry> Laney, debian/ is in trunk now
[16:42] <didrocks> for urgent things, like retrying a landing, mterry, cyphermox, kenvandine and robru will be knowledgeable starting from thursday :)
[16:42] <Laney> yeah but I was just confused about not pushing to the branch, what to do with the changelog and stuff like that
[16:43] <mterry> Laney, you don't push directly, but just file a merge.  Update the changelog and things in debian/ like normal, since that is in trunk
[16:43]  * Laney nods
[16:43] <Laney> would be good to have it written down somewhere more permenant (don't want to get into the details now) ;-)
[16:43] <Laney> thanks!
[16:43] <mterry> Laney, though if you link your branch to a bug, debian/changelog gets updated automatically
[16:44] <didrocks> Laney: that's planned, just need time :)
[16:44] <didrocks> you have the intro up there ^
[16:44] <Laney> mterry: (yeah, stuff ike that and the commit message you can set in MPs)
[16:44] <didrocks> more to come :)
[16:44] <Laney> (cool)
[16:45] <seb128> thanks for the replies guys
[16:45] <seb128> moving on
[16:45] <seb128> Laney, hey
[16:45] <Laney> erm
[16:45] <Laney> I just broke my paste, one second
[16:46] <Laney> More gstreamer porting. Split out a telepathy-farstream-0.4 package for universe KDE stuff & moved the main package forward. Uploaded a ported empathy. Some stragglers remain as outlined on the pad. Working on pidgin but it's crashing ATM. Also been tinkering around the language-selector/lang/fontconfig issue (bug #1043031). Made progress with ja_JP. zh is more difficult, but work continues. Helped with updating GLib to 2.35 ...
[16:46] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1043031 in language-selector (Ubuntu) "ja/zh fontconfig configuration only applied when locale is set 'natively'" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1043031
[16:46] <Laney> ... (seems Debian doesn't want this in exp so we'll diverge for a bit but still maintain it in svn there). HDD failed and uncovered some plymouth/mdadm bugs but mainly mdadm saved the day ;-). Patch piloted (uploaded unity-2d to precise).
[16:46] <Laney> ☭
[16:46] <seb128> thanks for the unity-2d to precise, it was waiting for a while
[16:46] <Laney> yeah, I was a bit surprised at that one
[16:47] <seb128> Laney, where are we with the gstreamer transition btw? almost done?
[16:47] <Laney> yeah, mostly
[16:47] <seb128> great
[16:47] <seb128> Laney, thanks
[16:47] <Laney> there's pidgin and libubuntuone
[16:48] <seb128> is dobey helping for libubuntuone? or is the u1 team porting it?
[16:48] <Laney> LO comes with 4.0 and bluez-gstreamer is going to be part of gstreamer itself
[16:48] <Laney> no I'll do that but it mainly deals with fluendo stuff which doesn't really exist for 1.0 yet
[16:49] <dobey> seb128: porting libubuntuone to what?
[16:49] <seb128> ok, I've been sending some emails about that, we can discuss it off meeting if you want
[16:49] <Laney> gstreamer 1.0
[16:49] <seb128> dobey, gstreamer 0.10 -> 1.0
[16:49] <dobey> oh
[16:49] <Laney> sure
[16:50] <dobey> is gst 0.10 going away for good in 13.04, or just off the image?
[16:50] <seb128> Laney, thanks, moving on
[16:50] <seb128> kenvandine, hey
[16:50] <mterry> dobey, off image
[16:50] <kenvandine> Fixed out of tree builds in libaccounts-qt and libsignon-qt
[16:50] <kenvandine> Prepared dual build (qt4/qt5) packaging branches for libaccounts-qt and signon
[16:50] <Laney> (the latter, no way we'll port everything)
[16:50] <pitti> dobey: it's supposed to provide (the most important parts of) the pygtk API as an adapter to GI, as you can't mix the real pygtk and GI
[16:51] <kenvandine>  /THATSALLFOLKS
[16:52] <dobey> Laney, mterry: ok, then i think we can just ignore libu1 for now; it's already off the image (rb plug-in doesn't use it any more), and we still need to decide what to do with libu1 wrt u1ms being moved to the web only, upstream. but i may very well just rip all the gst-using code out anyway
[16:52] <Laney> dobey: ah, that would be good
[16:52] <Laney> I'd rather get rid of shonky plugin installing code if possible :P
[16:52] <seb128> kenvandine, thanks
[16:53] <seb128> cyphermox, hey
[16:53] <cyphermox> yo!
[16:53] <cyphermox> indicator-session should build properly today, fixing some minor issues with g_type_init() blocking build for some indicators and xorg-gtest changes also failing some builds, libdbusmenu to be looked at by charles...
[16:53] <cyphermox> NM stuff: building the new ModemManager API in a PPA for people who want to help test it, there should be a proper release of NM (without that new API) which is what we should get in the end in Raring
[16:53] <cyphermox> Also trying to build/update connman in Debian and Ubuntu, but that's currently blocked on a kernel header issue.
