[02:56]  * pleia2 waves
[02:56] <pleia2> meeting in a few minutes
[02:57]  * grantbow waves
[02:58] <grantbow> SAG awards are on too
[02:59] <pleia2> SAG?
[02:59] <grantbow> Screen Actor's Guild
[02:59] <pleia2> oh :)
[03:00] <pleia2> #startmeeting
[03:00] <darthrobot> Meeting started Mon Jan 28 03:00:08 2013 UTC.  The chair is pleia2. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[03:00] <darthrobot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[03:00] <pleia2> hello everyone, who all is here for our meeting? :)
[03:01] <pleia2> anyone?
[03:01] <pleia2> hey eps
[03:01] <grantbow> o/
[03:01] <eps> pleia2: hi-hi
[03:01] <akk> o/
[03:01] <pleia2> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/13January27
[03:01] <darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/13January27 - Ubuntu Wiki]
[03:02] <pleia2> so we don't have anything on our agenda ;)
[03:02] <grantbow> short formal meeting, we can work on stuff
[03:02] <pleia2> #topic SCaLE11x
[03:02] <pleia2> so SCaLE11x is coming up in less than a month, philipballew has been putting in a lot of work to get our booth together: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/Scale11x
[03:02] <darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Projects/Scale11x - Ubuntu Wiki]
[03:02] <eps> West coast airfares are still lousy :-( ~$192 RT SFO-LAX
[03:02] <grantbow> scale is important :-)
[03:03] <pleia2> he definitely needs more volunteers for the booth and I'm not doing it this year do to other conference obligations
[03:03] <pleia2> s/do/due
[03:03] <grantbow> Unfortunately I am not going either
[03:04] <pleia2> I'll be at the conference, just not the booth ;)
[03:05] <grantbow> good :-)
[03:05] <pleia2> Richard Gaskin is also hosting an Ubucon on Friday:
[03:05] <pleia2> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2105023
[03:05] <darthrobot> Title: [Ubucon @ SCaLE 11x - Ubuntu Forums]
[03:05] <pleia2> (I did ask him to send that to the list too, but I don't think he's gotten around to it)
[03:06] <pleia2> eps: philipballew got the registration codes for booth volunteers, have you been able to touch base with him?
[03:07] <eps> pleia2: I was waiting until I'd made travel arrangements. Hopefully, flights will be cheaper two days from now. (set fingers=crossed)
[03:07] <pleia2> eps: ok good, just wanted to make sure you knew who to go to when needed :)
[03:07] <pleia2> ^^ that goes for everyone else too :) philipballew is your scale boss
[03:07] <eps> pleia2: He e-mailed me.
[03:07] <pleia2> great
[03:08] <pleia2> I guess that's it for scale then, more info will go to list as it comes along :)
[03:08] <pleia2> #topic Other upcoming events
[03:09] <pleia2> http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-california
[03:09] <darthrobot> Title: [Ubuntu California | Ubuntu LoCo Team Portal]
[03:09] <pleia2> looks like berkeley and SF have the next few
[03:10] <pleia2> the SV folks haven't been updating our official resources lately, so if you want to keep up with them I suggest signing up for the meetup: http://www.meetup.com/Ubuntu-SV/
[03:10] <akk> Seems like those south bay ones died out -- for a while it was twice a week, then nothing.
[03:10] <darthrobot> Title: [Ubuntu SV (Sunnyvale, CA) - Meetup]
[03:10] <eps> Berkeley conflicts with Macworld/iWorld
[03:10] <pleia2> akk: yeah, I'm not sure if they're actually not having them, or there is just a lot of confusion with their move to meetup
[03:11] <akk> I haven't been getting any meetup notices for them.
[03:11] <pleia2> yeah, looks like the last one was on december 20th
[03:11] <pleia2> hopefully things will pick up in February, January tends to be a slow month I think
[03:11] <grantbow> I was waiting to do the meeting reminders until later in January
[03:11] <grantbow> so so they were not too early
[03:12] <grantbow> for berkeley anyway
[03:12] <akk> True, it's usually hard to get anybody to a meeting in December or January.
[03:12] <pleia2> we did have about 7 people at the last SF one though :) including a woman who was visiting from Portland and runs Code Scouts: http://codescouts.org/
[03:12] <darthrobot> Title: [Code Scouts]
[03:12] <akk> (I'm not sure why that is for January, December is easy to understand.)
