| AlanBell | 6 and a bit hours \o/ | 09:53 |
|---|---|---|
| AlanBell | woot \o/ | 09:53 |
| AlanBell | anyone know what the excitement is about? | 09:53 |
| jussi | AlanBell: a tablet maybe? :D | 09:53 |
| AlanBell | paracetamol for humans? | 09:54 |
| jussi | AlanBell: hahaha | 10:02 |
| DJones | Nah, it'll be an announcement that Ubuntu will be powering the new computers in the abbotoirs producing Soylent Green to put an and to the horsemeat scandal | 11:10 |
| DJones | s/and/end/ | 11:10 |
| DJones | -> Soylent green tablets (Or maybe Soylent aubergine tablets) | 11:12 |
| jussi | DJones: hahaha | 12:44 |
| IdleOne | htc.com is ~2 minutes faster | 14:28 |
| IdleOne | make that 1 minute | 14:28 |
| IdleOne | OMG OMG OMG 39 minutes!!!!! | 15:20 |
| IdleOne | OMG OMG OMG 18 minutes!!!!! | 15:41 |
| k1l | IdleOne: i cant stand it. tell me whats gonna happen, nao!!11 | 15:47 |
| IdleOne | k1l: Canonical is going to announce a merger with HTC and kick out Microsoft!!! | 15:47 |
| IdleOne | 100% made up ^ | 15:47 |
| k1l | :) | 15:48 |
| k1l | you are sure its 100% made up? :) | 15:49 |
| IdleOne | never know :P | 15:49 |
| genii-around | I wonder if the HTC 8x could run Ubuntu after that... | 15:53 |
| IdleOne | it will be renamed the HTCanonical One | 15:56 |
| k1l | i see, IdleOne read all the conspiracy theories from the interwebz | 15:57 |
| IdleOne | I read nothing. | 15:58 |
| hkall | so… anyone know if there will be Ubuntu phone images built for Galaxy S2 (i9100)? | 16:23 |
| Calinou | since you used "…", no. | 16:24 |
| Calinou | :> | 16:24 |
| Calinou | only OS X users dare to use … | 16:24 |
| k1l | hkall: the specialists sit in #ubuntu-phone ; but i dont think that every phone will get images to flash. its mentioned that google nexus and nexus4 are supported from the start | 16:29 |
| Noorideen | k1l, :) | 16:38 |
| Tatuus | http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=5_4fXQcxFRs | 20:14 |
| zykotick9 | so ubuntu did announce a tablet... so now there's ubunu=fail on both the phone and table fronts. freedom = ftw, ubuntu = no-so-much. | 20:46 |
| k1l | i dont really get what you are trying to say | 20:50 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: i'd say canonical is trying to become Apple 2.0, basically. i won't trust my data to canonical (or anyone else for that matter). it's sad, i used to like ubuntu so much... now... no so much ;) | 20:51 |
| zykotick9 | this move to mobile/tablets, is just another front in the "providing advertisements" campaign | 20:52 |
| zykotick9 | and "data about users to advertisers" | 20:53 |
| k1l | ok, so where exactly is ubuntu touching your freedom? | 20:53 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: ubuntu NOW, guarantees it's users don't have it... | 20:53 |
| k1l | i dont see it that worst case szenario you are trying to draw here | 20:56 |
| k1l | i know you are relating to the rms spyware issue. but first: do you use a rms-holy-freedom-distribution yourself? even debian is not on the bright side from rms. second: you heard about the changes that are meant to be introduced for 13.04 on the desktop? | 20:57 |
| zykotick9 | canoncial though: ubuntu, ubuntuone, phone and now tablet. have provided a software eco-system, that doesn't respect user's rights, and is basically just spyware - thats primary objective is financial benefit for it's owner(s). "ubuntu" has become a sad distortion of what that word is suppose to mean. | 20:58 |
| zykotick9 | the change that isn't a change at all - according to slashdot the other day. OR, the KDE dev that says ubuntu-phone is a bait-n-switch tactic - also covered on slashdot in the last few days | 20:59 |
| k1l | erm. you know that "the owner" paid alot until now and i dont see he will get his money back anytime soon :) | 21:00 |
| k1l | so dont come with the profite thingy | 21:00 |
| zykotick9 | good for him, bad for users. | 21:00 |
| zykotick9 | but who cares about users... not canonical. | 21:01 |
