BarkingFishhi guys - just a word to the wise, something in the latest set of updates for raring is busted.  Apper won't download python-pycurl, claims packages are left unconfigured. if you deselct it, something else breaks, etc, ad infinitum, until you're left only upgrading firefox.00:03
Riddellwe've never used apper00:06
Riddelltry muon00:06
BarkingFishi've never used muon. i don't even have it installed.  i used kpackage until it vanished and apper took over, then carried on with apper :)00:08
BarkingFishi'll try doing it in a tty - that's solved most things before :)00:09
BarkingFishand as predicted, that fixed it.00:11
BarkingFishok, that's got most of it fixed.  still a little strange though - there's a new kernel in the update, 3.8.0-2, which has been kept back, and I can't figure out why.  00:26
yofelhow did you upgrade when it was kept back?00:27
BarkingFishtty, yofel - apper was being a pain in the privates00:27
yofelif you ran apt-get upgrade that won't install new kernels, dist-upgrade will00:27
BarkingFishthat'll be why then.00:28
yofelreason: the kernel image is a new package, only the meta package is really *upgraded*00:28
yofeland "upgrade" won't install anything new00:28
BarkingFishI hope ndiswrapper will build against 3.8.0-2 :)  I never figured out why it wouldn't build against 3.8.0-1 last night00:30
yofelthere a buildlog for the dkms module somewhere which should tell why00:32
BarkingFishthe answer to that is... no. It hasn't.  "Bad return status for module build on kernel 3.8.0-2-generic (i686)"00:32
BarkingFishyeah, just about to take a peek00:32
BarkingFishlooks like a problem with the code.  I might drop away from 1.58rc1 and go back to 1.5800:37
BarkingFishoh this is getting silly.   this is trying to build 1.5800:43
* BarkingFish bangs his head repeatedly against his desk00:44
yofelpossibly something it looks for got removed in 3.800:44
BarkingFishi hope not, or I am permanently screwed00:44
BarkingFishthere is no driver for the ar5523 - without ndiswrapper, i am shot.00:45
yofelwell, someone already filed bug 110605100:45
ubottubug 1106051 in ndiswrapper (Ubuntu) "ndiswrapper-dkms 1.58~rc1-0ubuntu1: ndiswrapper kernel module failed to build" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/110605100:45
BarkingFishok, well i'm subscribing to that now - i'll keep watch there00:47
* BarkingFish happy happy happy happy happy happy happy :D01:16
BarkingFishI don't need ndiswrapper anymore.  01:16
BarkingFishAs of kernel 3.8.0-2-generic, there is now an ar5523 module01:17
* BarkingFish bounces up and down like a roo on a pogo stick01:18
apacheloggerhooray for free drivers01:31
BarkingFishapachelogger, you bet.  I've been using ndiswrapper for almost 8 years, and finally a working ar552 driver pops up.  I can't deny i'll miss ndiswrapper's little foibles and general pain in the arse-ness, but this is about the best day since I dropped windows 11 years ago.01:35
BarkingFishespecially since ndiswrapper's dkms module wouldn't build on 3.8.0-2 - this sorta turned up at the right time01:36
BarkingFishnight guys, i'm out to get some sleep :) 2.50am here :P01:49
shadeslayerRiddell: it seems that rbelem didn't add the description and I didn't double check03:31
phoenix_firebrdRiddell: need to use ec209:21
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
phoenix_firebrdyofel: are you there?11:41
yofelmore or less yes11:42
phoenix_firebrdyofel: do you have access to the ec2?11:43
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ok11:43
yofelif anything I can get you an account on my server, has reasonable amount of bandwidth, but your sudo permissions would be limited to pbuilder11:44
phoenix_firebrdyofel: i think Riddell has added a wrong key of mine and i am denied access11:45
yofelis it even running?11:45
phoenix_firebrdyofel: not sure11:45
yofelprobably not then11:45
shadeslayerphoenix_firebrd: when did you request the instance?11:45
phoenix_firebrdyofel: if it is not running then how come it can give a key fingerprint11:46
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: hi11:46
shadeslayerhey :)11:46
shadeslayeryofel: huzzah, PA3 is up11:46
shadeslayeralmost all of it11:46
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: Riddell gave me naturally as you mentioned11:46
yofelhm, dunno, I don't know much about ec211:46
shadeslayerphoenix_firebrd: no, I mean *when*11:46
shadeslayernot to mention11:46
yofelshadeslayer: \o/11:46
shadeslayersince the IP addresses are shared11:46
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: 2 days back11:46
shadeslayerphoenix_firebrd: probably shut down then11:47
shadeslayerphoenix_firebrd: it's basically use and throw instances11:47
shadeslayeronce you're done, you shut them down and someone can spin a new instance and it might get the same address11:47
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: I have asked Riddell to add my key and i have 2 keys in launchpad, i think he might have added the wrong one11:47
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: ok11:48