[03:13] <pleia2> in Philly I assumed it was winter/bad weather, maybe it's the same here? it has been a relatively miserable month :)
[03:13] <grantbow> You never know who will show up. Otherwise getting work done is useful too.
[03:13] <grantbow> I think it's the same here. People just get busy.
[03:13] <pleia2> (today was stunning though, got headshots done outside!)
[03:13] <grantbow> nice
[03:13] <pleia2> yeah, I'm super excited
[03:14] <pleia2> hm, so I think that's it for upcoming events
[03:14] <pleia2> #topic Any other business?
[03:14] <pleia2> anyone have anything they wish to bring up? :)
[03:14] <pleia2> ideas? recommendations for dinner?
[03:15]  * eps is using a slow computer ... talk amongst yourselves
[03:15] <eps> pleia2: yes, Hunan after the S.F. Ubuntu Hour
[03:15] <pleia2> eps: yes! it's one of those months :)
[03:16] <grantbow> even month? cool.
[03:16] <pleia2> it shifts ;)
[03:16] <pleia2> but we didn't do it in january and I'm around the 2nd week in feb
[03:20] <philipballew> looks like the meeting went well
[03:20] <pleia2> still going!
[03:20] <pleia2> philipballew: anything to add about scale? :)
[03:21] <philipballew> Scale is gona be awesome, and you can email me to help and add your name to the wiki. Also you can still add your presentation to the ubucon cfp iifc.
[03:22] <pleia2> \o/
[03:22] <eps> I can't log into the wiki, grr!
[03:22] <philipballew> we could use a few more volenteers so the ones we have now can explore the other parts of the show.
[03:22] <philipballew> also mega bus is only a dollar from san fran to la
[03:22] <philipballew> eps, I can do it for you
[03:22] <pleia2> yeah, Richard had me fill in a cfp (Call For Papers) thing here and select "Ubucon" as the one I was submitting for: https://www.socallinuxexpo.org/cfp
[03:22] <darthrobot> Title: [Call for Papers | SCALE 11x]
[03:22] <pleia2> not sure where he is with that and/or if he needs more
[03:23] <philipballew> me and him are putting that together and things seem to be good, just make sure you can get your talks in
[03:23] <pleia2> cool
[03:23] <eps> philipballew: OK, on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/Scale11x scroll down to "Scissors" and put https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/Scale11x in the Comments field. Gotta stick with the orange theme. :-)
[03:23] <darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Projects/Scale11x - Ubuntu Wiki]
[03:23] <darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Projects/Scale11x - Ubuntu Wiki]
[03:24] <eps> Sorry, I meant http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000OMWGNS
[03:24] <darthrobot> Title: [Amazon.com: Fiskars 8-Inch Multi Purpose Scissors: Arts, Crafts & Sewing]
[03:24] <pleia2> eps: oh! should I bring the "candy dishes"? :)
[03:24] <eps> pleia2: Um, we can talk about that. I have an idea...
[03:24] <grantbow> Feb 22-24th for those following along http://www.socallinuxexpo.org
[03:24] <darthrobot> [R: www.socallinuxexpo.org] Title: [SCALE 11x]
[03:24] <pleia2> eps: ok
[03:25] <philipballew> Make sure we are all up to date on the ubuntu news we will be asked as well
[03:26] <philipballew> unity, tv, phone, juju. or we can say "I am not sure of that, but someone else is" and point to them.
[03:26]  * philipballew will tell them to go to pleia2 in any question he gets
[03:26] <pleia2> lol
[03:26] <pleia2> I don't keep up!
[03:27] <grantbow> editor, not a reader, lol
[03:27] <philipballew> well I will have some juju papers to hand out as well and some books on ubuntu and a system76 laptop to display
[03:27] <pleia2> yeah, I added some books too, need to get these out of here :)
[03:27] <philipballew> so we dont have to use our own and it will halp make the booth look polished,
[03:27]  * pleia2 nods
[03:28] <philipballew> just keep the free stuff like that under the table so it is not all gone in the first 5 minutes
[03:28] <pleia2> yeah
[03:28] <eps> pleia2: http://www.good.is/posts/hack-the-planet-why-code-scouts-is-helping-women-join-the-tech-community
[03:28] <grantbow> good luck wiwth that
[03:28] <darthrobot> Title: [Hack the Planet: Why Code Scouts Is Helping Women Join the Tech Community | Technology on GOOD]
[03:28] <grantbow> the free stuff always goes fast
[03:29] <pleia2> eps: yeah! :)
[03:29] <grantbow> nice link
[03:29] <philipballew> Lets just try to look as professional as we can I think.