[16:53] <cyphermox> 0x00
[16:54] <dobey> pitti: so something already using gi would have no reason to use it, right?
[16:54] <pitti> dobey: if it already works with Gtk through GI, I can't think of a reason to use
[16:55] <seb128> cyphermox, thanks
[16:55] <seb128> mterry, hey
[16:55] <mterry> - I've spent quite some time investigating adding support for AppArmor confined apps to gnome-keyring; work is ongoing
[16:55] <mterry> - Fixed an upgrade bug in ubuntu-release-upgrader
[16:55] <mterry> - Finished off a small UI rewrite branch for update-manager (I just blogged about it actually)
[16:55] <mterry> - And set up my new computer (a Dell sputnik) for development work; it's been very good so far
[16:55] <dobey> pitti: great, thanks
[16:55] <mterry> EOF
[16:55] <pitti> dobey: it's mostly meant to make the porting from pygtk2 easier, as that is an "all or nothing" port, i. e. you can't test your program in the middle of porting while it's still using both
[16:56] <seb128> mterry, oh, you got one of those Dell, great ;-)
[16:56] <seb128> thanks
[16:56] <seb128> mlankhorst, hey, short status update?
[16:56] <mlankhorst> - doing updates to xserver lts-stack for 12.04.2 release (LP: #1086345, #927424, and various build fixes)
[16:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1086345 in libdrm (Ubuntu Precise) "Quantal-LTS-stack: Showing low-resolution screen on shutdown/reboot" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1086345
[16:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 927424 in plymouth (Ubuntu Precise) "Please backport commit to enable building without irrelevant drm libs on some arches" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/927424
[16:56] <mlankhorst> - working with release team to trim size of mesa down to old levels (done, I hope)
[16:56] <mlankhorst> - fixing mesa vdpau bugs (also done, I hope)
[16:56] <mlankhorst> longjmp();
[16:57] <seb128> great
[16:57] <seb128> mlankhorst, how is the backported stack looking for 12.04.2?
[16:57] <mlankhorst> I think it's done, unless something urgent pops up
[16:58] <mterry> I like how seb128  has to solve the halting problem to determine if a status update is finished (albeit trivial examples of it)
[16:58] <mpt> Hmm, the Description for ubuntu-restricted-extras says "Installing this package will pull in support for ... DVD playback. Please note that this does not install libdvdcss2..." -- but as far as I can tell, it doesn't depend on any software related to DVDs at all.
[16:58] <seb128> mlankhorst, great
[16:58] <mpt> (or Recommend)
[16:59] <seb128> mterry, heh :p
[16:59] <mterry> mpt, in the middle of a meeting right now, hold up a few minutes
[16:59] <seb128> robru, hey
[16:59] <robru> seb128, hi!
[16:59] <robru> * Inline some online-accounts packages for mardy (two more to go)
[16:59] <robru> * Wrote up some documentation aimed at third-party plugin developers for lp:friends
[16:59] <robru> * Add some DBus method calls to python-dbusmock making it easier to use in non-python tests. (pitti accepted my patches! Yay!)
[16:59] <robru> * Integrate python-dbusmock into libfriends' Vala testsuite. Still waiting on kenvandine to approve that MP ;-)
[17:00] <robru> sys.exit()
[17:00] <kenvandine> robru, today :)
[17:00] <robru> kenvandine, ;-)
[17:00] <didrocks> robru: and you are going to bootstrap the process with upstream to get integration tests running as part of webcred stack, isn't it?
[17:00] <seb128> robru, nice to see the online accounts packages getting inlined! ;-)
[17:01] <robru> seb128, well, "inlined" may be somewhat generous. mardy still has to do manual merges from code.google
[17:01] <robru> it's only "inlined" to launchpad, not in the official upstream repo
[17:01] <robru> didrocks, yes, I suppose I will bootstrap also
[17:01] <robru> had forgotten about bootstrapping ;-)
[17:01]  * didrocks can't wait for that! :-)
[17:01] <seb128> oh, right, some of those are not maintained in launchpad...
[17:01] <robru> seb128, most
[17:01] <seb128> right
[17:02] <didrocks> robru: I mean, helping them to have integration tests running so that we can have daily release on webcreds :-)
[17:02] <seb128> robru, thanks
[17:02] <robru> didrocks, as long as they are the ones writing the tests it should be ok ;-)
[17:02] <robru> seb128, yw ;-)
[17:02] <didrocks> yep ;)
[17:02] <pitti> robru: FYI, 0.4.0 is in raring since yesterday
[17:02] <robru> pitti, excellent!
[17:02] <seb128> moving on
[17:02] <seb128> tkamppeter, hey
[17:04] <seb128> hum, not there? moving on...
[17:04] <seb128> attente, hey
[17:04] <attente> seb128, hi!