shadeslayerwhich is why you get a fingerprint on your konsole, but the fingerprint is different since it's a new instance11:48
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: ok11:48
shadeslayerwith a different ssh instance11:48
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: ok now understand11:48
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: So we should request Riddell everytime need one11:48
shadeslayermore or less11:49
shadeslayerand shut it down once you're done11:49
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: it was a blizz working with a 40 mbps connection11:49
shadeslayerone other way to speed up builds is by doing in memory builds11:49
shadeslayerbut then you need alot of RAM for that11:50
yofeltalking abou thtat11:50
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: only thing that is bad for me is i have a 400ms delay in char echo11:50
shadeslayerphoenix_firebrd: mosh ftw11:50
yofelshadeslayer: any idea why eatmydata wouldn't work?11:50
phoenix_firebrdi am getting my log filled by it11:51
shadeslayeryofel: no idea11:51
yofelI tried to make phoenix_firebrd enable it, but it only kept throwing errors that the so isn't there, even though it seemed installed (from what he said)11:51
phoenix_firebrdyofel: need the log?11:51
phoenix_firebrdyofel: its just this "ERROR: ld.so: object '/usr/lib/libeatmydata/libeatmydata.so' from LD_PRELOAD cannot be preloaded: ignored."11:52
shadeslayeryofel: did you try making sure LD_PRELOAD had the lib in it's path11:52
yofelnot really11:52
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: i checked it and it was in the patch11:52
yofelshadeslayer: if works fine for me, that's why I'm confused11:52
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: and ldd loads it without a problem11:52
yofelphoenix_firebrd: in the path *inside* pbuilder, right?11:52
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ya, we checked together, you forgot11:53
yofelno, just wanted to double check11:53
yofelas this doesn't make sense11:53
phoenix_firebrdyofel: let me check it one more time11:53
phoenix_firebrd the lib is in its path and it ldd shows no problem11:55
phoenix_firebrdyofel: how do i replace the default editor used by quilt, i put "EDITOR=kate" in quilltrc. thats not working11:57
yofelwhat would quilt need an editor for?11:57
shadeslayerquilt edit ?11:57
yofelnever used that11:57
shadeslayerheh okay11:58
shadeslayerphoenix_firebrd: try putting : export EDITOR=kate : in bashrc11:58
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: ok11:58
phoenix_firebrdi will try11:58
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: works12:01
phoenix_firebrdi can see probably in some debian/patches files the original file is in source.orig dir and the new file is in the source dir why is this?12:03
shadeslayerI usually setup quilt by following : http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/modify.en.html12:03
shadeslayerphoenix_firebrd: patch strips out the first part of the path when used with -p112:04
yofelsame here, except a few things removed that pinotree said were nonsense12:04
shadeslayeryofel: oh? like?12:04
shadeslayerphoenix_firebrd: have a read through the -pnum option in the patch man page12:05
yofelthat was like ages ago though so don't ask me for the reasoning12:05
phoenix_firebrdI am not able to understand what you said, i will post the original patch and the new patch created by me take a look at it12:07
phoenix_firebrdthis is the old one -->http://paste.kde.org/657410/12:08
phoenix_firebrdthis is the new one created my me -> http://paste.kde.org/657422/12:08
shadeslayerlooks the same12:09
shadeslayerexcept it adds an index12:09
yofelbecause he has my quiltrc12:09
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: look at the new and original file locations12:09
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: in the original patch12:10
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: sorry12:11
phoenix_firebrdi added the wtrong one as original file12:11
yofelphoenix_firebrd: or did you mean something like this: http://paste.kde.org/657428 ?12:11
phoenix_firebrdyofel: exactly12:12
yofelwhat's what you get if you don't use "-p ab" in quilt diff12:12
yofeland your quiltrc sets that12:12
shadeslayeryofel: he's talking about the path stripping stuff right?12:13
phoenix_firebrdyofel: when i uupdate, the default patch files are like this12:13
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: ya12:13
phoenix_firebrdwhy fuzz is not allowed patching?12:14
yofelwell, it's the default setting to have it with .orig12:14
yofelnot sure why uupdate would use that though12:14
yofelnot sure, from man 1 dpkg-source:12:15
yofel       Contrary  to  quilt's default behaviour, patches are expected to apply without any fuzz. When that is not the case, you should refresh such patches with12:15
yofel       quilt, or dpkg-source will error out while trying to apply them12:15
shadeslayeroh fun, that explains why builds fail when there is fuzz12:16
yofelwait, you didn't know that? :D12:16
shadeslayerlet's just say I didn't realize that it was documented behavior12:16