[03:29] <philipballew> Try to draw them into the booth.
[03:30] <eps> Put free stuff out in waves. Label things in advance if need be ("Sat. 2 p.m.").
[03:30] <philipballew> I am considering putting the table in the back and making the people come in to the booth to to get the stuff so we can talk to them.
[03:30] <philipballew> not sure what you people think?
[03:31] <pleia2> I can bring raffle tickets if we want to do that again
[03:31] <pleia2> s/we/you
[03:32] <philipballew> would business cards work like we did two years ago
[03:32] <philipballew> ?
[03:32] <pleia2> sure
[03:33] <philipballew> I was just thinking we then have their emails
[03:34] <pleia2> yeah, a lot of booths send out notes after the conference with details about their company or whatever
[03:34] <philipballew> Im gonna bring all my ubuntu tshirts so people without any can barrow them if they need
[03:34] <pleia2> might be an idea
[03:34] <pleia2> good idea!
[03:35] <philipballew> pleia2, were you gonna be putting your Ubuntu women items there?
[03:35] <philipballew> I can talk about the project if you need someone to.
[03:38] <pleia2> probably
[03:38] <pleia2> might drop off some partimus.org stuff too, depends on how much energy I have for producing materials before the event :)
[03:39] <philipballew> pleia2, dont worry about it if your busy with stuff.
[03:39] <pleia2> yeah, I'll see what I can do
[03:40] <pleia2> ok, anything else?
[03:40] <pleia2> all right, thanks for those updates philipballew!
[03:41] <pleia2> thanks for coming everyone :)
[03:41] <philipballew> not a problem, hope to see you there.
[03:41] <pleia2> I'll be sure to drop by regularly :)
[03:41] <pleia2> #endmeeting
[03:41] <darthrobot> Meeting ended Mon Jan 28 03:41:21 2013 UTC.
[03:41] <darthrobot> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2013/ubuntu-us-ca.2013-01-28-03.00.moin.txt
[03:44] <philipballew> eps, so whenever you get plans to come down to la, just shoot me an email. If phone is better I can give you my number.
[03:45] <pleia2> nUboon2age!
[03:46] <pleia2> nUboon2age: just missed our meeting, but we did have a question about when SV Ubuntu events would pick up again :)
[03:47] <eps> philipballew: I should probably have it regardless.
[03:48] <philipballew> whats your email again?
[03:48] <eps> I have two possibilities for orange scissors: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000OMWGNS or http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00006IFN9
[03:48] <darthrobot> Title: [Amazon.com: Fiskars 8-Inch Multi Purpose Scissors: Arts, Crafts & Sewing]
[03:48] <darthrobot> Title: [Error reading title]
[03:49] <pleia2> hehe
[03:49] <nUboon2age> Hey Liz, sorry i just got here.  uh, well most of the events last quarter were done by James McClain.  I think he held a Linux special interest group at the DeAnza ACM meeting on Friday (and will be 1x per mo. last Friday - maybe we could get him to post those, although they *are* aimed at DeAnza students so i'm not sure about that.  Also he said he was planning to do some Ubuntu Hours, but I haven't seen anything from him y
[03:50] <pleia2> nUboon2age: is he announcing this anywhere? I haven't seen any activity from south bay stuff even on the meetup since december
[03:50] <nUboon2age> but may be able to get some in.  How about jtatum / jledbetter (UH MV) ?  I haven't heard from them in ages so i'm not sure what their plans are.
[03:50] <pleia2> he hasn't been telling the rest of the team about events for a few months :( but I've been trying to keep people updated about the meetup account, a few still won't sign up though
[03:50] <philipballew> Off topic question: can I restart  daemon with one command or so I need to run a command to stop, then a command to start again?