[17:04] <attente> right now, the gtk 2 module is not working, but the gtk 3 module could use some general testing
[17:04] <attente> so the packages that are needed are: unity-gtk3-module, gtk 3, and indicator-appmenu, all available from ppa:attente/unity-gtk-module
[17:04] <attente> if anyone would like to help me test this, please be very careful not to use the gtk 2 packages in the ppa since they break pretty much every gtk 2 application
[17:04] <attente> the project page is https://launchpad.net/unity-gtk-module
[17:04] <attente> this week should be getting the gtk 2 module working, and probably dealing with a ton of the bugs in the gtk 3 module :)
[17:04] <attente> ^D
[17:05] <seb128> attente, great to see things getting in shape
[17:05] <attente> thanks seb128
[17:05] <seb128> attente, what is required to test? should gtk be rebuilt without the old patch? does it conflict with appmenu-gtk3?
[17:06] <tkamppeter> seb128, I did an improvemnt of page size recognition in the CUPS Raster driver of Ghostscript, there are problems with some HP inkjets, and I lost a lot of time fighting with the Pandaboard until I got a desktop in my monitor's resolution (incompatibility with monitor, worked only through an HDMI switch).
[17:06] <attente> the gtk in the ppa doesn't have the menu proxy patch, so updating to that should do it
[17:06] <attente> if appmenu-gtk3 is left alone, the module still works
[17:07] <seb128> attente, ah ok, you have a gtk in your ppa, great ... btw sorry for letting you fight with packaging, if you need help or having question for packaging stuff please ask her on the channel, we have enough tz coverage that you should have people around able to help you
[17:08] <seb128> those who feel adventurous, feel free to test ^
[17:08] <seb128> attente, I will give it a try later and tell you how it goes for me
[17:08] <seb128> attente, thanks
[17:08] <seb128> tkamppeter, ok, thanks
[17:08] <attente> seb128, thanks for your help, it was good to learn the basics
[17:09] <seb128> me: I was at a sprint last week and travelling, in between I worked a bit on the nexus7 memory usage problems and reviewed some of the blueprints/changes in the work
[17:09] <seb128> .
[17:10] <seb128> Did I forgot anyone? any topic/comment before we discuss libreoffice backports (item from Sweetshark)?
[17:11] <Laney> I'll have one after ;-)
[17:11] <seb128> Laney, go first if yours is short
[17:12] <Laney> oh ok
[17:12] <seb128> I will probably dismiss the meeting and not keep everyone to discuss libreoffice
[17:12] <seb128> so those who are interested by the topic please stay a bit after the meeting
[17:12] <Laney> so last week I raised on the ml about dropping gnome-media
[17:12] <Laney> didn't get any real objections on there unless there's something stuck in moderation
[17:12] <seb128> the sound recorder?
[17:12] <Laney> yeah
[17:13] <seb128> we got several oem-high priority bugs in the past when it was not working well, including in precise, they even spent time to fix some of those bugs
[17:13] <Laney> mpt said in the medium/long term they would like to include kazam which should get that functionality
[17:13] <seb128> that makes me think it's either on a list of requirement/important
[17:13] <Laney> hmm
[17:14] <seb128> or that they just had to make work correctly what is installed
[17:14] <seb128> it would be good to check with them which one it is
[17:14] <seb128> I will take an action to figure that out
[17:14] <Laney> it's dead upstream but there is a sort-of gnome3-ish rewrite
[17:14] <Laney> which doesn't really work yet but would be a good point if we want to keep on with a sound recorder IMO
[17:14] <seb128> and there is no working sound recorder in the whole universe we could use?
[17:14] <Laney> good point to start from
[17:15] <seb128> it seems like a simple feature and something that should have a dozen universe variants
[17:15] <seb128> but maybe it's not interesting to people ;-)
[17:15] <Laney> depends if any of them are good enough
[17:15] <Laney> nobody chimed in with any on list
[17:16] <seb128> Laney, thanks, I will follow up on the list discussion once I figure out if oem cares about it
[17:16] <Laney> ack
[17:16] <seb128> other topics?
[17:16] <seb128> seems not
[17:16] <seb128> thanks everybody
[17:17] <seb128> Sweetshark, so, libreoffice backports ... tell us ;-)
[17:17] <Sweetshark> as for the PPA policy here is the tl;dr version of what I proposed: "never upload a never (dependency) package to the LibreOffice ppa as long we are on the same major libreoffice version as the ubuntu series"
[17:17] <Sweetshark> so something like having libexttextcat 3.3.1-2/precise in the libreoffice-3-5 PPA shouldnt happen in the future (as precise has 3.2.0 and thats what upstream released with)
[17:17] <Sweetshark> this is to allow SRUs to be tested there unmodified (testing something different than what will be SRUed kinda defeats the point)
[17:17] <Sweetshark> previously there where even newer deps than upstream does with a given LibreOffice major (e.g. libexttextcat 3.2.x was used upstream with LO 3.5). I dont think that is useful, given the regression risk with such an untested combination
[17:17] <Sweetshark> I fear we still need an extra PPA for precise SRU testing (were we cant take back the existing upload with is likely widely deployed) as the libreoffice-3-5 PPA has already dependency updates that prevent a unmodified SRU to land there
[17:17] <Sweetshark> does this make sense or does somebody have a better proposal?
