[00:28] <TheDrums> IdleOne: He stopped ^
[04:58]  * shuduo is away: auto-away
[05:05]  * shuduo is back (gone 00:07:21)
[05:38]  * shuduo is away: auto-away
[05:56]  * shuduo is back (gone 00:17:53)
[05:57] <pleia2> shuduo: think you could disable that for this channel? :)
[05:59] <shuduo> pleia2, already disabled. sorry
[05:59] <pleia2> thank you!
[15:56] <seb128> hey
[15:57] <ogra_> yo
[15:58] <jibel> \o
[15:59] <janimo> hi
[15:59] <seb128> heya everybody
[15:59] <seb128> I hope you all had a good week
[15:59] <seb128> ogra_, want to lead the meeting as usual?
[15:59] <ogra_> sure
[16:00] <seb128> danke ;-)
[16:00] <ppisati> \o/
[16:00] <ogra_> sooo
[16:00] <ogra_> we have sound on boot working !!!!
[16:01] <mfisch> ogra_: nice!
[16:01] <ogra_> i think there were also some additional RAM cutoffs (i didnt fiollow to close this week, but it should be another few MB that we got rid of)
[16:01] <ogra_> my current desktop runs using ~390M ... but ...
[16:02] <ogra_> right after starting up the device it etas about 600M, it goes down over time to these 390 M later ... we need to find out what causes this spike
[16:03] <ogra_> once thats done i think we are good to tick off the thirs marker in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/raring-targets
[16:03] <janimo> ogra_, I think still some daemons are started by default even if they should be ondemand, right seb128 ?
[16:03] <ogra_> beyond that i think we should actually go over that table eveyr meeting (or every second one... or at least once a month)
[16:03] <ogra_> janimo, yeah, upstart just grew session support
[16:03] <seb128> yeah
[16:03] <ogra_> we should see some siginificant changes due to that soon
[16:04] <seb128> we daily some stuff on login
[16:04] <seb128> but they mostly don't exit
[16:04] <seb128> so I'm not sure what's creating the spike either
[16:04] <ogra_> yeah, any delaying wont fix our ram footprint
[16:04]  * janimo seems to have seen signond started although he never used U1
[16:04] <ogra_> i suspect some whoopsie or apport run
[16:04] <ogra_> janimo, yeah, there is a bug open for that, i thinnk ken looks into it
[16:05] <ogra_> the images were broken for a few days btw ...
[16:05] <ogra_> i just uploaded a roolback for a fix that seemingly caused this ... and will manually roll an image once the normal daily cronjob is done
[16:06] <ogra_> the 08.1 images should be functional again
[16:06]  * ptl wished he could have that annoying click loss bug fixed and also have the latest kde plasma so he could test other tablet interfaces on his nexus7
[16:06] <ogra_> so pepole wanting to play with it on the weekend will have images
[16:06] <ogra_> ptl, we all do :(
[16:06] <seb128> janimo, signond is fixed, signon-ui is fixed in trunk but that didn't land on raring yet
[16:06] <seb128> fixed = exit when not needed
[16:06] <ogra_> ptl, (not plasma, but the click issue)
[16:07] <ogra_> right, so ptl pointed out our worst bug still ...
[16:07] <ogra_> do we have anyone from the X team around ?
[16:07] <janimo> seb128, but does it start by default in a session?
[16:07] <ogra_> do we know if there is any progress being made ?
[16:07] <janimo> that seems a bit orthogonal to quitting on idle
[16:07] <seb128> janimo, not by default, only if an app query it
[16:07] <janimo> ok
[16:07]  * ogra_ sees neither bryce nor timo
[16:07] <seb128> which might be the case for e.g the files lens looking for google drive documents
[16:08] <ogra_> janimo, how are the luxd and acceld replacement bits going ?
[16:08] <janimo> not much code progress this week
[16:09] <janimo> with lux we seem to have pushback because it needs to be yet another poll/wakeup
[16:09] <janimo> the 'fix' would be to piggyback on the existing poll in accel code or somewhere else but that is a gross hack
[16:09] <ogra_> well, yeah, and the fact that you cant manually adjust the brightness if it runs isnt great either
[16:09] <janimo> upstream said they would not mind a dedicated lights plugin in gsd
[16:09] <janimo> but I don't know what our short term plans are
[16:09] <ogra_> how do they deal with that on i.e. macbooks ?