[03:50] <eps> philipballew: See https://launchpad.net/~eps+ubuntu
[03:50] <darthrobot> Title: [Eric P. Scott in Launchpad]
[03:51] <pleia2> philipballew: most support "restart"
[03:51] <philipballew> alright, gnome is acting funky with a few things on 13.04
[03:52] <nUboon2age> i didn't see postings from James McClain, and I'm not sure if he wants to put the DeAnza student club stuff up there.  I'll ask him though.  James was by far the engine that carried last quarters spectacular results.  I mostly just created the meetup site and came to his UHs to support it.
[03:52] <philipballew> eps, done
[03:54] <nUboon2age> One thing that might help some is I just got off my 2 year stint as a trustee at my church.  Not sure i'll be able to do much this school quarter though we'll see.
[03:54] <philipballew> alright, time to do some homework...
[03:55] <pleia2> nUboon2age: hope to see you more often :)
[03:55] <nUboon2age> usually i'm so tired Sun evening i space that there's a meeting, but fortunately i remembered tonight. :-)
[03:57] <nUboon2age> I really did very carefully and completely explain the whole expectation of joining and participating in the team to James, but beyond reminding him about it, there's not much i can do if he doesn't follow through
[03:57]  * pleia2 nods
[03:57] <pleia2> I've been trying to make announcements here and on twitter when the meetup emails come through, but it's really hard for me to stay on top of that
[04:01] <nUboon2age> i really do care about the issues you've raised pleia2 , and i'm sorry the result have been less than satisfactory.  i'll keep plugging away.  I *do* think that if its a choice between encouraging a dynamo like James to do the UHs or making sure we get all the publicity within the Ubuntu community tasks done i'll choose the incomplete publicility and an event that actually happens
[04:01] <pleia2> nUboon2age: it wastes a lot of time and upsets a lot of people in the team
[04:02] <nUboon2age> though i realize this might not be your preference
[04:02] <pleia2> s/time/my time
[04:02] <nUboon2age> tell me more since i might not be aware.  how is time wasted?
[04:03] <pleia2> I need to keep an eye on the meetup now in addition to the actual resources, I also need to take time at every meeting I host to explain to people who ask me what happened to the SV events
[04:03] <nUboon2age> at any rate as i've said many times i can't control others.
[04:03] <pleia2> and people come in here asking about them too, confused, so I need to take time out of my day to explain it to them too...
[04:03] <akk> I know I find it confusing ... but then it was confusing before the meetup too, never knowing if there was an event.
[04:03] <pleia2> I am not asking you to, sorry I brought it up
[04:03] <nUboon2age> well that isn't good.  sorry to hear that.
[04:04] <pleia2> akk: the process is to add things to loco.ubuntu.com which feeds an ical that people can subscribe to, and to send a post to the mailing list
[04:04] <akk> Yeah ... that seldom happened even before meetup.
[04:04] <pleia2> so it should keep people in the loop :)
[04:04] <pleia2> yeah, we wrote the event guidelines in October or so
[04:05] <pleia2> since folks were so confused
[04:05] <nUboon2age> i wish someone would create an app where in one stroke all the notifications would get posted.  kind of a gibber thing
[04:05] <pleia2> I'm not blaming meetup at all, it just added another resource to the many we already have and people already don't update ;)
[04:06] <pleia2> and I'm the one who gets to deal with all the complaints
[04:06] <akk> And meetup is kinda confusing to use -- either it sends too many notifications or too few.
[04:06]  * eps finds meetup.com an annoyance best avoided
[04:06] <pleia2> which is something I took on as a leader ;) but I don't have to enjoy it
[04:06] <nUboon2age> would it improve things if i took "ubuntu" out of the name?  I'd be willing if it helps.
[04:06] <pleia2> akk, eps, yeah, a lot of people feel that way
[04:07] <nUboon2age> out of the name of the meetup group and the events that is
[04:08] <pleia2> nUboon2age: it depends on what the goal is here
[04:08] <pleia2> if they're not adhering to the requirements of being an ubuntu california event, they probably shouldn't continue claiming to be part of this team
[04:09] <pleia2> we have very few requirements for hosting an ubuntu california event :)
[04:09] <nUboon2age> well i guess my goal is spreading free software however is best.  i don't wish to cause difficulty for anyone.  if changing the name helps I'm certainly willing.