[17:18] <seb128> Sweetshark, what's the purpose of the ppa? you wrote backports on the wiki page ... is that for backports or SRUs?
[17:19] <seb128> Sweetshark, we are getting libreoffice 4 in raring, is that going to a ppa for older series?
[17:19] <seb128> or is the ppa e.g for the libreoffice 3.5.7 update for precise?
[17:21] <Sweetshark> seb128: currently we have four ppas: the generic ppa, which will ideally hold the newest major LO version on all ubuntu series (that is 4 on all series) and libreoffice-3-6 (which has the latest 3.6 version on all series), -3-5 (same for the older LO major) and prereleases (which holds upstream betas)
[17:22] <Sweetshark> so what I want is that I can upload a 3.5.x SRU for precise unmodified in the libreoffice-3-5 ppa and a 3.6.x SRU for quantal to the libreoffice-3-6 PPA
[17:23] <seb128> can't you just make a sru ppa and upload 3.5 to the precise serie there and 3.6 to the quantal one?
[17:24] <Sweetshark> seb128: yes, except that most users are on the existing ppas. so I would lose testers.
[17:25] <seb128> ok, so what do you need to change exactly compared to today and why?
[17:25] <seb128> sorry I miss a bit of context there
[17:28] <Sweetshark> seb128: the change is essentially not to update libreoffice dependencies to something newer than the upstream major release did. E.g. libreoffice-3-5 PPA has a update of libexttextcat which need a slightly different LO package than the one that would be SRUed as the latest libexttextcat version in the PPA is different from the one in precise/main.
[17:29] <Sweetshark> thus if I copy the SRU package to that PPA it breaks stuff for people.
[17:30] <seb128> Sweetshark, staying on the same serie seems to make sense to me yes
[17:32] <Sweetshark> seb128: my point is that one should only upload a newer dep of LibreOffice to the libreoffice-3-5 PPA if that is intended to be SRUed.
[17:33] <seb128> Sweetshark, right, that makes sense to me if the goal is to test what is SRU material and not to have the crack of the day current version
[17:35] <Sweetshark> if one uploads a newer LibreOffice _major_ version than was in the Ubuntu release (e.g. in the generic PPA LibreOffice 3.6.x for precise), then its perfectly fine to upload newer deps along as that version wont be SRUed anyway.
[17:35] <Sweetshark> (we dont SRU a different major, heh)
[17:35] <seb128> Sweetshark, it's a bit confusing that you use the same ppa for SRUs candidate and new series
[17:36] <lool> seb128: I poked Oliver and Steve L on the Nexus 7 stuff, and updated the notes but I've discovered https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/raring-targets today, so will have to digest that; that might be the best place to contribute the smem instructions to
[17:36] <lool> there seems to be a lot documented there already
[17:37] <Sweetshark> seb128: yes, but thats how users see it: "I use the -3-5 ppa and when I want to update I can go to -3-6 or the generic ppa".
[17:37] <seb128> lool, ok, thanks, do you know who is working on those targets/defining them?
[17:37] <Sweetshark> seb128: The complexity is for the packagers.
[17:38] <seb128> Sweetshark, ok ... well in any case what you described before (e.g "keep the libraries on the same versions when the ppa has SRU candidate packages") seems fine to me
[17:38] <seb128> I would probably have made the ppas differently
[17:38] <seb128> e.g one "SRU" and one "current serie"
[17:38] <lool> seb128: it's a myriad of blueprints https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/topic-raring-desktop-targets-for-embedded
[17:38] <seb128> rather than 3.5, 3.6 etc
[17:38] <seb128> lool, do you know who is driving them?
[17:38] <lool> seb128: some workitems on Oliver, Martin etc.
[17:39] <lool> seb128: As a whole?  no; I know ogra_ is running some Nexus 7 meetings though
[17:42] <Sweetshark> seb128: yes, then people would complain that they want to update to 3.6.x on precise now (because upstream 3.6 is reasonably stable), but they dont want the possibly not-that-stable-yet LibreOffice 4.0.0 yet, bit instead stay with the stable 3.6.x updates ....
[17:45] <seb128> Sweetshark, well, you should have a ppa for SRU, one for "current stable", I wouldn't bother doing 4 for old series atm
[17:45] <seb128> stable should be current 3.6
[17:45] <seb128> Sweetshark, but, well, you are doing the work, so your call
[17:45] <seb128> your way just seems a bit more confusing
[17:45] <seb128> and it's a bit harder to know what/where can get new libraries
[17:49] <Sweetshark> seb128: I have some 10-20 mails in my inbox on LO4 release day screaming for backports for at least precise/quantal, possibly also for lucid. Im quite happy if ricotz does those and I can point people to that.
[17:49] <Sweetshark> s/I have/I will have/
[17:49] <mterry> mpt, heyo, btw.  Maybe libavcodec-extra-53 has some codecs used in decoding DVDs?
[17:50] <seb128> Sweetshark, ok
[17:50] <ogra_> seb128, victorp and achiang
[17:51] <victorp> ogra_, ugh?
