/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/08/#ubuntu-meeting.txt

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pleia2shuduo: think you could disable that for this channel? :)05:57
shuduopleia2, already disabled. sorry05:59
pleia2thank you!05:59
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seb128hey15:56
ogra_yo15:57
jibel\o15:58
janimohi15:59
seb128heya everybody15:59
seb128I hope you all had a good week15:59
seb128ogra_, want to lead the meeting as usual?15:59
ogra_sure15:59
seb128danke ;-)16:00
ppisati\o/16:00
ogra_sooo16:00
ogra_we have sound on boot working !!!!16:00
mfischogra_: nice!16:01
ogra_i think there were also some additional RAM cutoffs (i didnt fiollow to close this week, but it should be another few MB that we got rid of)16:01
ogra_my current desktop runs using ~390M ... but ...16:01
ogra_right after starting up the device it etas about 600M, it goes down over time to these 390 M later ... we need to find out what causes this spike16:02
ogra_once thats done i think we are good to tick off the thirs marker in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/raring-targets16:03
janimoogra_, I think still some daemons are started by default even if they should be ondemand, right seb128 ?16:03
ogra_beyond that i think we should actually go over that table eveyr meeting (or every second one... or at least once a month)16:03
ogra_janimo, yeah, upstart just grew session support16:03
seb128yeah16:03
ogra_we should see some siginificant changes due to that soon16:03
seb128we daily some stuff on login16:04
seb128but they mostly don't exit16:04
seb128so I'm not sure what's creating the spike either16:04
ogra_yeah, any delaying wont fix our ram footprint16:04
* janimo seems to have seen signond started although he never used U116:04
ogra_i suspect some whoopsie or apport run16:04
ogra_janimo, yeah, there is a bug open for that, i thinnk ken looks into it16:04
ogra_the images were broken for a few days btw ...16:05
ogra_i just uploaded a roolback for a fix that seemingly caused this ... and will manually roll an image once the normal daily cronjob is done16:05
ogra_the 08.1 images should be functional again16:06
* ptl wished he could have that annoying click loss bug fixed and also have the latest kde plasma so he could test other tablet interfaces on his nexus716:06
ogra_so pepole wanting to play with it on the weekend will have images16:06
ogra_ptl, we all do :(16:06
seb128janimo, signond is fixed, signon-ui is fixed in trunk but that didn't land on raring yet16:06
seb128fixed = exit when not needed16:06
ogra_ptl, (not plasma, but the click issue)16:06
ogra_right, so ptl pointed out our worst bug still ...16:07
ogra_do we have anyone from the X team around ?16:07
janimoseb128, but does it start by default in a session?16:07
ogra_do we know if there is any progress being made ?16:07
janimothat seems a bit orthogonal to quitting on idle16:07
seb128janimo, not by default, only if an app query it16:07
janimook16:07
* ogra_ sees neither bryce nor timo16:07
seb128which might be the case for e.g the files lens looking for google drive documents16:07
ogra_janimo, how are the luxd and acceld replacement bits going ?16:08
janimonot much code progress this week16:08
janimowith lux we seem to have pushback because it needs to be yet another poll/wakeup16:09
janimothe 'fix' would be to piggyback on the existing poll in accel code or somewhere else but that is a gross hack16:09
ogra_well, yeah, and the fact that you cant manually adjust the brightness if it runs isnt great either16:09
janimoupstream said they would not mind a dedicated lights plugin in gsd16:09
janimobut I don't know what our short term plans are16:09
ogra_how do they deal with that on i.e. macbooks ?16:09
janimoI would not want to work on gsd if we decide in a few months we make a dedicated daemon16:10
ogra_they ahve an ambient light sensor16:10
ogra_and other laptops too16:10
janimoogra_, probably a special daemon. I think some VAIO models have that too16:10
janimoso custom tools nothing in gsd16:10
ogra_it is a function i would actually expect to live in the default brightness code of g-s-d16:10
seb128upstream had concerns about those light sensors and power usage I think16:11
ogra_*sniff*16:11