[04:09] <pleia2> "send a mail to the list, add it to loco.ubuntu.com so people find it when they click "Events" on ubuntu-california.org"
[04:09] <pleia2> ^^ that's it!
[04:09] <pleia2> you can even delegate that to someone who keeps an eye on the meetup :)
[04:10] <nUboon2age> i'm not sure what our success rate on doing all the steps (and there are a few more that weren't mentioned there such as the forum posting) but i know it wasn't completely terrible.
[04:11] <pleia2> those two are the only required ones
[04:11] <pleia2> the rest are optional
[04:11] <pleia2> forums, telling us at team meetings, adding to the wiki, adding it to social media -- all optional
[04:11] <nUboon2age> well it sounds like the best thing is to change the name.  do you agree pleia2 ?
[04:12] <pleia2> nUboon2age: it's really up to you, if you can't find someone willing to tell us when you have events, then I think you have to
[04:12] <akk> Is there really no hope of getting events on the mailing list?
[04:12] <nUboon2age> i just can't keep up with others to make sure they follow up
[04:12] <pleia2> it's not really fair to other members of the team for you to have events that you won't tell us about
[04:12] <akk> (I don't care much about loco.ubuntu, I find that site hopeless to navigate)
[04:13] <pleia2> yeah, even a mail to the mailing list would be a good start
[04:13] <nUboon2age> its not that i *won't* tell the team about it.  its that the event is the event coordinator's responsibility to post about, not mine
[04:15] <akk> How are people supposed to find out about the events? Sometimes I got mail from meetup, but sometimes I didn't 'til a couple hours before it happened.
[04:15] <nUboon2age> i just created (and pay for) a resource that others can publicize events with.  i do ask them to follow up with the team, but they haven't been great about it, and i myself am not fantastic about it on my own events (though to be fair to me I certainly try).  any member of meetup can do an event on that meetup group
[04:16] <akk> Maybe that's just the event organizer not deciding 'til the last minute and not posting it 'til then.
[04:16] <nUboon2age> akk: that has certainly been the case many times
[04:16] <akk> I know with other meetup groups, I often see things like email about a proposed event (time TBA, location TBA)
[04:16] <akk> and then never hear about it again
[04:16] <akk> but if I happen to go to the meetup group's site, I find out there was actually a date and location chosen.
[04:18] <nUboon2age> i should say any member of *that meetup group* can create an event. that's what i meant.
[04:19] <nUboon2age> it sounds to me that it would be better if i changed the name.
[04:21] <nUboon2age> and again its not *me* having events.  its whoever organizes that event.
[04:22] <akk> Ubuntu SV doesn't say it's part of Ubuntu CA.
[04:23] <akk> But it might be worth not calling specific meetups Ubuntu Hours if they aren't announced.
[04:23] <pleia2> akk: ah, good to know
[04:23] <pleia2> it's ok to run your own Ubuntu Hours outside of the team, it had just been communicated to me that these paricular ones did actually intend to be as part of the team
[04:24] <nUboon2age> so even if i change the name, Ubuntians are free to post Ubuntu Hour and other Ubuntu California team events.  my view is there more activity and publicity the better, and i'd rather have a poorly publicized event than not get around to an event due to PR not getting done.
[04:24] <akk> I think everybody involved is in favor of posting Ubuntu Hour notices everywhere, including on meetup
[04:25] <akk> We just get a little frustrated about the events on meetup that we don't hear about in time to go to them.
[04:25] <pleia2> you may prefer that, but it really does upset people when they miss events because it's confusing to figure out where they are supposed to look for them (believe me, I get the complaints regularly)
[04:25] <akk> I don't think it has anything to do with the name of the meetup group, which seems fine (to me, anyway).
[04:25] <pleia2> so perhaps it's been good for new blood, but it hurts the team in the long run
[04:25] <nUboon2age> i believe you pleia2 , no worries.  okay well it sounds pretty conclusive that life would be better if i changed the name
[04:26] <pleia2> I still hope we can encourage people running ubuntu events to tell us about them
[04:26] <akk> It sounds like you want to change the name, but I don't understand why.
[04:27] <nUboon2age> akk: yes a separate problem is that the event organizers have frequently posted them quite late
[04:28] <nUboon2age> and i've done that myself.  as i say i'm okay with whoever can show and okay with not getting word out as early as i like.