| k1l | good for him that he paid everyone to get free ubuntu cds shipped the last years. yes | 21:01 |
| k1l | zykotick9: c'mon | 21:01 |
| k1l | that is lowest niveau of discussing | 21:01 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: ubuntu's distain for users is pretty well documented... starting from 10.04's moving the buttons, and "won't fix" as reply to bugs. | 21:02 |
| k1l | zykotick9: comon | 21:03 |
| zykotick9 | but ubuntu isn't a "community" project - it's a propritary one that happens to have a big naive free (as in cost) labour force | 21:03 |
| k1l | you can put 99% of "the users" critics into the trash | 21:04 |
| zykotick9 | yes as "depressed hipsters" | 21:04 |
| k1l | i know the critics about the windowbuttons move, or the unity as standard desktop introduction: "nobody can work with that" | 21:05 |
| k1l | sry, that is no constructive critics | 21:05 |
| k1l | i see alot of "gnome2 fanboys" hating on ubuntu. but that is the wrong target | 21:06 |
| zykotick9 | yes, the "target" audience appears to be "people who don't know better" and are willing to give canonical they're money, or personal data - either will do. | 21:07 |
| k1l | zykotick9: i see noone giving canonical money | 21:08 |
| k1l | most ubuntu critics state that they want linux to become more marketshare. but they refuse to take changes. that is not working | 21:09 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: really? how do you get around without your eyes open? ubuntuone storage/ubuntuone music | 21:09 |
| k1l | zykotick9: aha. so canonical nearly stealing money from the user | 21:09 |
| k1l | zykotick9: what is wrong with ubuntuone music or storage? | 21:10 |
| zykotick9 | oh, the services (though bad) probably isn't anything compared to handing user data over to 3rd parties like facebook/twitter/amazon/etc. | 21:10 |
| k1l | so your critics is: windowbuttons to the left, ubuntuone (music and storage) and the unity search | 21:12 |
| k1l | ever thought of the unity desktop with the global menue and the window buttons on the right? | 21:12 |
| k1l | that would ruin the whole concept, dont you think? | 21:12 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: my "cristism" is that ubuntu WAS a cool user-friendly-debian that i could recommend to anyone. now ubuntu is a spyware/corporate/data-mining machine... | 21:13 |
| k1l | aha, here we go | 21:13 |
| k1l | first: you know even debian is not the freedom distribution? | 21:14 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: wrong. though FSF and DFSG don't always align. | 21:14 |
| k1l | and the reason you didnt recommend debian was, it wasnt cool and didnt have the service as ubuntu. | 21:14 |
| zykotick9 | debian? what? ubuntu WAS a user-friendly-debian. i haven't mentioned debian. | 21:15 |
| k1l | user-friednly-debian mentions debian | 21:15 |
| k1l | personally im not using the amazon lense myself and i would recommend to make a opt-in for personal-data related searches. but there is no way for me to hop onto the shitstorm that is going on | 21:17 |
| k1l | and i see where the benefits of a global search could get. | 21:18 |
| k1l | i mean most critics you mentioned here was nothing but bias: window buttons, ubuntuone,... | 21:19 |
| zykotick9 | when the community/freesoftware is gone from ubuntu - there really isn't a reason for all ubuntu users to just switch to Apples. they probably should. | 21:19 |
| k1l | zykotick9: ok so you say users should stick to apple or http://www.gnu.org/distros/free-distros.en.html | 21:22 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: i'm saying there really isn't a difference NOW between ubuntu and OSX. but maybe OSX is technically superior - and if that's your only argument, why not use what's best? | 21:23 |
| TheLordOfTime | you're forgetting something about OSX | 21:23 |
| TheLordOfTime | its closed source | 21:23 |
| TheLordOfTime | as well, diagnosing issues with it is nigh impossible unless you've hacked away at the restrictions on OSX | 21:23 |