seb128from what I read on IRC16:11
janimoogra_, me too. We need to touch control center too. I guess if we don't mind the extra ubuntu patch it should be done16:11
janimobetter than a separate shell daemon16:11
seb128they said they are not easy to deal with, or you need to keep the dev ice open and pull16:11
ogra_janimo, ++16:11
janimoespecially since we need control center hooks16:11
ogra_seb128, right, thats our prob too16:12
ogra_we currently need to poll for orientation and ambient16:12
janimoseb128, yes that is hadess' reluctance too16:12
ogra_janimo, i think we should have a general backend that does both püolls16:12
janimobut if that is how the hardware works there's no way around it16:12
ogra_and i dont think its as gross to do it that way as you claim16:12
janimoogra_, I proposed that to lukewarm reception to upstream16:13
janimobut yes, we may want to do that16:13
ogra_it will save us one additional process that polls16:13
seb128right16:13
ogra_ideally we would indeed have the right firmware that gives us devices with events16:13
janimopitti suggested hooking it into unity even as that wakes up 60/s16:13
seb128urg16:14
ogra_oh ?16:14
seb128putting more code in the wm16:14
seb128what could go wrong...16:14
janimoogra_, sometimes the hw is cheap/dump so no events can come off it16:14
ogra_right16:14
ogra_seb128, we would have even more "unification" :)16:14
ogra_we should move the kernel into it too or just make unity a loadable module ;)16:15
seb128unity in the kernel16:15
* ppisati seconds the idea of moving kernel into unity16:15
seb128going to love it :p16:15
ogra_no more inter-process communication issues :)16:15
ogra_ppisati, are you eager to work under seb128 ? :)16:16
seb128ok, joke aside, let's move to the next topic ;-)16:16
vibhavo/16:16
ogra_what is the next topic then ?16:16
seb128if there is one16:16
ogra_vibhav, shoot16:16
janimoseb128, actually I am prepared to do this work as desktop team/Ubuntu gsd maintainers feel is less intrusive16:16
janimoif you are fine with a hacky patch for the time being that can be quickly done16:17
ogra_janimo, yay16:17
vibhavIs there any page listing tasks fpr new contributors?16:17
seb128janimo, I'm fine with a hacky patch for this cycle16:17
vibhavI wish to join the fun too :)16:17
janimo\o/16:17
ogra_dholbach, ^^^ do we have such a page ?16:17
seb128vibhav, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-reduced-power-ram16:17
seb128any item marked as TODO welcome contributions16:17
ogra_right, you could just pick up workitems16:17
dholbachogra_, for what? specifically for the nexus7 work?16:18
ogra_or talk to the QA guys and help gathering test data16:18
ogra_dholbach, yeah16:18
dholbachhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/Developers is the bare minimum - tasks could be added there16:18
seb128vibhav, http://www.chizang.net/alex/blog/2012/11/23/memory-leaks-in-ubuntu-episode-i-detection/ as well16:18
seb128and the following blog post16:18
ogra_or dig through https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-nexus716:18
janimoseb128, all workitems there that have no [username] are for takes?16:19
ogra_janimo, yep16:19
seb128I'm taking a todo to consolidate the TODO list16:19
janimoand the rest assumed to actually be owned16:19
vibhavYeah memory leaks, I was working on some the other day16:19
seb128dholbach, ogra_: I will get a "how to contribute" section on the wiki next week16:19
* ogra_ would do an "action" for the bot, but i forgot to start it :P16:19
dholbachperfect16:20
ogra_seb128, thanks16:20
seb128janimo, vibhav: any workitem that is TODO should not be started, feel free to grab those without name or ping whoever has his name on the line16:20
vibhavSure16:20
seb128I don't think any of us really want to own the fix16:20
ogra_we should all blog/G+/facebook about that page once it exists16:20
seb128that would be good16:20
ogra_get the community aware :)16:20
ogra_well ...16:21
janimoseb128, do you know why some have 'rewrite in vala' while others 'rewrite in !python'? Is there no consensus inside the unity team what the blessed plugin language should be?16:21
seb128it's not up to the unity team16:22
seb128we don't really want to dictate language16:22
ogra_something thats resulting in fast compiled binaries16:22