shadeslayerI thought it was some sort of feature that was missing12:16
yofelI think it did change at some point12:17
phoenix_firebrdyofel: here is a build log of texi2html http://paste.kde.org/657434/     do you see anything odd or everything is ok12:17
yofelas it did with dpkg-source not auto-committing manual changes anymore12:17
yofelphoenix_firebrd: ok, I think I know what's causing *those* LD errors12:18
yofelis eatmydata installed in your regular system?12:18
phoenix_firebrdyofel: let me check12:18
phoenix_firebrdyofel: no12:19
phoenix_firebrdyofel: install?12:19
yofelyeah, that'll probably help12:19
yofelas the pbuilder scripts need to run a few commands on the host system (like ln for the debs)12:19
shadeslayer"Need to get 969 MB/1,088 MB of archives."12:20
phoenix_firebrdyofel: should i update pbuilder?12:20
yofelshadeslayer: upgrading? ^^12:20
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: I am needing the ec2 for the same purpose12:21
shadeslayerupgrading after a long time12:21
shadeslayerabout 10-15 days12:21
shadeslayerphoenix_firebrd: actually I'm upgrading my system :P12:21
shadeslayernot pbuilder12:21
yofeloh, now that's a lot then...12:21
shadeslayerdidn't even upgrade KDE12:22
shadeslayerso most of it is that12:22
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: some of the apps need some java stuff pre installed before building in the system12:22
yofelif you build jar's you will need java...12:22
shadeslayeranyway, have to go, ciao12:22
shadeslayeryofel: but he said pre-installed12:22
phoenix_firebrdno somethink called maven-repo-buildhelper12:23
shadeslayeryofel: and by pre-installed I infer before dpkg installs build-dep12:23
yofelphoenix_firebrd: ^ ?12:23
yofelif maven needs it then it's supposed to pre-depend on java12:23
phoenix_firebrdyofel: its simple-http12:24
shadeslayerPre-Depends ... heh12:24
yofeldoesn't matter, maven is a build system for java, ofcourse it would need java to work12:24
phoenix_firebrdyofel: this is the package maven_repo_helper12:24
yofelphoenix_firebrd: what's the problem exactly12:25
yofelmaven-repo-helper does depend on default-jre-headless, does it fail to install?12:25
phoenix_firebrdyofel: my slow internet connection12:25
phoenix_firebrdyofel: then i tried to login to ec2 and failed and i halted building it now12:26
phoenix_firebrdyofel: the error stop12:28
phoenix_firebrdyofel: it worked12:28
yofelgood, I forgot about that possibility :/12:29
phoenix_firebrdyofel: what does fsync do and by not using that what does get affected?12:29
phoenix_firebrdyofel: what does fsync do and by not using that what does get affected?12:29
phoenix_firebrdyofel: what does fsync do and by not using that what does get affected?12:29
phoenix_firebrdI am i disconnected?12:30
tsimpsonfsync flushes any cache buffers to the disk12:31
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: thats what i thought12:31
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: so is fsync called every 10 sec?12:32
tsimpsonI think it depends on how much I/O there is, but something like that12:34
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: what will happen if i disable fsync?12:38
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: data in the buffer will be written only when unmounting and manually flushing?12:39
tsimpsonphoenix_firebrd: that's my understanding, yes12:40
tsimpsonand only flushed if the files aren't removed, like they would be when pbuilder is done12:40
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: I am working in a desktop with no backup power 12:42
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: this wont be good for me12:42
tsimpsonthough the kernel will probably flush at some interval12:42
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: are you sure?12:42
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: is it just for the ext or it applies to all types12:43
tsimpsonwell it only has a finite amount of memory to keep the buffer in12:43
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: thats right12:43
phoenix_firebrdyofel: is it compulsary that the files in the debian/patches to have an extensaion .patch or .diff is ok?12:44
tsimpsonI can't see it being a problem, it would only effect things run with that LD_PRELOAD in the environment12:45
tsimpsonso it won't effect the rest of the systems calls to fsync12:45
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: ok12:46
phoenix_firebrdshadeslayer: is it compulsary that the files in the debian/patches to have an extensaion .patch or .diff is ok?12:50
yofelphoenix_firebrd: sorry, was away12:59
yofelthe files there are named .diff or .patch by convention, as that's what they are12:59
yofelbut you'll see both used. I usually use .diff13:00
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ok then its time to upload13:01
yofelphoenix_firebrd: as for fsync. fsync will flush modifications to a file to disk. *Immediately*. It's to tell the filesystem not to wait until it would usually write it to disk13:02
phoenix_firebrdyofel: wow that cools my head13:02