| zykotick9 | TheLordOfTime: so is ubuntu... or much of it, these days. | 21:23 |
| k1l | zykotick9: im not saying that. i was just summarizing what you are saysing | 21:23 |
| zykotick9 | i hate OSX for the record ;) | 21:24 |
| TheLordOfTime | zykotick9, show me evidence of that and i'll listen, otherwise, the MAJORITY of Ubuntu minus drivers/kernel is open source | 21:24 |
| k1l | zykotick9: where is closed source? | 21:24 |
| TheLordOfTime | zykotick9, because in Ubuntu, we can modify the base of the OS, the kernel, as we want. | 21:24 |
| TheLordOfTime | thereby allowing free customization, we can't do that in OSX | 21:24 |
| zykotick9 | TheLordOfTime: steam ring any bells. that appears to be the major issue in #ubuntu theses days | 21:24 |
| TheLordOfTime | zykotick9, steam's a beta program | 21:24 |
| TheLordOfTime | and its got its own channel | 21:24 |
| TheLordOfTime | i send steam users there | 21:24 |
| TheLordOfTime | steam's also not TECHNICALLY part of the repos last i checked | 21:24 |
| zykotick9 | customization and ubuntu don't belong in the same sentence ;) | 21:24 |
| TheLordOfTime | unless its hiding | 21:25 |
| k1l | zykotick9: so steam is ubuntus closed source? | 21:25 |
| TheLordOfTime | zykotick9, saying Steam is a majority of ubuntu | 21:25 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: of course - it's non-free software? | 21:25 |
| TheLordOfTime | and then SAYING ubuntu is closed source... | 21:25 |
| k1l | TheLordOfTime: they have their own repo | 21:25 |
| TheLordOfTime | that's just pure blasphemy and you should be slapped | 21:25 |
| k1l | zykotick9: gotcha. so debian is out of the businee too | 21:25 |
| zykotick9 | ok i'll slap myself... not. | 21:25 |
| TheLordOfTime | k1l, my point exactly, its not technically part of Ubuntu itself, its third-party software not included in ubuntu, therefore you can't call Ubuntu closed source b ecause of it. | 21:25 |
| popey | +1 | 21:26 |
| popey | the contents of the cd is not closed | 21:26 |
| zykotick9 | popey: ahhh, i don't think that's true... | 21:26 |
| k1l | zykotick9: first of all that steam thing is not true. and second you just told some minutes ago that debian is ok to have that closed and unfree stuff | 21:26 |
| popey | zykotick9: what's not closed? | 21:26 |
| popey | er, what's closed on the cd | 21:26 |
| zykotick9 | popey: aren't there drivers for nvidia/amd on there these days? | 21:26 |
| k1l | zykotick9: so as i saied earlier: you are just hopping on the shitstorm | 21:26 |
| popey | we've always shipped hardware enablement components like nvidia drivers and firmware for network cards | 21:27 |
| popey | that's not changed | 21:27 |
| zykotick9 | popey: so, it's NOT free/open... what was your point? | 21:27 |
| popey | 21:23:48 < zykotick9> TheLordOfTime: so is ubuntu... or much of it, these days. | 21:28 |
| popey | "much of it" | 21:28 |
| TheLordOfTime | LIES | 21:28 |
| popey | is wildly inaccurate | 21:28 |
| TheLordOfTime | BLASPHEMY | 21:28 |
| TheLordOfTime | your statement is lies and blasphemy there, zykotick9 | 21:28 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: hopping on the shitstorm? i was a ubuntu users for a couple of years | 21:28 |
| TheLordOfTime | as popey is pointing out. | 21:28 |
| zykotick9 | TheLordOfTime: BLASPHEM is a religious statement, is ubuntu your religion? my goodness... | 21:28 |
| TheLordOfTime | zykotick9, you could call Ubuntu my religion, i'm EXTREMELY biased towards it and argue for it against the nay-sayers on other lionux forums and blogs. | 21:29 |
| k1l | zykotick9: most of your critics is inaccurate in comparison to debian (which you mentioned to be the good one) | 21:29 |
| TheLordOfTime | :p | 21:29 |
| zykotick9 | TheLordOfTime: oh man. that's so sad. you worship a company... you might as well worship at the alter of apple (no difference) | 21:30 |