seb128if somebody prefers C that works for us16:22
ptlgnome now recommends javascript, just to recall :P16:22
seb128for apps only though16:22
seb128they keep C for their platform16:23
seb128it would be crazy to write the system stack in something interpreted16:23
ogra_yeah16:23
seb128ok16:23
seb128so on other news, upstart session jobs seem to be on track16:23
seb128they are going through a first round of testing from adventurous users16:24
seb128it should land in raring in time for feature freeze16:24
janimowell not dictating but consistency of tech at least among the bits shipped by default would sure help16:24
janimofor carrying over maintenance/bugfixing experience16:24
seb128janimo, we recommend C/vala/qt/go16:25
ogra_binary is binary ... :)16:25
ogra_we recommend go ?16:25
seb128go is less for desktopish but a good choice for server components16:25
* ogra_ definitely doesnt recommend go for mobile images :) )16:25
seb128ogra_, more for server stuff16:25
seb128but yeah I would say C/vala/Qt for mobile16:25
ogra_static linking is evil size wise16:25
seb128Qt is closer from where we are going but it's cpp16:26
seb128C/vala is good for gobject world16:26
ogra_yup16:26
seb128ok16:27
seb128do we have anything else to cover?16:27
ogra_nothing else from me16:27
ogra_anyone else ?16:27
seb128is there any blocker issue we should be looking at? out of that X/click/grab issue16:28
seb128and the things mentioned during the meeting16:28
seb128?16:28
ogra_i dont think we have any blockers beyond that16:28
seb128ok, great16:28
ogra_it actually seems to all go very smooth atm16:28
ogra_oh, btw, usb-creator grew nexus7 installation support16:29
* ogra_ totally forgot to mention that above16:29
seb128nice16:29
seb128btw, just as another fyi, I will try to organize a bit better the valgrinding effort next week as well16:29
ogra_if you run a raring PC please help testing it (you need to gunzip the img.gz file first, there isnt unzipping code yet)16:29
seb128e.g set up a list of targets16:29
seb128and open some bugs16:30
seb128maybe blog about an example16:30
seb128so we get some extra traction in there16:30
ogra_awesome !16:30
seb128I also want to get extra memory usage mesure over time/usage for things like gvfs/unity lenses/indicators16:30
seb128we mostly did idle so far16:30
ogra_yeah16:30
ogra_but idle looks really good now16:30
seb128yeah16:31
seb128then you start using the dash or play with your indicator and you see we still have work :p16:31
ogra_and the fun part is that i read everywhere how much more stable and how much faster 13.04 is for everyone testing it16:31
ogra_even on desktops16:31
seb128anyway it's a good start16:31
seb128\o/16:31
ogra_so we're on a very good track here16:31
seb128good work everyone!16:31
ogra_yeah16:31
seb128ok that, let's wrap up?16:31
ogra_and with these words ...16:31
seb128have a good w.e everyone!16:32
xnoxogra_: the spike can be anacronjobs.16:32
ogra_heh, could we stop saying the same differently phrased all the time ? :)16:32
seb128ogra_, ;-)16:32
ogra_enjoy your weekend everybody16:32
ogra_:P16:32
seb128lol16:32
ogra_bye all16:32
ogra_7me goes back to #ubuntu-arm16:32
* ptl apt-getting full-upgrading his nexus 7 and the other 5 arm devices16:59
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tgm4883whose running this show?18:02
bobweaaverno I says this guy18:02
bobweaavernot *18:02
CrestedNewtok18:02
CrestedNewt#startmeeting18:03
meetingologyMeeting started Fri Feb  8 18:03:00 2013 UTC.  The chair is CrestedNewt. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.18:03
meetingologyAvailable commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired18:03
CrestedNewtevening all - how have we progressed this week?18:03
CrestedNewtOK I will start then18:05
CrestedNewtI was supposed to have a Google Hangout with Bobweaver last week but I have spent the time clearing my desk so that I can get a better grip on where we are18:06
CrestedNewtI messed up and bobweaver and I are going to have a google hangout early next week18:06
bobweaaverI am on live here atm http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0GJO_bCHDc    if you all have any question for me18:07
bobweaavertgm4883:  any work on scope ?18:09