[17:51] <ogra_> victorp, the blueprint above
[17:51] <ogra_> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/topic-raring-desktop-targets-for-embedded
[17:52] <Sweetshark> seb128: anyway, I will discuss with ricotz -- maybe he likes you proposal.
[17:52] <seb128> ogra_, victorp: we were talking about the number of different team/groups working on similar nexus7 work items, communication seem suboptimal at best
[17:52] <victorp> ogra_, yes that is the blueprint "topic" used to report on status.u.c
[17:54] <ogra_> seb128, i agree, i stated the weekly meeting again last week though
[17:54] <victorp> ogra_, that will help
[17:54] <seb128> do we have a public mailing list for nexus7 work?
[17:54] <victorp> seb128,  as this is a desktop image, are you the lead for this?
[17:55] <ogra_> ubuntu-devel
[17:55] <seb128> victorp, well, I started leading work from our side, but we discovered that some people were doing similar work on non ubuntu channel and not communicating, which is what raised the issue ... we need to sort that out and get everybody at the same place
[17:56] <victorp> seb128, ok - but I thought the "official" channel is #ubuntu-arm
[17:56] <ogra_> well, friday 16:00 UTC in #ubuntu-meeting ;)
[17:57] <ogra_> and yes, #ubuntu-arm beyond that
[17:57] <ogra_> and ubuntu-devel for mails
[17:57] <seb128> victorp, I didn't even know we had an #ubuntu-arm, we have been doing our work on "normal" channels, e.g #ubuntu-desktop and #ubuntu-devel
[17:57] <victorp> seb128, we had #ubuntu-arm for ever
[17:57] <seb128> I guess it's time to get everybody Cced in one email and to sort out who works on what and what channels/lists we use
[17:58] <seb128> victorp, well, I was never on that and I didn't know about it, I though one of the goals was to stop having difference between arch/images and work on "Ubuntu"
[17:58] <seb128> anyway, let's move on
[17:58] <ogra_> its only 4 years old :)
[17:59] <victorp> seb128,  seems like you need to read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/Developers - General info
[17:59] <seb128> ogra_, I'm not on all ubuntu channels, enough activity by following 10 of those
[17:59] <ogra_> yeah, agreed
[17:59] <seb128> victorp, thanks
[17:59] <ogra_> i'm not on all either
[17:59] <victorp> seb128, but I guess by non-ubuntu channel you dont mean #ubuntu-arm
[18:00] <seb128> victorp, well, I wish the work was in "mainline ubuntu" and no specific to arm, we said we need to make the image fit for mobiles targets, it's not arm specific work for most part
[18:01] <seb128> victorp, it's like plugging leaks in standard services, being smarter about what we run, that will impact the intel image in the same way
[18:02] <ogra_> well, ubuntu-arm surely doesnt need to be our work channel, it is traditionaly the arm support channel though
[18:02] <victorp> seb128, If you want to me channels I am fine with that. I would rather focus on knocking work items from blueprint to be honest
[18:03] <seb128> victorp, well, we discovered that some work was duplicate (e.g resources wasted) because different groups worked on similar things within knowing about each others, which is what I'm trying to sort
[18:04] <ogra_> seb128, well, it would help if people attended the meeting for a start
[18:04] <seb128> victorp, ogra_: who need somebody in charge of coordinating ... who would that be (I'm happy to step up if needed)
[18:06] <ogra_> well, achiang used to do that... alex, are you out of the project now ?
[18:06] <victorp> ogra_, no he isnt ;) it needs to be someone from the desktop team
[18:06] <seb128> ogra_, sorry I was in SF for a sprint last friday
[18:06] <victorp> you should ask jasoncwarner
[18:07] <ogra_> seb128, yeah, not blaming you, it was also short notice last week
[18:07] <achiang> ogra_: for one, i'm just maxed out at the moment, but even if that wasn't true, the real answer is that the role is properly owned by the desktop team. it would be weird if i was in charge. :)
[18:07] <ogra_> but someone had to start it again
[18:08] <ogra_> achiang, well, you were in charge of the preparation
[18:08] <achiang> desktop are the stewards, i'm just a helper who can go shake the appropriate trees if needed
[18:08] <ogra_> and kind of left a gap
[18:08] <achiang> ogra_: nod, we were filling a gap, and then yeah... created a new gap. :-/
[18:08] <ogra_> well, we'll get it filled again
[18:08] <ogra_> :)
[18:09] <achiang> ogra_: seb128: so let's figure out how to close the gap. 1) weekly meetings are starting back up, so that's good. 2) seb128 volunteered to lead coordination efforts
[18:09] <achiang> do we need a (3) ?