[16:10] <janimo> I would not want to work on gsd if we decide in a few months we make a dedicated daemon
[16:10] <ogra_> they ahve an ambient light sensor
[16:10] <ogra_> and other laptops too
[16:10] <janimo> ogra_, probably a special daemon. I think some VAIO models have that too
[16:10] <janimo> so custom tools nothing in gsd
[16:10] <ogra_> it is a function i would actually expect to live in the default brightness code of g-s-d
[16:11] <seb128> upstream had concerns about those light sensors and power usage I think
[16:11] <ogra_> *sniff*
[16:11] <seb128> from what I read on IRC
[16:11] <janimo> ogra_, me too. We need to touch control center too. I guess if we don't mind the extra ubuntu patch it should be done
[16:11] <janimo> better than a separate shell daemon
[16:11] <seb128> they said they are not easy to deal with, or you need to keep the dev ice open and pull
[16:11] <ogra_> janimo, ++
[16:11] <janimo> especially since we need control center hooks
[16:12] <ogra_> seb128, right, thats our prob too
[16:12] <ogra_> we currently need to poll for orientation and ambient
[16:12] <janimo> seb128, yes that is hadess' reluctance too
[16:12] <ogra_> janimo, i think we should have a general backend that does both püolls
[16:12] <janimo> but if that is how the hardware works there's no way around it
[16:12] <ogra_> and i dont think its as gross to do it that way as you claim
[16:13] <janimo> ogra_, I proposed that to lukewarm reception to upstream
[16:13] <janimo> but yes, we may want to do that
[16:13] <ogra_> it will save us one additional process that polls
[16:13] <seb128> right
[16:13] <ogra_> ideally we would indeed have the right firmware that gives us devices with events
[16:13] <janimo> pitti suggested hooking it into unity even as that wakes up 60/s
[16:14] <seb128> urg
[16:14] <ogra_> oh ?
[16:14] <seb128> putting more code in the wm
[16:14] <seb128> what could go wrong...
[16:14] <janimo> ogra_, sometimes the hw is cheap/dump so no events can come off it
[16:14] <ogra_> right
[16:14] <ogra_> seb128, we would have even more "unification" :)
[16:15] <ogra_> we should move the kernel into it too or just make unity a loadable module ;)
[16:15] <seb128> unity in the kernel
[16:15]  * ppisati seconds the idea of moving kernel into unity
[16:15] <seb128> going to love it :p
[16:15] <ogra_> no more inter-process communication issues :)
[16:16] <ogra_> ppisati, are you eager to work under seb128 ? :)
[16:16] <seb128> ok, joke aside, let's move to the next topic ;-)
[16:16] <vibhav> o/
[16:16] <ogra_> what is the next topic then ?
[16:16] <seb128> if there is one
[16:16] <ogra_> vibhav, shoot
[16:16] <janimo> seb128, actually I am prepared to do this work as desktop team/Ubuntu gsd maintainers feel is less intrusive
[16:17] <janimo> if you are fine with a hacky patch for the time being that can be quickly done
[16:17] <ogra_> janimo, yay
[16:17] <vibhav> Is there any page listing tasks fpr new contributors?
[16:17] <seb128> janimo, I'm fine with a hacky patch for this cycle
[16:17] <vibhav> I wish to join the fun too :)
[16:17] <janimo> \o/
[16:17] <ogra_> dholbach, ^^^ do we have such a page ?
[16:17] <seb128> vibhav, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-reduced-power-ram
[16:17] <seb128> any item marked as TODO welcome contributions
[16:17] <ogra_> right, you could just pick up workitems
[16:18] <dholbach> ogra_, for what? specifically for the nexus7 work?