yofeldpkg runs fsync a lot to make sure its status database files are in a consistent state after a power failure13:02
phoenix_firebrdtsimpson: you should note that 13:02
yofelso it runs fsync afer pretty much every modification - several times per package13:03
yofelin a pbuilder chroot you don't care about consistency, so you don't need fsync either. And disabling it speeds things up a lot13:03
phoenix_firebrdyofel: nice13:04
phoenix_firebrdyofel: when you modify the files that i uploaded in my ppa for example the log file do you download, edit and then upload or you just edit it online?13:07
yofeldownload, edit, upload13:09
yofelLaunchpad has no online editing feature13:09
phoenix_firebrdyofel: even when you merge from a branch?13:10
yofelthen I checkout the main branch, and run 'bzr merge <other_branch_url>" which will merge them locally and then I commit and push13:11
phoenix_firebrdyofel: what if when you want to edit the changelog before you merge it with the main branch13:12
yofelbzr merge will do the merge uncommitted so you can edit it before you push it13:13
phoenix_firebrdyofel: edit offline?13:14
yofelyes, you do everything on your local system anyway13:15
phoenix_firebrdyofel: so to confirm, you downloaded from my bazaar branch edited the changelog and then merged with the main, right?13:16
yofelno, I merged yours, edited the changes and committed the merge13:16
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ok, thats clear13:17
yofelmerging a branch doesn't mean you're done. It's just imported as one diff until you commit it13:17
yofel(you only notice that it's a merge from the log)13:18
phoenix_firebrdyofel: i was confused about the editing thing, i thought you edited stuff online13:18
yofelah no. Launchpad has no editor there, so whatever you do has to be done locally13:19
phoenix_firebrdyofel: now packages in my ppa are only built for i386, why is this happening?13:24
yofeldoes the control file have "Achitecture: all" for the binary package?13:25
phoenix_firebrdyofel: let me check13:25
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ya it says "All"13:26
yofelarch all packages are only built on i386 and can later be used on all13:26
yofelit just means that there's nothing architecure-specific in there13:27
phoenix_firebrdyofel: got it13:27
phoenix_firebrdyofel: so i should any if i want my package to be built for i386 and amd6413:28
yofelright. The usual situation that you have compiled binaries in "any", and things like images, documentation or scripts in "all"13:29
yofel*is that...13:30
yofeljust correcting my sentence13:31
phoenix_firebrdyofel: is there a deadline to package these http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/no_updated.html ?13:33
yofelusually feature freeze, after that you'll need to get an exception for non-bugfix updates13:33
phoenix_firebrdyofel: no not the schedule , for me?13:34
yofelthat counts for anybody13:35
phoenix_firebrdyofel: also is anyone else is doing, to avoid work duplication 13:35
yofelupdates need to in the archive before feature freeze13:35
yofeloh right, forgot about that13:35
yofelthe common case is to use update request bugs for that13:35
yofellook at launchpad for the 'upgrade-software-version' tag13:36
yofelyou'll have to file a bug to request sponsorship for a package anyway unless you know someone that can upload it13:37
yofelsee https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess13:37
phoenix_firebrdyofel: are you talking about the source release schedule or the package schedule ?13:37
yofelwhat's the difference?13:37
yofelschedule is13:37
ubottuA schedule of Raring Ringtail (13.04) release milestones can be found here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RaringRingtail/ReleaseSchedule13:37
yofelthe freezes are there and apply to every ubuntu contributor13:38
phoenix_firebrdyofel: but the title says "Most popular Ubuntu-specific packages that are not in sync with upstream."13:38
yofelon the qa page?13:39
yofelok, sorry, I think I lost the original question in the discussion...13:39
yofelwhat were you asking again?13:40
phoenix_firebrdyofel: if you say that the schedule is followed then why are these packages are not not the latest in the repos13:40
yofelnobody updated them?13:40
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ok13:40
yofelupdating packages with ubuntu modifications is a manual process13:40
yofeland there's a limited amount of packagers, and updating packages isn't the only thing to do13:41
phoenix_firebrdyofel: i thought every package is updated all the time13:41
yofelwell, it depends on who cares about it13:41
yofelthere are dedicated teams for various sets of packages, like us for KDE or mozillateam for firefox and co.13:42
phoenix_firebrdyofel: so the app maintainer doesn't care about this?13:42
yofelany packages that don't fall into those catecories in universe are maintained by the MOTU's13:42
yofelpackages in main by the core-devs (main packages all have dedicated maintainers though usually)13:43
yofelphoenix_firebrd: what app maintainer?13:43
