[00:11] http://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/comments/18ecca/was_asked_to_slow_down_the_servers_today/ [00:46] party party [02:16] and boom goes twitter with the state of union [02:17] oh right... do I turn the hotel tv back on or not... [02:18] decision: not worth the effort [13:03] Good morning [13:04] yes [13:11] wheeee [13:56] Y'know, for the amount of people lamenting Opera's engine change, you'd think I'd have more Opera users in my logs. [14:01] PEople use Opera? [14:03] You'd think they did from the amount of kvetching [14:05] I think jrwren is trolling you [14:08] Wouldn't be the first time. [14:09] But I doubt it. I think jrwren is sincere [14:36] snap-l: btw http://askubuntu.com/questions/3503/best-way-to-cache-apt-downloads-on-a-lan [14:55] i'm only sincere in that I value diversity. [14:55] i strongly dislike the "1 down, 2 to go" sentiment. [14:55] I'd be very disappointed if there was only webkit. [14:56] jrwren: but what do you prefer to webkit? That's my thing. If a new contender came up I'd be happy, but gecko/etc are just not up to snuff [14:56] might as well compete with each other on top of the same kernel imo [14:56] I'm not sure Opera was up to snuff, honestly. [14:56] just like RH/Ubuntu/Debian on the same linux kernel [14:56] er, Presto [14:56] jcastro: Thanks! Will check it out. [14:57] jcastro: Does it also cache private repos, or will I have to add those in by hand? [14:57] i disagree with all of that. [14:57] gecko, opera and trident are all "up to snuff" [14:59] ugh, hate this title though http://ejohn.org/blog/webkit-is-the-jquery-of-browser-engines/ [14:59] hah [14:59] That's what I don't understand: all of the webkit hate. [15:00] i dont' hate it at all. [15:00] its great. [15:00] i strongly dislike the sentiment that there should be only webkit. [15:02] Yeah, I don't buy that either [15:02] Because it won't just be webkit, it'll be IE and webkit and gecko and something else [15:04] It's not like MS will ever switch [15:05] I'm not so certain, but if they do, they'll definitely extend it [15:13] i would have agreed with MS never, until I've seen how MS embraced nodejs. [15:13] as of yet, ms hasn't extended nodejs in noncompatible ways. [15:13] i'm still waiting [15:14] What are they using node on? [15:15] yea, nodejs and jquery have been fairly cleanly integrated [15:15] brousch: they support it on azure [15:16] it was one of the first non-.net platforms on there [15:16] That's all? [15:16] they sponsored a ton of work to move to libuv to get it to work on MS platforms [15:16] basically node didn't work on MS at all, then they sponsored a ton of good work and now works pretty well from what I hear [15:17] That is just them realizing no one wants to run ASP and no one wants to port cool things to Windows [15:17] one of the core node devs works for msft IIRC [15:18] brousch: we are trying to have a serious discussion. hyperbole like no one wants to run asp -- assuming you mean asp.net -- is not true. [15:18] in fact, its not even hyperbole, its flat out false. [15:19] Fair enough [15:20] strategically i can't figure out what msft is doing with it other than tooling. but they don't make $$$ on tooling. [15:20] msft is a sinking ship. [15:20] They make money because node can be run on Azure. It's a way to bring in "the cool kids" to their cloud platform [15:21] Given a choice, most of the developers I've encountered would not use MS. They only do so because they are paid to use it [15:22] snap-l: yeah you need to whitelist some domains on the server piece, it's in the "3rd party" section of my post. [15:22] snap-l: iirc we added some common ones commented out. [15:22] I don't get the webkit or the opera hate either [15:23] my impression from talking to 'azure people' is that there are not a lot of paying customers. [15:23] a couple of big profile ones like nbc for olympics, but its not very wide spread. [15:24] it's not in GA yet that's why [15:24] azure? [15:24] yeah [15:24] most azure servies are GA w/ production support [15:24] oh, you mean node specifically? [15:24] jrwren: It's for the same reason. given a choice, most developers I know would not use Azure [15:25] brousch: I would have agreed and been one until I first deployed to it. its pretty much just like heroku now. git push to deploy the node app. [15:25] the only thing I have against it is cost - its pretty expensive. [15:26] Azure is windows, right? [15:26] jrwren: the compute thing isn't GA, the IAAS compete-with-amazon part. [15:27] i see. [15:27] soon though [15:27] the tools are all node, it's pretty nice [15:28] brousch: its called "Windows Azure" so yes :) [15:28] So to ensure your stuff will run properly on it, you should be developing on Windows [15:28] nope, Linux is 100% supported [15:29] So you can run a Linux server on Azure? [15:29] brousch: i really don't understand. you write nodejs. [15:29] or yes, for IAAS stuff you can run Linux on Azure. [15:29] brousch: yep, full support from MS and Canonical too: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/06/canonical-partners-with-microsoft-to-support-ubuntu-on-azure/ [15:29] dun dun dun! [15:29] Fascinating [15:29] the part where it will really suck is if you use SQL... its gonna be MSSQL and not Postgresql :( [15:30] brousch, if i remember correctly the Hypervisor is MS Hypervisor [15:30] well, unless you run and install postgresql on an IAAS [15:30] but I was refering to paas [15:30] yes, its HyperV. [15:30] so whatever is supported on Hyper-V should run on Azure [15:30] remember when MS sent the huge patch to linux kernel? [15:30] yup [15:30] I don't care about paas, there's plenty of choice in paas, what's needed is more iaas competition, IMO of course [15:31] _someone_ needs to compete with amazon [15:31] Doesn't rackspace? [15:33] their new cloud is still beta [15:33] HPs is still beta [15:33] Google's is still beta [15:33] Azure's is still beta [15:34] jcastro: seriously? [15:34] i feel exactly the oposite. [15:34] meanwhile Amazon is printing money. [15:34] Google is doing IAAS? [15:34] yep [15:34] yep [15:34] google compute [15:34] plenty of choice in Iaas, and very little in paas :) [15:34] Oh right [15:34] jrwren: most of the "iaas" I see is just some resold VPS garbage with "Cloud" stuck on the front. [15:34] how so in paas? There seems to be a ton of them [15:34] I mean real scalable IAAS, like, Netflix scale [15:34] i don't see anything about Azure being a beta product [15:35] if you want IAAS and you need to scale AWS is your only real choice [15:35] jcastro: there are half a dozen vendors selling openstack clouds. [15:35] brousch: https://cloud.google.com/products/compute-engine [15:35] jrwren: and they will be awesome, just not right now. [15:35] so not VPS garbage with cloud on the front, but openstack with cloud on the front. [15:35] AWS's IAAS is NOT waht makes netflix be netflix scale. [15:36] netflix programers design decision is what makes netflix be that scale. [15:36] don't get me wrong, openstack clouds are the future, but there's no killer customer at scale on openstack clouds yet [15:36] yea, really hoping dreamhost/rackspace/hp can get up and running 100% and complete against AWS. Google would be nice but they just seem to care about BIG deploys right now [15:36] a vast majority of systems running on aws iaas use it just like hosted servers and when there is an infra outage, htey go down. [15:36] jrwren: netflix is very much scalable in large part to aws, I was at the session where they talked about it [15:37] I mean, their architecture is also very smart [15:37] jcastro: i strongly disagree. I too was at the session where they talked about it, and had some beer with Carl Quinn taht weekend. [15:37] jrwren: just because a tool has options doesn't make people use it. [15:37] rick_h_: exactly. [15:37] jrwren: we should drink beer and argue again like old times [15:38] jcastro: indeed we should. and you are closer than ever! [15:38] and EBS has gotten a few different updates to make cross region deploys easier as part of those downtimes [15:38] jcastro: want to come to Learn something @ fanzoo Feb 27th? [15:38] what is fanzoo? [15:38] IIRC netflix doesn't use ebs at all. [15:38] no one uses EBS, not even amazon. :) [15:38] jcastro: a tiny consulting company in AA [15:39] jrwren: right, because they know better but it's a big reason other people go down [15:39] rick_h_: yes, I see your point. that is what I was saying too. [15:39] anyway, tldr, linux on azure works just fine [15:39] jcastro: 4th wednesdays they host a code jam style get together were you really just hang out drink beer, work on software or wahtever and talk about it with other people [15:40] jrwren: where do they meet? [15:40] jrwren: CHC! [15:40] jcastro: at fanzoo technologies in AA - its at Ann and Ashley right downtown [15:40] oh rock and roll [15:40] I can probably do that, I have a car now [15:40] YAY for cars! [15:41] tldr: linux on azure works just fine. building your own cloud with a 12.10 iso and the maas boot option - not so much :p [15:41] hey man, sign up for a jumpstart and pay me and I'll be more than happy, lol [15:42] <--- can't set it up either. [15:42] we've had a couple guys trying it and both failed independantly. [15:42] it works if you do things EXACTLY right, but as soon as ANYTHING is different - fail. [15:42] like we have multi nics so spearate mgmt network and cloud network and NOPE [15:42] all fail [15:43] send me your problems, I can have people look at them [15:43] very quickly too [15:44] that is what I keep telling the guys here - i'm tell 'em, talk to jcastro, he is local - but they never do. [15:44] anything openstack or maas related I can get looked at [15:44] or hell, file a bug [15:45] I've not had to do it myself, so I've not directly experienced the pain or success, but I'll let them know. [15:45] DO NOT SUFFER IN SILENCE [15:47] not sure who it was that mentioned the MUG meeting last night, but thanks. [15:47] But suffering in silence is webscale. [15:47] i saw it beofre leaving work [15:48] decided to head over, enjoyed it [15:48] UnFixed: I think that was me. :) [15:48] Welcome. :) [15:48] :D [15:48] Hope you can make it back to the upcoming meetings [15:48] should be some good ones coming up [15:48] farmington is a little out of my way, but i do plan to try to make it to some [15:48] (note: I'm on the board, so take that with the appropriate disclaimers) [15:49] any idea on what the topics for the following meetings are? [15:50] someone skimmed through them at the meeting, but i can't recall them [15:51] http://blog.ziade.org/2013/02/13/fun-with-angularjs-amp-cornice/ for some pyramid/cornice/app love [15:54] UnFixed: We have a calendar of upcoming events under mug.org/meetings [15:55] found it just a moment ago [15:55] http://www.mug.org/?page=CiviCRM&q=civicrm/event/ical&reset=1&list=1&html=1 [15:55] i didnt see the link at the bottom of the page [15:55] thanks [15:55] Yeah, it doesn't jump out unfortunately [16:09] jcastro: sellers just said we should take you to lunch sometime to talk openstack and maas [16:10] awww yeah [16:13] im gonna see if he wants to today. you up for lunch today? [16:14] Must be nice. :) [16:18] which part? [16:19] The going to lunch part. :) [16:19] ah, nope, people are all busy here. another time and SOON [16:34] whoa, cool https://launchpad.net/~zfs-native/+archive/stable [22:22] upvites [22:22] bah [22:22] upvotes appreciated: http://www.reddit.com/r/pebble/comments/18h0vg/a_pebble_users_first_impressions_and_feedback/ [22:32] I just got this email from Carrie: "Rowan just peed on the back deck, came inside to get a rag, and is now wiping it up." [22:33] lol [22:33] he's 14 months, effing crazy