[04:29] <nUboon2age> akk: well it seems like lyz's expectations for the event organizers are not likely to be consistently met and that is causing her grief, so it would be better to decouple the name so as to lessen expectations
[04:30] <kdub> are there any promo codes for scale 11x (i know we had some in the past....)
[04:30] <pleia2> kdub: email philipballew, he has them
[04:30] <kdub> thanks pleia2
[04:31] <pleia2> akk: yeah, it doesn't solve the problem of folks not being notified :( but it does lessen how bad it makes this team look (and all the complaints I get)
[04:31] <akk> nUboon2age: I still don't understand how the name relates. You want to take ubuntu entirely out of the name?
[04:31] <nUboon2age> akk: yes
[04:31] <pleia2> I wish we could solve the actual problem, but I've been trying for months without much response from the SV organizers
[04:31] <akk> The name isn't ubuntu-california or ubuntu-hours or anything like that.
[04:31] <eps> kdub: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/Scale11x if you're planning to attend; Philip has codes for people working the booth
[04:31] <darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Projects/Scale11x - Ubuntu Wiki]
[04:31] <akk> I'm sure Liz (or anyone else here) wouldn't say that no meetup group should ever have ubuntu in the name.
[04:32] <pleia2> yeah, it's not about it having Ubuntu in the name, it's that they were telling people they were ubuntu california events
[04:32] <pleia2> but no one in the ubuntu california team actually knew about them ;)
[04:32] <nUboon2age> akk: James McClain and jtatum and the other fellow (spacing his name) never were good about following up on the team's announcement guidelines and i'm not going to try to run along behind them and clean up
[04:34] <nUboon2age> akk: if someone such as yourself were willing to make sure the Ubuntu CA notifications happened, it would solve that particular problem (though not the late announcements).
[04:34] <akk> Yes, I agree -- the problem existed before the meetup group did.
[04:34] <akk> I'd be willing to post notifications if I knew about events in advance ... but I'm one of the ones who never hears about them in time.
[04:35] <nUboon2age> hmmmmmm
[04:35] <nUboon2age> well when the events are announced they go to all meetup group members including you akk.
[04:36] <akk> I find meetup's email announcements very flaky.
[04:37] <akk> Or possibly it's the organizers being flaky and not posting 'til the last minute, but I've had notification problems in other groups too (see above).
[04:37] <nUboon2age> a way to resolve it would be if you were to be the coordinator of the event coordinators :-)  and when they wanted to do an event they let you know directly.  i think that's what it might require
[04:38] <pleia2> yeah, I've tried to keep on top of them and send notifications to the list and on twitter, but I'm not the gal for the job
[04:38] <akk> I can't step up and organize ubuntu hours now, when I'm out of town half the time.
[04:38] <pleia2> (and I also have meetup email troubles)
[04:38] <akk> Maybe later in the year.
[04:40] <nUboon2age> either each event organizer has to do all the steps themselves (and that hasn't been very successful) or some one person (such as akk) would have to take the responsibility to make sure the Ubuntu CA team gets the notifications.  its not going to be me because i've got too many other things on my plate
[04:40] <nUboon2age> or i can change the name.  i think i'll have to change the name
[04:41] <akk> I still don't see what the name has to do with it.
[04:41] <eps> What's wrong with loco.ubuntu.com? It has an RSS feed and a frighteningly large ical feed (including past events going back to Mar. 2010)
[04:41] <akk> If you're dead set on changing the name, go ahead, but it won't change anything.
[04:41] <akk> (except the name :)
[04:42] <nUboon2age> well no it will change the expectations
[04:42] <akk> nUboon2age: Why?
[04:42] <nUboon2age> i think lyz would agree
[04:43] <akk> So you rename it to something that has nothing to do with ubuntu or linux, and then none of us will feel like we wanted to go anyway
[04:43] <akk> so we won't care that we didn't hear about events?
[04:43]  * akk would still like to see ubuntu/linux/free software events happen, preferably when she can go to them
[04:43] <nUboon2age> because no longer would people come to lyz asking why the Ubuntu California team didn't hear about the event for one thing.
[04:44] <akk> If the group is called something else but events are still called "Ubuntu Hour", I bet people will still be confused.