yofelit's not the upstream developer's job to make sure all hundreds distributions ship his software13:43
phoenix_firebrdyofel: example the developer of nano doesn't care if it is update in all the distros ?13:44
yofeland we have no explicit package maintainers in ubuntu like debian does13:44
yofelthat's his decision13:44
yofelwe have plenty of upstream folks poking us in here to please update the packages13:44
yofelbut that's still a rare case compared to the full list of packages13:45
phoenix_firebrdyofel: good13:45
yofelother than that whether a package is updated or not depend on whether an ubuntu-dev notices it and wants to update it13:46
phoenix_firebrdyofel: is this auto generated or updated by someone? http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/no_updated.html13:47
yofelautomated I think, but I'm not sure13:48
phoenix_firebrdyofel: some packages is not the latest in the repos, is that because of the stability taken into account or its not updated simply 13:49
yofelunless there is an update bug mentioning a reason, it's usually latter13:50
phoenix_firebrdyofel: so if a stable version of the gimp is released today i can package and put it in the beta ppa ?13:51
yofelppa sure, but if you want to update it for the archive talk to the desktop team first13:52
phoenix_firebrdyofel: i am kubuntu beta ppa13:52
phoenix_firebrdyofel: i am mean kubuntu beta ppa13:52
yofela stable version wouldn't belong in the beta ppa, but the update one. 13:55
yofelyou would need to be a ninja first anyway to have upload permission. And our PPA's are for KDE related stuff really13:55
yofelthey don't have unlimited space13:56
BluesKajHey all13:56
phoenix_firebrdyofel: i should put my question like this. why is the gimp not the latest in the normal channel while i have to add a third party ppa to get the latest13:56
phoenix_firebrdyofel: when i was talking about the ppa , i was talking symbolically13:56
phoenix_firebrdBluesKaj: hi13:56
yofellooks up to date to me...13:57
phoenix_firebrdyofel: no,  its just an example13:57
BluesKajhi phoenix_firebrd13:57
yofelwell, as long as you own the PPA, you can put in there what you want as long as you don't violate Launchpad's TOS13:58
phoenix_firebrdyofel: for example when ever a stable digikam version is release, if i want it i have to add some philip ppa to get that13:58
yofelah, you shouldn't need that, we try to keep a package for it in our PPA's13:59
phoenix_firebrdyofel: sorry couldn't understand14:00
yofelphoenix_firebrd: well, I'm not sure what you're asking. Yes, if you want to put an updated version of digikam in your PPA do it14:00
yofelwe do the same14:00
phoenix_firebrdyofel: so you mean that if a stable version of digikam is released, it is packaged and put in the update14:02
yofelwell, it's like this:14:02
yofelif a new digiakm version comes out, someone of us will put an updated package into the development release14:02
yofelthat is then later backported to the current stable release and possible more in our PPA's14:03
yofelif it's a safe backport, someone will file a backport request so it ends up in <release>-backports14:03
yofelthere isn't really any more than that to it14:04
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ok14:05
yofelin what of our PPA's it ends up depends on what kind of update it is. A 2.8.0 -> 2.8.1 update would be bugfix and end up in the updates one. 2.7.0 -> 2.8.0 is something for backports14:05
yofelthe 3.0.0~rc is in the beta ppa14:05
yofelphoenix_firebrd: note that this is the kubuntu team workflow14:07
phoenix_firebrdyofel: usually i see in the blog, they say a new stable version is released and they give a ppa to get it, i guess thats a zero hour ppas14:07
yofelfirefox for example as a core package gets full official updates for all supported releases in the archive14:07
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ya 14:07
yofelyeah, PPA's are the fastest way to get something out14:08
yofelproviding updates in the archive for anything other than the development release takes a while14:08
phoenix_firebrdyofel: does kubuntu contribute security patches upstream?14:10
yofelwe try to contribute any patches upstream14:10
phoenix_firebrdyofel: who is the kubuntu security expert?14:11
yofelI'm not sure whether we have one...14:11
yofelScott is on the release team and usually knows best what CVE's there are14:12
yofelScottK: do we have someone that looks at the security issues beside you?14:15
phoenix_firebrdyofel: http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=kubuntu14:19
phoenix_firebrdyofel: in this link the version of xz is shown as alpha in 12.10, is that normal?14:19
yofel!info xz-utils14:20
ubottuxz-utils (source: xz-utils): XZ-format compression utilities. In component main, is optional. Version 5.1.1alpha+20120614-1 (quantal), package size 87 kB, installed size 384 kB14:20
yofelit is a snapshot after all14:20
phoenix_firebrdyofel: so alpha allowed in main?14:21
yofelit's the same version as in debian. Maybe dpkg needed some new feature14:22
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ok14:23