[16:18] <ogra_> or talk to the QA guys and help gathering test data
[16:18] <ogra_> dholbach, yeah
[16:18] <dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/Developers is the bare minimum - tasks could be added there
[16:18] <seb128> vibhav, http://www.chizang.net/alex/blog/2012/11/23/memory-leaks-in-ubuntu-episode-i-detection/ as well
[16:18] <seb128> and the following blog post
[16:18] <ogra_> or dig through https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-nexus7
[16:19] <janimo> seb128, all workitems there that have no [username] are for takes?
[16:19] <ogra_> janimo, yep
[16:19] <seb128> I'm taking a todo to consolidate the TODO list
[16:19] <janimo> and the rest assumed to actually be owned
[16:19] <vibhav> Yeah memory leaks, I was working on some the other day
[16:19] <seb128> dholbach, ogra_: I will get a "how to contribute" section on the wiki next week
[16:19]  * ogra_ would do an "action" for the bot, but i forgot to start it :P
[16:20] <dholbach> perfect
[16:20] <ogra_> seb128, thanks
[16:20] <seb128> janimo, vibhav: any workitem that is TODO should not be started, feel free to grab those without name or ping whoever has his name on the line
[16:20] <vibhav> Sure
[16:20] <seb128> I don't think any of us really want to own the fix
[16:20] <ogra_> we should all blog/G+/facebook about that page once it exists
[16:20] <seb128> that would be good
[16:20] <ogra_> get the community aware :)
[16:21] <ogra_> well ...
[16:21] <janimo> seb128, do you know why some have 'rewrite in vala' while others 'rewrite in !python'? Is there no consensus inside the unity team what the blessed plugin language should be?
[16:22] <seb128> it's not up to the unity team
[16:22] <seb128> we don't really want to dictate language
[16:22] <ogra_> something thats resulting in fast compiled binaries
[16:22] <seb128> if somebody prefers C that works for us
[16:22] <ptl> gnome now recommends javascript, just to recall :P
[16:22] <seb128> for apps only though
[16:23] <seb128> they keep C for their platform
[16:23] <seb128> it would be crazy to write the system stack in something interpreted
[16:23] <ogra_> yeah
[16:23] <seb128> ok
[16:23] <seb128> so on other news, upstart session jobs seem to be on track
[16:24] <seb128> they are going through a first round of testing from adventurous users
[16:24] <seb128> it should land in raring in time for feature freeze
[16:24] <janimo> well not dictating but consistency of tech at least among the bits shipped by default would sure help
[16:24] <janimo> for carrying over maintenance/bugfixing experience
[16:25] <seb128> janimo, we recommend C/vala/qt/go
[16:25] <ogra_> binary is binary ... :)
[16:25] <ogra_> we recommend go ?
[16:25] <seb128> go is less for desktopish but a good choice for server components
[16:25]  * ogra_ definitely doesnt recommend go for mobile images :) )
[16:25] <seb128> ogra_, more for server stuff
[16:25] <seb128> but yeah I would say C/vala/Qt for mobile
[16:25] <ogra_> static linking is evil size wise
[16:26] <seb128> Qt is closer from where we are going but it's cpp
[16:26] <seb128> C/vala is good for gobject world
[16:26] <ogra_> yup
[16:27] <seb128> ok
[16:27] <seb128> do we have anything else to cover?
[16:27] <ogra_> nothing else from me
[16:27] <ogra_> anyone else ?
[16:28] <seb128> is there any blocker issue we should be looking at? out of that X/click/grab issue
[16:28] <seb128> and the things mentioned during the meeting
[16:28] <seb128> ?
[16:28] <ogra_> i dont think we have any blockers beyond that
[16:28] <seb128> ok, great
[16:28] <ogra_> it actually seems to all go very smooth atm
[16:29] <ogra_> oh, btw, usb-creator grew nexus7 installation support
[16:29]  * ogra_ totally forgot to mention that above
[16:29] <seb128> nice
[16:29] <seb128> btw, just as another fyi, I will try to organize a bit better the valgrinding effort next week as well
[16:29] <ogra_> if you run a raring PC please help testing it (you need to gunzip the img.gz file first, there isnt unzipping code yet)
[16:29] <seb128> e.g set up a list of targets
[16:30] <seb128> and open some bugs
[16:30] <seb128> maybe blog about an example
[16:30] <seb128> so we get some extra traction in there
[16:30] <ogra_> awesome !