[04:44] <akk> It's the names of the events that's confusing, not the name of the group.
[04:44] <pleia2> it really just solves the problem of the team looking bad for having such disorganization of events, sadly not that existing members are being ignored by event organizers
[04:45] <nUboon2age> if Grant or i or you want to run an event and name it Ubuntu Hour, i don't have a problem with that
[04:45] <nUboon2age> (and use the meetup group to publicize it that is)
[04:45] <akk> Perhaps there shouldn't be any expectation that events called an "ubuntu hour" are associated with the ubuntu loco
[04:46] <akk> and maybe over time people would get used to that, but I think for now, there is that expectation.
[04:46] <akk> If I google for "ubuntu hour" all the top links have to do with Ubuntu locos.
[04:46] <nUboon2age> i really object to your continual use of words like "ignored" when that is so not the case pleia2
[04:46] <nUboon2age> like i said, i cannot police others
[04:47] <pleia2> nUboon2age: sorry, I'm not sure what else to say, "forgot"?
[04:47] <nUboon2age> but i refuse to assume they are "ignoring" anyone
[04:47] <pleia2> I don't know what word won't offend you
[04:47] <nUboon2age> well okay, let me think
[04:47] <pleia2> they claim to be part of this team, but don't tell the team about events they are running in the team's name, that's offensive to us
[04:47] <nUboon2age> how about not ascribing anything to them except that they didn't post?
[04:48] <nUboon2age> so that's you taking offense pleia2
[04:48] <akk> pleia2: Are they actually claiming to be part of the team?
[04:48] <nUboon2age> and taking offense when i don't think its wise to do so or justified
[04:48] <pleia2> akk: yes, I emailed a few months back specificially to ask if they considered themselves part of the team in order to try and clear this up
[04:48] <akk> I don't think they are. I think they're taking the term "ubuntu hour" and using it to mean any informal gathering about Ubuntu, having nothing to do with a loco.
[04:48] <pleia2> they got very defensive :(
[04:49] <akk> Hmm, weird.
[04:49] <pleia2> I didn't mean to offend, I was just trying to figure out why they weren't telling the rest of the team about events
[04:49] <akk> Maybe they misunderstood and thought you were asking if team members were welcome?
[04:49] <pleia2> I am not sure
[04:49] <nUboon2age> as i said i've done my best to connect them to the team, but they just don't seem to be as focused on it as i am or you are pleia2
[04:49] <pleia2> I think they saw me as an authority figure so they just went immediately to being defensive and thinking I was accusing them of something, I was just trying to work with them
[04:49] <pleia2> honestly I've given up
[04:51] <pleia2> that's when I started trying to manually cross-post the events myself, with limited success :)
[04:51] <nUboon2age> i certainly consider myself to be part of the team and try to follow the guidelines, though i know i haven't always succeeded. its certainly not that i'm ignoring the team or don't want them to know on my (or even the other's events)
[04:51] <nUboon2age> oops, i meant ... know about my ... events
[04:52] <pleia2> nUboon2age: I guess you are interpreting "ignore" as a more aggressive act, I just mean we're been forgotten and put out of sight by organizers who only post last minute notices on meetup
[04:52] <nUboon2age> so i can only have any sort of control over my own actions and i do try.
[04:53] <nUboon2age> i'll say again i wish there was an app that would handle all the notification postings in one stroke
[04:54] <pleia2> loco.ubuntu.com is the closest thing we have to that, but it doesn't do email yet (there is a wishlist bug)
[04:54] <pleia2> it updates our events page and calendar, which a lot of people use, and is what the social media admins use for posting the on-day event reminders
[04:55] <akk> And it doesn't do meetup (which apparently some people prefer).
[04:55] <akk> Dunno if meetup even offers an API to create events from outside.