tgm4883I've done nothing more that make sure it builds on 12.0418:10
tgm4883and it's in the PPA now18:10
tgm4883soon, I'll probably write some instructions for people to use for testing18:10
bobweaavertgm4883:  I fixed the bug in previews so that it is launching using unity and not Qt anymore18:14
bobweaaveradded more previews18:14
tgm4883bobweaaver, nice18:14
bobweaavertorrents and news18:14
bobweaavernews is cool torrents is nothing special18:14
bobweaavergoing to have to work on getting lens backported for testing with previews18:15
bobweaaverI need to do a mass re-write of the word "preview" and change it so that lens can call but that is about it on my end18:15
CrestedNewtOK so bobweaver - your work is almost done?18:16
bobweaavermaybe we can talk about getting this done https://plus.google.com/u/0/104659991254860976283/posts/hu8MmEqvEnX18:16
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bobweaaverwhat are your thoughts ?18:17
tgm4883bobweaaver, which parts?18:17
tgm4883maybe we should go though each section of that for this meeting18:18
bobweaaverany18:18
bobweaaverok18:18
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* tgm4883 awaits CrestedNewt to do the topic stuff18:18
CrestedNewt#topic Google+ Page18:18
=== meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Google+ Page
CrestedNewtOK - looks good18:19
tgm4883lol18:19
tgm4883CrestedNewt, how about A) Setting up a documentation session.18:19
CrestedNewtOK, I'm all for doing some documentation. or do you mean #topic A) etc18:20
tgm4883CrestedNewt, I mean for the topic18:21
CrestedNewt#topic Setting up Documentation Settings18:21
=== meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Setting up Documentation Settings
CrestedNewtDone18:21
bobweaaverI think htat I am talking away on youtube to thin air :P18:21
tgm4883bobweaaver, probably18:21
CrestedNewtput that ciggie out - it's bad for you18:21
tgm4883So documentation wise, we need some decent docs on setup18:22
tgm4883Does anyone want to lead that up?18:23
CrestedNewttgm4883 - I'll download the latest release and install in a VM and document18:23
tgm4883CrestedNewt, all parts?18:23
CrestedNewtwhy not18:23
* tgm4883 notes that includes Mythtv setup18:23
CrestedNewtbobweaver - let me change RL room as wife is sitting next to me :D18:24
CrestedNewtOK back - had to switch wireless18:25
CrestedNewtI don't know enough about MythTV18:25
bobweaavertgm4883:  I will send you video link of this record so you can watch after work or whatever18:26
CrestedNewtbobweaver - thanks18:26
CrestedNewtok - so the documentation is all over the place at the moment - it just needs to be correlated?18:27
tgm4883Yes18:28
bobweaaverso I am set with that docs that is dont know what else is needed to talk about maybe questions that you all might have18:28
bobweaaversorry this webchat thingy is messing up18:28
tgm4883I'll write up some basic mythtv instructions and hopefully someone can go though them and see what is missing18:28
CrestedNewtok - I'm happy to pull that together and test it during an install18:28
CrestedNewtthat should highlight any bugs18:29
CrestedNewtwhat is good bobweaver?18:29
tgm4883so that probably covers A and B on that list18:30
CrestedNewtsounds like it18:31
CrestedNewttgm4883 & bobweaver - could you tell me where you have the documentation so that I can start to pull it together18:32
tgm4883I don't have much18:32
tgm4883Moving on?18:33
CrestedNewtjust listening to bobweaver atm18:33
CrestedNewt#action crestednewt - setup meeting with bobweaver18:34
meetingologyACTION: crestednewt - setup meeting with bobweaver18:34
CrestedNewtok - I'm in the UK so you guys are like 6 & 7 hrs behind me18:35
bobweaavertgm4883: could you do this via google hangout with me if so what is the best time for you ?18:36
CrestedNewtwhen are you free tgm4883?18:36
tgm4883Not sure what we're talking about right now18:36
CrestedNewtok - bobweaver is talking on a youtube channel - makes it a bit hard to document but he is talking about a G+ Hangout between the 3 of us18:37
bobweaaverwe have to set a time to do this the meeting for the public18:37
tgm4883CrestedNewt, right, for what reason?18:37
bobweaaverto get the public involed18:37
bobweaaverwell more that is18:37
tgm4883but what are we going to discuss?18:37