[16:30] <seb128> I also want to get extra memory usage mesure over time/usage for things like gvfs/unity lenses/indicators
[16:30] <seb128> we mostly did idle so far
[16:30] <ogra_> yeah
[16:30] <ogra_> but idle looks really good now
[16:31] <seb128> yeah
[16:31] <seb128> then you start using the dash or play with your indicator and you see we still have work :p
[16:31] <ogra_> and the fun part is that i read everywhere how much more stable and how much faster 13.04 is for everyone testing it
[16:31] <ogra_> even on desktops
[16:31] <seb128> anyway it's a good start
[16:31] <seb128> \o/
[16:31] <ogra_> so we're on a very good track here
[16:31] <seb128> good work everyone!
[16:31] <ogra_> yeah
[16:31] <seb128> ok that, let's wrap up?
[16:31] <ogra_> and with these words ...
[16:32] <seb128> have a good w.e everyone!
[16:32] <xnox> ogra_: the spike can be anacronjobs.
[16:32] <ogra_> heh, could we stop saying the same differently phrased all the time ? :)
[16:32] <seb128> ogra_, ;-)
[16:32] <ogra_> enjoy your weekend everybody
[16:32] <ogra_> :P
[16:32] <seb128> lol
[16:32] <ogra_> bye all
[16:32] <ogra_> 7me goes back to #ubuntu-arm
[16:59]  * ptl apt-getting full-upgrading his nexus 7 and the other 5 arm devices
[18:02] <tgm4883> whose running this show?
[18:02] <bobweaaver> no I says this guy
[18:02] <bobweaaver> not *
[18:02] <CrestedNewt> ok
[18:03] <CrestedNewt> #startmeeting
[18:03] <meetingology> Meeting started Fri Feb  8 18:03:00 2013 UTC.  The chair is CrestedNewt. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[18:03] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[18:03] <CrestedNewt> evening all - how have we progressed this week?
[18:05] <CrestedNewt> OK I will start then
[18:06] <CrestedNewt> I was supposed to have a Google Hangout with Bobweaver last week but I have spent the time clearing my desk so that I can get a better grip on where we are
[18:06] <CrestedNewt> I messed up and bobweaver and I are going to have a google hangout early next week
[18:07] <bobweaaver> I am on live here atm http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0GJO_bCHDc    if you all have any question for me
[18:09] <bobweaaver> tgm4883:  any work on scope ?
[18:10] <tgm4883> I've done nothing more that make sure it builds on 12.04
[18:10] <tgm4883> and it's in the PPA now
[18:10] <tgm4883> soon, I'll probably write some instructions for people to use for testing
[18:14] <bobweaaver> tgm4883:  I fixed the bug in previews so that it is launching using unity and not Qt anymore
[18:14] <bobweaaver> added more previews
[18:14] <tgm4883> bobweaaver, nice
[18:14] <bobweaaver> torrents and news
[18:14] <bobweaaver> news is cool torrents is nothing special
[18:15] <bobweaaver> going to have to work on getting lens backported for testing with previews
[18:15] <bobweaaver> I need to do a mass re-write of the word "preview" and change it so that lens can call but that is about it on my end
[18:16] <CrestedNewt> OK so bobweaver - your work is almost done?
[18:16] <bobweaaver> maybe we can talk about getting this done https://plus.google.com/u/0/104659991254860976283/posts/hu8MmEqvEnX
[18:17] <bobweaaver> what are your thoughts ?
[18:17] <tgm4883> bobweaaver, which parts?
[18:18] <tgm4883> maybe we should go though each section of that for this meeting
[18:18] <bobweaaver> any
[18:18] <bobweaaver> ok
[18:18]  * tgm4883 awaits CrestedNewt to do the topic stuff
[18:18] <CrestedNewt> #topic Google+ Page
[18:19] <CrestedNewt> OK - looks good
[18:19] <tgm4883> lol
[18:19] <tgm4883> CrestedNewt, how about A) Setting up a documentation session.