[18:09] <ogra_> we can make up 3 at the meeting ;)
[18:09] <chrisccoulson> seb128, can we have this in our cairo? http://cgit.freedesktop.org/cairo/commit/src/cairo-xlib-surface-shm.c?id=5d21c9e224617110678a5b854a6a41049a02fca2
[18:09] <chrisccoulson> :)
[18:10] <chrisccoulson> it fixes another leak in firefox ;)
[18:10] <chrisccoulson> (and probably everywhere else too)
[18:10] <seb128> ogra_, achiang, lool: ok, let's sort that out friday at the meeting, I will pick coordination up from there
[18:10] <seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, firefox uses system cairo now? ;-)
[18:10] <achiang> +1
[18:10] <seb128> chrisccoulson, when do you apply for coredev btw? :p
[18:10] <achiang> seb128: ogra_: thanks
[18:10] <seb128> achiang, thanks as well ;-)
[18:11] <chrisccoulson> seb128, it doesn't use the system cairo directly, but it gets used by the native theme rendering
[18:11] <ogra_> seb128, do you think he'll get approved ?
[18:11] <chrisccoulson> heh, coredev ;)
[18:11] <ogra_> with less than 5 years experience
[18:11] <seb128> ogra_, likely not :p
[18:12] <seb128> ogra_, will give me another reason to be grumpy ;-)
[18:12]  * ogra_ pondersbto apply for DMB since that mail thread started
[18:12] <chrisccoulson> heh, i was thinking about doing that too
[18:13] <seb128> ogra_, you should
[18:13] <seb128> chrisccoulson, anyway, I can get the patch in, or sponsor an upload for you... ;-)
[18:14] <ogra_> heh, yeah, looking if i can free up the time is the issue
[18:17] <chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, is there no bzr branch for cairo?
[18:18] <seb128> hum, I don't think so, I think we were in sync for Debian too regularly for that
[18:18] <seb128> just put a debdiff online ;-)
[18:24] <chrisccoulson> seb128, ok, i'll do that in a second. just testing to make sure this build works
[18:24] <chrisccoulson> and need to do another run with valgrind too, which is slow ;)
[18:25] <chrisccoulson> it's been a productive day today, getting to the bottom of the 2 largest firefox leaks :)
[18:38] <achiang> ogra_: poke, how's your bandwidth these days? any chance you could try this? LP: #1081734
[18:38] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1081734 in eglibc (Ubuntu Precise) "malloc hangs when ltp mallocstress is run repeatedly" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1081734
[18:39] <achiang> ogra_: nvidia want to get that SRU'ed into precise, but i don't have any cycles to test
[18:40] <ogra_> achiang, hmm, libc is more infinity-land
[18:40] <achiang> ogra_: yeah, i poked him, but he's ignoring me. ;)
[18:40] <ogra_> might be off today
[18:40] <ogra_> i havent seen him all day
[18:41] <ogra_> oh, he just showed up in #ubuntu-release
[18:42] <achiang> ogra_: it might just be a matter of applying the patch and then running the ltp test
[18:42] <achiang> ogra_: ah, he just woke up in -devel too. :)
[18:42] <ogra_> yup
[19:36] <mterry> Is autologin broken for anyone else?
[19:36] <mterry> (in raring)
[19:38] <seb128> mterry, dunno but I can test later, I don't want to reboot now (my user is ecryptfs so I don't use it, but I can turn on autologin for my test user and see on next boot)
[19:39] <seb128> mterry, I see you just uploaded accountsservice, maybe a bug in that version?
[19:39] <seb128> mterry, do you want me to fetch that one or try with current raring?
[19:40] <mterry> seb128, OK thanks.  The version of accountsservice shouldn't matter.  That just affected the reporting of whether autologin was enabled or not
[19:40] <mterry> seb128, which was broken.  But in addition, the feature itself isn't working for me
[19:40] <seb128> mterry, shouldn't/doesn't :p
[19:40] <mterry> I can see it try in the lightdm logs
[19:40] <mterry> seb128, doesn't.  Was broken for me before and after that update
[19:40] <seb128> let's see
[19:42]  * mterry reboots to try again
[19:45] <seb128> mterry, works for me
[19:45] <seb128> mterry, is the account you try to log in ecryptfs protected (just asking in case)
[19:45] <mterry> seb128, yeah you gave me the idea to check a non-ecryptfs user
[19:45] <mterry> seb128, it worked for me too then
[19:45] <seb128> lol
[19:45] <mterry> seb128, so I'll file a bug and give it to rob
[19:46] <seb128> that's a bug, autologin is not supposed to be possible to set for ecryptfs users
[19:46] <seb128> that used to work in the past
[19:46] <mterry> seb128, oh god
[19:46] <mterry> seb128, you're right.  I forgot about that
[19:46] <mterry> seb128, good that it's working 'correctly' then.