yofelphoenix_firebrd: it's up to the maintainer, usually you shouldn't do that, but if it has enough value and no critial bugs it's allowed14:23
phoenix_firebrdyofel: thats out of necessity,ok 14:24
yofeland i would assume that this got plenty of discussion in debian considering it's importance14:24
phoenix_firebrdyofel: texi2html is in my ppa, just 1 package in 2 days, because of the republic day holiday and today is sunday.14:28
yofel0.5 packages-per-day is far higher than my quota14:28
yofelbut then again I wasted the weekend on python and project neon14:29
phoenix_firebrdyofel: the project-neon is the best thing14:29
phoenix_firebrdyofel: my mind is confined to c++14:30
phoenix_firebrdyofel: also BASIC14:30
yofelyeah, better stick to that, the pyhon bindings are a packaging insanity14:30
phoenix_firebrdyofel: apper is python14:31
phoenix_firebrdyofel: muon replaced apper because it was not c++ 14:32
phoenix_firebrdyofel: why is that so?14:32
Quintasanomfg I passed calculus14:32
phoenix_firebrdQuintasan: congrats14:32
yofelthat wasn't really the primary reason, the packagekit apt backend stucking was a more important one14:32
QuintasanI HAVE ABSLOLUTELY NO IDEA what did I write there14:33
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ya, qapt is awesome14:33
QuintasanI succesfully calculated one integral and did some deriviatives14:33
Quintasannothing more and I got 12/20 points14:33
yofelphoenix_firebrd: have fun reading python-qt4-4.9.6/debian/rules : http://paste.kde.org/657524 (very educative ;P )14:33
Quintasanthis is either magic or I actually get what's going in there14:33
yofelit'll expire soon, so just look at the package14:34
phoenix_firebrdi will include it with my homework :)14:34
yofelwell, you don't really need to understand it...14:34
yofelor rather you won't understand it until you know how gnu make handles pattern matching, substitutional references and function calls14:35
yofelhttp://www.gnu.org/software/make/manual/make.html recommended14:35
phoenix_firebrdyofel: the top priority in things to learn by me is cmake14:37
yofelgood idea, we're spending plenty of time debugging upstream buildsystems ;)14:38
phoenix_firebrdyofel: does publishing a built package in a ppa need an admin approval?14:39
yofelno, it's a cronjob that runs every half an hour or so14:40
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ok14:40
phoenix_firebrdyofel: I think i forgot to debuild after i updated the changelog14:43
phoenix_firebrdyofel: I am going to delete the package in the ppa and rename the version from 5.0-0ubuntu1~ubuntu13.04~ppa1 to ?14:45
yofelphoenix_firebrd: why delete it, just change it to ppa214:48
phoenix_firebrdyofel: ok14:50
phoenix_firebrdyofel: the old file name was 01_remove_doc_dir.patch and the new file name is 01_remove_doc_dir.diff. the changelog should reflect as "Refresh 01_remove_doc_dir.diff for the new release"?14:52
yofelin a case where you just refresh a patch don't rename it14:54
yofelotherwise yes14:54
phoenix_firebrdyofel: in the process got renamed, what should i put in the log14:55
yofelwhy was it renamed?14:56
phoenix_firebrdyofel: when creating a patch with quilt , i forgot to use the the extension .patch and it was named with an extension .diff by default14:56
yofeljust rename it back14:57
phoenix_firebrdyofel: will that work?14:57
yofelas long as you also change it in the series file, yes14:57
phoenix_firebrdyofel: i will try that14:58
phoenix_firebrdyofel: works15:01
phoenix_firebrdyofel: going to bed, good night15:04
sheytanapachelogger: is your work on U1 for kubuntu done?15:13
sheytani mean, did you drop it?15:13
apacheloggerages ago15:14
shadeslayeruse owncloud15:15
apacheloggerowncloud, love of my life15:17
sheytanapachelogger: im going to15:21
sheytanbut i need my own server, right?15:21
sheytanor a space i bought on someone else's server15:21
shadeslayer5 GB of free space15:23
shadeslayer( shameless plug for a Blue Systems sponsored service :P )15:23
apachelogger"give us your data pretty please"15:24
shadeslayerit's not as if *I* have access to it15:25
shadeslayerI don't even know who runs it :P15:25
apacheloggerthat's what you claim15:25
shadeslayerI will hax0r your runners-id account15:25
shadeslayerand steal all your dataz\15:25
Tm_TI just configure U1 account once with that gui client and after that it just works15:27
Tm_Tso I'm not sure anymore what work or integration it would need necessarily15:27
apacheloggerno one does15:27
apacheloggerFWIW I think you can get an owncloud as cheap as 2 euros a month or something15:30
sheytanthat is 8 PLN for me :D15:30
sheytanit's 2 good beers15:30
sheytani cant afford that15:30
apachelogger2 beers vs. free data15:31
apacheloggerwe'll take the beer, thank you very much15:31
sheytanbtw, i have to work for an hour to earn that much money :D15:32
sheytanwelcome to Poland :D15:32
apacheloggerdownloading mono for wine takes forevr15:32
sheytanwhat you use wine for?15:32
apacheloggergetting drunk15:32
sheytanstupid question15:32
apacheloggersheytan: you probably don't need a cloud storage then btw15:33
tsimpsonyou get drunk, then you get mono15:33
sheytanapachelogger: i do! :D15:33