[18:20] <CrestedNewt> OK, I'm all for doing some documentation. or do you mean #topic A) etc
[18:21] <tgm4883> CrestedNewt, I mean for the topic
[18:21] <CrestedNewt> #topic Setting up Documentation Settings
[18:21] <CrestedNewt> Done
[18:21] <bobweaaver> I think htat I am talking away on youtube to thin air :P
[18:21] <tgm4883> bobweaaver, probably
[18:21] <CrestedNewt> put that ciggie out - it's bad for you
[18:22] <tgm4883> So documentation wise, we need some decent docs on setup
[18:23] <tgm4883> Does anyone want to lead that up?
[18:23] <CrestedNewt> tgm4883 - I'll download the latest release and install in a VM and document
[18:23] <tgm4883> CrestedNewt, all parts?
[18:23] <CrestedNewt> why not
[18:23]  * tgm4883 notes that includes Mythtv setup
[18:24] <CrestedNewt> bobweaver - let me change RL room as wife is sitting next to me :D
[18:25] <CrestedNewt> OK back - had to switch wireless
[18:25] <CrestedNewt> I don't know enough about MythTV
[18:26] <bobweaaver> tgm4883:  I will send you video link of this record so you can watch after work or whatever
[18:26] <CrestedNewt> bobweaver - thanks
[18:27] <CrestedNewt> ok - so the documentation is all over the place at the moment - it just needs to be correlated?
[18:28] <tgm4883> Yes
[18:28] <bobweaaver> so I am set with that docs that is dont know what else is needed to talk about maybe questions that you all might have
[18:28] <bobweaaver> sorry this webchat thingy is messing up
[18:28] <tgm4883> I'll write up some basic mythtv instructions and hopefully someone can go though them and see what is missing
[18:28] <CrestedNewt> ok - I'm happy to pull that together and test it during an install
[18:29] <CrestedNewt> that should highlight any bugs
[18:29] <CrestedNewt> what is good bobweaver?
[18:30] <tgm4883> so that probably covers A and B on that list
[18:31] <CrestedNewt> sounds like it
[18:32] <CrestedNewt> tgm4883 & bobweaver - could you tell me where you have the documentation so that I can start to pull it together
[18:32] <tgm4883> I don't have much
[18:33] <tgm4883> Moving on?
[18:33] <CrestedNewt> just listening to bobweaver atm
[18:34] <CrestedNewt> #action crestednewt - setup meeting with bobweaver
[18:34] <meetingology> ACTION: crestednewt - setup meeting with bobweaver
[18:35] <CrestedNewt> ok - I'm in the UK so you guys are like 6 & 7 hrs behind me
[18:36] <bobweaaver> tgm4883: could you do this via google hangout with me if so what is the best time for you ?
[18:36] <CrestedNewt> when are you free tgm4883?
[18:36] <tgm4883> Not sure what we're talking about right now
[18:37] <CrestedNewt> ok - bobweaver is talking on a youtube channel - makes it a bit hard to document but he is talking about a G+ Hangout between the 3 of us
[18:37] <bobweaaver> we have to set a time to do this the meeting for the public
[18:37] <tgm4883> CrestedNewt, right, for what reason?
[18:37] <bobweaaver> to get the public involed
[18:37] <bobweaaver> well more that is
[18:37] <tgm4883> but what are we going to discuss?
[18:38] <CrestedNewt> I think we need to get the installation adocumentation ironed out and fluid
[18:38] <bobweaaver> like a basic setup and things to look out for when buying card ect
[18:38] <CrestedNewt> I just need some guiding on that from both of you
[18:39] <tgm4883> I'll try to get some information together for that
[18:39] <bobweaaver> I am hoping by having this that we will not have to doc and the public will doc
[18:39] <bobweaaver> mainly because of my learning disability
[18:39] <CrestedNewt> that's why I am here - I can document into a wiki and then that can be updated
[18:40] <bobweaaver> Like I could ask you a coupld of questions about myth how long you have been using it
[18:40] <CrestedNewt> at least there will be a start point
[18:41] <CrestedNewt> OK, so you want 30 minutes with tgm4883 about the video capture hardware
[18:42] <CrestedNewt> for the public to be aware of what HW will work as a minimum
[18:42] <bobweaaver> I would ask tgm4883  questio ns like D) How to prep a computer for Myth TV
[18:42] <bobweaaver> what is good hardware ?