CrestedNewtI think we need to get the installation adocumentation ironed out and fluid18:38
bobweaaverlike a basic setup and things to look out for when buying card ect18:38
CrestedNewtI just need some guiding on that from both of you18:38
tgm4883I'll try to get some information together for that18:39
bobweaaverI am hoping by having this that we will not have to doc and the public will doc18:39
bobweaavermainly because of my learning disability18:39
CrestedNewtthat's why I am here - I can document into a wiki and then that can be updated18:39
bobweaaverLike I could ask you a coupld of questions about myth how long you have been using it18:40
CrestedNewtat least there will be a start point18:40
CrestedNewtOK, so you want 30 minutes with tgm4883 about the video capture hardware18:41
CrestedNewtfor the public to be aware of what HW will work as a minimum18:42
bobweaaverI would ask tgm4883  questio ns like D) How to prep a computer for Myth TV18:42
bobweaaverwhat is good hardware ?18:42
bobweaaverwhere to get help18:43
tgm4883so for that, I'm going to documents a few tuners depending on your location/use case18:43
bobweaaverhow long you been using mythbuntu18:43
tgm4883hardware wise, I'm going to leave minimum system requirements for bobweaaver to figure out18:43
tgm4883bobweaaver, me?18:43
CrestedNewtand this is to be recorded and put up on youtube?18:43
bobweaavery18:44
* tgm4883 is one of the founding developers of Mythbuntu18:44
bobweaaverLive18:44
CrestedNewtok - so it is a living manual18:44
bobweaaverpeople will be able to ask questions via chat18:44
tgm4883My goal for the Mythtv documention is to end up with a "quick start guide", similar to what you get when buying a new computer/TV/stereo equipment18:45
bobweaaverthat is perfect18:45
bobweaaverbut whta is good time for you ?18:46
bobweaaverweekends ?18:46
CrestedNewtOK, I think I have a handle on this..... tgm4883 - yes with a link then back to the online for more advanced tasks?18:46
bobweaaverwill take 30 min tops18:46
tgm4883bobweaaver, usually yes, but I'm going out of town this weekend18:46
CrestedNewttgm4883 - enjoy!! :D18:46
bobweaaveryeah I amm also busy18:46
CrestedNewtok - what about Monday sometime?18:46
bobweaavermaybe 2 weeks from now ?18:46
CrestedNewtthe problem with 2 weeks from now is it puts us a bit further back18:47
bobweaaveranything but this weekend is good for me18:47
bobweaavermeaning anything but thsi weekend18:47
CrestedNewtlol @ bobweaver - got it mate18:47
tgm4883anything during the week is going to mean really late for CrestedNewt18:47
CrestedNewtwell - I just need to drink less and stay up late :D18:48
bobweaaverlol18:48
CrestedNewttgm4883 - I can do up to midnight UK time, which would mean 6pm East Coast time18:49
bobweaaverWe just have to have a date that way we can tell public the time and place ect18:49
tgm4883We're getting to the end of our time, are there any community questions this session?18:49
CrestedNewt#topic Q&A18:49
=== meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Q&A
tgm4883CrestedNewt, I couldn't do earlier than 9PM East coast time18:49
bobweaaverall the things do not need to be done in one day though that would be good18:49
CrestedNewttgm4883 - ouch!! that may not work18:50
CrestedNewttgm4883 - will e-mail you later on some idea's18:51
bobweaaverallright we got 10 min I say we go to questions unless there are none are there any Questions ?18:51
CrestedNewtThe floor is open - anyone have any questions for tgm4883 & bobweaver?18:51
CrestedNewtno-one?18:52
bobweaavergood less to do :)18:52
CrestedNewtLOL!!!18:52
bobweaaverI say that we are done  what about you all ?18:52
CrestedNewtagreed18:52
CrestedNewt#endmeeting18:53
=== meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology
meetingologyMeeting ended Fri Feb  8 18:53:14 2013 UTC.18:53
meetingologyMinutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-08-18.03.moin.txt18:53
meetingologyMinutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-08-18.03.html18:53
bobweaavertgm4883:  get ahold of me after this week end I want to show you what I am doing with the previews18:53
tgm4883ok18:53
bobweaavercya all have a good one18:53
CrestedNewtcya18:54
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