sheytanwell, in my case i get some more money for one hour of work15:33
sheytanbut in Poland usually you get even less then 2 eur15:33
apachelogger...storing porn in the cloud is not wise15:33
sheytani stream. always.15:34
apacheloggeryou don't need a cloud then15:35
* shadeslayer needs the cloud for contact storage15:38
sheytanapachelogger: well, i use other files too ;d15:39
sheytannot only p0rn15:39
apacheloggerso why do they need to be in the coud?15:39
apacheloggershadeslayer: don't you use googleseee for that?15:39
shadeslayerI do15:39
shadeslayerI fear I'm too tied into Google 15:40
shadeslayerI'm more or less at the mercy of Google :P15:40
apacheloggerpersonally I have almost no value from synced addressbooks15:40
apacheloggerpeople I send mails to I usually do not call and vice versa15:41
apacheloggerthough I suspect it is one of the arears where cloud sync actually adds value15:41
apacheloggerfrom a business perspective at least15:41
apacheloggerfor the regular person I still think the mail && !call statement holds, particular since I suppose most people don't use mail anymore ^^15:42
sheytanapachelogger: i have files like documents and pictures i need to have access to15:47
sheytanand my problem is that i forget to put them on a pendrive or something15:48
sheytanso i better save it as default in the dropbox folder15:48
sheytanso they automatically sync 15:48
sheytandoes owncloud sync notes too?15:50
apacheloggerowncloud supports arbitrary plugins15:52
sheytanapachelogger: you askd me last time when i showd the lightdm theme if i talk to Nuno. Why?15:59
apacheloggersheytan: because we continue to follow upstream's artwork16:00
sheytanapachelogger: but KDE didn't switch to lightdm or did they?16:01
apacheloggerlightdm is a kde project16:01
sheytanso KDM is out ?16:02
shadeslayerafaik both kdm and lightdm will be in kde-workspace16:02
apacheloggerplus nuno wanted to do some artwork alignment for 4.1116:02
shadeslayeror atleast that's what d_ed is aiming for16:02
apacheloggershadeslayer: nuno also advocates lightdm from what I understand16:02
shadeslayerapachelogger: I see, probably because of QML stuff though :P16:03
apacheloggerthat is a fair assumption :P16:03
shadeslayerwhat I'm saying is, KDM will be around though probably not actively developed16:03
shadeslayerlightdm offers the exact same feature set with the added niceness of QML16:03
shadeslayerand being actively developed16:03
sheytanshadeslayer: already saw my new lightdm theme? :)16:04
shadeslayerthough the latter is probably the result of the project being quite new16:04
shadeslayersheytan: yes, imho it clashes with Air16:04
shadeslayerdark backgrounds + Air don't go well together16:04
sheytani have a light version too :D16:04
sheytanfirst i was doing dark, cause i done it for my desktop ;)16:04
shadeslayerbut then again, you can change the background16:05
shadeslayerso meh16:05
shadeslayerand the login manager should be as un-obtrusive as possible16:05
shadeslayerlike, Users should have big avatars16:06
shadeslayerand password boxes16:06
shadeslayersince that's the focus ... hibernating/shutdown/sleeping are just added extras16:06
shadeslayeroh and we need to figure out if we can support RDP stuff16:07
sheytani'm not a fan of big things16:07
shadeslayerlike they showed off at UDS16:07
shadeslayerthat stuff was awesome16:07
apacheloggershadeslayer: rdpwhat?16:07
sheytanthey don't look good16:07
sheytanshadeslayer: what did they show?16:07
shadeslayerapachelogger: they established a RDP session right from the login manager16:07
sheytancan i see it?16:07
shadeslayerso they logged into a Windows session running on EC216:08
shadeslayerfrom lightdm16:08
shadeslayerlemme see if I can pull up the video16:08
apacheloggerthings people do with a login manager16:08
shadeslayercan't find it16:11
shadeslayerapachelogger: actually, it makes sense in a business env16:11
shadeslayersheytan: http://zbloggers.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/remote-login-lightdm-ubuntu1210.png16:12
apacheloggershadeslayer: does it?16:13
shadeslayerapachelogger: yes16:13
shadeslayerapachelogger: you have some proprietary service tied into Windows16:13
shadeslayerbut you have ubuntu deployed across your office16:13
shadeslayerso you just setup EC2 and provide access to that one windows machine16:14
shadeslayerwhere that service is running16:14
apacheloggerso you logout and then login again to get to a windows session?16:14
apacheloggerthat's a funny concept16:14
shadeslayerwell ... you could spawn a new session16:14
shadeslayerlike you can do in KDE16:14
apacheloggerso you can easily switch back to your ubuntu session?16:14
apacheloggeroh wait16:14
apacheloggeryou can't16:14
shadeslayerno I mean16:15
apacheloggerI know what you mean16:15
shadeslayerspawn a new X16:15
shadeslayerX1 is running unity 16:15
apacheloggerand it is fom a usage perspective exactly the same as logout and login16:15
shadeslayerX2 is running RDP session16:15
shadeslayerhm, idk, it made alot of sense to me to have the remote login thingy16:15
apacheloggerin a thin client setup16:16