[18:43] <bobweaaver> where to get help
[18:43] <tgm4883> so for that, I'm going to documents a few tuners depending on your location/use case
[18:43] <bobweaaver> how long you been using mythbuntu
[18:43] <tgm4883> hardware wise, I'm going to leave minimum system requirements for bobweaaver to figure out
[18:43] <tgm4883> bobweaaver, me?
[18:43] <CrestedNewt> and this is to be recorded and put up on youtube?
[18:44] <bobweaaver> y
[18:44]  * tgm4883 is one of the founding developers of Mythbuntu
[18:44] <bobweaaver> Live
[18:44] <CrestedNewt> ok - so it is a living manual
[18:44] <bobweaaver> people will be able to ask questions via chat
[18:45] <tgm4883> My goal for the Mythtv documention is to end up with a "quick start guide", similar to what you get when buying a new computer/TV/stereo equipment
[18:45] <bobweaaver> that is perfect
[18:46] <bobweaaver> but whta is good time for you ?
[18:46] <bobweaaver> weekends ?
[18:46] <CrestedNewt> OK, I think I have a handle on this..... tgm4883 - yes with a link then back to the online for more advanced tasks?
[18:46] <bobweaaver> will take 30 min tops
[18:46] <tgm4883> bobweaaver, usually yes, but I'm going out of town this weekend
[18:46] <CrestedNewt> tgm4883 - enjoy!! :D
[18:46] <bobweaaver> yeah I amm also busy
[18:46] <CrestedNewt> ok - what about Monday sometime?
[18:46] <bobweaaver> maybe 2 weeks from now ?
[18:47] <CrestedNewt> the problem with 2 weeks from now is it puts us a bit further back
[18:47] <bobweaaver> anything but this weekend is good for me
[18:47] <bobweaaver> meaning anything but thsi weekend
[18:47] <CrestedNewt> lol @ bobweaver - got it mate
[18:47] <tgm4883> anything during the week is going to mean really late for CrestedNewt
[18:48] <CrestedNewt> well - I just need to drink less and stay up late :D
[18:48] <bobweaaver> lol
[18:49] <CrestedNewt> tgm4883 - I can do up to midnight UK time, which would mean 6pm East Coast time
[18:49] <bobweaaver> We just have to have a date that way we can tell public the time and place ect
[18:49] <tgm4883> We're getting to the end of our time, are there any community questions this session?
[18:49] <CrestedNewt> #topic Q&A
[18:49] <tgm4883> CrestedNewt, I couldn't do earlier than 9PM East coast time
[18:49] <bobweaaver> all the things do not need to be done in one day though that would be good
[18:50] <CrestedNewt> tgm4883 - ouch!! that may not work
[18:51] <CrestedNewt> tgm4883 - will e-mail you later on some idea's
[18:51] <bobweaaver> allright we got 10 min I say we go to questions unless there are none are there any Questions ?
[18:51] <CrestedNewt> The floor is open - anyone have any questions for tgm4883 & bobweaver?
[18:52] <CrestedNewt> no-one?
[18:52] <bobweaaver> good less to do :)
[18:52] <CrestedNewt> LOL!!!
[18:52] <bobweaaver> I say that we are done  what about you all ?
[18:52] <CrestedNewt> agreed
[18:53] <CrestedNewt> #endmeeting
[18:53] <meetingology> Meeting ended Fri Feb  8 18:53:14 2013 UTC.
[18:53] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-08-18.03.moin.txt
[18:53] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-02-08-18.03.html
[18:53] <bobweaaver> tgm4883:  get ahold of me after this week end I want to show you what I am doing with the previews
[18:53] <tgm4883> ok
[18:53] <bobweaaver> cya all have a good one
[18:54] <CrestedNewt> cya