| k1l | zykotick9: there are points to argue about, like i said myself (opt-in, etc). but just beeing picky in ubuntu's case and say "nah that is all free" in debian case is not right, imho | 21:30 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: debian "main" is 100% libre/free software... yes there is contrib/non-free (which is a choice users can make, to deny there own freedom if they wish) | 21:31 |
| TheLordOfTime | zykotick9, i'm going to ignore your last statement for the sake of this channel, i don't want to expose it to a hellstorm | 21:31 |
| TheLordOfTime | having said that, your statement about "most of ubuntu" being closed source is just WRONG | 21:31 |
| TheLordOfTime | and you need to reexamine your statements with a fine toothed comb. | 21:31 |
| zykotick9 | TheLordOfTime: you're right "most" is certainly NOT the case... | 21:31 |
| TheLordOfTime | failure to comply is illogical, as is your initial statement. | 21:31 |
| k1l | zykotick9: there are not so many users in the world who thing that this definition of free is the first rule to an operating system | 21:32 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: and that's sad. | 21:32 |
| k1l | that is the reason linux never was attractive to the mainstream | 21:32 |
| k1l | until ubuntu started | 21:32 |
| zykotick9 | who cares if it's mainstream or not? | 21:32 |
| k1l | zykotick9: who cares? | 21:33 |
| zykotick9 | oh canoncial/ubuntu does - sorry. | 21:33 |
| k1l | the ones who want companys to produce drivers and programs for linux aswell | 21:33 |
| zykotick9 | more $$$ | 21:33 |
| TheLordOfTime | and now you're arguing that canonical and ubuntu are the same individual entity. | 21:33 |
| zykotick9 | TheLordOfTime: they are... | 21:33 |
| k1l | there are alot of those users who would like to step back from the closed systems | 21:33 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: not ubuntu users, they don't know any better. | 21:34 |
| TheLordOfTime | right... my initial conclusion that you are insane is now confirmed, and i'm going to go do something productive. like bugs triage. | 21:34 |
| k1l | zykotick9: you forget one point in your argumentation: besides the big names like rms etc not every coder that contributes to free software gets paid for it if there wasnt some "evil companys" paing them | 21:35 |
| k1l | zykotick9: and i would stop refering to ubuntu users as they all were just plain dumb. | 21:35 |
| k1l | that is very arrogant from your side | 21:36 |
| popey | lets refrain from personal attacks | 21:36 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: i have 0 problems with free-software people getting paid. but if your only goal is $$$ then you'll do things VERY differently. see canonical as example, sell your user data to 3rd parties. | 21:36 |
| popey | this channel (like all in the ubuntu namespace) expects everyone to adhere to our code of conduct | 21:36 |
| k1l | zykotick9: does it sell userdata? | 21:36 |
| zykotick9 | popey: TheLordOfTime is gone. and i'm pretty sure i didn't sink to that level ;) | 21:36 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: how do you think it gets money from amazon exactly? | 21:37 |
| popey | the same way anyone with an amazon affiliate scheme does | 21:37 |
| popey | by tagging urls and people buying stuff | 21:37 |
| k1l | zykotick9: and i didnt say i want the money. i said i want people to become proper drivers from the manufacturer and software | 21:38 |
| k1l | zykotick9: that only happens if the manufacturer sees a market in linux and thinks he can make money with selling devices to this market. | 21:38 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: i hear ya. drivers are certainly a good thing (even closed source drivers) - reason i boycott AMD/ATI and only purchase nvidia. | 21:38 |
| k1l | zykotick9: so like the rhythmbox guys did just before? | 21:38 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: the rhythmbox things was another "not good" move my ubuntu | 21:39 |
| k1l | zykotick9: there are alot of software still just programmed for windows. so many users still have to use this. that is because linux is still not a market to target | 21:40 |