[19:46] <seb128> mterry, if lightdm can figure how to log you in, your ecryption is not as strong as you think it is ;-)
[19:47] <mterry> seb128, yeah yeah.  I'm just an idiot.  :)
[19:47] <mterry> let me see why gnome-control-center is being so generous
[19:48] <seb128> mterry, 55_user_accounts_hide_controls.patch is supposed to take care of it
[19:49] <seb128> mterry, bzr seems to point you as the author of the patch btw ;-)
[19:51] <mterry> seb128, yup
[19:51] <mterry> :)
[19:59] <jbicha> nice :)
[20:01] <jbicha> it'd be nice to get accountsservice 0.6.30 into raring as it would be 1 less thing to maintain in the gnome3-staging ppa
[20:11] <jbicha> gthumb now uses Ctrl+Delete for send to trash too :(
[20:14] <mterry> seb128, hmph.  Seems *someone* that updated to 3.6.3 didn't double confirm that my patch still worked.  Upstream changed code out from under me, but I'll fix it in a sec
[20:14] <seb128> mterry, /me looks somewhere else, dunno what you mean by "someone" there ;-)
[20:14] <seb128> mterry, thanks for fixing it
[20:14] <mterry> :)
[20:19] <mterry> cyphermox, I see that indicator-session isn't doing daily builds yet?
[20:29] <cyphermox> it should be working since this morning
[20:50] <robru> anybody else seeing bug 1099589?
[20:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1099589 in devscripts (Ubuntu) "wrap-and-sort crashed with TypeError in save(): must be str, not bytes" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1099589
[20:51] <robru> xnox, ^^ ;-)
[20:57] <mterry> cyphermox, oh neat.  Looking forward to it!  I've got a work item sitting in indicator-session trunk  :)
[20:58] <mterry> robru, I get it too
[21:04] <robru> mterry, thanks, I'm not crazy ;-) somebody had marked it as a duplicate of something else that got fixed, but I'm still experiencing it
[21:05] <robru> mterry, btw, you in a rush for that mp you sent me? I'll probably get to that tomorrow
[21:06] <mterry> robru, no rush
[22:01] <jasoncwarner> RAOF TheMuso bryce hey AU folk. Meeting reminder https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2013-01-22 (I think my calendar switched to the right time ;) )
[22:03]  * bryce waves
[22:04] <bryce> jasoncwarner, so I hear you're the infection vector this trip?
[22:05] <jasoncwarner> bryce I think didrocks was patient zero ;)
[22:06] <jasoncwarner> bryce anything you wanted to update for the meeting? TheMuso same question? RAOF you would be last ;)
[22:07] <bryce> currently working on nexus7 patches for some touch issues.
[22:07] <jasoncwarner> bryce: nice
[22:07] <bryce> meeting tomorrow with tvoss to coordinate some display server integration stuff
[22:07] <bryce> last week focused on getting bunches of fixes into xdiagnose; still have a few follow ups to do there but it looks good
[22:08] <jasoncwarner> nice, thanks bryce
[22:09] <bryce> oh, and fixed vnc4 on armhf
[22:09] <bryce> (wasn't building)
[22:09] <bryce> jasoncwarner, think that covers it
[22:09] <bryce> oh, one issue I wanted to bring up
[22:10] <jasoncwarner> bryce: ok
[22:10] <bryce> I looked into our currently pending SRU's the other day.  Things generally look good, except for the proprietary drivers which are a mess
[22:10] <bryce> for both -nvidia and -fglrx we have a gob of SRUs blocked on verification failures or other misc. problems
[22:11] <bryce> I'm not sure what to do with these
[22:12] <jasoncwarner> thanks, bryce.
[22:12] <RAOF> Ah, good. This morning is my SRU day; I thought that last time I'd pushed everything appropriate for testing in -proposed.
[22:13] <TheMuso> Nothing from me other than whats on the wiki page.
[22:13] <jasoncwarner> RAOF perhaps take a look at the things bryce raised? :)
[22:13] <jasoncwarner> (perfect timing)
[22:14] <bryce> RAOF, the problem is mostly SRUs were verification has failed or we're waiting endlessly on someone to do verification on quantal or something
[22:14] <RAOF> Story of SRUs in general ☹
[22:14] <bryce> I added all the SRU's to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/TODO with what it looked like the next action is for each
[22:15] <bryce> RAOF, any you can help plink off or move forward will help; I'll pitch in as well as I have time
[22:15] <bryce> jasoncwarner, done for real now :-)
[22:15] <jasoncwarner> bryce: :) thanks.
[22:16] <jasoncwarner> Thanks eastern update! /end
[22:17] <RAOF> bryce: Have we determined when we'll be rolling out display server integration stuff more widely?
[22:19] <bryce> RAOF, will probably have things more pinned down after tomorrow's meeting but the schedule I showed you a while back is the current plan
[22:21] <bryce> RAOF, let's plan to PM tomorrow to get some specific tasks and stuff laid out.
[22:22] <RAOF> I'll hunt down that email and see where my progress lines up.
[22:23] <RAOF> That's also roughly my desktop report :)
[22:23] <mlankhorst> bryce: can I ask you to make one of those version check scripts, to check precise versions of the lts-stack against what' s available in quantal?
[22:24] <bryce> RAOF, btw I emailed you some general X status Q's a couple weeks ago.  Shoot in a reply when you get a chance
[22:24] <RAOF> Urgh. More email hunting :(
[22:24] <bryce> mlankhorst, sure; do you mean like http://www.bryceharrington.org/Arsenal/ubuntu-x-swat/Reports/package-status.html ?