shadeslayersomething KDE fails at ? :P16:16
apacheloggerat the point where I roll out a system that has multiarch on a thin client setup I'll shoot mysefl in the head though16:16
apacheloggerdoubtlessly there are people who'd do that though16:16
shadeslayerapparently KDE does too much network IO in a thin client setup16:16
apacheloggerplasma does too much IO16:18
apacheloggerso how do you make the touchpad deactivate when typing?16:18
shadeslayerI think16:19
shadeslayerapachelogger: just get one of these http://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/wireless-trackball-m570?crid=816:19
Mamarokasking here as this was probably screwed by the last update: I try to isntall simon and get this error message:  16:20
MamarokCMake Error at /usr/share/cmake-2.8/Modules/FindPackageHandleStandardArgs.cmake:97 (MESSAGE):16:20
Mamarok  Could NOT find ALSA (missing: ALSA_LIBRARY ALSA_INCLUDE_DIR)16:20
Mamarokhow can it not find alsa?16:20
Mamarokon Quantal that is^16:20
apacheloggershadeslayer: so every kubuntu users is supposed to buy one of those?16:21
Mamarokapachelogger: right, so I have to change the build script...16:22
apacheloggerMamarok: I'd argue that findalsa.cmake is broken16:23
shadeslayerapachelogger: every laptop user16:23
shadeslayertouchpads are crap16:23
apacheloggerlibasound is in a multiarch path, so likely that is whythe finder does not find it16:23
yofelshadeslayer: that's why all laptops should have a trackpoint16:24
shadeslayeridk ... that nub seems slightly unreliable16:25
shadeslayernot to mention difficult to find in the dark16:25
shadeslayeryofel: do you know if {latest-tag} in recipes has ever worked?16:27
Mamarokapachelogger: that didn't really help16:27
shadeslayeryofel: see https://launchpadlibrarian.net/129687230/buildlog.txt.gz16:28
Mamarokstill the same error16:28
yofelwhat the hell is that?16:28
Mamarokand yes, I erased the build folder :)16:28
shadeslayeryofel: tomahawk daily build recipe16:29
apacheloggerMamarok: dunno then16:29
yofelI meant latest-tag16:29
shadeslayerlast tagged version in git?16:30
yofelwhere's the recipe?16:30
ScottKyofel: Riddell has done it as well.16:30
ScottKIt's something we all need to be mindful of.16:30
yofelshadeslayer: what's ~tomahawk-importer?16:31
yofelshadeslayer: huh? we have hash tags now?16:32
shadeslayerprobably a cronjob that apachelogger setup16:32
apacheloggermagic machine16:33
shadeslayerapachelogger: stop stealing karma16:33
apacheloggerit's my script that does all the work!!!16:33
shadeslayerapachelogger: that might also explain why it crashes16:33
apacheloggerwho crashes?16:33
apacheloggerwhen does bzr crash? Oo16:34
yofelshadeslayer: # bzr-builder format 0.3 deb-version 0.6.99.{time}~{latest-tag}-016:34
shadeslayerapachelogger: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/129687230/buildlog.txt.gz16:34
yofellatest-tag is 0.416:34
shadeslayeryofel: how? afaik the tag isn't pushed16:35
yofelbzr builder docs suck though it seems16:35
shadeslayerthe cronjob just gets the last diff and applies that to the bzr branch16:35
yofelshadeslayer: no, I mean you need format 0.4 if you want to use latest-tag16:35
shadeslayerapachelogger: ^ 16:35
apacheloggerfuck this shit16:35
yofeland ofcourse I had to read bzr-builder source to find that out *-.-16:35
shadeslayerproperly documented there ^16:36
yofeloh ok16:36
yofelI obviously don't know the whole launchpad documentation yet16:36
yofelneeds fixing16:37
shadeslayerthough this is slightly stupid16:37
apacheloggera new version for a new sub?16:37
shadeslayerif it says 0.3 and uses a 0.4 function it should not complain16:37
apacheloggeryes that is slightly stupid16:37
shadeslayerit should just do the right thing16:37
apacheloggerit should not require a new version for a new sub :P16:37
shadeslayerotoh if it says 0.3 and uses a deprecated function, then complaint16:37
Mamarokapachelogger: is there a chance to get a newer vlc backend in Quantal? It still ships 0.6.016:38
yofelthe question is rather why it defaults to 0.316:38
apacheloggerit does not default to it, the recipe says 0.316:38
yofela new default recipe uses 0.3. It doesn't use any 0.4 features though16:38
yofelnobody cared to update it I guess16:39
* apachelogger sighs16:40
apacheloggerMamarok: there is, once I get a newer release out16:41
apacheloggerwhich is now blocked for almost 2 months by lack of QA16:41
shadeslayerapachelogger: release beta -> get feedback -> release RC -> get feedback -> release16:42
apacheloggerthat does not work for a plugin of a middleware library16:43
apacheloggerunless the get feedback phases are meant to be >6 months16:44
shadeslayerI'm sleeping16:44
apacheloggershadeslayer: nini16:45
shadeslayerapachelogger: lunchpad is trolling you16:45
apacheloggerI know16:46
apacheloggerwe should write more software in python I think16:46
shadeslayeryou mean in ECMA script16:46
apacheloggerin fact, we should write an OS in python16:47
BarkingFishevening :)  anyone else have the problem with an unmet dependency in the last round of updates on raring?20:23

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