| k1l | zykotick9: ok, but rhyhtmbox is ok by getting amazon money? | 21:40 |
| k1l | zykotick9: you see the bias you are having= | 21:40 |
| k1l | ? | 21:40 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: they wrote the software, ubuntu tried to steal the money. you don't see issue with that? (i'm NOT saying rhythmbox is right in it either!) | 21:41 |
| k1l | zykotick9: and: rhythmbox made more money with the % they got from ubuntus amazon ref links because they got the standard music player than before | 21:41 |
| k1l | zykotick9: you are wrong | 21:42 |
| IdleOne | I seriously doubt there was any intentional theft involved. | 21:42 |
| k1l | you cant steal money that is not present | 21:42 |
| zykotick9 | IdleOne: as if you stuck your nose into with - with a voice of reason ;) | 21:42 |
| popey | Uhm. | 21:42 |
| k1l | if they had taken another programm as music player rhythmbox wouldnt got any money. | 21:42 |
| zykotick9 | s/with/this/ | 21:42 |
| popey | It was Banshee which we changed the referal link for, not Rhythmbox | 21:43 |
| k1l | popey: oh sry. i got this wrong | 21:43 |
| zykotick9 | Banshee is mono-crap. a good move ubuntu dumped that. | 21:43 |
| IdleOne | Why would it be ok for the app devs to make money from the app but not the distribution platform of said app? | 21:44 |
| popey | We didn't "dump" it, it's still in the repository. | 21:44 |
| popey | Anyway, this is all very entertaining if you like being trolled, so I'm going to wander off. Cheerio. | 21:44 |
| zykotick9 | IdleOne: well, the app devs wrong teh software - including the pay scheme. what did the distro do? use that software - that's it. | 21:44 |
| k1l | zykotick9: im out of this discussion since you still couldnt convince me that your state of view is nothing else then biased. | 21:44 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: we are all biased. you, and everyone here, has a pro-ubuntu bias, mine's just different then yours. | 21:45 |
| IdleOne | Ubuntu is a major distributor of all these apps. I don't think banshee or any other app could make nearly as much money without the existence of Ubuntu. Canonical being a major distributor should be able to make a % of that money. | 21:45 |
| zykotick9 | and does ubuntu have the right to determine that %? 'cause in that case, they decided unilaterally. | 21:46 |
| IdleOne | They do. | 21:46 |
| IdleOne | like any contract, things get negotiated | 21:47 |
| IdleOne | assuming that Canonical took the money and didn't pay intentionally is wrong. | 21:47 |
| zykotick9 | there was no negotiation in that case? ubuntu just changed to code. which they have the right to do legally (with free software) but morally? | 21:48 |
| IdleOne | the licence removes the morality in my opinion, the dev knows full well what rights he is giving up. Again, I seriously doubt that Canonical did anything wrong intentionally and aiui they rectified that situation, popey can probably conform this. | 21:49 |
| popey | ye olde news | 21:50 |
| zykotick9 | k1l: thanks for the discussion. take care all. i doubt i'll return ;) so in closing, ubuntu has become an immoral distro. | 21:50 |
| popey | google knows the answer to this | 21:50 |
| zykotick9 | IdleOne: take care! | 21:50 |
| IdleOne | Do you really think Mark needs the money? | 21:50 |
| popey | trolololo | 21:50 |
| k1l | i dont agree with the closing | 21:50 |
| IdleOne | it was a baby move | 21:51 |
| k1l | (just for the log) | 21:51 |
| k1l | (like i got to know anything you do on irc is for the log) ;p | 21:51 |
| IdleOne | people have this idea that licences and contracts exist to protect the rights you have. IMHO they enumerate the rights you are giving up. | 21:53 |
| hggdh | rights each side is giving up. Not necessarily one-sided | 21:53 |
| IdleOne | right. | 21:53 |
| genii-around | The comprotract | 22:23 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!