[22:25] <bryce> RAOF, no worries, I'll resend
[22:25] <RAOF> Thanks.
[22:25] <mlankhorst> bryce: yes :-)
[22:26] <bryce> mlankhorst, sure thing; adding it to my todo's...
[22:26] <mlankhorst> the precise -lts-quantal version should be identical if you strip off ~precise* from the version number
[22:27]  * bryce nods
[22:28] <RAOF> bryce: Ta, got it.
[22:29] <RAOF> (I got fed up with evolution dying too much and switched to Thunderbird, but am not yet comfortable)
[22:30] <bryce> heh, crashes are why I never started using gui mail programs. You would think they'd have solved all the crashes by now.
[22:31] <bryce> mutt ftw ;-)
[22:37] <RAOF> Geary's winding up to be quite nice.
[22:37] <RAOF> But then again, it's currently pretty skeletal. You get to fill in all the future awesome features :)
[22:37] <RAOF> (Such as handling >1 mail account)
[23:07] <rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, around at all?
[23:08] <jasoncwarner> hey rickspencer3 yup yup!
[23:09] <rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, so ... I have a nexus 7 challenge for your team
[23:09] <rickspencer3> see what you think
[23:09] <jasoncwarner> rickspencer3: listening ;)
[23:09] <rickspencer3> I'd like to be able to run Qt creator and work on my apps (with keyboard and mouse attached)
[23:10] <rickspencer3> so, get Qt5, Qt creator with our new Ubuntu loveliness all packagedup
[23:10] <rickspencer3> and find/fix any perf issues
[23:10] <jasoncwarner> rickspencer3 seems like a generally useful benchmark for success. don't see why we couldn't target that. Would be an all around good test of the system.
[23:10] <rickspencer3> then I could play with the touch interactions and stuff
[23:10] <rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, QtCreator works well on my little netbook, fwiw
[23:11] <jasoncwarner> rickspencer3: I'll add that as one of my usecases to the target tests.
[23:11] <rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, it would be nice to have qt Creator properly packaged anyway
[23:11] <rickspencer3> it seems like it's still slightly out of whack
[23:12] <micahg> !info qtcreator
[23:12] <ubot2> 'maverick' is not a valid distribution:
[23:12] <micahg> !info qtcreator raring
[23:12] <ubot2> 'raring' is not a valid distribution:
[23:12] <jasoncwarner> rickspencer3 yeah, that goes to the whole qt5 stuff. ETA was end of month, though I'll get an update on that one from didrocks when he wakes up tomorrow.
[23:13] <micahg> qtcreator is in raring
[23:13] <jasoncwarner> rickspencer3 though, it is all in line with our targets so I don't see a problem framing the discussion that way at all.
[23:14] <jasoncwarner> rickspencer3: thanks for the feedback and challenge...not to mention the specific testing use case ;)
[23:15] <rickspencer3> thanks jasoncwarner
[23:16] <rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, I actually think it would be nice to be able to develop directly on a device that has touch and gesture support
[23:17] <jasoncwarner> rickspencer3 I could see the appeal of that. particularly with your game ;)
[23:17] <rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, hah
[23:17] <rickspencer3> next I will ask for easy packaging tools :)
[23:19] <rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, I can't believe I am saying this ... but I am really enjoying having an IDE again
[23:21] <jasoncwarner> rickspencer3 I'm pretty happy with qtcreator as well. Though, my bar is quite low...ie...not eclipse ;)
[23:21] <rickspencer3> haha
[23:22] <rickspencer3> I've been using terminal, gedit, and pydb for so long, I forgot how civilized people live
[23:22] <rickspencer3> pdb, my best friend
[23:22] <jasoncwarner> :)
[23:24] <rickspencer3> gaaah
[23:24] <rickspencer3> with the Gimp, I can no longer find the tool for setting the pencil properties easily :/
[23:30] <chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, jasoncwarner, what's wrong with vim? ;)
[23:30] <rickspencer3> hi chrisccoulson
[23:30] <jasoncwarner> chrisccoulson sheesh...why don't you just start talking religion in the channel ;)
[23:30] <rickspencer3> I'm not man enough for VIM
[23:30] <chrisccoulson> hi rickspencer3 :)
[23:31]  * rickspencer3 kicks The Gimp
[23:31] <chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner, heh. i'll end up starting a emacs vs vim debate if i'm not careful
[23:31] <desrt> rickspencer3: remember in oakland when we had a sit-down to try to get something working properly with webkit and python and some socket that you needed to read from?
[23:31] <desrt> and how insanely complicated it was...
[23:31] <rickspencer3> desrt, heck yeah
[23:31] <rickspencer3> good times
[23:31] <desrt> rickspencer3: there's a new one-call API now to do that
[23:32] <desrt> added because of how annoyed i got on that day :)
[23:32] <rickspencer3> lol
[23:32] <rickspencer3> nice one desrt
[23:32] <rickspencer3> having users really does make one's code better
[23:32] <desrt> indeed