[04:55] <pleia2> you can add a meetup link for registration, but no, I don't think meetup has an API that would support that
[04:55] <nUboon2age> akk: but it'd be fantastic even without meetup
[04:55] <nUboon2age> yeah i haven't seen an api
[04:56] <nUboon2age> but for our own stuff we'd be helping ourselves out SO much
[04:56] <pleia2> adding the meetup as the registration URL is mostly for people who want people to RSVP on meetup rather than loco.ubuntu.com directly, and it's worked pretty well for them
[04:57] <pleia2> but not much we can do about meetup's limitations :(
[04:57] <nUboon2age> yes, i'm very happy and grateful for that feature pleia2
[04:58] <pleia2> nUboon2age: I am very glad you're involved and I hope this doesn't cause hard feelings
[04:58] <pleia2> <3
[04:58] <pleia2> running teams is tough work :)
[04:58] <akk> I'm glad you're both involved
[04:59] <akk> especially since I don't actually do anything but hang out on IRC and whine, and go to events when I hear about them. :)
[04:59] <nUboon2age> i do ask people to join the team.  i think some have.  but we do need to be realistic and realize that taking the steps to join the team takes time and if people don't really understand the value they'll get from it, they'll put a low priority on it
[04:59] <pleia2> akk: haha
[04:59] <pleia2> nUboon2age: yeah :\
[04:59] <akk> Joining the team requires signing up for launchpad and signing the CoC and all that, right?
[04:59] <akk> I can totally understand people not caring enough.
[04:59] <pleia2> we don't technically have a procedure for "joining the team"
[05:00] <nUboon2age> even after i knew i wanted to join the team it took me a while to get around to it
[05:00] <pleia2> joining the mailing list is probablyt the closest, since then you at least get updated on events and team news
[05:00] <pleia2> (well, mostly :))
[05:02] <nUboon2age> to me, i think the team is fantastic and i am very excited about the connections we have here
[05:03] <nUboon2age> but if i hadn't experienced the team in person at the picnix and such and gotten so much help from the forums and ircs i might not have ever made the connection.
[05:03] <pleia2> yeah, the confusion over events is really the only complaint I hear about the team in general
[05:04] <pleia2> mostly I think we do ok, and I've met a lot of great people
[05:07] <nUboon2age> well i'm thinking that moving to a more generic name but still allowing team members to post Ubuntu Hours and Ubuntu events will be the way to go.  doesn't solve all the problems but it seems it would improve things
[05:07] <nUboon2age> one thing to note, is James McClain has only met Lyz and me from the team I think
[05:08] <nUboon2age> so if he's never really experienced the team, then he might not get the value it adds
[05:08]  * pleia2 nods
[05:09] <nUboon2age> i tried to arrange for him to come to an UH where he'd meet jtatum and jledbetter , but it hasn't worked out yet.  I'm not sure if he and akk ever connected
[05:09] <nUboon2age> he's never met the other James either
[05:09] <akk> Is he the one doing the SJ events? I don't think we've ever overlapped.
[05:09] <nUboon2age> let alone aditya or others
[05:10] <nUboon2age> yes akk
[05:11] <nUboon2age> its sort of like trying to shepard folks into the community.  we need some Ubuntu border collies
[05:11] <nUboon2age> ;-)
[05:16] <nUboon2age> away for a few minutes
[05:16] <akk> nice mental image :)
=== jono is now known as Guest10241
[17:43] <kdub> philballew, how to use that code? the scale11x most obvious registration page doesn't look like where exhibitors will register
[18:53] <pleia2> http://uds.ubuntu.com/ has dates now
[18:53] <darthrobot> Title: [Ubuntu Developer Summit]
[19:22] <kdub> oakland again?
[19:22] <pleia2> yeah
[21:32] <grantbow> yes!
[21:42] <Torikun> Yo!
[22:05] <grantbow> markshuttleworth.com is down?
[22:10] <grantbow> what about the uds-s release naming? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DevelopmentCodeNames
[22:11] <darthrobot> Title: [DevelopmentCodeNames - Ubuntu Wiki]
[22:12] <pleia2> last cycle UDS was announced before Mark picked a name too
[22:12]  * grantbow nods
[23:15] <grantbow> hi Philip
[23:16] <philipballew> grantbow, hello
[23:16] <philipballew> whats up?
[23:17] <philipballew> I liked the email you sent grantbow
[23:36] <grantbow> philipballew: thanks! You've seen it before, thanks for your input on this. Torikun was that responder. :-)
[23:37] <grantbow> So I'll start with a project wiki page
[23:37] <philipballew> perfect
[23:38] <philipballew> I need to apply for sponsorship as i dont feel like buying an airplane ticket sunday morning